S04.E16: New York, New York, New York

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

The Pearsons visit New York City.

Promo:

Clip #1:

Clip #2:

Original air date: 3/10/20

[ams1001]

pterojacktyl 😄  (How is there not a dinosaur emoji?)

 

 

[BuckeyeLou]

Rebecca looks so beautiful in that purple sequin dress & she is so happy, she is glowing.  Mandy Moore is doing such a phenomenal job as older Rebecca.  

[debraran]

42 minutes ago, BuckeyeLou said:

Rebecca looks so beautiful in that purple sequin dress & she is so happy, she is glowing.  Mandy Moore is doing such a phenomenal job as older Rebecca.  

I LOVED the red carpet scenes and the Simon and Garfunkel music. ; ) She glowed with Kevin.

Having 3 NYC scenes is a bit much but nice to see them young.  I didn't like the Kate scene...just waiting for Marc.  (yuck) Hope it's not tonight.

That was sad when Kirby (?) made fun of the horse and buggy but I can see why a year later, it stung. I would have wanted to leave soon but it showed Rebecca had a little room to be friendly with another man.

Wish Randall had therapy years ago for anxiety and his guilt. So much to process at that age. They all could have benefited.

Edited March 11, 2020 by debraran

[BuckeyeLou]

I am chuckling at a reference to "Passions" 🙂 Kevin says he dated Susan Lucci's daughter(and her daughter, Liza Huber was on "Passions" just like Justin Hartley)

[Spartan Girl]

"...to go hook up with Susan Lucci's daughter..."

"Well, it was her daughter, but whatever."

Line of the night!

This episode made me want to go back to NYC again (when certain things are under control). And Kevin and Randal were both acting like dicks, but I find myself agreeing with Kevin. Randall means well, but he's acting like he's the only one that's entitled to take care of Rebecca and isn't letting anyone else help. My mom is the same way with my grandma.

[CleoCaesar]

So the Pearsons accidentally took the train to Queens, and (instead of just getting on another train going back into Manhattan) got off, exited the station, and wandered around Queens for 2 hours whining that they were lost? Did the entire family have a collective stroke?

Kevin taking his mom to his premiere was damn cute.

Randall: a toxic asshole then, an even more toxic asshole now. How does anyone stand him, seriously.

[milner]

Randall made a plan to send his moms way for 9 months and never consulted her husband!!

[ShadowFacts]

That ending gut punched me -- Rebecca as a little girl and now, and Randall wanting so badly to save his father. Powerful.

 

 

[mtlchick]

Well then.  We're reaching the breaking point with Kevin and Randall.  While Kevin did dish out a low blow about that he's the one that is able to pay for Rebecca's care, Randall was once again being Randall in thinking he knows what is best and then try to broach the subject at Kevin's premiere. He may have been right, but Rebecca feels she's going to lose 9 months in treatment instead of living and making up for lost time.  Flash forward a few months later on their 40th and I see why Randall would be that resentful. 

 

Next week, Randall has his Sliding Doors episode. 

[ams1001]

Just now, CleoCaesar said:

Randall: a toxic asshole then, an even more toxic asshole now. How does anyone stand him, seriously.

Randall at every age needs to get over himself. (Well, maybe not toddler Randall.)

[BuckeyeLou]

Oh My! That scene in the Met of Rebecca staring at the painting & telling her sons she wants to enjoy her life & not regret not doing things.  I certainly have felt that way, that I will do something or travel to somewhere I want to see, but keep putting it off.  That scene made me cry 😞

[ams1001]

1 minute ago, milner said:

Randall made a plan to send his moms way for 9 months and never consulted her husband!!

I think they've made it pretty clear that Miguel doesn't count in their book.

[debraran]

1 minute ago, milner said:

Randall made a plan to send his moms way for 9 months and never consulted her husband!!

Because the kids and writers treat Miguel like a potted plant with no feelings. He works and lives with Rebecca, sleeps with Rebecca, shares his life with her but he is invisible to the Pearsons.

[Scarlett45]

Randall......I understand his guilt over Jack and his concern for his Mom, but lashing out at Kevin isn’t the way. And there’s NOTHING he could’ve done to save Jack. Twenty years later he’s still holding onto that? Hot damn. 
 

Teenaged Kate should’ve made Kevin’s acting showcase. I know she was upset about Mark, but it had been a month and that’s her brother. 

7 minutes ago, milner said:

Randall made a plan to send his moms way for 9 months and never consulted her husband!!

Well he wasn’t “sending her away”. It was presented as an option. If she had wanted to do it she should’ve been the one to discuss it with Miguel. That’s HER husband after all. That part didn’t bother me at all. 

[Spartan Girl]

2 minutes ago, milner said:

Randall made a plan to send his moms way for 9 months and never consulted her husband!!

Ugh, that and he's so convinced he alone would have stopped Jack from going back into the fire and letting poor Louie burn. GET OVER YOURSELF, RANDALL.

[ShortyMac]

I can't stand Randall's noble and holier-than-thou BS. Glad Kevin bit back and told the truth, though harsh. And that he stood up for himself and his career.

Edited March 11, 2020 by ShortyMac

[ams1001]

2 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

Teenaged Kate should’ve made Kevin’s acting showcase. I know she was upset about Mark, but it had been a month and that’s her brother. 

I was expecting "Molly" to be Marc. Though I guess those flashbacks could be in another episode.

[Scarlett45]

2 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

I was expecting "Molly" to be Marc. Though I guess those flashbacks could be in another episode.

Ewwww. Just no. But I wouldn’t be surprised. 

[nilyank]

I can totally understand why Kevin and Randall aren't speaking. After Rebecca's lovely speech about spending that time with hers sons in the front of the painting, Randall tells Kevin that the trial would have saved her life but that Kevin blew it. That is really shitty especially as Rebecca is going to get worse and there is no guarantee that trial will slow down the disease.

Plus Rebecca was very clear as she made that decision. She was not confused or scared as Randall insisted that she was. 

[BuckeyeLou]

Is it my imagination or was that Milo Ventimiligia playing the role of Kirby, the acting teacher?

[bettername2come]

Kevin was right. Kevin was right, Kevin was right, Kevin was right. It's Mom's decision. You couldn't have saved Dad. His money is what's paying for things. Randall was admittedly right about three things tonight 1) Telling Rebecca about the trial was a fair decision 2) "Jack-rassic Park" deserved a better reaction (though "Ptera-jack-dyl" was admittedly better) 3) Rebecca did look like a young Helen Mirren. Wrong about all else. Seriously, Kevin asked you to wait. He gave you a perfectly good reason. You AGREED. He was at his own WORK event. You've asked him to contribute to your campaign events and you can't listen to him and not screw up your mother's evening? Give the woman her night out! I liked how the flashback to 1999 was relevant to the issue they're having today - Kevin wants to push Rebecca into the world and Randall is so busy trying to take care of her he doesn't listen to her.

The lady who was staring at the painting looked deeply discontent to me. I half-suspect we'll get an episode about her and how Rebecca was wrong about her life.

I'm looking forward to the "what could've been episode." Those can be a little cheesier on realistic shows, but I'm looking forward to seeing Milo Ventimiglia working with the adult Big 3.

[Trillian]

So Kevin gives his sick mom a magical night where she gets to live the life of a glamorous movie star and pissy self-important selfish momma’s boy Randall has to go spoil it because he wasn’t the centre of attention for a few minutes. Are we supposed to hate his character?  Because, if we’re supposed to like him or feel sorry for him, the writers are failing miserably. 

[debraran]

8 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

I was expecting "Molly" to be Marc. Though I guess those flashbacks could be in another episode.

I think so too. Fogleman  didn’t want it to wreck the feelings of this episode 

[Domenicholas]

28 minutes ago, BuckeyeLou said:

I am chuckling at a reference to "Passions" 🙂 Kevin says he dated Susan Lucci's daughter(and her daughter, Liza Huber was on "Passions" just like Justin Hartley)

Hah! I thought I would be the only one who remembered that show. I loved Passions.

[debraran]

Am I the only one who thought forgetting the name of the Plaza wasn’t a big deal.? I work with many women 50 and over and we all do that . Men too.  She has issues but that was normal,at least according to many doctors opinions. For me it’s names of actors, comes much later or a movie name on occasion 

Edited March 11, 2020 by debraran

[Lady Calypso]

6 minutes ago, BuckeyeLou said:

Is it my imagination or was that Milo Ventimiligia playing the role of Kirby, the acting teacher?

Actually, it was Dave Annable playing Kirby. 

Wow, they really pounded in the Randall vs Kevin feud in all timelines, didn't they? Not only that, but they made Randall as obnoxious, smug, and pretentious as he could be. I didn't like it at all. I think they could have toned it down because, as much as Randall can show all of these qualities, I felt like it was a bit too much. 

I see why Kevin and Randall aren't speaking. Treatment differences for their mother would certainly cause such a rift. I'm glad that they're going to follow through and that it won't be pretty to watch. 

Huh. Kate was only in the beginning and she ended up being the voice of reason. I love it.

Molly is 100% Marc. I called it the moment Teen Kate said that she was going to be hanging with Molly. 

Kevin was absolutely right about how to handle Rebecca's diagnosis. Randall needs to stuff it. He's spiraling hardcore but being an ass about it. 

I don't think Teen Kevin was necessarily right in setting up his mother with Kirby without consulting her, but I appreciate the sentiment and the idea of wanting her to be happy was correct.

I laughed at Jack's multiple attempts to be the macho man, only to have Rebecca right every time. Poor woman just wanted to see the Met but it was Jack who inadvertently prevented that by not listening to the more experienced New York tourist.

Ooo, we're getting a What If episode? Sweet!

[txhorns79]

14 minutes ago, BuckeyeLou said:

Is it my imagination or was that Milo Ventimiligia playing the role of Kirby, the acting teacher?

It was Dave Annable.  If you ever saw the show Brothers and Sisters (it was on ABC), he was one of the siblings. I think that was his last most prominent role. 

And seriously Randall, go get all the therapy.  You are awful, and I wish Rebecca had slapped him across the face and told him to snap out of it.

[BuckeyeLou]

1 minute ago, txhorns79 said:

It was Dave Annable.  If you ever saw the show Brothers and Sisters (it was on ABC), he was one of the siblings. I think that was his last most prominent role. 

Thank you for the info....I knew that he looked familiar & I do remember him from "Brothers&Sisters"(It was bugging me thru the whole show & I kept thinking the eyes looked like Milo's)

[Ohiopirate02]

5 minutes ago, bettername2come said:

 

The lady who was staring at the painting looked deeply discontent to me. I half-suspect we'll get an episode about her and how Rebecca was wrong about her life.

 

The painting in the episode is John Singer Sargent's Portrait of Madame X.  A late Victorian painting which was scandalous when it first premiered because of all the exposed flesh and the straps appear to be falling off.  The name of the lady was not mentioned even if all of parisian society could figure out who it was.  I can see a woman in the repressive 1950s staring at that painting for hours wondering if she has the gumption to do something similar.  And then we get 1999 Rebecca starting to flirt with another man, staring to think about her life without Jack.  A+ use of symbolism writers.

 

On another note, STFU Randall.  

[BuckeyeLou]

4 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

Actually, it was Dave Annable playing Kirby. 

Wow, they really pounded in the Randall vs Kevin feud in all timelines, didn't they? Not only that, but they made Randall as obnoxious, smug, and pretentious as he could be. I didn't like it at all. I think they could have toned it down because, as much as Randall can show all of these qualities, I felt like it was a bit too much. 

I see why Kevin and Randall aren't speaking. Treatment differences for their mother would certainly cause such a rift. I'm glad that they're going to follow through and that it won't be pretty to watch. 

Huh. Kate was only in the beginning and she ended up being the voice of reason. I love it.

Molly is 100% Marc. I called it the moment Teen Kate said that she was going to be hanging with Molly. 

Kevin was absolutely right about how to handle Rebecca's diagnosis. Randall needs to stuff it. He's spiraling hardcore but being an ass about it. 

I don't think Teen Kevin was necessarily right in setting up his mother with Kirby without consulting her, but I appreciate the sentiment and the idea of wanting her to be happy was correct.

I laughed at Jack's multiple attempts to be the macho man, only to have Rebecca right every time. Poor woman just wanted to see the Met but it was Jack who inadvertently prevented that by not listening to the more experienced New York tourist.

Ooo, we're getting a What If episode? Sweet!

Thanks for the info about David Anable...I knew he looked familiar!  And yes, Jack & Randall both have "macho" attitudes where they discount Rebecca's feelings...I like that we see that Kevin was willing to let his Mom enjoy life.

Just now, Ohiopirate02 said:

The painting in the episode is John Singer Sargent's Portrait of Madame X.  A late Victorian painting which was scandalous when it first premiered because of all the exposed flesh and the straps appear to be falling off.  The name of the lady was not mentioned even if all of parisian society could figure out who it was.  I can see a woman in the repressive 1950s staring at that painting for hours wondering if she has the gumption to do something similar.  And then we get 1999 Rebecca starting to flirt with another man, staring to think about her life without Jack.  A+ use of symbolism writers.

 

On another note, STFU Randall.  

Thanks for the info about the painting...it definitely fit in with the theme of the episode

[stonehaven]

Sterling Brown is a great actor playing a shitty character. I liked Randall in the beginning but his attitude reeks of dogshit. Almost every scene he was in, I was shouting shut up Randall. I though Mandy Moore really did fantastic with her scenes and loved all of it. I do wish Miguel was treated as an actual person with feelings but the Pearsons are all about the Pearsons.

I am not really looking forward to next week's episode but it will be cool to see Milo interact with the adults.

[mommalib]

I was waiting for the day where they try to make Randall the bad guy, Yes he has his issues that he needs to work on like his anxiety and need for control but he genuinely has good intentions and if he thinks something is broken he wants to fix. Kevin gets to be fun son but Randall is the one Rebecca always leaned on. He's the one who had to carry the guilt about Jack's death where as Kevin hasn't even thought about it.

They just can't let a brotha be loved lol.

Edited March 11, 2020 by mommalib

[One Imaginary Girl]

I liked the multiple timelines for the contrast in how Randall and Kevin have changed over time: young Randall was so cute, but even as a middle-schooler he was acting superior, and he's been insufferable lately, while young Kevin could be a jerk who unironically loved bad movies, and he's turned out to be very kind and to have better taste in things than he used to.

[Roxie]

2 minutes ago, mommalib said:

 He's the one who had to carry the guilt about Jack's death where as Kevin hasn't even thought about it.

Randall didn't have to carry that guilt - he chose to.  He's been an adult with access to counseling and self-help books for 20 years and hasn't chosen to let go.  And Kevin didn't say that he didn't think about (mourn) Jack's death.  He just doesn't think about the useless "what if's."

[Scarlett45]

10 minutes ago, mommalib said:

I was waiting for the day where they try to make Randall the bad guy, Yes he has his issues that he needs to work on like his anxiety and need for control but he genuinely has good intentions and if he thinks something is broken he wants to fix. Kevin gets to be fun son but Randall is the one Rebecca always leaned on. He's the one who had to carry the guilt about Jack's death where as Kevin hasn't even thought about it.

They just can't let a brotha be loved lol.

I don’t think Randall is a bad guy or a bad son (I think he is a good man and a good son), but this time Kevin was 100% in the right and Randall needed to shush. Yes it’s true he’s been the more constant presence and emotional support in Rebecca’s life when Kevin was off doing his own thing (not saying that makes Kevin a bad son but that’s the truth), so I get how he is protective and thinks he knows everything. But that doesn’t mean it’s true. Also he was being an ass to his brother. Someone can be coming from a well intentioned place and still be WRONG and uncompromising. 

[Ohiopirate02]

4 minutes ago, Roxie said:

Randall didn't have to carry that guilt - he chose to.  He's been an adult with access to counseling and self-help books for 20 years and hasn't chosen to let go.  And Kevin didn't say that he didn't think about (mourn) Jack's death.  He just doesn't think about the useless "what if's."

As someone who has experienced loss, thinking about the what ifs on a daily basis for 20+ years is just something you don't do.   That way lies madness.  You have to let things go and move on.  Kevin is doing that.

[Roxie]

And I think Mandy Moore is killing it in these last few episodes.

[Bulldog]

I don't think I've ever had a scene resonate quite as much as Rebecca's "next time" speech. 

3 minutes ago, Roxie said:

And I think Mandy Moore is killing it in these last few episodes.

I know awards shows gravitate towards premium cable, but if Moore isn't at least nominated for an Emmy (and I would argue win), then there is no justice.  

[memememe76]

I find it weird to set your mom up on a date, with your professor, one year after your dad’s death. Just saying. Yet, Kevin is the one who had the biggest issue with Miguel.

Dave Annabel and Mandy worked together as a romantic pairing on some medical show, with Octavia Spencer. Name escapes me.

There was one shot where Kid Kate looked so much like Teen Kate. 
 

The guilt Randall holds clearly explains why Teen Randall behaves the way he did. 

Edited March 11, 2020 by memememe76

[Scarlett45]

Liza Huber acknowledged their nod to their time on Passions together. 

 

[Aliconehead]

6 minutes ago, memememe76 said:

I find it weird to set your mom up on a date, with your professor, one year after your dad’s death. Just saying. Yet, Kevin is the one who had the biggest issue with Miguel.

Dave Annabel and Mandy worked together as a romantic pairing on some medical show, with Octavia Spencer. Name escapes me.

There was one shot where Kid Kate looked so much like Teen Kate. 

Red Band Society

I am having a hard time with the Alzheimer’s story and the conflict between siblings.  Mainly because I have been there with my none involved brother deciding he knows best when he was not there and had no background on what was going on, would not listen to my mother and Me about what was going on with dad and thought he knew best. But saying that, I am firmly on Kevin’s side.  He was right. 

[LoveLeigh]

1 hour ago, mtlchick said:

Next week, Randall has his Sliding Doors episode. 

That technique is not for everyone, but I happen to love it. I love to see an alternate reality. Demi Moore did a film called "Passion of Mind" where she lives in two different worlds. I like that. It is not manipulative but just allows the audience to imagine different possibilities. 

[Scarlett45]

12 minutes ago, memememe76 said:

I find it weird to set your mom up on a date, with your professor, one year after your dad’s death. Just saying. Yet, Kevin is the one who had the biggest issue with Miguel.

Yeah I thought that was a little weird. And I fully believe that Kevin only called his Mom when he needed something and Randall had a better grasp on her emotions at that time. But the decision to date wouldve been up to Rebecca (I’m not insinuating that Kevin was trying to force her into anything). 

[willco]

20 minutes ago, memememe76 said:

I find it weird to set your mom up on a date, with your professor, one year after your dad’s death. Just saying. Yet, Kevin is the one who had the biggest issue with Miguel.

Dave Annabel and Mandy worked together as a romantic pairing on some medical show, with Octavia Spencer. Name escapes me.

There was one shot where Kid Kate looked so much like Teen Kate. 
 

The guilt Randall holds clearly explains why Teen Randall behaves the way he did. 

Shh ! Don't let Randall hear you've forgotten a name, you'll end up in St. Louis for 9 month ! 🙂

 

I can see that Randall harbors guilt over Jack's death and all, but seriously he needs to get over himself. And all the eye rolls tonight pretty much every time Kevin said anything, in any time frame, was annoying as all hell. Randall has a massive ego, thinking he knows better than everyone else ( even his much older Father ), and it's hard to watch. If the writers are trying to write him as the world's biggest dick, then bravo, they've succeeded ! 

[BC4ME]

25 minutes ago, Bulldog said:

I don't think I've ever had a scene resonate quite as much as Rebecca's "next time" speech. 

It was particularly powerful for me right now with the coronavirus lurking and my age and underlying health problems.

I actually still like Randall. I get why he's like he is. I think they're doing a good job of not making it black and white.

I thought this was a really good episode. They tied it all in well and we got a little more insight into what Rebecca and Jack were like together. 

[chocolatine]

Randall was extremely out of line to claim that the drug trial would save Rebecca's life. Even if she gets into the trial, there's a 50% chance that she'll end up in the control group, i.e. she would not get the drug, and she wouldn't know either way because any legitimate drug trial would have to be double-blind. That would mean spending nine months - possibly all of the "good" time she has left - in St. Louis for absolutely nothing. And if she does get the drug, there's no guarantee that it will work, since she will be one of the first humans on whom the drug is tested. There's also a considerable chance of side effects that could diminish her quality of life, or even kill her. And even if the drug "works" it's unlikely to cure her completely but rather slow down the progress of the disease. And that slow-down may not be meaningful if you subtract the nine months she spends in St. Louis. So it's a perfectly sound decision on Rebecca's part to not want to do it.

1 hour ago, Scarlett45 said:

Randall......I understand his guilt over Jack and his concern for his Mom, but lashing out at Kevin isn’t the way. And there’s NOTHING he could’ve done to save Jack. Twenty years later he’s still holding onto that? Hot damn.

My understanding based on what the doctor said to Rebecca after Jack's death is that the widow-maker heart attack could have happened either way due to blockage in his arteries. If that's correct, then Jack may still have died even if he hadn't gone back for the dog. There's nothing Randall could have done short of making Jack have an angiogram long before the fire.

[The Ringo Kidd]

You know after this episode I want to leave Randall at the firehouse.

[Bringonthedrama]

49 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

As someone who has experienced loss, thinking about the what ifs on a daily basis for 20+ years is just something you don't do.   That way lies madness.  You have to let things go and move on.  Kevin is doing that.

That moment where Randall tells Kevin he wonders about it every day really drove home the point for me that being Randall must be exhausting, and life must truly be exhausting for Beth. Emotionally, Randall is stuck in time as that teenage boy on the lawn, seeing his father on the roof as the house burned. He has tried to manage and control everything in life since that moment. He thinks he should have done something different to "save" their dad; now he thinks he would "save" mom by setting her up for the clinical trial but his brother got in the way of that goal. Seems like he needs to feel he is the only son their mom can depend on, and also that he needs to feel superior to Kevin, in order to function in life.

[buttersister]

Madame X? More like An Onion Peeling. Because it triggered the memory of a little girl who wanted to be a sophisticated lady 😪 and the missed-it-by-that-much flood of memories that went with choices made. Got me, Show. 

Poor Randall. His guilt over not saving his father isn’t rational, but that’s why he doesn’t see it that way. There’s no objectivity at all, which is why he’s been an overcompensating, controlling, anxiety-ridden mess. Although the anxiety was baked in before that, I guess. Patricia Alcon better be a really good therapist.

Also, Team Kevin.