S02.E07: Invasion!

[scarynikki12]

Quote

After learning the Dominators’ plan for the world, the Legends must work together with The Flash, Supergirl and Green Arrow to kill them once and for all. Meanwhile, Stein figures out, with the help of others, how the team can terminate the Dominators, but is distracted by the aberration he realizes he created in 1987.

 

[J0nas3]

Okay, so you have this plot point, where the Flash has to sacrifice himself for the good of the world. Now, we know that the CW will continue to have The Flash as a show so you know it's probably not going to happen. But, maybe don't run a promo for the fall finale of the Flash during one of the commercial breaks.

[Primetimer]

Fortunately, they've got help from the rest of the DC universe.

View the full article

[phoenics]

This crossover series really underwhelmed me.  I think the more shows they cram into this the worse it gets.  The only successful crossover in my opinion was the one from S1 of the Flash.

[mtlchick]

I'm just relieved that Cisco can stop being a douche to Barry now that HE screwed up time. 

"She really looks kind of like my cousin."  I was HOPING a line like that would come from him. 

Some minor nuisances but overall, I liked the crossover.  I do hope things get streamlined for next year though.

[Primal Slayer]

Overall it was better then last years crossover so thats good but overall it was all pretty much all flash and no substance when it came to the big bads. It had good character moments for Cisco/Sara/Oliver/Barry/Stein and Kara to a lesser extent.

Having Thea disappear suddenly sucked since she gets thrown to the wolves nowadays when it comes to importance.

I wish they had had everyone react to Amaya since they are all friends with Mari and meeting her grandmother should be a WHOA moment for them.

The fight is kind of boring. Vixens elephant didn't seem to do much. Mick just shooting fire and it not doing anything is super old. And how do you screw with a magic totem by putting its owner to sleep temporarily? It was a poor excuse to get Felicity/Cisco into the field.

It is nice that Firestorm finally got to embrace his powerset.

One again everyone was way to clean, Diggle had more injuries from his dream then he did in the real world.

When they put Cisco/Felicity into super geek mode it isnt cute.

How are they not effecting the timeline by trying to abduct a dominator from the past? They are just going to glance over it. And the tiny change it did make caught up REAL quick.

[Jediknight]

Loved the Routh as Superman reference.  And, yep, Mick has a crush on Kara, also liked him and Sara bonding over finding the President attractive.  Liked that Kara smacked down Agent Smith.  I really liked that Cisco seemingly has finally let go of his hatred of Barry, maybe we'll get fun Cisco back.

I liked the crossover, we need more Kara interacting with the rest of the CW crew.

Edited December 2, 2016 by Jediknight

[Morrigan2575]

I liked this episode of the crossover. It might have ended up being the best of the 3. 

The Cisco and Felicty parts were great. I love that they got to save the Legends and help save the world. I HATE that they were acknowledged by the President.

I liked the final scene between Barry and Oliver. I also loved the Felicty mention of looking in a mirror (Kara does look like her) and the nudge nudge to Routh's Superman was cute.

[Sakura12]

I enjoyed these episodes more than I thought I would. I loved seeing all of them work together and have a some nice character interactions. I loved getting a Sara and Oliver scene since we haven't had one since she died. They didn't get to speak after her resurrection. The Oliver and Barry sharing a beer scene was nice as well. 

Hopefully Cisco is over his issues and can move on. I still don't like the changes Barry made but it's getting really repetitive to see people mad at him then he gets a pep talk. Enough of that. 

[Lantern7]

That was fun. Cisco gets to play god like Barry. Firestorm breaks out the transmutation powers that he/they only used once before. Sara and Mick get to "admire" the new president aka Not Lynda Carter. And Mick gets to set aliens on fire.

While I think the story may have gotten too much hype, and that Supergirl wasn't that necessary to the plot, I liked the four-night event. I'm okay with more crossovers, even if the stage threatens to buckle from the weight. Fans will probably get fanfic on background stuff as soon as tonight.

I'm probably going to refer to Lily as "Hope" from now on. Had a good laugh at Jax bringing up "pound town" to Martin. So inappropriate.

Quote

When they put Cisco/Felicity into super geek mode it isnt cute.

Awwww, I liked them. So adorable. And if one can ship Barry & Kara, then why not Cislicity? And they bailed out the newbies and Mick! So funny.

[squidprincess]

I liked the episode, but I thought it focused a bit too much on Cisco, Barry and Oliver for my taste.  I wanted to see the Legends get to shine more considering it's their show.  But I'm probably just being petty.

I'm really interested in Martin's plotline with Lily.  I'm hoping we see Rip for part of it, because as a Time Master with a vested interest in keeping the timeline intact, but also as a father who has lost a child, I think he'd have a pretty interesting perspective on the entire situation.

[Lady Calypso]

So, the Cisco forgiving Barry thing was pretty contrived but if that means mopey Cisco goes away, then I'm all for it. I don't quite get how Cisco/Nate assume that them letting the Dominator go in 1951 caused the end of their world in 2016, but maybe I just missed a further explanation here.

How is it that Felicity is the most useful here, not on her own show? It's actually really sad. But she was fantastic here. They actually utilized her to the best of her abilities. Her and Cisco were great together.

Heh, Barry almost had to sacrifice himself as a consequence for Flashpoint. I thought that was the reason for the Dominators coming to destroy the world. Anyway, this hopefully concluded the Barry/Flashpoint arc on The Flash. This crossover definitely had less to do with Legends, but I'm not surprised.

Ok, well Stein got to know his daughter, who really IS great. I don't know if the team will eventually agree to erase her (still don't know her name), but if they do, it'll be an emotional goodbye. I like her a lot. Usually they introduce a secret son or something. It's a nice change to have a daughter, especially after they switched out Baby Sara Diggle for Baby John. Plus, she is so much like her father but with slightly better social skills. I kind of want them to let this one go, even though I know it'll probably be better to fix the timeline if they can. But...if Barry can't fix his mistakes, maybe the world can give him this one?

So, first the Tommy/Chicago Med reference in Arrow's crossover, and now Brandon Routh's Superman reference. I am still entertained by the meta, and not just the humans.

I love that Mick Rory has a crush on Kara, and Kara's weirded out face. I also love that now this earth has a female President! Also Kara's smackdown of Agent Smith. I love snarky Kara a lot. Can they make her this useful on her show? And can she maybe not be a reporter, but an excellent PR rep or something? 

It's funny that Barry and Oliver get the last scene on the Legends crossover episode. But I love that Sara and Oliver finally got a moment and it was about them. It was really nice to see, since I missed them.

Overall, excellent ending to the crossover. This may be my favourite episode of the four.

I cannot wait for all of Supergirl characters to cross over to this earth now that Kara has a handy transuniversal button.

1 minute ago, squidprincess said:

I liked the episode, but I thought it focused a bit too much on Cisco, Barry and Oliver for my taste.  I wanted to see the Legends get to shine more considering it's their show.  But I'm probably just being petty.

I wouldn't call it petty. I get that they had a lot to conclude with these three and having Legends on a Thursday and the last show to air in the week doesn't help matters. I totally get it, which is why I'm hoping the next crossover will focus a bit more on the Legends. Not Ray because he always gets focus, but maybe Mick, Jax, and Amaya. It especially sucks if you're not a fan of The Flash or Arrow. I enjoyed it and I enjoyed certain plotlines being concluded, but those are all for different shows. At least they managed to get this Stein/Lily plot in to continue on this show. 

[cambridgeguy]

The three episodes (Supergirl doesn't count) had very different tones to them.  The Flash episode was mostly about Barry and his crew but had a fair amount of crossover material while the Arrow episode had virtually none, especially since Sara and Ray were Arrow characters first.  However, in their own series the Legends were mostly shoved aside in favor of Cisco/Felicity, Barry, and Oliver.  Only Stein had any sort of meaningful storyline.  It was kind of funny to see who was and wasn't important enough to appear in various episodes.  Sorry Thea, HR, and Wests.

I suppose Jerk Oliver had to show up after his supportive behavior in the previous two episodes but he still made no sense.  A great tactician doesn't sideline his most powerful weapon.

Oh, and I'm not sure I buy Barry and Kara being able to plant a device on every single Dominator in a few minutes - that type of speed means they should be invincible.

[madhacker]

random thoughts:

first and most importantly: next teamup has gotta be Crisis on Infinite Earths witch end with the universes remade into one consistent Earth with Metropolis, National City, and Gotham City made part of the permanent Berlantiverse.

"yknow, she look like my cousin...." wow a total call out to Brandon's previous life and was absoltuely perfect.

Evil Government types beware of spunky Kryptonians they'll screw you over everytime.

My only nitpick (besides Cisco finally getting a clue) was when the Dominator started to launch their attack, Kara really should've had Cisco bop her back to Earth 38 for about 15 minutes to have them return with J'onn, Alex (hey, she's damn good with a gun), Mon-el and of course, Superman. 

Worst line of the night "See you later, Dominator". Really , Ray?

[benteen]

I really enjoyed this.  While not perfect, this crossover was a lot of fun.

Once again loved all the character interactions, particularly that scene between Oliver and Sara.  Kara's involvement, while somewhat more limited than I expected, is a great addition of the Arrowverse.  No surprise Victor Garber nailed the whole daughter subplot.

I liked the stuff with the Dominators and the alien attack on 1951 was quite impressive.

I very much look forward to the next crossover.

[Primal Slayer]

10 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

Ok, well Stein got to know his daughter, who really IS great. I don't know if the team will eventually agree to erase her (still don't know her name), but if they do, it'll be an emotional goodbye. I like her a lot. Usually they introduce a secret son or something. It's a nice change to have a daughter, especially after they switched out Baby Sara Diggle for Baby John. Plus, she is so much like her father but with slightly better social skills. I kind of want them to let this one go, even though I know it'll probably be better to fix the timeline if they can. But...if Barry can't fix his mistakes, maybe the world can give him this one?

I don't even know how they would manage to erase her without changing the timeline even further. Talk about playing with fire. It would be no different then Barry going back in time to fix something that happened due to Flashpoint. The cracks are there and will only continue to get worse the more you try to fix it.

[Lantern7]

1 minute ago, madhacker said:

Worst line of the night "See you later, Dominator". Really , Ray?

Do you watch Legends? Ray is 40 percent cheese. If the team had to go undercover in Switzerland, Mick would try to shoot holes in him.

[bettername2come]

My tradition of holding low standards for Legends of Tomorrow that are consistently surpassed continues. That was an emotionally satisfying conclusion to the week. Cisco and Felicity working together was nice. I think they had a believable way to forgive Barry in showing his willingness to sacrifice himself, along with making Cisco responsible for the alien invasion when he tried to do the right thing. Classic Cisco can come back (and if they bring him back only for that Caitlin vs. Cisco vibe from a few weeks ago be because he's evil, I'm gonna be pissed).

How come in Oliver's description of how ridiculous things had gotten, he didn't mention magic? Magic he can do. It's definitely on par with aliens and metas.

Loved the final scene with Barry and Oliver, and the acknowledgement of who won in the first crossover. Liked Ray and Felicity's scene. Especially the weirded out moment of silence after acknowledging Kara and therefore Felicity looks like his cousin. Liked the Sara/Oliver moment of "this started with us."

Needed more Jax. But I kind of love that Firestorm tells their secret about Barry's message only to get another in Stein's daughter.

Edited December 2, 2016 by bettername2come

[kirinan]

23 minutes ago, Jediknight said:

Loved the Routh as Superman reference. 

What was the reference? It appears I missed it.

[KirkB]

4 minutes ago, kirinan said:

What was the reference? It appears I missed it.

Ray said Kara kind of looked like his cousin, which a stealth reference to Routh having been Superman.

Edited December 2, 2016 by KirkB

[statsgirl]

I think this is the best written of the four Arrowverse shows.  I liked the way they wrote Felicity here more than I've liked her all season on Arrow, and I loved the geekouts with Cisco.  Also loved the subtlety of the Superman reference, and Felicity saying that looking at Kara is like looking in a mirror.

I liked pretty much everything about this episode.  How the characters were written, how it was resolved, especially the final resolution of Barry's Flashpoint misbehaviours. 

I want to keep Stein's daughter on the show.

The only sour note was the fact that everyone was acknowledged by the president except for Cisco and Felicity who certainly played their part in saving the world.  (Also the impression that was left by Oliver saying that the dream world was a gift that he should have married Laurel.)

[benteen]

Here's an article detailing what scenes and ideas got cut out of the entire crossover.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/12/02/arrowverse-crossover-what-was-left-on-the-cutting-room-floor?abthid=5840a962d41a466868000022

[Maverick]

 Nate's costume looks like ass.  I mean that is some serious FUG going on.   Probably the worst live action superhero costume ever.    

 So a half dozen heroes from WWII triggered an alien invasion?   Half of them aren't even metas.  Vixen, Hourman and Stargirl get their powers from objects or drugs.

 I don't know which is more implausible, the President giving a formal speech (complete on a bunting-clad stage) flanked by people from the past and another world in front of a full audience or Oliver standing up there for it.

 How has Lilly not radically altered the timeline?  She's a super genius like her father and had to have some impact on history.  She's in the same field as Ray so his life most likely had to be impacted by her.  Is Stein ever going to have his memories of Lilly integrated or will he just continue to have headaches?  Why aren't the rest of the Legends effected.  At a minimum, Jax would know about Stein's family situation and Ray knew Stein years earlier so they should be suffering from the aberration too.

 When Barry asked who and what army was going to stop him, I wanted Oliver to shoot him in the back for old time's sake.  

 The most frustrating thing for me was no one on the Legends team asking Barry about the time-traveling speedster causing aberrations.  Barry's a speedster who's just admitted to causing trouble by traveling through time.  Wouldn't it occur to you to ask if he's ever heard of another (evil) speedster who might have a habit of travelling through time and wreaking havoc?  Maybe see if Barry has any tips on how to find and/or stop him?

Edited December 2, 2016 by Maverick

[Sakura12]

7 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

I want to keep Stein's daughter on the show.

According to Deadline's she's recurring an LoT. 

http://deadline.com/2016/11/dcs-legends-of-tomorrow-christina-brucato-the-flash-crossover-1201860555/

[KirkB]

9 minutes ago, Maverick said:

The most frustrating thing for me was no one on the Legends team asking Barry about the time-traveling speedster causing aberrations.  Barry's a speedster who's just admitted to causing trouble by traveling through time.  Wouldn't it occur to you to ask if he's ever heard of another (evil) speedster who might have a habit of travelling through time and wreaking havoc?  Maybe see if Barry has any tips on how to find and/or stop him?

I agree,  but to be fair they had a lot going on, what with the alien invasion and all.

Still, the Legends did get a little short-changed in their portion of the crossover. Oliver, Barry and Kara got major focus in all three, but if you weren't a regular watcher of LoT you might not be able to tell which ones really belonged on this show.

11 minutes ago, Maverick said:

Nate's costume looks like ass.  I mean that is some serious FUG going on.   Probably the worst live action superhero costume ever.  

I don't know about the worst, but it IS pretty goofy. I honestly think the main reason it is so bulky and brightly colored is to disguise the fact they're cheating on his powers by not showing any more of the metal than they have to. Speaking of, considering the majority of what Nate does is taking hits the others can't what does he really need a suit for?

[Last Time Lord]

I absolutely loved this, and really want the next one to take place o Kara's Earth.

[TDT]

"Hey Skirt..call me." LOL now i want to see a Legends/Supergirl crossover where the team is incapacitated and the only ones who can save them are Mick and Kara..

If they do plan to pull off that rumored Crisis On Infinite Earths-storyline next year or whenever,that line by Oliver to Kara could seem to be a bit of foreshadowing

Looks like Mr Snart will be re-appearing next week..

[AD35]

Likes: Mick calling Kara/Supergirl "Skirt" will NEVER get old.

Ray Palmer's comment about Kara resembling his cousin.

Oliver's apology to Kara after being a grade-A douche to her.

Cisco realizing that by going to the past to change the future he actually made things worst, just like Barry.

Jax's comment about Martin going to "pound town".

 

Dislikes: Oliver's overall attitude toward Kara and the sidelining of their most powerful asset

Where's Thea and what was going on with the Wests?

[RedVitC]

Some initial thoughts:

-Some nice character moments, particularly between Oliver and Kara, Oliver and Barry (though ending an episode of Legends with those two seemed a little off) and Oliver and Sara.

-What took me out of the episode was Barry getting ready to sacrifice himself without saying goodbye to the Wests or even the rest of Team Flash. They're with him every single day/episode, while Barry has barely spent more than a few days or weeks total with some of the crossover team. Iris and Joe (and Wally?) are pretty much the most important people in Barry's life, so it just seemed wrong to have his possible last moments on earth without them. He could have at least mentioned them.

-The sentiment that Kara expressed that you don't have to have powers to be a hero (or was it good person? idk, I'd have to go back and rewatch to catch what she said exactly) was nice, but I don't think they actually acknowledge that in the shows much. I said it somewhere else, but the teams off all shows are becoming more an more filled with metas and mask.

-Overall a good episode though.

[BkWurm1]

48 minutes ago, mtlchick said:

I'm just relieved that Cisco can stop being a douche to Barry now that HE screwed up time. 

"She really looks kind of like my cousin."  I was HOPING a line like that would come from him. 

Some minor nuisances but overall, I liked the crossover.  I do hope things get streamlined for next year though.

And to have it come out of his mouth just after Felicity pointed out how much they looked alike, ha!  That was hilarious.  Oh the looks on their faces!

45 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I liked this episode of the crossover. It might have ended up being the best of the 3. 

The Cisco and Felicty parts were great. I love that they got to save the Legends and help save the world. I HATE that they were acknowledged by the President.

I liked the final scene between Barry and Oliver. I also loved the Felicty mention of looking in a mirror (Kara does look like her) and the nudge nudge to Routh's Superman was cute.

It was really the only part of the crossover that really dealt with the aliens, which makes a lot of sense to save them for the LoT part but it was odd how sidelined a lot of them were.  I guess Sara got to shine on the Arrow part and Ray had a few moments on the Flash part.  I'm not loving Nate so putting him in charge didn't endear him to me even if Mick was for sure a worse choice (from a logical standpoint, would have been hilarious though) but why not put Amaya in charge?  She had way more experience and training in the hero business. 

I did enjoy Stein's storyline and yeah, let's keep Lilly.  :)

42 minutes ago, squidprincess said:

I liked the episode, but I thought it focused a bit too much on Cisco, Barry and Oliver for my taste.  I wanted to see the Legends get to shine more considering it's their show.  But I'm probably just being petty.

.

Barry was at the center of it but he really didn't do much heavy lifting which I think was good.  I mostly liked what they did with Oliver, but hard to believe that he'd have handled Supergirl that way.  My first thought was that normally in the past Felicity would have talked him down when he was freaking out but alas he and Felicity (the real one) never spoke in the Arrow part, and had maybe one line to each other in this one.  And I was not happy that Felicity was left out of the goodbyes among the team.  Oliver and Diggle yes, but Felicity no.  :( 

There was a lot of CIsco but I liked him in this episode even before he realized that people do sometimes screw up and get the President of the United States killed.  Oop!  

 

15 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

I think this is the best written of the four Arrowverse shows.  I liked the way they wrote Felicity here more than I've liked her all season on Arrow, and I loved the geekouts with Cisco.  Also loved the subtlety of the Superman reference, and Felicity saying that looking at Kara is like looking in a mirror.

I liked pretty much everything about this episode.  How the characters were written, how it was resolved, especially the final resolution of Barry's Flashpoint misbehaviours. 

I want to keep Stein's daughter on the show.

The only sour note was the fact that everyone was acknowledged by the president except for Cisco and Felicity who certainly played their part in saving the world.  (Also the impression that was left by Oliver saying that the dream world was a gift that he should have married Laurel.)

I was looking at the people on the stage and the only ones with no masks were going to get on a spaceship and keep traveling through time or slip back to another universe which at first I decided made sense and that Cisco and Felicity (and the rest) were trying to hide their identity....but then they had a party afterward with everyone so nope, they just didn't get any credit.  Not cool.  Not surprising since really it was all about getting the shot of the fighters but still!!!  At least Madame President gave them a shout out.  

Over all this was a far better crossover than last year.  

[CabotCove]

Quote

"She really looks kind of like my cousin."  I was HOPING a line like that would come from him. 

Haha, I laughed so hard

Quote

However, in their own series the Legends were mostly shoved aside in favor of Cisco/Felicity, Barry, and Oliver.  Only Stein had any sort of meaningful storyline.

Well Nate/Amaya/Mick did get to go on a "lets catch an alien" mission and the Waverider got lots screentime lol.

Edited December 2, 2016 by HeroLeague

[steelyis]

I like this episode of the crossover, but I do wish the final fight on the roof had been a city-wide rumble instead. There was probably a budgetary reasons not to do that, but it would have given the episode an Avengers feel, which is the live action gold standard of alien invasion battles.

I was less happy about Cisco comparing rescuing the dominator to what Barry did. Cisco and them saved a sapient being from being tortured to death because it was the moral and ethical thing to do, if not the most practical thing to do. Barry changed an entire timeline--wiping out or bringing to life countless people--for understandable, but selfish reasons.

But if letting Barry off the hook through false equivalency means we get our adorable little geek back, I'll allow it.

[tarotx]

I can't stand Nate. He doesn't warrant the time spent on him. He was acting like the captain in telling people who can and can not go and saying which members he was bringing. He's a Newbie and mocks the "nerds".  Yuck. And Sara as captain wasn't even mentioned. Which I can deal with if not for Nate. She got plenty of screen time and emotional beats over the crossover. Nate was aggressive as well. I'm liking him less and less.

The episode ending on Barry and Oliver was weird since this wasn't a crossover movie. I liked the moment though. I think if I could remove Nate and Arrow's Wild Dog and some of Curtis I would have enjoyed the crossover a lot more. I did love that little Oliver and Sara talk and hug. I wish Sara could have seen her Dad. He really could benefit from seeing her. I enjoyed Felicity&Cisco as well as Stein dealing with his daughter.

Still very little female interaction. I think that is why I especially enjoyed Sara&Laurel and Thea&Moira in the Arrow part.

Edited December 2, 2016 by tarotx

[KirkB]

9 minutes ago, steelyis said:

I like this episode of the crossover, but I do wish the final fight on the roof had been a city-wide rumble instead. There was probably a budgetary reasons not to do that, but it would have given the episode an Avengers feel, which is the live action gold standard of alien invasion battles.

Expensive, yes, but remember the last time a Kryptonian got involved in a city wide alien battle? DC probably does too. More likely though, it was to maintain the masquerade. Keeping the fight confined to a small area means most of the world will never know the world was invaded by aliens in the first place.

9 minutes ago, steelyis said:

But if letting Barry off the hook through false equivalency means we get our adorable little geek back, I'll allow it.

It's not exactly a false equivalency though. Cisco's point was "we went back in time and changed the past, which screwed up the future." So did Barry. Neither of them meant to cause the damage they did. It was a realization he needed to start mending their relationship.

7 minutes ago, tarotx said:

I can't stand Nate. He doesn't warrant the time spent on him. He was acting like the captain in telling people who can and can not go and saying which members he was bringing. He's a Newbie and mocks the "nerds".  Yuck. And Sara as captain wasn't even mentioned. Which I can deal with if not for Nate. She got plenty of screen time and emotional beats over the crossover. Nate was aggressive as well. I'm liking him less and less.

I didn't understand why he was introduced in the first place and I'm not sure what he brings to the show. I want to see Sara, Mick, Stein and Jax and so help me, even Ray. I can take or leave Amara. I want Rip and Snart back. But I don't care what happens to Nate.

Edited December 2, 2016 by KirkB

[StaceyNotStacie]

This was my favorite episode of the crossover. I don't watch The Flash or Arrow, but I didn't mind the characters. I might put The Flash on my Netflix list, but Arrow seems a bit dark.  

The dialogue after the victory was great. I loved everything that was mentioned (the cousin reference, Kara and Mick, the Jax and Martin conversation). Since Kara mentioned the DEO, I'm hoping that more Supergirl characters will appear on the next crossover. Also, since Kara also mentioned her cousin, maybe they can also include him in the next crossover. 

To be honest, the only things I didn't like about the episode were Nate's suit and Sara's braided hair at the end. 

[DearEvette]

Overall I think the whole was better than the parts.  But I am still a bit let down.  I think Cisco's drama felt misplaced amidst what should have been something much bigger than them all.  But then the writers go and make it all Barry's fault because of Flashpoint which feels so damned illogical.  Between all of the time travelling and affect on people's lives that the Legends have and Barry & Cisco opening portals between infinite Earths that act as some intergalactic Uber, Aliens decide that Barry's Flashpoint is what gives them the willies about meta-humans?

I thought the Flash episode was the strongest from a character involvement standpoint.

I thought the Arrow ep felt like it was barely even part of the crossover.

And I thought the Legends ep was fun an actiony, but also felt it did the LOTs characters a disservice. They felt like supporting players on their own show.  Felicity is not one of my favorite characters and Cisco is on my shit list, so having the two of them have such major parts while Jackson was virtually non-existent til almost the second half of the show just pissed me off.

I don't watch Supergirl so I don't know how her ep happened.  But she also felt weirdly side-lined in this one until the big battle in end.  I felt like I could almost hear the writers justifying it by thinking she is too powerful so they had to create some weird argument between her and Oliver to take her out for a bit.

It was popcorn action but overall it felt a little empty.

[GHScorpiosRule]

Okay this one made me cry. Actually, it was Grant/Barry who made me cry with his "It's been an honor" line and what followed. 

I also loved Ray's line about how Kara looked like his cousin!?

I don't watch this show or Arrow, BUT the actress who plays Amaya/Vixen is a VAST improvement over the one who played Kendra. 

I'm also loving Mick's crush on Kara and her reactions to him.

Add me to the list of those that loved Kara putting Smith in his place.

I still don't understand how Barry is responsible for the Aliens coming back, unless they meant that they were monitoring Earth 1 and somehow knew he'd gone back in time? And Barry didn't erase any timelines-they still exist-as alternate timelines. At least, that's how Barry explained it.  But I'm so sick and tired of "FLASHPOINT!!" that if I ever hear it again, it will be too soon.

And I'm glad Cisco got an epiphany about how Barry didn't do what he did intentionally to hurt people. And I'm hoping that because of the crossovers and everything being out and open and addressed, that the future has changed and we won't see that Killer Frost and Vibe fight now.

Edited December 2, 2016 by GHScorpiosRule

[steelyis]

12 minutes ago, KirkB said:

Expensive, yes, but remember the last time a Kryptonian got involved in a city wide alien battle? DC probably does too. More likely though, it was to maintain the masquerade. Keeping the fight confined to a small area means most of the world will never know the world was invaded by aliens in the first place.

Remembers Man of Steel

Shudders

Good point.

 

13 minutes ago, KirkB said:

It's not exactly a false equivalency though. Cisco's point was "we went back in time and changed the past, which screwed up the future." So did Barry. Neither of them meant to cause the damage they did. It was a realization he needed to start mending their relationship.

I think what separates the two actions in my mind is motive and intent:

Cisco and friends intended to go back in time and capture the dominator (which allowed the government goons to get their hands on the dominator) not directly change the future. It was a plan they all come up with to save the world and it led to someone being tortured to death and they chose not to let it happen in front of them even though it was an enemy, because that's what heroes do.

What Barry did was pure selfishness. He wanted to make his life happier and made the decision to alter time on his own, consequences be damned and people suffered. Barry knew his motives were wrong from the start and he didn't care until it began to affect him personally. There was nothing heroic about Barry's actions.

I can forgive a lot if someone's intentions are good but bad things happen as result, it doesn't negate the bad stuff but I can at least see that the person paving the road didn't mean to hurt anyone. Barry hurt a lot of people, knew he would and shrugged it off with a big dumb smile on his face. The two actions are not the same to me.

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

You all saw what I saw, with regards to Smith, right?  That being that he was a clone of CSM from X Files.  Like seriously, an almost exact clone.

•  Shadow-government type that calls shots and makes vague threats
•  Involved with aliens and has been for many (65) years
•  Was working with said aliens to prevent something horrible happening to the greater part of humanity
•  Knows all about the man - or at least his identity - that's most involved with the (current) alien problem/crisis

The similarities are striking (IMO).

[futurechemist]

Devil's advocate, I felt bad for the Dominators.  Their methods were murderous and questionable, but they believed themselves to be heroes and I think they could charitably be called anti-heroes.  Metas like Barry that can change history whenever they want are incredibly dangerous.  Barry clearly doesn't have the maturity to use his powers wisely.  Is it so bad to not want some random alien (alien from the Dominators' perspective) to wreck the universe?  And most metas on Earth do seem to use their power for evil.

Interesting how the 3 episodes dealt with the crossover differently.  Flash was mostly a normal episode with lots of guest stars.  Arrow basically ignored the crossover.  And Legends focused on the crossover and practically ignored some of its own characters.

It was a fun experiment, but was too bloated with characters.  3 ensembles + Supergirl was just too much.

[VCRTracking]

Seeing Victor Garber be an emotionally distant father is giving me Alias flashbacks.

[ketose]

The Dominators don't seem like good beings if they experimented on a bunch of Kryptonians and killed them like Supergirl said during The Flash.

Considering how uninterested the LoT are in keeping the timeline intact, I don't think Stein has to worry about Lilly.

So, Lilly saved the world by giving the Dominators an owie and Firestorm destroyed the superweapon. What did everyone else do?

Felicity said "Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra" when her language was scrambled. There's a geek shout out.

Edited December 2, 2016 by ketose
The recap actually mentioned Darmok.

[statsgirl]

11 minutes ago, ketose said:

No one mentioned that Felicity said "Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra" when her language was scrambled?

I totally missed that!  (I couldn't understand what she said.)  Awesome.

[RedVitC]

Now that I think about it, where were the Dominators when Eobard Thawne first traveled back 130 plus years in time to kill Barry's mom. Also, presumably he's still out there wreaking havoc so why were they going after only Barry?

[Xenith22]

Okay so here's how I think I understand the whole plot...

The dominators came to Earth in the early 50s to check out the metas, satisfied they were not a threat they left.   They came back in 2016 again just as a scout mission.   They captured the non-meta Arrow crew and only learned all about Flashpoint from them since it was fresh on all of their minds.  (The show does a really shitty job of making this clear...but it only makes sense otherwise the capturing Oliver and company plot was completely pointless.)  So that is how the aliens learned about it and told the government about it in the process revealing Barry's identity as the responsible party. 

How the dominators came to speak with agent douche or all people I have no idea....as the VP seemingly did not have knowledge of his douchey kidnapping attempt of the heroes?  Or maybe she just played dumb...because I just can't see the aliens choosing to work with a guy who tortured one of them in the post rescue timeline?  Anyways Cisco/Nate and company rescuing the alien in the past really did not change anything for the worse...  The dominator they captured was not the leader so events would have happened with or without him so I have no idea what bad crack Cisco was smoking when he had his supposed epiphany.   They were only responsible for the alien being tortured for maybe a couple minutes...which while regrettable again had nothing to do with the whole wipe out all metas threat of the present.  (HOWEVER you could make the case that Cisco was to blame for a different reason.  If he had not made Flashpoint an big issue telling the whole Arrow crew about it and putting it at the top of their subconscious then the aliens may not have learned about it and just left on their own without trying to use the metabomb!)  The alien did however pretty much tell them that their actual plan was to exterminate all metas...which those two dolts seemed to completely miss that this obviously 100% meant that Barry turning himself over was nothing more than a ruse to take him off the board while they exterminate everybody else a little easier without the threat of him running back in time to change things again to prevent their actions...

Personally I would have loved to have seen the Arrow and Legends episode merged a little more....because I still don't love how they escaped the dream world prison or the pointlessness of the subplot with Wild Dog.  So I would have ideally had the rescued dominator in some manner aid Felicity in rescuing her comrades by inserting the Smoak Tech escape building into their world so it would have only suddenly appeared after they had figured things out but did not know how to escape...

Quote

Okay, so you have this plot point, where the Flash has to sacrifice himself for the good of the world. Now, we know that the CW will continue to have The Flash as a show so you know it's probably not going to happen. But, maybe don't run a promo for the fall finale of the Flash during one of the commercial breaks.

I mean technically they do have Wally on there now....but yeah it's way too soon for him to believably take over the mantle for even an episode...  Plus they'll likely want to save that development for if they decide to pull the trigger on an actual Crisis event in the next few years.

Quote

I was looking at the people on the stage and the only ones with no masks were going to get on a spaceship and keep traveling through time or slip back to another universe which at first I decided made sense and that Cisco and Felicity (and the rest) were trying to hide their identity....but then they had a party afterward with everyone so nope, they just didn't get any credit.

The party looked to be just between the heroes.  The president and all her staff/military, etc had all left by that time so yeah it probably was meant to be an identity thing.

On a different note...Vixen channels the powers of an elephant...and then proceeds to just repeatedly do fancy spinning kicks.  I don't think someone understands how her powers are supposed to work.  Because I can't exactly recall the last time I've seen an elephant move anything remotely like that.

Edited December 2, 2016 by Xenith22

[ottoDbusdriver]

9 hours ago, futurechemist said:

Devil's advocate, I felt bad for the Dominators.  Their methods were murderous and questionable, but they believed themselves to be heroes and I think they could charitably be called anti-heroes.  Metas like Barry that can change history whenever they want are incredibly dangerous.  Barry clearly doesn't have the maturity to use his powers wisely.  Is it so bad to not want some random alien (alien from the Dominators' perspective) to wreck the universe?  And most metas on Earth do seem to use their power for evil.

This also means that not only do the Dominators exist in parallel universes (Earth 38 for sure, per Supergirl), but they can detect changes in the timeline.  Would have been helpful 'how' they were able to do this ?  And how far away they were when they were able to detect Metas in the first place ?  And how long it took them to get to Earth -- do they have FTL propulsion or did they take years to travel to Earth ?  Where exactly is their home planet ?

8 hours ago, ketose said:

Felicity said "Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra" when her language was scrambled. There's a geek shout out.

That was pretty awesome.

Edited December 2, 2016 by ottoDbusdriver

[ketose]

As amusing as Jax's "pound town" line was, I would assume that Martin has taken his wife there once or twice before. So, was Lilly a romantic accident as well as a temporal one?

[scarynikki12]

I cannot express how loudly I laughed when it was revealed that this was all Barry's fault. He ruins everything! Not that I'm upset he and Cisco made up because I enjoy them together despite my anti-Barry feelings. I've just spent this whole tv season jokingly blaming Barry whenever something goes wrong on other shows so I really liked that. It was like they were cyber stalking me. 

I've tried so hard to keep an open mind about Nate but I'm officially done with him. They spent way too much time on him. I don't know the numbers but it certainly felt like he had more screen time than the other Legends. Plus his suit is stupid and I don't want to look at it. 

That said I did enjoy Ray being meta, Mick taking over the "crushing on an unattainable blonde who can kick my ass" mantle from Snart, and the Sara/Oliver moment at the end. I never expected to love her or them when she first showed up on Arrow in season 2 (I have a knee jerk reaction to cheater characters) but Caity and Amell, individually and together, won me over right away. Every scene they have together is great. Just their body language conveys their long history together and I love it. 

I quit Arrow in season 3, which was hard as I adore Felicity and Diggle, so I was over the moon to see them this crossover. Would like more Dig next time (or he can do a solo on LOT, I'm not picky) but Felicity was excellent. Tech support saving the day! 

I agree they can't erase Lilly without causing further time problems but that works out as she's awesome. Win-win!

[thuganomics85]

Fun episode, even if it felt like the actual Legend characters kind of got pushed back on their own show.  Outside of Martin's plot, it still seemed to be mainly about the big three: Oliver, Kara, and Barry.  Really, if anything, Barry was probably the most important character for the entire crossover. Also, I found it really strange that Sara was the one that took a back seat.  At least Nate/Mick/Amaya had stuff to do with capturing the Dominator, but Sara was mainly stuck with the big trio, which, one one hand, it's kind of cool that the show considered her worthy to be among them, but they kind of overshadowed her for a lot of the scenes (Ray too, but his meta line alone about Brandon Routh's Superman past makes up for any lack of screen time.)

If nothing else though, this episode gets point for finally ending Cisco's issues with Barry.  Even if it's a bit too pact, I'll take it at this point, so he'll hopefully lighten up again.  And all it took was for him to go time-traveling and fuck things up, and realize maybe he was a bit too hard on Barry. That and seeing Barry willing to freaking sacrifice himself to the Dominators.  Good enough for you, Cisco?!

Speaking of which, The Dominators are kind of dicks, because they apparently weren't that concern of Eobard/Reverse Flash fucking up the timelines, and even Zoom's fuckery, but it's only when Barry does it, they go "We cannot abide by this!"

Don't blame Martin at all for keeping Lily a secret, but I'm sure that is going to cause problems down the line.  Victor Garber was great as always.

Not enough Diggle, but his reactions to all the weird stuff that goes down, never gets old.  Neither does Cisco/Felicity geeking out.

Mick though, continues to be the best.  Him hitting on Kara is something I never knew I wanted, along with him and Sara both admiring the new President.  And why is that I want Rene/Wild Dog to get smacked whenever he calls Felicity "Blondie", but Mick calling her "Ponytail" doesn't seem to bother me?  Is it because he gives pretty much everyone nicknames?  Or it just doesn't come off as condescending or disrespectful compared to Rene?  I really don't know.

Barry and Kara making Oliver do a group hug should be required for every crossover.  There already is a great chemistry between those three.

Can't wait to see them do it again and hopefully flesh out a few more pairings (really want to see some actual Kara/Sara scenes), but I'm looking forward to next week, after seeing those previews!

[CletusMusashi]

Well I'll be damned. Of the four shows, this one is the one that tends to strike me as putting, by far, the least effort into its writing. But in this... quadralogy? it actually pretty much singlehandedly carries the whole crossover.

The other shows seem like they were told by the network that they had to do a crossover event, and blew it off in varying degrees.

Supergirl: Yeah, yeah, we got your message. Just let us finish up what we're doin' here and we'll give you two minutes at the end to do whatever the hell you want. But we're not writing it. Or making it. Or giving a shit about it.

(Guardian: And I can be in it. Right? Um... where'd everybody go?)

The Flashes: Barry is the star, right? Okay, cool then. Oh, and you remember that Cisco is mad at Barry, right? And so later he can remember that Barry is the star? Cool. And... what do you mean, "aliens?" Are you even listening? So all the heroes gather around to worship Barry, and then right before Wally goes into an epic speech about wanting to be able to run really fast... hey, why aren't you writing this down? And what's the deal with all those bald naked cardboard puppets?

(H.R: Not that we're judging! Ha ha ha  ha ha ! I like coffee. And am useful, in theory.)

Arrow: Well, at least we can twist it into an excuse to just congratulate ourselves on how much back story we have. Kind of weird, though, how accessible the ep was to somebody who stopped watching in late Season 1...

(Wild Dog: And if they haven't seen what a raging asshole I am yet, maybe I can subtly sneak that into the plot?)

Legends: We quite honestly have no agenda. We don't know who our cast is going to be next year, we don't know which of our story arcs are actually going to happen, and we neither know nor care which of our plot twists are going to actually be remembered. You want to do a Supergirl/Green Arrow/Flash teamup on our show? Hell yeah! Throw in Goofy, Zoidberg, Spiderman and Blacula while you're at it, because we seriously do not give a fuck! 

(Heatwave: Sounds like our show! P.S: Fuck Suicide Squad. I'd especially like to take that little clown girl and #@#&*#*!!!!)

Edited December 3, 2016 by CletusMusashi