S32.E14: Not Going Down Without A Fight / S32.E15: Reunion

[LanceM]

I can see the point with Scot and Jason but I haven't seen anything to indicate at all that Julia was divisive around camp, other than trying to play in the middle of two alliances. I just think that for whatever reason her and Aubry didn't get along out there (though they are great friends now) and there was obviously an issue with her and Cydney (one spoiler said they had a big fight at camp) but other than every exit interview I have seen from the players that were voted out had nothing but kind words to say about her (though this could be influenced by post show interactions).

[ProfCrash]

We saw very little about Julia in the game but her Jury Votes video points to a really bad side of her. She was gleeful in her derision of Aubrey. Smiling and happy that she was saying some not so nice things. Her initial Ponderosa video was fine but the fact that she choose to hang out with the Scot and Jason so much is a bit suspicious. I understand not wanting to spend a ton of time with Debbie because she is annoying but Neal and Nick seemed to get along fine with everyone. I simply suspect that we were not shown Julia's behavior in the game and that there was probably a reason why Aubrey wasn't chatting her up.

[piequinn35]

Neal said Nick voted for Aubry, which means Deb voted for Michele

does anyone know the correct votes lol

[himela]

I think nobody said that Michelle is a bad player. What most people say is that there was a better player than her in the final three and this player should have been the winner. Yes the jury was bitter against Aubry but I don't really see why. Aubry was kind and respectful to everyone and she voted out players to get to the end as she was supposed to do. There have been many many players who were voted out of the game throughout the years and then they were mature enough to recognise the necessity of this and thry were happy to vote for the person who voted them out cause they knew IT IS A GAME! These four idiots could not do this and this will be the memory everyone will have of them. Aubry clearly played a better game than Michelle and she would have won in almost every other season of Survivor. Damn even Richard Hatch won in the end cause the jury recognised his good game! Shame for Aubry BUT I do believe it, just like Cochran, it was not her time to win yet. Maybe we get to see a similar situation like Cochran and she wins next time. Michelle, I hope you are reading all the comments and know you did not WIN the game but you just prevented someone else to win. Enjoy your money but know you dont deserve it.

[ljenkins782]

Quote

My favorite moment that nobody has mentioned is when the jury realized that someone was going to be voted out and Scot and Jason were SO certain that it would be Jason. Because he's so respected and so persuasive, everyone would have been just blown away by his speech, right? Just pure overly confident self-worth, as usual. Hilarious.

That was hilarious.

Michele: "This person could be a very persuasive speaker" 

Jason: "That could be MEEEEE!"

Scot: "Sounds like you. Bye!!!" 

And...Neal :)

Lovely sequence by the editors. 

Quote

Also, for someone who hates attention so much that she has to wear an oversized wig to hide her face, Sia sure likes attention enough to "interrupt" a live broadcast and hang out onstage for a long time!

Yes, we didn't need to hear from 50% of the cast, including the 4th place, lost in a tense fire challenge, finisher, but Sia gets 10 minutes to blather on about Tai.

Plus, nice of her to mention that she was GOING to do it for Keith, but then didn't bother. Sure he'll love to know he almost got 50 grand but didn't. 

Quote

This might be the first time that I actually think there was a real bitter jury. I can see how Russell's bullying behavior prevented people from voting for him. He was an asshole and alienated everyone. There is no real indication that Aubrey was mean to folks. It sounds like she did not talk a lot with Julia and Kyle but she wasn't a bitch. And yet to hear Kyle and Julia talk, Aubrey was a paranoid person who had no game.

Yeah, I've called juries bitter in the past (All-Stars choosing Amber over Rob for example), but in that case, Rob had dug himself some major holes on a personal level. Aubry seemed to be on good terms with everyone so this end result is baffling. 

There were definitely moments in the season where it appeared to show Aubry on good terms with Jason and Scot, whereas there didn't appear to be any relationship at all between those 2 and Michele. I have to assume Julia is the one who drummed up votes for Michele.

[Shimmergloom]

5 minutes ago, himela said:

I think nobody said that Michelle is a bad player.

This thread is full of people saying she is the least deserving winner ever.  That equates to being a bad player.  It's not just a matter of people saying Michelle played well, but Aubry was better.  Instead there's a whole lot of 'Michelle only won cause she's pretty'.

 

8 minutes ago, piequinn35 said:

Neal said Nick voted for Aubry, which means Deb voted for Michele

If Deb really voted for Michelle then Michelle got the entirety of the female vote, so misogyny can't be used as the reason she won.

[kassa]

14 hours ago, Alapaki said:

 

And I wonder if the doctor realized how damning his contrast between how they treat "cuts and bruises" and "life and limb threatening" injuries was?  He admitted that they completely ignore the former, which as we saw this season can lead directly to the latter, at which point the player has no choice but to be pulled.

I'm pretty sure they are given lots of treatments that we never see... behind the scenes.  I'm betting they got antibiotic pills aplenty this season.  In other seasons they've gotten antidiarrheals and I think maybe even fluid ivs.  

Joe's crisis was acute -- there wasn't a point where treating it would have prevented the outcome, unless there was a Glolytely chaser beside the satay platter he gorged on.  I don't remember why exactly Neil went out, but if it was infectious, chances are whatever they gave him just wasn't doing the trick.

I agree that aside from Caleb I didn't remember anybody in the back row.   

The timing of this show was completely whack, like they did not under any circumstances want to let Cydney or Aubry have a moment.  But Jeff managed to call Caleb a stud.      

[meep.meep]

13 minutes ago, piequinn35 said:

Neal said Nick voted for Aubry, which means Deb voted for Michele

It turned out it was Michele who Debbie was gazing lovingly at during all those TCs.  You could tell when Michele started her final statement.

Everyone worried about the chicken - there are people all around, she wasn't abandoned to the wild jungle.  The vast majority of those people stuck around until the next series was filmed on the same location.  There are actual Cambodians who live there.  I'm sure the chicken found someone to live with, for a while.....

I loved Scot and Jason's certainty that Michele was going to eliminate Jason from the jury.  I doubt he ever entered her head.  It was either Joe or Neal.

[Alapaki]

Quote

I don't remember why exactly Neil went out, but if it was infectious, chances are whatever they gave him just wasn't doing the trick.

But Neil didn't come into the game with a deep, gaping wound in his knee.  He obviously suffered an injury during the game.  The fact that it progressed to the point that it did suggest to me that he was either not given prophylactic antibiotics and/or they failed to clean and dress the initial wound.  

Otherwise, hearing about some of the comments made by the jurors in their pre-vote videos, a scary proposition occurs to me:

Had Joe not been evacuated and Michelle eliminated at F5 (having lost whatever that IC would have been), and somehow made it to FTC, there may have actually been a non-trivial chance that he could've gotten enough votes to win.

[hyukx3]

Joe is just Aubrey's loyal dog. Everybody saw that. Nobody would vote for him.

[piequinn35]

23 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

That was hilarious.

Michele: "This person could be a very persuasive speaker" 

Jason: "That could be MEEEEE!"

Scot: "Sounds like you. Bye!!!" 

And...Neal :)

Lovely sequence by the editors. 

 

I thought they were just joking about it and yes it was hilarious.

It was either Neal or Joe for that vote.

[kakiphony]

For me, it's not that Michele is a bad or totally undeserving winner as much as it is that she is a forgettable winner. I don't see her going in any lists of best winners, or being someone the vast majority of fans clamor to see play again. Her game was under-the-radar, but without the personality that makes a Sandra such fun to watch. Her social game was clearly good enough to gain her jury votes, but it wasn't good enough for the audience to see her as charming, witty, entertaining, etc. Aubry, on the other hand, played a game that was truly entertaining to watch for the audience. Had she won, we still would have debated her mistakes and merits as a winner, but she'd be remembered in a way that Michele simply won't. 

Edited May 19, 2016 by kakiphony

[LanceM]

Here is an interview with Michele.

http://my.xfinity.com/blogs/tv/2016/05/19/survivor-winner-michele/

I found this interesting:

I think it went down to social vs. strategic. Not that Aubry didn’t play socially, because she did. But, she played socially with the people that she wanted to play with. She picked and chose who she wanted to play with whereas I played with everybody. And I never counted anybody out. I was very flexible with who I could work with. If we could’ve gotten the numbers and I could have worked with Jason or Scot, I would have. I always had options open where I think she was a little more closed with her options. I think people were a little bitter about that. I think when you’re not willing to work with people it hurts their feelings.
 

[Cutty]

Michele confirmed on RHAP that Nick voted Audry. Yikes. 

Audry told Rob she figured she had lost after FTC, and said at Ponderosa she overheard Debbie tell Michele she voted for her.

I'm really surprised at Cydney's vote. 

[piequinn35]

I understood why Cyd voted for Michele because she gave her a chance at f4 to fight for the spot in f3

but I don't get it why Deb voted for Michele :/

[jjj]

6 hours ago, LanceM said:

In regards to Mark the Chicken...

Finally, I have saved the most important question for last: What happened to Mark the Chicken after you guys wrapped Tribal Council? 
He was given to a local family.

Yes, and we sent your dog Skippy to a farm with nice people, where he can run and play.  Not buying it, although I want to.

[blackwing]

I think Tai must feel a bit of validation... Scott made fun of him for "wasting" his advantage and casting a second vote for Michelle.  But as we saw, Michelle was the biggest threat to Tai and Aubrey.  Tai had a private convo with Aubrey about how Michelle was a huge threat  and Aubrey said "oh I'm so with you there".  And yet Aubrey along with lapdog Joe, Cydney and Michelle voted out Kyle.  Kyle voted out Joe since he thought he was going anyways.  If Aubrey had gone with Tai, then Michelle would have been sent home.  The next round, Joe goes home with geriatric intestinal distress.  That would have left Aubrey, Tai, Cydney and Kyle as the final four.   At that point, Aubrey could likely have persuaded Cydney that Kyle had too many friends on the jury (Scott, Nick, Julia) and she wouldn't win against him.   Aubrey, Tai, Cydney for final 3.  Aubrey would have had a much better chance of winning against Tai and Cydney than the 0% she had against Michelle.

I give credit to Michelle for a good social game, and for winning challenges when she needed to.  But I find large fault with her strategic game.  I think her strategic game was fairly nonexistent.  She never made the big moves that Tai or Aubrey and never was in control of the game.  She just went along with whatever was best for her at the time.  I guess some people appreciate this Sandra-style play of "anyone but me", but I'm not one of them.  As much as I disliked them, I prefer winners like Tyson and Tony who were the ones in charge.

[Miss Scarlet]

Quote

Sucks that Aubrey had to learn at such a young age that hard work is meaningless in our society because in the end it's the good-looking people who get all the breaks.  

This happens sometimes in life, but I feel like this effect is exacerbated in Survivor. I'm trying to figure out why exactly. I think a lot of it is in the casting. Obviously they cast attractive/stereotypical people, a lot of whom tend to don't value other qualities as much. So in real life you can find environments with people that have more values than just that and will judge others based on different values, but in Survivor you find that less so. And then of course there are the "themes" and leading questions from producers that indicate to the players what "roles" they want them to fill.

And Linda Holmes (TWOP's Miss Allie) said it best when she said there doesn't seem to be a host on TV that is more resentful of intelligent people than Probst. And I think that's very much seeped into the Survivor casting, editing and universe in general. Which seems odd because it seems like there's a mismatch between what the show is and what people think it is -- like it seemed to be marketed as a show for strategic, analytical, psychology and sociology interested people and to an extent it is, but it's also sort of the reality TV version of Two and a Half Men.

[blackwing]

11 minutes ago, piequinn35 said:

I understood why Cyd voted for Michele because she gave her a chance at f4 to fight for the spot in f3

but I don't get it why Deb voted for Michele :/

So I see that the Wikipedia has changed again... before it said that Joe and Debbie voted for Aubrey, now it is saying Joe and Nick (and yes, I get that anyone can edit it, but still).  Would be nice to get official confirmation.

If Debbie voted for Michelle instead of Aubrey, I wouldn't be surprised.  Debbies was always about a woman winning.  But she probably got ticked off because she thought Aubrey was her ally, and knew that Aubrey orchestrated her ouster.  I did think that Aubrey answered Debbie's question as best as she could... she voted Debbie out because they were moving in different directions, and it's what Debbie would have done.  Unfortunately for Aubrey, I do think Debbie is very egotistical and didn't get over it.  I would have thought that Debbie would reward brains and strategic gameplay, but in the end, I guess she couldn't get over it.

And no matter what Debbie says... I see very little difference in "odd" vs. "eccentric".   Jeff called her "odd", she described herself as "eccentric".  Sorry Debbie, but to me, "eccentric" is just a three-dollar-word for "odd".  You're odd.

[dkb]

3 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Reward Challenge:

I feel like Jeff announcing out loud that Aubry had figured out her mistake during that challenge was not fair to the other three.  However, I did burst into tears when she won.  Aubry hugging Jeff after, LOL!

Immunity Challenge:

The slowest person always wins these challenges.  It reminds me of what I'm always saying to my father.  When you rush, you make dumb mistakes.  I wanted Tai to win Immunity, however when Michelle won Immunity, Tai's face was just amazing.  That was some good TV.

Aubry:  Tai's being super shady.

Cydney:  Aubry and I have been Ride-or-Die Homies from the beginning.

Tribal Council:

Debbie being so happy and smiling at everyone, and Scot being such a sour fucking bastard.

When Cydney lost that Fire Challenge, I was so emotional.  I cried more than she did.  I don't even know why.  I kind of lost my mind.  I wanted BOTH Aubry and Cydney to get to the end, which was unfortunately not possible in this scenario.  And then they brought out Cydney's mom.  I was a mess.

I was surprised that Tai wanted to go to the end with Aubry.  I also find it interesting that Tai viewed Michelle as a major threat from early on, and though I found it kind of funny back then, we see now that he was right.

The "Twist":

I went through an emotional rollercoaster with this one.  I was dying laughing when it was announced.  I think the conclusion is it's very cool.  I just wish that Aubry had won the game in entirety.  Neal was such a fucking asshole for no reason.  #MICHELEHASSPOKEN   #NEALISANASSHOLE

The Winner:

I talked about this in the Reunion live chat but I was very, very shocked that Aubry didn't win and the more I think about it, kind of devastated.  Were the editors simply trying to surprise everyone?  Because not only did it surprise me it upset me.  

The editors went on and on about Aubry being the biggest threat, and Michelle feeling like Aubry getting to the end would threaten Michelle's game, which is why, among a million other reasons, I see the editors painting Aubry as their winner for a very long time.  It's so odd and confusing!  Doesn't it kind of hurt your show to edit Michelle as a not deserving winner?

Aubry is my winner.  Cydney and Tai are my fan favourites.  I think the ending could have been my most fantasy ending ever/one of the best seasons ever if Michelle had not made it to the Final 3.  I guess Aubry became the Spencer of this game, in that she received so much narration and growth arc time, although, there are analogies between Tai and Spencer as well, as they were prone to mouthing off at Tribals and did not receive any votes..   Scot controlled too much of this show.  He's a scary, irrational, single-minded asshole and he absolutely did not pick the person with the best game to win.

Ms. Blue Jay your whole post is awesome, and I feel your inside my brain because everything you wrote is what I thought and said. I was crushed that Aubry didn't win even though previously I said that I would be fine with any of the final 3 women winning. I just really was rooting for her, and I thought her game was so good.

2 hours ago, Alapaki said:

 No word on whether they baked or fried him.

 

Alapaki, this made me laugh out loud, and I'm still giggling about it.

[fishcakes]

1 minute ago, piequinn35 said:

but I don't get it why Deb voted for Michele :/

Aubry engineered Debbie getting voted out because Debbie liked Julia and Aubry didn't (and Julia had immunity, so Aubry couldn't vote for her). As more people went to Ponderosa, Debbie likely got the scoop on why she was voted out and how Aubry was behind it.

[hyukx3]

7 minutes ago, Miss Scarlet said:

This happens sometimes in life, but I feel like this effect is exacerbated in Survivor. I'm trying to figure out why exactly. I think a lot of it is in the casting. Obviously they cast attractive/stereotypical people, a lot of whom tend to don't value other qualities as much. So in real life you can find environments with people that have more values than just that and will judge others based on different values, but in Survivor you find that less so. And then of course there are the "themes" and leading questions from producers that indicate to the players what "roles" they want them to fill.

And Linda Holmes (TWOP's Miss Allie) said it best when she said there doesn't seem to be a host on TV that is more resentful of intelligent people than Probst. And I think that's very much seeped into the Survivor casting, editing and universe in general. Which seems odd because it seems like there's a mismatch between what the show is and what people think it is -- like it seemed to be marketed as a show for strategic, analytical, psychology and sociology interested people and to an extent it is, but it's also sort of the reality TV version of Two and a Half Men.

isnt jeff friends with cochran?

[piequinn35]

Just now, fishcakes said:

Aubry engineered Debbie getting voted out because Debbie liked Julia and Aubry didn't (and Julia had immunity, so Aubry couldn't vote for her). As more people went to Ponderosa, Debbie likely got the scoop on why she was voted out and how Aubry was behind it.

Another bitter jury member then :/

[ratgirlagogo]

7 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

This has already been mentioned a lot but damn at the just letting Mark go like that. That's savage! I mean it's not like Mark was even a wild chicken to begin with, he was given to them by Production. How sad. Poor Mark.

And fucking Sia gave Tai fifty grand FOR NOT SAVING MARK. 

6 hours ago, LanceM said:

Finally, I have saved the most important question for last: What happened to Mark the Chicken after you guys wrapped Tribal Council? 
He was given to a local family.

A local family that runs a domestic livestock rescue center? Or a family that's going to eat him? 

I'm not opposed myself to people eating chickens, but it's just useless to act as though Tai saved a chicken he didn't actually save.

[Wandering Snark]

2 minutes ago, blackwing said:

And no matter what Debbie says... I see very little difference in "odd" vs. "eccentric".   Jeff called her "odd", she described herself as "eccentric".  Sorry Debbie, but to me, "eccentric" is just a three-dollar-word for "odd".  You're odd.

I worked in a law office dealing with wills/estates. One of our senior clients declared about one of her siblings that she "wasn't rich enough to be called eccentric, she's just crazy." So yes, Debbie is just crazy.

And yeah I'm sure the "family" that Mark was given to was licking their chops at the time...

[pamplemousse]

Word, blackwing. I thought Aubrey pretty much tanked her own game after she chose to go along with Cyd rather than Tai and voted out Kyle instead of Michelle, hanging Tai -- supposedly one of her closest allies -- out to dry (she did a similar thing to Joe when she wrote Julia's name down and then crossed it out and changed it to Peter, what saved her and Joe was that they merged next episode). That struck me as a truly bone-headed and illogical decision and I think it was the turning point for her game, it was all downhill after that. Michelle was a real threat, which Tai recognized, and yet Aubry screwed Tai and herself and kept Michelle in the game just to appease reactionary Cydney. So stupid and I would almost go as far as to say that Aubry deserved to lose after that. But then that would leave Michele as the winner (poor Tai, regardless of my own personal opinion as to his game and his worth, didn't stand a chance) and mehhhh.

[ratgirlagogo]

7 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

That seems kind of funny because wearing such a strange wig and having her face covered seems to scream, "Hey this is Sia in disguise!!" Her disguise is so odd. She should just wear sunglasses, no makeup, jeans and T-shirt and maybe no one would know who she is.

She is not a favorite of mine but that part of her schtick makes perfect sense to me. Her disguise is the drag she performs in and is famous in.  This allows her to go out wearing  jeans and a t-shirt with her friends and have no one know or care who she is.

[hyukx3]

1 minute ago, pamplemousse said:

Word, blackwing. I thought Aubrey pretty much tanked her own game after she chose to go along with Cyd rather than Tai and voted out Kyle instead of Michelle, hanging Tai -- supposedly one of her closest allies -- out to dry (she did a similar thing to Joe when she wrote Julia's name down and then crossed it out and changed it to Peter, what saved her and Joe was that they merged next episode). That struck me as a truly bone-headed and illogical decision and I think it was the turning point for her game, it was all downhill after that. Michelle was a real threat, which Tai recognized, and yet Aubry screwed Tai and herself and kept Michelle in the game just to appease reactionary Cydney. So stupid and I would almost go as far as to say that Aubry deserved to lose after that. But then that would leave Michele as the winner (poor Tai, regardless of my own personal opinion as to his game and his worth, didn't stand a chance) and mehhhh.

Aubrey's game certainly has a lot of flaws. Becoz of editing, they made seemed like "the woman behind the curtain", but it is easy to see that's not the case.

[thehepburn]

11 minutes ago, fishcakes said:

Aubry engineered Debbie getting voted out because Debbie liked Julia and Aubry didn't (and Julia had immunity, so Aubry couldn't vote for her). As more people went to Ponderosa, Debbie likely got the scoop on why she was voted out and how Aubry was behind it.

Minutes after her boot, Debbie said - "Aubry, you will not get my vote if you get to the end." And she kept to it. I dont have a problem with that.

[Wandering Snark]

5 minutes ago, hyukx3 said:

isnt jeff friends with cochran?

And with Sia too, as Jeff made sure we knew.

[blackwing]

14 minutes ago, ratgirlagogo said:

[Sia] is not a favorite of mine but that part of her schtick makes perfect sense to me. Her disguise is the drag she performs in and is famous in.  This allows her to go out wearing  jeans and a t-shirt with her friends and have no one know or care who she is.

Wait, Sia is a man in drag?  I've never seen this person before.  I vaguely recognise the name from a song that's currently on the radio, but I had no idea that Sia is a man.  I found the whole wig in the face thing very odd, and I understand that this is her "thing".  For some reason, the hat and wig in the face reminded me of a Muppet.

Edited May 19, 2016 by blackwing

[J.D.]

Sia had such pretty eyes.  

[piequinn35]

Ahaha just google it so you can see Sia without the wig please. 

[QTBlueMoon]

15 hours ago, Shimmergloom said:

 that's still only 2 out of her 5 votes. 

Change those "only 2" votes, and Aubry wins 4-3

[millennium]

7 hours ago, Bouffe said:

I enjoyed the show, and I usually enjoy the reunion show even better, but not this year. That reunion show was badly planned. I love Jeff but last night he kept cutting people off. Yes, Tai was rambling and looking for his words, but as a person whose mother tongue is not english, I completely understand Tai stumbling on his words. Having Jeff cut him off only made things worse. Why can't they add an extra 30 min to the reunion show and take time with everyone (or most everyone)? Sydney was not my favourite player, but she came fourth and yet, Jeff didn't talk to her at all! I would have loved for him to ask who would have voted for whom if Sydney had been in the F3. If it's the three women there, who wins?

 

I almost never watch the reunion show because it almost always proves a disappointment.    I have read comments about it here and back at TwoP, and the impression I get is that it often seems to be more about people in the audience (Cochrane and other past players, current players' family members, celebrity guests) than about the folks we've just spent a whole season with and might like to know better (not you, Scot).

Having Sia showboat in the middle of the reunion strikes me as all kind of wrong -- especially if Cydney received no face time at all.    I don't care what Sia's reason was or how much money she gave away.   She is not relevant to the show and IMHO had no business being there any more than Tyler Perry has a right to be inventing immunity idols.  Does this mean any celebrity now can buy their way into the Survivor reunion for some cheap advertising?   You can be damn sure the advertisers who purchased air time during the show paid a hell of a lot more than $50,000 for a 30-second spot.    Sia, stay the fuck out of my show, thank you very much.

It makes no sense that Probst should bypass Cydney during the reunion, especially since he spent a good minute with her mother in the audience during one of the breaks.   He should have followed up with Cydney to complete the arc he began with her mom.    Personally, I thought Cydney was the most intriguing personality on the island this season and her exit confessional was heartbreaking after so much effort.   What  a disservice to ignore her in the end. 

Edited May 19, 2016 by millennium

[Miss Scarlet]

Quote

A lot of  it looks suspiciously like bitterness that a favored player didn't win, and a lot like the good old fashioned hate-the-pretty-girl stuff that happens so often. There's some terrible misogynistic plot against Aubry...or Aubry just didn't think about how she was actually going to win if she didn't make connections.

Yeah, I think it's important to point out that both can happen. Attractive people may get some advantages for being attractive, but there are also so many situations where their intelligence, hard work, etc. are dismissed because of their attractiveness and that's unfair. It's interesting that people will talk about how pretty girls get their way and how they hate them for it, even though these reactions themselves are great examples of how things can actually be unfair for attractive women. And I know that no one wants to hear how attractive or wealthy or talented people can have it hard, but their problems are legitimate too.

It's so hard to tell what happens on Survivor with the editing and the fact that Scot and Jason were assholes this season and Probst is extremely sexist and has undue influence on the show, etc. In terms of the argument that Michele played a better social game, I think she's someone who is a nice, normal, level-headed person and that doesn't make for good TV in terms of being interesting or showing gameplay. Aubry is good TV, but I can also understand why she might get annoying. And not in the sense of "she's an assertive woman and that's annoying", although that could be part of it for some people, but for others I could just see them finding her as being too quirky for them or not having as much social finesse.

[simplyme]

2 hours ago, Shimmergloom said:

This thread is full of people saying she is the least deserving winner ever.  That equates to being a bad player.  It's not just a matter of people saying Michelle played well, but Aubry was better.  Instead there's a whole lot of 'Michelle only won cause she's pretty'.

I respectfully disagree.  Yes, a few posts expressed that opinion, but I think most people simply were expressing frustration with the jury's verdict.  I'd keep in mind that people are also prone to exaggerate and nitpick in the heat of the moment. :)  IMO Michele played a good game, and yes Aubry also made mistakes.  Everyone does.  I have yet to see what I consider a perfect game of Survivor.

I think it's easy to say that Michele played a much better social game without considering why that was possible.  Aubry going to TC earlier and more often than Michelle put her in conflict with others before Michelle.  Aubry does not exactly ooze charisma (although she's charming in her own way), and I can see her placement on the Brains tribe helping to pigeonhole her into being perceived as less socially oriented.

2 hours ago, Shimmergloom said:

If Deb really voted for Michelle then Michelle got the entirety of the female vote, so misogyny can't be used as the reason she won.

Technically, it can.  Women can be misogynists too, or it could be a partial reason.  That said, I think saying Michele won because certain players are misogynists is overly simple.  I certainly think Jason and Scot disliked Aubry because they perceived her as a woman with some power who wouldn't do what they wanted.  (Michele wanted them gone too, but it was Aubry that Scot approached about working together, and thus Aubry who took the blame for the ultimate decision.)  Debbie was upset at Aubry for voting her out.  Cyd either was closer to Michelle or held some resentment for Aubry and Tai voting against her or a combo.  Julia just seems like a nasty piece of work who's still stuck in junior high, so she condescendingly voted for the person most associated with her.  Loyal Joe has never heard of flipping, so of course he voted Aubry.  Nick always seemed to appreciate strategy and gameplay, and he saw that in Aubry and voted for her.

Overall, I would stand by my statement that this was a bitter jury.  Yes, Aubry played the type of game I prefer.  I don't think either of those statements means that Michele did NOT play a good game, though.  She certainly did.  I think a number of posts that were nuanced got interpreted as "Michele is bad!" when that was not the case.  But hey... differing opinions make discussions fun. :)

[ratgirlagogo]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

Wait, Sia is a man in drag?

No, she's a woman.  I just meant drag in the more general meaning of costume.  Like RuPaul always says, we're born naked and everything after that is drag.

[mythoughtis]

Sia - stop pulling the Greta Garbo routine.  If you want to be a famous singer, then show your face.  If you want privacy, don't be a famous singer.

 

Reunion was the pits.  50 minutes. most of which was spend on stuff other than the contestants.

[peachmangosteen]

4 hours ago, himela said:

Aubry clearly played a better game than Michele ...

I don't think that's clear at all. I personally don't see it that way and some others here didn't either. And 5 jury members didn't either.

2 hours ago, Miss Scarlet said:

And Linda Holmes (TWOP's Miss Allie) said it best when she said there doesn't seem to be a host on TV that is more resentful of intelligent people than Probst.

I agree with this completely but I would also argue that sometimes it seems the online audience in general for Survivor is the opposite: very resentful of people who aren't highly intelligent.

Edited May 19, 2016 by peachmangosteen

[mojoween]

Wait.  So they've wanted to bounce a juror for seven years, and they apparently liked it so much that they didn't even do it on the very next season?  I mean, I am cool with that because I hated the very idea, but don't act like it was the greatest idea since sliced bread, Jeff.

[Callaphera]

15 hours ago, BK1978 said:

This post cracked me up way more than it should have.  I wonder what Caleb is going to do this summer.  The next spring season of Survivor is rumored to be an All Star season and the upcoming season of Big Brother is rumored to be All Stars vs. new players.  I would think both shows would want him to be an All Star.

Caleb back on BB would be fantastic. I could do another summer of Tall Tales with Beast Mode Cowboy. "I can't shave my head! Uh... because... there's a Nazi tattoo under there! That's right!" "I really like you, let me shove a pickle into a banana peel, sew it up with dental floss and glue it shut with toothpaste to explain how you and I work as a couple before I vote to evict you from the house and hide Franken-Nanner in your bag!" Caleb back on Survivor would be fantastic, too, but I really feel that either the BB House made him go absolutely bug-shit insane or Survivor gave him a very nice edit.

9 hours ago, LanceM said:

In regards to Mark the Chicken...

 

Finally, I have saved the most important question for last: What happened to Mark the Chicken after you guys wrapped Tribal Council? 
He was given to a local family.

And was promptly eaten for dinner that night, I'm sure. I hope Mark was tasty at least. There was a moment during Final Tribal that Scott was looking at Mark like he still wanted to eat him. Good thing Tai didn't bring Mark for the fire building tribal. 

[Cynna]

9 hours ago, Cutty said:

Do we know who Aubry's second vote was?

Do we know that Aubry had only 2 votes? The last one wasn't revealed - could it not have been Aubry 3, Michelle 4?

6 hours ago, hyukx3 said:

I dont like Chandelier. I dont watch panderos videos. Can somebody please tell me why Julia is such a bitch?

She and the two goons refused to speak to or even acknowledge Cyd when she arrived. Someone said they'd heard them planning it. Watch the Ponderosa - it's pretty unsettling to watch.

5 hours ago, Alapaki said:

I agree that Caleb is the type to send Jeff running for the hand-lotion.  But the guy did almost die on-set.

Still, did Jeff had to say, "You looked like a STUD who was playing a hard game!"  :(

9 minutes ago, mojoween said:

Wait.  So they've wanted to bounce a juror for seven years, and they apparently liked it so much that they didn't even do it on the very next season?

I get the sense they decided to at the last minute - seems like an odd decision, and one that cost Aubry the vote.

[needschocolate]

Somehow lost my post - if it isn't lost, then sorry for repeating myself -- 

In a season that had a lot of legitimate blindsides, the biggest one was probably on the audience with Aubry not winning.  Those watching at my house were all sure Aubry had it locked up.  Especially after so many on the jury seemed so happy that the Aubry won the fire challenge.  

I have a possible explanation for Michelle winning over Aubry that I haven't seen mentioned yet ---  What the jury saw was that Michelle was a woman without an alliance, she was at the bottom off the pecking order, yet, she was able to make it to the end.  The classic underdog who never gave up and did what she had to do to make it.  Meanwhile, Aubry had Joe in her pocket and she and Cydney seemed to be controlling the game.  Then they get to FTC and Aubry basically says that Cydney called the shots.  Plus, Aubry didn't do a very good job of explaining how she actually played the game - adapting after losing allies, keeping people on her side even after not voting with them or letting them know how she would vote (this happened with Tai and with Joe, but they stayed with her - proof that her social game wasn't too shabby).  

I can see how the jury could convince themselves that Michelle was more deserving.  Still, it doesn't mean that I think she deserved it more - Did Michelle ever have a plan that worked the way she wanted?

A few other random thoughts --

I think Sia is the love child of Cousin It and Cruella deVille. However, given the way her head was bopping around as she looked from Tai to Jeff, I have decided to believe that under that ridiculous wig was Mark the chicken.

I normally don't care about sob stories - seems every contestant on every show has one - but I wouldn't mind hearing more about Cydney's mom and why Cydney needed to win for her.  Jeff asked the mom that question and the mom just talked about how afraid she was that Cydney might die when she watched the challenge were Caleb was medivaced.  Then Jeff points out Cydney's father, which means it wasn't the classic "I was raised by a single mother" story so often told on these types of shows.  

Is this the first season where all of the advantages ended up not being an advantage - all the idols were unused, the second vote didn't end up sending anyone home, even the advantage of voting out a jury member didn't change the outcome.  

[LanceM]

3 minutes ago, Cynna said:

Do we know that Aubry had only 2 votes? The last one wasn't revealed - could it not have been Aubry 3, Michelle 4?

 

Yes Aubry only got two votes if there was a 3rd vote for her they would have showed it to up the drama. 

Aubry got votes from Nick and Joe

[Cynna]

1 minute ago, LanceM said:

Yes Aubry only got two votes if there was a 3rd vote for her they would have showed it to up the drama. 

Aubry got votes from Nick and Joe

Jeff was asked about the last vote, he said it didn't matter as he didn't open it.
I suspect it was for Aubry, and they don't want people upset about it, because it would be clear that pulling Neal gave Michelle the game.  They also likely know people were rooting for Aubry and wanted Michelle's win to look stronger.

[pennben]

That's not what he said on twitter:

Quote

And for those of you wondering about the final vote... Michele 5, Aubry 2. Once I read the 4th vote it was over so no need to read last one

They always show all votes not for the winner to keep the suspense up. The producers know every single vote immediately at the final vote, lest they ever have to deal with a tie or other problems, there are no envelopes and they have a show to edit for a season to tell a story.

Edited May 20, 2016 by pennben

[azshadowwalker]

1 hour ago, needschocolate said:

Somehow lost my post - if it isn't lost, then sorry for repeating myself -- 

In a season that had a lot of legitimate blindsides, the biggest one was probably on the audience with Aubry not winning.  Those watching at my house were all sure Aubry had it locked up.  Especially after so many on the jury seemed so happy that the Aubry won the fire challenge.  

And the fact that they were all celebrating her win makes the "Aubry ran into a bitter jury" thing really questionable. So, they were so bitter they wanted her to lose, but they cheered for her to get to FTC? Don't believe it for a minute. She lost because she was up against Michele. 

[kassa]

3 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

Sia - stop pulling the Greta Garbo routine.  If you want to be a famous singer, then show your face.  If you want privacy, don't be a famous singer.

She IS a famous singer and HAS managed to keep her privacy, so I guess what she's doing is working just fine from her perspective.

[DonitsYum]

One of the most disappointing wins ever. Up until the last move  (Neil) she did nothing.