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Jill, Derick & the Kids: Moving On!!

Chris Knight

By Chris Knight
in Counting On

CM-CrispMtAir
Message added by CM-CrispMtAir,

Shout out to everyone participating in the conversation about Jill’s miscarriage/stillbirth. You’re navigating a difficult topic with respect and thoughtfulness and your contributions are kind, considerate, constructive and informative. 

Thank you. 💚💚

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Zahdii

Zahdii

(edited)

They [the Catholic church] have always been great at enveloping other cultural mores.

 

And there is always an air of smug superiority to witnesses. and Then there is that whole "I'll pray for you" thing they like to say when you are not interested.  I'm sure Jill and Jessa say that a lot.

 

So much to comment on.  As I understand it, one of the reasons the Catholic church was able to spread so far and wide was because they were willing to incorporate some of the beliefs of other religions into their own, making it easier for people from other religions to convert.  I'm sure there were and are a lot of other devices used to get converts, but Catholicism has been around for 2000 years and they've learned a few tricks, so to speak. 

 

I agree that there have been many times when I've heard someone "witness" and it seems like they're going for some kind of prize.  "I was so far gone/was so bad/was so ill/etc.  Then I found Christ/Christ found me, etc.  Now I'm on top of the world/I'm doing great things for humanity/I'm so healthy my doctors are shocked/etc."  Yeah, a lot of times there's an element of one-upmanship going on.  How "low I was" vs "how high (spiritually) I am now".  It doesn't take much for a person to come off as smug, arrogant, superior, or downright insufferable, with an element of salesmanship thrown in.

 

The Duggars don't even bother with talking about how low they were before.  JB&M talk about how they were raised Christian and simply got better when they fell for the Gothard spiel.  Well, JB's the worst because he was apparently always a "good Christian", but Michelle wasn't quite as good before he got to her.  She was a cheerleader wearing short skirts and bouncing around in public, for God's sake!  She mowed the lawn in a bikini top and shorts, causing a neighbor to lust after her so much he divorced his wife three years later!  She kissed, yes, KISSED other boys before JB!  Clearly, Michelle was much lower on the Christian ladder than Jim Bob, but he fixed all that and pulled her up to almost his level.  I bet they kissed before marriage, though they'll never admit it.  Still, in JB's eyes, Michelle was pretty much a fallen woman that he rescued and brought closer to the light, and he'll never let her forget it.

 

Then they got sucked into the Gothard cult and became the asshats we know and loathe today.  Their 'testimony' is so full of crap I want to call Roto Rooter whenever they start talking.

 

The whole "I'll pray for you" thing is obnoxious.  If I don't want to discuss religion with a person, having them announce they're going to pray for me isn't something I want to hear.  In my mind, either you're letting me know that you're appealing to God to bring me around to your message, or you're walking off and muttering "Fine, go to Hell.  Hey God?, I tried and they wouldn't listen, so whatever you want to do about that...(shrug)".  Obviously I'm putting my own interpretation on that scenario, but I fully believe that most, if not all of the Duggars do just that.  They beat people over the head with their superior religiosity and if the person they're talking to doesn't instantly fall into line or express a desire to hear more, they get the brush-off prayer.

 

Their stupid show might have started off with the premise of using themselves as a vehicle to bring others to Christ, but it devolved into a chance to get money, travel, gifts, and fans.  Now that their seedy underbelly is visible, they're just trying to stay relevant, and I bet it scares them to think too deeply about why they want to stay on TV. 

 

Here's a hint, Duggars/Dillards/Seewalds:  Your pathetic attempts to keep your show, or another variation of the show, is not to keep bringing the word of Christ to heathens.  You're trying to maintain the status quo.  You want the money so you can keep living a life without work (as the average person defines it), and you need the attention and acclaim to prop up your massive egos.

Edited by Zahdii
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Vermicious Knid

Vermicious Knid

what we are told are the words of Christ: "No man comes to the Father but through me."

"There is no God but Allah and Mohammed is his Prophet"-The Shahada, the Moslem declaration of faith.

We are the One True Faith!

No, we are!

My God is better than your God!

No he isn't, and I'll prove it to you by killing you all!

Etc, etc...

The part about Fundies wanting to rescue us all from Hellfire is true. I tried to find an article I remembered reading a while back, couldn't find it, where a Jewish boy in Texas I think, had gone to Bible camp with some friends. There weren't many Jewish families and his friends were all Christian and he wanted to do things with them. At the camp, he was held down and forcibly baptized. His parents were understandably very upset and the preacher, minister, whomever explained it by saying if you saw someone in the desert dying for water and you could give that water and save them, wouldn't you?

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

JB and Mechelle admitted that they kissed before the wedding, but claim to have been virgins. 

 

But back to Jill and Derick's pathetic attempts to convert the locals, y'all, before the mods shut it down. :D

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becca3891

becca3891

The thing is, with Jill and Derick - what is it, exactly, that makes them so sure, so superior, so all-knowing, that *their* God, their religion (CULT !), is "better" than anyone else's ? That their way is the ONLY way ? NOT damned if you do, but surely damned if you don't, so to speak...

Anyone - and I mean ANYONE - can claim that they are a member of the one and only "true" faith and then proceed to condemn everyone else to eternal Hellfire and dalmations (tee-hee), but who would really know ? Without verified, documented evidence (pics or it didn't happen, y'all !) of one God or another going all badass on the evil and saving the righteous and just, how would anyone know they backed the right horse ???

I think that their brand of missioncation/conversion attempts is nothing more than a pseudo-religious game version of "My dad can beat up YOUR dad !", and it's detrimental - even harmful - to the people they're purportedly "ministering" to.

They want to "save souls" in a dangerous, violent, pitiably impoverished country with drugs problems, rampant unemployment, horrifying infant mortality, bad water, intermittent, undependable electrical power, street thugs, and a government that is rife with corruption.

How about saving a *life* before you save a soul ?

They could have done SO much more if they'd just stayed in Arkansas and sent the money to a legitimate charity. JillyMuffyn could have stayed put to make bad dinners for Derick when he came home from his job at Walmart while changing Izzy into a dozen different outfits for her Instagram account while people like the Red Cross and Doctors Without Borders addressed the REAL problems in Guatemala.

Meh.

Well, with all due respect, I very much disagree. You would be amazed at how many good and kind people are COMPLETELY certain that God's plan of salvation through Jesus Christ is the only escape from eternal agony. I know to many logical minds, it sounds ridiculous, but the numbers are staggering. It really isn't "my dad can beat up your dad." It's not wanting anyone to be tortured eternally. Yes, that's sick that they think a loving god does this, but they really, truly do. Again, do I like the Duggars? No. But I don't for a second doubt their sincerity in wanting to save the world from hell.

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Chalby

Chalby

And let's not forget the minimizing of criminal behavior.

From the FB comments:

It was jes' tough times and troubles, y'all!

It is jes' plain delusional on behalf of their Facebook fans and family.

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Chalby

Chalby

it's a picture that shouldn't have been shared in the first place. I will however defend the swaddle until my dying day. My second child was a terrible baby. Cried the first three months of his life non stop. 

 

I agree, there wouldn't be all this snark if the picture hadn't have been posted. Also, I know you are probably already aware of this (but maybe some readers aren't), but come on, there's no way a baby with colic is a "terrible baby". I figure it was simply a coincidence that your swaddling started as the colic ended (generally 3 months is the rule).

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Mountainair

Mountainair

I agree, there wouldn't be all this snark if the picture hadn't have been posted. Also, I know you are probably already aware of this (but maybe some readers aren't), but come on, there's no way a baby with colic is a "terrible baby". I figure it was simply a coincidence that your swaddling started as the colic ended (generally 3 months is the rule).

I don't see why not. People claim to have so called "good babies" why can't I have had a "terrible" one? He never slept, cried non stop, ate like food was never coming back, screamed bloody murder all the time. He was a terrible baby and there's nothing wrong with that. It's the way he was. Doesn't mean I love him any less.

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

(edited)

She needs to cite some references in support of this general statement. Especially the many musicians dying of AIDS. I can think of a few, but not "many". I bet more fundies die from AIDS overdoses, or suicides, than musicians.

 

I say again, though -- Jill did not write this book. None of the girls wrote this book. I'd be surprised if they even read the book, frankly.

 

All they did was tell some of their personal stories to a couple of ghostwriters -- one of them a Gothard righthand man -- and they wrote a book, making the points that their parents and their parents' cult wanted to see made -- i.e., the Gothard points -- including by editing and utterly reshaping even the stupid anecdotes that the girls related. 

 

This is a straight-up (stupid, outdated, exaggerated) Gothard talking point, accompanied by the exact same kind of "stat" that he's always used. Jill didn't come up with it, any more than she came up with the ridiculous "stat" about abuse that she used in the tv interview. I agree that it's crap. But it just seems ridiculous to me to keep hammering on the fiction that somehow this ignorant, brainwashed, utterly incompetent 20-something child was somehow the source and author of a stat or a talking point.

 

It also doesn't make sense to keep pinning the book on Jill, just because some edition of it lists her as the first or the main or the only author. On the copyright page, they're clearly listed in descending order of age -- Jana, Jill, Jessa, Jinger. So does that mean Jana was the main author? No. They were going to list them in some order, so that obvious one was the one they chose. Quite clearly, all the girls were asked to tell some of "their" stories -- i.e., tales loosely based in their lives that Jim Bob and Michelle had already deemed acceptable in the forms into which Jim Bob and Michelle had already edited those stories, over years of mental bludgeoning -- and then the ghostwriters, who were clearly paid to write a Gothard tract, took it from there. It's a stupid, lying book. But Jill didn't write it. People paid or otherwise motivated by the Gothard empire to do so, did. Jill probably believes a lot of what's in the book. They all probably do. But honestly, as "authors" (not) of that book, all four of them were just puppets with Jim Bob's, Michelle's and Bill Gothard's hands in their mouths.

Edited by Churchhoney
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MarysWetBar

MarysWetBar

I say again, though -- Jill did not write this book. None of the girls wrote this book. I'd be surprised if they even read the book, frankly.

All they did was tell some of their personal stories to a couple of ghostwriters -- one of them a Gothard righthand man -- and they wrote a book, making the points that their parents and their parents' cult wanted to see made -- i.e., the Gothard points -- including by editing and utterly reshaping even the stupid anecdotes that the girls related.

This is a straight-up (stupid, outdated, exaggerated) Gothard talking point, accompanied by the exact same kind of "stat" that he's always used. Jill didn't come up with it, any more than she came up with the ridiculous "stat" about abuse that she used in the tv interview. I agree that it's crap. But it just seems ridiculous to me to keep hammering on the fiction that somehow this ignorant, brainwashed, utterly incompetent 20-something child was somehow the source and author of a stat or a talking point.

It also doesn't make sense to keep pinning the book on Jill, just because some edition of it lists her as the first or the main or the only author. On the copyright page, they're clearly listed in descending order of age -- Jana, Jill, Jessa, Jinger. So does that mean Jana was the main author? No. They were going to list them in some order, so that obvious one was the one they chose. Quite clearly, all the girls were asked to tell some of "their" stories -- i.e., tales loosely based in their lives that Jim Bob and Michelle had already deemed acceptable in the forms into Jim Bob and Michelle had already edited those stories, over years of mental bludgeoning -- and then the ghostwriters, who were clearly paid to write a Gothard tract, took it from there. It's a stupid, lying book. But Jill didn't write it. People paid or otherwise motivated by the Gothard empire to do so, did. Jill probably believes a lot of what's in the book. They all probably do. But honestly, as "authors" (not) of that book, all four of them were just puppets with Jim Bob's, Michelle's and Bill Gothard's hands in their mouths.

Trust me, you don't need to purpose to convince me that Jill Duggar didn't write a book. I knew that. :)
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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

(edited)

Trust me, you don't need to purpose to convince me that Jill Duggar didn't write a book. I knew that. :)

 

lol     

 

At least Jill doesn't list herself as "author" or "writer" on her websites. Now, Miss Jessa, on the other hand ....

 

There it is on her Facebook page --

Jessa Seewald

Author

 

https://www.facebook.com/JessaSeewald/

 

And, if anything, I'd judge Jessa to perhaps be even less likely than Jill to write a book. Less interested in and maybe even less capable of it. Jill, after all, did do the studying to become a pseudo midwife (which, for a Duggar, was actually a lot of studying, I'd say) and she imagines that she's been studying Spanish for years! Hell, Jill even married a college graduate. Jessa? Not so much.

Edited by Churchhoney
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JoanArc

JoanArc

 

And, if anything, I'd judge Jessa to perhaps be even less likely than Jill to write a book. Less interested in and maybe even less capable of it. Jill, after all, did do the studying to become a pseudo midwife (which, for a Duggar, was actually a lot of studying, I'd say) and she imagines that she's been studying Spanish for years! Hell, Jill even married a college graduate. Jessa? Not so much.

Jill lectures. Jessa sneers.

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Chalby

Chalby

 why can't I have had a "terrible" one? He never slept, cried non stop, ate like food was never coming back, screamed bloody murder all the time. 

I just don't see a baby being 'terrible' because of something beyond his control. As a teen, sure, he can be 'terrible' but not as a baby. Frustating, annoying, fussy, selective... I don't know. But he's your kid, so have at him.

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BitterApple

BitterApple

(edited)

Ugh, gag me with a spoon. I read the comments underneath the picture and one leghumper commends Jill for "touching lives and hearts." I think we need to apply for one of those research grants so we can study the phenomena of the Duggar fan base. They are truly a peculiar species.

Edited by BitterApple
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Almost 3000

Almost 3000

WTH is it with these grown men wearing backward trucker hats in 2016??

I think in some form hats will always be part of men's wear because I swear the balding rate seems to have escalated in the last few years. Ben is just a douche.
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Wellfleet

Wellfleet

(edited)

There are worse things than baldness. Like backward trucker hats. Comb overs. Bad toupees. And, of course, the Trumpadour.

 

You said it. Proving one thing for sure - Donald Trump may be a billionaire, but all his $ still couldn't buy him any good taste, because he truly thinks his hair looks good.

Edited by Wellfleet
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Joe Jitsu913

Joe Jitsu913

Derick looks like the biggest Deadhead, stoner around. He reminds me of Shaggy from Scooby Doo.

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

You said it. Proving one thing for sure - Donald Trump may be a billionaire, but all his $ still couldn't buy him any good taste, because he truly thinks his hair looks good.

Derick's shagginess I can deal with better than JB's & Ben's helmet heads. And the Donald - what happens during sex? Does he not move his head?

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mbutterfly

mbutterfly

I don't see why not. People claim to have so called "good babies" why can't I have had a "terrible" one? He never slept, cried non stop, ate like food was never coming back, screamed bloody murder all the time. He was a terrible baby and there's nothing wrong with that. It's the way he was. Doesn't mean I love him any less.

I'm not at all against swaddling infants. But in my experience, the baby was very young, so young the nervous system needed soothing and comfort. The baby would be dressed very comfortably, ready for sleep. Israel was apparently clothed for the day wearing hard shoes. I've seen a lot of baby's swaddled, never with outdoor shoes on. Socks or booties, yes, for warmth. But not hard-soled shoes. I don't believe Jill and Derrick were actually trying to discipline in the whack with a ruler sense. I believe Derrick completely relies on Jill for good practices, and Jill has been poorly trained. 

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

I'm not at all against swaddling infants. But in my experience, the baby was very young, so young the nervous system needed soothing and comfort. The baby would be dressed very comfortably, ready for sleep. Israel was apparently clothed for the day wearing hard shoes. I've seen a lot of baby's swaddled, never with outdoor shoes on. Socks or booties, yes, for warmth. But not hard-soled shoes. I don't believe Jill and Derrick were actually trying to discipline in the whack with a ruler sense. I believe Derrick completely relies on Jill for good practices, and Jill has been poorly trained. 

While I think both are HORRIBLY wrong, a tap with a plastic ruler almost seems less cruel.

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neural-plasticity

neural-plasticity

Not sure exactly where the Dillards are in SA, but I thought about them on my way home as I was listening to NPR today. Brazil and some other countries in the continent are having some serious issues with the Zika virus and are urging pregnant women not to travel to those places, as the virus can cause some birth defects, particularly microcephaly. Hopefully Jill's not pregnant/trying to get pregnant and if she is, she's being really careful down there! 

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Wellfleet

Wellfleet

Derick's shagginess I can deal with better than JB's & Ben's helmet heads. And the Donald - what happens during sex? Does he not move his head?

 

LOL! I imagine Donald just sets his hair on the bedside table - or puts it in its cage or whatever... 

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MargeGunderson

MargeGunderson

Derick's shagginess I can deal with better than JB's & Ben's helmet heads. And the Donald - what happens during sex? Does he not move his head?

I prefer to think of the Donald like Ken (of Ken and Barbie) and therefore incapable of sex. No number of biological children can convince me otherwise. So, your question makes no sense here in the great state of Denial, USA.

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scriggle

scriggle

What does that mean in the pic, that they were able to "find service"? Like missionary service? Service in a restaurant? A church service?

 

Free wifi so they could send/upload the pictures of their missioncation?

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Fuzzysox

Fuzzysox

Not sure exactly where the Dillards are in SA, but I thought about them on my way home as I was listening to NPR today. Brazil and some other countries in the continent are having some serious issues with the Zika virus and are urging pregnant women not to travel to those places, as the virus can cause some birth defects, particularly microcephaly. Hopefully Jill's not pregnant/trying to get pregnant and if she is, she's being really careful down there!

I heard this on the news tonight and my first thought was goodness if Jill is pregnant NOW would be a good time to come home and call it a day.

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Chalby

Chalby

Might be a bug bite, its not really big enough for something an adult hand could do.

When you spoke of a bruise, I thought you meant on his head. But now I am thinking it's only hair, lol. My eyes are old. That thing on his leg looks like nothing serious.

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Chalby

Chalby

I was appalled at how little Spanish JIll and Derick knew upon arriving. Not to be mean, but it's a Latin based language. It's way easier to learn than, say, Russian or Chinese. They had ages to prepare and they waited to GET THERE before taking lessons? I just don't understand it. They had all the time in the world to learn it in the US.

To me, this is just a continuation of the Duggar smugness, and ignorance, they have never disguised. Even during their jaunts around the world, I was consistently embarrassed at their lack of knowledge, and refusal to study, the culture they were visiting. That excuses Jill (the Duggar ignorance) but what is Derrick's excuse? He appeared to know Nepalese when he was there, and as pointed out, Spanish is an easier language to grasp. Due to the Duggar's home schooling (led by a mother who knows nothing) none of us really know if they are good students. If anything, they always appeared to be years behind in their study books. Jill et el could actually be academically challenged which would explain her giggling and inability to carry on a conversation.

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awaken

awaken

(edited)

Free wifi so they could send/upload the pictures of their missioncation?

Oh. Duh. Sorry- thanks! I thought they had finally found some real missionary work to do and we're officially "in service" vs hanging out!

Edited by awaken
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kokapetl

kokapetl

on Duggar Family Official Facebook page, they're asking for $$ again, on the Dullards behalf. Well, supposedly to put those boys through English school. They're getting really specific now - asking for $500.

Wouldn't a woman who teaches Spanish to English speakers be able to do this herself? She's familiar with English, and she's familiar with teaching language. I don't understand.
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NikSac

NikSac

Wouldn't a woman who teaches Spanish to English speakers be able to do this herself? She's familiar with English, and she's familiar with teaching language. I don't understand.

Not to mention she'd probably do a way better job than Jill, who can barely seem to grasp the finer points of English, and has taken years to learn "Si!"

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JoanArc

JoanArc

Jill's probably rooting for Zika. An underdeveloped cranium is a huge plus in their world. Anything to hobble the next generation. Of course that assumes they know about it. I doubt Jill and Derrick watch much news, or understand Spanish language news.

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Micks Picks

Micks Picks

Kokapetl and NicSac it's not about the English; it's not about the Spanish; it's not about studying or learning. They just want $500.

I know people who are not smart at all, although they may have college degrees, who teach English in other countries and make a good living. It pays all their expenses. And although they have done it for years, they still don't know any of the language of the students. I am not kidding. I was and remain flabbergasted.

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kandinski

kandinski

To me, this is just a continuation of the Duggar smugness, and ignorance, they have never disguised. Even during their jaunts around the world, I was consistently embarrassed at their lack of knowledge, and refusal to study, the culture they were visiting. That excuses Jill (the Duggar ignorance) but what is Derrick's excuse? He appeared to know Nepalese when he was there, and as pointed out, Spanish is an easier language to grasp. Due to the Duggar's home schooling (led by a mother who knows nothing) none of us really know if they are good students. If anything, they always appeared to be years behind in their study books. Jill et el could actually be academically challenged which would explain her giggling and inability to carry on a conversation.

I think its quite obvious a few of the brood mares offspring are not playing cards with the full deck.Jill seems to behave and speak like a ten year old girl.

I think as some of the younger ones grow and become more vocal,it will be more noticable.

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Barb23

Barb23

I'm thinking asking for donations to help these boys is just another scheme by the Dullards. The tutor mom probably knows nothing about it & would never see a dollar from the donations. I guess the Dullards bank account is running a little low.

That Zika virus thing is scary, especially since its mosquito driven. I'm with you JoanArc, they probably arent up on the news. Hopefully, Cathy is.

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