Current Plots Discussion: Actually Today's Episode

[JBC344]

5 hours ago, CanaryFan98 said:

Yes that I believe I mean on screen why are Kate/Marlena friends at one time Kate called Belle a bitch, moved into her penthouse and banged John for months....

Its like Nicole/Chloe being BFFs despite all the terrible things Nicole has done to her namely the flesh eating bacteria all because the actresses sell it despite the character history not supporting such a friendship.

Well to be fair Marlena did get pregnant by Kate's husband, but I digress.

I actually really love both friendships. With Kate and Marlena a lot of their friendship is based on the past, becoming genuine friends when both women were barely out of their teens. Their lives have taken completely different turns but I like that they always remain friends.

With Chloe and Nicole, I liked that both women sort of met each other in the "middle" of being their respective labels (good girl, villian) and formed a genuine friendship. Once you took Brady as a love interest out of the equation there wasn't a huge reason (by soap standards) to continue hating one another. 

I also just really enjoy seeing friendships depicted on the show. For me not every pairing needs to be romantic to be interesting. 

[nilyank]

1 hour ago, JBC344 said:

I actually really love both friendships. With Kate and Marlena a lot of their friendship is based on the past, becoming genuine friends when both women were barely out of their teens. Their lives have taken completely different turns but I like that they always remain friends.

I would say way past their teens as Marlena was initially treating Kate as her doctor around the time she was fooling around with Bill and getting pregnant with. Lucas.

[Petunia13]

8 hours ago, CanaryFan98 said:

Yes that I believe I mean on screen why are Kate/Marlena friends at one time Kate called Belle a bitch, moved into her penthouse and banged John for months....

Its like Nicole/Chloe being BFFs despite all the terrible things Nicole has done to her namely the flesh eating bacteria all because the actresses sell it despite the character history not supporting such a friendship.

The same way Marlena has forgiven and brush off Ben strangling to death her favorite grandchild and Kate has tried to murder Sami and they are close friends now? 

Also there’s few women in Marlena’s age or it to kick it w and they both have their sons w their daughters and share grandchildren so have to be civil. 

[Lastwaltz]

Awwww. Roman and Kayla learning about Caroline's death reminded me so much of the day my dear mother died 7 years ago. I had to make 6 calls like that to my siblings and each one went pretty much like this one. Sigh. 

[JBC344]

2 hours ago, nilyank said:

I would say way past their teens as Marlena was initially treating Kate as her doctor around the time she was fooling around with Bill and getting pregnant with. Lucas.

A slight exaggeration on my part. My understanding was that Marlena was still a resident when she was treating/becoming friends with Kate, which sort of leads credence to a "green" Marlena becoming best friends with a patient. 

Also merging her with Kate Winagred, the implication being she met Bill because she was always at the hospital either being treated by Marlena or socially meeting Marlena. 

But yeah, they were probably 23-25 when they met. 

[Apprentice79]

13 hours ago, CanaryFan98 said:

I find it rather unrealistic those two are friends but the actresses make it work.

I understand what you mean because of all the things that Kate did to Sami.  Sami for all her flaws never tried to kill Kate. Whereas Kate tried to kill Sami several times.  If Marlena can become Ben's defender despite him trying to kill Will, then, I can live with Marlena and Kate being friends.

Edited June 20, 2019 by Apprentice79

[lb60]

I really enjoyed that 20 minute Breaking News report right in the middle of today's show.

#sarcasm

NBC10 out of Philly is THE WORST!!

[TigerLynx]

I liked seeing all the Bradys together, and getting an explanation for most of those who weren't there.  It was nice seeing Sami and Carrie getting along, and Sami, Carrie, and Eric being siblings.

I wish we had gotten more flashbacks.

Ciara and Claire maybe causing some problems, but they aren't nearly as entertaining as Sami was.

Edited June 20, 2019 by TigerLynx

[CanaryFan98]

13 hours ago, JBC344 said:

Well to be fair Marlena did get pregnant by Kate's husband, but I digress.

I actually really love both friendships. With Kate and Marlena a lot of their friendship is based on the past, becoming genuine friends when both women were barely out of their teens. Their lives have taken completely different turns but I like that they always remain friends.

With Chloe and Nicole, I liked that both women sort of met each other in the "middle" of being their respective labels (good girl, villian) and formed a genuine friendship. Once you took Brady as a love interest out of the equation there wasn't a huge reason (by soap standards) to continue hating one another. 

I also just really enjoy seeing friendships depicted on the show. For me not every pairing needs to be romantic to be interesting. 

I love friendships too in fact I prefer them to most pairings but its the glossing over of the history I don't really care for. I mean Bo/Steve had their issues but they got past them and it was never glossed over. 

For Nicole/Chloe it wasn't just Brady there was Deimos and Daniel too. They also shared Lucas but at different points in time.

[CanaryFan98]

Sami was a better developed character than Ciara/Claire could dream of being. That being said I was surprised at how much I didn't dislike Ciara today see what getting her away from Ben and putting her in her family orbit does to a character... I know its short lived though.

I thought the Victor/Hope and Victor/Kayla scenes were the best. I wish we had more flashbacks but that could be a budget issue which I find a shame. I did like the scene at the end w/ Shawn/Caroline looking in on their family.

Today's show had a heart and soul reminded me of the good old "Days" where it was about family and character driven stories... It annoys me more that they are capable of this and choose not to be. Tomorrow it will be back to the crapfast its been for quite sometime now.

[Irlandesa]

I ended up fast forwarding through most of today.  Maybe that was a mistake but it was irritating a show memorializing a character with so many great connections was lacking in so many flashbacks.  Talking about how great she was got boring.

Are there residuals on actors in clips or something?  Even if they had to use clips from people who are currently on the show, they could have come up with something decent. 

[WendyCR72]

43 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

Are there residuals on actors in clips or something?

Short answer: Yes.

Long answer: Yes, but the show has no money, so...no flashbacks.

[Irlandesa]

1 minute ago, WendyCR72 said:

Long answer: Yes, but the show has no money, so...no flashbacks.

How expensive could the residuals be on 30 year old clips? The 80s wasn't big into residuals unless soaps were ahead of the game. They decrease over time.  There's always the 1 cent check joke of actors who get really old residuals.

[Frozendiva]

I was also bored with a lot of today's show. I only enjoyed the Kayla/Victor and Hope/Victor scenes. It was nice to see an old photo of Victor and Caroline. Surely the Bradys could have had Kimberly and other family members Skype in or do Facetime or whatever.

[WendyCR72]

4 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

How expensive could the residuals be on 30 year old clips? The 80s wasn't big into residuals unless soaps were ahead of the game. They decrease over time.  There's always the 1 cent check joke of actors who get really old residuals.

True, but consider, this is a show that "killed" its marquee actors in that New Salem debacle (which was supposed to stick!) because it wanted to slash the budget. So it does not surprise me that those behind the scenes are still pinching every penny.

ETA: And I think the decreased revenue is dependent on how many times something is shown. So if the clips they wanted to use were rare or whatever/not shown often [especially since soaps never repeat] - the payouts could be substantial, depending on how many former actors are involved.

At least, I have read this is how it works for TV reruns. The first few cycles of a show airing, the big royalties come. After so many cycles/years, that is when it gets to pennies.

[A.J.]

14 hours ago, Apprentice79 said:

Whereas Kate tried to kill Sami several times.  

I either forgot this or this happened during a time I was not watching.  

They are definitely cool now.  Which makes me wonder why she forgave Kate but Nicole remains public enemy #1.  After E.J. died the two ladies shared a very moving moment.  However the next time they were together, Sami was back to hating Nicole.  

[BoldDays]

So my commentary to today’s memorial show is ridiculously shallow given the circumstances but WTF was that jacket Hope was wearing?!?

Edited June 21, 2019 by BoldDays

[JBC344]

1 hour ago, A.J. said:

I either forgot this or this happened during a time I was not watching.  

They are definitely cool now.  Which makes me wonder why she forgave Kate but Nicole remains public enemy #1.  After E.J. died the two ladies shared a very moving moment.  However the next time they were together, Sami was back to hating Nicole.  

I think because Nicole at the time was going through drama with Eric that Sami's grudge resurfaced.

If she came back to Salem and Nicole was a single mom raising Holly I think Sami would of been more civil. 

It's unfortunate since they have such a great history. If Chloe and Nicole can become friends, surely Sami and Nicole can bury the hatchet. 

Really loved the joint message from Frankie and Max. Would it of killed the writers to include a message from Chelsea especially since she and Max are together in London.

I second bringing Frankie back. I loved him with Jennifer the last time around and he is probably the only person who could appeal to Eve's humanity moving forward. 

[BoldDays]

10 minutes ago, BoldDays said:

Edited June 21, 2019 by BoldDays
Double post

[boes]

14 minutes ago, BoldDays said:

So my commentary to today’s memorial show is ridiculously shallow given the circumstances but WTF was that jacket Hope was wearing?!?

I thought the same thing.

She looked like a senior instructor at Clown College.

[buffynut]

I hate to be so negative about a memorial, but I can't help it. With decades of history, I really wanted to see some flashbacks of Caroline and her family. If film flashbacks are too expensive, then just have a couple posters of pictures of the characters, and simply pan over to it, after each character's "speech".

And I have to nitpick the speeches too.  Other than John, did any of those character's "memories" happen onscreen?  Surely they could have dredged up something, even recent for the recasts, that we viewers would remember. 

The best scenes didn't even take place at the pub, but with Victor/Kayla and Victor/Hope.  

I guess my expectations/wishes were just higher, as usual, than what the show can produce. 🙁

[Vixenstud]

10 hours ago, Frozendiva said:

Surely the Bradys could have had Kimberly and other family members Skype in or do Facetime or whatever.

SEE?!  Good to know I wasn't the only fucking one that thought it.

[Sandman]

4 hours ago, buffynut said:

And I have to nitpick the speeches too.  Other than John, did any of those character's "memories" happen onscreen?  Surely they could have dredged up something, even recent for the recasts, that we viewers would remember. 

I thought the oddest thing was Kayla's speech -- maybe it's just that I've forgotten whatever convolution of the storyline led to Caroline's taking a murder rap for Kay, but when Kayla just dropped that little nugget into her story it was really a "Wait -- whaat?" moment, at least for me. It's not like her family is really going to need context for an experience like that (or would they? Was everyone present at the wake even alive at that time?) but it just didn't feel like something that would actually be brought up in a memorial to show that Ma was a tough cookie.

I did like Jawn's story about Caroline's refusal to consider him anything other than family -- but a lot of the reminiscences, including Marlena's, seemed kind of … generic. There had to have been more to Caroline than "Generous But Feisty Old Lady." I liked Sami's, because it seemed both loving and honest. (I liked Sami's scene where she tells Will that she believes his great-grandmother sent him home to his family. :ssniff::)

And no one but Victor and Hope even mentions Bo? Seriously? I did like their scene together at the Kiriakis Pile. (It's the most I've liked Hope in quite a while. Every time I think about Hope and Ted (Ted, of all people!) I just think "Uh, nope!) I liked how Hope didn't let Victor's reflexive thorniness prevent her from offering him comfort -- or seeking it -- after all these years. And I also liked that his rebarbative nature wasn't entirely softened, even so. It felt true to the character of both. 

And Caroline, they kept telling us, was "a woman of deep faith," clearly observant enough as a Catholic to give her granddaughter a favourite rosary, but she doesn't have a funeral mass, just a wake? Sorry, I just don't see that happening.

Edited June 21, 2019 by Sandman

[Lastwaltz]

Well, I thought it was hard for me to cry these days, but that last scene of Caroline and Shawn arm in arm at the window did me in. Was thinking about my own parents again, of course. The thought of them together again was truly a comfort to us. But please, show, make that be it. 

And yes, for god's sake, what was that sparkly jacket Hope was wearing to a wake? At first I thought she was dressed up for a date with Ted (eye roll), but that jacket has no place outside a disco. and even then, who wears a jacket to a disco? Or club, if you want to be 21st century about it. Ugh, anyway, onward and upward, and rest in peace, Peggy McKay. 

[Sandman]

Also, it's only occurring to me now, but it's weird that Rex is … what, not Will's double cousin, but his uncle twice over, or something? As the son of his maternal grandfather and his paternal grandmother, right? Which means Sami and Lucas have a half-brother in common.

And I'm the last one to figure this out, right? Eurggh.  

[Lastwaltz]

29 minutes ago, Sandman said:

Also, it's only occurring to me now, but it's weird that Rex is … what, not Will's double cousin, but his uncle twice over, or something? As the son of his maternal grandfather and his paternal grandmother, right? Which means Sami and Lucas have a half-brother in common.

And I'm the last one to figure this out, right? Eurggh.  

LOL, we shouldn't have to think this hard :)

[Apprentice79]

3 hours ago, buffynut said:

I hate to be so negative about a memorial, but I can't help it. With decades of history, I really wanted to see some flashbacks of Caroline and her family. If film flashbacks are too expensive, then just have a couple posters of pictures of the characters, and simply pan over to it, after each character's "speech".

And I have to nitpick the speeches too.  Other than John, did any of those character's "memories" happen onscreen?  Surely they could have dredged up something, even recent for the recasts, that we viewers would remember. 

The best scenes didn't even take place at the pub, but with Victor/Kayla and Victor/Hope.  

I guess my expectations/wishes were just higher, as usual, than what the show can produce. 🙁

I love your post and it was why I did not comment on the episode.  I was disappointed with the funeral. Only John's memory of Caroline was actually shown on the show.  However, It was Papa Shawn who noticed that John was avoiding the family after Roman came back and he with Caroline's support told John that  he and Brady were still their son and grandson. Kim, Kayla and Bo also told John at different moments on the show that he was still their brother, full stop. 

I wish that they had shown flashbacks with Caroline with all of her kids and grandkids, even if the roles are recast today.  Ken Corday could have open up the checkbook to do that in honor of Caroline who was such an important person to the Brady family.  I wish we had gotten dialogue that Caroline was with Bo and Zack as well.  

Kayla/Victor was very moving and typical of Kayla who has always been generous to a fault. Kim would not have been that kind to Victor. She despised him and never let him forgot that. At her dad's funeral she was a total bitch to him and I loved it.  I always believed that while Victor loved Caroline, he loved power and money more. It is why in the long run he and Caroline would not have worked.  Caroline knew this and kept Bo's paternity a secret because Shawn was the better father for all of her kids, despite his flaws.  Shawn sacrificing his life for Bo was proof that Caroline made the right decision.

Edited June 21, 2019 by Apprentice79

[boes]

I also was expecting a lot more from the memorial episode than we got.  I couldn't help but compare it to Alice's memorial - is it really that long ago?  I don't for one second begrudge Alice her memorial, with all the character returns and the time spent on it, but I was expecting something along those lines for Caroline.  I knew it couldn't be as rich but surely more than we ended up getting......

There were moments yesterday, ones you've all mentioned - Kayla with Victor, Hope with Victor, and some of the speeches at the Pub, and combined with how beautifully Roman and Kayla reacted the day before, that struck the right emotional note.  But overall, it was a pretty shit sendoff for both the fictional matriarch of a long term anchor family and for a long time cast member.  

They don't make 'em like that anymore.

ETA - yeah, what's up with that "there won't be a funeral" nonsense?  Caroline will certainly be interred next to Shawn, there will undoubtedly be a mass, so ????  Was that Show's way to telling the audience, "THIS IS IT and don't expect more"?

[Sandman]

1 hour ago, Lastwaltz said:

LOL, we shouldn't have to think this hard :)

Especially about something this potentially creepy.

ETA: It was awfully nice to see Christie Clarke yesterday, and to see the twins and Carrie with their arms around each other. Somehow I didn't expect to see Sami and Carrie treat each other with such genuine sisterly affection -- I will say "Well done, show," at least about that.

Yes, boes, I'd say that's exactly how we're supposed to understand it -- exactly.

Edited June 21, 2019 by Sandman

[Apprentice79]

28 minutes ago, Sandman said:

ETA: It was awfully nice to see Christie Clarke yesterday, and to see the twins and Carrie with their arms around each other. Somehow I didn't expect to see Sami and Carrie treat each other with such genuine sisterly affection -- I will say "Well done, show," at least about that.

The last time we saw Carrie embracing the twins was when they were all kids with Rojohn as their dad.. Carrie embracing Jarlena was a highlight for me.. So much history between them.

Edited June 21, 2019 by Apprentice79

[Sandman]

On ‎6‎/‎19‎/‎2019 at 10:25 PM, boes said:

But then again, Ciara appalls me on a regular basis and considering what a moob Tripp is, he really should be Eric's kid, not Steve's.  

Backpedalling a bit (hey! Kinda like a flashback to that thing that just happened in the same episode!) to say this is still making me laugh. "MoobTripp," it is! (I want to like the kid, somehow, I think, but his every storyline just feels like a chore to me.)

Speaking of things about MoobTripp that make me scratch my head, since when are he and Kayla exchanging "I love you"s? I get that Kayla is the soul of generosity, but, hey, really? REALLY, show?

[QueenSerena]

🤐

[howmanywords]

See, thats what I was trying to convey up thread. As much as I would like to blame Ron for everything some things are out of his hands.Even the idea of video conference for Kim and/or multiple people.  The actors would still have to be paid for a certain amount of time. These things consume time and money and its pretty obvious they are barely getting by with what they do have to work with.

[DisneyBoy]

39 minutes ago, QueenSerena said:

🤐

I'm sorry...but what?

I get that the head writer doesn't control everything, but this was an important freaking episode. I don't even know half of Caroline's storylines on the show and was really hoping to see as much of her time on DAYS as possible. If you want to squeeze in a lot of flashbacks, you just don't have the characters on screen saying too much. If you write less dialogue, then there's more time for flashbacks. It seems like a pretty simple mathematical equation to me. Either that, or you write the dialogue so that it leads into the flashbacks and there's no way to cut around it.

I wonder if there are rights issues or legal problems when it comes to the flashbacks. Is it that they have to be digitally processed first? I suspect since none of the older episodes are on some official streaming service, that they're probably still on VHS in the archives. Was it a matter of time and money? Would pulling out certain episodes require digitally processing them and then also paying a special fee to the estate of Peggy?

I don't know. I'm just annoyed.

[Silver Raven]

4 hours ago, Sandman said:

Also, it's only occurring to me now, but it's weird that Rex is … what, not Will's double cousin, but his uncle twice over, or something? As the son of his maternal grandfather and his paternal grandmother, right? Which means Sami and Lucas have a half-brother in common.

And I'm the last one to figure this out, right? Eurggh.  

The same way in which JJ and Abigail are cousins to both Sonny and Will.

[kitmerlot1213]

There should have been more to Caroline's memorial service but what we got was lovely and today's episode did a nice follow through with Eric and Sami drinking to their grandma--that was nice.

What is not nice is Ciara and Tripp's beyond lame master plan to get Claire to confess.  Tripp and Ciara deciding to set Claire up by having Tripp break up with her so he can get back together with Ciara is shocking in how dangerously dumb it is.  They know that Claire is already unhinged enough to start two fires in order to kill both Ciara and Tripp, so they decide to make themselves easier targets?

But it's okay because at the end of the day, Ben will be vindicated as a hero and his and Ciara's epic love story can continue--their happiness is all that matters, right Show?

[TigerLynx]

Sami, I love you, but it's one step forward and two steps back.  Could you have been a little less gleeful about Eric not being with Nicole?

ETA:  I hope Sami gets into a physical fight with Nicole/Kristen, and rips her mask off.

Edited June 21, 2019 by TigerLynx

[CountryGirl]

Like many others, I was very disappointed with the lack of flashbacks as well as characters who are actually ON the show who didn't show up for the wake (Jennifer, who was once engaged to Caroline and Shawn's adopted son, Frankie) was a glaring omission. If it was just family, then Abe wouldn't have been there. 

Peggy and Caroline certainly deserved better as did her fans.

I will say that I enjoyed seeing Christie Clark/Carrie again and I loved seeing her and Drake/John interact. It's clear those two will always be close - on and offscreen.

I normally detest Hope but I liked her reaching out to Victor and they were very sweet together. And when Victor said, in the room alone, that he loves Maggie but Caroline would was and always would be the love of his life, I actually shouted out loud: "I KNEW IT!" And while she loved Shawn more, I believe Caroline always loved Victor as well.

I found this tribute to them on YT: 

And that final flashback of Shawn and Caroline broke my heart as did the sight of them, reunited at last, looking in the window at their loved ones.

[Guest]

I wish Days have a big budget so they can afford a proper memorial service for Caroline with more flashbacks.

[Lastwaltz]

Aww, that was a lovely tribute @CountryGirl, thanks for finding it. (See, show? Apparently it's not impossible to find a few good clips on YT after all). 

The song -- Until it's Time for You to Go -- stirred up even more nostalgia for me. It's such a 70s-esque song, lol, but it was on an Elvis Presley record that I played to death when I was in 8th grade. Damn you, show, you're killing me this week. 

[DaphneCat]

Like the rest of you, I was very disappointed by the lack of flashbacks.  Spending a few extra dollars would have been well justified to satisfy the many long time viewers of DOL.

Back to today.  So Ben has simply been sitting in the same room for 2(?) days now?  I get they don't have money for sets but at least have Eve bring him in for some reason.  And now, they can't even afford to buy the guy a jumpsuit?  Let's a least try a little show!

Yes, NOTHING could POSSIBLY go wrong with Tripp and Ciara's plan.  Ciara says she'll be careful but what does that even mean?  How about enlisting JJ's help and have him in the background as back-up?  I know they don't want to spill the plan to Marlena, but how about giving her a heads up her granddaughter is batshit crazy and seeing if she could intervene in some way?  All they have to do is tell her Ben recognized the ring tone and let Marlena figure it out from there.

[Sandman]

35 minutes ago, TigerLynx said:

ETA:  I hope Sami gets into a physical fight with Nicole/Kristen, and rips her mask off.

Mask, hell! Off with her head.

[WendyCR72]

31 minutes ago, Sandman said:

Mask, hell! Off with her head.

Won't argue there. Kristen passed her "Sell By" date long ago.

[JBC344]

5 hours ago, Sandman said:

Also, it's only occurring to me now, but it's weird that Rex is … what, not Will's double cousin, but his uncle twice over, or something? As the son of his maternal grandfather and his paternal grandmother, right? Which means Sami and Lucas have a half-brother in common.

And I'm the last one to figure this out, right? Eurggh.  

Yeah, Rex and Cassie are double aunt/uncle to Will, Ally, and Noah.  Also they are aunt/uncle and cousin to Chelsea.

What surprised me most of that scene was Sami being the one to mention Rex.  Maybe because he just had a huge hand in saving Will, but back in the day Sami wasn't always so fond of her new twin siblings. Anyway it was nice to have her be the one to ask about him.

The memorial stories were all pretty generic except for a few but one thing about Marlena's that I liked was her mentioning Caroline's penchant and love of strip clubs.  That was a nice "recent" memory of the character that they actually could of flashbacked too.

Really loved Abe's story, it was something specific and totally in tune to who the character was.

When Carrie was speaking I was surprised that she didn't mention being Caroline's namesake along with her words of how Caroline was an example to follow.

Considering that we got a message from Frankie and Max, I was very disappointed that Abe didn't deliver a message from Celeste.  We know she is with Theo in Africa but a few words from Caroline's best friend would of been nice.  Even a little something of Caroline never giving up on her, refusing to call her Celeste initially, because she wanted to hold onto the part of her that was Frankie, her best friend who disappeared.

[Silver Raven]

6 minutes ago, JBC344 said:

Considering that we got a message from Frankie and Max, I was very disappointed that Abe didn't deliver a message from Celeste. 

When they mentioned Frankie and Max, I was wishing that they would come back, Frankie pick back up with Jennifer (and maybe be another thing for Eve to get pissy about), and Jennifer can tell Jack to f off.

[CountryGirl]

I found a few other Caroline clips on YT:

No one put Victor in his place quite like Caroline.

[howmanywords]

I guess a lot has changed since 2016 with cheapass Sony but when Bo died, man they gave fans something amazing. I know the budget was shit back then too because I remember all the jokes about how they must of broke the bank for getting the rights to use Bo and Hope's song.  They delivered a standalone episode of Bo's ghost visiting Hope, flashbacks (ancient flashbacks so yes they are available, even actors from the past. I get this time around the situation is probably worse but even if 9 flashbacks was too much IMO they could have made a brief montage, anything. I'm blaming the producers and editors for this omission.

[Swartz]

Not even a mention of Kayla's kids.  

I wasn't a big fan of the ep. There were some sweet moments but overall I didn't feel much.   I swear the show isn't even trying anymore. 

[peachmangosteen]

It's been said but should be repeated, Ciara and Tripp are fucking stupid. Ugh, Claire, just kill them already! And yea, the fact that this is obviously all just so Ben can play hero and save Ciara again makes the whole thing rage inducing.

I think this is quite the UO but I love Eve. She hates all the same characters I do lol.

Xander's, "I don't wanna kill someone," puppy face can go. They're already skirting the line of woobifying him and I am just waiting for them to cross it in spectacularly annoying fashion.

[Sandman]

2 hours ago, JBC344 said:

When Carrie was speaking I was surprised that she didn't mention being Caroline's namesake ...

It strikes me as entirely possible that the writers have forgotten this detail.