Season 21 Live Feed Discussion

[Lady Calypso]

17 minutes ago, mooses said:

The only thing that bothers me about Jackson's praying is that it just feels like part of his effort to rehabilitate his image. Did he do this whole kneeling, sign of the cross thing before he found out he was so disliked? If he did, then that's cool, that's just part of his daily life. If he didn't, it comes off as super-duper fake - just in case my kneeling and emoji prayer hands didn't give it away, I'm going to do the sign of the cross and mutter the Trinity also! And him asking for privacy doesn't really check with him literally kneeling in the DR to make sure they get it on cameras (and he, of all HGs, should know there's certain areas where you're more likely to get privacy). 

So, yeah, I don't care who prays to what or who or when. But if it's insincere and just a showy act to try to demonstrate he's such a good guy? Then it definitely rubs me the wrong way. 

I get the sentiment here....but I can confirm that he did this right from the start. I remember the discussions going as far back as the first week of feeds. I also didn't realize this until I reread his bio, but he does mention that he's religious in his bio:

Quote

What would you take into the house and why?
- An iPad or tablet that streams my mass every Sunday morning so I can stay in touch with my religious side.

I mean, that's not to say that it's not a ploy for the cameras and he planned it going in. Nor do I think that he's super duper religious. But I do believe that he has certain religious rituals that he likes to do, so I do think he's not faking it.

[mooses]

6 minutes ago, Nashville said:

I believe Jackson’s fussing at the cameras to allow him “prayer time privacy” has been going on since the early days of the season - which doesn’t necessarily make it any more (or less) genuine.

Good to know! I think I've mentioned I'd avoided him on Feeds for the most part when I could, so my bad for assuming the worst. 

[Callaphera]

8 minutes ago, Nashville said:

I believe Jackson’s fussing at the cameras to allow him “prayer time privacy” has been going on since the early days of the season - which doesn’t necessarily make it any more (or less) genuine.

It's okay, Jackson. You don't always have to take a partner up to the HoH shower, you can go by yourself for some fun time. Everyone does it, there's nothing to be embarrassed about. 

[DannyRugg]

I think Snackson is praying for Nicole to quit raining on his (potential) Festivus parade and the accompanying confetti. He is finally for the first time in his life doing something selfish by taking Holly to the Final Two and no one appreciates his sacrifice. He has integrity and is playing chess NOT checkers, Candyland or Snakes & Ladders. Here's hoping his Mama takes the stage on Wednesday and berates Julieiee, CBS, and America at large for daring to question his nobility in refusing to live on his knees (except maybe with the sex stool in the HOH shower stall). Mama is SO over it!

[Ellee]

24 minutes ago, Nashville said:

I believe Jackson’s fussing at the cameras to allow him “prayer time privacy” has been going on since the early days of the season - which doesn’t necessarily make it any more (or less) genuine.

11 minutes ago, Callaphera said:

It's okay, Jackson. You don't always have to take a partner up to the HoH shower, you can go by yourself for some fun time. Everyone does it, there's nothing to be embarrassed about. 

You are a bad girl, Julyiee with an 'a'.  I spit coffee all over myself.  😁😁😁

[ohcomeon]

1 hour ago, Lady Calypso said:

I had to reverse image search to find out. This was in 2012 and it's NOT Kat. 

Thank you for doing that. I was looking at the shoes and thinking the photo had to be 6 or more years old. 

[Gummo]

All this talk about a "bitter jury" and how Jackson "deserves to win for his gameplay" ....

is bullshit.

Jury management IS gameplay. Period.

If people aren't willing to vote you half a mil, you played badly. Period. I don't care how many comps you win.

If the jury is so pissed off they reward Anyone But You, it's not on them -- it's on you. Period. No excuses.

[But barring a miracle, Jackson's still going to win. Barf.]

[Vixenstud]

From Joker's Twitter....

5:24am Jackson continues fretting about his portrayal. Holly says she's in the same boat but not by her doing. Jackson sarcastically says "thanks" and storms off. Minutes later he returns and sneers, "You sure know how to comfort someone when they're down." 

My God, he's such a douchebag!

Edited September 23, 2019 by Vixenstud

[Gummo]

4 minutes ago, Vixenstud said:

Jackson sarcastically says "thanks" and storms off. Minutes later he returns and sneers, "You sure know how to comfort someone when they're down." 

I. Love. It! Just when Jackhole should be reveling in his near-win, he's sunk in the depths of a Pity Party! 

Such a stoic, noble soul!

I hope his spiralling gets so bad, Holly wins final HOH and takes Nicole. That's MY fucking manifestation, bitches!

[Melina22]

56 minutes ago, DannyRugg said:

I think Snackson is praying for Nicole to quit raining on his (potential) Festivus parade and the accompanying confetti.

It doesn't bother me that he's praying. It bothers me that I'm almost certain he's praying to win the $500,000.

12 minutes ago, Gummo said:

Jury management IS gameplay. Period.

I completely agree. 

13 minutes ago, Vixenstud said:

24am Jackson continues fretting about his portrayal. Holly says she's in the same boat but not by her doing. Jackson sarcastically says "thanks" and storms off. Minutes later he returns and sneers, "You sure know how to comfort someone when they're down." 

But not by her doing? What does that even mean? 

[Nashville]

38 minutes ago, Melina22 said:

It doesn't bother me that he's praying. It bothers me that I'm almost certain he's praying to win the $500,000.

I completely agree. 

But not by her doing? What does that even mean? 

Probably Holly means by his (Jackson’s) doing - in which case Holly would be exactly 50% right.  Or wrong.  Whichever.  Hell, Holly chose to stick with Jackson - so she can’t exactly disavow responsibility.

Edited September 23, 2019 by Nashville
Punctuation and grammar

[Lady Calypso]

50 minutes ago, Gummo said:

Jury management IS gameplay. Period.

And I don't disagree with this.

There are many reasons why I can see Jackson not winning, similar to why Tyler lost last season.

However, I don't think it helps when people say that they want to vote for people who played the best game and then they vote for someone else with some bullshit reason. If the jury members can give a reason for voting differently, then I'm ok with it. If they own their vote, like the final 2 should own their moves, then I'm ok with it. But don't lie to us and give us a reason that makes no sense.

For example, Scottie voting for Kaycee to win last season and I can't remember exactly what he said, but it was such a dumb excuse that it was clear he was simply mad at Tyler but pretended he was voting strategically.

And I realize that this is what I mean by a bitter jury; I really mean jury members who refuse to own their votes.

[Tdoc72]

40 minutes ago, Melina22 said:

It doesn't bother me that he's praying. It bothers me that I'm almost certain he's praying to win the $500,000.

I completely agree. 

But not by her doing? What does that even mean? 

Me too. I dislike selfish prayer. For me there’s a big difference between give me the strength to try and see this through vs. please let me win the money. 

IMO Holly was talking about her edit. I think she thinks they are getting bad edits but they are not behaving badly. She’s going to be shocked when she gets out. Between the nasty stuff she says and  all the shower sex, I don’t think she has a clue. Which is dumb. 

[ByaNose]

21 minutes ago, Tdoc72 said:

Me too. I dislike selfish prayer. For me there’s a big difference between give me the strength to try and see this through vs. please let me win the money. 

IMO Holly was talking about her edit. I think she thinks they are getting bad edits but they are not behaving badly. She’s going to be shocked when she gets out. Between the nasty stuff she says and  all the shower sex, I don’t think she has a clue. Which is dumb. 

What nasty stuff has Holly said? I’m not saying you’re wrong but what has she said? I thought she was one of the nicer girls in the house. I wasn’t watching the feeds at the beginning though. 

[tinkerbell]

this is interesting: 

You have to click to see all of it. 

[Callaphera]

4 minutes ago, ByaNose said:

What nasty stuff has Holly said? I’m not saying you’re wrong but what has she said? I thought she was one of the nicer girls in the house. I wasn’t watching the feeds at the beginning though. 

I believe Holly was one (of a few) that kept calling David "aggressive" when Camp Not-Like-Us started and he came back into the house. While not overtly nasty, it's definitely coded language. Let's not forget how much Holly flipped out when Kat called Jackson aggressive and she started lecturing her on how that can stick with a person and follow them around their whole life Jackson is not aggressive!!!1 but the black man is totally aggressive for calling her Beth. Yup.  

Man, I miss the days of Jackson getting pissed off because David made a joke about the self-help book he read that led Jackson to... become a waiter in L.A.? That was hilarious. "Oh, you read a book?" Well, lah-di-dah, Mr. Michie. 

[Dance4Life]

7 minutes ago, ByaNose said:

What nasty stuff has Holly said? I’m not saying you’re wrong but what has she said? I thought she was one of the nicer girls in the house. I wasn’t watching the feeds at the beginning though. 

First 4 weeks when Kemi was still in the house.

Kemi’s hotness had everyone on edge and on their best mean-girl behavior.

During this time Holly was BFF with Analyse.  Their gossip sessions were on fire!

Then somewhere between week 4-6..(?)......Holly made it Showmance official with Jackson......and, she dumped all her girl friendships. No more Holly-Analyse.

Yea...she is the type that dumps you for a man!

So, she became a lot more discreet as Jolly is extremely paranoid on how they are being portrayed.

Oh, that whole Nicole gang-up....???

That was kinda started by Holly and Analyse gossiping about Nicole.

They never owned up to it......but, BB flashback the convo.....where they repeat the.....’Bella is a Bully’.....convo.

I forgot!!!

Anyone check on Bella now that Kat & Nick made it JH official?????  Lol!!

Now, that Tommy is in the house......those 2 have probably resumed their bromance, too! 

That Nick.....loves to get around. 🤣

[Melina22]

Interesting info posted by Evel Dick, but seriously. Pot meet kettle. 

[tinkerbell]

4 minutes ago, Dance4Life said:

That Nick.....loves to get around

the thing is, to my mind, that none of these people would have given Nick the time of day outside the BB house.  he's weird looking, has a goofy hairstyle, and is devoid of any charm or interesting personality characteristics.  

and that's not even counting his weird tendency to hump, hug, caress, anyone who gets within 10 feet of him. 

[Dance4Life]

21 minutes ago, tinkerbell said:

this is interesting: 

You have to click to see all of it. 

Hahahahahahahahaha!

I cannot believe I read all this!

I mean.....he genital germ cootied........whaaaaat...??  Who wrote that?

He also has OCD.  I hate how he is always opening the fridge doors.  Stares inside.  Then slams them shut as hard as possible.

I also started to notice he would cut his watermelon into the large metal bowl.

Then would throw away the leftover......instead of saving it. 

Seems like he enjoys prepping the watermelon more than eating it.

weird dude.

[Callaphera]

Jackson scratching his balls and then touching the bananas. Is it on the same level as Zakiyah taking off her pad in the storage room and then digging into the communal chips? Or is it like Matt leaving his spunk towel on the kitchen counters? The Salad of Unwashed Hands? 

I feel like we need a ranking system for all the gross bodily hygiene meets food moments in the Big Brother house. 

[Brian Cronin]

10 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

And I don't disagree with this.

There are many reasons why I can see Jackson not winning, similar to why Tyler lost last season.

However, I don't think it helps when people say that they want to vote for people who played the best game and then they vote for someone else with some bullshit reason. If the jury members can give a reason for voting differently, then I'm ok with it. If they own their vote, like the final 2 should own their moves, then I'm ok with it. But don't lie to us and give us a reason that makes no sense.

For example, Scottie voting for Kaycee to win last season and I can't remember exactly what he said, but it was such a dumb excuse that it was clear he was simply mad at Tyler but pretended he was voting strategically.

And I realize that this is what I mean by a bitter jury; I really mean jury members who refuse to own their votes.

Exactly. No one ever said, "Fucking Rockstar, how dare she not vote for Tyler?" because she hated the guy and there was no relationship there and she was upfront about not voting for him. The only times it's ever a problem is when people say, "I'll vote for the best player!" and then vote for a weaker player just because they like them better.

This cast has been hitting the "I'll vote for the best player" stuff repeatedly, so it will be a hard argument to then say, "But I'll vote for Holly over Jackson." Holly didn't even do the whole "be nice to people that Jackson was alienating" stuff. 

[peachmangosteen]

7 hours ago, Cutty said:

Did they really not have the days comp at the endgame? Something smells funny about this.

I thought Part 2 was days related. Was it not?

14 minutes ago, Melina22 said:

Interesting info posted by Evel Dick, but seriously. Pot meet kettle. 

Yea really. I hate when Dick brings up people being favored by Production or people's bad behavior. It's like, coming from the biggest piece of shit to ever play the game that only won because Production handed it to him kinda ruins the argument.

[Callaphera]

Evel Dick, Defender of the Big Brother HGs from the Big Brother Bullies makes me laugh every year. But it's the hurt-y kind of laugh that kind of makes your throat ache and you regret it right after you do it. 

[peachmangosteen]

1 minute ago, Brian Cronin said:

The only times it's ever a problem is when people say, "I'll vote for the best player!" and then vote for a weaker player just because they like them better.

And even then all you gotta do is say, "I decided to vote for who I liked better instead," because you are totally free to do that. It's like @Lady Calypso said, just own it. I mean, if you decide you just can't vote for someone because they suck even if they played a good game then that's perfectly fine imo. That's on the person who failed to not suck enough to get your vote lol. But yea, when people try to justify their votes as something other than "I didn't like the other person" they make themselves look bad.

[Brian Cronin]

1 minute ago, peachmangosteen said:

And even then all you gotta do is say, "I decided to vote for who I liked better instead," because you are totally free to do that. It's like @Lady Calypso said, just own it. I mean, if you decide you just can't vote for someone because they suck even if they played a good game then that's perfectly fine imo. That's on the person who failed to not suck enough to get your vote lol. But yea, when people try to justify their votes as something other than "I didn't like the other person" they make themselves look bad.

No, you're absolutely right. I think my issue is that Holly HASN'T been the nicer person to the jury members this season. She was nicer to the PRE-jury people (in that she wasn't a complete dick to Kemi or David, even if she threw in the occasionally awful "aggressive" comment about David). So it would purely be, "I hate Jackson, so I'll vote for the other person out of spite." 

Which is TOTALLY fine, but you know that's not what they'll say, which is what pisses me off (like Scottie last year. I'm still pissed at that dickhead). 

[Tdoc72]

12 minutes ago, Dance4Life said:

Hahahahahahahahaha!

I cannot believe I read all this!

I mean.....he genital germ cootied........whaaaaat...??  Who wrote that?

He also has OCD.  I hate how he is always opening the fridge doors.  Stares inside.  Then slams them shut as hard as possible.

I also started to notice he would cut his watermelon into the large metal bowl.

Then would throw away the leftover......instead of saving it. 

Seems like he enjoys prepping the watermelon more than eating it.

weird dude.

He throws away the watermelon if it’s not the sweet stuff. One night he cut into two, tastes them and immediately threw them out. The third one met his needs. 

[Tdoc72]

50 minutes ago, ByaNose said:

What nasty stuff has Holly said? I’m not saying you’re wrong but what has she said? I thought she was one of the nicer girls in the house. I wasn’t watching the feeds at the beginning though. 

What everyone else said. Plus she’s really bitchy but fake to your face. More recently, she’s been upset w/Nicole and her ‘forcing’ her to throw the HOH so she called her a bully, arrogant and immature. 

[peachmangosteen]

4 minutes ago, Brian Cronin said:

No, you're absolutely right. I think my issue is that Holly HASN'T been the nicer person to the jury members this season. She was nicer to the PRE-jury people (in that she wasn't a complete dick to Kemi or David, even if she threw in the occasionally awful "aggressive" comment about David). So it would purely be, "I hate Jackson, so I'll vote for the other person out of spite." 

Which is TOTALLY fine, but you know that's not what they'll say, which is what pisses me off (like Scottie last year. I'm still pissed at that dickhead). 

Absolutely. Basically, since you can vote however you want, just fucking own the reason you vote the way you do. "I hate [this person]" is a perfectly valid reason to vote the other way. And it's on [this person] if people hate them enough that they would rather vote for a bottle of ketchup than them (Hi, Dan!). I think the issue is that a lot of the audience looks down on people who vote emotionally (which is almost everyone lol) and people don't want to be looked down on by the fans.

4 minutes ago, Tdoc72 said:

He throws away the watermelon if it’s not the sweet stuff. One night he cut into two, tastes them and immediately threw them out. The third one met his needs. 

Wow. Of all the shit Jackson's done/said, this one really fucking annoys me for some reason.

[LoveLeigh]

2 hours ago, Vixenstud said:

From Joker's Twitter....

5:24am Jackson continues fretting about his portrayal. Holly says she's in the same boat but not by her doing. Jackson sarcastically says "thanks" and storms off. Minutes later he returns and sneers, "You sure know how to comfort someone when they're down." 

My God, he's such a douchebag!

I think he is picking a fight with Holly so he has an excuse to not take her to f2. He is sooooooo manipulative and transparent. He will do ANYTHING to leave with confetti on his shoulders. Holly should take Nicole and cut that jerk off NOW. 

Edited September 23, 2019 by DakotaLavender

[Lady Calypso]

2 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

Absolutely. Basically, since you can vote however you want, just fucking own the reason you vote the way you do. "I hate [this person]" is a perfectly valid reason to vote the other way. And it's on [this person] if people hate them enough that they would rather vote for a bottle of ketchup than them (Hi, Dan!). I think the issue is that a lot of the audience looks down on people who vote emotionally (which is almost everyone lol) and people don't want to be looked down on by the fans.

 

Yep. It's why I totally understood why Bayleigh never handed her vote to Tyler. I just thought "well, that's to be expected." And then there were people like Fessy, who mumbled through some bullshit excuse as to why they voted for Kaycee to win and I just HATE that. 

I mean, yeah, I'd rather the best game player won, but there are circumstances where I understand why they didn't.

It's why I totally got why Paul lost, despite the fact that he DID run the house and had marginally good game play....from a certain standpoint....if you squint hard enough. 

Big Brother Rule: Own Your Game. Or, OYG. 

If I ever go onto Big Brother Canada, my catch phrase will be "Own It!" Like Send It, but better.

[hhawks]

5 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I think it goes back further than that. They should have taken out Jackson in the double eviction. Everyone was so amped to get rid of Christie, and at the time I knew that was the last opportunity they were going to have to prevent Jackson from walking away with this season. I said so at the time and nobody agreed, but here we are with Jackson poised to win it all just as I said he would several weeks ago. He's a comp beast and with Christie gone there was nobody left who was going to go after him. Either because they had a "deal" with him, or because they wanted to keep a bigger target in the house. He was virtually guaranteed the win from that point on.

And I don't think a bitter jury will hand the win to Holly, either. This isn't the same as when it was Tyler and Kaycee or Paul and Josh. Those people weren't in a showmance. This isn't the same kind of jury either. Knowing them and knowing the choice they'll have I'm willing to bet Jackson gets every single vote. 

I just can't picture Jessica ever voting for a penis unless it was attached to her own showmance.  She put Snackson on the block.  Yes, the dynamics of a final two showmance destroys comparison to previous seasons.   I don't know what to think about how it will end.  Snackson or Beth?

[Maverick]

28 minutes ago, Callaphera said:

Jackson scratching his balls and then touching the bananas. Is it on the same level as Zakiyah taking off her pad in the storage room and then digging into the communal chips? Or is it like Matt leaving his spunk towel on the kitchen counters? The Salad of Unwashed Hands? 

I feel like we need a ranking system for all the gross bodily hygiene meets food moments in the Big Brother house. 

 No sane person would do this show, but if they did they would only under the condition of a summer's supply of Lunchables and Army MRE rations.  No way I would do communal anything in that cesspool.   

[HeShallBMySquishy]

46 minutes ago, Callaphera said:

Jackson scratching his balls and then touching the bananas. Is it on the same level as Zakiyah taking off her pad in the storage room and then digging into the communal chips? Or is it like Matt leaving his spunk towel on the kitchen counters? The Salad of Unwashed Hands? 

I feel like we need a ranking system for all the gross bodily hygiene meets food moments in the Big Brother house. 

That is truly disgusting, truly vomit-inducing. I can feel the bile rising in my throat just reading this. I never witnessed any of it, thank God, but just reading it is more than enough. It reminds me of Frankie saying Zach's game was "dirtier than a dildo from his asshole." Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with people?

I would never say or do anything like this, even in the privacy of my own home, let alone on a TV show where I know everything is being recorded.

32 minutes ago, DakotaLavender said:

I think he is picking a fight with Holly so he has an excuse to not take her to f2. He is sooooooo manipulative and transparent. He will do ANYTHING to leave with confetti on his shoulders. Holly should take Nicole and cut that jerk off NOW. 

She should, but, spoiler: she won't. She'll do absolutely anything he orders her to do. I firmly believe that her throwing that HOH comp had nothing to do with honouring her deal with Cliff and Nicole and everything to do with making her man happy. She simply dropped because Jackson ordered her to.

One of the reasons I was so livid at Cliff during the whole Tommy-or-Holly debacle was because Jackson was so blatant and transparent with his lies. Nicole figured out what was going on, but instead of listening to her inner voice and following her instincts, she allowed Cliff to talk her into voting out Tommy, which is why I was so annoyed and disappointed with her.

[HighMaintenance]

19 minutes ago, Maverick said:

 No sane person would do this show, but if they did they would only under the condition of a summer's supply of Lunchables and Army MRE rations.  No way I would do communal anything in that cesspool.   

Same.  I used to think I would like to compete on this show, but in the last 10 years or so, I've admitted to myself that my constitution wouldn't allow it.  I would be smothering most of these people in their sleep just because I couldn't stand the sound of them swallowing. 

Needless to say, I refuse to share a toilet, let alone an entire bathroom with 15 STD ridden fratbros, their noxious watermelon farts polluting my oxygen and boogery fingers touching my delicates.  I have become accustomed to a higher quality of life, dahling.

[Brian Cronin]

I'd be shocked if Holly actually fights to win the final 3 HOH.  She won't just give up, but I doubt she actually FIGHTS for it. 

[hhawks]

3 hours ago, Gummo said:

I. Love. It! Just when Jackhole should be reveling in his near-win, he's sunk in the depths of a Pity Party! 

Such a stoic, noble soul!

I hope his spiralling gets so bad, Holly wins final HOH and takes Nicole. That's MY fucking manifestation, bitches!

Beth winning final HOH and evicting Snackson. telling him how she no longer has to suffer his filth in silence, would be the best moment of BB ever.  Beth will make her parents proud after all.  Let's all manifest.

[PaperTree]

First Holly has to win Part 3.  (sigh)

Maybe the DR would tell her how much America loves Jackson.

Tell her it would be the biggest move in BB history and she would be a hero.  Legendary.  With $500K.

F3 speech:  "Well Jackson, it's a game, and I'm not playing checkers either.  You're evicted."

Fantasies are fun 🙂 

The Stockholm Syndrome is probably too strong.

[Dance4Life]

19 minutes ago, hhawks said:

Beth winning final HOH and evicting Snackson. telling him how she no longer has to suffer his filth in silence, would be the best moment of BB ever.  Beth will make her parents proud after all.  Let's all manifest.

I need my Tangelo moment!

Jolly  F2.

Holly wins #1.

Jackson faints. 🙌🏻

 Nicole can collect her $25,000.  That should buy a lot of unicorn crap at Dollar Tree. 

[TheRealT]

9 hours ago, Gummo said:

All this talk about a "bitter jury" and how Jackson "deserves to win for his gameplay" ....

is bullshit.

Jury management IS gameplay. Period.

If people aren't willing to vote you half a mil, you played badly. Period. I don't care how many comps you win.

If the jury is so pissed off they reward Anyone But You, it's not on them -- it's on you. Period. No excuses.

[But barring a miracle, Jackson's still going to win. Barf.]

ITA. BB is a social/emotional, as well as strategic/physical/mental, game. It's arguable that the social/emotional aspect is the most important. I don't think it's arguable that playing such a bad social/emotional game that jurors will vote for anyone but you shouldn't matter if you're good at strategy and comps.

If anything, it's the other way around. Someone who gets to F2 with the majority of the jury wanting to give them the money has, IMO, played a better game than someone who gets there with the majority wanting them NOT to get the money, regardless of comp wins, strategery, etc.

8 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

And I don't disagree with this.

There are many reasons why I can see Jackson not winning, similar to why Tyler lost last season.

However, I don't think it helps when people say that they want to vote for people who played the best game and then they vote for someone else with some bullshit reason. If the jury members can give a reason for voting differently, then I'm ok with it. If they own their vote, like the final 2 should own their moves, then I'm ok with it. But don't lie to us and give us a reason that makes no sense.

For example, Scottie voting for Kaycee to win last season and I can't remember exactly what he said, but it was such a dumb excuse that it was clear he was simply mad at Tyler but pretended he was voting strategically.

And I realize that this is what I mean by a bitter jury; I really mean jury members who refuse to own their votes.

Ah, I don't think jury members have to coherently and consistently explain their motives in advance. It's an emotional game and most people can't predict what effect living with the other players for however long will have on them. People may come in saying, "I'm going to vote based on strategy/comp wins/whatever," but then they become BFFs with someone who hasn't met those benchmarks, or they feel mistreated by the person who met the benchmarks, or they feel the person who met the benchmarks is a dick, etc., etc. That's part of the game. It's not like the Olympics, where it's reasonable to assume that if one runs the fastest race, they will win. It's much more subjective than that. But that's the game (to me).

Edited September 24, 2019 by TheRealT

[tinkerbell]

3 minutes ago, TheRealT said:

ITA. BB is a social/emotional, as well as strategic/physical/mental, game. It's arguable that the social/emotional aspect is the most important. I don't think it's arguable that playing such a bad social/emotional game that jurors will vote for anyone but you shouldn't matter if you're good at strategy and comps.

The problem is that these guys think that playing a "social game"  consists of saying "I love you and respect you as a person"  before stabbing someone in the back. 

[Brian Cronin]

Take Nick, for example. Nick has no reason in the WORLD to vote for Holly. She hated him and made that pretty obvious to him for much of the season. He went on and on about rewarding "big game moves" and so then he votes for Holly over Jackson? It wouldn't make any sense. 

Just be consistent in your shit, that's all I want. 

[TheRealT]

9 minutes ago, tinkerbell said:

The problem is that these guys think that playing a "social game"  consists of saying "I love you and respect you as a person"  before stabbing someone in the back. 

It doesn't really matter how "right" or "wrong" the jurors are in their reasoning, though. The winner's "job" is to figure out what s/he needs to do to get to F2 and get a majority of the votes. That depends on reading the jurors, figuring out what strategies/messages/appeals/etc. will work with each of them, etc., etc. Having a reasonable, logical argument for why one or more jurors aren't "correct" in voting against you is worth bupkis. It's more valuable to get jurors to vote for you for "dumb, illogical, inconsistent, 'wrong'" reasons.

5 minutes ago, Brian Cronin said:

Take Nick, for example. Nick has no reason in the WORLD to vote for Holly. She hated him and made that pretty obvious to him for much of the season. He went on and on about rewarding "big game moves" and so then he votes for Holly over Jackson? It wouldn't make any sense. 

Just be consistent in your shit, that's all I want. 

But people aren't consistent. BB is an emotional game. It's bad strategy/jury management/etc. to count on everyone being "consistent" and "logical" in deciding their votes. Any savvy player understands that jurors will vote based on their personal experiences/feelings/assumptions/worries/relationships/etc./etc. Expecting people to vote based on "consistent" application of their stated values/plans/opinions is just dumb, IMO.

[Brian Cronin]

2 minutes ago, TheRealT said:

But people aren't consistent. BB is an emotional game. It's bad strategy/jury management/etc. to count on everyone being "consistent" and "logical" in deciding their votes. Any savvy player understands that jurors will vote based on their personal experiences/feelings/assumptions/worries/relationships/etc./etc. Expecting people to vote based on "consistent" application of their stated values/plans/opinions is just dumb, IMO.

Oh totally, but then I call them dickheads for being hypocritical dickheads. 

[Otherkate]

1 hour ago, HeShallBMySquishy said:

 I firmly believe that her throwing that HOH comp had nothing to do with honouring her deal with Cliff and Nicole and everything to do with making her man happy. She simply dropped because Jackson ordered her to.

I totally agree with this. I also think it's why she went so overboard and on and on talking about how ANGRY she was at Cliff and Nic for making her do that. I think she can't even face the truth because she would be so disappointed in herself, so she is projecting that story from the rooftops until we all believe it. But mostly until SHE believes it. But...her subconscious will never believe it and that's the rub. Me thinks the lady doth protest too much and all that jazz. 

[TheRealT]

3 minutes ago, Otherkate said:

I totally agree with this. I also think it's why she went so overboard and on and on talking about how ANGRY she was at Cliff and Nic for making her do that. I think she can't even face the truth because she would be so disappointed in herself, so she is projecting that story from the rooftops until we all believe it. But mostly until SHE believes it. But...her subconscious will never believe it and that's the rub. Me thinks the lady doth protest too much and all that jazz. 

I actually wonder where Holly's head is. I have a personal theory that she's 35, not 31, but, regardless, she is certainly older and wiser than Jackson. Even if she's gotten caught up in the atmosphere in the house/the game/etc. in terms of her relationship with him, she doesn't seem completely stupid or inexperienced with relationships, so you'd think there is at least a small part of her that realizes that there's no future there. She clearly has self-esteem issues and is having a hard time emotionally with being on the show/dealing with the stress of the game/being emotionally abused by Jackson/etc., but I still don't get why she's behaving the way she is.

I was particularly struck a couple of weeks ago when she was having a really hard time emotionally and Jackson was berating her for 2 days over her muttering "Fucking asshole..." while in a contentious conversation with him. He literally went ON and ON for AT LEAST 2 DAYS about how horrible it was for her to call him that name and how it would reflect so badly on her, which he knew she was worried about, and how he would never have done such a thing and he totally didn't deserve it and he didn't care, but he was just worried about how his family, her family, and America would view her because he cared about her so much. All while she was sobbing, apologizing over and over, and trying to explain how that one moment wasn't representative of her character.

Then she went into a bunch of stuff about how (basically) she has really low self-esteem and she beats herself up more than he ever could, etc., etc. Jackson replied with what I believe is his standard schtick for when he's dumping someone, "I care about you and I want you to be happy, but, obviously, I can't make you happy, so I'm going to let you go to pursue whatever it is you need to be happy. I'm basing all of this on logic and your own actions, so there's nothing you can say to contradict me."

You would think that a reasonably intelligent 31-35-year-old woman would be able to see through that shit immediately, but, apparently, that's not the case for Holly. Weird and sad.

[ByaNose]

I keep forgetting I “have to” watch Part III. I might just watch the last 20 minutes or so. If Survivor wasn’t on before it I would probably forget to watch it. I’m being a baby and wanted Nicole in the finals. LOL!!!,

[Callaphera]

I love how the thread goes from masturbation jokes (my contribution, of course) to breaking down the psychology of the jury in, like, five posts. Only on the Big Brother live feed thread. 

[Tuxcat]

23 minutes ago, Callaphera said:

I love how the thread goes from masturbation jokes (my contribution, of course) to breaking down the psychology of the jury in, like, five posts. Only on the Big Brother live feed thread. 

There's value in this observation - somewhere! Perhaps we are the real hamsters 😉

[mooses]

I'm of two minds on bitter juries - I do get both sides. But, I feel like a "bitter" vote bothers me when a HG is just angry they got outplayed and manipulated, not that the HG was actually over-the-line rude to them. It's no coincidence that a bitter jury doesn't reward the player that had the most control in the game. A lot of the, "But he didn't manage my jury vote!" boils down to, "But they made me look stupid!" It's like Nick being angry at Christie for Taco Tuesday - he comes up with so many excuses for being bitter, but, in the end, he was just mad she didn't accept her eviction and outmaneuvered him, so she got to stay instead of him.

For example, in terms of Jackson this year, I get Christie/Kat not wanting to vote for Jackson - he actually made that personal. But HGs like Cliff/Nicole and Tommy? They just got played. 

Yeah, juries can vote however they want. But just because they can doesn't mean I have to like it or that it shouldn't be criticized.  Nobody likes a sore loser, and that's what a lot of jurors are, even though they'd never admit it. Sure, anyone's allowed to be a sore loser, but they still suck. They ruin board game night and Big Brother!

Edited September 24, 2019 by mooses