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Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

maraleia

By maraleia
in Counting On

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hoosier80
hoosier80

New show title: 10 to 20 Years and Counting 

MargeGunderson
MargeGunderson

Someone on Reddit just described Josh’s face as a glistening glazed ham. I am considering divorcing my husband and marrying that poster. 

doodlebug
doodlebug

Well, for many of us, it's the difference between 'imperfect' and 'non-PC' and being a criminal.  Josh is a child molester and his parents actively intervened in his situation to avoid him being punis

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Marigold

Marigold

(edited)

I hate to say this but I think Josh will get some interest in the new baby. 

Everyone hates him so some people will be interested to see how this train wreck played out. I admit, I would read a People article on it at the check out line.  Not because I CARE but I'd like to see the spin etc.

Edited by Marigold
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Nysha

Nysha

2 minutes ago, Marigold said:

I hate to say this but I think Josh will get some interest in the new baby. 

Everyone hates him so some people will be interested to see how this train wreck played out. I admit, I would read a People article on it at the check out line. 

I wonder how incensed Jill will be if Josh gets a page or half page in People on his new baby & quest for redemption, when she just got a tiny blurb for Sammy.

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

On 7/29/2017 at 9:26 PM, Genevrier said:

Please tell me no media site is willing to pay money for a picture of the fruit of Josh Duggar's loins. Please.

Unless one is a woman of age 14 or maybe 80, I'm not sure anybody's fifth kid would be news, would it? ... Or unless you'd already been delivered of quads a month ago and the quint-maker suddenly appeared or something.

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drafan

drafan

(edited)
9 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

 I'm not sure anybody's fifth kid would be news, would it?

Well, if one of Joshley's hook-ups comes forward soon, and reveals Joshley's 5th kid, with complete DNA proof, before Anna pops out this next one....then yeah, it would be news....and it would sell a shitload for People Mag.

12 hours ago, Genevrier said:

Our next one will be along in 12 months. Hey, a guy has desires that have to be righteously fulfilled.

No...Anna's Mkids are spit out every two years.....pop out the M, nurse for a year, get BabyFever (tm Anna) , get pregnant, whelp another Mkid. Repeat...repeat...repeat.....

Edited by drafan
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sometimesy

sometimesy

(edited)
13 minutes ago, JoanArc said:

Sigh...I'd watch that episode.

Yup. Don't we just love it when one jumps the fence and defies JB. Too bad we couldn't count on one to just go smoke a doobie in his dorm room and get caught in a threesome with co-eds. Until then we pin all our betray-JB hopes on Josh. 

Edited by sometimesy
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TeaTV

TeaTV

(edited)
On 3/25/2017 at 7:02 AM, Churchhoney said:

For survival purposes, the brain eventually doesn't even allow ideas outside of the rules to become conscious. You can be made by into a virtual robot by that means.

And isolation in a large group of people going through the exact same regimen, plus a nearly unfathomable but constant system of consistently inconsistent punishments and rewards of various kinds (many of the rewards made possible because of the tv show) keep the molding and indoctrination continuing. Remember that the executive functions of your brain aren't actually mature until your early 20s, so it was possible to shape these brains, big time, for over two decades, and shape all aspects of them, including the executive functions, and we can see clearly that the Duggars did. 

Been there. Done that. Seen that. Had that done to me.

Some people have the capacity to walk away fairly early, some have the capacity to walk away in later decades when some other influences have managed to seep in, some appear never to have the capacity to walk away at all. Because what's keeping you there? The way your own brain operates. The fact that, after an experience like this, your own being simply follows, quite unconsciously, the pattern that has been set up and it does so as a learned behavior to keep you surviving. 

And if you've never had something like this done to you, you will never ever understand and, most likely, never even believe that it can be done. I've spent a lifetime trying to explain it, and I have yet to see anybody really believe it or be able to get their mind around it if something similar hasn't happened to them. 

So everybody can just go ahead and say that the Duggar kids are all perfectly capable of changing their ways and leaving. But as a person who's been in that situation, I'll attest forever that, no, many of them most likely are not. 

Had it done to me too and escaped in my 40s after many attempts. It's the main (only?) reason I watch--waiting to see if one of them ups and leaves like Nathan Phelps did. 

You can't "just leave". Where would you go--especially in your 20s? You literally have to cut ties with ALL your family and ALL your friends and trust strangers. This relates to why I feel JB and MEchelle have no excuse because they're my age (early 50s) and should know better by now. I have hope that maybe as a couple, one of the married kidouples will leave together as a team...but I'm not holding my breath.

Edited by TeaInTheMoment
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louannems

louannems

(edited)

I read that Nathan Phelps link and immediately thought of Soloman, the oldest son of Pissing Preacher Anderson.  I hold out hope that he, and his many siblings can leave, and give insight to his father's horrible church.

If only Anna had an education, and could work and support her many kids, then perhaps she could grow up and leave, too.

Edited by louannems
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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

8 hours ago, TeaInTheMoment said:

Had it done to me too and escaped in my 40s after many attempts. It's the main (only?) reason I watch--waiting to see if one of them ups and leaves like Nathan Phelps did. 

You can't "just leave". Where would you go--especially in your 20s? You literally have to cut ties with ALL your family and ALL your friends and trust strangers. This relates to why I feel JB and Mechelle have no excuse because they're my age and should know better by now. I have hope that maybe as a couple, one of the married kidouples will leave together as a team...but I'm not holding my breath.

@TeaInTheMoment thank you for sharing your experiences. 

 

I too understand why many many of the children haven't "left" already. I contend if there had been no show/no TLC etc a few would be gone, or at least distant, but the fininancial success of the show is a carrot JB &M can hold out to keep the adult kids in line. Also with a more comfortable lifestyle the emotional and social oppression is less offensive. 

I think Jana and JD would've stayed- because they take their responsiblies seriously and Jana loves the Littles like her own kids. I think Josh would've been long gone because they wouldn't have been able to buy him a wife. I think after the Josh molestations Jessa and Jinger would've jumped ship together even if just the next town over. Despite Jessa's party line about Josh's behavior, I think unlike Jill she never internalized the abuse, knew from day one Josh was an awful human being and what happened was NOT her fault at all. Joy and Josiah- another duo that would've left together.

Jill is a crap shoot- if they needed her income and sent her out to earn a living, and she had met a guy who was willing to give her the slightest bit of kindness, affection and individual attention she would follow him to the ends of the earth. 

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TeaTV

TeaTV

(edited)
9 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I contend if there had been no show/no TLC etc a few would be gone, or at least distant, but the financial success of the show is a carrot JB &M can hold out to keep the adult kids in line.

TBH, that's what kept me in line all those years. I had no other means to support myself so it became a choice between staying and allowing the abuse to continue or leaving the only group of people who were there to fall back on financially. I had three kids by the time I was 29 and divorced at 30. I chose to stay. I was the best choice for me until I was able to become financially independent and more importantly, stay and sustain a financially stable life without them that I was able to finally cut off ties.

If you're like me, the chain of events goes something like this: 1) You realize one day that the last time you "needed money" (in my case it was for emergency dental work) was 1 year ago 2) You realize it's been 2 years since you "needed them for anything" 3) Their abusive behavior continues with you sucking it up and putting up with it just to keep the peace 4) You realize you'd rather be a beggar on the streets than have to ask them for anything anymore and you're sick of being a phoney.... etc. etc. with realizations..... 

Until one day you have nothing to lose by cutting ties and you do it. Their reaction will make you wish you did it the day you turned 18 even though you realize you couldn't have even if you wanted to so you don't feel guilty for not having left sooner because  a good jail break takes careful time and planning.  I'm picturing the movie Escape from Alcatraz right now and smiling (it's a cheesy old movie based on real events) but I'm also noting how similar the two actually are! 

So who knows, we may not see a Duggar escape for another 10 years but it will be totally worth it imo. And since this is the Smugger thread, I'll add that I too bet it will be Anna out of that bunch that makes a run for it. but who knows? It may be one or more of their kids especially if/when they get on the internet. FTR Mackynzie will be 18 in just over 10 years.

Edited by TeaInTheMoment
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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

1 hour ago, kaleidoscope said:

Is there any word on when M5 is due?  For some reason I was thinking mid summer.

Every time I see new posts on this thread I think Anna has delivered. I remember her being pregnant with Meredith and delivering right after the first Josh scandal broke- I had a bit of sympathy for her then, now, not two ounces. 

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

3 hours ago, Fostersmom said:

It seems like she's been pregnant forever, but I guess that's what happens when you announce and the pee stick is still wet. 

She was actually about 20weeks when she announced. She has to be due any day- or she's gone over her dates. If I recall she was due right after Jill and Sam is a month old no?

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

3 hours ago, Fostersmom said:

It seems like she's been pregnant forever, but I guess that's what happens when you announce and the pee stick is still wet. 

She was actually about 20weeks when she announced. She has to be due any day- or she's gone over her dates. If I recall she was due right after Jill and Sam is a month old no?

Albanyguy

Albanyguy

38 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

She has to be due any day- or she's gone over her dates.

Or she's already had the baby and the Duggars are holding off on announcing it until they figure out how to put a positive spin on the news. They must be aware on some level that, except for the leghumpers on their Facebook page, nobody will be thrilled by this new arrival. And any announcement will inevitably result in a public re-hashing of Joshgate, Parts I & II.

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

3 minutes ago, Albanyguy said:

Or she's already had the baby and the Duggars are holding off on announcing it until they figure out how to put a positive spin on the news. They must be aware on some level that, except for the leghumpers on their Facebook page, nobody will be thrilled by this new arrival. And any announcement will inevitably result in a public re-hashing of Joshgate, Parts I & II.

Yes I agree with you. Maybe they won't do a huge public announcment, Anna will just post on her instagram when she's ready. 

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Arwen Evenstar

Arwen Evenstar

4 hours ago, Ljohnson1987 said:

I don't think the baby should be brought into what Josh did, but I'm sure the Duggars' are trying to find a positive spin on this 'precious, blessing, who saved their marriage'. Yuck! I wish Anna had some balls and could leave Josh 

Poor little thing sure as hell didn't ask to be born into that clusterfuck of a family.

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lulu69

lulu69

1 hour ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

Poor little thing sure as hell didn't ask to be born into that clusterfuck of a family.

Yup. Can you imagine the m & m's kids' horror when they are old enough to Google their dad's name? Good luck explaining that Anna - 'No honey, it wasn't daddy molesting his own sisters and trolling for p*ssy. It was satan subletting a fortress in daddy's heart.'

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Booey

Booey

I feel like every single Duggar article I read mentions the Josh topic. That is such a shame for the kids who can't help be born into the family.

Thinking about the kids being old enough to Google their dad's name also makes me think about what the articles will be like years down the line when Josh passes away. Surely everything will be mentioned again, and how sad for the children. My Dad passed recently, and he was a good man who did a lot for the community. The local papers wrote some real nice articles about him. It made dealing with his death a lot easier. I feel sorry that the M kids may have an opposite experience because they happened to get an asswipe for a father.

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ariel

ariel

(edited)
On ‎8‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 6:37 PM, GeeGolly said:

I do feel bad that an announcement of their baby will be met with Josh's bullshit. Its the one time where I wish haters would bypass their post and leave them alone.

That can be a little difficult when many feel this baby is a way for Josh to get in good graces, get back on TV & get the TLC paychecks again.  It does suck that M5's father is a douche.

Edited by ariel
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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

2 hours ago, ariel said:

That can be a little difficult when many feel this baby is a way for Josh to get in good graces, get back on TV & get the TLC paychecks again.  It does suck that M5's father is a douche.

Yes, but I'm not sure I understand that theory. Josh is toxic to the Duggar reputation and having another child doesn't change that. And Anna hasn't done anything wrong. I just think that if Anna or JB & M chose to announce the birth, that bringing up Josh's scandals is unfair. Its bad enough that when these kids Google Josh's name all the shit it'll bring up, and even worse when they Google their own name and their birth announcement is drowned out by stories of things they had no control over.

And I also think its unfair for folks to bring it up when Derick makes stupid Tweets. Derick had nothing to do with Josh's behaviors nor did his wife. It feels like social media posters bring it up anytime anyone related to the Duggars makes a misstep.  

I believe Josh is fair game for the attacks but not his children or his siblings.

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mimionthebeach

mimionthebeach

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(edited)
9 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Yes, but I'm not sure I understand that theory. Josh is toxic to the Duggar reputation and having another child doesn't change that. And Anna hasn't done anything wrong. I just think that if Anna or JB & M chose to announce the birth, that bringing up Josh's scandals is unfair. Its bad enough that when these kids Google Josh's name all the shit it'll bring up, and even worse when they Google their own name and their birth announcement is drowned out by stories of things they had no control over.

And I also think its unfair for folks to bring it up when Derick makes stupid Tweets. Derick had nothing to do with Josh's behaviors nor did his wife. It feels like social media posters bring it up anytime anyone related to the Duggars makes a misstep.  

I believe Josh is fair game for the attacks but not his children or his siblings.

Josh (and his parents) should have thought all this through before making their poor choices.  This family was not reluctantly in the public eye; they've striven to maintain a level of publicity, even as their skeletons have been falling out of the closet. 

They've made a name for themselves by ostensibly protecting themselves and their children from "the world" while, in reality, selling them to the highest bidder. They're not just complicit, they're active in soliciting media coverage. By now they should know, once you've turned on that media tap of attention, the option to turn it of is no longer yours. 

The media is not in the business of protecting children from their parents' mistakes. That's their parents' job. 

There are only two tragedies in life: one is not getting what one wants, and the other is getting it. ~ Oscar Wilde
 

Edited by mimionthebeach
Apostrophes have their place.
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saylubee

saylubee

Did Anna say she was 20 weeks or were we assuming that because she also announced the gender?  I could see the Duggar Machine paying for the blood test at 11 weeks to find out the gender so the timeline could be obfuscated to the general public.  Anna looked pregnant at Joy's wedding, but not nearly as big as Jill was.

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Mojitogirl

Mojitogirl

Who is the girl who gets off the plane that isn't Anna?  Does following everything your headship takes extend to having to travel when that pregnant?  I know that at such late stages of my pregnancies, being folded up into that seemingly cramped and crowded airplane would have caused me pain for days.  Anna really doesn't know how to say no AT ALL does she?

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Arwen Evenstar

Arwen Evenstar

8 minutes ago, Mojitogirl said:

Who is the girl who gets off the plane that isn't Anna?  Does following everything your headship takes extend to having to travel when that pregnant?  I know that at such late stages of my pregnancies, being folded up into that seemingly cramped and crowded airplane would have caused me pain for days.  Anna really doesn't know how to say no AT ALL does she?

She's gotta watch him.  He's SLY.  After all, wasn't it her fault he cheated? Aaaaaand she's big pregnant, but might need to make herself joyfully available, lest he choose to stray if she won't.

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

I imagine they had Duggar books in those boxes. They actually expect Smuggar to be a hero to these people (no church service tonight...must be an RU event). OR they had a church service that they didn't live stream since Smuggar was part of it. But in that case, I'd think they would have brought more boxes of (likely) books. They're not in Rockford to pass tracts to like-minded people. That makes no sense. 

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madpsych78

madpsych78

1 hour ago, ozziemom said:

So it looks like 2 of the M kids, JD, Boob, Smuggar and Anna. Plus a howler? And a chubby fellow and the unknown lady in the boots. They seemed to unload a bunch of boxes, tracks to pass out maybe? One large suitcase for all those people so must not be too long of a trip. 

I think I saw Justin and Josiah.

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