S08.E07: It's Not About the Pastor

[SarahPrtr]

13 hours ago, Rbonnie said:

 

Even with the censored patch, I can tell that your daughter is gorgeous and I love her dimples!

 

7 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

If Lisa’s lips are moving, she’s lying. 

I could be on her side if she would say, “his Tweets are in keeping with my understanding of the Bible,” because she’s entitled to her point of view.  This would probably get her kicked off the show though, and she should be prepared to accept the consequences.

 

Ha!  I agree with you re: Lisa!

 

I don't know what kind of Bible she's reading, but it also mentions not committing adultery, so why is she marrying someone who so clearly is going to be cheating on her for the rest of her life/short marriage?

 

7 hours ago, nytonc said:

I think the reason she doesn’t come right out publicly to voice her disapproval of his disgusting comments is because deep down inside she agrees with him. And she’s as fucking  dumb as a box of rocks and can’t see that not speaking out against him will hurt them in the long run.

Yeah, she's been sneaky about that this whole time, but didn't say anything about it because she wanted to stay on the show.  She loves the attention and the limelight more than she loves Jax, but he's a piece of shit, so I don't care if she uses him. 

 

7 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

Proposition eight would never have passed with 52.3% of the vote in California if there were not an overwhelming amount of  people who believed this way.  Perhaps many of these people changed their minds in the last seven years, but it’s doubtful all of them did.

Same in Australia.  We passed the law regarding making same sex legal a few years ago for the entire country.

[Legalbeagle421]

5 hours ago, princelina said:

In the case of an actual Christian pastor, it is that gay marriage is unbiblical and that pastor should not be marrying people who are not of the opposite sex.  However, so is driving to Vegas to sleep with a stranger you saw on tv, following him to move in with him in California, being involved with various sexual shenanigans and near constant drunkenness, and even, as a "Christian woman", marrying a non-Christian like Jax.  If this was her actual pastor from growing up, he should have been having off-camera talks with her about that, rather than agreeing to perform her wedding to this guy on tv.  Peace to all 🙂 

Oh yes, understood in regards to the pastor. I was referring to LiberterianSlut’s discussion of proposition 8 in California. Voting against someone’s right to marry who they want. Gross.

Totally agree with your assessment on Brittany. Why is the pastor so worried about homosexuality when she’s breaking all kinds of other “rules”? Sounds like he just wanted to be on tv. Relatedly, I grew up in a Christian household and I never understood people who tried to force their views on others. Maybe I’m not a “good christian” lol. 

[DrSparkles]

5 hours ago, biakbiak said:

I think Raquel is a moron but her relationship  with James is so terrifyingly toxic that it’s even more uncomfortable to watch their scenes. Watching their relationship after this season of Below Deck and it’s misogyny it’s an additional layer of horrifying that they are playing this emotionally abusive relationship for entertainment. Yes, I know that this show has a history of crazy unhealthy relationships but it just further proof that the rot is all throughout the network. And yes I realize I am part of the problem watching it.

Oh my god. That kitchen convo about her going/not to Peter’s bday party? CHILLING. Run girl, you in danger.

Also, the horror?! Peter has had to work on his bday several times?!?! These people.

ETA: Brittany’s problem eyebrows seem to be a combo of microblading & botox.

Edited February 19, 2020 by DrSparkles

[Iris987]

4 hours ago, Marley said:

The exchange about Jaxs wedding song made me laugh.

"That's your song choice? Very funny. What is it really? No, really? You're serious? Still the One is really the song? Oh, OK. That totally makes sense. Great song"

Beau's horror at the song choice and then the desperate backtracking when Jax defended it was the first time I've genuinely liked him and the only laugh at loud moment of the episode. Screw Kristen trying to bat. The expression on Beau's face is the MVP of season.

[GonnahearmeRoar]

Sandoval and Ariana wanted to clear their names in this mess. Ariana’s decision to celebrate pride as a bisexual woman has me questioning her intentions. Was this a way to distance herself from what was going on with the pastor? Sandoval pointing out tagged posts and no action to address the issue of the pastor was a definite throw Jax and Brittany under the bus. 

 

 

[Jezebel97]

9 hours ago, breezy424 said:

Lisa - put your f'ing seatbelt on properly.

Beau - would be btter to put that casserole on the middle rack.

What troubled me is that most of them knew about the pastor for the last six months.  And it takes all  this time for Tom to confront Jax.  After they finally decide to change pastors.  Shut up Tom.  If you or anyone else was that upset,  say it when you found out.  Not two weeks before the wedding and a new pastor was decided on.

Get out Raquel.  No.  You really need to get out.

Exactly Sandoval as usual was grandstanding with his high morality crap.  Where was all this the first time he was made aware of the homophobic piece of shit pastor?  At this point there really was nothing left to say, the POS pastor was cancelled & it's done.

The whole he "needs answers" is just another way to make the shit show about him.  He knows what a dumbass selfish douche Jax is for over 10 years, after all the rotten things he's done to Sandoval & all, he now needs answers?!?

Deep down he & to a lesser extent Ariana are resentful that the Dumb & Dumber couple are the center of the season due to their wedding.  Since season 1 TomToms are the supporting cast to Jaxhole, Schwartzie is ok with this Sandoval will never be.

"I'm sorry but" I never bought his whole pious act since day one



 

or his fakes ass crying

[Little Lady Back]

Brittany screaming for Jax to knock someone the fuck out...someone please knock Brittany the fuck out!

[nexxie]

I really hope Jax and Brittany are happy together, but can’t help thinking narcissist Jax is marrying someone he perceives as “good” with the idea that he’ll be seen as good better. So funny that he thought being a pastor = being good - apparently he hasn’t read about the con man pastors who end up in the news or in jail.

[nexxie]

Raquel has to be with James just for the show. And even that is no excuse - wonder if her storyline involves LVP helping her out of the situation.

[Otherkate]

10 hours ago, Callaphera said:

Well, now that I'm committed to my "Raquel is the future child of Jax and Brittany sent back in time from the future to make sure her parents marry and have a child, otherwise she won't exist" head canon, I have officially cast DJ James Kennedy as the villain who also has come from the future, only he's trying to distract Raquel from her quest with his mind games. James won this battle, keeping Raquel dumbfounded enough that she didn't go to Peter's party and stop Sandoval and Ariana from causing shit, but this is a war and our Stupid Protagonist is in it to win it. 

This is everything and now I am completely co-opting it for myself. Can't wait for next week.

8 hours ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

Ariana: “This is what always happens. The high-pitched, like, yah YAAAAH yah!”

That was so weird and funny.

In an episode extremely devoid of humor, this was a nice funny spot. 

No wonder Ariana is depressed, her house is a nightmare. Please hire someone to fix it, kids.

Aren't you guys like SO into whatever is going on with Max and that other blonde girl? I know I'm not!

[Carolina Girl]

Can someone explain to me what exactly Kristen did that has the useless blob otherwise known as Katie so effing upset?  That Kristen has difficulty with Carter?  How often did Kristen (and the rest of us) have to listen to that worthless twit whine about Schwartz's commitment issues / cheating / drinking or whatever until that engagement party (and then the constant bickering afterward)?  Or how about Stassi and the narcissic man-bun known as Patrick?  I don't even like Kristen but I really want to drop kick Katie over the Wells Fargo Building.

I rewatched Seasons 4 and 5 on Hulu over the last week and watched her morph into Stassi season 1, especially regarding Lala.   She hated her from jump street.  No one can be friendly with Lala because she called me fat.  And you insinuated she was a slut from the moment you met her.  But of course that all changed when the "married man" they were all upset about turned out to be someone who gave them a 30-minute ride in the crappiest private jet I've never seen.

[heatherchandler]

1 hour ago, Little Lady Back said:

Brittany screaming for Jax to knock someone the fuck out...someone please knock Brittany the fuck out!

"I am a good Christian woman!"

minutes later...

"Knock him the fuck out!"

I usually HATE a gang-up, and usually take the side of the ganged-upon... but I hate Jax and really hate Brittany, so fire away, gang.  I love that they are getting roasted on twitter.

 

[FozzyBear]

Annnnd I was right. I hate Jax, Brittany, Sandoval, and Arianna. They all suck. Jax and Brittany really don’t care about anyone but themselves and only replaced the pastor because they were getting shit. They are shallow horrible people. However, nothing they did was going to satisfy Tom and Arianna until Tom and Arianna got to be self righteous on camera. They are also shallow horrible people.

[ivygirl]

3 hours ago, DrSparkles said:

Oh my god. That kitchen convo about her going/not to Peter’s bday party? CHILLING. Run girl, you in danger.

Yes. I frequently feel puzzled at best and disgusted at worst by the choices people make on this show, and roll my eyes at the stupid things they say, but this is one of the few times I’ve watched and had serious alarm bells of fear go off on someone’s behalf. 

Raquel is not bright, but she doesn’t deserve that kind of mind-screwing mistreatment. (No one does)

 

Edited February 19, 2020 by ivygirl

[bichonblitz]

First the engagement party. Then the bachelor/bachelorette parties. Then the princess bridal shower. Then the wedding. Then, wait for it... pregnancy announcements, baby showers, baby luncheon's, baby birth's...When will this nightmare end? I can't with this show anymore. Oh, and we still have Stassi engagement and wedding bullshit to get through. Not sure how much of Lala's we will have to endure. 

I'm loving all the negative comments Brit got on social media about her stupid princess bridal shower. It's so hard, ya'll, the comments really hurt ma feelin's, ya'll. Whimper, whimper. 

I also liked the shit talking Stassi and Lala were doing about Brittney behind her back. Wonder what Brit thinks about that after seeing it air.

Sandoval is clearly insanely jealous of the attention Brit and Jax are getting over this wedding fiasco all season long. He is doing anything and everything to put a big, dark cloud over all of it. Just to add fuel to his already burning fire, it's pretty obvious he was set up by production to harp on the pastor issue at Peter's birthday party. They are all told what they have to do/say/fight about before the camera's start rolling. Same thing with the Sadoval/Stassi fight. I read they had to do several takes before they got it right by someone that was there that day and watched it all. 

[TattleTeeny]

12 hours ago, Thumper said:

Princesses at a bridal shower?? What is she, 6?  

Nice of her friends to enable her, but no.  So weird.

It was not my cup of tea, but neither are "standard" bridal showers (or bachelorette parties, ugh. UGH!), which I find no less weird than Brittany's. princess theme.  

[Carolina Girl]

34 minutes ago, FozzyBear said:

Jax and Brittany really don’t care about anyone but themselves and only replaced the pastor because they were getting shit.

Because of the delay between filming and broadcast, I'm still hazy about the timeline of when everyone knew.  I think I first heard about it here probably at the time of filming.  But considering Bravo's unqualified support for the LGBTQ community, it would not surprise me in the least of these two jackasses weren't going to do anything about it initially (especially since from what I understand, the vile comments had been out there for months).  It would not surprise me to learn once the story went viral Bravo (justifiably) stepped in and either (1) told Lisa to get them to fire the pastor or (2) told them directly that there would be no financing of this farce if presided over by this walking turd with a clerical collar.  

[Carolina Girl]

And by the way Peter, who the hell invites one-half of a couple to a birthday party?  "Hi, you can come, but your boyfriend can't.  I'm sure he'll be just fine with it."  

And frankly Raquel, why the fuck did you even mention it?  Admit it, you WANTED to go and you WANTED James to tell you it would be all right if you went.  Don't whine to me about how "volatile: he is - mentioning this was pretty much designed to set him off.  If my live-in boyfriend came home and told me he was invited - without me - to a party where most of the participants either have in the past or would be smack-talking me, I'd tell him to go and while he was out, changed the damn locks.  

[cheewhiz]

I'm 19 minutes into this week's episode and I really cannot stand Lala. She has become "that bitch" that I want to throat punch. She really must think she is better than everyone else.. Her little quip "that's the most I have ever helped" made me want to vomit. The ego is out of control.

The Princesses? Grow the fuck up Brittany. Like a 5 year old's birthday party. 

Edited February 19, 2020 by cheewhiz
dear lord, i just keep watching this shit show and have more and more to say!

[GonnahearmeRoar]

1 hour ago, Carolina Girl said:

Can someone explain to me what exactly Kristen did that has the useless blob otherwise known as Katie so effing upset?  That Kristen has difficulty with Carter?  How often did Kristen (and the rest of us) have to listen to that worthless twit whine about Schwartz's commitment issues / cheating / drinking or whatever until that engagement party (and then the constant bickering afterward)?  Or how about Stassi and the narcissic man-bun known as Patrick?  I don't even like Kristen but I really want to drop kick Katie over the Wells Fargo Building.

I rewatched Seasons 4 and 5 on Hulu over the last week and watched her morph into Stassi season 1, especially regarding Lala.   She hated her from jump street.  No one can be friendly with Lala because she called me fat.  And you insinuated she was a slut from the moment you met her.  But of course that all changed when the "married man" they were all upset about turned out to be someone who gave them a 30-minute ride in the crappiest private jet I've never seen.

It sucks Katie, Stassi and Lala think they are so much better than her.  How hurtful! Kristin should leave her private things out of their ears. Disgusting to have everything you shared thrown back in your face by your supposed friends. 

[b2H]

7 hours ago, Marley said:

I’m ready for Jax and Brittanys weeding to be over.

I'm loving the mis-spell because I'd like to weed them out of this show.  They're awful, awful people and they deserve each other, but not on my TV.

[bichonblitz]

16 minutes ago, Carolina Girl said:

And by the way Peter, who the hell invites one-half of a couple to a birthday party?  "Hi, you can come, but your boyfriend can't.  I'm sure he'll be just fine with it." 

No fan of James but if my husband was constantly invited to events and I was left out, I would have a huge problem with it. Raquel should keep her mouth shut about the invites, though. Unless she really wants to go to the parties in which case she should break up with James and go be free to do what ever she wants. 

[b2H]

2 hours ago, Little Lady Back said:

Brittany screaming for Jax to knock someone the fuck out...someone please knock Brittany the fuck out!

I'm hoping that, on seeing this play back during the reunion show, Andy puts Lisa on the hot seat for allowing this behavior on her show.  If Lisa is smart, she'll cut these two loose next season.

Always remember and never forget - this is Lisa's show.  Lisa is the one that repaired this pastor nonsense because it's HER show.  Not Jax's, not Brittany's, not any of the other chuckleheads.  They serve at the pleasure of Lisa and J&B's behavior on this episode should be a dealbreaker for Lisa.

[bichonblitz]

Everybody always talking about how stupid Raquel is. Brittney is every bit as stupid but somehow gets a pass from her friends. Is she more bearable because she uses that annoying, cutsie southern twang to make herself appear so sweet?  If you ask me, Brit is not only stupid but also marrying someone worse than James. 

[princelina]

1 hour ago, FozzyBear said:

Annnnd I was right. I hate Jax, Brittany, Sandoval, and Arianna. They all suck. Jax and Brittany really don’t care about anyone but themselves and only replaced the pastor because they were getting shit. They are shallow horrible people. However, nothing they did was going to satisfy Tom and Arianna until Tom and Arianna got to be self righteous on camera. They are also shallow horrible people.

I know it's a show and this was chosen as a "storyline" but in the real world this is the one and only thing I'd agree with Jax and Brittany on - if you had a problem with something for the last 6 months, why are you now bringing it up 2 weeks before the wedding?  No one looked good last night 😄 

[angelamh66]

I didn't think I'd ever be back on the Sandoval train after the Stassi rage texting incident.  But lo and behold,  here I am. Anyone who takes on coked up defensive Jax, and but it's my weeeeedddddiiiing Britney is ok in my book. She is the worst.  Screeching that she didn't do anything wrong and bitching about social media commenters being mean to her. I just think she can't handle negative feedback,  even from total strangers.  The social media tide has turned on her, and since she apparently lives and dies by that shit, she just cannot handle it. 

[Ubiquitous]

I wonder how one rents princesses and how much it costs. 🤔

The entire segment at Britney's party and her meltdown ob people saying mean things ob it on social media contributed to my eye injuries last night. 🙄

Is "bisexual" this year's "transexual"?  

[hoodooznoodooz]

13 hours ago, Callaphera said:

Well, now that I'm committed to my "Raquel is the future child of Jax and Brittany sent back in time from the future to make sure her parents marry and have a child, otherwise she won't exist" head canon, I have officially cast DJ James Kennedy as the villain who also has come from the future, only he's trying to distract Raquel from her quest with his mind games. James won this battle, keeping Raquel dumbfounded enough that she didn't go to Peter's party and stop Sandoval and Ariana from causing shit, but this is a war and our Stupid Protagonist is in it to win it. 

So it’s Back to the Future with elements of Terminator II.

[2dogmom]

I thought they were talking about Looks Like we Made it.... Barry Manilow.

I'm so old.

 

 

 

[eleanorofaquitaine]

28 minutes ago, princelina said:

I know it's a show and this was chosen as a "storyline" but in the real world this is the one and only thing I'd agree with Jax and Brittany on - if you had a problem with something for the last 6 months, why are you now bringing it up 2 weeks before the wedding?  No one looked good last night 😄 

See, I completely understand where Sandoval and Ariana are coming from. It WAS brought up in January 2019 and swept under the rug.  And I do think that everyone has been walking on egg shells around Brittany and Jax, because god forbid Brittany get upset that she isn't getting the absolute perfect wedding. 

IMO, Sandoval asked an appropriate question in the appropriate way and Jax was just mad he got caught. I'm Team Sandoval on this one. 

[worleybird]

So how long before Ariana and Dayna have a little sumthin'-sumthin' goin' on behind (or in front of) Sandoval's and (God's gift) Max's back?

[LibertarianSlut]

6 hours ago, SarahPrtr said:

Same in Australia.  We passed the law regarding making same sex legal a few years ago for the entire country.

Oh, I should have explained better—Proposition 8 was a proposed amendment to California’s constitution to prevent gay marriage.  It was voted in by over 7 million people.  And it was overturned a bunch of years back.  My point in bringing it up was that it is not a fringe viewpoint to have reservations about the LGBT lifestyle in California, let alone the rest of the country.  The reason I brought it up was to point out that Bravo does not always represent the mainstream point of view of this country.  There are people who feel all kinds of ways, and it’s not that one has been proven right and the other proven wrong.  

I found this episode really tough to swallow.  I couldn’t sleep last night—if I’m being honest, it was probably related to this episode—so I re-watched it at 4 am, like one of those movie detectives who re-watches film over and over because they think it will clue them in to the identity of the murderer.  And I was intrigued and appalled.  Then I looked into the minister, and it got even stranger from there.  I am finding myself re-thinking some of my own beliefs.  It really got to me.  

Re-watching the episode, I found it was positively Orwellian.  And Kafkaesque.  From the beginning, when Lisa is talking to Ken in the car, and she pretends she just heard about the minister, Ken tells Lisa that this minister’s views fly in the face of everything Lisa believes in and Lisa says in this chilling way, something like, “well, we’ll just have to tell them.”  And she’s completely calm and almost charming about it.  It was so chilling.  Like, in that moment, obviously Lisa was going to change Brittney’s and Jax’s minds about who was going to officiate their wedding, and that was going to be that.  And, of course, that’s what happened.

Then Sandoval, Ariana and Lala kept saying how uncomfortable this thing with the preacher was, when the info had been out since at least January 2019.  They just kept saying—especially Sandoval—that they are getting tagged in these re-tweets about this pastor and they’re really unhappy and uncomfortable.  I have to agree with everyone who posted here—why did Sandoval wait so long?  Why didn’t he bring it up to Jax and Brittney a long, long time ago that this was wrong to him, and he had reservations about supporting it?  Why didn’t Ariana, as a bi-woman, who said twice that this pastor is trying to invalidate her humanity, not say anything?  Why did Ariana go to Lisa?  Lisa is not even Brittney’s boss at this point, not that I would understand why a boss gets a say over someone’s nuptials.  Who is Lisa?   Is she Napoleon?  

Then Brittney doesn’t even have the decency to call the pastor, she texted him.  I can only imagine what kind of conversation happened between her and Lisa and God knows who else behind closed doors.  The thing is, I don’t think Lisa cares about the LGBT cause much further than it’s lining her pocketbook.  She knew about this “homophobic” pastor.  There is no way Andy knew in January 2019, but Lisa didn’t.  So why didn’t she go to Brittney and Jax then?  Because it wasn’t causing her a personal problem until two weeks before the wedding.  

Then, after Brittney and Jax changed the pastor to Lance Bass, Lisa aka Napoleon clearly gave the order, A Few Good Men Style, that Brittney wasn’t to be touched.  Everyone except Sandoval suddenly wanted to whitewash the whole matter and pretend it didn’t happen.  Brittney was back in full good standing with everyone except Sandoval, and, by asking questions, Sandoval made himself the target.  Why can’t he ask questions?  What are you guys hiding?  If there was a grave ill going on, better late than never, right?  

Say it had been a Nazi that Brittney and Jax had hired to officiate their wedding—no one can say “boo” because they changed their minds at the bottom of the ninth?  Huh?  If this preacher is really a bad guy like everyone is saying, the question still stands—why did they choose him?

Then I saw that the Tweet they put on the screen was dated February 2015.  So this info was 4+ years old.  I figured this must have been a really bad guy that people would be unearthing his Tweets going back so far, so I looked into him.  I can’t find any evidence that Ryan Dotson is “homophobic,” much less a piece of shit.  

He gave an interview to Page Six, and he sounds like a mainstream, Christian clergyman with small-town or traditional values:  https://pagesix.com/2019/06/14/pastor-who-made-anti-lgbtq-comments-wont-officiate-jax-and-brittanys-wedding/

He says in his full statement, which is buried in tiny font at the bottom of the article, that he is an American who is entitled to his Christian values, and that Brittney and Jax approached him, because they wanted a Christian wedding.  He says he loves the gay person (he uses the term “homosexual,” but I’m not sure I’m allowed to use that word, so I’ll just say “gay.”)  He says he never discriminated against a gay person.  He leased his property to a gay person, he has gay people working for him in all of his businesses, and he reports that they are some of his best workers.  He reports that he has been the target of a smear campaign of hate and intolerance by people who claim to be on the side of tolerance.  

I simply don’t see what’s wrong with those statements.  Where does Ariana derive that he wouldn’t recognize her as a person?   I feel really bad for the guy, though I think he was naive to agree to officiate this wedding.  I think Brittney and Jax were much more in the wrong, especially Brittney, to have one foot in each world.  As others have said upthread, you don’t really get to move out to one of the most pro-LGBT places in the world to sleep with a guy you barely know, become his live-in girlfriend, let him buy you silicone breasts, become employed by a huge LGBT activist, participate in her Pride events for years...and then ask Ryan Dotson to marry you.  It’s like being a little bit pregnant.  It’s confusing when someone has one foot in the traditional world (when it suits them) and one foot in the progressive world (when it suits them).  If you are going to straddle both worlds, you need to put a lot of thought into your responses when your friends from both walks of life come to you with questions.  The more I think about it, the more awful it was that Brittney screamed “fuck you” to Sandoval for asking to ask a freaking question.  But I don’t see what the pastor did wrong, other than agreeing to this in the first place.  He was just living his life according to his conscience in Kentucky, which is leaps and bounds ahead of what Brittney is doing—living the unexamined life in which she stands for nothing and appeases all. 

And I guess it caused me to reconsider my views, because I posted yesterday that I wouldn’t go to a wedding that I didn’t support.  This used to be one of the few small things my husband and I would disagree about—I would say I wouldn’t go to a wedding and be phony about a couple who shouldn’t be together, and he said he didn’t care.  But does my “conscience” extend to the officiant?  At what point would I be willing to throw down the gauntlet and refuse to attend a wedding?  If the people getting married aren’t exactly how I want them to be, and the officiant isn’t in lockstep with my belief system?  Why?  Would it kill me to celebrate something that doesn’t adhere, chapter and verse, to my lifestyle?  Would it kill the people on the show to have attended the wedding without fanfare, or at most, raise a conscientious objection as soon as they realized what was going on, and bowed out of the wedding graciously if they couldn’t abide by it?  Because nothing even resembling that happened here.  I think everyone on this show who was involved with this thing behaved terribly.  Lisa, Lala, Jax, Sandoval and Ariana, but especially Brittney, and the whole thing makes me sad.  I don’t enjoy this type of entertainment.  

[hoodooznoodooz]

1 hour ago, bichonblitz said:

Everybody is always talking about how stupid Raquel is. Brittney is every bit as stupid but somehow gets a pass from her friends. Is she more bearable because she uses that annoying, cutsie southern twang to make herself appear so sweet?  If you ask me, Brit is not only stupid but also marrying someone worse than James. 

I think that this is because the cameras always capture how confused, lost and uncomprehending Raquel looks. We see her struggling so often to construct a reply to an attack, as the clocks patiently tick. And then when she finally does speak, her arguments/thoughts seem so simple-minded. Brittany’s arguments are usually as simple-minded, but at least she accesses them more quickly. 

Edited February 19, 2020 by hoodooznoodooz

[2dogmom]

something about max reminds me of kermit the frog, his head and body.....but kermit has a much better personality and I totally understand miss piggy's attraction to him.

I don't understand anyone's  attraction to max, he is skinny and gossip-y and lacks the most basic masculine traits. 

 

[Never Again]

8 hours ago, SarahPrtr said:

21 hours ago, Rbonnie said:

 

Even with the censored patch, I can tell that your daughter is gorgeous and I love her dimples!

@SarahPrtr   Sarah, that’s so sweet, thank you!

[hoodooznoodooz]

4 hours ago, nexxie said:

I really hope Jax and Brittany are happy together, but can’t help thinking narcissist Jax is marrying someone he perceives as “good” with the idea that he’ll be seen as good better. So funny that he thought being a pastor = being good - apparently he hasn’t read about the con man pastors who end up in the news or in jail.

I would not be surprised if Brittany pitched it to Jax thus. “If I’m your girlfriend, it’ll be gooder for your image, compared to you jumping from skank to skank. If we get married, it will improve your image even fastlier.” 

[heatherchandler]

33 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

 

Then, after Brittney and Jax changed the pastor to Lance Bass, Lisa aka Napoleon clearly gave the order, A Few Good Men Style, that Brittney wasn’t to be touched.  Everyone except Sandoval suddenly wanted to whitewash the whole matter and pretend it didn’t happen.  Brittney was back in full good standing with everyone except Sandoval, and, by asking questions, Sandoval made himself the target.  Why can’t he ask questions?  What are you guys hiding?  If there was a grave ill going on, better late than never, right?  

 

 

This is such a great analogy!

I also agree with your findings, there must be A LOT that went on behind closed doors.  It was like a badly acted play, and the timing is not "right."  Everything seemed rehearsed. 

 

25 minutes ago, 2dogmom said:

 

I don't understand anyone's  attraction to max, he is skinny and gossip-y and lacks the most basic masculine traits. 

 

Something about Max is off, and I am not buying the Max & Dayna relationship at all.  You can see there is nothing between them.  They must have gotten together before filming started and decided to play out this couple -act.

[b2H]

48 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

I have to agree with everyone who posted here—why did Sandoval wait so long?

For the record, the PRIDE parade in LA in 2019 was on 9 June.  If the pastor was hired in December of 2018 and fired on or about 12 June, yeah, a lot of time passed.  Now, exactly when did people know about this?  That I don't know - but there is a period of at least six months.

The whole thing with hiring Lance Bass is just ridiculous.  Hell, why not just use Lisa, since she's apparently qualified to marry folks?

Edited February 19, 2020 by b2H

[hoodooznoodooz]

3 hours ago, ivygirl said:

Yes. I frequently feel puzzled at best and disgusted at worst by the choices people make on this show, and roll my eyes at the stupid things they say, but this is one of the few times I’ve watched and had serious alarm bells of fear go off on someone’s behalf. 

Raquel is not bright, but she doesn’t deserve that kind of mind-screwing mistreatment. (No one does)

 

Does Peter have a significant other? Because Raquel choosing James and Dayna choosing Max, so that they could appear on the show, makes me think that there must be something utterly repulsive about Peter, despite seeming like a fairly decent guy, if he can’t be either woman’s foot in the door. 

[njbchlover]

4 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

"I am a good Christian woman!"

minutes later...

"Knock him the fuck out!"

I usually HATE a gang-up, and usually take the side of the ganged-upon... but I hate Jax and really hate Brittany, so fire away, gang.  I love that they are getting roasted on twitter.

 

That, to me, is the real, true Brittany.  I've never been a big fan of hers, and thought that she was putting on a "sweet Southern girl" front for a long time.  IMO, in reality, she is someone who has no qualms about getting nasty quickly.  I don't buy for one minute that she is having wedidng jitters or nerves or whatever they are calling it.  If she and Jax last more than two years, it will be a miracle.

I'm so over all of this Jax/Brittany wedding stuff - even more over it than I was with Schaena's wedding.  

Edited February 19, 2020 by njbchlover

[nytonc]

2 hours ago, 2dogmom said:

I thought they were talking about Looks Like we Made it.... Barry Manilow.

I'm so old.

 

 

 

Me too. Weren’t they? I guess I’m right up there with you. 

[Mahamid Frauded Me]

why after watching this show do I feel the need to whip out a can of scrubbing bubbles and douse myself with it - all these people make  my skin crawl

 

[blixie]

Quote

'm Team Sandoval on this one. 

Yeah someone mentioned that Ariana brought it up initially,  and I can see them deciding since it WAS NOT for the camera drama, that one of them should say something for them BOTH and since she's the one who is gay it might penetrate more coming from her, Jaxny might be less defensive and reactive. My guess is they were dismissive and reactive and  Ariana told Tom they should let it lie. I also think this is why Tom was bringing it up now, because Ariana had and they didn't give a fuck, LVP does and suddenly Lance Bass is marrying them. I think it's legitimate for him to care/to wonder if their motivation was actually because they care about their gay friends and the gay community they work in, or if they just did what their boss told them too so they could ALL keep making money off that community. I also have to wonder if they were explicitly told not to address it until filming where it would be resolved one way or another by LVP decree. 

Now it doesn't make Tom any less stupid for stirring the shit after it had more or less BEEN resolved but the man  has weird hills to die on and he dies on them weirdly. He can find a way to be wrong even when he's right more or less. 

Edited February 19, 2020 by blixie

[ivygirl]

40 minutes ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

Does Peter have a significant other? Because Raquel choosing James and Dayna choosing Max, so that they could appear on the show, makes me think that there must be something utterly repulsive about Peter, despite seeming like a fairly decent guy, if he can’t be either woman’s foot in the door. 

I really wonder! Some of the women in the cast did date him, and didn’t Dayna hang out in the bathroom with him (and deny anything happened)? He’s also dated non-show women. I used to think he was the coolest guy on the show... but not really anymore. 

29 minutes ago, njbchlover said:

That, to me, is the real, true Brittany.  I've never been a big fan of hers, and thought that she was putting on a "sweet Southern girl" front for a long time.  IMO, in reality, she is someone who has no qualms about getting nasty quickly.  I don't buy for one minute that she is having wedidng jitters or nerves or whatever they are calling it.  If she and Jax last more than two years, it will be a miracle.

I'm so over all of this Jax/Brittany wedding stuff - even more over it than I was with Schaena's wedding.  

Yes, yes, and yes. She put on that front but revealed herself really quickly when Mama Frosty Lips came to town and they joked about Brittany having keggers at home during high school. There’s also that matter of DATING JAX, which I just can’t escape. None of those scream “naive ingenue” to me.

[eleanorofaquitaine]

2 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

 

He gave an interview to Page Six, and he sounds like a mainstream, Christian clergyman with small-town or traditional values:  https://pagesix.com/2019/06/14/pastor-who-made-anti-lgbtq-comments-wont-officiate-jax-and-brittanys-wedding/

He says in his full statement, which is buried in tiny font at the bottom of the article, that he is an American who is entitled to his Christian values, and that Brittney and Jax approached him, because they wanted a Christian wedding.  He says he loves the gay person (he uses the term “homosexual,” but I’m not sure I’m allowed to use that word, so I’ll just say “gay.”)  He says he never discriminated against a gay person.  He leased his property to a gay person, he has gay people working for him in all of his businesses, and he reports that they are some of his best workers.  He reports that he has been the target of a smear campaign of hate and intolerance by people who claim to be on the side of tolerance.  

I simply don’t see what’s wrong with those statements.  Where does Ariana derive that he wouldn’t recognize her as a person?   I feel really bad for the guy, though I think he was naive to agree to officiate this wedding.  I think Brittney and Jax were much more in the wrong, especially Brittney, to have one foot in each world.  As others have said upthread, you don’t really get to move out to one of the most pro-LGBT places in the world to sleep with a guy you barely know, become his live-in girlfriend, let him buy you silicone breasts, become employed by a huge LGBT activist, participate in her Pride events for years...and then ask Ryan Dotson to marry you.  It’s like being a little bit pregnant.  It’s confusing when someone has one foot in the traditional world (when it suits them) and one foot in the progressive world (when it suits them).  If you are going to straddle both worlds, you need to put a lot of thought into your responses when your friends from both walks of life come to you with questions.  The more I think about it, the more awful it was that Brittney screamed “fuck you” to Sandoval for asking to ask a freaking question.  But I don’t see what the pastor did wrong, other than agreeing to this in the first place.  He was just living his life according to his conscience in Kentucky, which is leaps and bounds ahead of what Brittney is doing—living the unexamined life in which she stands for nothing and appeases all. 

 

As a Christian (Catholic), I do.  

First of all, he claims that it is "Christian values" to "not agree with the homosexual lifestyle." But that is only a "Christian value" because he defines it as such.  I know what the Catholic Church teaches about homosexuality - but I reject it. Because I see no reason to believe that Christ himself would not have accepted gay people for who they are and who they love. Conservative Christians have gotten a lot of mileage in positing their "Christian values" against gay people, but the fact is that there are literally millions of other Christians - myself included - who don't consider homophobia a "Christian value." A "Christian value" is to love one another, and it doesn't come with qualifiers like "but only if people are straight."

Secondly, he talks about the "homosexual lifestyle," which is usually the tell-tale sign of a homophobic bigot. What's a "homosexual lifestyle?"  I know a LOT of gay people, and their "lifestyles" run the gamut from committed relationships to casual dating and more... you know, just like straight people's "lifestyles."

Finally, his "I have gay employees!" screams of "I have black friends!"  And I would bet that if he talked to those gay employees, he'd probably find that they'd say that yeah, they did discriminate against them. Point being, you can know gay people and still have homophobic attitudes. Hiring gay people doesn't mean you accept them for who they are.

Anyway, I do agree with you that he was living the life he is comfortable with. But I'm having a hard time understanding why people are blaming Sandoval and Ariana for not "bringing it up earlier," when clearly Brittany and Jax were already aware of the issue "earlier."  Sandoval and Ariana aren't to blame for the fact that Brittany and Jax only addressed the issue when they realized it was going to make them look bad.

[The Ringo Kidd]

Brittany should have realized that you can not allow traditional religious values to be portrayed on TV.  Any appearance needs to be expunged and destroyed. She needs to realize that she s not a good Christian woman. She only plays one on TV.

Poorly.

[LibertarianSlut]

4 minutes ago, eleanorofaquitaine said:

Anyway, I do agree with you that he was living the life he is comfortable with. But I'm having a hard time understanding why people are blaming Sandoval and Ariana for not "bringing it up earlier," when clearly Brittany and Jax were already aware of the issue "earlier."  Sandoval and Ariana aren't to blame for the fact that Brittany and Jax only addressed the issue when they realized it was going to make them look bad.

I think the blame can go around.  Out of the four of them, I blame Brittney most heavily, by far, for reasons I’ve already stated.  Jax is just an ass who has no morals, who will go along with anything that is convenient for him.  I blame Jax the second-most for shutting down Sandoval for trying to talk to him about it.  I think Sandoval was last in line for blame, because he at least tried to broach the subject directly to Jax once, even when it was “over” and he could have just as easily let it pass.  

This is why I blame Ariana— on this episode they flashed back to a clip in January 2019 where all the females from the show except Lisa were in the Clubhouse, Andy asked Brittney about her “homophobic” pastor, Brittney assured everyone that he is not “that way” (again, what way, Brittney?) and everyone started clapping, except Arianna, who looked down at her hands.  After they showed that flashback, Ariana said she had been very uncomfortable.  In January.  

If she thought in January that she was going to be in a wedding whose officiant was going to put her humanity into question in June, why not have a conversation with your significant other about it, and take action in January?  Go to Brittney and Jax and explain your reservations and work out a plan for a diminished role in the wedding, or to be absent from it, and maybe the friendships would have survived, maybe they wouldn’t, but Ariana and Tom would have acted according to their consciences, and no one could have accused them of holding something so serious back for the sake of a storyline on reality television.

Instead, they held off from acting on their consciences and talked behind Brittney’s back about it and then waited for Lisa to do the dirty work, so that everyone could heave a big sigh of relief that Lance Bass was going to beam in and save the day.  This made Ariana looked like a big chicken to me.  

[Callaphera]

Re: the pastor, claiming his Christian values are more important than being a decent human being and considering others that aren't like him:

2 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

I simply don’t see what’s wrong with those statements.  Where does Ariana derive that he wouldn’t recognize her as a person?   I feel really bad for the guy, though I think he was naive to agree to officiate this wedding.  I think Brittney and Jax were much more in the wrong, especially Brittney, to have one foot in each world.  As others have said upthread, you don’t really get to move out to one of the most pro-LGBT places in the world to sleep with a guy you barely know, become his live-in girlfriend, let him buy you silicone breasts, become employed by a huge LGBT activist, participate in her Pride events for years...and then ask Ryan Dotson to marry you.  It’s like being a little bit pregnant.  It’s confusing when someone has one foot in the traditional world (when it suits them) and one foot in the progressive world (when it suits them).  If you are going to straddle both worlds, you need to put a lot of thought into your responses when your friends from both walks of life come to you with questions.  The more I think about it, the more awful it was that Brittney screamed “fuck you” to Sandoval for asking to ask a freaking question.  But I don’t see what the pastor did wrong, other than agreeing to this in the first place.  He was just living his life according to his conscience in Kentucky, which is leaps and bounds ahead of what Brittney is doing—living the unexamined life in which she stands for nothing and appeases all. 

You don't see what's wrong with othering and homophobic views and the damage they can cause? What dehumanizing someone does? Because those are what those statements are putting forward. I don't see what's so confusing about that. There's no "straddling both worlds": you're either homophobic or you're not. You can collect all the gay people around you that you want (*coughLVPcough*) but it doesn't excuse the things you say - it reeks of "I have a black friend so."

[eleanorofaquitaine]

7 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

I think the blame can go around.  Out of the four of them, I blame Brittney most heavily, by far, for reasons I’ve already stated.  Jax is just an ass who has no morals, who will go along with anything that is convenient for him.  I blame Jax the second-most for shutting down Sandoval for trying to talk to him about it.  I think Sandoval was last in line for blame, because he at least tried to broach the subject directly to Jax once, even when it was “over” and he could have just as easily let it pass.  

This is why I blame Ariana— on this episode they flashed back to a clip in January 2019 where all the females from the show except Lisa were in the Clubhouse, Andy asked Brittney about her “homophobic” pastor, Brittney assured everyone that he is not “that way” (again, what way, Brittney?) and everyone started clapping, except Arianna, who looked down at her hands.  After they showed that flashback, Ariana said she had been very uncomfortable.  In January.  

If she thought in January that she was going to be in a wedding whose officiant was going to put her humanity into question in June, why not have a conversation with your significant other about it, and take action in January?  Go to Brittney and Jax and explain your reservations and work out a plan for a diminished role in the wedding, or to be absent from it, and maybe the friendships would have survived, maybe they wouldn’t, but Ariana and Tom would have acted according to their consciences, and no one could have accused them of holding something so serious back for the sake of a storyline on reality television.

Instead, they held off from acting on their consciences and talked behind Brittney’s back about it and then waited for Lisa to do the dirty work, so that everyone could heave a big sigh of relief that Lance Bass was going to beam in and save the day.  This made Ariana looked like a big chicken to me.  

I'm not sure what the point of "blaming" Ariana (or Sandoval, for that matter) for Brittany and Jax's bad behavior.  It's Brittany and Jax who picked a homophobic pastor and it's Brittany and Jax who deliberately put their head in the sand rather than face the fact that they wanted a homophobic pastor to officiate their wedding. Sandoval was right, they KNEW what was out there - we SAW Andy confront them with it. They just thought that they could say vague words and that it would all go away.

It's not Ariana's job to make them be better people. Ariana still has the right to feel like the fact that they picked a homophobic pastor - and ignored the very real info out there about his homophobia for months - made her feel diminished as a member of the LGBTQ community. It's not her job to educate Jax and Brittany on why that is.

You can't force people to act when they are doing everything in their power not to act. That's what happened with Brittany and Jax here. Ariana's not to blame for the fact that Brittany and Jax wanted both to have their homophobic pastor AND to not be seen as homophobic themselves.

[Callaphera]

3 hours ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

So it’s Back to the Future with elements of Terminator II.

Yes, but with more puppy showers and cocaine. 

Because ultimately, that's what this boils down to: if Brittany and Jax don't marry and have at least one child, Raquel won't exist and there will be no puppy showers in the future and that brings us to the Darkest Timeline. But DJ James Kennedy doesn't want the puppy shower future, he wants the cocaine dusted future (aka The Dark but Not Darkest Timeline) so he has to stop Raquel who is just like her mother and thinks everything should be unicorns and princesses. (I think that makes Raquel the God-like figure of the future which might be the Darkest Timeline after all.)

Raquel is slightly confused because she's heard of White Kanye from her future timeline before but she's also heard of this thing called "counting" before and she's pretty sure that doesn't exist so *blink* *blink* *blinkblink*. James wasn't sure Raquel was the girl from the future that he has to stop until she wanted to have the puppy shower in this timeline but at first, he was okay with this timeline because there was still cocaine and he got to nail the hot, dumb chick but now he's back on track.