S02.E06: Sicut Cervus

[Christi]

Thanks for the subtitles Asshats. I really didnt want to have to pay that close attention to this cluster.

Tonite I learned:

Im on Chris' team

Strand has a heart 

Nicky thinks fake owls talk to him

Worst death in the entire series was the dog tonite.?

Seriously.

did.NOT.need.that

[Muffyn]

Okay, let's break this shitshow down.  As always, they tell, don't show.  I know we were supposed to be overwhelmed by suspense when the ship fools were not exactly hiding down below.  The problem is I don't give a damn about any of these fools and the acting/directing/writing is subpar so zero suspense.  Thanks for telling us about the shooting rather than having us see what happened. 

Daniel looks at the coin like he knows what it means and tosses it, but he does let the guy bleed out because the world needs more zombies. 

They abandon The Abigail because um, yeah, I got nothing.

Chris tried to do us all a favor by letting Madison get bit and Alicia ruins it.  Dammit Alicia! 

Celia is BSC and (like Lizzie before her) thinks the dead have just changed rather than are really dead and trying to munch down on the living.  She sidles up to Nick because he's so special and spiritual and deep and meaningful and  . . . (or he's a junkie about to snap because he smashed a little girl in the head). 

Maddie actually smiled at Celia.  Points to anyone who guessed that Maddie would change her facial expression this episode.  It's always a long shot.

Strand and Abigail act the ever-loving fuck out of their scenes making everyone else look that much worse in comparison. 

Somehow the jail cell o'zombies is quiet when the boy is chatting away with his mom (who he stands way too close to) but becomes super chatty/moany when Daniel comes in.  He must smell extra tasty or they think he's trilingual -- English, Spanish, Zombie. 

Strand shows yet again that he has more sense than the rest of them combined and shoots Abigail in the head.  Mama's gonna be mad.

They sleep soundly with doors unlocked because of course there is nothing to worry about.  It's not like the dead are rising and trying to kill the living.  Nap away kids; it's all good.

[thuganomics85]

I am so lost with everything involving Chris.  Is he a psychopath now?  When did this happen?  Was it suppose to be when he put that one guy out of his misery in the plane and it woke something up about him?  Or does this go all the way back to losing his mom?  Or does he truly believe that he didn't stand by when Maddie almost became walker chow?  I am just so confused right now.  And while I'm glad at least Alicia is onto it, I would have think she would be slightly more freaked out about it.  But she acted less like she just saw Chris standing near them with a knife and more like she caught him peeking at her through a window or something.  What is going on here?!

So, no surprise, paradise doesn't last for long, because this Ceila character basically is like a more violent version of Hershel, where she truly believe that walkers aren't "actually" dead, so she's keeping them alive on the compound.  Unlike Hershel though, she actually is going out of her way to kill them, because she believes this is the next step or something.  Yep, the crazy ones always tend to survive these things.

Daniel is having flashbacks or something now?

Of course, Travis didn't believe Alicia or Maddie.  He could probably walk in on Chris killing someone with his bare hands, and he would refuse to believe that his son could ever do something like that.

Nick continues to be the only Clark family member I kind of like.  Alicia could get there though, if she just wises up more.

The Strand/Thomas scenes were well-done.  Sad that Dougary Scott is already gone, but Colman Domingo was great in all of those scenes.  Glad Strand seems to have snapped out of his funk, and didn't go through with the suicide.

Bye, Luis.  Barely got to know you, but I already kind of liked you more then most of the leads.

[MVFrostsMyPie]

So it's been realistically, what, a week or two since shizzle hit the fan? And Chris is already off his rocker? (Was anyone else expecting the Psycho music to start playing when Chris's shadow was looming over Madison & Alicia?) And it looked like everyone is already comfortable picking up a sharp object and stabbing walkers.

Spoiler

Why do I feel like there were some folks on TWD that still weren't comfortable or courageous enough to 'kill' walkers even though the timeline was much further along? 

What's up with there being a mid-season finale for FTWD? I thought TPTB had said that fans should be pleased because while one WD show is on hiatus, the other one would be airing? Anyone know how long the break will be until the second half of the season?

And the hair, oh the hair. I know it's a show, but how come everyone's hair looks so nice and blown out most of the time (minus Nick)? I can't even get my hair to hold waves like that on a normal day, let alone on a windy yacht or hot ass Mexico or while fighting with alive/dead people. Did the Abigail have a spare curling iron in one of the bedrooms that they then packed to go on land? 

Edited May 16, 2016 by HalcyonDays
TWD spoilers.

[Christi]

Not Johnny Depp better make the most of his looks, and cash in within the next few years.

I dont think his hairline is long for this world.  He is pretty but not can not pull off "skinny bald guy" pretty.

Edited May 16, 2016 by Christi

[Muffyn]

Well, Madison took a shower at the house and did her hair before finding Nick and telling him to wash the godawful stank off.  She is committed to her hair care regimen. 

[bookrat]

So mom was ok knowing that killing the entire church lead to the death of her son and she doesn't fear the zombies, but then doesn't want to become one herself. Why didn't she commit suicide after killing everyone in the church. In fact, WHY did she kill everyone at the church but not back at the house.

And speaking of the house, did the son (the one who ended up dying) know that his mom was keeping the zombie staff locked in the cellar...because that doesn't seem very safe.

But I guess the most pressing question I had was how was the house still getting electricity? I didn't see solar panel and why weren't people not yet dead not trying to break in...if only to steal food from the crops. Were there fences all around the place because it looked like hoards could come over the mountains.

[minamurray78]

So, for a bunch of episodes we've been hearing about the payment Strand has to make to get to Baja, and how Luis only had money for two, and the safe passage, etc, etc.

But Luis and two officers get killed, the Abigail speeds off to the coast, and... that's it. They let them pass. Big. Deal.

What was the point of that plot, other than killing Luis? And why did Daniel throw the coin into the ocean rather dickishly in front of Luis? And what did they do with his body anyway? I doubt Strand would have left him still alive in the boat. So did they left the body on deck all the way to the coast, or did they throw him into the ocean? He's not going to zombie his way up to the compound like Mami said he would, is he?

And Celia, well. I'd like to know how she got her paws on those wafers. Cause if the priest and his flock thought she was responsible, and were going to look for her, why would they accept anything from her?

Also, what set off Chris exactly? He seemed a bit upset that Madison told Travis about the guy he killed last week that wasn't turned yet, but now? 'cause if he had claimed from the beginning that he froze up and panicked when Madison got attacked, that would have seen more believable, but he was more insistent that Alicia kept her mouth shut, like "you can't tell anyone this lie, what you think you saw is wrong, what's gonna happen to our family" and then he tells her he froze... And then the knife thing in Madison's room while she's asleep.. like dude, if you're being suspected from something, keep away from her, specially in the dark while  she's sleeping.

[Yolapukka]

Quote

Also, I can totally get behind Chris not helping Maddie.  I mean, who in their right mind would?  What's the motivation to keep a dysfunctional family like this together?

I get the feeling that Travis has bent over backwards to treat the Clarks as his family but I don't think the same can't be said of Madison. I think some of Travis' efforts to be family with Madison has been at his son's expense. Chris' hesitation when Maddie was under threat was unsettling, but it was not clearly malicious disregard. Even without the horrible situation over his mother's death,  I can't see Madison's safety being a priority for the boy and it seems the reverse is true.  Certainly her words to Travis about Chris indicated no concern for him, just concern about what his behaviour might mean for her own blood. I think a lot of what we've seen with Chris has been ambiguous, maybe the kid is going psycho, maybe people are overreacting to his stumbles in dealing with the new world. Certainly his words to Alicia weren't a clear threat, but they could be taken as such. It's interesting to me that for Madison there is no question in her mind that he was making a threat. Personally, I think it would be interesting if the issue was more Madison having a problem with him than him turning dark and threatening. Mind you, I think the most interesting thing Madison could do would be go away and never come back, hopefully it would involve being on the losing side of a fight to the death.

 

I hated it when Tom asked Madison to look out for Strand, like she's some sort iron-willed, fierce, mama-bear instead of an expressionless, enabling know-it all.

Edited May 16, 2016 by yuggapukka

[Sentient Meat]

I've concluded that at this point I'm only watching this show with the desperate hope that they fire all the writers and showrunners and start anew next half season.  So many problems, I don't even have the will to make heads or tails of it all.

It's like one of those straight to video dvd with a cool cover that fools you at the Redbox over and over again.

[Save Yourself]

3 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

The scenes between Strand and Abigail reminded me of the men who held their lovers while they died back at the height of the AIDS crisis.  They really added a lot of emotion and dignity to this show that doesn't deserve any of it.

I thought EXACTLY that too!

[heisenberg]

The only one I care about is Strand.  The bunch of selfish stupid idiots can die.  Why did they made that trip with him anyway?

[Save Yourself]

3 hours ago, riverheightsnancy said:

Oh thanks, but isn't the above a "good thing"? lol

YES!!! At that point I was like wow Chris, you just became MVP.

[catrox14]

I must have lost my mind, because this was not terrible. I mean it wasn't GOOD but not awful either. Strand is interesting. I don't mind Nick. Poor Luis. That was a dick move to throw that medallion or coin in the ocean. .

Edited May 16, 2016 by catrox14

[Kenz]

I'm not sure why I'm still watching this show. The scene where the parishioners, including children, were heaped up with blood seeping out of their eyes, flies buzzing around, and a dog munching on them elicited no real emotion of horror from the crew I've come to hate. They walked by like it was no big deal until they started being attacked. The acting on this show is so slow and dim witted. I know they don't have much to work with script-wise, but can't they show some kind of genuine expressions on their faces? Only Strand and Daniel are tolerable to me in the acting department.

[placate]

Not going to lie, I stopped paying attention once I started looking up pozole recipes.  The owl has to have some type of audio recorder so Celia can spy on others' prayers.  The only character I felt for this evening is poor chute puppy :(  At least the one at the church was having good pickings with all the dead bodies.

Nick was wearing the old man clothes he stole in season 1 again.  I feel like it's his sheriff hat.  Since this show lacks a lot of creativity, I'm guessing that the zombies in the cellar will be released at the mid-season finale and everyone flees, that or Chris channels his inner Shane and kills them all.

[MVFrostsMyPie]

31 minutes ago, yuggapukka said:

Chris' hesitation when Maddie was under threat was unsettling, but it was not clearly malicious disregard. Even without the horrible situation over his mother's death,  I can't see Madison's safety being a priority for the boy and it seems the reverse is true.  

I would think though that as a normal person, if you see anyone right in front of you fighting for their life, your first instinct would be to help them out of compassion for another human being.

[MVFrostsMyPie]

Another inconsistency I just remembered - if they had to give up their weapons upon entering the house, why was there a knife available for Chris to take in the bedroom Madison & Alicia were sleeping in, and where did Strand get the gun to shoot his lover? And couldn't someone just grab knives from the kitchen, or would Celia force feed them a wafer?

I was waiting for Celia to say the pozole was extra yummy because she added some human heart and some minced feet to it. Mexican Terminus, yay!

Edited May 16, 2016 by MattDuffysCat

[phoenix780]

7 minutes ago, MattDuffysCat said:

I would think though that as a normal person, if you see anyone right in front of you fighting for their life, your first instinct would be to help them out of compassion for another human being.

But these aren't normal people. They barely react to anything. I don't think we can expect them to have normal reactions like compassion. 

I do have a behavioral/reaction question though. Why did Travis immediately start yelling at Madison about unity? Nothing she'd said seemed to indicate she wouldn't help the kid, yet he went off. I missed something. 

I thought the knife Chris had was a kitchen knife on the nightstand. Strand's gun came from plot necessity. 

The old man led hundreds of walkers in LA, surely he can pied piper the relative few in Celia's basement. If not, they handled the churchgoers pretty easily so...not sure why it's a big deal. 

[kj4ever]

The only thing that made sense in this whole episode was that Chris was going to just let Madison get chomped.

[ottoDbusdriver]

On 5/16/2016 at 1:43 AM, bookrat said:

So mom was ok knowing that killing the entire church lead to the death of her son and she doesn't fear the zombies, but then doesn't want to become one herself. Why didn't she commit suicide after killing everyone in the church. In fact, WHY did she kill everyone at the church but not back at the house.

And speaking of the house, did the son (the one who ended up dying) know that his mom was keeping the zombie staff locked in the cellar...because that doesn't seem very safe.

But I guess the most pressing question I had was how was the house still getting electricity? I didn't see solar panel and why weren't people not yet dead not trying to break in...if only to steal food from the crops. Were there fences all around the place because it looked like hoards could come over the mountains.

As far as electricity at the house, I'm just assuming that the Mexican electrical grid in this show is 100% reliable, self-maintaining and zombie resistant -- much like the Mexican Naval Border Patrol.  Come on, this world has gone to shit -- there are heavily-armed pirates roaming the sea lanes, the US military is fire bombing it's own cities, there were lightly armed pirates hijacking boats using deceptive practices (but they are gone now), and airliners are falling from the sky -- and they expect us to believe that this sleepy little town in Baja has a nearby vinyard that has its own jail with a capacity to hold dozens of walkers staffed by loyal and heavily armed employees and run by a murderous woman who has been collecting the undead family members of the staff and doesn't think twice about murdering an entire church full of people because they wanted to kill all the walkers she was keeping.  Seriously, this is what the writers for this show are trying to sell.

Here's a better question -- how is Michelle Ang's character (Alex) supposed to get past the naval border patrol (or land border patrol) ?  I can't believe that they would put her character through all of the plane crash, being found on the ocean, being abandoned on the ocean, being kidnapped by lightly-armed pirates and ratting out the members of the Abigail only never to be seen again.  That seems like such a colossal waste.  Or is she going to get that boat out of drydock and become the big bad for the 2nd half of the season ?

Edited May 23, 2016 by ottoDbusdriver

[Save Yourself]

8 hours ago, riverheightsnancy said:

This show blows (in comparison to the other show...) however, I do not understand what they are doing to Chris. In the first season he was just a regular kid. I understand that he is traumatized, but to make him seem like a deranged serial killer is just stupid and unfair to the character.

I felt sorry for him tonight and that's the first time I've had any feeling towards him other than please die. He seems very confused - I bought when he said that he froze; I think he deliberately didn't help Maddie in that moment but misremembered afterwards because he's all over the shop. He's been in a state of shock since his Mum died and he's got an idiot for a father who's no help at all. But the show does seem to be setting him up as the resident psycho, it makes no sense.

 

8 hours ago, Amelie06 said:

And why was Daniel such a dick? He didn't need to throw away that coin right in front of the dying man.

What was with Nick having first season flashbacks? Seemed a bit unnecessary. It's too early for them to be burnt out on the ZA. Earn it. I like Nick's styling earlier in the season 1. The slicked back mess is not his best look.

That church scene went on forever. I felt like I'd actually gone to mass by the end of it.

That sucked, why the hell did he do that? It was just nasty for no reason at all.

The flashbacks were weird because you didn't see how they tied into the owl bit unless it was just because he and Ofelia were in an al fresco church. I did like seeing it again though because I thought the opening scenes to the series were great.

OMG, it felt like 10 hours went by! It was so monotonous.

 

6 hours ago, Texasmom1970 said:

Part of the show I enjoyed the most seeing Nick try to speak Spanish and enjoy his posole. I am glad they showed a softer side of Stand and glad he did not listen to Mama crazy pants.

He's so sweet and I really like seeing him easily connect to (and make an effort with) other people considering the rest of the Abigail crew have barely any communication skills. I agree with Maddie (a rarity!) that he is fragile but it doesn't make him an idiot, I don't see how Celia was jeopardising him in any way by talking about the dead always having walked among us, some people do think that (ghosts, souls, angels, etc), to me that was harmless but of course cow Maddie has to be her usually rude self. Like Maddie doesn't even know yet that Celia is batshit! She just can't help herself from verbally attacking people.

 

5 hours ago, Muffyn said:

Okay, let's break this shitshow down.  As always, they tell, don't show.  I know we were supposed to be overwhelmed by suspense when the ship fools were not exactly hiding down below.  The problem is I don't give a damn about any of these fools and the acting/directing/writing is subpar so zero suspense.  Thanks for telling us about the shooting rather than having us see what happened. 

That's what's so annoying. If they usually did show us instead of tell us what was going on that ship scene could have worked because it's scary hiding and not knowing what is happening (think Anne Frank) but instead it was like, oh god, trying to save money again AMC?

Edited May 16, 2016 by Save Yourself

[Pixiebomb]

44 minutes ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

A

Here's a better question -- how is Michelle Ang's character (Alex) supposed to get past the naval border patrol (or land border patrol) ?  I can't believe that they would put her character through all of the plane crash, being found on the ocean, being abandoned on the ocean, being kidnapped by lightly-armed pirates and ratting out the members of the Abigail only never to be seen again.  That seems like such a colossal waste.  Or is she going to get that boat out of drydock and become the big bad for the 2nd half of the season ?

She will just Scooby Doo it across the border like the other group did. 

We really need a name for the Clark/Manawa group. 

[MostlyContent]

1 hour ago, icemiser69 said:

Daniel was a major dick for taking the prayer coin from the man that was going to die, and throwing it overboard.  I don't know what the writers' are thinking.  

I am assuming (oops) that he saw the owl on the coin and knew it represented some sort of 'Saint of Death' dealio, which apparently, it does.  So, Daniel was clued in way before we were that they were heading towards.......a really bad place.  

I take it that he hasn't been fooled by WitchyWoman (Celia) at all.  So now he knows he's right.  He's seen the unfortunate dog chute, seen the walkers, and so perhaps this will get somewhat interesting now.  Her two 'sons' were not her sons at all.  

Now, I suppose; Strand, the newly strong Maddie, Daniel, Travis, serial killer, doper boy, Alicia, and someone we have never seen before will make a grand exit out of the place of insanity.  I hope someone will die.  The end.  :)

.......oh, and Ophelia.  *snooze*

[JackONeill]

I get the very real impression that the writers haven't thought through this, except on maybe a grand level. For instance, they're on a boat. Then, but only later on, do the writers think of what to do with that.

I pity the poor actors. I mean, maybe they all suck anyway, but I think the largest problem is that the actors don't know what they're characters are all about. Seriously, and not go get all Al Pacino,mouth they don't know what their motivation is. I beg the actor who plays Chris is probably asking the same questions we are. "Wait, that's my step-mom. Do I want her to die? Well, why?"

I think the actors spend a lot of time scratching their heads between scenes.

how many actors, expecially guest actors, have I heard on TTD say: "I had no idea what they wanted me for. I thought it was a cop and robbers story!?! Then, all of a sudden, I get there and . . ."

[oakville]

9 hours ago, Straycat80 said:

A functioning Mexican border naval patrol makes no sense. Apparently there was no U.S. Border naval patrol left. Why worry about borders when the world has gone to hell and lawlessness. Plus, how many people are actually left in a ZA? 

I was confused why the other Mexican navy ships didn't chase Strand's boat after he killed one of their officers. I don't understand why Cecilia wanted to poison the parishners. Is she mad that her son was killed, so she wanted every one to die.

[oakville]

9 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

It's interesting that Celia gets all high and mighty in next week's preview since her poisoning the parishioners is what got Abigail bitten.  He went to the church to stop those people from coming for her crazy ass and he probably stayed with them until they turned because he felt guilty and ashamed about what Celia did.

I hope Strand tells Celia to step the fuck off next week.  Considering that he was Abigail's partner, the house belongs to him, not her.  Strand needs to tell that crazy bitch to take her zombie crew and hit the bricks. 

Were the parishoners planning to revolt against Abigail's compound?

[Texasmom1970]

1 hour ago, Save Yourself said:

He's so sweet and I really like seeing him easily connect to (and make an effort with) other people considering the rest of the Abigail crew have barely any communication skills. I agree with Maddie (a rarity!) that he is fragile but it doesn't make him an idiot, I don't see how Celia was jeopardising him in any way by talking about the dead always having walked among us, some people do think that (ghosts, souls, angels, etc), to me that was harmless but of course cow Maddie has to be her usually rude self. Like Maddie doesn't even know yet that Celia is batshit! She just can't help herself from verbally attacking people.

 

I told my daughter Madison needs some southern manners, we are from Texas. I couldn't believe how bitchy she was with Celia then added thank you for your hospitality. So insincere. I know she is protective of her children but dang lady let Nick enjoy his soup! And I agree in some ways Nick is fragile and also he is stronger than some of the other characters because of what he has encountered on the streets and with his past drug use. And after all that he still has manners, the others could learn a lot from him.

[Josette]

Celia poisoned the parishioners because she knew they disapproved of her zombie hoarding.  Looks like they were going to go to the compound to destroy the walkers.  Thomas was trying to talk them out of it because his workers would be ready to fight them, but it didn't matter since Celia had poisoned the church people already.

I do think Chris felt betrayed by Madison because she told Travis that the man he killed wasn't sick.  Of course, that should not lead to him wanting her dead, but whatever.  I think it's funny that Madison was a guidance counselor for teenagers, but she can't seem to do anything with Chris.

[Bad Example]

9 hours ago, catrox14 said:

I must have lost my mind, because this was not terrible. I mean it wasn't GOOD but not awful either. Strand is interesting. I don't mind Nick. Poor Luis. That was a dick move to throw that medallion or coin in the ocean. .

There I was, thinking yes, Daniel's badass and doing what has to be done with the bodies and I appreciate that pragmaticism.  And then he tossed the coin and yes... dick move.  I think another poster is correct that Daniel recognized the symbolism, but that didn't occur to me at all on the show.  On the show it just felt unnecessary, especially since I didn't see any reason for him to have any animosity toward Luis. 

That's just not the way to build characters.  

 

11 hours ago, Christi said:

Thanks for the subtitles Asshats. I really didnt want to have to pay that close attention to this cluster.

 

 

Those subtitles are absolutely impossible for me to read.  They're tiny.  We're not all watching on 52" screens.  (But I see this more and more with a lot of shows.

4 hours ago, Pixiebomb said:

I really try to watch this show for itself without comparing it to the Mothership. But that church yard scene really bothered me. 

Spoiler

On TWD for at least a year into the ZA CDB and other groups first option when confronted with Walkers was to run. Maybe kill one or two close ones but then high tail it out of there. Remember Andrea running from the farm, Tyrese, Sasha, and that family running into the prison?  And very pregnant Lori and the whole gang in Season 3 opener?  They always ran. 

Now here we are one month (maybe) into the apocalypse and here we have a group that has been on a safe boat for most of it.  Few have killed a walker let alone been close to one.  And they all just pick up whatever weapon they see and stand their ground and take out that church group.  They havent earned that yet.  Where's the fear and the terror?  Where is the incompetence?  

Spoiler

When Our gang on TWD stands and takes out a zombie pack it's because they have earned it.  I always feel like letting out a little cheer for them.  And still a walker always gets through and almost takes out Glen.  And they are always exhausted and smeared with blood and gore.  Can you imagine how nasty Rick would have been walking up to Celias Casa?

 

This this this a million times.  These people have earned nothing, yet they're out there without hesitation.

Spoiler

 I think of Rick's evolution from "I'm sorry this happened to you" to the "my natural state is covered in blood... whut?" and THAT is how you evolve a character.  These people... UGH.

Nick and Strand are the only characters that seem to have any energy to me.  And yet I was hoping that Strand would go through with the suicide pact.  Because that would be different and unexpected... and at least that would have meant something happened.  Yeah, we're all twisted, but we're right:  it's time for someone else to die, and someone REALLY should have been killed by Walker during that churchyard scene, because THAT is what they've earned.  

Edited May 16, 2016 by HalcyonDays
Walking Dead spoilers!!

[Christi]

6 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

Random thoughts:

"They should have saved the dog and sent Chris and Celia down the shoot.  I know it isn't real, but I don't like seeing animals killed on any tv show or anywhere else for that matter.  I am just glad that this was as subtle as it was."

Ditto! Hated that!!

Spoiler

Plus all the horses on TWD.

That writer evidently was wronged by a horse at some point in his life..jerk

"Daniel was a major dick for taking the prayer coin from the man that was going to die, and throwing it overboard."

They kept showing a closeup of that stupid coin, so I'm guessing it has some meaning that Luis knows about...must be from a devil cult or something....yawn

Edited May 16, 2016 by HalcyonDays
TWD spoilers!

[Lamima]

I got the feeling that Thomas was already sick as Strand seemed to know he had to hurry back to him before he died and I don't think that Thomas could text Strand 'I got bit, man'. So I think he was sick and Celia wanted to keep him as a walker. Tom stayed alive until Strand got there and Strand knew that the kindest thing to do for Thomas is to put him down. Though, one question...if he used a pillow when he shot him in the head (which they showed Thomas with a pillow over his head), then why did we hear a gun shot when crazypants Chris was standing over the ladies' bed with a knife?

[diebartdie]

10 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

I hope Strand tells Celia to step the fuck off next week.  Considering that he was Abigail's partner, the house belongs to him, not her.  Strand needs to tell that crazy bitch to take her zombie crew and hit the bricks. 

Unless Thomas Abilgail LEGALLY married Victor Strand OR Abigail had an iron clad will leaving everything to Strand, Strand is not entitled to anything. No "partner" or "boyfriend" or "girlfriend" or lover or whatever has the same standing as a legal spouse. That's why we fought so damn hard for the right to be legally wed and our marriages to be recognized in all 50 states. I dont know how it is in Mexico though but last time I heard anything about marriage equality world wide, in Mexico it was only legal in Mexico City.

I do agree Celia needs to go.

[riverheightsnancy]

7 hours ago, MattDuffysCat said:

I would think though that as a normal person, if you see anyone right in front of you fighting for their life, your first instinct would be to help them out of compassion for another human being.

Ah yes, but Madison didn't immediately help Travis on the dock either (hypocrite). She hung back and watched as Travis fought. Then she contributed with a few kicks. I am starting to hate the Madison character. No amount of retconing will make her the leader, ever. Now she is completely babying Nick again, telling others not to let him have a gun, or to talk to certain people. He is not an 8 year old Carl here. 

I get that they are including some of the differences in cultural views regarding the "dead" which could be a very interesting angle, if if weren't so similar to the farm and they didn't build it up enough to a grand reveal. It would have been better for Daniel to look at the coin and show some concern of recognition and then pocket it but not give it to Cecilia, until he figured it out. Since he is from South America he might be more aware of the differences in the religious and cultural views of the Mexican camp, but it would be better to let the discoveries happen more organically. It is like the producers are on overdrive to try and make the show a success and catch-up to the original recipe, but that means everything is rushed and just cheap. The make-up on the walkers is so cheap and jarring. It is like a 3rd rate horror film. It doesn't evoke the fear of a well done (make-up wise) walker at the exact right moment. The actors do not show the right amount of fear or anything. Where is the emotion? In addition, for a group on the run, they have had it pretty damn good. The boat was pretty great and The Mexican camp is frigging awesome. Power, water, lights, TV, food. Not hardly a peep about being so grateful to be there and safe. They just roll in and it is like they are on vaca from California. I do have to agree, Nick's hair looks better down and not slicked back. (dirty or clean). 

[kj4ever]

So I just read this article with the producer about this episode:

 

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/05/15/fear-the-walking-dead-sicut-cervus-strand-showrunner-dave-erickson

It doesn't even seem like the same show, the way he talks about it.  Then he says something about Thomas being Celia's adoptive son.  Did I miss that?  Oh and Chris?  His insights on Chris and the episode are nothing like what I was thinking.

[Primetimer]

Someone's stashing zombies en masse instead of killing them? That sounds awfully familiar!

View the full article

[loki567]

They need to can the current writers and start over (just like TWD has done a couple times). You can tell these writers have no clue what they're doing with the story. They're stumbling from one scenario to another like a... well, a zombie. I think that's a major reason that most of the actors feel off, they're doing their best with an extremely jumble and disjointed storyline. They need to get a showrunner in there who has a strong vision for what they want to do with a zombie apocalypse show. 

[RedDelicious]

This show is absolutely f*cking terrible and I am not watching it anymore.  The poor dog was completely unnecessary.

[RustbeltWriter]

Since I enjoyed last night's episode and complain about every other episode, I'm going to step up and list what I think the show is trying to do correctly.

• Everyone breaking down now that they've reached a relatively safe harbor. Nick saying he was tired of the violence and just looking for a shoulder to cry on was fairly realistic and logical.
• Chris going off his rocker. I've really got no problem with this considering he was just a moody teenager in school a month ago. Since then he's seen society fall, his mom was killed, he's been stuck on a boat and he's killed both walkers and people. That's some trauma that would make Dr. Phil call Dr. Oz for a consult.
• Daniel going of his rocker. Here's a guy who thought he knew a thing or two about cruelty and death but now he's been brought up to the big leagues and discovered that living through this much horror has a price. It would have been nice to know what the coin signified but this show is determined to be as befuddling as possible.
• Travis and Maddy arguing. These two just may not work out. Blending families is tough even when the dead aren't roaming the countryside. Throw in kids fighting over whether enough was being done to save mom from a walker preparing to chow down and that increases your chances for a good old fashioned mom and dad fight that makes the whole house uncomfortable.
• Celia is clearly not playing with a full deck but she is getting the job done. She's got people safe and fed behind walls.

My only nitpick is they finally get to a place with TV and Alicia is dicking around with recorded black and white movies. Would it have killed the writers to add a line of expository dialogue to the conversation that made it clear the news networks weren't broadcasting any longer?

[diebartdie]

29 minutes ago, kj4ever said:

So I just read this article with the producer about this episode:

 

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/05/15/fear-the-walking-dead-sicut-cervus-strand-showrunner-dave-erickson

It doesn't even seem like the same show, the way he talks about it.  Then he says something about Thomas being Celia's adoptive son.  Did I miss that?  Oh and Chris?  His insights on Chris and the episode are nothing like what I was thinking.

I missed it too! I was so confused by the relationship between Celia and Thomas, I thought she was his Housekeeper. If she adopted him as a boy, why did he have an Irish accent while she had a Spanish one?

[NorthstarATL]

1 hour ago, diebartdie said:

Unless Thomas Abilgail LEGALLY married Victor Strand OR Abigail had an iron clad will leaving everything to Strand, Strand is not entitled to anything. No "partner" or "boyfriend" or "girlfriend" or lover or whatever has the same standing as a legal spouse. That's why we fought so damn hard for the right to be legally wed and our marriages to be recognized in all 50 states. I dont know how it is in Mexico though but last time I heard anything about marriage equality world wide, in Mexico it was only legal in Mexico City.

I do agree Celia needs to go.

Abigail seemed to have an existing business arrangement with Victor, so it's likely that everything IS legally set up between them. (Most of us who became partnered or "married" over the past century or so did just that before the idea of Government marriage became a "thing".) However, we don't have any indication that Tom saw his mother as BSC or that she did not, in fact, own the property outright. Besides, ownership in the ZA is a flexible thing, as we have seen on TWD.

[riverheightsnancy]

11 minutes ago, RustbeltWriter said:

 

• Chris going off his rocker. I've really got no problem with this considering he was just a moody teenager in school a month ago. Since then he's seen society fall, his mom was killed, he's been stuck on a boat and he's killed both walkers and people. That's some trauma that would make Dr. Phil call Dr. Oz for a consult.

I don't agree (not saying that you are wrong), but most people don't become psychopathic killers when stressed or having been in a trauma, even one as bad as the ZA.  If they want this to be the outcome, then I would like to have seen some tidbits of this in his personality (going back to season one), if they were going to go there with him. Generally speaking, sociopaths shown symptomology in many ways before they start offending or acting in violent/criminal ways. That doesn't mean that it can't be Chris, but they haven't shown us this in his background. I can see Daniel having some issues because we know from season one that he has a secret past and he tortured people. I would like a bit more guilt or something from him regarding the killing of a child though before he kills another one. Of course, a lot doesn't make sense here, so they are going to do what they want to do. 

[Snaporaz]

5 hours ago, Bad Example said:

Those subtitles are absolutely impossible for me to read.  They're tiny.  We're not all watching on 52" screens.  (But I see this more and more with a lot of shows.

Not only were they tiny, they were white and set against a light sand-colored background.  Really aggravating and frustrating, but, yes, not unique to this show.

Edited May 16, 2016 by Snaporaz

[Lamima]

Again you need to watch TWD to get the show writers intentions. Epic fail!

1- Maddison is supposed to be the Rick of the show...NOT!

2- Chris isn't psycho and didn't mean his threat as a threat...um, seems full on crazy and murderous to me.

3- Celia isn't really Thomas' mom. Not sure how we were supposed to get that.

Etc....

Edited May 16, 2016 by Lamima

[LocimusPrime]

5 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

As far as electricity at the house, I'm just assuming that the Mexican electrical grid in this show is 100% reliable, self-maintaining and zombie resistant -- much like the Mexican Naval Border Patrol.  Come on, this world has gone to shit -- there are heavily-armed pirates roaming the sea lanes, the US military is fire bombing it's own cities, there were lightly armed pirates hijacking boats using deceptive practices (but they are gone now), and airliners are falling from the sky -- and they expect us to that this sleepy little town in Baja has a nearby vinyard that has its own jail with a capacity to hold dozens of walkers staffed by loyal and heavily armed employees and run by a murderous woman who has been collecting the undead family members of the staff and doesn't think twice about murdering an entire church full of people because they wanted to kill all the walkers she was keeping.  Seriously, this is what the writers for this show are trying to sell.

Here's a better question -- how is Michelle Ang's character (Alex) supposed to get past the naval border patrol (or land border patrol) ?  I can't believe that they would put her character through all of the plane crash, being found on the ocean, being abandoned on the ocean, being kidnapped by lightly-armed pirates and ratting out the members of the Abigail only never to be seen again.  That seems like such a colossal waste.  Or is she going to get that boat out of drydock and become the big bad for the 2nd half of the season ?

 In regards to the power at the Abagail's compound, it most likely has emergency generators as well as being connected to the electrical grid. Most of the houses around here which qualify as " mansions" - 10,000 sq ft minimum all have generators. They also have wine cellars and safe rooms.  As long as you have diesel or gas, the power stays on.  Also several small Mexican towns are being powered by solar power farms such as Boqullios Mexico.  If you really think about it 2nd and 3rd world countries are more prepared to quickly adapt to the ZA  especially rural areas.  

 

2 hours ago, diebartdie said:

Unless Thomas Abilgail LEGALLY married Victor Strand OR Abigail had an iron clad will leaving everything to Strand, Strand is not entitled to anything. No "partner" or "boyfriend" or "girlfriend" or lover or whatever has the same standing as a legal spouse. That's why we fought so damn hard for the right to be legally wed and our marriages to be recognized in all 50 states. I dont know how it is in Mexico though but last time I heard anything about marriage equality world wide, in Mexico it was only legal in Mexico City.

I do agree Celia needs to go.

Agreed on the legal issue. I hope there's a will, but the again it's the ZA, it belongs to whoever can forceablly take and control it ( the land and property ect). 

 

Now some comments and questions of my own 

• Why does cecilia wield so much power. Is she not a maid/ care taker/ governess type who is simply employed by Tom. Couldn't tom just tell her to release or kill the zombies. 
• I hate Chris and Maddy. Chris's face irks me, like some goofy emo punk kid trying to act hard wearing skinny jeans. I'll smash your punk face in. Maddy has no qualities to make her a good leader. She's not charismatic, strategic, or a baddazz killing machine. I would not follow her. 
• The compound is actually a good set up. That wall that surrounds the compound looks sturdy and there plenty of farm animals and land to sustain the survivors. Furthermore there probably a low population in that area thus nit many zombies to kill.

[spiderpig]

14 hours ago, econ07 said:

As one of the few defenders of this show, that was a whole bowl of nothing.

Will have to watch again as I had no idea what was going on.

[piequinn35]

Is this Greene Family Farm 2.0?

[candall]

1 hour ago, riverheightsnancy said:

I get that they are including some of the differences in cultural views regarding the "dead" which could be a very interesting angle, if if weren't so similar to the farm and they didn't build it up enough to a grand reveal. It would have been better for Daniel to look at the coin and show some concern of recognition and then pocket it but not give it to Cecilia, until he figured it out. Since he is from South America he might be more aware of the differences in the religious and cultural views of the Mexican camp, but it would be better to let the discoveries happen more organically.

Great instinct, wrong show.  I think they've dropped enough breadcrumbs to capitalize on an interesting philosophy about death that's different from the Protestant/American one and would swerve far enough away from Herschel's "I'm workin' on a cure for my wife" position.  Take Dia de los Muertos and the superstition that owls represent imminent death and witchcraft.  (I read on another site that Celia's skirt had owls, but I don't see it myself.)  Throw in something Catholic about the Latin episode title, let Salazar be the only one with the background to piece it all together and we're going places.

Except, pffft, that would be so deep and ambitious when this show has a whole history of spatter and run.

30 minutes ago, diebartdie said:

I missed it too! I was so confused by the relationship between Celia and Thomas, I thought she was his Housekeeper. If she adopted him as a boy, why did he have an Irish accent while she had a Spanish one?

I remember a scene where Thomas talked about his parents and that his family had hired Celia.  I think they needed an older-looking actress, since there was some speculation that she was being flirtatious with Nick instead of maternal.  Although she still had to be young enough to have had Luis, because he was much younger than Thomas.  Wasn't he??

I'm probably missing something crucial because that's how I am with this show, but Celia is definitely the housekeeper.

***********

I had to hear again last night that Kim Dickens features herself the Rick.  Please stop with that, it's embarrassing.

[TattleTeeny]

OK, I am confused and hopefully someone can help me (I apologize if this is a dumb question): The church massacre--how long ago was that supposed to have happened? Was it earlier on the same day that Strand & Co. arrived? Also, why would Celia not want to preserve Thomas in the wine cellar with the others?

Also, has this only been a few weeks into the Z.A.? It feels like they were trapped in their own neighborhood under military supervision for at least a week or two in season 1. 

I don't know if it was an accident or what, but it was adorable when Strand's voice changed a little when he got there and yelled "Thomas?"

Quote

Thanks for the subtitles Asshats. I really didnt want to have to pay that close attention to this cluster.

Thanks for nothin'! It would be great if this show would stop featuring subtitles in a white font over white things behind them.

Edited May 16, 2016 by TattleTeeny

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

Fear The Walking Dead's Recycling Program Hits A Snag

Someone's stashing zombies en masse instead of killing them? That sounds awfully familiar!