Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[DangerousMinds]

My boyfriend loves baths, too.

[Tabbygirl521]

Am reading the staff bios now. What the hell is a "dynamic love relationship with Jesus Christ"? Why did Mr CURE-ington's death send "a vibrant ripple effect" over the survivors? What does it MEAN? What an odd turn of phrase.

More generally, why are SO MANY WOMEN willing to give up their autonomy to these various doughy bastards?

[subber]

When Josie was born, the Duggars didn't send her to a prayer group for medical attention. They trusted the well educated doctors and nurses whose skill kept her alive in a perilous situation. Some problems are simply too complex to be prayed away.

Boob and Michelle are fools to think Josh can somehow be "cured" of his desire to look at porn and have extra-marital sex by sending him to a glorified prayer meeting. They've done enough damage. Nothing will change until Josh works up the courage to tell them to butt out and let him and Anna work this out for themselves with the help of a competent, educated, qualified counselor. There is no way Josh is going to spend 6 months trying to pray away who he is at the core -- a young guy stuck in a life he isn't suited for. I don't think he truly buys into Gothard anyway, and I predict he'll be out of prayerville in a couple of weeks. Hopefully he'll use some time there to take stock of who he is, what he wants, and how he and Anna should proceed going forward.

[Wellfleet]

It's certainly possible. Baths are gross.

 

Unless you've taken your regular scrub-em-up shower first and are just using the tub to relax, read, even doze an hour away in warm water, bubbles and quiet, then yep. Baths are a little gross.

[sometimesy]

Well, Josh is away from Anna and his kids. She must know by now her brother is willing to help. She has time and space to think about what she wants to do. If she stays, I feel for the M & M's and their future within Gothardism/JBism. I wonder if they will be required to tithe to grandpa?

[Honeycocoa]

I can't imagine how overwhelmed Anna is. She's what, six weeks postpartum? Meredith is maybe sleeping 4 hours at a stretch? Anna is supposed to eat and drink so she can breast feed and she probably has no appetite at all. Marcus is two and needs help with everything. Michael is 4,  Kinzie is 5, so she can sort of dress herself and pour a bowl of cereal, but Anna must be so completely overwhelmed and exhausted.  I bet she resents the lack of help at home. Honestly caring for 4 kids under 5 ought to be  enough for Josh to deal with.  And when she has time to think about it maybe Anna is glad he's gone for a while. but I hope someone is there helping her. Probably Jana, Jinger or Joy, may be the older guys can  go shopping for her, or come over and play with the kids. Instead of sending Josh to some stupid work camp for six month, they should have sent Anna to a nice Hotel. ( not that she'd go, I know)  But he gets to sleep all night.  Poor Anna.

[Micks Picks]

Right at the moment I'm not feeling it for Anna.  She has created her own destiny.  She should be paying somebody for childcare, not being a user of free help, offered by the husband or parents in law, but provided by the brothers and sisters in law.  If she still sees her way as so right, live it.  Grab it. Take it. 

[Blondeone21]

I also am from Rockford. This place is a joke. I live right by that Walmart, I will be looking out for him.

Long, long time lurker but I just had to post for this!

[Micks Picks]

You watch out for Smugger, and I'll watch out for your postings, Bondeone21.

[cheatincheetos]

But wasn't he horrified at the thought that she might get pregnant and have an abortion?  

Why, who wouldn't want the child of the mighty Firstborn of the House of Duggar?

As for J having unprotected sex with a porn star, he does just keep getting skeevier doesn't he. - and really I've never understood guys who would pay extra to go bareback. Theoretically if a prostitute is willing to take extra money from you to do that, she's done probably done the same with other people, so why would you chance it. Ick.

Edited August 27, 2015 by cheatincheetos

[cheatincheetos]

The person I know that works with this place has proudly proclaimed that they have saved many people from The Gay along with their addictions. So there is that too.

Here's Duggar friend David Waller modelling the manly poses that they teach!

[Darknight]

Or didn't know how to use them.

Gosh she might be pregnant. Wonder what Josh would do

[Chalby]

 It looks like the only person who still has a gravy train stopping at People is Amy.

I hope you are right, and Amy is the only stop left on the gravy train. I am surprised at how angry I feel at Josh's attempt to sneak he and his family back into our, and the media's, good graces on the back of a pathetic "I'm addicted to pornography. Its power over me caused this mess I'm in".  I am angry with People magazine for extending Duggar's 15 minutes of fame. I am angry with Jill and Jess for feeling they are owed more from the public. Lastly, I am angry with myself for following the Duggars' lives (in all of its hypocrisy) while knowing that I will never get what I really want...which is ... An apology and a public acknowledgement that the so-called quiverful faith (and Gothard) they followed was a full-on, ratings grabbing, scam.

[SomePity1066]

Regardless of what Josh is up to at the Rockford rehab, I hope this casts that public eye on the place in a big way ! Forgetting for a moment the ludicrous nature of their "counseling" services, the warped men. vs. womens' chores, and the kerfuffle over whether or not anyone, including Josh, should be receiving public welfare money in a voluntary rehab program with NO credentials whatsoever, I'd really like to know if the people who go there for drug or alcohol addiction are first sent to a legit d/a center or hospital for medically supervised detox. 

 

This is some serious shit here - people die, literally DIE, without proper medical care during the detox process. It's not just shaking and sweating and seeing pink elephants or whatever - seizures, convulsions, strokes, heart attacks, and death are a reality, and far more common than you'd think. You just don't see a lot of people putting THAT in obituaries...

 

This reminds me of the movie "Ruthless People" where Bette Midler is abducted by two bumbling clowns who can't seem to get things right and keep lowering the ransom demand - she cries from her basement confines "I've been kidnapped by K-Mart !"

 

Seems like Josh has been sent to the K-Mart of rehabs. Thankfully, I think, it's just punitive for his cheating, the molestation, etc, and not for an addiction. The guy is a punk-ass punk, but he doesn't deserve to die. 

 

If the Rockford place said they could pray and work away your appendicitis, they'd be shut down in a heartbeat. I don't see how this is any different.

 

Maybe this should go in the JB and Michelle thread (?) but how do I reconcile them sending Josh (which is another matter altogether - he's an ADULT, for Pete's sake !)  to possibly the shittiest rehab on the face of the planet in a private plane ?

 

Mind meet boggled.

[Chalby]

I can't imagine how overwhelmed Anna is. She's what, six weeks postpartum? Meredith is maybe sleeping 4 hours at a stretch? Anna is supposed to eat and drink so she can breast feed and she probably has no appetite at all. Marcus is two and needs help with everything. Michael is 4,  Kinzie is 5, so she can sort of dress herself and pour a bowl of cereal, but Anna must be so completely overwhelmed and exhausted. 

How right you are. Even though G'Josh's the one who needs to answer for his transgressions, it seems that she continues to be the one who suffers and is punished. I realize her vows are for good and bad times, but surely there's some kind of loophole to help her out of this travesty. Then she should turn around and demand a feasible amount of money to cover her future expenses/ living allowance,  as her placement within this family means she will never work nor become further educated. She needs to make Jim Boob and MeMeShell pay up for all the things they knew and understood, yet withheld, regarding their Duggar Dud. Give her money and cut the poor girl loose!

Edited August 27, 2015 by Chalby

[Wellfleet]

Is it just me or do I see another Sierra "flamingo/stork" moment happening here? Don't these people mean to call themselves "Reformers Anonymous" - ???  It's Alcoholics Anonymous, Gamblers Anonymous etc. Not unanimous. Good grief.

 

Dear Celestial Magistrate, please make these hillbillies go to school. Real school - no Bibles or no "workbooks" allowed.

[Chalby]

I don't think he has a problem, no.  Unlike others, I actually see most of the molestation as the work of a seriously horny pubescent boy who had absolutely no other females to interact with outside his own sisters.  Any other boy that age would be making out with some girl from school behind the bleachers.  I do not think that Josh is currently a pedophile.  However, I do not think he is sorry for what he did to his sisters, mainly because he was raised to think that females were created purely for the pleasure of men.  He needs help but only to fix the mysogynistic indoctrination he has experienced since babyhood.  

 

Worse yet, he doesn't regard the females in his life as entities. They are merely robots there to serve him. I choked on my laughter at the episode when Josh said he was going to check Derrick over to see if he could 'cut it' as a husband, and father. Give me a break... what pearls of wisdom does Josh have to impart to anyone? 

[Chalby]

Regardless of what Josh is up to at the Rockford rehab, I hope this casts that public eye on the place in a big way ! Forgetting for a moment the ludicrous nature of their "counseling" services, the warped men. vs. womens' chores, and the kerfuffle over whether or not anyone, including Josh, should be receiving public welfare money in a voluntary rehab program with NO credentials whatsoever, I'd really like to know if the people who go there for drug or alcohol addiction are first sent to a legit d/a center or hospital for medically supervised detox. 

 

Mind meet boggled.

I hope you ARE right and a lot of people take notice of where he's going. Otherwise, what will anyone have learned? If the Duggar's efforts at spin doctoring, while keeping to the exact same beliefs that have introduced them to so many unwise choices, prove to be successful... well??? What's our next step, if any? How many people being outraged does it take for all forms of media to cut them loose. THEN I will be a happy camper.

[Temperance]

Is there an article where Anna's parents say they want her to stay with him even now? If so link to it. 

[randomania]

Since the Duggars support and promote this place, there will be different rules for Joshie. Keep in mind that the point is not to get Josh better; the point is to make it appear to others that Josh is better.

I imagine the first rule to be bent for Josh will be the "up at 4:30 a.m." one. Duggar Time does not recognize that concept.

[NextIteration]

Also, they kind of implied that the addicts are expected to return to their home churches and then be a kind of distance minister for RU to the community. So yeah, it looks like we can expect to see Reformed Josh launching his own ministry as soon as rehab is over.

 

I called televangelist days ago!

 

I can't bring myself to watch the rest of that. Is there some reason the nice man is masturbating a dowel?

 

These folks are the worst perverts!

 

My gaydar has been going off since I first saw his photo … I think he is in desperate denial--a hyper-heterosexual--in order to deny the one sin that would probably get him booted from the family.

 

And all this makes me wonder about the other Duggar boys (and maybe even the girls) … Are there any other skeletons in their closet?

 

Joshie might not be gay - but going by the numbers, one of the kids probably is.

 

I am an LCSW and I looked into become an addictions counselor and it was very rigorous, a good two years to complete as well as hundreds of hours of supervised practice. I know each state has their own guidelines for liscensure but it was nothing to sneeze at. This treatment center does not have anyone even certified in anything by the state let alone degreed in anything (we aren't going to consider a BS in church work a real degree). In addition it clearly states anyone with any medical issues or requiring two or more doctor visits will be discharged. There are no consulting psychiatrist, psychiatric nurses , social workers to treat patients. Lastly AA is a spiritual program but not a religious one. As far as Josh is concerned let him go to the work camp, He knows what he's getting into but I would hate to see anyone go to this place seeking any type of real treatment for their "sin" of addiction. This is not an industry standard.

ETA: I just reread this and it sounds so hostile, I swear I don't mean it that way. It just makes me crazy what passes as treatment (or education or medical care.,..) with these groups.

 

You are not hostile, treatment/rehab is serious business and often there is dual diagnosis that requires medical staff.  So many people with mental illness self-medicate their way to addiction.

 

So true Lily. Even when trying for children. My sister had fertility issues and while they were trying to conceive,it took the intimacy right out of sex.

 

Trying to get pregnant with fertility issues is a chore.  If you're lucky it's just a couple months and you can laugh out loud at the "work" of it when really no one is in the mood.  Years of it is another thing entirely.

 

I'm wondering what type of people Josh was exposed to while working in Washington.  Were all the FRC folks evangelicals like the Gothard cult he was immersed in, or did he get the opportunity to know and talk to more worldly people?  Do you suppose Josh ever had opportunities to discuss his culture with others and the way other Christians live?  I would hope that he had time to realize this life wasn't for him--maybe he will find the strength at some point to say--No more!  (And get that vasectomy!)

 

Here's the deal with some of those assholes at FRC historically, they were self-hating gays or they were mad cheating assholes.  But, they all bow down and do the beg for forgiveness from their authoritarian master James Dobson.

 

Some guys say stuff like that just lure women into a place where they cannot get away and then they pounce.  I do not take anything like that on a dating site at face value.  In fact, I would personally see that as a trap.  Men don't like bubble baths.

Maybe, maybe not.  The point is that everyone thought he was, and he knows it's not cool these days to be a virgin on your wedding day.  

 

Not true in my experience, but showers first!

 

Any man on an hook up site saying he likes bubble baths just sounds like him saying something he thinks women want to hear.  Men hate baths and taking baths with women.  

 

No seriously, they can be romantic, but showers first!

Missed this one...

 

I'd really like to know if the people who go there for drug or alcohol addiction are first sent to a legit d/a center or hospital for medically supervised detox. 

 

This is some serious shit here - people die, literally DIE, without proper medical care during the detox process. It's not just shaking and sweating and seeing pink elephants or whatever - seizures, convulsions, strokes, heart attacks, and death are a reality, and far more common than you'd think. You just don't see a lot of people putting THAT in obituaries...

 

This is most likely what killed Amy Whinehouse.

[NextIteration]

There were a few posts about J&M and their possible isolation and veiled threats with Anna, that's abuse, and honestly?  I think that's what these narcissists have done to all 19 of their "blessings".

[GeeGolly]

Regardless of what Josh is up to at the Rockford rehab, I hope this casts that public eye on the place in a big way ! Forgetting for a moment the ludicrous nature of their "counseling" services, the warped men. vs. womens' chores, and the kerfuffle over whether or not anyone, including Josh, should be receiving public welfare money in a voluntary rehab program with NO credentials whatsoever, I'd really like to know if the people who go there for drug or alcohol addiction are first sent to a legit d/a center or hospital for medically supervised detox. 

 

This is some serious shit here - people die, literally DIE, without proper medical care during the detox process. It's not just shaking and sweating and seeing pink elephants or whatever - seizures, convulsions, strokes, heart attacks, and death are a reality, and far more common than you'd think. You just don't see a lot of people putting THAT in obituaries...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If an addiction includes benzodiazepines or alcohol a person would have to detox first because the risk of serious injury or death is real. Detoxes, in my area, are in separate facilities with medical staff where patients stay for 3 - 10 days before they are medically cleared for rehab. Any place that offers inpatient addiction services would know this or be in the news because as SP1066 said - this is serious shit.

[Darknight]

I just keep finding things in the "application" that make me laugh! The bold italics are of course mine....

Gee this sounds like bullshit

[becca3891]

I really feel that in this cult people know things that are going on with other members but they keep it within the cult.  I think that  not only did Pa Keller know about Josh's internet porn habit but JB & Michelle did too.  They try to keep it from going public but when it does the apologies come out and they're not as mad at the person as they are at the media responsible for making it known.  I still call BS on JB & Mechelle's statement of 'when we found out late last night'.  BS.   Pa Keller made David Waller put the internet usage promise as the second most important thing for a reason, he knew about Josh. This cult keeps secrets and tries to keep them secrets.  They prefer to deal with things 'in house' as they call it. 

I think they thought it was over years ago. I believe, based on Alice's report, that his confession to the church included his porn viewing and Boob and Mechelle told themselves they'd get him married off ASAP and he'd be fine. So I really do believe this blindsided them. Pa Keller's remarks to TFDW were not unusual in their belief system.

 

That said, yikes. Doesn’t exactly match with his more vanilla profiles but it wouldn’t surprise me that the mind set that these men have when they cheat that they think sex workers are for terrifying anyway, being whores and all (not my opinion).

I can easily believe Josh having a double standard where he feels contemptuous toward strippers and prostitutes and sees them as unworthy of respect. 

 

The Duggar females having to swim while fully dressed is ridiculous. Grown-ass men like Josh (et al) needing their wives to monitor their internet use is asinine. If a man can't manage himself in his everyday life without either being constantly policed or piling ever more draconian RULES on women, I'd say we maybe better switch to matriarchal societies. Change the rules and clamp down on the gender most often getting up to trouble. Maybe the Joshes of the world need a law that they must wear a bag over their heads at all times, except when in the shower alone, or when handcuffed to their own beds at night. Apparently these dudes cannot be trusted, and they seem to know it. If a man has a problem managing himself, then let him volunteer to restrict his own freedom--don't lay your twisted trip on me, though.

This is my favorite post in a long time! 

 

My fear is they will insist that Anna remain under someone's headship while Josh is gone.  Can't have a grown woman and four kids leading their own lives now, can we?  Will they make her move into the TTH?  This really, really sucks for her, no matter how you slice it. 

They definitely believe Anna needs a temporary headship, and I'm putting my money on her staying at the TTH. Boob is her umbrella of authority for now, the kids like playing with their aunts and uncles, and Jana, Jinger and Joy can be aunt moms in addition to sister moms. 

[CofCinci]

I think they thought it was over years ago. I believe, based on Alice's report, that his confession to the church included his porn viewing and Boob and Mechelle told themselves they'd get him married off ASAP and he'd be fine. So I really do believe this blindsided them. Pa Keller's remarks to TFDW were not unusual in their belief system.

I can easily believe Josh having a double standard where he feels contemptuous toward strippers and prostitutes and sees them as unworthy of respect.

This is my favorite post in a long time!

They definitely believe Anna needs a temporary headship, and I'm putting my money on her staying at the TTH. Boob is her umbrella of authority for now, the kids like playing with their aunts and uncles, and Jana, Jinger and Joy can be aunt moms in addition to sister moms.

The term "temporary headship" makes me so angry but you are right. For the next 6 months, if Josh lasts that long, JB will (micro)manage Anna and her children. Any autonomy gained from her experience in DC will be stripped away. JB will tell her and her children when to eat. JB will "suggest" what she'll do that day. He'll watch her like a hawk and limit her access to social media.

[Defrauder]

But what was he going to say? "I just used my credit card every month to peruse the site." ? After his earlier horrendous actions, he was dead in the water.

IMO, no amount of counseling, therapy, retreats, church going, can cure sexual predators. None.

I agree with you that Josh is a sexual predator.  Not because of the cheating specifically but because of what he did to his sisters (one of whom was 5 years old at the time) combined with his 'double life'.  And it wasn't just an ordinary run of the mill double life hypocrisy - he's the biggest hypocrite ever. I also seem to remember the answer to the question about how there are times when women are obligated to have sex with him.  I don't think that Josh has a conscience. He only has to pretend he has one.

[3girlsforus]

Right at the moment I'm not feeling it for Anna.  She has created her own destiny.  She should be paying somebody for childcare, not being a user of free help, offered by the husband or parents in law, but provided by the brothers and sisters in law.  If she still sees her way as so right, live it.  Grab it. Take it.

Really? No compassion for Anna? She is 6 weeks postpartum with 3 other kids to take care of and she just found out her husband has been cheating on her and paying for sex. If that was your sister would you tell her screw you - pay for help or would you want to help her?

[cheatincheetos]

[Oldernowiser]

Quoting becca3891 the old fashioned way, because IPads are rough with the quoting thing...

"I can easily believe Josh having a double standard where he feels contemptuous toward strippers and prostitutes and sees them as unworthy of respect."

No double standard. He has no respect for women, period.

The more I hear about this guy, the more I'm thinking full-on pathology, not just a perpetual adolescent acting out.

[Rancide]

I work in the Behavioral Health field. My work is with folks who carry a mental health diagnosis, and many of them have dual diags. I am very familiar with rehabs, supportive living and half-way houses in my area because many of them refer their clients to us. The rehabs in my area are staffed with folks who have certificates in addiction rehabilitation (many w/ addiction histories) and few, if any have any type of degree. Not one of the facilities I am familiar with has any medical staff or mental health staff, because the treatment models are different. Most addiction clients seek mental health therapy in addition to addiction counseling, and if psychiatric medication is indicated, they would be referred to a prescriber at a mental health agency, most likely by their therapist.

 

Not sure this place isn't a scam but it is not too far off from the norm. And many rehabs follow 12 step recovery which has a spiritual base to it.

 

Honestly, most rehabs in this country are a scam.  I get that AA/12-step have helped many people, and I don't begrudge those people their success or think it shouldn't be one treatment option, but the relentless focus on AA-type models in this country is facilitated by an outdated puritanical outlook towards addiction (you're a bad person!  It's your fault you can't stay clean!  You just don't want it badly enough!), an ignorant court system (tons and tons of people at AA/NA/etc are there on court order sent by judges who have bought in to the idea that addiction is the addict's "fault"), a failing health care system (doctors and drugs too expensive for you!  AA is CHEAP), and inertia (what other field of physical/mental/behavioral health is still using a model largely unchanged from the 1930s?).

 

Bottom line:  addiction treatment in this country is a mess.  I agree with you that the place Josh is going isn't too far off from the norm.  And that's a really, really sad thing.

[TaxNerd]

Gosh she might be pregnant. Wonder what Josh would do

A TRUE scandal would be Anna being four months pregnant when Joshie gets back from his six months in unrehab.

I can't imagine he was much more than in the way, so the six months will be good for her. Gives her a chance to see she really can live without him and off the kindness of others.

The whole thing reminds me of Carolyn Jessop's memoir where it was difficult to run away because the whole town conspired to keep her and her kids put.

[Churchhoney]

I don't find the strip club and paid sex parts implausible, just the part where Josh isn't sedentary. If he paid I think he would expect her to do all the work.

 

Me, too. I even believe the part where he tried to be aggressive and rough. The part I absolutely don't believe is where she says it's the scariest thing that ever happened to her. Please. That's pure embellishment, in my opinion. And a stupid embellishment at that, especially for someone who's lived on the seamy side of things. Not only is Josh a 200-pound weakling but he's a scared, blustering child who almost certainly could be easily intimidated by any woman who stood up for herself for half a minute. In the sex business, you're going to run across many many men with aggressive feelings toward women and who seek you out because they intend to act on them. Josh would have been far from the first. And there's no way that that hide-behind-daddy's-skirts, cry-when-he-leaves-momma 20-something wanna-be-lawyer lard-ass was the scariest she ever saw, by a long shot. She wants to sell newspapers, so she embroidered.

[TaxNerd]

Going back to the strip clubs, allegedly Josh said "Don't you know who my father is?"

Sounds to me like a possibility that JB knew and approved of these strip club visits. Maybe it was an outlet to sew his wild oats with the expectation of getting it out of his system before settling down in marriage.

If anyone should understand sex addiction, it's JB and Michelle. Where else would he get cash as a teen?

[sleekandchic]

Is it just me or do I see another Sierra "flamingo/stork" moment happening here? Don't these people mean to call themselves "Reformers Anonymous" - ???  It's Alcoholics Anonymous, Gamblers Anonymous etc. Not unanimous. Good grief.

 

Dear Celestial Magistrate, please make these hillbillies go to school. Real school - no Bibles or no "workbooks" allowed.

OMG, yes!!! I've been thinking the same thought since we first heard about Reformers UNANIMOUS, but was too afraid to mention it! LOL. I told myself that, surely, RU's people cannot be that uneducated, or clueless or ignorant, right? That they probably chose UNANIMOUS as an homage to "all for one, and one for all." Fat chance. Ha!

[Churchhoney]

Regardless of what Josh is up to at the Rockford rehab, I hope this casts that public eye on the place in a big way ! Forgetting for a moment the ludicrous nature of their "counseling" services, the warped men. vs. womens' chores, and the kerfuffle over whether or not anyone, including Josh, should be receiving public welfare money in a voluntary rehab program with NO credentials whatsoever, I'd really like to know if the people who go there for drug or alcohol addiction are first sent to a legit d/a center or hospital for medically supervised detox. 

 

This is some serious shit here - people die, literally DIE, without proper medical care during the detox process. It's not just shaking and sweating and seeing pink elephants or whatever - seizures, convulsions, strokes, heart attacks, and death are a reality, and far more common than you'd think. You just don't see a lot of people putting THAT in obituaries...

 

This reminds me of the movie "Ruthless People" where Bette Midler is abducted by two bumbling clowns who can't seem to get things right and keep lowering the ransom demand - she cries from her basement confines "I've been kidnapped by K-Mart !"

 

Seems like Josh has been sent to the K-Mart of rehabs. Thankfully, I think, it's just punitive for his cheating, the molestation, etc, and not for an addiction. The guy is a punk-ass punk, but he doesn't deserve to die. 

 

If the Rockford place said they could pray and work away your appendicitis, they'd be shut down in a heartbeat. I don't see how this is any different.

 

Maybe this should go in the JB and Michelle thread (?) but how do I reconcile them sending Josh (which is another matter altogether - he's an ADULT, for Pete's sake !)  to possibly the shittiest rehab on the face of the planet in a private plane ?

 

Mind meet boggled.

 

This group isn't just in Illinois, either. It appears to be in multiple states, although it's a little hard to tell. And they don't just claim that whatever it is they do works for addiction; they claim it works for a bunch of other things, too -- virtually anything you'd consider a problem, it looks like.

 

Here are some more websites. They make an effort to get involved with state juvenile-justice and criminal-justice systems, for example (don't know how successfully). And they claim people "cured" of a ton of things, including sex addiction. (although at least on this first site that I looked at, in Ohio, their video testimonies about this seem to be busted.

 

http://www.rustreetsboro.com/

http://www.reformu.com/

http://reformersrecovery.com/

 

You can see why Jim Bob would be attracted to this. They do it all. And they do it without any education, training, relevant experience (or IQ). Why, it's practically a miracle!

[Churchhoney]

Honestly, most rehabs in this country are a scam.  I get that AA/12-step have helped many people, and I don't begrudge those people their success or think it shouldn't be one treatment option, but the relentless focus on AA-type models in this country is facilitated by an outdated puritanical outlook towards addiction (you're a bad person!  It's your fault you can't stay clean!  You just don't want it badly enough!), an ignorant court system (tons and tons of people at AA/NA/etc are there on court order sent by judges who have bought in to the idea that addiction is the addict's "fault"), a failing health care system (doctors and drugs too expensive for you!  AA is CHEAP), and inertia (what other field of physical/mental/behavioral health is still using a model largely unchanged from the 1930s?).

 

Bottom line:  addiction treatment in this country is a mess.  I agree with you that the place Josh is going isn't too far off from the norm.  And that's a really, really sad thing.

 

Amen.

[frenchtoast]

Honestly, most rehabs in this country are a scam.  I get that AA/12-step have helped many people, and I don't begrudge those people their success or think it shouldn't be one treatment option, but the relentless focus on AA-type models in this country is facilitated by an outdated puritanical outlook towards addiction (you're a bad person!  It's your fault you can't stay clean!  You just don't want it badly enough!), an ignorant court system (tons and tons of people at AA/NA/etc are there on court order sent by judges who have bought in to the idea that addiction is the addict's "fault"), a failing health care system (doctors and drugs too expensive for you!  AA is CHEAP), and inertia (what other field of physical/mental/behavioral health is still using a model largely unchanged from the 1930s?).

 

Bottom line:  addiction treatment in this country is a mess.  I agree with you that the place Josh is going isn't too far off from the norm.  And that's a really, really sad thing.

Taking my reply to Small Talk

[lulee]

But wasn't he horrified at the thought that she might get pregnant and have an abortion?

But then it would be *her* sin, not his, according to the JBs of the world.

[Cherrio]

Worse yet, he doesn't regard the females in his life as entities. They are merely robots there to serve him. I choked on my laughter at the episode when Josh said he was going to check Derrick over to see if he could 'cut it' as a husband, and father. Give me a break... what pearls of wisdom does Josh have to impart to anyone? 

No wisdom, just a necklace. :)

[zenme]

If the stripper had the baby, JB and Michelle could just adopt it. Boom! 20 kids!

[Defrauder]

Someone who could publicly preach and make his life's work all about Family Values - all the while when he's actively trying to guarantee sex with someone else, frequenting strip club and is obsessed with porn is someone who can attack and have rough sex with a porn star, stripper.  There isn't any conscience there, it's all a facade. The five year old, the sisters, the actively seeking out strippers and porn stars all while claiming to be about the very opposite of these things.  You can not have a conscience and do that. 

[WhineandCheez]

I think it's safe to say if you beleive Jesus rode a dinosaur blue cross is not going to allow you to bill them

 

SNORT!!  I think that is written in the drop down menu on the Blue Cross website, when you look to see if a practitioner or facility is a provider!!

[FakeJoshDuggar]

Me, too. I even believe the part where he tried to be aggressive and rough. The part I absolutely don't believe is where she says it's the scariest thing that ever happened to her. Please. That's pure embellishment, in my opinion. And a stupid embellishment at that, especially for someone who's lived on the seamy side of things. Not only is Josh a 200-pound weakling but he's a scared, blustering child who almost certainly could be easily intimidated by any woman who stood up for herself for half a minute. In the sex business, you're going to run across many many men with aggressive feelings toward women and who seek you out because they intend to act on them. Josh would have been far from the first. And there's no way that that hide-behind-daddy's-skirts, cry-when-he-leaves-momma 20-something wanna-be-lawyer lard-ass was the scariest she ever saw, by a long shot. She wants to sell newspapers, so she embroidered.

Okay, I've looked for twenty minutes and I can't find the clip I'm looking for. Basically, it was when Anna was in Florida for Prissy and TFDW's wedding and they were having an awkward sex talk in the Keller's home. Anna said something to the effect of, "it'll be different than anything you've ever thought off..." and her eyes kind of bulged. Her body language was screaming, "it's not all it's cracked up to be!" And I've always assumed that it was just lousy. But now, as an admitted porn addict, I wonder what kind of porn Josh was into and if he took it as an instruction manual instead of entertainment. I don't mean to use arm chair psychology on Josh, but it's not a far jump to speculate that Josh took his pent up sexual frustrations out on women because of the Duggar's well documented stance on sexual repression mixed with patriarchal notions that amount to spousal rape.

Edited August 27, 2015 by FakeJoshDuggar

[NextIteration]

They make an effort to get involved with state juvenile-justice and criminal-justice systems

 

Oh baby jeebus, not another Teen Challenge!  (I'm a broken record on this particular cult.)

[Barbie]

That people magazine story on Anna might as well just say Anna's brother is the source.... 

Edited August 27, 2015 by Barbie

[cheatincheetos]

If the stripper had the baby, JB and Michelle could just adopt it. Boom! 20 kids!

If it's a girl they might name her Joshley Madison.

[JenCarroll]

Eventually the pressure on Josh to live in a way he really does not want will get to him, and he will leave.

 

Yeah, I think he will leave. But there will be a couple of babies before he does.

 

I may be in the minority but I think this is coming....I honestly don't think he's a complete moron. I think he's going to try and figure out how to get out of this mess and that breaking out and telling the "real" Duggar story might be the ticket. He'll "rehabilitate", write a book and hit all the morning shows. He's probably hoping he can take Anna with him but I think it'll happen with or without her. I think within the next 2 years he'll be "out".

  

Totally.

This place is a joke. I live right by that Walmart, I will be looking out for him.

Betting there are stringers for all the tabloids hanging out in that Walmart right now.

  

OMG, yes!!! I've been thinking the same thought since we first heard about Reformers UNANIMOUS, but was too afraid to mention it!

They chose Unanimous specifically to distinguish themselves from the various Anonymouses, of which they do not approve.

[kokapetl]

This whole "rehab" thing is preposterous. There's no actual addiction, Josh is just a selfish person. The jig is up, Josh can't get away with it anymore therefore he can't enjoy it anymore, why would he continue with it? This isn't like heroin.

[cheatincheetos]

Josh is able to toss around an adult "like a rag doll"? .... If that's so, it's the first thing in the whole mess that really truly surprises me. He looks like all flab to me. Especially his brain.

I could just see him yelling Bible verses about whores and devils and Jezebels while he's doing it too...like Cotton Mather in the first episode of WGN's Salem.