S02.E10: Farewell

[norcalgal]

For me it's a basic thing:  when the viewer has to fanwank to the degree that has been posted in the S2 threads, it's a major fail/red flag.

Glad there are others who enjoyed this season, but as I posted before, imho it's a hot mess.

The only thing that resonated for me this entire season were the Q/Picard scenes. RIP Rios, he was done dirty this whole season, so I can't blame the actor if it was his decision to exit. In fact, I feel bad in advance for the other characters

Spoiler

(except perhaps Seven) because with TNG characters coming on board in S3, show might as well have jettisoned even more of them since they're probably going to be sidelined quite a bit...

 

Edited May 7, 2022 by saoirse
Spoiler tag added

[marinw]

The Q/Picard hug was actually really nice. I do know that back in the day there was a LOT of Picard/Q slash.

[Ottis]

That, and this entire season, sucked balls. How can you squander Jean-Luc Picard?

Can I just point out one thing? If the whole purpose of the season was to correct a time issue, then randomly letting Rios stay makes zero sense.

Edited May 6, 2022 by Ottis

[SnarkShark]

Wil Wheaton on this appearance:

https://wilwheaton.net/2022/05/welcome-home-wesley/?utm

I'm happy for Wil, who's a genuinely nice guy, but I can't say I enjoyed the appearance (or most of this season).  If you took a scalpel and cut out every last bit of the Mama Picard plot, I might have... slightly.  But even then, there was too much silliness.

Think of what they didn't explain.  If three different entities/organizations were either monitoring (The Travelers; then also Gary 7 and Tallinn's organization) or manipulating (The Q) this, isn't it weird they never encountered each other even once?   Also, why the heck did Wesley have to drop his name?  It was weird and silly, even if a nod to the TNG episode.  And I'm not sure I buy the all too convenient last second reveal that older Guinan knew all of this.  That's really not what the subtext of the esrlier scenes with her revealed.  Also, how did Agnes become the Queen yet ALL of the earlier hostile Federation/Borg stuff also happened?  We can speculate that the original iteration of the Queen originally in the timeline still existed and Agnes sat back and patiently waited for her to die or something, to make her move.  Maybe.  I dunno.  It's confusing.  

Next season's plot is pretty obvious, I guess. 

6 hours ago, norcalgal said:

 RIP Rios, he was done dirty this whole season, so I can't blame the actor if it was his decision to exit. In fact, I feel bad in advance for the other characters

Spoiler

(except perhaps Seven) because with TNG characters coming on board in S3, show might as well have jettisoned even more of them since they're probably going to be sidelined quite a bit...

 

And how little dignity his disappearance from the ship (not to mention one version of Agnes) was given.   Whoops!  He's gone!  We'll pretend to care about it next scene!  Heck, even Seven was dissed there.  Given an instant field commision, right after Raffi makes some inane comments about what a good Captain she'd make, so she can sit in a chair while Picard gives all of the actual orders.  Stinky!  Humiliating!  

Edited May 7, 2022 by saoirse
Spoiler tag added to quoted post

[Haleth]

That was disappointing.  So the whole universe depended on Picard resolving his mommy issues?  Ok. Sigh. 

Edited May 7, 2022 by Haleth

[Starchild]

4 hours ago, SnarkShark said:

Think of what they didn't explain.  If three different entities/organizations were either monitoring (The Travelers; then also Gary 7 and Tallinn's organization) or manipulating (The Q) this, isn't it weird they never encountered each other even once?

Actually, I think Wesley said that agents like Talinn and Gary Seven work for the Travelers. Neat little canon addition there.

Of course, the Travelers must know about Q by now, since Wes does. And presumably omniscient Q has always known about the Travelers. I guess they've mostly stayed out of each others' way? 

[MissLucas]

2 hours ago, Haleth said:

That was disappointing.  So the whole universe depended on Picard resolving his mommy issues?  Ok. Sigh. 

Well, Discovery had a season-long apocalyptic scenario caused by an alien teenage tantrum 🤷‍♂️

[summitsw]

I found most of the first season boring and was going to skip season 2 until I found out Q and Guinan would be in it. Watched the first two eps of season 2 and thought the premise was great til we got to time travel back to 2024 (they have done this so many times in every Trek that it’s complete unoriginal at this point. Would have been better to make the time point where it diverged in the Third World War, or something more interesting than two years in from the crap we’re all currently living in). From the time jump back I was bored for 8 straight episodes. The ‘Jean-Luc experienced a childhood trauma that effects the fate of the universe’ thing was ridiculous and watching him go through 8 episodes of therapy was SO VERY BORING.

Agnes is my least favourite new character and making her central to this plot and then making a new Borg Queen out of her was beyond stupid. If she’s now been around for four hundred years, then wouldn’t that mean that the original Borg doesn’t exist? That would have huge ramifications for the TNG, DS9 and Voyager crews at the very least. Like, you know, Locutus and Seven never existing. 

There was absolutely no reason for Soong or Kore to be in this season other than to feature those two actors. That that storyline led to Wil’s cameo as Wesley was the only saving grace. I enjoyed that moment mostly for what I know it means to Wil. 

As for the completely out of nowhere contrived crap of Laris and Picard’s romance, if he’s bound to find romance with someone now he’s no longer closed off then Beverly ‘been here all along’ Crusher for that storyline please. 

I was glad Chris stayed in the past, if only so we won’t have to see him in the future.

Seven and Raffi were the only good thing in this season. Since Picard is over after season 3, please give us the Seven spin-off that Jeri Ryan deserves.  

Spoiler

I’ll be tuning into season 3 only because the rest of the TNG cast are back. 

 

 

Edited May 7, 2022 by saoirse
Spoiler tag added

[Frozendiva]

I liked Q's and Picard's hug - like they were close friends or weird family.

I liked the idea of the Travelers and don't mind them.

No need for Wesley Crusher.

At least Rios got a happy ending and finally finding a place he belonged - living in the past - a man out of time.

Elnor rides again! The timeline has been repaired.

Seven and Raffi were good. Quagness made the Borg a bit less assimilacious. So saving billions of lives means some attention and recognition and acceptance? The rise of the machines has always been a sore point with humanity and new robot or AI overlords.

Not a great season. So much unnecessary stuff that dragged it down. Probably could have tightened up the story and made it 2 2 hour parts as a special.

[formerlyfreedom]

Just a reminder, season three discussion and spoilers should not happen here in a season two topic. Posts have had spoiler tags added. Thank you!

[starri]

4 hours ago, summitsw said:

If she’s now been around for four hundred years, then wouldn’t that mean that the original Borg doesn’t exist?

We've seen in both TNG and Voyager that the main Collective will cut off drones that gather too many thoughts that disrupt the hive mind.  I don't have a problem with Agnes gathering her own small-scale collective that was separate from the one we're more familiarly with.  Especially since she only appeared to have one ship.

[Hiyo]

Quote

Wow I must be the only person to really like this season.   Maybe because I don’t hate new trek out of spite.   Maybe because I like the idea of season 2 essentially being about what made Picard Picard.     Of course the show had its issues.  I still think it should have spent more time digging into Seven vs Annika Hansen and having her run into an ancestor of hers just for a moment.    I did like Alison Pill this season and her storyline was probably the most interesting.    Picard and Q should not have been as sweet as they were.  But then they have a weird and complicated history.   I don’t mind Rios staying in the past/current era. Giving him a happy ending was a good thing to do.  You don’t need to read too much into it.  Yes the future for him is probably hard and complicated but he is happier then being alone with a bunch of holographs that look like him.  

All in all I give if a thumbs up.  

I'll join you at that table. We'll be having vintage wine from Picard's vineyard along with some of his Secret Stash for Special Occasions Caviar. Tea, Earl Grey, and hot, will be served with dessert, natch.

I liked the season 2. Was it the best season of Star Trek ever? No, but it kept me entertained enough. My main issue is I would have liked to see them return to the future earlier. But overall I liked it.

[catsitter]

So many of the characters in this season were driven by loneliness. Q, Rios, Raffi, Agnes, even the Borg Queen.

[readster]

11 hours ago, Starchild said:

Actually, I think Wesley said that agents like Talinn and Gary Seven work for the Travelers. Neat little canon addition there.

Of course, the Travelers must know about Q by now, since Wes does. And presumably omniscient Q has always known about the Travelers. I guess they've mostly stayed out of each others' way? 

I remember years ago both Weaton and DeLance said outside of The Q and the Gray, they never really had any scenes together. They apparently did hang out outside the show and even made jokes. Especially after the Travler episodes, which I don't remember  DeLance's real reply because it was years ago in a magazine. "Seems like the Traveler was the anti-Q". The season was really a mix bag for me. Loved the final moments between Picard and Q and Rios got some real closure. Plus, the Borg situation honestly took them in a new place that was long, long overdue for the characters who became one note. I was happy to see Weaton though, so at least next season will be the last. This was just such a muttle season and trying to also play nice with continuity, especially at the end with the Khan File. 

[benteen]

I have to hand it to them...Picard actually managed to stick the landing. I really enjoyed this episode. 

I wasn't expecting Wesley's return. Very cool scene. I like the reveal that the Travelers are behind the supervisors. I didn't expect a mystery from TOS to be solved (ie the alien race Gary Seven was working for) and it totally worked. Wil was more Wil Wheaton than Wesley and I wish he had had a scene with Picard bit that was fine.

After largely wasting Q this season we got an amazing and emotional scene between him and Picard. It was the best scene in the entire run of Picard. I can buy that Picard would miss Q. And vice versa. I laughed at Q not knowing who Elinor was.

It was nice to see Picard in command again. He feels like TNG Picard at those moments. 

The finale was a success but was this season? No. Picard's 85-year-old undetected trauma was ridiculous and unnecessary. This shouldn't have been what defined him and it just didn't add up to the character we have seen in the past.

I was not a fan of Rios's storyline either. He's a really good character and this is the best they could come up with. So much for spinning the character off.

Also, did Talinn really have to die? It seemed pretty preventable.

That said, I am really looking forward to Season 3 again. 

[cambridgeguy]

54 minutes ago, benteen said:

After largely wasting Q this season we got an amazing and emotional scene between him and Picard. It was the best scene in the entire run of Picard. I can buy that Picard would miss Q. And vice versa. I laughed at Q not knowing who Elinor was.

He just couldn't help himself from trolling someone one last time since he clearly did know what happened to the guy.  I also found it funny that Q told Picard that not everything was about galaxy altering stakes, yet that's exactly what was up when he teleported them back to the Stargazer.

[millennium]

On 5/5/2022 at 9:02 PM, chaifan said:

And, OMG, they gave Wesley Crusher a redemption arc.  OK, that's not the best word for it, but for fuck's sake, he was such an annoying character on TNG

I always considered Wesley redeemed in TNG's "The First Duty," when he faced up to the consequences of participating in the Kolvoord Starburst and lying about it.   A very good episode, IMO.

9 hours ago, benteen said:

After largely wasting Q this season we got an amazing and emotional scene between him and Picard. It was the best scene in the entire run of Picard. I can buy that Picard would miss Q.

It was the only scene in the entire run of Picard that was 100% true to the character(s) history and nature.   It honored their bond without screwing it up.  A sad but very memorable ending for their story.  

[Starchild]

I'll miss Q

[marinw]

So why was Q dying? Simple ageing? The Q may have very long life spans, perhaps millennium, but are not immortal. Or is he sick?

Edited May 7, 2022 by marinw

[millennium]

1 hour ago, marinw said:

So why was Q dying? Simple ageing? The Q may have very long life spans, perhaps millennium, but are not immortal. Or is he sick?

I think he caught a few episodes of Discovery and decided there's no future in this.

[TVbitch]

At the risk of sounding like Mozart, it just had... "too many notes." And they were not fleshed out properly and fully.

Q was always my favorite character, and I was so thrilled he was going to be the story this season, but save for a few moments, it was unsatisfying for me. Not enough Q, and none of those iconic moments where Q embarrasses Picard, or uses big words that others don't understand, or his classic one-liners. I wanted far more interaction, discussion and philosophizing between Q and Picard. Here, Q seemed to be doing all the teaching, but in TNG, Picard just as equally offered wisdom and counsel to Q. I kept waiting for them to talk about death and for JL to offer some sage solace. 

Anyways, I just wanted it to live up to its potential. Maybe next season....

[formerlyfreedom]

Again - not the spot to discuss season three. Posts have been removed. Next steps are further sanctions, which may include warnings, suspensions, or more. Please stick to discussing this episode and the rest of season two. Thank you.

[millennium]

On 5/7/2022 at 1:01 PM, benteen said:

The finale was a success but was this season? No. Picard's 85-year-old undetected trauma was ridiculous and unnecessary. This shouldn't have been what defined him and it just didn't add up to the character we have seen in the past.
 

ITA.  Picard is a man who, in "Tapestry," intentionally took a Nausican dagger in the heart a second time rather than lead a diminished life. 

[summitsw]

On 5/7/2022 at 6:50 PM, starri said:

We've seen in both TNG and Voyager that the main Collective will cut off drones that gather too many thoughts that disrupt the hive mind.  I don't have a problem with Agnes gathering her own small-scale collective that was separate from the one we're more familiarly with.  Especially since she only appeared to have one ship.

I can agree to a point. They’ve cut off drones, yes, but not other Borg queens. I find it impossible to believe they didn’t know she existed and try to eliminate her. It’s also somewhat unbelievable that Agnes has only one ship, at the very least she should have been going around picking up the drones she knows about like Hugh and Seven and that colony from Voyager. She’d also have knowledge of other ships that she could possibly take over. Plus you’d think she’d want to intervene at something like, I don’t know… Wolf 359?
 

For people who were trying not to create any ‘butterflies’ creating a hybrid Borg Queen seems like a mighty big fail. 

Edited May 9, 2022 by summitsw

[Chit Chat]

On 5/6/2022 at 10:50 PM, Frozendiva said:

I liked the idea of the Travelers and don't mind them.

While driving on the interstate this weekend, I passed a car that had a decal that read "The Traveler is my co-pilot!"   I assumed it was a Star Trek reference, which made me laugh.  I don't know of any other Travelers, so enlighten me if any mythical travelers exist!

While there were parts of the season that I thought weren't necessary, Mr. Chat & I liked the final episode.  I don't mind admitting that!!

[millennium]

4 hours ago, ChitChat said:

While driving on the interstate this weekend, I passed a car that had a decal that read "The Traveler is my co-pilot!"   I assumed it was a Star Trek reference, which made me laugh.  I don't know of any other Travelers, so enlighten me if any mythical travelers exist!

It's not Star Trek.   I googled the decal and a bunch of stuff came up that I can't make heads or tails of.

[benteen]

Do you think Gary Seven quit in disgust when he found out Wesley was his boss?

[Lebanna]

2 hours ago, benteen said:

Do you think Gary Seven quit in disgust when he found out Wesley was his boss?

Maybe Wesley is just their in-house headhunter, or their head of HR.

Actually, it’s not a bad test. If you can be recruited on the spot by (Shut up) Wesley, you probably really want to get out of your life*.

*No disrespect to the actor, who I assume is absolutely lovely.

[MissLucas]

Since I loved Wheaton on TBBT and Leverage I was expecting a much more sarcastic recruitment speech.

[TAG42481]

Wait wait wait wait wait.

Agnes merged with the Borg Queen in 2024 ... and allowed the Borg to do EVERY TERRIBLE THING THEY'VE EVER DONE ... only to come to the Federation "now" and save them from the galactic event?  A galactic event that only shoots out energy in ONE DIRECTION (not 360 degrees) so we can put a shield up and prevent it?

I'm not even sure how I typed this post - my eyes rolled so hard they've fallen out of my head and I'm permanently blind.  THE MOST STUPID WRITING EVER.  And I'm sure there's much, much more I could post, but my head would explode if I attempted to contemplate it.

[Llywela]

9 hours ago, TAG42481 said:

Wait wait wait wait wait.

Agnes merged with the Borg Queen in 2024 ... and allowed the Borg to do EVERY TERRIBLE THING THEY'VE EVER DONE ...

Not quite. Agnes merged with a Borg Queen in 2024, one who had travelled back in time from 2401 and was weakened and had been completely severed from her Collective. The original Borg Collective of 2024 would have been still out there at that point, so that there would have been two separate Borg factions from that point on. One was the original Collective, which bulldozered its way through history as we've always known; Borgati would have had no influence or control over any of that whatsoever. The other was Agnes's Cooperative, which has no connection to the wider Collective, and would have spent the 400 years slowly but surely growing itself, building on that tiny beginning, and staying out of the way of history. The wider Collective would not have touched that Co-op with a barge pole, even if they came into contact with one another. There are many examples littered through Trek history of Cubes being severed from the Collective to prevent the spread of any 'infection' - including, for example, any pervasive thought pattern thought to be a danger to the Collective. That was why Hugh's Cube was severed from the wider Collective, which is how Hugh ultimately became free.

Fast forward back to 2401, Borgati's Cooperative and their very non-cube shaped ship came through a kind of rift in space-time, which is probably where they'd been hiding, to avoid interfering with history and to avoid being attacked, either by the regular Borg or anyone else.

Having said all that, yes, it is stupid writing and none of it is a story I'd have chosen to tell, given this cast and setting.

[wanderingstar]

That was the most I have ever liked Q. 

Oh hey, Wesley! 

The Borg in the Federation? Whoa. But I dig it. Would love to know what the hybrid Borg queen got up to in the 400 years.

Tallinn sacrificing herself gave me all the feels. Same with Picard getting closure. 

And Elnor lives! Well done, show!

 

 

[LaylaGirl]

On 5/8/2022 at 5:16 PM, ChitChat said:

While driving on the interstate this weekend, I passed a car that had a decal that read "The Traveler is my co-pilot!"   I assumed it was a Star Trek reference, which made me laugh.  I don't know of any other Travelers, so enlighten me if any mythical travelers exist!

While I don't think it explains the decal, there was a show called "Travelers" on Netflix and Showcase (in Canada) for three seasons beginning in 2016. The premise is that the world is ending in the future, so they send "travelers" to the past, into the bodies of people just as they die. Then they try to fix things so the future isn't so bad. I enjoyed the first two seasons, not so much the third.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travelers_(TV_series)

[SnarkShark]

On 5/12/2022 at 2:33 PM, LaylaGirl said:

While I don't think it explains the decal, there was a show called "Travelers" on Netflix and Showcase (in Canada) for three seasons beginning in 2016. The premise is that the world is ending in the future, so they send "travelers" to the past, into the bodies of people just as they die. Then they try to fix things so the future isn't so bad. I enjoyed the first two seasons, not so much the third.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travelers_(TV_series)

Nah.  95% of the time if it's a bumper sticker or car window decal, it's about Jeebus. At least presuming the OP was in the US.

[chaifan]

Re: Traveler is my Co-pilot...

Congratulations everyone who doesn't know what this is!  You're not the nerdiest/geekiest person in the room!   And that's saying a lot for people on this forum.  😁

It's from Critical Role - a D&D style web series.

[revbfc]

I accidentally got spoiled on the Borg requesting admission to the Federation, so I had to get my thrills from watching my wife get angry about it. 

You know, I enjoyed seeing all my favorite characters again (except Q; never liked Q), but this show didn’t matter.  Nothing mattered.  56 years of established timelines?  Fuck it!  Just revise everything.

 

[Llywela]

1 hour ago, revbfc said:

I accidentally got spoiled on the Borg requesting admission to the Federation, so I had to get my thrills from watching my wife get angry about it. 

You know, I enjoyed seeing all my favorite characters again (except Q; never liked Q), but this show didn’t matter.  Nothing mattered.  56 years of established timelines?  Fuck it!  Just revise everything.

The established timeline was not changed. Everything that happened through the entire history of the franchise still happened. Agnes's Borg Cooperative is a separate entity from the original Borg Collective, which still did everything we've previously seen it do. And only that one comparatively small faction of Borg requested membership of the Federation.

Having said all that, I was extremely disappointed by this season. The whole was considerably less than the sum of its parts, leading to the inescapable conclusion that it was a big mistake to structure an entire show so exclusively around Jean Luc Picard; his story was not strong enough to sustain this season, and trying to make it do so warped the natural development of everyone around him. I keep asking myself what I would change to fix the season, and the answer is: I can't. Because I think it was a mistake to tell this story to begin with. I'd have take a completely different approach to the season - and to the show as a whole!

[Chicago Redshirt]

On 5/6/2022 at 3:08 PM, TV Anonymous said:

• Cristóbal stays in 2024 and continues on living an adventurous life. Fine. How does he do it without any civil document? No passport, no social security, no birth certificate from anywhere.
• Where is the rocket launch site that is within small drone flying distance from Metropolitan Los Angeles?
• If Renée is Jean-Luc ancestor, does this mean that she will marry another Picard? Even in Star Trek universe family name follows paternal line.

Considering normal people can get fake documents all the time, and considering Cris has access to a girlfriend who works with undocumented people not to mention could at least conceivably work some 24th Century tech magic/connections, I'm not worried about him getting documents. 

Putting aside for the moment that the Trek Universe doesn't have to follow the guidelines of the real world, in the real world there's https://www.vandenberg.spaceforce.mil/.

Women could still give the last name Picard to their children even if they take their husband's name (or if they even have a husband.)

[Pallas]

In 1968, Gary Seven's home computer was spewing out his pick of convincing fake credentials like a cigarette machine. I'm sure Tallinn's is updated, and Rios has access. During his commencement speech at the Academy, Picard identified Renée as a cousin (many times removed), not a direct ancestor. 

[sugarbaker design]

On 5/20/2022 at 6:53 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

If Renée is Jean-Luc ancestor, does this mean that she will marry another Picard? Even in Star Trek universe family name follows paternal line.

On 5/20/2022 at 6:53 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

Women could still give the last name Picard to their children even if they take their husband's name (or if they even have a husband.)

On 5/22/2022 at 4:41 PM, Pallas said:

Picard identified Renée as a cousin (many times removed), not a direct ancestor. 

It was said early in the season that Renee Picard is not a direct ancestor of JL.  She is his many times great aunt.

[Tachi Rocinante]

On 5/16/2022 at 2:01 PM, chaifan said:

Re: Traveler is my Co-pilot...

Congratulations everyone who doesn't know what this is!  You're not the nerdiest/geekiest person in the room!   And that's saying a lot for people on this forum.  😁

It's from Critical Role - a D&D style web series.

I would have guessed it was from the video game Destiny, until I looked at a sample that has the CR logo.  (I know someone that still has a Dead Orbit sticker on their clunker.)

[millennium]

On 5/17/2022 at 1:15 PM, revbfc said:

56 years of established timelines?  Fuck it!  Just revise everything.

Oh wait -- for a moment I thought you were discussing Strange New Worlds.

[Paloma]

On 5/5/2022 at 5:16 PM, salaydouk said:

Okay so if Picard remembers the bullet holes in the wall or the stories of them in the wall... Then why didn't he also have stories about bodies in the chateau walls!?!?!?

Maybe he thought they were weird scuptures that were created as part of the original construction? Ridiculous, I know, but no more ridiculous than some of the other plot holes.

[dovegrey]

On 5/7/2022 at 1:01 PM, benteen said:

Also, did Talinn really have to die? It seemed pretty preventable.

Piggybacking off this nearly-year-old comment... I was convinced that she was actually Laris. It doesn't make any sense, to me, that she and Laris are different people 400 years apart but just happen to be indistinguishable and fondly attached to the same man. Soong's human neurotoxin could have just not worked on a Romulan. 🤷‍♂️

All in all, as a new-to-the-show binge viewer, this season did not work for me. Most close/deeply-felt character moments seemed forced and unearned because the writers decided to leave 1x10->2x1 character/story development to the fanfic writers, while deeply-felt moments that I expected to happen... never happened. Picard seemed so hung up on his surprise mom issues that he forgot to react to almost anything that happened to his crew or even anything happening to him between confusing flashbacks. My sense is that the writers weren't able to get out of their own heads long enough to write a good character-driven story (e.g., like when none of the characters blinked when Agnes became a Borg Queen and took off into space...the writers knew Agnes was "okay" but seemed to forget the characters and audience didn't). In my opinion, this was a supremely unfulfilling second season and a waste of the characters introduced in season one, with Raffi faring best. And I'm bummed that I found Picard to be the worst thing about Picard.

Anyway, I'm glad to see that Seven has had a chance to become her own person and grow as an individual; backing off from Starfleet after Voyager was likely the right move, even if I'm skeptical that she's so well-adjusted given she went from 6 to ~30-years-old as a mindless drone (hard to reconcile with how the xB's were depicted last season). Anyway, I'm happy that she was brought onto this show as a main character but sad that they seemed to dumb her down. In this episode alone, Voyager!Seven would have solved Soong's computer/drone problem in about 0.5 seconds, rather than wringing her hands while Raffi and Rios bumbled around; as I recall, Seven routinely ran tech circles around a ship full of brilliant Starfleet crewmembers. (There are probably ways to fanwank that, sure, but I'd love to see a good canonical deep dive into Seven.)

[PurpleTentacle]

On 5/9/2022 at 1:16 AM, ChitChat said:

While driving on the interstate this weekend, I passed a car that had a decal that read "The Traveler is my co-pilot!"   I assumed it was a Star Trek reference, which made me laugh.  I don't know of any other Travelers, so enlighten me if any mythical travelers exist!

That's a Critical Role reference. I very much recommend watching The Legend of Vox Machina and soon The Mighty Nein on Prime Video (the Traveler had a small Cameo in the most recent season of Vox Machina and will become more important in The Mighty Nein). Of course I would also recommend watching the original D&D roleplay, but that's hundreds of hours and might be a bit much at first.

On 5/9/2022 at 6:07 AM, millennium said:

It's not Star Trek.   I googled the decal and a bunch of stuff came up that I can't make heads or tails of.

To make heads and tails of it, I'd also recommend The Legend of Vox Machina to you. :D

On 5/16/2022 at 12:35 AM, SnarkShark said:

Nah.  95% of the time if it's a bumper sticker or car window decal, it's about Jeebus. At least presuming the OP was in the US.

You are correct. The Traveler is indeed a god.

Spoiler

or so it seems for a long time

[Quickbeam]

As a fan who has suffered the vagaries of drifting ST canon, I had very low expectations for this episode. I loved seeing Wil Wheaton if only because the industry is so hard on child actors. If he makes a few bucks, good on him.

Nice scene with De Lancie and Stewart. Had no idea De Lancie was that much taller than Stewart.

The rest of the episode was all *and a miracle happens* to me. No clue what transpired. 

[Prevailing Wind]

1 hour ago, Quickbeam said:

Had no idea De Lancie was that much taller than Stewart.

Stewart's 5'9"; De Lancie is 6'3"

Stewart's only 9 years older than I am. Yikes. He looks & sounds way older - not just in the show, but interviews, too.

[supposebly]

So, after binging this season after being utterly annoyed with season 3, this started out well and then, kind of became therapy for childhood trauma? So Picard could have a girlfriend?

You'd think that we would have better mental health support in the future for children who find their mothers hanging from a rope. Or that he would have been told by his father or a therapist at some point how ill his mother really was. This story was reliant on mental health attitudes from the 20th century. With some 19th century 'mad woman in the attic' imagery with the white night gown.

I adore Patrick Stewart but this was utterly self-indulgent and made no sense in a story about the future.

And returning to live in that house makes even less sense now.

I also hated that they put Rios into an utterly cliched story about Mexican immigrants with the cliched bad ICE agents and the cliched heroic doctor. He was such an interesting character in season 1 and now this. Ugh.

I love time travel stories and if it had been done with the sole purpose of getting Renee on that rocket and save the future, this would have been fine. Navigating early 21st century society and issues, dealing with the characters' relationships, keeping the Borg queen on a leash.

And now we have a good Borg queen? In the Delta Quadrant? How does that not mess up the timeline? How did she get there again? Couldn't she have helped Voyager to get home? Why didn't she help out to defeat the bad Borgs? 

I loved discovering the awesomeness that is Alison Pill in this show but I can't say I liked Agnes turning into a PC Borg queen. But then, I never even found the other Borg Queens interesting as a concept. I would have preferred the Borg to be mindless assimilators.

The problem with genre shows is that they often seem to need a speechifying antagonist instead of finding ways to make a faceless menace interesting. *cough Stargate replicators *cough

The less said about Mr. Not-Data, the better. Such a weird side-plot that only served to position him to prevent Renee from leaving. And give Brent Spiner and Isa Briones something to do.

I have nothing to say about Seven and Raffi. I think their relationship just seemed to be so forced. They implied a history that I never really felt.

I have even less to say about Q. He never made sense to me and this didn't do anything either.

At least Will Wheaton got a paycheck. He deserves one many times over.

RIP Annie Wersching. She was awesome as a Borg Queen.

[7-Zark-7]

Oooh... the Voyager erasure... They just like to pluck Seven of Nine out of that series, and leave the rest behind.

They were in LA in the 2020s and yet:

No Sarah Silverman reprising her role as the helpful scientist from "Future's End".

No crazy ass Captain Braxton, even though he was trapped on Earth for 30 years and should still be there.

But, just to rub salt in my wound, Yes... they bring back the actor who played Lieutenant Ducane (who worked on the timeship with Captain Braxton in "Relativity") just to play some random FBI agent who has nothing to do with anything.  For so long, I was hoping he'd reveal himself as Ducane. Honestly, they could have just had him standing on the street offering assistance to a mumbling disheveled Braxton with Seven doing a double take, and made a lot of people's day.

But no... these mutha$^*k3#s tried it.

[starri]

11 hours ago, 7-Zark-7 said:

No crazy ass Captain Braxton, even though he was trapped on Earth for 30 years and should still be there.

That episode was set 25 years before the stuff in this season.