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Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

maraleia

By maraleia
in Counting On

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Minivanessa

Minivanessa

(edited)
1 hour ago, crazycatlady58 said:

Ok if the husband works all day and the wife has to go outside the home to give piano lessons who will watch Josh?

Mrs. Reaver Reber doesn't give the piano lessons. Their (I think adult) daughter gives the lessons at their house. Mrs. Reaver Reber testified that the daughter can give the lessons somewhere else. My reading of the recap of the testimony is, that the daughter gives "some" piano lessons there, not like it's a full time business.

Edited by Jeeves
It's "Reber" not "Reaver." Sigh.
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hoosier80
hoosier80

New show title: 10 to 20 Years and Counting 

MargeGunderson
MargeGunderson

Someone on Reddit just described Josh’s face as a glistening glazed ham. I am considering divorcing my husband and marrying that poster. 

doodlebug
doodlebug

Well, for many of us, it's the difference between 'imperfect' and 'non-PC' and being a criminal.  Josh is a child molester and his parents actively intervened in his situation to avoid him being punis

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Madtown

Madtown

22 minutes ago, crazy8s said:

Josh can have unlimited contact with his children as long as their mother is present.

How can any judge think this is ok??????? These children are in the same age range as the CP found on his divices!

It amazes me how little punishment these disgusting ass pigs get. Fuck Mr. Reavers for allowing Josh to stay there. Mrs. Reavers clearly did not want him there and yet....UGH!

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Tuxcat

Tuxcat

From the judges decision:

"Seriousness of the danger Josh poses to the community: The court does not know. Josh has not been convicted of being a danger to anyone. There is no criminal history that suggests Josh has displayed a pattern of violence to anyone. But Josh's children, his sibling's children, and his minor brothers and sisters are all part of the community that need to be protected from him.

This is a very close call. The U.S. Attorney has not met its burden."

_________________________

I thought in these specific types of cases, it was the defendant that needed to meet the burden of proof???

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Oldernowiser

Oldernowiser

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It is my most fervent hope that the adult children and their spouses confront JB and Michelle and say, “That’s it. This is a bridge too damned far and if you put up that bond money, you’ll never see any of us again AND we’ll be shopping the tell-all to the highest bidder by Friday. We’re done.”

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Gigi43

Gigi43

If only we knew how that phone call went between JB and Mr. Reavers. I really want to know. 

 

The wife was sandbagged and all but said 'I'm in a cult where I have to listen to my husband.' What the hell. It's one thing to grant Josh bond, but, to them? After that testimony? 

 

I'm assuming Josh has to give DNA for the very reason I really don't want to have to type out. But he's totally fine to be out. He's never harmed anyone, except the five girls he's admitted too. I'm not including the Ashley Madison woman because Josh has admitted to the others. FFS

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Tuxcat

Tuxcat

"The court is mindful, however, that this conduct happened a long time ago. And it happened when Josh was a child. That fact, and that fact alone, are in Josh's favor. It is concerning to court that Josh has committed that he has an issue with pornography; that is different than child pornography. But what the court has heard is that prior to images being downloaded to Josh's computer, Covenant Eyes was installed which is a program that acts as a deterrent. The court has also heard testimony that Josh's wife may have been his accountability partner on that. The court is not making a determination on that, but it concerns the court."

 

And I don't understand this part either? He installed a partition to deliberately conceal his deliberate attempts to access images of the same ages as his sisters were -- and his children are. So why is she letting Anna be the supervisor when on unlimited child visits?

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

2 minutes ago, riverblue22 said:

If Josh can work I guess JB can stick him on a construction detail as long as no children are around.  They were nuts if they thought he would stay out of trouble being at a crappy car lot all day with time on his hands.

And obviously nobody -- Anna, JB and M -- pressured him to find himself a slate of jobs to contribute to the upkeep of his too-big family and have enough other things to do to distract him from his "porn addiction" that they all know about for at least some hours each day. 

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MargeGunderson

MargeGunderson

(edited)
1 hour ago, WinnieWinkle said:

Sounds like Mrs Reaver is the one who just got sent to jail.

What a sacrifice for her husband though - he’s going to have to watch her wait on Josh, cook his meals, clean up after him, do his laundry, etc. That will be exhausting for him. 

Fuck that noise.

Edited by MargeGunderson
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WinnieWinkle

WinnieWinkle

1 minute ago, MargeGunderson said:

What a sacrifice for her husband though - he’s who going to have to watch her wait on Josh, cook his meals, clean up after him, do his laundry, etc. That will be exhausting for him. 

Well you know the old saying "it's always harder to watch the person who's in pain then to be the person in pain".  

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JoanArc

JoanArc

1 minute ago, libgirl2 said:

Being that I don't know the world of online porn at all, he would have to pay for access to these sites, wouldn't he? If so, how did he pay and where did the money come from? 

It sounds like he used Tor ( decently anonymous )  to download bit torrent files of the CSA ( not anonymous at all).  Bit Torrent is  just like a giant neon sign Pointing to the computer that is accessing the files. I would doubt that he paid anything for the images, but then I don’t know that world very well. Hathor? Thank God he thinks he’s so smart but is actually so stupid

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WinnieWinkle

WinnieWinkle

13 minutes ago, crazy8s said:

I hope the Reavers have a big house because anna and the kids are probably going to be there a lot.

Actually for Mrs Reaver's sake I hope this is the case.  I really don't think Josh even wants the kids, let alone Anna, around, but if she's fool enough to think he does at least Mrs Reaver won't be alone with the bastard.

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CouchTater

CouchTater

Just now, emmawoodhouse said:

They claimed under oath that Boob isn't paying them anything.

I wonder if Jim Bob would be allowed to pay them, legally.  I don't see why not.  I don't think that would make them any more or less credible.  I  mean, those "crazy Reavers" are already straining credulity for me.  They'd seem more sensible and savvy if they were getting paid.

For our legal-minded friends:  would the Reavers be able to be charged with something if they didn't report Josh for breaking some rule?  Or if they didn't remove all of their weapons from the home (yikes)?  Or would that just revoke Josh's bond?

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Boston

Boston

25 minutes ago, Gigi43 said:

 

I doubt the two I highlighted will be an issue.

 

I feel bad for Mrs. Reavers. Not only will she be in t he house all day with someone she isn't comfortable with, she stated so in court to be used against her. 

 

So Anna can go to the Reavers home and she's fine supervision? God I hope the bond is too high to pay. 

I am always on here.. but who are the REAVERS??  i've been out of the loop for the last few hours.. Thank you

satrunrose

satrunrose

(edited)

Kudos to the people who called that they'd ask an elder to be the third party guardian. Zella, do you know if the headship thing is widely known in the community? I read the summary and saw "headship says yes, so I say yes (please no!)" but someone who doesn't know that dynamic might assume an (understandable) reluctant consent. 

Realistically, you aren't going to find anyone to enthusiastically agree to babysit someone with these charges for months, so I hope the judge didn't mistake that for Mrs Reaver having no choice at all in the matter (as she likely didn't). 

Edited by satrunrose
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Pingaponga

Pingaponga

I wonder if today's hearing was an eye-opening experience for the Duggars. I can easily imagine Josh admitting to his parents/Anna that the car lot was raided because he had downloaded pornography - but omitting the fact that the images were of children being assaulted. But hearing about the images may have finally shocked them to see Josh in a different light.

And apparently the warehouse they've been living in is actually called "the guest house". A windowless guest house. I'm guessing law enforcement has not yet visited it and seen what it actually is.

 

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Gigi43

Gigi43

5 minutes ago, Boston said:

I am always on here.. but who are the REAVERS??  i've been out of the loop for the last few hours.. Thank you

 

They testified to be Josh's guardians should he be released, which he is. The wife admitted she did not know the charges til the hearing and that her husband made the decision and supports his decisions, and admitted she's not very comfortable with being alone with Josh after hearing everything but swore she would call law enforcement before her husband/JB if she catches Josh in violation. She also mentioned thinking they had to give Josh and Anna 'ministry.' They've known the family but about 6 yrs, likely cult members because who else would JB ask? Basically she is just obeying her husband and the court seems to think that's good enough.

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Minivanessa

Minivanessa

(edited)
1 hour ago, Boston said:

I am always on here.. but who are the REAVERS??  i've been out of the loop for the last few hours.. Thank you

LaCount Reaver Reber is a guy JB knows from church I think. Reaver Reber works full time at the VA and does prison ministry on the side but hasn't been active with that since the pandemic locked down the jails. His wife Maria is a housewife. Their adult daughter (who I think lives elsewhere) sometimes gives piano lessons to children at the Reaver Reber home. The Reavers Rebers have a "mother in law" apartment in their home where Josh will stay, I don't know much about it except it has its own door to the outside. They also have six firearms in the house that aren't in a gun safe, just a bedroom closet. I'm not sure how well the Reavers Rebers know the Duggar family. Mrs. Reaver Reber testified that her husband decided to "help" Josh by giving him a place to stay and she "supports" that decision.  

ETA: The judge asked Mrs. Reaver Reber some rather savvy questions as @Gigi43 indicated. Including, if you know Josh has violated any of the release terms, you WILL call the federal probation office first? Not JB Duggar, or the church elders, or your husband? You will tell them AFTER you notify the probation office, right? 

Edited by Jeeves
I've learned the name is "Reber"
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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

(edited)
7 minutes ago, Boston said:

I am always on here.. but who are the REAVERS??  i've been out of the loop for the last few hours.. Thank you

They seem to be "church people" who kinda sorta know JB and M, except kinda sorta not. I guess they seem like upright, church-going people, the guy works at the VA, etc.....So after calling 52,000 other people, JB must have gotten Mr. Reaver to agree to this. .... Mr. Reaver, like Mr. Keller, used to do prison ministry before COVID.....So I guess this is part of his ministry. 

If the judge followed these idiot people the way we do, she might be more skeptical of anything that's part of anyone's ministry who has anything to do with the Gothard and/or Duggar enterprise...But she clearly doesn't. 

I'm hoping it's all a trick and someone who knows the score has set up a situation where Josh will be babysat by the Reavers from Firefly. Who are cannibal pirates. 

Edited by Churchhoney
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Arkay

Arkay

15 minutes ago, 3 is enough said:

He has unlimited access to the kids as long as Anna is there?  Are you kidding me?  

I have no words.

The thread is moving too quickly for me, so this has probably already been asked and answered: this unlimited access to his kids while Anna is present——does that take place at the Reavers’ home only? It can’t possibly be at his house as long as Anna is there, right? 
What would happen when Anna needs the bathroom, or to escort a toddler to the bathroom? 
Someone with better eyes than mine, pls inform me. 

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Nysha

Nysha

2 minutes ago, WinnieWinkle said:

Does anyone know what happens to the Reavers if Josh actually does make a break for it?  Are they on the hook for anything?

As long as they notify his probation office/police they're in the clear. If they don't or for some reason cover for him, I'm sure they can be charged with aiding and abetting. 

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BitterApple

BitterApple

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I'm really scratching my head on the Reavers being deemed suitable guardians. I felt like Mrs. Reaver was practically BEGGING the judge to say "Hell No!" with all the red flags she was dropping during her testimony. 

Minors in the home, weapons in the home, room with outside access, wife admitting she's not comfortable alone, wife admitting she's only doing this out of deference to her husband, adult daughter not comfortable with set-up, etc. Seriously, who in their right mind adds up those factors and thinks, "Yep, Mrs. Reaver has the right constitution to deal with a pedophile." What the actual fuck is going on here?

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emmawoodhouse

emmawoodhouse

5 minutes ago, Arkay said:

The thread is moving too quickly for me, so this has probably already been asked and answered: this unlimited access to his kids while Anna is present——does that take place at the Reavers’ home only? It can’t possibly be at his house as long as Anna is there, right? 
What would happen when Anna needs the bathroom, or to escort a toddler to the bathroom? 
Someone with better eyes than mine, pls inform me. 

He's not allowed at the TTH or the guesthouse.

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PJ123

PJ123

7 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Wouldn't surprise me. I think Josh will either run or off himself before it's all said and done. No way do I think this ends with him in prison.

Hmmmm...I think he is still believing the horsepoop JB has told him since day one that one day he (Josh) will be the head of household.  JB and ME-shelle are certainly continuing to act like that is the case.  This is just a temporary thing to Josh (hence the smirking and other reactions).  He thinks wont be found guilty (or just have probation) and it will go away. No big deal.  Ugh.

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Patricia07

Patricia07

11 minutes ago, mynextmistake said:

Sounds like Josh has this case in the bag. The judge is probably a closet fundie. 
 

Someone should start a petition to recall them, like they did that judge in California who gave the guy who raped a girl 2 years because he was afraid a longer sentence would affect the rapist’s life. I’d sign.

I’m not surprised he got out on bail, I pretty much accepted that would happen. But allowing him access to the kids when only their brainwashed zombie mother is around does surprise, and horrify me. Plus it seems like the judge bent over backwards to minimize Josh’s prior conduct. And it’s *really* interesting that the judge kept calling him “Josh.” An uninvolved professional would have used Mr. Duggar or called him the defendant. Things that make you go hmm...

 

Maybe that's why Josh was reportedly smirking and laughing. 

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