S11.E06: Sleeping With the Fishes

[heavysnaxx]

On 4/11/2019 at 5:29 AM, Juliegirlj said:

I hope Dorinda doesn’t get fed up with the bad manners of her guests and stop hosting at Blue Stone Manor !! Dorinda should start having them draw numbers for room assignments.

Speaking of hotel reservations- Luann tells the hotel manager to arrange a room for her, which he did, after which she cavalierly hollers at him that she is staying at Dorinda’s after all ( but keep that room handy just in case). What an entitled cow. 

Yeah, Luann is a world-class spelunker in exploring the deepest levels of rudeness, selfishness, and snobbery, aka The Caves of the Countess. I don't want to call her behavior "low-class" because being poor and lacking social status doesn't mean you don't care about other people's feelings.

While I would always prefer that Luann say, "Wow, being a guest of the County really helped me appreciate the hospitality of my friends," I have officially given up hope that there's any there, there with her. Luann is as fundamentally shallow as her self-absorption runs deep.

All that said, I've got a simple solution for who gets Dorinda's fish room: Shark Week get the Shark Room.

Because the above just wasn't enough menstrual vaudeville* for me: "Tonight, she bleeds with the fishes."

Image description: Screenshot of Bethenny asking, "What are the odds that somebody here has a tampon"

*Any comedy act that opens for menopausal cabaret.

Edited April 12, 2019 by heavysnaxx

[SuprSuprElevated]

2 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

When I read posts about Barbara it hits me that she's on the show, otherwise, I just don't give her much attention.  When she's on screen, my mind must wander or that's when I take my bathroom break. lol  She's just doesn't capture my interest at all.  Makes me wonder who scouted for her.....odd. 

Wasn't there speculation that her contract was some sort of settlement for the stink she made upon discovering that she had been recorded, and the recording aired, when she was discussing Lu's impending nuptials at the pre-wedding yacht party?  Was thinking that I read she threatened to sue Bravo over it.

Edited April 12, 2019 by SuprSuprElevated

[Double A]

On 4/11/2019 at 9:40 AM, Gem 10 said:

So I just read that Bluestone Manor was bought for Dorinda by Richard right before they got married.  It has 11 bedrooms.  Maybe Richard or someone caught that fish.  The room was probably decorated for a male guest who would appreciate the decor.  Dorinda obviously doesn’t want to change it.  11 bedrooms is plenty for all of them.  Some probably for all the help.  The house is an estate and they all are treating it like it’s no big deal, but it is.

I think Dorinda can do whatever she wants to her home so there's that. BUT I had a sneaky thought as she was defending their existence that there was a day those shellacked fish were presented to her and she was like wth do I do with this sh&t...oh right - that back bedroom! I'd defend them to those crazy women too though.

[smores]

4 hours ago, StatisticalOutlier said:

See, I've always thought that when someone invites me over, it's because they want my presence and that my presence is gift enough.  But I hate the idea of forced gift-giving. 

Like when Barbara showed up somewhere (Bethenny's Hamptons place?) and was like, "Oh shit, I didn't bring her anything," and was going rush off to go buy something but then pulled out the tool kit and gave that to her...even though when Barbara gave it to her, Bethenny said something about already having one.  I'd feel guilty if I put someone in that position.

I like gifts that people give because they want to, not because they have to.  And the last thing I want is some damn candle because I invited somebody over for dinner and they thought they had to give me something.

And actually, as for Luann thinking her presence is gift enough, people are paying money to be in her presence, so she might have a point.

I don't think it's mandatory that you bring a gift when you're invited somewhere, and I don't judge people if they don't bring one to my house.  I was taught to bring something when I was invited to a thing, though, so I don't like to show up empty handed.  By thing, I mean staying at someone's house that is out of town, a dinner party, not just dropping by to hang out for a bit and visit.  I tend usually bring breakfast pastries or some alcohol that they like, figuring they don't have to worry about food for the next morning after everyone has left.  

[Double A]

LuAnn seems to be practicing white knuckle sobriety (sobriety without working a recovery program). She could have hit rock bottom after that family lawsuit but Rich Bitch Super Hero to the rescue and LuAnn actually thinks her problems went away because she deserves it. Hearing that she checked out of rehab early that was paid for by her rescuers to do a show is alarming, exposes her priorities and foreshadows disaster. You know you have hit rock bottom when you have no rescuers left.

Edited April 12, 2019 by Double A

[Juliegirlj]

I think it IS rude to stay at someone’s house and not give a hostess gift. Also- wine you plan on drinking during your visit does not count. I try and keep a small stash of potential items on hand just in case- candles, cloth napkin sets, pretty tea towels,chocolates,  etc. 

[babykin]

26 minutes ago, smores said:

I don't think it's mandatory that you bring a gift when you're invited somewhere, and I don't judge people if they don't bring one to my house.  I was taught to bring something when I was invited to a thing, though, so I don't like to show up empty handed.  By thing, I mean staying at someone's house that is out of town, a dinner party, not just dropping by to hang out for a bit and visit.  I tend usually bring breakfast pastries or some alcohol that they like, figuring they don't have to worry about food for the next morning after everyone has left. 

Same Smores. I think it's just thoughtful to bring something to someone's house. I actually do want to give it, and giving a gift feels good. 

[heavysnaxx]

On 4/11/2019 at 11:12 AM, Dance4Life said:

But, that Naked Chef...no.....Just No!  He was gross looking.

I thought it was going to be a hunk!  Then again Dorinda boyfriend looks like him.  Maybe this is why she found NC attractive. 

Eh was also pushy with the wine...No...means No.....now, go away!

Honestly, I wondered if the whole schtick was actually the "Bear Naked Chef" cause he looked a lot like a bear to me. The "bare" thing was supposed to be a play on words. I could imagine the guy in this episode making good money booking gigs during Lazy Bear Week and other times.

Edited April 12, 2019 by heavysnaxx

[Dance4Life]

2 hours ago, Dirtybubble said:

THANK U!  I was just about to post this!  I live just outside of Charleston, SC and plantation home tours are big business here.  A friend of mine was a tour guide on one of these homes and she said that stuff like letters on desks, ink wells, and things like that are just decorations and NOT ORIGINALS.  The paper is dyed a yellow tint and distressed on the sides to make it look authentic but if you pick the paper up (which a lot of people do) when touring the homes you would feel it's a heavy weight and not the leaf thin weight it would be if it was 100+ years old.  You would think Lady Morgan would now the difference between an original and a fake *eye roll*  Her flip out over Dorinda touching these precious items is just stupid. 

Everything is a replica.  I am not sure what people expect.  They go to historic ruins abroad such as the Pyramids and Machu Picchu and everything is in pristine condition.  I am sure it looked just like that 500 years ago.

Even places that make a huge deal and do not allow you inside like the Hemingway House in Havana.  I am sure most of it is replicas because ......one hurricane and all of it is gone.  

I think what happens to these women since most are single is that they mix their mental pills with alcohol. Then get drunk and horny and have no man to bed!

Stay up all night either lonely and crying tearing things up in their assigned rooms.......or, stay up gossiping and fighting with each other.

That is why Lu freaked out.  No Pirate to pick up at the bar.....so, she had no choice but to go back to her room ....sober and alone....and, stare at the fish on the wall!

Yea, Lu..that is your life!  No more drinking like a fish. 

[ghoulina]

On 4/11/2019 at 1:11 PM, Thumper said:

I can understand how Betthany could feel guilty that she might be in some way responsible for Dennis OD'ing -- if in fact he was pushing her to marry and she could not.  I don't see it as an ego thing, but a guilt thing.  

Note to Beth:  I don't think you are responsible!  I can see feeling guilty though.

I see it the same way. I'm fortunate to have not (at this time) lost anyone close to me to a sudden death, OD,  suicide. But I feel like it's only natural to start picking everything apart and wondering if you were to blame in any way. It's human nature. I don't think it makes her narcissistic or self centered. She feels bad. And grief is FULL of regret, shame, self doubt. 

[izabella]

By suggesting Dennis killed himself becasue of her, she is injecting suicide into a tragic OD death when there is no indication of that.  That is not grief but narcissism and it's an attempt at making Dennis' death all about Bethy.  The worst part is that his family is grieving, too, and now they have Bethy talking out of her ass that their dad killed himself because of her. 

[Reality police]

20 hours ago, smores said:

I totally think she's a scorekeeper and while I do give her credit for starting out each year as a gracious hostess, I also wonder what is in it for her.  Does she get the ability to have some work done to the house or property and write it off since it's used for filming? It just seems odd that you'd continue to host these giant house parties year after year that always turn into a disaster when other people have houses that could be used and/or they could easily go to a hotel in a destination a short distance away.  Instead of the Berkshires, why not all head to Chicago to visit Tinsley and Scott for a weekend?

Without the whole Luann thing going on, I do think Barbara might be a different character, but she's going to be caught as a puppet of Luann's and she's likely not going to make it past one season.  She does also look like she'd be a better fit for NJ, but, I don't really think either Ramona or Dorinda have room to talk about someone needing a makeover.  It took Ramona how long to get that the long hair and gross extensions were not a good look? And while Dorinda looked great the first year or so, her hair has gone to a weird length and color.  

Nope, I totally think it's all been for show, to try to get out of legal trouble.

Bethenny arrived with a bag in her hand, I believe it was the light up sign.  I think Tinsley, Ramona and Sonja brought flowers (and, I'm guessing Tinsley bought the flowers and then Ramona and Sonja were like "yeah WE brought flowers!"), and Barbara had a box of something in her hand when she arrived.  I don't remember if Luann brought anything, but I'd guess that she probably did.  Though it is Luann, and it wouldn't surprise me if she thought her presence was gift enough.

Absolutely.  As soon as she said it, I turned to my husband and said Dorinda needs to check her suitcase because Ramona's going to load up like my great aunt used to.  If you went to her house back in the day, she had a whole bunch of Days Inn towels in her bathroom.  Evidently, my great aunt felt anything not nailed down in the room was there for her personal, permanent consumption.  

I kind of go back and forth on this.  I'm a pretty private person, I'm not someone who posts every detail of my life on FB, and I don't share everything.  So I do feel like if I were in Bethenny's shoes, I would keep a lot of this off camera.  Then, of course, I realize that I wouldn't be in her shoes in the first place, because I'd never be ok with having any of my life on camera.  I'm not saying there's anything wrong with people who do it, it's just not for me.  And I think it would be weird for something this major to happen in her life and for it to not be mentioned at all.  After giving it more thought, I realized that Dennis chose to come on the show, opening his life and situation up to coverage on the show, and that makes it a topic now.  

He cooked for the Obamas?

He has cooked for many politicians. This is from Wikipedia. 

Smith has cooked for many celebrities and heads of state, including President Barack Obama and the current King of Sweden.[9] In addition to being chef for Florida Governor Bob Graham, he cooked for Florida Governor Jeb Bush, Romero Britto, film stars Ali Landry and Eduardo Verástegui amongst many others. He has also appeared on Extreme Makeover: Home Edition.[10] Smith also appeared in a cooking segment in Lady Gaga's 2011 ABC special A Very Gaga Thanksgiving in which he and Gaga prepared a Thanksgiving meal of turkey and waffles. Months later, Smith became the head chef of Joanne Trattoria, an Italian restaurant in New York City owned by Lady Gaga's parents.[11] He was also a celebrity judge on the second seasons of the reality shows BBQ Pitmasters and Nailed It.

[sasha206]

18 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

I see it the same way. I'm fortunate to have not (at this time) lost anyone close to me to a sudden death, OD,  suicide. But I feel like it's only natural to start picking everything apart and wondering if you were to blame in any way. It's human nature. I don't think it makes her narcissistic or self centered. She feels bad. And grief is FULL of regret, shame, self doubt. 

The narcissism is discussing your theories that he perhaps killed himself over you, in what two or three separate episodes, on a television program where  your comments get picked up on Daily Mail and doing this without ANY regard to how the family felt.    How would you feel if you had someone close to you that more than likely accidentally OD'd on a combination of pills he was taking for a serious injury and then you find out his GF is talking openly about how it could have been suicide over her?  The narcissism to me is speculating that on a death that would make the family members wonder WHY DIDN'T I SEE THE SIGNS OF DESPAIR OVER A GF?  His children are in enough pain and don't need the added speculation. 

Edited April 12, 2019 by sasha206

[StatisticalOutlier]

40 minutes ago, Juliegirlj said:

I think it IS rude to stay at someone’s house and not give a hostess gift. Also- wine you plan on drinking during your visit does not count. I try and keep a small stash of potential items on hand just in case- candles, cloth napkin sets, pretty tea towels,chocolates,  etc. 

Knowing I was given something out of a stash that somebody keeps to fulfill obligations doesn't really touch my heart.  Mileage varies on that, though.

[smores]

25 minutes ago, Reality police said:

He has cooked for many politicians. This is from Wikipedia. 

Smith has cooked for many celebrities and heads of state, including President Barack Obama and the current King of Sweden.[9] In addition to being chef for Florida Governor Bob Graham, he cooked for Florida Governor Jeb Bush, Romero Britto, film stars Ali Landry and Eduardo Verástegui amongst many others. He has also appeared on Extreme Makeover: Home Edition.[10] Smith also appeared in a cooking segment in Lady Gaga's 2011 ABC special A Very Gaga Thanksgiving in which he and Gaga prepared a Thanksgiving meal of turkey and waffles. Months later, Smith became the head chef of Joanne Trattoria, an Italian restaurant in New York City owned by Lady Gaga's parents.[11] He was also a celebrity judge on the second seasons of the reality shows BBQ Pitmasters and Nailed It.

Art has legitimately cooked for them, the issue, though, is that he has appeared on a LOT of Bravo shows (and other networks), and every single time, he repeats over and over that he has cooked for the Obamas.  It's like it's part of his name, "Hi, I'mArtIcookedforObama!"  I'm not saying he doesn't have talent, but it's worse than Luann being a cabaret star or Tom having a penthouse. 

[Reality police]

16 minutes ago, smores said:

Art has legitimately cooked for them, the issue, though, is that he has appeared on a LOT of Bravo shows (and other networks), and every single time, he repeats over and over that he has cooked for the Obamas.  It's like it's part of his name, "Hi, I'mArtIcookedforObama!"  I'm not saying he doesn't have talent, but it's worse than Luann being a cabaret star or Tom having a penthouse. 

Just trying to help. 

[gritz]

I love Sonja and don't like seeing her upset, but "You DON'T touch the fucking LETTERS!" was pretty funny, if only for the wtf-ness and the reactions. 

Frankel's milking of Dennis's passing for all its worth has been totally predictable. However, the way she twisted his death into being a suicide in order to pad her ego was beyond gross. Her commentary of the Atlanta HWs on WWHL was also ugh. 

On 4/10/2019 at 11:10 PM, Stats Queen said:

Bethenny with “I need a tampon does anyone have one?” Seems to me she was implying of course not, you don’t need them anyone. 

That's exactly what she was implying - she makes a menopause jab towards the other ladies every season.

It was kind of sad seeing Art reduced to playing sous chef for this bunch. It seems he's gained back all the weight he lost, too. 

[smores]

15 minutes ago, Reality police said:

Just trying to help. 

I know, and I appreciate it! I just wanted to clarify because I think my initial sarcasm wasn't clear unless the reader watches as much Bravo as I do over the years.  It's kind of embarrassing to admit it, but for the most part, if Bravo makes it, I'm watching it.  

[KungFuBunny]

14 minutes ago, Reality police said:

Just trying to help. 

Awww..you gets a hug, Grasshopper

I remember Art On the Oprah Winfrey Show - he made fried green tomatoes - it looked so gooooood.

There's a scene where drunk Sonja is talking to Tinsley about Barbara making a pass at Bethenny, poor Art has to walk passed them. Did you catch what he was holding - scallion?

3 minutes ago, smores said:

I know, and I appreciate it! I just wanted to clarify because I think my initial sarcasm wasn't clear unless the reader watches as much Bravo as I do over the years.  It's kind of embarrassing to admit it, but for the most part, if Bravo makes it, I'm watching it.  

Group hugs no one gets left out

[hoodooznoodooz]

I find it odd that when events/conversations/objects transport Sonja back to her Lady Morgan days, she often seems most comfortable wallowing in all the little nuisances. The Help dinging up the furniture with the vacuum cleaner. How easily the little boxes break. Paying for storage. 

[KungFuBunny]

Dorinda wasn't referring to the decorations, but the guests she hosted for the weekend

[SuprSuprElevated]

3 minutes ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

I find it odd that when events/conversations/objects transport Sonja back to her Lady Morgan days, she often seems most comfortable wallowing in all the little nuisances. The Help dinging up the furniture with the vacuum cleaner. How easily the little boxes break. Paying for storage. 

Yeah, for someone who doesn't appear to take particularly great care of her shit, she sure can find fault in how other folks manage stuff.  Confirms for me, the superficiality of her marriage and life as a Morgan.

Had a "NO.WIRE.HANGERS!" vibe to it. 😵

Edited April 12, 2019 by SuprSuprElevated

[SuprSuprElevated]

[Gem 10]

23 hours ago, snarts said:

Production pays for all of this.  Anytime they're being filmed, especially if they're on a trip.  All the dinners, all the parties, events, etc. That's why Luann was asking Dorinda to schedule the yoga & massage.

Luann's on probation, not parole.  Very different things.  She's also being drug/alcohol tested as part of her probation. And yes, she likely had to request permission to travel.

Stupid me.  I didn’t know the difference between probation and parole until u told me .. then my husband. Anyhow, I think she got away shitty clean whatever the hell it is, lol.  Some are saying she’s still drinking.  How could she if she is being tested?

[Gem 10]

On 4/11/2019 at 1:59 PM, kicksave said:

Last night's episode was sad and depressing. I don't find it funny at all to see a fifty something woman falling down drunk, yelling and crying at a dinner table. How sad for Sonja's daughter to see her mother falling apart on national TV and making a spectacle of herself in the most vulgar and coarse ways possible...her obsession with sex and talking like a frat boy about "getting laid" etc. was over the top even for her. Nothing screams pathetic and sad like a menopausal woman with a teen age daughter getting drunk and behaving in this way...great role modeling Sonja. And her obsession with the Morgan family when technically she is not a part of that family due to divorce, seems rather clingy and desperate. I understand she wants her daughter to be totally accepted as an heir to the family fortune but good grief, enough of the whining and melancholia over the Morgan letters and dusty old crap! Move on Sonja...

Luann has forgotten where she came from...working class roots from a working class small town in Connecticut. She's no blue blood...she came from humble beginnings and seems to have forgotten that...no humility, no gratefulness for what she has...I think she is incapable of being grateful to these women for what they've done for her. It's rather ironic that she pedaled herself as the scion of good manners when she clearly doesn't practice what she preaches. It was enlightening to hear Bethenny talk about LuAnn's rehab and how she cut out two weeks early to do her cabaret show...that speaks volumes about how serious she is about recovery. 

I was so looking forward to this episode and didn’t like it either.  All the bitchin and screaming was too much.  To boot, what’s with Sonja trying to make out with everyone?  Gross.

[Gem 10]

On 4/11/2019 at 3:57 PM, OFDgal said:

Luann is playing at a theater outside of Boston 4/25.  I've been seeing commercials for it.  After reading your post I checked on this venue's tickets.  There are still hundreds of tickets left, many for $39.  /She is also playing down in Provincetown in August.  She should not be acting so countessy if she can't even sell out a show in a Boston suburb.

I posted a while ago that my daughter saw her act in N.Y.City.  She said the audience goes “crazy” when she’s on stage singing “Money Can’t buy You Class”. They don’t care that she can’t sing.  She just has a presence and looks gorgeous in her Jovanni gowns.

[SuprSuprElevated]

45 minutes ago, Gem 10 said:

I was so looking forward to this episode and didn’t like it either.  All the bitchin and screaming was too much.  To boot, what’s with Sonja trying to make out with everyone?  Gross.

Sonja has been displaying these behaviors for years now.  I don't find same-sex harrassment any less off-putting than I do opposite-sex harrassment.  She either wants us to know that she is bisexual, or she believes that the inference is apple-keeping teevee.  

I can do without it in either case.

Edited April 12, 2019 by SuprSuprElevated

[Natalie68]

1 hour ago, Gem 10 said:

Stupid me.  I didn’t know the difference between probation and parole until u told me .. then my husband. Anyhow, I think she got away shitty clean whatever the hell it is, lol.  Some are saying she’s still drinking.  How could she if she is being tested?

In the preview for next week where she is wearing white talking to Sonja while getting her hair done she looks LIT!  I don't know whether it was booze, pills, a combo whatever but the Countess was LIT AF!  Maybe she is buying urine or making someone she feels is beneath her give her some.  

[Gem 10]

3 minutes ago, Natalie68 said:

In the preview for next week where she is wearing white talking to Sonja while getting her hair done she looks LIT!  I don't know whether it was booze, pills, a combo whatever but the Countess was LIT AF!  Maybe she is buying urine or making someone she feels is beneath her give her some.  

I can’t see her going on stage cold turkey.

[Natalie68]

3 minutes ago, Gem 10 said:

I can’t see her going on stage cold turkey.

Me neither.  I think she only sees her drinking as a problem as long as she is on probation and her kids think she was trying to steal from them.  Now she can say it was the booze.  I would NEVER do XYZ.  

[Reality police]

5 hours ago, KungFuBunny said:

Awww..you gets a hug, Grasshopper

I remember Art On the Oprah Winfrey Show - he made fried green tomatoes - it looked so gooooood.

There's a scene where drunk Sonja is talking to Tinsley about Barbara making a pass at Bethenny, poor Art has to walk passed them. Did you catch what he was holding - scallion?

Group hugs no one gets left out

I have a fantastic recipe for fried green tomatoes and shrimp salad. Oh so good. 

[gingerella]

7 hours ago, smores said:

See, I've always thought that when someone invites me over, it's because they want my presence and that my presence is gift enough.  But I hate the idea of forced gift-giving. 

I dont think of it as forced gifting at all. I was raised to always bring a little something when you're invited to someone's house for dinner. And if it's staying over, something a little nicer. Or buying a nice dinner or wine or something. It's a way to say "thank you for inviting me, I appreciate the effort."

2 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

She said the audience goes “crazy” when she’s on stage singing “Money Can’t buy You Class”.

She's so delusional. I'd like to know who the majority of her audience really is. I'd wager a lot of them are laughing at her, not with her, but denial aint just a river in Egypt when you're name is Luann...

Edited April 13, 2019 by gingerella

[Stats Queen]

32 minutes ago, gingerella said:

8 hours ago, smores said:

3 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

She said the audience goes “crazy” when she’s on stage singing “Money Can’t buy You Class”.

She's so delusional. I'd like to know who the majority of her audience really is. I'd wager a lot of them are laughing at her, not with her, but denial aint just a river in Egypt when you're name is Luann...

You are beyond right.  I thought about going for to one of her shows for the same purpose. 

She is delusional not understanding that her cabaret has a really short shelf life and won’t go on for years at a time.  

Her rock bottom crash and burn will be massive and I sincerely hope those around her let it happen because otherwise she will never deal with her reality.

Been there when I had nothing left but to deal with but who I was and what led me how I ended up where I was. It was hard, but if I hadn’t I would not be living such a blessed life today.

[HunterHunted]

1 hour ago, gingerella said:

She's so delusional. I'd like to know who the majority of her audience really is. I'd wager a lot of them are laughing at her, not with her, but denial aint just a river in Egypt when you're name is Luann...

1 hour ago, Stats Queen said:

You are beyond right.  I thought about going for to one of her shows for the same purpose. 

She is delusional not understanding that her cabaret has a really short shelf life and won’t go on for years at a time.  

Her rock bottom crash and burn will be massive and I sincerely hope those around her let it happen because otherwise she will never deal with her reality.

Been there when I had nothing left but to deal with but who I was and what led me how I ended up where I was. It was hard, but if I hadn’t I would not be living such a blessed life today.

Little Edie had a cabaret show; the Times called it a public display of ineptitude. Florence Foster Jenkins had a vocal career. William Hung did too. Joe Pesci put out a rap song. No one is going to Luann's shows because she's a good singer or entertainer. They are watching because she's a fucking disaster. There shouldn't be multiple reviews by critics, viewers, and fans saying they were surprised how entertaining her shows are. That's the tell that they kind of went expecting a disaster. Luann is just soooooooo very lucky that Ben Rimalower created the show. He has a fantastic understanding of cabaret and camp that he could craft an entertaining evening with a self-absorbed asshole who can't sing. 

Joe Pesci rap video:

http://m.worldstarhiphop.com/android/video.php?v=wshhB98TlioAwdnPnAC1

[MrsWitter]

12 hours ago, heavysnaxx said:

Yeah, Luann is a world-class spelunker in exploring the deepest levels of rudeness, selfishness, and snobbery, aka The Caves of the Countess. I don't want to call her behavior "low-class" because being poor and lacking social status doesn't mean you don't care about other people's feelings.

While I would always prefer that Luann say, "Wow, being a guest of the County really helped me appreciate the hospitality of my friends," I have officially given up hope that there's any there, there with her. Luann is as fundamentally shallow as her self-absorption runs deep.

All that said, I've got a simple solution for who gets Dorinda's fish room: Shark Week get the Shark Room.

Because the above just wasn't enough menstrual vaudeville* for me: "Tonight, she bleeds with the fishes."

Image description: Screenshot of Bethenny asking, "What are the odds that somebody here has a tampon"

*Any comedy act that opens for menopausal cabaret.

B’s menopause/tampon comments hit me wrong. It reminded me of Brandi Glanville calling the other women “menopause mommies” and bragging about getting a monthly flow. Brandi was more outwardly malicious about it and I’m sure Beth would say something like, “I hate my period! I can’t wait to hit menopause! I’m not criticizing!” (like when she wished for diarrhea in Colombia). But it all still reeks of ageism. With both Brandi and Beth, I think it displays a profound fear of aging and a desperation to set themselves apart from the older women. 

Also, isn’t it possible, due to hormone therapy, that some of these women still get a “period” of sorts? I saw a short clip of Kris Jenner calling her doctor to make sure she couldn’t get pregnant. (side note: 🤦‍♀️) She was apparently still regularly bleeding due to medical intervention. 

Edited April 13, 2019 by MrsWitter

[nenya]

Wow - lots of crazy in this episode. 

For sake of brevity, I'll just focus on Sonja.

I thought the Morgan house might have been a nice thing. If Sonja can handle living in a Morgan house, is on the board of the foundation, and talks about wanting to preserve this for her daughter, it seems like she would be okay visiting the property. I did appreciate when she started to break down, the ladies rallied around her, and got her out of there.

And boy did Sonja go into full on Lady Morgan. I'm pretty sure if touching the letters was a concern, their tour guide would be on top of it. I have been to preserved places where, if you step off the path, they tell you. There would be prominent "do not touch" signs, velvet rope where they didn't want people to go near and exhibit, etc. 

I love how Sonja got upset about what likely are copied letters, but then was manhandling the boxes, and could have scratched or broken them or the furniture. And was she comparing letters written in the 1800s/1900s to letters her daughter writes? It just seemed both funny and forced.

Poor Sonja. She should have spent time learning more about financial management from her husband. Then, maybe she would be in a better situation than in the past. It is never easy to have to come down from a lofty position, but at least she could live a comfortable life without having a falling apart home, or having to use a sharpie on her old designer shoes. 

[biakbiak]

10 hours ago, nenya said:

Sonja can handle living in a Morgan house,

The house was purchased when they got married. It is only a “Morgan” house because of the fact that two people who haven’t really done anything named John and Sonja Morgan bought it in 1998.

Edited April 13, 2019 by biakbiak

[Adiba]

Haven't watched this show in a while, but come here to lurk and see what the OGs (Beth, Luann, Ramona) are up to. So much about a frickin' room, I had to watch the clip on the Bravo site.

Forgive me if I don't know the whole backstory, but jeez! Such histrionics over a room that one is only going to spend one or two nights in? I mean, were they going to be locked in the room for solitary confinement, was Dorinda going to lock the door from outside and make the guest play a game of "Escape Room?" They are all silly.

My father went on a fishing trip in Florida whenI was a kid (eons ago) and caught a gigantic tarpon. He had it stuffed and sent up to our house were he installed it in the family room. Looked at it for years before I moved out, and actually stopped "seeing" it. So I guess I don't get what the fuss was about unless one is a vegan/PETA person.

And Sonja--still crazy after all these years. I like going to historic homes and taking tours. I have been to many in the Northeast (Newport, RI, upstate NY, Biltmore in NC, etc.) and believe me, if one is not permitted to touch something it is roped off, there are signs, or the thing is behind glass, etc. So CTFD Lady Morgan.

[izabella]

9 hours ago, nenya said:

Poor Sonja. She should have spent time learning more about financial management from her husband. Then, maybe she would be in a better situation than in the past. It is never easy to have to come down from a lofty position, but at least she could live a comfortable life without having a falling apart home, or having to use a sharpie on her old designer shoes. 

See, I can never forget that Sonja got plenty of money from her ex but blew it all on a movie-making scheme that was bullshit, and not only lost all her millions, she defrauded a bunch of innocent movie people into losing a lot of their own money on her non-existent movie with George Clooney.   If Sonja hadn't chosen to lie to other people about some grandiose movie mogul plan she had for herself, she could have hired a financial planner and invested her money.  Instead, she went bankrupt and cheated other people and was sued.

Edited April 13, 2019 by izabella

[Jennifersdc]

9 hours ago, biakbiak said:

The house was purchased when they got married. It isn’t only a “Morgan” house because of the fact that two people who haven’t really done anything named John and Sonja Morgan bought it in 1998.

Exactly. From what we’ve seen of the interior too, I didn’t see a whole lot of 200-yr old antiques (or medieval wainscotting). More like mid-90’s Ethan Allen. Not knocking Ethan Allen - I have a good bit of it myself (tip - don’t get sucked into their custom curtains, beautiful but I could have bought a nice, lightly used, mid-size economy car). But I’m not a “Morgan”.

Was she freaking out over some Limoges boxes too? They’re not exactly Faberge eggs. 

I also checked - she’s not on the Board of the Morgan Library/Museum (her ex-husband is). She’s on the “American Friends” Board of a small Morgan Museum/Chateau in France with 20 other people. It looks lovely though! It’s called Blérancourt. It celebrates Franco-American relations. I thought that was funny too (layman European history buff).

I love you Sonja! Don’t go changing! And for the love of Baby Jesus don’t be all getting sober on the show (I’m a terrible person). I think I peed myself when she tried to wrap Coco around her neck (see terrible person).

[Giselle]

On 4/10/2019 at 6:28 PM, Straycat80 said:

The fish room cost 250k! Holy Makeral! Or Shark! 

Just proves money doesn't buy taste.

I'd love to know what the profit margin was for that room.

Edited April 13, 2019 by Giselle

[Steph J]

23 hours ago, Mondrianyone said:

One thing about Babs that creeps me out is her seeming disrespect of personal space.  I don't like getting physically encroached upon, especially by strangers, and she always appears to be getting way too close to people.  Back up, Loretta.  You don't need to be close enough to plant one on my lips when you're just trying to talk to me.  That is, assuming you're just trying to talk to me.

I feel like Barbara is very "on" every time we see her. It struck me watching this episode how comfortable everyone else is on camera (as they should be; some of them have been doing this for a decade) and how able they are to just be their (sometimes horrible) selves. In contrast, Barbara seems very... performative about everything that she's doing. Like when Bethenny showed up and she dramatically threw her arms around her, or when she was sitting next to Sonja at the dinner table and goading her about her sleeping arrangements (because she kept going on about how Bethenny was her "girlfriend).  There's a lot of mugging with Barbara that I find very off-putting.  Even in the conversation with Ramona and Tinsley about the seating arrangements I felt like that wasn't the result of her lacking tact so much as her trying to engineer a "moment" that people would talk about.  She seemed very aware of what she was doing in that scene.

[hoodooznoodooz]

14 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

Little Edie had a cabaret show; the Times called it a public display of ineptitude. Florence Foster Jenkins had a vocal career. William Hung did too. Joe Pesci put out a rap song. No one is going to Luann's shows because she's a good singer or entertainer. They are watching because she's a fucking disaster. There shouldn't be multiple reviews by critics, viewers, and fans saying they were surprised how entertaining her shows are. That's the tell that they kind of went expecting a disaster. Luann is just soooooooo very lucky that Ben Rimalower created the show. He has a fantastic understanding of cabaret and camp that he could craft an entertaining evening with a self-absorbed asshole who can't sing. 

Joe Pesci rap video:

http://m.worldstarhiphop.com/android/video.php?v=wshhB98TlioAwdnPnAC1

Hee!

Do we think Ben let Lu in on the joke? I don’t think Lu realizes it’s camp appeal. 

[Mondrianyone]

36 minutes ago, Steph J said:

I feel like Barbara is very "on" every time we see her. It struck me watching this episode how comfortable everyone else is on camera (as they should be; some of them have been doing this for a decade) and how able they are to just be their (sometimes horrible) selves. In contrast, Barbara seems very... performative about everything that she's doing. Like when Bethenny showed up and she dramatically threw her arms around her, or when she was sitting next to Sonja at the dinner table and goading her about her sleeping arrangements (because she kept going on about how Bethenny was her "girlfriend).  There's a lot of mugging with Barbara that I find very off-putting.  Even in the conversation with Ramona and Tinsley about the seating arrangements I felt like that wasn't the result of her lacking tact so much as her trying to engineer a "moment" that people would talk about.  She seemed very aware of what she was doing in that scene.

I agree with this.  It also occurred to me after I posted about how invasive of personal space she seems to be that her habit of sardining herself up against people could be a result of not understanding how camera shots work and trying to make sure she's included in all the shots.  Whatever her issues are, I'll be happy not to see her come back.

[Baltimore Betty]

4 hours ago, Adiba said:

Such histrionics over a room that one is only going to spend one or two nights in?

I had a few thoughts about Lu and her room issues...one, AA says to stay away from people, places and things that trigger your habit so that room might be a trigger, ok, I get it but it also seemed like a convienent excuse to get what she wanted.  Remember the ski trip and she stomped around that house screaming how she is getting married and should have the best room!?

Lu has woken up in quite a few places hung over so she either needs the tools to deal with it or decline a trip to the Bershires.  That said, the way she carried on about the room could have been a chapter in the Class with the Countess on how not to be a gracious guest.   

I think the fish room is ugly but so what it is not my house and Dorinda did not ask me for the money to decorate it.

Dorinda is kind of a saint for not suggesting the hotel room would be better for her and letting her come back to her house because if it was my house I would recind my invite at the first sign of bitching about my fish rrom!

Sonja is a lunatic.  She is not a Morgan! She married in to the family and divorced the family!  Those bills on the desk could have been reproductions for all she knew.

Grown ups that still get their period should have learned long ago to carry supplies, Bethenny has people to do things for her so she could easily have a Period Butler, lol!

Ramona did not dry hump anyone on this trip so far.

I was waiting for Bethenny and Lu to make some crack about if Carole was at the Naked Chef dinner how she would have picked him up before the main course was served ala Sexy Salad chef boy.  The idea of having a naked chef eludes me, the health department has nothing to say about this practice?  

[PradaKitty]

Regarding the “fish room”-  do all of these women sleep with their eyes open? Honestly, go to bed, close your eyes, and the fish magically disappear. 

And I Love the Halloween decor. (That may be because my birthday is on Halloween...)

[izabella]

Every time they say fish room, I think of that fish heads song.  Sigh.

Last fall, we visited friends and were happy to take the last bedroom they had available in their house because we wanted to hang out with them instead of going to a hotel.  We shared it with three cats, a bird, a turtle and a fish - all living.  We were all fine and lived to tell the tale.  These women's continual complaints about the fish room (fish heads, fish heads, roly poly fish heads...) are ludicrous and extremely rude.

[biakbiak]

2 hours ago, Steph J said:

Like when Bethenny showed up and she dramatically threw her arms around her

This stood out to me so much because Bethenny is so not that sort of person and I know they “bonded” over Lu’s manic weekend but they don’t appear close and Bethenny seemed surprised by her hugging her. 

[HunterHunted]

13 hours ago, nenya said:

Poor Sonja. She should have spent time learning more about financial management from her husband. Then, maybe she would be in a better situation than in the past. It is never easy to have to come down from a lofty position, but at least she could live a comfortable life without having a falling apart home, or having to use a sharpie on her old designer shoes.

4 hours ago, izabella said:

See, I can never forget that Sonja got plenty of money from her ex but blew it all on a movie-making scheme that was bullshit, and not only lost all her millions, she defrauded a bunch of innocent movie people into losing a lot of their own money on her non-existent movie with George Clooney.   If Sonja hadn't chosen to lie to other people about some grandiose movie mogul plan she had for herself, she could have hired a financial planner and invested her money.  Instead, she went bankrupt and cheated other people and was sued.

It was actually a John Travolta movie called Fast Flash to Bang Time. He was to play a crack addicted FBI agent. He and his partner, a sex addicted FBI agent, were on the hunt for a serial killer, who may have kidnapped a baby. I'm sure the mob was involved somewhere in the plot, which probably explains why it failed.  No one watches mob movies anymore. Rand and Lala can confirm that.

Sonja can seem nice and sweet, but she's a massive stealth bitch. We've pretty much confirmed that she planted stories about Tinsley being a sad ungrateful mess, Dorinda and John's cocaine use, Luann, Luann and Tom, and I wouldn't be surprised if she was happily supplying a ton of the Ramona and Mario gossip. And if you read up about the movie lawsuit, she was a nasty lying bitch during it as she had used her ex-husband's name without his permission as a member of her "company" and then used it again to intimidate the people she was scamming. She is not an honest or truthful person.

3 hours ago, Jennifersdc said:

I also checked - she’s not on the Board of the Morgan Library/Museum (her ex-husband is). She’s on the “American Friends” Board of a small Morgan Museum/Chateau in France with 20 other people. It looks lovely though! It’s called Blérancourt. It celebrates Franco-American relations. I thought that was funny too (layman European history buff).

We've heard her say repeatedly in this show that she was married to J.P. Morgan instead of John A. Morgan. She's decided that she's Sonja Tremont Adams Morgan and that they have a double barrelled surname even though it's not. Adams is John's middle name. You legitimately can't trust anything out of Sonja's mouth. In college we had this formula for this guy who was a pathological liar. It was 1/4K = T. One fourth of what Kevin says is true.

With Sonja I feel like the following are accurate:

Tˢᵒⁿʲᵃ=STAM; truth to the Sonja power explains STAM

Fˢᵒⁿʲᵃ=Madonna is outside my fashion show; facts to the Sonja power explains how Madonna was outside the show because 7 billion people, including Madonna, less the 100 people at the show were technically outside the show

Eˢᵒⁿʲᵃ=Lady Morgan scion of the Morgan family who was in marketing and besties with all of these notables; exaggerations to the Sonja power.

Taking anything to the Sonja power explains why almost everything she says cannot match up with the facts of her life.

Sonja is the architect of her own misery. Her divorce settlement was actually really substantial. She got a lot of property, child support, and at least $3 million which JA refuses to pay. She got a fuckton of property.

[Chit Chat]

2 hours ago, Baltimore Betty said:

I had a few thoughts about Lu and her room issues...one, AA says to stay away from people, places and things that trigger your habit so that room might be a trigger, ok, I get it but it also seemed like a convienent excuse to get what she wanted.  Remember the ski trip and she stomped around that house screaming how she is getting married and should have the best room!?

Just as her getting married was an excuse, I think her being "triggered" is another one.  There's been a whole lot of shit that's gone down in Dorinda's house, so one would think that the house itself would be one giant trigger for her, starting with the shrubbery out front!

Dorinda needs to put this book in little gift bags for her guests: