S04.E04: Like Father, Like Daughter

[Oblique Angle]

I don't know which made me roll my eyes more- that Olivia actually told Fitz she ran away alone or that he turned every conversation about his daughter into being all about getting back into her pants. You would think watching his teenage daughter's sex tape would dampen his libido for at least a day or two. Then saying everyone agreed he was a failure as a husband while he stepped right up in Olivia's personal space so she could show him he wasn't a failure as a man too was disgusting

All this. He's the First Father and Leader of the Free World but with him everything always comes back to his peen seeking out Olivia like due north.

 

[whispers] I ... totally already knew what the Eiffel Tower position is.

Yep, and The Bold and the Beautiful went there a couple of months ago (as an allusion; no three-way sex scenes--yet). If daytime soaps are already on it then Scandal is late to the party. Sorry, Shonda.

 

Joe Morton's weekly bloviating, scenery chewing speeches are tiresome. He needs to go. I'm done with Papa Pope eating the entire show every week.

Thank you. He just got his "you're about due for one" Emmy; are they seriously trying to get him another one with the same old routine? I'm gonna need to see Papa Pope completely destroyed, broken down with sadness and regret over how badly his actions have affected Olivia's life in ways she doesn't even--and may never--entirely realize.

[Racj82]

Could one guy on this show who has interest in Olivia not try to use sex to get what they want. It's actually kind of funny writing that out because many many female characters on tv past and present have used sex as a tool or are a lazy piece of sexual obsession for another male. But, dammit, I'm over Fitz and Jake using sex to get into her mind. Even more than that, I'm tired of Olivia going weak for it. It's past the point where I think it's sexy. Jake talking about what he makes her do physically in bed and Fitz putting her hand down her dress instead of having a real conversation is getting really fucking old.

 

On another note, who the hell is Fitz to be asking any questions about why or where Olivia was. Until he leaves his wife, there are no questions he can ask that are justified. Kick rocks man,

 

I did enjoy the episode but I found everything about the Fitz/Olivia scene infuriating.

[Spartan Girl]

It didn't take Fitz long to go back to being a crappy husband once Liv was in the building.

 

 

Letting Mellie do whatever she wants regardless of it causing her to embarrassment herself doesn't make him a better husband, IMO.

 

"I'm failing as a father, husband, and man."  Oh Fitz, that ship sailed a looooooooooooooooong time ago.

 

During his self-righteous rant to Mellie, I tried to imagine her bashing his brains out with one of the desk ornaments.  When he was pawing Liv in the Oval Office I fantasized about her kneeing him in the groin.  While either one of those things would be awesome, they still wouldn't be enough to satisfy me at this point.  And you can tell he's just happy to have some reason to lock Jake up.

 

Olivia calling out those bastards was phenomenal, but when she got to the part about them "having everything yet wanting more," I was thinking to myself, "That's exactly the kind of person Fitz is!"  Yet she will never ever call him on it.

[reggiejax]

I really wish Tom had answered "you gave the order, sir". I know he thinks that Papa Pope has him behind the 8 ball, but so what? I highly doubt implicating Jake is going to do anything different for Tom than implicating Rowan. Tom is going down, and rightfully so. Let's not forget, he straight up murdered a kid. But if he's going down, the least he can do is try and take everyone with him. After all, Rowan's B12 schemes work because they are done in secret. But there is no secret here, there is a lot of light on the situation, he can't really hide behind "plausible deniability" or whatever passes for that in the Scandalverse.

 

Also, can someone remind me why exactly Rowan had little Fitz killed? That all happened so fast last season, and there was so much ridiculousness to wade through, I never really understood why that happened.

[Dowel Jones]

Even allowing for the pledge of secrecy and discretion that is required of White House staffers, it probably wasn't the wisest of choices for Mellie and Fitz to have their blowout argument in the Oval Office.  Granted, Bill and Hillary had the same arguments, but I think that was after the Monica scandal broke.  Here they are trying desperately to keep it under wraps, yet shouting about it at the top of their voices. What happens if one of those staffers whispers about it, even to a "trusted" friend?

[janeta]

"I'm failing as a father, husband, and man."  Oh Fitz, that ship sailed a looooooooooooooooong time ago.

 

 

 

He failed as a husband as soon as he took a mistress.  I mean, I'm just sayin'.... ;-)

[Primetimer]

Fitz's daughter gets involved in a potential sex tape scandal, and Olivia has to nip it in the bud. Meanwhile, Jake thinks he might finally have the chance to nail Rowan to the wall, so that should totally work out.

Read the story

[Almost 3000]

Yep. I loved "y'all don't know who you're fucking with" Liv. There was a beat before she went off, when the parents wanted to make it an even $3M, where she gave them a look like "The fuck did you say?" and then started kicking ass and taking names. I loved it.

I commented on social media that Karen was taking after her father (I didn't know what the ep was called) so I was delighted to hear Mellie call that out.

[whispers] I ... totally already knew what the Eiffel Tower position is.

Ha! I just went to Urban Dictionary and one of the comments was, "You know it's a good episode of scandal when you have to urban dictionary a term."

[Artsda]

I'm so so over B613 and Olivia's father and Jake.  I hope Jake does die, he deserves it. He threatened to kill David in this same episode. He may not have given this specific order to kill Jerry, but he still killed others and never paid for it. Cyrus is still grieving and their daughter is stuck with Cyrus as a parent only. That kid has no hope now.

 

Jake is no innocent man, he shot James. He killed James. Let Fitz kill him and be over with this.

 

Liked Cyrus going off on Abby and Fitz going off on Mellie.  The tough love was deserved, she can't be drunk in Uggs all day and then play the good parent card. 

Edited October 17, 2014 by Artsda

[Adeejay]

I can't get over Olivia saying that reality television stars are the "lowest form of life."  Ouch!  Guess Kim K won't be guest starring on any of Shondaland's Production. 

Edited October 17, 2014 by Adeejay

[jjj]

While I understood that they wanted the cell phone access shut down at the party, it still did not stop anyone from snapping photos that could be Instagrammed as soon as the partiers stepped outside.  Was that just to buy five extra minutes?  And no reference to pictures in the Twitterverse later? 

 

their daughter is stuck with Cyrus as a parent only.

Really?  In the sense that have we seen or heard anything about this child in the season yet?  I have an image of her with a box of Cheerios in an empty house, waiting for Cyrus to show up. 

[politichick]

I think that Fitz going off on Smelly Mellie was a wake up call for her. Given her behavior these past months he had no way of knowing how she would react and they needed to do some quick damage control. And he also acknowledged that he's been no prize parent either. Like someone else said, I think the old Mellie will be making a comeback soon. I also liked her talk with Karen.

 

As for Papa Pope: Can someone please kill him soon? He eats up the show. The writers need to act like B613 never existed and make Olivia an orphan. Jake can go, too. If Olivia really knew him and how easily he becomes dangerous, she would not be doing this pretend boyfriend/girlfriend thing.

 

Hate me, but I still love Olitz.

 

Urban Dictionaried the Eiffel Tower thing. OMG. 

[marceline]

I can't get over Olivia saying that reality television stars are the "lowest form of life."  Ouch!  Guess Kim K won't be guest starring on any of Shondaland's Production. 

 

I loved that because it's pretty much how I feel.

 

I liked Mellie's convo with Karen. Not the "high five" part but the "If you tell me that you did this because you felt empowered or turned on, then I will try to be happy for you even though I'm having a little seizure inside." I thought that was a very nice way of letting Karen know that she is loved and supported and still letting her know that she is responsible for the choices she makes.

 

The moment Olitz moved back into couple mode I opened my laptop and did a little banking. I just don't care about them.

 

I'm calling it now: Tom is a dead man. 

[Julia]

The tough love was deserved, she can't be drunk in Uggs all day and then play the good parent card.

She can, though, play the only good parent the older children ever knew card, and I'm guessing once he quit using him to get Olivia's attention Baby Teddy doesn't get a whole lot of POTUS time either.

[BeaVee]

 

Also, can someone remind me why exactly Rowan had little Fitz killed?

 

Because during one of Fitz's "I'm a real boy" speeches he told Liv's father what she tastes like.  Fitz is all class. 

[DearEvette]

She can, though, play the only good parent the older children ever knew card, and I'm guessing once he quit using him to get Olivia's attention Baby Teddy doesn't get a whole lot of POTUS time either.

 

 

But can she really?  The kids were mentioned and rarely seen in earlier seasons.  They were trotted out as plot points for  the very unsatisfactory re-election plot last season.  The fact is, canon just does not support either Mellie or Fitz being good parents because the kids on the show have just been there as phantoms, not real people.  This is why I have such a problem connecting with Mellie's overwrought and damn near comical grief.  The writing simply did not provide a strong enough foundation to get to this point for me.

 

And Baby Teddy fares no better either.  At least with the older kids the excuse was they were away at boarding school.  But Teddy was a child conceived out of political expediency, a birth that was induced early against medical advice in order to stay in the White House and promptly handed over to nannies once he served his purpose. 

 

In my book Fitz and Mellie are both terrible assholes.  Fitz' jealousy of Jake is blinding him to some pretty obvious shenanigans.  While Mellie's jealousy of Olivia is blinding her to the fact that Liv's resources and expertise  is what  basically kept their daughter's shit from being put on blast. Meanwhile both of them conveniently forgetting how culpable they are in their own mess.  Fitz is the one who had Jake spy on Olivia in the first place.  Meanwhile, Olivia had completely distanced herself from the White House until Mellie invited her back because Fitz wasn't sleeping well without his bae.

 

Let's face it, The Grant family is rather ratchet

[marcee]

Was anyone else squicked out when Fitz starting macking on Olivia? It was just so skeevy to me. Kind of like "You know you want it..." *unbutton unbutton* "Stop protesting just kiss me..." *caress hip* I was really disgusted with that scene.

As a side note, other than plot device, there's no logical reason Tom wouldn't rat out Rowan right then and there. And the multiple 'near-misses' of Jake telling Liv and/or Fitz was just so over-the-top stupid. All it would have taken for Liv would've been, "It's about your dad." All it would have taken for Fitz is, "It's about Olivia."

Edited October 17, 2014 by marcee

[jjj]

All it would have taken for Liv would've been, "It's about your dad." All it would have taken for Fitz is, "It's about Olivia."

Totally agree about the first sentence -- although, why did Jake wait (a day, several days?) to introduce this topic to Liv?  About the second sentence, no way would Fitz talk to Jake at that point, *especially* about Olivia,  except to punch out Jake -- although Jake did not know that Olivia told Fitz that Jake/Olivia spent two months on a beach.  (When you write this stuff out, it reads like a "Friends" episode.)

 

What did Jake see under his car?  And did his car remote set off the bomb?  That's not very effective, as most of us click before we are right next to the car.  In fact, I'll be clicking from about thirty feet from now on. (!) 

[Catherinewriter]

Whose car did Jake blow up? And why?

[Chicago Redshirt]

I really wish Tom had answered "you gave the order, sir". I know he thinks that Papa Pope has him behind the 8 ball, but so what? I highly doubt implicating Jake is going to do anything different for Tom than implicating Rowan. Tom is going down, and rightfully so. Let's not forget, he straight up murdered a kid. But if he's going down, the least he can do is try and take everyone with him. After all, Rowan's B12 schemes work because they are done in secret. But there is no secret here, there is a lot of light on the situation, he can't really hide behind "plausible deniability" or whatever passes for that in the Scandalverse.

 

Also, can someone remind me why exactly Rowan had little Fitz killed? That all happened so fast last season, and there was so much ridiculousness to wade through, I never really understood why that happened.

 

Like I said above: Tom himself is screwed no matter what. If he did the "You gave me the order, Rowan," then Rowan is likely to have the chance to go scorched earth on all the people and things Tom cares about. Jake is relatively powerless to do anything. And now there's even a phone record of a conversation between Jake and Tom just after word of the investigation pointing to Tom. 

 

Rowan had Jerry killed for what I see as multiple reasons. The first is because Olivia begged him to use his power to keep Fitz in the presidency. With Jerry's death, Fitz got a sympathy boost that pushed him over his former VP. So sort of a "careful what you wish for" scenario. The second is because he probably saw it as a form of poetic justice -- you took my daughter away, I'll take your son. The third is by pinning Jerry's killing on Marie (aka MamaPope), he got Fitz to a) give him the resources to track down Marie and b) reinstall him as Command.

 

While I understood that they wanted the cell phone access shut down at the party, it still did not stop anyone from snapping photos that could be Instagrammed as soon as the partiers stepped outside.  Was that just to buy five extra minutes?  And no reference to pictures in the Twitterverse later? 

 

 

I think we are to believe that the hack-fu that Huck employed somehow shut down all picture-taking functions of cell phones in the vicinity of the party as well as prevented people from phoning/texting.

[PrincessTT]

Letting Mellie do whatever she wants regardless of it causing her to embarrassment herself doesn't make him a better husband, IMO.

 

I agree, the crappy husband comment was referring more to how it took next to no time for him to be all over Olivia and having one of his Liv-fueled petulant tantrums again.

 

Whose car did Jake blow up? And why?

 

I think it was his own... I think he realised that Papa Pope had had someone attach a device to his car in an effort to have Jake killed.

 

I think we are to believe that the hack-fu that Huck employed somehow shut down all picture-taking functions of cell phones in the vicinity of the party as well as prevented people from phoning/texting.

 

Yeah, it looked like everyone's phone screens just blacked out even the ones that were just trying to take a picture. I know he could have cut off everyone's signal, but I had no idea it was even possible to shut people's phones down like he did.

[shelley1234]

Fitz is a prime time asshole. I've always given him slack, but tonight no more. Tonight he became the stereotype of what is good for the gander is not good for the goose. Jerk. He has always been married and therefore Liv has been the woman on the side, but the idea that Liv might have a someone who she can love in the light of day is revolting to Fitz? Fuck you dude.

I loved seeing old school Liv who got down and dirty and found ways to fix the clusterfuck that was thrown at her feet. I liked how she was with Karen (tough but caring), how she told off the black mailing parents who had no soul. That's the Liv I fell in love with.

Even though I loathe Fitz, I liked his lecture to Mellie. She hasn't been present for her surviving children and while he was mean, I think it woke her up. Her convo with Karen was also great IMO. She was her Mom and not the broken woman we've seen for the past few episodes.

I also loved Cyrus' rant at Abby. He was right and Abby needs to just get Liv out of her head. It also reminded me how much Cyrus really does adore Liv.

I'm 99.9% sure Jake won't die since this is a formulaic tv show, so I am just gonna enjoy the showdown he is headed for with Papa Pope.

Edited October 17, 2014 by shelley1005

[Ann Mack]

Right now I am so over all things Olitz. They are toxic, sad face, love sick, immature puppy dog eyes having idiots. Olivia is a very capable woman and yes I know "the heart wants what the heart wants" but damn woman let it go. Fitz I really can't really look at him without raging. Sorry that rant he went on with Mellie only disgusted me more with him, and what playground kid did he steal the "Smellie Mellie" jab from.

 

As for Jake, sorry but I saw that coming and it was predictable from the time Tom made the phone call and Jake told him he had evidence and a plan. As much as I love Papa Pope I'm over him too. I know there are slimy people who can get away with quite a lot but when you continually do it and anyone who finds out either dies or gets set up its time to change the narrative. MO, and story line.

 

I foresee Olivia being the one who will take down her own father for the murder of little Jerry and for Harrison's murder as well. Papa Pope has ran his course for me and will soon be joining Mama Pope in a hole hopefully.

 

Did like Olivia getting her back bone back unlike David and setting those parents straight. Apparently they for some reason did not know who the hell they were dealing with. You can only push Olivia so damn far before she destroys you.

 

Overall a good episode but as I stated it was a bit predictable for me. So I guess now in his jealous rage and filled with this untruth that Jake (who had no reason to kill his son) Fitz will be consumed to make sure that Jake pays the ultimate price. I really don't want to see Jake die and I hate that they did the same old stupid stunt that so many shows are guilty of: They let Jake tell Papa Pope that he knew what  he did, and then threatened him to leave his home and daughter, how stupid are these writers (that was weak and lazy because I know they are more creative than that)  we all know Jake above anyone else knows was Eli (Head of Command) is capable of.

 

So next week we get to see Olivia running around like a woman on a mission trying to save her "not boyfriend" from dying for a crime (treason I don't see how and yes a murder which he had no knowledge of) at the hands of her stupid ass, weak ass lover of a President. I'm sure there will be many more twists to come. 

 

I do however hope that Olivia standing by Jake and supporting him is the final nail in the whole Fitz/Olivia love thing. I was a little done with it last season and I am completely done with it now.

 

MVP goes to Mellie for holding it together. Not sure what my reaction would have been to my child making a sex tape (grieving or not) but hey Mellie always brings her "A Game" and last night episode was no exception! Liked Quinn beginning to dislike Abby. Cyrus was rather quiet in this episode. But damn he needs to open his eyes and realize his new stud muffin is playing his ass. Lizzy Bear is about to rip Cyrus to shreds.

 

BTW I liked Tom why the hell didn't they use Hank, never liked that little snitch any way. I will miss murdering, order following, B613 plant, Secret Service Agent Tom though! RIP Tom!!!

Edited October 17, 2014 by Ann Mack

[XtremeOne1]

I loved that because it's pretty much how I feel.

 

I liked Mellie's convo with Karen. Not the "high five" part but the "If you tell me that you did this because you felt empowered or turned on, then I will try to be happy for you even though I'm having a little seizure inside." I thought that was a very nice way of letting Karen know that she is loved and supported and still letting her know that she is responsible for the choices she makes.

 

The moment Olitz moved back into couple mode I opened my laptop and did a little banking. I just don't care about them.

 

I'm calling it now: Tom is a dead man. 

 

Ha I'm quoting yout both all your thoughts mirror mine in EVERY sentence. Hello thought buddy :p. But yes to the reality star thing, yes to Mellie, and yes to Ollitz.

 

"Hey, my son died two months ago, my wife is grieving, my daughter is grievig and was in a sex tape, wannna just the tip?"

 

I really hope this ends with both Jake and Papa Pope going away.

 

I wonder if Mellie will ever find out her son was murdered?

[TheGreenKnight]

But can she really?  The kids were mentioned and rarely seen in earlier seasons.  They were trotted out as plot points for  the very unsatisfactory re-election plot last season.  The fact is, canon just does not support either Mellie or Fitz being good parents because the kids on the show have just been there as phantoms, not real people.  This is why I have such a problem connecting with Mellie's overwrought and damn near comical grief.  The writing simply did not provide a strong enough foundation to get to this point for me.

I know this doesn't mean Mellie is a great mother, but there was the episode--in season 2, I think?--where Fitz wanted the kids to be taken out of school and come visit with him, and Mellie explained how the kids basically hated him as if they had been calling her to stop the visit from happening. Although it's hard to say for sure since, like you said, they're just trotted out for the plot, Mellie does seem to be a better mother than he is a father, at least. That probably comes from not having her life invested in a love affair for years.

 

By the way, I just wanted to say how hilarious it was that, after Fitz screamed and yelled at her for a minute or more, she completely shut him down with one sentence.

[CofCinci]

I'm 99.9% sure Jake won't die since this is a formulaic tv show, so I am just gonna enjoy the showdown he is headed for with Papa Pope.

Given the formula of this show, I think Papa Pope and Jake will off each other during the same fight. Oliva will lose them both. Then, she'll blame Fitz or some shit like that.

[buttersister]

Looking at these people, it's hard to truly believe in the depths of Jake's depravity because Scott Foley. But he brings the cute. Papa Pope makes Dick Cheney look like a nice guy, but I root for him because Brother From Another Planet. Grieving POS POTUS lining up for a strike on Olivia? No redeeming nothing in that guy. And I did recall him telling Rowan "Olivia" and "tasting" and I do believe that was the moment he lost me forever.

 

Buh-bye, Tom. You were killed by bad character writing--always a bad way to go.

[PrincessTT]

One thing I don't get about how Tom got found out... Surely a B613 plant on a super secret mission to kill the president's son would know better than to use such an identifying method of getting in to the place that he took the meningitis from?! Like he couldn't steal / clone someone else's card and use that to get in?! 

 

Leaving such a trail just seems like an amateur move.

[Lillybee]

Am I evil for enjoying the fact that the bad teen with the video was the name of a Palin grandchild.

[JAYJAY1979]

I was reminded how much Fritz is a d-bag with the way he was calling out Mellie then trying to get back into Olivia's bed.  I did like that after his rant on Mellie, she just laid a great slam back at him leaving him speechless.  I think our Mellie is down, but not out!  Plus, loved her scene with her daughter and their mutual grief.

 

Great episode, but still wondering if the show is going back to case of the week totally.. or if the season long arc is still being formulated .

[ToukieSmith]

 

"I'm failing as a father, husband, and man."  Oh Fitz, that ship sailed a looooooooooooooooong time ago.

 

He can't be that great of a President either if his mind is always on Olivia and we all know his ass uses public resources for his own personal errands.  I can only imagine how much it costs to keep Pope and Associates on retainer and I don't think he is paying for that out of his own pocket.  At the very least, he is accessing his campaign fund and I don't think the people contributing to it thought it would be paying for Presidential booty calls.

[PepSinger]

Let me just say that if a man grabbed me the way that Fitz grabbed Olivia's arm, he'd need a testis retrieval operation. Before that happened, I was all about the Olitz chemistry.

 

Also, the way Olivia took down those scumbags called "parents"? Brilliant and old school Olivia Pope. Furthermore, I just want to say that while the people that Olivia associates with are morally dubious at best (and murderers at worst), it makes her no less right to call those shitbag parents out on extortion.

[Julia]

Let me just say that if a man grabbed me the way that Fitz grabbed Olivia's arm, he'd need a testis retrieval operation. Before that happened, I was all about the Olitz chemistry.

 

Also, the way Olivia took down those scumbags called "parents"? Brilliant and old school Olivia Pope. Furthermore, I just want to say that while the people that Olivia associates with are morally dubious at best (and murderers at worst), it makes her no less right to call those shitbag parents out on extortion.

 

She was willing to pay them, though, until they slutshamed the kid (and by extension, Olivia). I think half the venom she took after them with was her anger at what Fitz (another rich white guy who has everything and lies, cheats and whines about not having more) has reduced her to.

Edited October 18, 2014 by Julia

[ToukieSmith]

 

She was willing to pay them, though, until they slutshamed the kid (and by extension, Olivia). I think half the venom she took after them with was her anger at what Fitz (another rich white guy who has everything and lies, cheats and whines about not having more) has reduced her to.

 

Nah, Olivia is just as delusional as Fitz IMO.  Her morality is selective.  Its okay to commit treason because you like your candidate better compared to the other candidate?  Its okay to sleep with a married man because you want him and his wife is a bitch?  Once she was confronted with the crimes that she and her conspirators committed to give the Presidency to Fitz, she still wants to make it all noble somehow.  I thoroughly enjoyed the take down of the parents, but Olivia is delusional if she thinks she is not as greedy and morally corrupt.

[DearEvette]

She was willing to pay them, though, until they slutshamed the kid (and by extension, Olivia). I think half the venom she took after them with was her anger at what Fitz (another rich white guy who has everything and lies, cheats and whines about not having more) has reduced her to.

 

I was very surprised she went the route of even entertaining the idea of paying them.  But then I thought,  she is in fixer mode.  All she wants to do is make the problem go away.  Fix it. And just giving them the money seemed the path of least resistance even if it was seemingly against all best judgement. 

 

But I think when they decided to up the ante, she realized that giving them the money would not fix it.  They'd revealed that they would renege on any deal.  So she went scorched earth.  I have always felt that Olivia was best when she was being bloodlessly pragmatic.  I can't stand Olivia when she gets all schmoopy.  I like her best when she's all 'Fuck it, Imma bury you, and keep my hair pressed while I am doing it.'  This is why I hated ALL of season 3. 

[Julia]

Completely off topic (sorry), but I've loved Toukie Smith for longer than either of us would want to admit to, so good name.

[wanderingstar]

Fitz's rant at Mellie made me so angry. First of all, what country does he run? It ain't the USA. B613, Cyrus, et. al have that locked up. So is Fitz in charge of the country of his own man-pain? Can he please die in a fire.

 

The Papa Pope vs. Jake War is the most intriguing plot of this young season.

[Black Knight]

I see nothing has changed in regards to Olitz scenes - they still bring each other down horribly and become unwatchable for me. But I was pleasantly surprised that there wasn't all that much Olitz in this episode and, now that Fitz has had Jake arrested, there probably won't be much Olitz for a couple more episodes.

 

Speaking of Fitz having Jake arrested - I just knew as soon as Fitz picked up the phone and asked for a secure line that he was going to fuck everything up. I blame the Olitz. Fitz has never been all that bright, but when he's under the Olitz influence he loses the brain cells he has. But calling his son's murderer to investigate his son's murder was exceptionally stupid even for an Olitzed Fitz. If somebody else were Command, but this is Rowan. Why Fitz would ever call Rowan about anything is beyond me.

 

I loved Mellie's scene with Karen. Beautifully done. I think she'll be getting back to herself soon now. And her shot at Fitz was hilarious.

[pennben]

 

"I'm failing as a father, husband, and man."

 

Yes, yes you are.  If you fail on the first count "father", you are failing as a man; if you fail on the second count "husband", you are maybe failing as a man; if you fail on the third count, when discussing with your adulterous lover your relationship with your wife, well (a) I'm going back to correct my answer in the last question to "yep, you suck" and (b) if you bring all these hypotheticals to your adulterous lover (scuse me, "luv of your life") to guilt her, well, yep, you suck and you fail.

 

But, back to the beginning,  you fail your child?  Yes, you fail as a man.  No outside interference needed.

[Anna Yolei]

Reading this thread (because the show is either too stupid or too boring to sit through anymore on any given week, my only wish for season four that I can reasonably expect to happen is for Mellie to ditch the Jackie Kennedy look for good once she comes roaring back. It is really less flattering than the crazy cat lady look she's been rocking so far.

 

 

"I'm failing as a father, husband, and man."

As mentioned, that ship sailed a good while ago. He can hiss and whine about Mellie's failings as a mother, but that does nothing to remove the shade around him becoming a booze fiend when his side piece moves on in life--and I refuse to call Olivia his "lover" after that endearing speech he gave to Pap Pope last season.

[Julia]

I kind of can't with Olivia this season. She has no power, and no agency, and all that time in the sun appears to have addled her brain (right, princess, your dad is a lovable guy you and your hit man can play Norman Rockwell with and the guy fucking you on his desk after you said no is totally going to respect you in the morning). And now she's all overidentified with Fitz' daughter, but only the part where their sexual histories overlap, because it's a little hard for the rest of family Fitz to have Norman Rockwell when they don't know what pieces of furniture Olivia's naked ass has been on. And she does what for a living, now?

IRL this woman would be getting interviewed by Andy Cohen at the end of every season.

[Haleth]

Why didn't Tom just blurt out "You did, Mr. Pope"? Truthfully or not, it would have thrown the glare back on him.

 

I know!  I was yelling at the tv, "Say it!  Say it!  SAY.IT!"  Gah.

I think he's going to find a way to get Rowan back.

 

I know!  I always start to feel sorry for Jake for the way both Popes treat him, then I remember he killed James so coldy.  Still, I think this is why Shonda had Jake get the files back early in the episode.  That is going to be his salvation.  (Unpopular opinion, I do find Joe Morton entertaining, much as I want to see his comeuppance.)

 

Loved, loved the way Liv handled the blackmailing parents.  Amateurs.  And I thought the chemistry is still there between Fitz and Liv.

*off to Google "Eiffel Tower position"

 

I don't even want to know.

[Eolivet]

I thought this was a great episode -- heavy on Liv's fixing, judicious use of Olitz scenes (a little goes a long way), Mellie snapping out of her funk at last (expect to see her fully dressed next episode), progress on the secret assassin!Tom story and a reminder that if Olivia wants normal, she shouldn't be looking at Fitz or Jake. I was actually really pleased to see Jake try to choke David Rosen. Though I agree with a poster above, that Scott Foley doesn't quite have the dark hitman look down, so he has to do more "show" than "tell."

 

I actually find myself really missing Charlie. George Newbern is the best of any of them (better than Huck or Jake) at balancing "I'm just a normal, regular guy...who will torture and kill you if someone pays me." He was equally believable drilling holes in someone as he was playing happy families with Quinn.

 

With Jake sometimes, I feel like he's playing at being a bad guy. "Look at me! I'm a badass! Would my black leather jacket lie to you?"

[thewhiteowl]

I had been mostly enjoying the season up until the Fitz/Olivia grope scene. I liked Jake investigating Harrison's death and putting the pieces together but then he had to be stupid and threaten DaddyPope without having any power to carry through on it. Amateur mistake that will likely be his death unless he something in place now. Olivia can't help him because Fitz is in his jealous snit. I liked that Cyrus is getting played, no one deserves it more. I have been entertained by Mellie but I was getting bored with it so I hope she is back to normal. I didn't like Cyrus' speech to Abby because Abby has a right to be pissed and I hate that jealousy is assumed when two women have a conflict. Abby may be jealous of Olivia but that doesn't mean she can't be rightfully pissed at Liv's behavior. IMO Liv was a selfish asshole, running off without contact with her "Gladiators". She collected all these broken people and knew they depended on her, she used that then walked away without a backward glance. She was, however awesome with the extorting parents. And I liked David finding out that the price of being "inside the bubble" is steep.

[PrincessTT]

I had been mostly enjoying the season up until the Fitz/Olivia grope scene. I liked Jake investigating Harrison's death and putting the pieces together but then he had to be stupid and threaten DaddyPope without having any power to carry through on it. Amateur mistake that will likely be his death unless he something in place now. 

 

In fact, wasn't that what got Harrison killed too? He put the pieces together and then went running straight to Papa Pope to tell him what he had worked out about him.

[thewhiteowl]

 I believe you are right, PrincessTT.

[Dejana]

In fact, wasn't that what got Harrison killed too? He put the pieces together and then went running straight to Papa Pope to tell him what he had worked out about him.

 

If you suspected someone of being a devious killer, why would you let that person know it? If the guy has already had the president's teenage son killed shouldn't that be a hint of how ruthless he is? I hand-waved it with Harrison because of the off-screen situation with the actor. Jake can be pretty smug, but really, have some sense. It must be a corollary of the rule that makes movie villains reveal their nefarious plots when they have the hero all tied up. A movie is only two hours, though, and the writing/logic don't have to be sustained over the course of many episodes.

[DearEvette]

I actually find myself really missing Charlie. George Newbern is the best of any of them (better than Huck or Jake) at balancing "I'm just a normal, regular guy...who will torture and kill you if someone pays me." He was equally believable drilling holes in someone as he was playing happy families with Quinn.

 

Well, Charlie is still there.  And if Portia DiRossi and Male Escort guy fall on Mr. Beene's bad side, I am thinking Charlie will get a phone call.  LOL. They don't know who they are messing with. 

 

 

With Jake sometimes, I feel like he's playing at being a bad guy. "Look at me! I'm a badass! Would my black leather jacket lie to you?"

 

So much this!  This is why I can't take him seriously at all!  Ugh. 

[PrincessTT]

If you suspected someone of being a devious killer, why would you let that person know it? If the guy has already had the president's teenage son killed shouldn't that be a hint of how ruthless he is? I hand-waved it with Harrison because of the off-screen situation with the actor. Jake can be pretty smug, but really, have some sense. It must be a corollary of the rule that makes movie villains reveal their nefarious plots when they have the hero all tied up. A movie is only two hours, though, and the writing/logic don't have to be sustained over the course of many episodes.

 

For a super-secret-spy-agency, these B613 guys make quite a few amateur mistakes... Jake running straight to Papa Pope with his threats, Tom using his own card to get into the place that he took the bug from. And didn't Jake put the pieces together about Harrison's murder because Charlie was caught on camaera sitting & eating in the place he used Harrison's credit card to buy food?

Edited October 19, 2014 by PrincessTT

[shelley1234]

I had always assumed that this newly surfaced "proof" about Tom's whereabouts and his key card and pics of him in the facility was at the hands of Papa Pope. When Tom seemed to be dragging his feet on the orders to kill Jake, I think Papa Pope realized that his allegiance may be to Jake and not him, so he sweet into action with the intention to kill two birds with one stone.