Jessa, Ben and Their Brood: Making a (Diaper) Mountain out of a Mold House

[Mollie]

 She *claimed* that she made her Instagram private because she was going into teaching. I get that, but she wouldn't be working until next fall, at the earliest. The timing of her snatching those pics back was classic poster's remorse.

Krista didn't say that about herself.  That was in one of the comments left on her Instagram.  Krista says that right after her graduation from college next month, she is going to law school in New York.

 

The picture she took of Ben at the hip hop concert they both went to without Jessa is still on her Facebook page.

 

By the way, on Facebook she is friends with Ben but NOT with Jessa!  She is also friends with Sierra Dominguez, Laura DeMassie (seen with John David many times), and Mandie Query (Duggar friend).

Edited April 19, 2016 by Mollie

[Marigny]

Turns out the baby really wore the hat and glasses.

 

Sweet baby Jeebus, that child looks like Boob spit him out! 

 

On the menu aboard the duggar-seewald cruise line is ttc, chicken segetti, melted root beer floats and Starbucks coffee. Don't even think about asking for a cocktail.

Tonight's entertainment features bin seewald dropping beats from that old favorite"10 Reasons You're Going To Hell" and his latest hit "I Change all the shitdiapers because blessa told me to"

No need to worry about life boat muster because there are no lifeboats.

Passage is limited to judgemental famewhores. Must be willing to marry a duggar offspring you hardly know and sell your soul to tlc and jimboob duggar.

Space is limited so call today.

 

I want you to know I just completely lost my shit in the middle of the office. Post of the week! 

HA! I know just the face you mean. It does seem to be the new duck face, doesn't it, now that that one has been so thoroughly ridiculed that it's gone out of fashion. I wonder what people like Sierra and Jessa would have done if they had been born into an era without Pinterest and social media. Well, actually, Sierra loves PInterest. I honestly don't think Jessa has the initiative to complete anything so elaborate. Sierra makes me feel exhausted when I think of her five kids age five and under, beginning a SOTDRT, and her endless Pinterest projects. And I have a lot more initiative than Jessa, that's for sure! (Also, I find it absolutely hilarious that Sierra calls dipping strawberries for friends a ministry. Sure, it's nice, but how is that helping people spiritually, which according to them is what a ministry is all about?

 

And she does it all without tying her hair back or wearing gloves. Because Jesus. 

[BitterApple]

Lol, if the Duggar cruise did have lifeboats it would be narcissists and judgmental bigot males first. The women and children would be shark food.

Spurgeon is a cross between JimBoob and Josh. The Duggar genes are crazy strong.

[laurakaye]

What I notice about Benessa is that she doesn't seem to worship him in that dopey Fundy way that Jill and Michelle and Anna do with their spouses. For a cult so focused on shaming anyone not in total lock step, I'm wondering if their ilk has taken to Jezebel-shaming Jess-z-bel on some level. It seems such subversive behavior will not be tolerated privately in Fundy homes, let alone on national television...can you imagine the likes of Steve Maxhell tolerating such attitude from his wife or kids?

It's obvious she finds him tiresome and a dolt (how could she think otherwise given how immature he is)and she's so full of stank and contempt when she speaks of him. They've got a kid, both unemployed (except for the TLC freak show), living at Grandma's house...unable to cut the cord and leave the family compound...let's face it....once the TLC pay checks go away and Bin's rebellious desire to be a rapper albeit a Christian rapper gets stomped on by Jessa and Boob....and Joshley Madison takes on toilet duty...neither one of them will be able to survive the rigors of actual employment anywhere for anyone.

Boob has methodically ensured that they and the rest of his adult and married children will be dependent on him for life...and have no chance of being able to enjoy a life of their own or any sense of independence thereof.

And this makes me absolutely crazy.  Why any parent does this is beyond my comprehension.  How can he not understand that someday, his children will be without him, and then what are they supposed to do?  Flounder blindly at life, wail and gnash their teeth at the fact that their headship is not there anymore to direct their lives?  I have a family member who is doing something similar - raising three teenagers to be completely dependent on her, and it makes me nuts.  

 

At the beginning of Jessa's marriage to Bin, she DID gaze upon his countenance with great adoration while he spoke. Check out the Duggar Film on utube called A Christmas Tour (I think). It is before the scandals and is narrated by Josh. As Bin explains to us all about the sweet baby jesus being born, and thus creating the Christmas holiday, Jessa has the longest Headship gaze I can ever recall.

Wow, that is saying something...there have been times I have had to turn my television off because I cannot tolerate the long, adoring, ZOMG I LURVE HIM SO MUCH gazes from the likes of J'Chelle or Kelly Bates.  Blarfffffffff.

 

Aaaaaaaand...what would we call the members of The Phillipians? Ms. Stank, Toilet Boy, and L'il Spurge?

The Spurgenator Krew?  Spurge & the Gang?  Spurgey Spurge & the Stanky Bunch?  DJ Bin and the Fresh Spurge?

[JoanArc]

Lol, if the Duggar cruise did have lifeboats it would be narcissists and judgmental bigot males first. The women and children would be shark food.

Spurgeon is a cross between JimBoob and Josh. The Duggar genes are crazy strong.

Pretty sure if Jim Bob would dress as a modest woman, with over permed hair, to get a seat on the lifeboat. Complete with nursing tent.

[satrunrose]

 

Lol, if the Duggar cruise did have lifeboats it would be narcissists and judgmental bigot males first. The women and children would be shark food.

 

Pretty sure if Jim Bob would dress as a modest woman, with over permed hair, to get a seat on the lifeboat. Complete with nursing tent.

 

I'm with Bitterapple on this one. Gothard life-boats would be patriarch, wives, children. Can you imagine what would happen if women were allowed in a life-boat without a headship telling them what to do? They'd have gotten jobs, applied for college and started worshiping the Devil before Godly help arrived. Nope! We need some manly men to tell the ladies where to paddle and properly shame the hussies whose life-jackets are showing some collar bone. 

[GeeGolly]

Does anyone have the original Ben Raps recorded? I just watched the beginning of the one airing tonight, and only a brief mention was made about this "chapel in the woods". No mention, or flashbacks of Jessa's engagement. 

 

So TLC, since you seem to hear us, and respond to us, please film someone other than Jessa. How about the little girls, no script, just playing and answering a few questions. Or ask them the same questions you asked their siblings at similar ages, and let us compare the two.

[Arwen Evenstar]

Of course it's ridiculous. But if the church did say they couldn't film there again, I can see them lying because they wanted to pretend someone didn't say 'no' to them. They figure if they pretend they are still filming there, then they are. After all - they are experts at altering reality by pretending.

Thorn crown Chapel looks like a more modern take on Cooper Chapel. They are both beautiful chapels.

Though it's possible they were asked not to film there anymore....the chapel could have been unavailable due to another event...but why not just say so rather than Duggarize the truth?

[Arwen Evenstar]

Toddles, your post was pure gold!

I can just imagine a Duggar Cruise...probably a floating Petri dish ...kind of like a floating stink bus.

Even cruise lines that know what they are doing gave sanitation issues. The Duggs would buy a rotted out un seaworthy vessel and try to flip it...it's too disturbing to imagine.

[toodles]

Toddles, your post was pure gold!

I can just imagine a Duggar Cruise...probably a floating Petri dish ...kind of like a floating stink bus.

Even cruise lines that know what they are doing gave sanitation issues. The Duggs would buy a rotted out un seaworthy vessel and try to flip it...it's too disturbing to imagine.

Aww. Thank you.

[Arwen Evenstar]

I'm with Bitterapple on this one. Gothard life-boats would be patriarch, wives, children. Can you imagine what would happen if women were allowed in a life-boat without a headship telling them what to do? They'd have gotten jobs, applied for college and started worshiping the Devil before Godly help arrived. Nope! We need some manly men to tell the ladies where to paddle and properly shame the hussies whose life-jackets are showing some collar bone.

Defraudment on the High Seas...I can even imagine the Fundies clutching their pearls in utter horror.

I can only imagine how difficult it must be to do an emergency embarkation of a lifeboat in those god awful flip flops and floor length skirts...and fearful of showing an ankle.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Arwen Evenstar

[Arwen Evenstar]

Lol, if the Duggar cruise did have lifeboats it would be narcissists and judgmental bigot males first. The women and children would be shark food.

Spurgeon is a cross between JimBoob and Josh. The Duggar genes are crazy strong.

I see Jessa Von Stank (aka Princess Prickly Pear) ....her pointy chin and pouty lips in that little one. He's a cute little baby though despite his parentage.

[Muffyn]

Defraudment on the High Seas...I can even imagine the Fundies clutching their pearls in utter horror.

I can only imagine how difficult it must be to do an emergency embarkation of a lifeboat in those god awful flip flops and floor length skirts...and fearful of showing an ankle.

A godly fundie woman would never get into a lifeboat.  When getting into the boat, someone might be able to look under her skirt.  She could never risk defrauding a man to that extent.  After all, if they saw under the skirt, the men folk could not control themselves.  Sure, Nike works for the random ankle or collarbone.  If they see more than that, they would never be able to stop themselves.  It's science!   

[Quilt Fairy]

Nah, they'd just wear tights or those yoga pants under the skirt. We've seen plenty of pictures of that.

[Arwen Evenstar]

Looks like Benessa wants to take Lil Spurge to Central America...have they gone mad?

http://www.enstarz.com/articles/156012/20160425/jessa-duggar-ben-seewald-news-couple-risking-family-s-safety-by-taking-son-israel-to-central-america-video.htm

You don't put a baby in harms way with Zika and the violence and kidnappings going on...neither Israel or Spurge are old enough to know what's going on.

[Sew Sumi]

They've already been. That's the whole plot of tomorrow's episode.

 

eta: It's a two-parter, and just looking at the show description, they won't be in Danger America until next week's season finale. Tomorrow is "getting ready" to go on the trip, and an updated All About Jessa segment. 

 

Barf.

Edited April 26, 2016 by Sew Sumi

[Mollie]

They've already been. That's the whole plot of tomorrow's episode.

 

eta: It's a two-parter, and just looking at the show description, they won't be in Danger America until next week's season finale. Tomorrow is "getting ready" to go on the trip, and an updated All About Jessa segment. 

 

Barf.

Can't wait for the "All About Jessa."  Maybe we'll find out why Jessa appears to be growing a mustache.

[Mollie]

The update took out my picture of Jessa's mustache.  Here it is again.

[emma675]

I can't stand Jessa, but man, those Duggar kids are cursed with terrible skin. It's sad.

[Missy Vixen]

On 4/27/2016 at 8:29 AM, emma675 said:

I can't stand Jessa, but man, those Duggar kids are cursed with terrible skin. It's sad.

It's probably a combo of their processed food diet, cheap makeup, and the fact she probably does not wash her face with any regularity before going to bed at night.

[Absolom]

It's also possible that they genetically have acne.  Some people can eat right, wear little to no makeup, use prescription products exactly as directed and still have acne.

[BitterApple]

Wow, Jessa's skin is in rough shape. Given how vain she is, I'm surprised she isn't wrangling her minor celebrity into free dermatology visits.

[Aja]

2 hours ago, Absolom said:

It's also possible that they genetically have acne.  Some people can eat right, wear little to no makeup, use prescription products exactly as directed and still have acne.

Very, very true, but I'd be willing to bet a diet comprised exclusively of Starbucks and Chik Fil A coupled with a habit of troweling spackle on their faces with a painter's chisel doesn't help.

[truthtalk2014]

Oh no!  Bengermin and Jessa have some competition when it comes to adopting all those children.  Same sex adoption!  I wonder if Jessa will resort to a robocall to stop the injustice and make sure Bengermin gets his baseball team.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/mississippi-same-sex-adoption_us_56fdb1a3e4b083f5c607567f

[Missy Vixen]

20 hours ago, truthtalk2014 said:

Oh no!  Bengermin and Jessa have some competition when it comes to adopting all those children.  Same sex adoption!  I wonder if Jessa will resort to a robocall to stop the injustice and make sure Bengermin gets his baseball team.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/mississippi-same-sex-adoption_us_56fdb1a3e4b083f5c607567f

All I can say is that I hope with everything inside that Jessa Blessa decides to make a public comment on this story. Come on, Jessa Blessa. Let's see what you're made of. And let's see how many MORE "Counting On" advertisers will flee as a result of whatever anti-LGBT screed you and Bin spit out.

[Marigold]

jessa and the kidults probably have some food sensitivies or allergies and are undiagnosed. 

Or bad genetics. 

[GeeGolly]

54 minutes ago, Janarella said:

I'm guessing that it's a combination of bad genetics and poor diet. Jessa and Ben eat a crap load of fast food, whereas Jana has the clearest skin of all the older children and it's not uncommon to see her choosing a bagged salad over whatever greasy nastiness is for dinner.

In addition to genetics and diet, as I mentioned before, I assume their bedding is not often clean, especially their pillow cases. I hope they at least have their own bed pillows.

[Vaysh]

From what we've seen on the show the boys don't even have sheets.

[Sew Sumi]

I think they FU Interneted the sheet thing several years ago. 

[GeeGolly]

40 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

I think they FU Interneted the sheet thing several years ago. 

You are feisty today!  :)

[graefin]

Spurgeon is actually really cute and always looks engaged with his surroundings. I hate to say it because I know he's just a baby and it's not his fault, but I'm always struck by how dull cousin Izzy looks in nearly every photo. Somehow I think that Jill probably mothers in a way that's more similar to Michelle than Jessa does, and Jessa is also clearly smarter than Jill (although that doesn't take much), so maybe that accounts for the difference?

[truthtalk2014]

A couple of episodes ago- when the four girls were sitting on the beds in the bedroom- I noticed that the bed on the right had no sheets (not even a mattress cover).  There was just a comforter pulled up over.  Once again - gross.  You are filming.  Maybe you are planning on putting sheets on later (doubt it) but still.  

I'm sure that most of the bad skin in that family is a direct result of the food they eat.  They could be allergic to processed foods (90% of their diet) or dairy.  Not to mention, clean sheets can do wonders.  

[kokapetl]

A lot of what we see of Izzy is him looking at a FaceTime screen. I doubt Jill takes him anywhere much in peligrosa América Central. 

[Marigold]

I have to agree. Spurgie look alert and engaged.

Both cute boys and I wish them well. I certainly don't want say anything about a baby but let's just say that Spurgie looks very alert and curious about his surroundings. Izzy...

Edited May 1, 2016 by Marigold

[Allison Lynn]

In the most recent episode, I found it chilling that Jessa referred to about "things from my older brother's past", as though they weren't also part of hers.  

Also, I found it strange that Jessa said that the more recent scandal (the Ashley Madison one) was harder for her, because she had defended him.  Wouldn't it be harder for, say, Anna?  Or John David, who seems to feel more pressure to act as a role model now?  And then I thought perhaps the others just weren't surprised, but why was Jessa?

[Jeeves]

5 hours ago, Allison Lynn said:

In the most recent episode, I found it chilling that Jessa referred to about "things from my older brother's past", as though they weren't also part of hers.  

Also, I found it strange that Jessa said that the more recent scandal (the Ashley Madison one) was harder for her, because she had defended him.  Wouldn't it be harder for, say, Anna?  Or John David, who seems to feel more pressure to act as a role model now?  And then I thought perhaps the others just weren't surprised, but why was Jessa?

Jessa found the Ashley Madison thing harder, because it was one more blow against her getting to continue to be a reality TV star. 

As far as I can tell, the Official Duggar party line about the molestations is that the victims were asleep, it was "over the clothes" and none of them knew it was happening. (Which is totally contradicted by the police reports. Just saying.) And it happens "a lot" in families the Duggars know, according to Jill. Obviously, JB and MEchelle and Jessa, and probably Jill too, were just anxious to get the whole damned mess swept back under the rug where they think it belongs, so they could continue their careers as Famous Speshul Christly Examples of Family Life. With their TV show, and paid speaking engagements, and book contracts, and "Mother of the Year" awards.

Of course Jessa and Jill appeared on Faux News where they minimized and lied and defended Josh like mad. Only to be blindsided a few months later when the whole Joshley Madison thing hit.

No way is any Duggar, especially Jessa, going to be frank about anything on that show, especially Josh. The conundrum for them, and the producers, is that the only actually dramatic or interesting thing about the Duggars these days is: Josh. 

So they have to "walk through" this unnamed and mysterious "difficulty" they have with "what their brother did" to bring some slight bit of drah-mah to their snoozefest show. In their own inarticulate way. Result: THs that may indeed strike viewers (whether random or well-informed) as strange. The molestations are a minefield that nobody wants to step a foot into, on the show, since at least two victims are the stars. That serves JB's agenda of denial/coverup perfectly, and if anybody wants to diss Josh, there's the whole Ashley Madison and porn and infidelity thing which is much safer to mention.

It's the kind of fustercluck you'd probably have trouble believing in a work of fiction. But it's the reality behind the faux reality of the show.

Because, remember, this is NOT reality. It's a TV show with some connection to reality. The Duggar family members are real, and their ages and marital statuses are accurately portrayed. What they do on the TV show is, for want of a less crude word, heavily curated.

[Quilt Fairy]

On ‎5‎/‎2‎/‎2016 at 8:25 AM, Jeeves said:

Obviously, JB and MEchelle and Jessa, and probably Jill too, were just anxious to get the whole damned mess swept back under the rug where they think it belongs,

It's like the inflatable raft that Laura Petrie opened on the old Dick Van Dyke show, it ain't never going back in the box.

[sometimesy]

Jessa seems like the older sister. She dominates the other girls. Jana is meek, Jill is a fairy tale idiot, Jinger rolls her eyes then cries and rolls with it, Joy exudes some strength but the age difference gives Jessa the edge. If push came to shove, I think Bin and Jessa could make a real life on their own terms. I just wish they would. 

[GeeGolly]

On 5/2/2016 at 3:42 AM, Allison Lynn said:

Something weird is happening here. I was trying to quote sometimesy, and this box kept popping up and it will only let me type in this quote box. Even when I went to a different thread and then came back to this one, this boxed popped up without my even attempting to quote anyone. So I'm just writing in here to see if after I submit this, I will be able to post as usual. So just to clarify, this is not Allison's post.

So anyway, sometimesy you had me all the way to the last line of your post. You are spot on in describing Jana through Joy. However as for who could manage real life, I'm thinking Jessa & Ben would struggle.

And now my posts were merged. YIKES!

I'm thinking Satan ...

[Muffyn]

When in doubt, blame Satan.

[Adeejay]

21 hours ago, sometimesy said:

Jessa seems like the older sister. She dominates the other girls.

I think Jessa dominates the entire family.  According to Jinger, before she gave birth to Spurge, she was mean and bossy.  Her parents seem deathly afraid of her, hence her ill-advised marriage to an unemployed teenager.  Before the crackup, she appeared to be the family's spokesperson.  They all deferred to her.  Come to think of it, they still do. 

[sometimesy]

Ben's twitter isn't as moderated as I was expecting. Bin says something similar to 'don't worry about illegal immigrants, bad economy or Isis, fear gawd.' someone invites him to the border 'cause they have all three.. Bin says he knows he has friends there.. Bahahaha. Did TLC get Bin to email some people on the border and they became friends?  

[Churchhoney]

6 hours ago, sometimesy said:

Ben's twitter isn't as moderated as I was expecting. Bin says something similar to 'don't worry about illegal immigrants, bad economy or Isis, fear gawd.' someone invites him to the border 'cause they have all three.. Bin says he knows he has friends there.. Bahahaha. Did TLC get Bin to email some people on the border and they became friends?  

That's probably the scenario.

On a less tv-oriented note, though, the Seewalds were in Vision Forum, and it was headquartered in San Antonio. So it's likely he would have met some south Texans through that route.

[Lemur]

10 hours ago, Adeejay said:

I think Jessa dominates the entire family.  According to Jinger, before she gave birth to Spurge, she was mean and bossy.  Her parents seem deathly afraid of her, hence her ill-advised marriage to an unemployed teenager.  Before the crackup, she appeared to be the family's spokesperson.  They all deferred to her.  Come to think of it, they still do. 

 

I find her to be very ... predatory.  I think in another context, she'd be the sorority bad girl who gets the whole chapter in trouble for calling pledges fat and revels in making them discuss their sexual exploits or the mean girl high school bully who demands tribute from freshmen.  She has all the makings of a stereotypical Lifetime Movie Channel villain.  She has a stronger personality and will than the rest of the family and is cunning enough to hide it or wrap it in Jesus (sorry, Jesus) so it's almost kinda palatable. And she knows it, which makes her dangerous.  The question is, is she smart or is she wily?  Wily, I think.  Some of her decisions, like marrying a mouth-breathing troglodyte teenager with visions of being a hardcore Christian rapper, are definitely not smart.  

[sometimesy]

1 hour ago, Churchhoney said:

That's probably the scenario.

On a less tv-oriented note, though, the Seewalds were in Vision Forum, and it was headquartered in San Antonio. So it's likely he would have met some south Texans through that route.

Oh, I wasn't aware of that ok, maybe he did meet people, maybe Bin even has friends!

He was being challenged on twitter for giving parenting advice as well, so we know he is seeing some of the responses to his bullshit. Good medium for him to start  handling some of the social media jabs, he can move on to gang-lords. 

I don't see Jessa as a complete bitch. It's just that she has coloured outside the Gothard lines of what a helpmeet is supposed to be. If Jessa had Jill (sister) diluted personality and was married to Bin, I imagine the conversation something like..'do you want to go to Taco 4 life?' 'I guess we could, do you want to go to Taco 4 life?' 'Is this your bookmark'? Someone has to be assertive. IF Bin is suffering, it's because he is growing up and gaining independence (it should be from his parents, but it's happening with his wife), he knew Jessa was a shrew and he went all Jane Austen on her. If they were a little older I think it would have been a Jill Rod and whatshisface type relationship, but I think Bin is changing not Jessa. 

Edited May 5, 2016 by sometimesy

[Whyyouneedaname]

I wonder if Ben still sees his parents? Are they involved "grandparents" at all, meaning are they allowed to be? Not sure the distance between the towns they live in but they never share any pics of them being together.

[BitterApple]

28 minutes ago, Whyyouneedaname said:

I wonder if Ben still sees his parents? Are they involved "grandparents" at all, meaning are they allowed to be? Not sure the distance between the towns they live in but they never share any pics of them being together.

Bin's family is a four hour drive away. I'm not sure what's up with the Seewalds lack of involvement. Fundies will drive eighteen hours to attend the wedding of someone they don't even know, so a four hour trip to see a grandchild shouldn't be a big deal. Part of me wonders if Bin is resenting his parents for pushing him into marriage at such a young age. 

[Churchhoney]

7 hours ago, sometimesy said:

Oh, I wasn't aware of that ok, maybe he did meet people, maybe Bin even has friends!

He was being challenged on twitter for giving parenting advice as well, so we know he is seeing some of the responses to his bullshit. Good medium for him to start  handling some of the social media jabs, he can move on to gang-lords. 

I don't see Jessa as a complete bitch. It's just that she has coloured outside the Gothard lines of what a helpmeet is supposed to be. If Jessa had Jill (sister) diluted personality and was married to Bin, I imagine the conversation something like..'do you want to go to Taco 4 life?' 'I guess we could, do you want to go to Taco 4 life?' 'Is this your bookmark'? Someone has to be assertive. IF Bin is suffering, it's because he is growing up and gaining independence (it should be from his parents, but it's happening with his wife), he knew Jessa was a shrew and he went all Jane Austen on her. If they were a little older I think it would have been a Jill Rod and whatshisface type relationship, but I think Bin is changing not Jessa. 

Good points about Bin growing up and changing and Jessa maybe not. I hope he actually looks at the social-media responses to his silliness! I sort of think that he might, since he does have some interest in education and so on, unlike in the ruling philosophy of Duggardom. I haven't really given up all hope on Bin and Derick gradually dragging Jessa and Jill into slightly different worlds than the one they grew up in.

[Missy Vixen]

1 hour ago, Churchhoney said:

Good points about Bin growing up and changing and Jessa maybe not. I hope he actually looks at the social-media responses to his silliness! I sort of think that he might, since he does have some interest in education and so on, unlike in the ruling philosophy of Duggardom.

Bin's all about the sin, fire and brimstone, and black and white thinking. He's not able to consider there may be a different way to live. He also can't fathom how his view of the world or his chosen religious expression could be erroneous at all. After all, Jesus. And judgment, which feeds his teen boy ego. Bin's not going to change until there is a significant life event (and I mean significant) that makes him question it all. Jessa Blessa's parents will do whatever is necessary to keep them in the fold as long as there is any possibility of hanging onto the TV show.

[Churchhoney]

4 minutes ago, Missy Vixen said:

Bin's all about the sin, fire and brimstone, and black and white thinking. He's not able to consider there may be a different way to live. He also can't fathom how his view of the world or his chosen religious expression could be erroneous at all. After all, Jesus. And judgment, which feeds his teen boy ego. Bin's not going to change until there is a significant life event (and I mean significant) that makes him question it all. Jessa Blessa's parents will do whatever is necessary to keep them in the fold as long as there is any possibility of hanging onto the TV show.

Yeah, sometimes I think that, too. I'm still not convinced he's that hard core, though.

An awful lot of kids his age (almost all kids his age?) come off as pretty hard line about something, seems to me. So I wonder whether part of it isn't just his immaturity. Seems to me he clearly seems more open to experiences than the Duggars, and that's one of the things that moves you away from that hardline-teenager thing, ultimately. It's also not unusual at all for hardline teenagers to double down when their pronouncements are challenged, out of insecurity about things, whether they're conservatives or wild-eyed liberals, so I can't take his doubling down on Calvinism completely seriously. I kind of expect that his urges to go to concerts and meet rappers may prove the more powerful force in his life, in the long run.

He has had a few more experiences than Duggars, and that's probably cracked some of his windows at least a bit. And where there's a crack, there can be change. I also get the sense that he kind of likes people, unlike Jessa, who seems scared to death of strangers, and sociability is something else that, long term, can crack people's windows.

In short, I wouldn't be surprised if it all turns out as you say. Nevertheless, I still hold out a little long term hope for Bin's ability to change a bit.