S08.E05: The Bells

[I-Kare]

42 minutes ago, Popples said:

I was really hoping he would stab or choke her or something when they were in the map room.

That's what I predicted last week because THAT WOULD HAVE MADE SENSE and would have been an earned ending. 

Instead they take a - what? 4 season? 5 season - redemption arc and throw it away like it never happened. 

I mean sure, you finally have sex with another woman, one you have slowly fallen in love with, then you learn that your sister/lover hired someone to kill you, and you immediately leave the bed of the one we thought you loved and made you a better man, to GO RUNNING BACK TO YOUR SISTER/LOVER! 

Good god. Usually being wrong about a tv show's writing decisions doesn't make me ragey. Today it does. 

(my laptop says I've spelled ragey wrong which is making me even more mad) 

Edited May 13, 2019 by I-Kare

[Delete]

That was some fucked up shit. 

[rozen]

7 minutes ago, QuinnM said:

I did not see Mad Queen.  I saw someone that was determined to make them pay.  She was angry.  She was not mad.  I bet anything that next episode she is all smiles.  And the next time someone doesn’t do exactly what she wants, exactly when she wants it, and exactly how she wants it ... dracarys.

Tyrion was already afraid of her, Sansa saw it.  Now Jon is afraid of her.  This is not going to end well.

Agreed, this felt like Dany unshackled. The two people that constantly urged her to make concessions, at the cost of her own progress, are also the two people who betrayed her most deeply. She has no reason to take their wishes into consideration anymore. Instead, she prioritized her and Grey Worm's rage and dedication to executing Missandei's last words.

Was it awful and bloody and terrible? Yes. All wars of conquest have been. 

[AimingforYoko]

1 minute ago, QuinnM said:

That I can sit in my home and see this level of acting, score, cinematography is a friggin miracle to me.  Let’s here it’s for the cinematographer with the Arya/horse scene.  Absolutely beautiful.

Technically, I have no complaints. This is one of the best-looking, best-directed, best-scored shows ever to be on television. It's the story I'm having a hard time with, rather, the way the story was told.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Dany said #FuckDemKids 

Dumb and Dumber said #FuckDemFans 

What an Epic Clusterfuck! 

Edited May 13, 2019 by MrsRafaelBarba

[MissLucas]

3 minutes ago, QuinnM said:

People complaining should be forced to live through 1980 with 3/4 network channels on crap TVs, with rerun’s ALL SUMMER.  You’d love GoT.

I've lived through the 80s and I'm still complaining. Fantastic cinematography can't replace good writing.

Edited May 13, 2019 by MissLucas

[Macbeth]

23 minutes ago, Conan Troutman said:

Jaime and Cersei dying together like that wasn't how I pictured it, but I liked it. Felt like an ending that made sense for Jaime, although a bit rushed (that's more on last week's episode though). 

I liked it too. Nice symmetry. Their love started the war. It is fitting they should die at the end in each other's arms. 

Jaime and Cersei. GOT's great romance. 

[UNOSEZ]

16 minutes ago, ShellsandCheese said:

Dany still isn't mad. She did that shit on purpose. It's insulting to suggest that she's gone mad, she has not gone mad and she is not mad. She's angry, hurt, and upset about everything she's lost but she's not mad. I know I'm supposed to hate her after this episode, but I can't even be bothered. Varys, Tyrion, Sansa, etc - none of them really care about the regular folk.  She should have burned it all down and said fuck it and went back to Essos. 

I agree she isn't "Mad" but that was homicidal maniac attempted genocide on her part... I get grief... But that was anger and hatred and resentment and maybe some selfishness in there as well... If she's resigned to the fact that the ppl of westeros will always love Jon more maybe she just burned it down.. So in case he goes thru with his "betrayal " he'll  have nothing to rule over... She finally had enough.. Seems like a real progression of who she's been... An empathic  hyper-violent quick trigger conqueror with a savior complex

[Sakura12]

1 minute ago, rozen said:

Agreed, this felt like Dany unshackled. The two people that constantly urged her to make concessions, at the cost of her own progress, are also the two people who betrayed her most deeply. She has no reason to take their wishes into consideration anymore. Instead, she prioritized her and Grey Worm's rage and dedication to executing Missandei's last words.

Was it awful and bloody and terrible? Yes. All wars of conquest have been. 

Yep, Dany listened to the one advisor she could trust, Missandei. Dracarys.

[BooBear]

7 minutes ago, Drogo said:

Kings Landing was a shithole anyway.

Yeah, I said it. 

Yeh personally I have no sympathy for them. How many times have we seen the people act horribly there, (beheding Ned) - the walk of shame? But I know D&D in the story will be horrified and will want everyone to feel that they have to take her out because she dared to act like any other man would.  Oh sorry, not the saintly Jon. Sorry.

[catrice2]

7 minutes ago, Ocean Chick said:

But remember that the last act an Unsullied commits before becoming an Unsullied is to take a baby from his/her slave mother’s arms and kill them. As long as Grey Worm said to kill them, they’ll kill them. And Grey Worm was leading the attack. 

Well he said his people are not peaceful

[Leroux]

25 minutes ago, kellog010 said:

They couldn't help themselves. The sane Targaryeon is the male heir. I'm so pissed. 

He might be sane but he is a wimp not fit to rule. He stood by while she burned a man to his death for the sin of telling the truth, that she was not the rightful heir to the throne. He stood there and said absolutely nothing. 

After witnessing that, he still went to cuddle her and comfort her and even kiss her. In my eyes, he is just as bad as she is. 

He needs to go and live a simple life knowing that thousands upon thousands of people have died by the hands of a woman he vouched for. I have no respect for Jon Snow, none! 

[Bryce Lynch]

11 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

I don’t think Dany was mad either.  I agree with the poster who said it’s insulting to call her mad.

Dany was hurt, angry, fucking pissed off.  She saw her child, her dragon killed, her most trusted confidant, friend, brutally murdered in front of her. 

Who would be all love and light after all that shit.

Remember the last word of episode 4, Dracarus indeed.

Only mad or evil person would take it out on thousands of innocent people, including children, instead of going after Cersei and The Mountain first.

The writers decided to assassinate Dany's character and ruin the entire series with this episode, and gave Cersei and Jaime a romantic, Romeo and Juliet ending, to boot.  

[kieyra]

6 minutes ago, QuinnM said:

Here’s the thing.  After 8 seasons of this I just close the room darkening shades, turn up the sound to ‘11’, pour some wine and enjoy myself.   I grew up on network tv only.  That I can sit in my home and see this level of acting, score, cinematography is a friggin miracle to me.  Let’s hear it for the cinematographer with the Arya/horse scene.  Absolutely beautiful.

People complaining should be forced to live through 1980 with 3/4 network channels on crap TVs, with rerun’s ALL SUMMER.  You’d love GoT.

This is a logical fallacy called the fallacy of relative privation.

[catrice2]

12 minutes ago, Drogo said:

I know the acting is good when I'm rooting for a brother and sister to get to Essos and raise their baby in relative peace and anonymity. 

Cersei sends Bronn to kill Jaimie....Cersei sees Jaimie and says, "you're hurt," as if she is surprised and distressed by that....lady you wanted him DEAD??!!! 

[terrymct]

Holy moly.   

My condolences to Team Dany among the fandom but that was frickin amazing.  Everyone knows that Dany is unfit, other than the remaining Unsullied and Dothraki.  Jon, Davos, and Tyrion will have to do something.  Davos may be the only who still doesn’t know Jon’s real identity. 

Clegane Bowl went the only way it could. Sandor figured out just just don’t stab your undead brother to death.  

Arya is getting a chance to change path.  The Hound tried to save Sansa but ended up saving Arya.  

I’d have preferred that Jaime kill Cersei but I think Jaime’s arc is that not everyone wants to be redeemed.  The weight of the Red Keep fell on her like the weight of events did.  

[Growsonwalls]

And what an insult to the work Nikolaj Coster Waldau and Gwendolyne Christie who acted the shit out of one of the most 'shipped romances on the show. We watched them meet. We watched them hate each other. We watched them slowly like each other. We watched that liking and trust turn to love. And we finally watched them consummate their relationship. After all that we're supposed to believe it meant nothing to Jaime and Brienne was just the side chick? Fuck that.

[JTMacc99]

Alrighty then! 

Not sure where we go from this fireball of disaster, but can’t wait to find out. 

[LuvScottishAccents]

I have read that D&D said they are going off the grid for the finale. If they want to go into radio silence, I don’t have much hope that there will be anything salvageable next week. If they can’t seem to show any pride and face their fans, that tells me they know they produced a shit final season.

[UNOSEZ]

22 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

For starters I would not have had Jaime crawling back to Cersei. 

What about the previous seasons made you think he wouldn't go back... Cersei's bullshit made Tommen kill himself... She cremated him and took over as queen and Jaime stuck around... Y'all think a roll in the proverbial hay with Brienne was gonna change that.. When she's carrying his baby??  Not liking how things turn out is not the same as character assassination or bad writing.. 

[The Companion]

I am sorry, but I just don't see why people are so surprised that the woman who barely flinched when her brother was killed and who has never shown herself to be be particular interested in diplomacy or mercy decided to burn it all down. This was conquest. We didn't exactly hear stories of kindness and mercy from Robert Baratheon. We haven't seen a lot of kindness and mercy from those with power in the show. How is this a surprise? Hell, she told us at the beginning she didn't have love, all she had was fear. 

I enjoyed it. I am happy Arya made it and loved the disbelief at the horse out of nowhere. I am only disappointed by Cersei's end. I wanted more vengeance.

[Affogato]

20 minutes ago, Brn2bwild said:

Did anyone even bother to explain to Dany beforehand that the bells being rung meant surrender?!  Tyrion seemed to mention it to everyone else except her.

Yes she was told more than once. 

[Yodabeesh]

34 minutes ago, Popples said:

I was really hoping he would stab or choke her or something when they were in the map room.

I was expecting him to snap her neck. There was just that one moment where he could have done it. But NOOOOOO... we couldn’t have that, could we?

[Delete]

30 minutes ago, Lemuria said:

Pretty much the same way she got past all the NK's generals and a portion of his army in that relatively small Weirwood without anyone noticing her dragging the trampoline she jumped from.

This is what bothered me the most with this final season. Arya trained for years and could assume other faces. Why couldn't she have taken a face of Urine Greyjoy, for example, and came up to Cersei and shanked her? It doesn't make sense that she didn't utilize this during this episode, or with the NK.  They completely rushed through this last season and missed some crucial details. 

[Drogo]

Arya and the horse, echoes of another woman leaving one life behind for a new one. 

Arya saw all that death and destruction...

And decided "That's not me."

[WatchrTina]

19 minutes ago, Leroux said:

Nobody gets in between Daenerys and her throne, nobody! 

Yep. And "No one" is exactly who is going to take her out next week.  Mark my words!

[lvbalgurl]

33 minutes ago, Lillith said:

Arya is the only person not burned to death and finds a white fucking horse she trots off on.

This legit had me LMAO.

[Advance35]

Quote

Cersei died in the most unspectacular way...not happy with that, I really thought Jaime was going to kill her.  As hateful as she has been, why did I feel sorry for her when she was saying she wanted her baby to live. As for Jaime, he is my favorite character so I was disappointed that he still is in love with Cersei but darn it if they didn't sell me with those scenes.

Lena was phenomenal, as she slowly came to realize that it was all over.   As it all slowly, literally started to crumble around her.  I thought it was like opera.  Qyburn the victim of his own macabre creation.   

I think Cersei got her desserts, she knew it was over and we saw her absolutely terrified, more so then we ever have in the past.  And I believed her, when she was in the catacombs and she told Jamie she wanted to live and she wanted her child to live.   All I could think was Ned Stark wanted to live, Robb Stark wanted to live, Catelyn, Lancel, Margaery, Kevan, Olenna, Ellaria.

The fact that I felt a pang of empathy is down, purely to Lena's acting. 

Sandor warning Arya to turn back because he didn't want her to end up like everyone else, letting ambition and grudges lead them towards inevitable destruction.  He didn't want Arya to become him.

Daenerys is a monster.  The hero becomes the villain and all that.  I thought it was believable. She's grieving.  I don't like her but objectively, she's lost a lot of people recently.  So has everyone else in this story but Dany has dragons.

I felt sorry for Varys.  CH is a treasure.   And I found him oddly sympathetic.

[Paws]

1 minute ago, Yodabeesh said:

I was expecting him to snap her neck. There was just that one moment where he could have done it. But NOOOOOO... we couldn’t have that, could we?

That would have been satisfying to fans but not at all in keeping with his character. He has devoted his whole life to her other than going to fight the white walkers and then having victory sex w Brienne. He came back when he heard she’d be executed. He gave a whole speech to Brienne about it. I don’t like that he left her but he has loved Cersei since birth.

[Lemuria]

10 minutes ago, Leroux said:

He stood by while she burned a man to his death for the sin of telling the truth, that she was not the rightful heir to the throne. He stood there and said absolutely nothing. 

I get that you hate Jon Snow, but seriously?  He had sworn allegiance to Dany and has repeatedly held to that.  He has stated that as far as he is concerned, she is the rightful heir because he doesn't want the throne.

Varys didn't just "tell the truth," he was actively working against her (even possibly trying to poison her) and he had also sworn to serve her.  Tell me any monarch, especially in the rather brutal world of Planetos, would have tolerated that and not executed the person they all would have considered to be a traitor?

Edited May 13, 2019 by Lemuria

[Jewlmc]

2 minutes ago, The Companion said:

I am sorry, but I just don't see why people are so surprised that the woman who barely flinched when her brother was killed and who has never shown herself to be be particular interested in diplomacy or mercy decided to burn it all down. This was conquest. We didn't exactly hear stories of kindness and mercy from Robert Baratheon. We haven't seen a lot of kindness and mercy from those with power in the show. How is this a surprise? Hell, she told us at the beginning she didn't have love, all she had was fear. 

I enjoyed it. I am happy Arya made it and loved the disbelief at the horse out of nowhere. I am only disappointed by Cersei's end. I wanted more vengeance.

I think the "barely flinching"  had to do with her brother being an abusive sack of shit. But, whatever.

[Minneapple]

18 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

So, what exactly has been the point of Jaimie having years of development and wanting to be a better person and getting with Brienne and all that stuff if he was just going to die the same person and in the same place he started in? What was the POINT?! 

What years of character development for Jaime? It was only in the season 7 finale that he finally decided enough was enough with Cersei and cut ties with her. His spine growth lasted all of, what, four episodes before it wilted again and he went back to Cersei. His coming North to have sex with Brienne was pure fanservice and nothing else. His book character was absolutely slaughtered for the show and it's a shame.

[Scarlett45]

22 minutes ago, Drogo said:

You couldn't just make out with your hot aunt, Jon Snow? 

Motherfucker...

Yeah Dany wasn’t pleased that Jon isn’t into her any more. No sexy times for them since he found out the truth about his parentage. So you have the sexual rejection thrown in there as well. 

[shireenbamfatheon]

Oh look, a woman who's threatened to burn cities to the ground pretty much every season actually burning a city to the ground. What a surprise.

[ShellsandCheese]

What bothered me the most about this episode was the glaring and obvious fact that character actions haven't been natural for the past few seasons and have only served to advance the plot - ending. 

Last week, we have Dany forgetting about The Iron Fleet and Rhaegal dying. This week, we have her rather smartly taking out the Iron Fleet, the Scorpions, and the gate to Kings Landing. It's like one minute all of the characters are really stupid and the next minute, they are demonstrating good tactics and smart thinking. It's all so inconsistent and ridiculous. 

[catrice2]

Just now, Scarlett45 said:

Yeah Dany wasn’t pleased that Jon isn’t into her any more. No sexy times for them since he found out the truth about his parentage. So you have the sexual rejection thrown in there as well. 

Why couldn't they have just let her be with Jorah or the other guy?  Dario??

[Affogato]

5 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

And what an insult to the work Nikolaj Coster Waldau and Gwendolyne Christie who acted the shit out of one of the most 'shipped romances on the show. We watched them meet. We watched them hate each other. We watched them slowly like each other. We watched that liking and trust turn to love. And we finally watched them consummate their relationship. After all that we're supposed to believe it meant nothing to Jaime and Brienne was just the side chick? Fuck that.

Just isn’t a romance. More complicated. Etc. ibviously love there. 

[Andromeda]

36 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

I am curious for all who hated it, what would you have preferred?

Dany acting like she has for the past 7 seasons.

Cersei getting her comeuppance in a better way. For years we've discussed who should kill her: Sansa, Arya, Jamie, Tyrion.... No one ever said "wall." Even better than an assassination would be her demise from political maneuvering (it is a game of thrones).

Jamie not running back to Cersei, but helping to take her down.

Tyrion being intelligent.

Varys not switching alliances on a dime and getting roasted for it.

[tennisgurl]

I mean, is this really what George RR Martin wanted? To end his epic sprawling fantasy stretching decades and continents...like this? Arya is the terminator? Cersei and Jamie die in the most anti climactic way possible? Almost every character is assassinated and their growth ignored? What? Tyrion is dumb? Varys gets caught sneaking? Jaimie still wants Cersei? Cersei is taken out by...a falling wall?

I mean, I admit I didnt see it coming, so I give them that. Because I expect stories to, like, make sense, and have pay off. Silly me.

Edited May 13, 2019 by tennisgurl

[terrymct]

4 minutes ago, UNOSEZ said:

What about the previous seasons made you think he wouldn't go back... Cersei's bullshit made Tommen kill himself... She cremated him and took over as queen and Jaime stuck around... Y'all think a roll in the proverbial hay with Brienne was gonna change that.. When she's carrying his baby??  Not liking how things turn out is not the same as character assassination or bad writing.. 

...and GoT is well known for avoiding the tidy happily ever after.  If they were, The Hound would still be helping a minister build things.  

[Pestilentia]

So that incinerated corpse that Arya saw at the end there was the mom and child she tried to lead to safety? And that hand poking up that looked like the pommel of a charred Longclaw was just a hand and not a charred Longclaw? 

RIGHT? 

Am I the only one seeing these things?

[GodsBeloved]

26 minutes ago, Brn2bwild said:

Did anyone even bother to explain to Dany beforehand that the bells being rung meant surrender?!  Tyrion seemed to mention it to everyone else except her.

Yes Tyrion did. He basically asked if she could call off the attack if the bells rang and she finally looked at Grey Worm and nodded.

[rollacoaster]

45 minutes ago, revbfc said:

Cersei: “Well I’m all for family getting together to poke each other, so I hope you and Sandor have a great time.  I’ll be downstairs.”

This was actually my favorite scene in the entire episode. 

As for all the rest, I say: "FUCK THIS SHOW."

I'll be here next week cuz I am exhausted and I just want this to end. I sincerely hate feeling this way. 

[QuinnM]

2 minutes ago, Advance35 said:

Sandor warning Arya to turn back because he didn't want her to end up like everyone else, letting ambition and grudges lead them towards inevitable destruction.  He didn't want Arya to become him.

This seemed to authentic.  Maisie did a really good job accepting what he said.  Just the bit where she called him Sandor and he accepted it.

I would like to say that the Cleagons going over the edge into the fire was a really satisfying end to their store.

[Paws]

1 minute ago, Pestilentia said:

So that incinerated corpse that Arya saw at the end there was the mom and child she tried to lead to safety? And that hand poking up that looked like the pommel of a charred Longclaw was just a hand and not a charred Longclaw? 

RIGHT? 

Am I the only one seeing these things?

It looked like longclaw to me too but that had to be the mom and kid, right?

[Lemuria]

3 minutes ago, Jewlmc said:

I think the "barely flinching"  had to do with her brother being an abusive sack of shit. But, whatever.

And threatening to harm her baby, IIRC

[kieyra]

2 minutes ago, Pestilentia said:

So that incinerated corpse that Arya saw at the end there was the mom and child she tried to lead to safety? And that hand poking up that looked like the pommel of a charred Longclaw was just a hand and not a charred Longclaw? 

RIGHT? 

Am I the only one seeing these things?

If you’re suggesting that Arya was dead, I wondered the same thing. But it would be a very weird way for her to go. Goes after her final revenge list item, decides to be a better person, then spends about one third of the episode’s runtime dodging fire and falling walls only to die to ... fire and falling walls?

Edited May 13, 2019 by kieyra

[GodsBeloved]

27 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

No because that would make sense and the Dany we knew for 8 seasons would have stopped torching women and children. But you know D&D wanted not just to burn KL to the ground, they also wanted to burn Dany's character to ashes.

Yes Tyrion did.

[BitterApple]

Forget about the prequels, we need an entire series dedicated to Jon searching for his lost balls. 

Too bad the smith who fashioned Arya's plot armor couldn't have done the same for all the innocents who got slaughtered. And she magically rides off on a white horse? Does she shit rainbows and glitter as well? 

Of course Tyrion's alive. Of course Jon's alive, because, who fucking cares at this point.

Clegane Bowl, whatever. 

Cersei getting the most unfair, cheap death in eight seasons of the show, whatever. Jamie giving up life with an honorable woman like Brienne to save Cersei? Whatever, play stupid games, win stupid prizes. 

The Dothraki having suspiciously large numbers despite being bludgeoned in E03? Whatever.

I'm out of fucks to give. 

Edited May 13, 2019 by BitterApple

[terrymct]

4 minutes ago, Advance35 said:

I felt sorry for Varys.  CH is a treasure.   And I found him oddly sympathetic.

I did, too.  My feelings about him really changed over the seasons.  I appreciated that he tried to look at the bigger picture.