Jill, Derick & the Kids: Moving On!!

[BigBingerBro]

46 minutes ago, galaxychaser said:

Anyone use hubby in real life conversation? 

I had a coworker that said it all the time.  She thought is was cute.  It was like nails on a chalkboard.

Yes, Jill's new do looks nice.  I'm sure soon it will start to look like her old one as it grows out.

[cmr2014]

9 hours ago, Whyyouneedaname said:

Jill's haircut looks good! she said she got 14" cut off, maybe Jessa will take note, this looks so much healthier. 

She looks great! This cut must have been done by an actual professional stylist. It looks like her hair was WASHED before it was cut, and it also looks like their might have been some conditioner involved, too. Way to go Jill!

[JoanArc]

Jill looks WONDERFUL. Wat a great move for her. I hope it's a symbol of her breaking away from the crappy beliefs forced on her.

[Picture It. Sicily]

1 hour ago, farmgal4 said:

I hope Derrick is crazy about it, because if he’s not, she’ll let grow back out.

Honestly, I think Derrick will love whatever she loves. As much as I don't like him,  I'm sure he can see how happy she is with the cut and will remain supportive. 

[Picture It. Sicily]

Kirsten what's her face is being very presumptuous. Does she really think Jill went behind his back and sprang a drastic change on him?

[Lisa418722]

Anytime a fundie woman moves into the "real" world a little, whether it's wearing pants, cutting her hair, or piercing her nose, her followers go bat shit crazy to put it mildly.  I've always said that Christians are some of the most judgmental people ever (and I'm a Christian, but not a fundie or evangelical).  kristenr83 needs to get off her high horse (to quote my grandmother and mother) and come down to earth.  Jill said she was having headaches. I guess kristenr83 would tell her to pray, but keep her "glory."  
I hope that Derick is supportive of Jill.    I really want Jill to be able to expand her horizons. Put the kids in daycare - or when Izzy is old enough put him in kindergarten whether it be Christian or a pubic school. Maybe when both kids get into school, she may think about getting some more education herself.   She has definitely changed more than I would have ever expected back in the ___ Kids and Counting days. 

[Growsonwalls]

I'm a bit confused. Derrick's mom has a very short bob. Mary Duggar also had a shortish bob. Why is it ungodly for Jill to cut her hair? 

Reminds me of the meltdown the first time Kate (Duchess of Cambridge) wore pants to an engagement. "Princesses dont wear pants!!!!" Really? 

[lascuba]

I'm actually glad that the leghumpers are giving her a hard time about the hair, not because I want her to feel bad about the hair, but I do want her to experience the pain and discomfort that she and her family have dished out (and continue to do so!) to people when they didn't fall in line with their beliefs. Because it's not enough that she realizes the sky isn't going to fall if she does things differently than what her parents insisted was the best way to do things. She also needs to feel just how hurtful her words and pronouncements--and the pronouncements of people she supports and endorses--are to people. Maybe then, she'd make changes that really matter. 

Yeah, yeah, baby steps. I get it. But the doesn't mean we should stop her from falling over and knocking her head on the path to full on sprinting. 

[doodlebug]

3 hours ago, galaxychaser said:

Anyone use hubby in real life conversation? 

I never hear it in real life. I hear my husband or we or Bob went to the movies with the kids etc.

I'm guilty of using it, when referring to a pregnant patient's husband to a third part; mainly because I can never remember their names.  As in, 'her hubby came with her to her last appointment'.  Doesn't matter whether they're actually legally married, I usually don't know that, either. It's better than BabyDaddy.

Edited December 21, 2019 by doodlebug

[leighdear]

A haircut on an uneducated, backward, misguided hick is just a haircut. 

I don't get being proud that a perfect stranger did something millions of people do every day.  It's a haircut,  

If she was donating it, she would be showing off the bound ponytail or braid.  My SIL did Locks of Love, and it had to be mailed to them in ponytail or braid form.

I think she's just looking for attention, as usual.  

ETA: My mistake about her donation, I only see the photos posted here, I don't follow any of them.  

 

Edited December 21, 2019 by leighdear

[Sew Sumi]

Her IG pic is of the cut ponytail. She is asking for suggestions to donate. Seems sincere to me.

[QuinnInND]

Jill looks amazing! She looks like a whole different person. Happy! Like she's got a new lease on life! It's amazing what a new haircut can do! Go Jill go!! 

My twins take baths together. They're 3 and a half. They've bathed together since they were old enough to sit in the tub. Mostly for convenience for me, but they love being together. My son bathes separately. In clean water. We do baths every day. The thought of using the same water for all of them is disgusting. For myself, if I don't wash my hair every day, it's so greasy I could lube the car. 

[queenanne]

10 hours ago, xwordfanatik said:

I had waist length hair in my 20's.  I had it cut to shoulder length, and I did get fewer headaches after that.

Jill looks great.  It's nice she's donating hair.  Yay!  🙂

As per my mother, hairdressers still call shoulder-length hair "long" (source: her regular hairdresser makes her book two time slots on account of it).  Jill's hair looks great and I hope she keeps it there.

[GeeGolly]

Jill's response to the SM poster reveals she is still following the headship mindset. She explained that she discussed her haircut at length (had too) with Derick prior to cutting it.

While I'm sure many women discuss their hair with their partners, I'm thinking most don't ask for permission or approval. Personally, I've been married over 35 years and never once discussed what I do with my hair, with my husband.

[Growsonwalls]

2 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Jill's response to the SM poster reveals she is still following the headship mindset. She explained that she discussed her haircut at length (had too) with Derick prior to cutting it.

While I'm sure many women discuss their hair with their partners, I'm thinking most don't ask for permission or approval. Personally, I've been married over 35 years and never once discussed what I do with my hair, with my husband.

Eh, men can be weird about hair. A few months ago I toyed with shaving my head and my gay friends freaked out over it. They're just my gay friends. But they were absolutely freaking out about it. I didn't end up doing it. 

It doesn't sound like Derick was very domineering about this particular issue. I think the snotty judgmental responses caused Jill to assure the leg-humper fundies that she was still "keeping sweet" but if Derick is away most of the day I don;t think the convo went deeper than "I want to cut my hair." "Ok cool." "No, a lot of it." "Ok cool." Derick's mom has short hair, and Derick's sister in law Deena also has short hair. The females in his family wear pants and also do not dress in the frilly Duggar style. 

I don't think this was a big thing for Derick. I think it was a big thing for Jill, and Derick was supportive which is important. Anna, Jana, and Jessa also left nice messages.

[GeeGolly]

1 minute ago, Growsonwalls said:

Eh, men can be weird about hair. A few months ago I toyed with shaving my head and my gay friends freaked out over it. They're just my gay friends. But they were absolutely freaking out about it. I didn't end up doing it. 

It doesn't sound like Derick was very domineering about this particular issue. I think the snotty judgmental responses caused Jill to assure the leg-humper fundies that she was still "keeping sweet" but if Derick is away most of the day I don;t think the convo went deeper than "I want to cut my hair." "Ok cool." "No, a lot of it." "Ok cool." Derick's mom has short hair, and Derick's sister in law Deena also has short hair. The females in his family wear pants and also do not dress in the frilly Duggar style. 

I don't think this was a big thing for Derick. I think it was a big thing for Jill, and Derick was supportive which is important. Anna, Jana, and Jessa also left nice messages.

I agree that it was no big deal for Derick. I actually don't think Derick is all that domineering in their marriage overall. But because this was a big deal for Jill I'm guessing they discussed cutting her hair for a few days, if not longer, before she finally got up the courage to do it.

 

[mythoughtis]

11 hours ago, doodlebug said:

I'm guilty of using it, when referring to a pregnant patient's husband to a third part; mainly because I can never remember their names.  As in, 'her hubby came with her to her last appointment'.  Doesn't matter whether they're actually legally married, I usually don't know that, either. It's better than BabyDaddy.

Yes it is better.  The terms BabyDaddy and BabyMama are like fingernails on a chalkboard to me.  Is it really that hard to add the possessive and say ‘Babys’ Dad’?

As to Jills’ haircut- it looks great, she feels better, it’s easier to take care of.  and she wasn’t struck by lightning.   Win win.   Maybe she will continue blossoming into a  semi-normal adult.   Maybe a nice Christian school for the kids? 

 

 

 

[Scarlett45]

Jill looks beautiful. The cut really flatters her and you can see the joy in her eyes. 

[Madtown]

9 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I agree that it was no big deal for Derick. I actually don't think Derick is all that domineering in their marriage overall. But because this was a big deal for Jill I'm guessing they discussed cutting her hair for a few days, if not longer, before she finally got up the courage to do it.

 

I kind of feel the same way. I think Jill was probably extremely nervous to cut it, but really wanted to cut it. I don't think Derick would've been all upset had she just went out and done it without discussing it with him. Then again I go out and cut my hair whatever way I want without discussing it with my husband because he could give two craps..lol If he encouraged her and gave her the strength to do it, good for him.

I did notice in the video that she seemed a little nervous to show him. She made the comment that she wanted to make sure she looked good for him before showing him. Which I hope was just her excitment and not how she feels every day.  She seems very happy and maybe even a little more confident. The leghumpers giving her crap for it are in need of some serious help..lol

[libgirl2]

I will talk about a haircut with my husband but I don't get permission. Its more like, I think I'm going to take a few inches off and he is like okay. Now if I were going to shave my head we would probably have a long talk about that and while he wouldn't forbid me, he would not encourage me either.

Poor Jill was nervous because she has been brought up with the whole crowning glory etc.... I think Derrick might like longer hair but I don't think he really cares if its down to her butt or at her shoulders.

[Jynnan tonnix]

2 hours ago, libgirl2 said:

I will talk about a haircut with my husband but I don't get permission. Its more like, I think I'm going to take a few inches off and he is like okay. Now if I were going to shave my head we would probably have a long talk about that and while he wouldn't forbid me, he would not encourage me either.

Poor Jill was nervous because she has been brought up with the whole crowning glory etc.... I think Derrick might like longer hair but I don't think he really cares if its down to her butt or at her shoulders.

This. I had a talk with Mr. Jyn recently about whether or not to color my hair again...I've finally grown out the last of the color over the past three years or so, and I like it in some ways, but there is still a higher proportion of dark to gray hair in there, so it just looks sort of dull. He's OK with whatever, but if pushed, will admit that he thinks coloring the gray would be more flattering. I need a cut, too, as it's down to about bra-strap length, wet. Just below my shoulders dry.

I think that Derick (I won't call him Dreck on this occasion) probably just told her to go with what she wanted. As many have pointed out, his mother has short hair, and Jill has started wearing pants and loosening up some of the more stringent of Fundie behaviors under his headship. He may have encouraged this, but I don't think he told her what to do one way or another. In any case. as much as he is pretty forthcoming on what he doesn't consider Godly, hair doesn't appear to be something he cares one way or the other about. He might not have wanted her to have it cut really short, but many men seem to prefer slightly longer hair to a severe, structured cut. I had very short hair for years, and Mr. Jyn never really loved it, but didn't complain either. 

My guess is that they are both happy about this new look. Maybe Jill won't need to drag out the lotion so often.

Edited December 21, 2019 by Jynnan tonnix

[DangerousMinds]

16 hours ago, BitterApple said:

I agree. I remember Alyssa Bates caught hell when she wore a sleeveless dress to church. From the way Fundie trolls were going in on her, you'd have thought she walked into the service naked. It just goes to show the level of petty judgment within these circles. I'm not surprised these girls struggle with the most basic of changes. What a way to live.

If they didn’t choose to share these details with millions of complete strangers, it wouldn’t be that way.

[graefin]

19 hours ago, libgirl2 said:

For her, it is a drastic cut. 

I agree that it's a big change for her; I was just saying that relatively speaking, it's not as radical as going to short (shoulder-length) hair like some of the Bateses have done (Alyssa and Katie), which is a real departure from their (Gothardite) culture. Jill's hair is still long--it's just not insanely, unmanageably long like before.

I think it's interesting that of all the girls, although Jill seems the simplest minded, she also seems to be the one who has broken away the most from their previous lifestyle and belief system, while Jessa, who is arguably the brightest, is the one who seems most deeply entrenched and least likely to veer away.

I know this is Jill's topic, but to me, Jessa seems to be the one most afraid of stepping outside of the Duggar bubble and living a different life. Hell, she couldn't even approach a stranger to accept a rose on the day she and Ben were getting engaged. I'd love to imagine her following suit and chopping a much-needed foot off her mane, but can't see it happening. For her, I think her hair is literally a covering (for all her insecurities).

[Jynnan tonnix]

15 minutes ago, graefin said:

I agree that it's a big change for her; I was just saying that relatively speaking, it's not as radical as going to short (shoulder-length) hair like some of the Bateses have done (Alyssa and Katie), which is a real departure from their (Gothardite) culture. Jill's hair is still long--it's just not insanely, unmanageably long like before.

I think it's interesting that of all the girls, although Jill seems the simplest minded, she also seems to be the one who has broken away the most from their previous lifestyle and belief system, while Jessa, who is arguably the brightest, is the one who seems most deeply entrenched and least likely to veer away.

I know this is Jill's topic, but to me, Jessa seems to be the one most afraid of stepping outside of the Duggar bubble and living a different life. Hell, she couldn't even approach a stranger to accept a rose on the day she and Ben were getting engaged. I'd love to imagine her following suit and chopping a much-needed foot off her mane, but can't see it happening. For her, I think her hair is literally a covering (for all her insecurities).

Well, since Jill and her family are not being featured on the show, except maybe peripherally (rarely), there is not as much pressure for her to toe the company line. If she enjoys the freedom of a few more choices than she had under DimBlob's headship, good for her for embracing them. It gives me a little more hope that Iz and Sam might someday go to an actual school.

Jessa, on the other hand, is stuck rigidly following the standards that the show has set. If she is of the more business-minded side of the Duggars, she may well see it as her responsibility not to let it slip. Though, thankfully, she does not appear to have gone so far as to blanket-train her children. I suspect, though, that Ben may have had something to do with that. He seems more naturally gentle than Jessa, and maybe once she relaxed a bit with thinking she had to expect instant obedience with her kids, she found she actually enjoyed them more.

[GeeGolly]

Of all the females, the one who I think changed the most, or in reality, has let out some traits she was born with, is Jana. I think Jill has shown some independence by not following a few of Michelle's Gothard inspired convictions. I think Jinger's changes have been inspired by Jeremy and she has grown even more confident without Jessa around. I still see Jessa as the same selfish, insecure, passive-aggressive, manipulator she has always been.

I really don't see any of the girls as being smarter than one another though. With the exception of maybe Jana, who has shown little bits of critical thinking even during the original series.

What I think will help Jinger and Jill going forward is that you don't know what you don't know, and they now have more frequent exposure to the more subtle aspects of mainstream living. They grew up knowing their clothing and hair were atypical. They're now getting a lot more exposure to educated, intelligent and independent folks. Folks who may not be Fundy or even Christian, who are kind, honest folks with no agenda.

Jana is also getting some, although less, exposure because when she's out and about with her adult siblings she doesn't have a husband/father headship physically looming over her.

I'm guessing we'll never really know if someone breaks free, because even if/when some of their beliefs have softened or completely changed, I don't think they would openly discuss it.

When Jill learns to find her way out of a paper bag, or maybe turn a TV show on when she's stir crazy at home with the boys, I'll have even more hope for her.

[cmr2014]

I thought it was worth mentioning that there are now multiple pages of comments about Jill's haircut; there was, maybe, a page about Lauren's baby. 

In this bizzaro-world, a BABY is a completely uninteresting everyday event, and a HAIRCUT is a minor miracle that everyone wants to talk about.

[doodlebug]

1 hour ago, cmr2014 said:

I thought it was worth mentioning that there are now multiple pages of comments about Jill's haircut; there was, maybe, a page about Lauren's baby. 

In this bizzaro-world, a BABY is a completely uninteresting everyday event, and a HAIRCUT is a minor miracle that everyone wants to talk about.

Let's face it; with this crowd, babies are a dime a dozen while a real haircut for a female Duggar happens about as often as Halley's comet makes an appearance.  There will probably be half a dozen more new babies before the next significant haircut, if not longer/

[lascuba]

4 hours ago, graefin said:

I agree that it's a big change for her; I was just saying that relatively speaking, it's not as radical as going to short (shoulder-length) hair like some of the Bateses have done (Alyssa and Katie), which is a real departure from their (Gothardite) culture. Jill's hair is still long--it's just not insanely, unmanageably long like before.

I think it's interesting that of all the girls, although Jill seems the simplest minded, she also seems to be the one who has broken away the most from their previous lifestyle and belief system, while Jessa, who is arguably the brightest, is the one who seems most deeply entrenched and least likely to veer away.

I know this is Jill's topic, but to me, Jessa seems to be the one most afraid of stepping outside of the Duggar bubble and living a different life. Hell, she couldn't even approach a stranger to accept a rose on the day she and Ben were getting engaged. I'd love to imagine her following suit and chopping a much-needed foot off her mane, but can't see it happening. For her, I think her hair is literally a covering (for all her insecurities).

Years ago in the comments of a blog post I can't remember, someone claiming to be a former fundie (but was unfamiliar with the Duggars) said that kid who was the biggest believer and most eager to please was the one who would be most likely to leave, because as soon as something happened to make her question, the whole house of cards comes tumbling down.  The kid(s) who seemed to know that a lot of their beliefs are bullshit are likely to never leave, because they long ago learned to accept the contradictions and it didn't cause them any emotional anguish.  I kind of scoffed at that idead because in this family that biggest believer  was Jill and no way would SHE be the one to ever leave, right? But now? That comment describes Jessa and Jill pretty well.

[Temperance]

I really think Jill looks great. I've had longer hair and shorter hair and you would definitely feel the difference. She may even have more energy. 

Her hair is still long enough to put up in a pony tail and looks feminine.

Gothard liked long hair, but he's out at IBLP. Gil Bates is on the current board of IBLP and several of his daughters cut their hair before they got married. The dowdy fashions of IBLP are going, going, gone! The Bates rock short skirts, and short hair even before marriage. 

The Maxwell women tend to have short hair too. Anna, Sarah, and Teri all have/had shorter hair. Only Mary keeps hers long and that seems to be a choice for her. 

[Growsonwalls]

I also think Jessa realizes that right now she’s sort of the queen bee of that particular fundie circle. The three adorable kids who already have Bible verses memorized, the attractiveness (by fundie standards of beauty), the nice laid back husband are things fundie women dream about. Now in a few years when there aren’t more cute babies, when Jessa maybe loses her looks, we’ll see if she’s still the Regina George of the Duggar clan.

[DangerousMinds]

1 hour ago, Growsonwalls said:

I also think Jessa realizes that right now she’s sort of the queen bee of that particular fundie circle. The three adorable kids who already have Bible verses memorized, the attractiveness (by fundie standards of beauty), the nice laid back husband are things fundie women dream about. Now in a few years when there aren’t more cute babies, when Jessa maybe loses her looks, we’ll see if she’s still the Regina George of the Duggar clan.

I think Jessa lost her queen bee status a while ago. She may think she still has it though! 🤣

[galaxychaser]

If Josh divorced Anna that would make news. Or identical triplets.

[JoanArc]

5 hours ago, cmr2014 said:

In this bizzaro-world, a BABY is a completely uninteresting everyday event, and a HAIRCUT is a minor miracle that everyone wants to talk about.

Babies come every nine months, but haircuts are a once-in-a-lifetime thing!

Quote

Now in a few years when there aren’t more cute babies, when Jessa maybe loses her looks, we’ll see if she’s still the Regina George of the Duggar clan.

Then she'll have the youngest Duggar Girls to compete with. When She's 35 and they're all courting or married with young babies she'll wind up screaming into a mold house pillow.

Edited December 21, 2019 by JoanArc

[GeeGolly]

4 hours ago, lascuba said:

Years ago in the comments of a blog post I can't remember, someone claiming to be a former fundie (but was unfamiliar with the Duggars) said that kid who was the biggest believer and most eager to please was the one who would be most likely to leave, because as soon as something happened to make her question, the whole house of cards comes tumbling down.  The kid(s) who seemed to know that a lot of their beliefs are bullshit are likely to never leave, because they long ago learned to accept the contradictions and it didn't cause them any emotional anguish.  I kind of scoffed at that idead because in this family that biggest believer  was Jill and no way would SHE be the one to ever leave, right? But now? That comment describes Jessa and Jill pretty well.

Of the girls, I think Jinger was(is?) the biggest believer and Jill thinks she is the biggest believer but really is a blind follower and Jessa is a mix of both. I think Jana has questioned a lot of things but is still a believer. Joy was said to have had a brief struggle with her faith, but we don't know what the struggle was and knowing the Duggars it could have been anything from wanting to be a preaching mechanic to wondering if God is real.

The theory sounds like it holds some weight, but I wonder if circumstances and timing matter? Like, did they leave prior to marriage? Did they leave the faith with a spouse? 

[Heathen]

On 12/19/2019 at 4:00 PM, BigBingerBro said:

I remember that a bit differently.  I thought it was said that with so many kids, they would run out of hot water with so many showers, so the dirtiest went first.  I seem to remember one of the Jslaves telling this.  I could be totally wrong though.

That's what I remember. I do not remember anything about the Duggars, or a number of Duggars, all using the same bathwater. That comment reminds me of the childhood game of telephone, where you sit in a circle and each in turn whisper something to your neighbor. 

Good on Jill for cutting her hair. No matter what we say about her, it took courage to do that. 

[magpye29]

Quote

Heavy is the head that wears the crown(ing glory).  Maybe Jill will lighten up on other things now that she's not carrying 15 pounds of hair on her head.

 

[graefin]

22 hours ago, Jynnan tonnix said:

Jessa, on the other hand, is stuck rigidly following the standards that the show has set. If she is of the more business-minded side of the Duggars, she may well see it as her responsibility not to let it slip. Though, thankfully, she does not appear to have gone so far as to blanket-train her children. I suspect, though, that Ben may have had something to do with that. He seems more naturally gentle than Jessa, and maybe once she relaxed a bit with thinking she had to expect instant obedience with her kids, she found she actually enjoyed them more.

Jinger is still featured on the show (in fact, apparently she and Jeremy are the show's "breakout stars" <smirk>), yet as soon as the wedding ring was on, she was all over Instagram wearing jeans and shorts. Maybe you're right, and Jessa is all about branding--she does seem savvy in that way. But I still think her lifestyle choices stem from her fundamental beliefs at the core, with a bit of her personality flaws (e.g., deeply rooted insecurity) added in to cement the deal.

[libgirl2]

23 hours ago, Jynnan tonnix said:

I think that Derick (I won't call him Dreck on this occasion) probably just told her to go with what she wanted. As many have pointed out, his mother has short hair, and Jill has started wearing pants and loosening up some of the more stringent of Fundie behaviors under his headship. He may have encouraged this, but I don't think he told her what to do one way or another. In any case. as much as he is pretty forthcoming on what he doesn't consider Godly, hair doesn't appear to be something he cares one way or the other about. He might not have wanted her to have it cut really short, but many men seem to prefer slightly longer hair to a severe, structured cut. I had very short hair for years, and Mr. Jyn never really loved it, but didn't complain either. 

 

My husband knows not to complain or else!

[lascuba]

 

15 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Of the girls, I think Jinger was(is?) the biggest believer and Jill thinks she is the biggest believer but really is a blind follower and Jessa is a mix of both. I think Jana has questioned a lot of things but is still a believer. Joy was said to have had a brief struggle with her faith, but we don't know what the struggle was and knowing the Duggars it could have been anything from wanting to be a preaching mechanic to wondering if God is real.

The theory sounds like it holds some weight, but I wonder if circumstances and timing matter? Like, did they leave prior to marriage? Did they leave the faith with a spouse? 

I never know quite what to think of Jinger's personal convictions. I often think of her as an easy going version of Jessa in that regard, but then she says certain things that make me think she may not care about the trappings of Gothardism in particular, but is super devout otherwise. And now with Jeremy in the picture, I wonder if her faith is only as deep as those of the person/people closest to her. 

You make a good point about Jill. She's such a natural people pleaser that she never thought to question her beliefs because making her family happy by being devout made her happy. Once adulthood happened and life threw her curveballs a perfect Gothard christian like her wasn't supposed to get, it made her actually think about some of the minutiae of her belief system. 

[Barb23]

1 hour ago, libgirl2 said:

My husband knows not to complain or else!

My mother-in-law was the only one who had a negative comment when I got a much shorter layered hair cut years ago.  She didn't come right out and say she didn't like my new cut but I could tell by her facial expression how she felt when she said she liked my hair when it was longer. 

Glad Jill's getting positive responses. 

[madpsych78]

20 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Of the girls, I think Jinger was(is?) the biggest believer and Jill thinks she is the biggest believer but really is a blind follower and Jessa is a mix of both. I think Jana has questioned a lot of things but is still a believer. Joy was said to have had a brief struggle with her faith, but we don't know what the struggle was and knowing the Duggars it could have been anything from wanting to be a preaching mechanic to wondering if God is real.

The theory sounds like it holds some weight, but I wonder if circumstances and timing matter? Like, did they leave prior to marriage? Did they leave the faith with a spouse? 

I think in Jill's case, Derick was a big influence in her life path and I think if she had married someone like an Austin, she'd probably still be doing more traditional things. Jill has been willing to please and it wouldn't surprise me if some of her decisions were influenced by Derick (or Cathy).

IIRC, the Reddit poster briefly addressed the issue of a female raised with IBLP who marries someone who is more fundie-lite, or at least not quite into the fold. Just that the female experiences more cognitive dissonance when her husband does not follow The Standard (i.e., Gothard rules) to the letter. I can see this being the case especially with Jill, and maybe sometimes with Jinger.

[OpieTaylor]

Jill is suggesting an app from her church’s children’s program, and she mentions that one of its features is telling you how much longer until they’re 18 years old and “on their own. “ She’s counting the days (weeks)!
 

I’m not sure if the whole screen shot will show, but it says Sam is 128 weeks old and 808 weeks until he moves on.

[Chicklet]

Like everyone in her family "moved on" when they hit 18? 

[ouinason]

It's a cute little gimmicky thing to help when the kids are monsters.  I don't think she takes it seriously.  

 

In all the hair talk we missed an important point.  Jill went to the hairdresser ALONE.  I can't even do that!

[GeeGolly]

I hope she using the app to remind her that days are long, but the years are short.

I remember feeling like the toddler years lasted forever, the lower school years seemed to pass normally and the high school years passed in a blink.

[galaxychaser]

Well at the high speed Jill teaches Izzy will graduate high school by 12. 18 he can be running for Congress with Jim Boob help.

[Christina87]

1 hour ago, OpieTaylor said:

Jill is suggesting an app from her church’s children’s program, and she mentions that one of its features is telling you how much longer until they’re 18 years old and “on their own. “ She’s counting the days (weeks)!
 

I’m not sure if the whole screen shot will show, but it says Sam is 128 weeks old and 808 weeks until he moves on.

I reeeeeeeally don't think I'd post this, no matter how "funny" it may be, if the Internet was convinced i hate my children!!!

[Whyyouneedaname]

Was just sitting here reading comments & rubbed my head (habit lol), my head tends to get sore spots sometimes. She was talking about wearing her hair up all the time, ponytails.....i can't imagine that, my head would  be sore all the time. 

[MsJamieDornan]

5 hours ago, Whyyouneedaname said:

She was talking about wearing her hair up all the time, ponytails.....i can't imagine that, my head would  be sore all the time. 

How tight do you wear your ponytails ??

[Higgins]

On 12/20/2019 at 8:03 PM, lascuba said:

I'm actually glad that the leghumpers are giving her a hard time about the hair, not because I want her to feel bad about the hair, but I do want her to experience the pain and discomfort that she and her family have dished out (and continue to do so!) to people when they didn't fall in line with their beliefs. Because it's not enough that she realizes the sky isn't going to fall if she does things differently than what her parents insisted was the best way to do things. She also needs to feel just how hurtful her words and pronouncements--and the pronouncements of people she supports and endorses--are to people. Maybe then, she'd make changes that really matter. 

Yeah, yeah, baby steps. I get it. But the doesn't mean we should stop her from falling over and knocking her head on the path to full on sprinting. 

I think she probably gets treated with intolerance from non Christians and is used to it.