S04.E13: A Hell of a Week: Part Three

[AzraeltheCat]

7 hours ago, bros402 said:

At the start of the episode, Kate was totally unreasonable with Toby - both of them are coping in different ways with Jack's legal blindness. He's grieving (as any parent of a child with a disability does) and she is diving headfirst into research/advocacy to cope with her grief. Both of those are perfectly reasonable ways to deal with it.

I agree.  I know it has been 10 months, but I don't know that you can put a time line on coping.  Also, Toby has issues with depression and I could see how this could really rock him.  He and Kate really need to get to therapy. 

 

3 hours ago, Veronica said:

I think Kate will cheat on Toby with Gregory. Gregory loves and accepts little Jack and does things like buy him the beeping toy. Meanwhile,  Toby is struggling to accept their child and his disability. Gregory is with little Jack what Toby should be. Gregory would have been all in on that retreat. Gregory was the one Kate called. 

I hope not.  I love Gregory but I just don't want a cheating situation.  Also, I think it is easier to be "accepting" when it is not your child... not your hopes and dreams that have been altered.  And while I don't have a problem with either Kate or Toby confiding in friends, the fact that they seem not to communicate with each other at all is not good. 

 

7 hours ago, MBayGal said:

I really don’t need to ever see Kate in a swinsuit.

This is SO FREAKING OBNOXIOUS. The fact you even said this shows why Kate (and real-life Kates) feels so anxious about putting on a swimsuit going to a pool/beach... because they assume everyone is thinking that.      

[JudyObscure]

3 hours ago, Empress1 said:

 

 

Mandy Moore was the MVP. Her reactions to Mark at the coffee shop were excellent. I also laughed at “You’re fat, I’m ancient, we’re gorgeous! Let’s go!”

I'm usually the last person to say anything nice about actress Mandy Moore or character Rebecca, but they were both wonderful this episode.  What a great ending to that little story, reminding us that no matter how many issues we have with out mothers by the time were grown -- when we're three they are the whole world.

I'm fat and old so you can imagine my swimsuit problems.  I thought Kate looked great in hers, her arms and legs are just fine.

[Quickbeam]

I liked the stress between Kate and Toby. They got married and all the emphasis was on having a baby. Now they have a child with a sight impairment. They never really got to be a couple before this challenge. I worked as a pediatric nurse with chronically disabled kids and about 75-90% of the parents were divorced. The intact family was an anomaly.

I thought the direction was excellent so good on you Justin. The casting is so good I forget these are not the same people!

[ShadowFacts]

58 minutes ago, AzraeltheCat said:

I agree.  I know it has been 10 months, but I don't know that you can put a time line on coping.  Also, Toby has issues with depression and I could see how this could really rock him.  He and Kate really need to get to therapy.

I hope not.  I love Gregory but I just don't want a cheating situation.  Also, I think it is easier to be "accepting" when it is not your child... not your hopes and dreams that have been altered.  And while I don't have a problem with either Kate or Toby confiding in friends, the fact that they seem not to communicate with each other at all is not good.

This is SO FREAKING OBNOXIOUS. The fact you even said this shows why Kate (and real-life Kates) feels so anxious about putting on a swimsuit going to a pool/beach... because they assume everyone is thinking that.      

Yes to all of this. The way forward for Toby is to spend hands-on, one-on-one time with Jack. He will see from experiences they have that the two of them will have a different future than he imagined/hoped for, but a good one. As to Gregory, he can be a wonderful support, but Kate still needs to be communicating with Toby. She gave a detailed report on the phone to Gregory, but apparently not to Toby because when she came home and he asked how it was, she said it was great. I didn't get the impression that he knew anything more about it. She didn't want Rebecca to know that wasn't Toby. That's not going to work for their relationship.

26 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

I'm fat and old so you can imagine my swimsuit problems.  I thought Kate looked great in hers, her arms and legs are just fine.

Hear, hear. Total props to Chrissy for going there, I'm sure she could have objected to that and it would have been respected. That girl is on fire.

Edited February 12, 2020 by ShadowFacts

[ElectricBoogaloo]

2 hours ago, greekmom said:

What really bothered me about Toby is the fact he keeps mentioning he wont be able to watch Star Wars with his son.  Not play catch, not ride a bike, not play overall but just Star Wars (oh and he added Rick and Morty).  First, there is descriptive television and movies for the blind. Second, even if Jack was a sighted child, who knows if he would EVEN want to watch Star Wars with dad or football with mom.  Kids don’t turn out to have the same interests as parents.

ITA - I think all parents need to prepare themselves for the very distinct possibility that their kids will not share their interest in sports/movies/music/various activities. Toby is leaning so hard on some specific ones that he wants Jack to love and I don't think he realizes that even if Jack had 20/20 vision, he still might have had no interest in his dad's favorite movies or tv shows.

 

[DoubleUTeeEff]

Toddler Kate could not be more cute. I found Jack's injecting a Prince without the poufy sleeves into the story obnoxious until Kate saved it by disappearing him without a thought, ha.

I don't think Teen Kate is all that big and could see plenty of boys being interested in her. I do understand that she feels like Mark is the only one who could ever be interested in her. It's a very understandable POV from a teen girl. That coupled with her lack of experience has really set her up to be vulnerable for Mark's abuse.

2 hours ago, BonnieD said:

Unpopular opinion but you must know if you saw everything from Bad Boyfriend's POV, all the things in his life that warped him, and perhaps even medical reasons why he is the erratic, passive aggressive, controlling person he is, then you would not immediately stamp him as VILLAIN. All people are full of crazy complications and that is what can keep someone in "stand by yer man" mode for so much longer than they should.

I'm sure if we saw Mark's background, it would explain his behavior. In no way, shape or form would it excuse his behavior. He's straight up abusive. I was terrified of his reckless driving. It really shows how far gone Kate is for her to get back in the car after that!

11 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

I'm fat and old so you can imagine my swimsuit problems.  I thought Kate looked great in hers, her arms and legs are just fine.

Her swimsuit really covered her up, it was practically a dress. I wouldn't mind finding a suit that went that far down my legs, skirt or shorts. One of the funniest things I ever read was from a woman who was talking about those dumb articles in women's magazines that talk about buying a suit that will hide your "problem areas" and she said her whole body was a "problem area!"  It's so ridiculous that we worry about stuff like that instead of just enjoying our bodies for what they can do.

I can see why Kate is so worried about her marriage with Toby after he told her that he "wants" to be a good husband and father. I really want to tell Toby that Jack having a father who is neither fully present nor invested in his upbringing will be way more of a disability in his life than his being blind will. I think a weekend for Toby and Jack to bond is an excellent idea and I'm glad Toby is willing to do that for a start.

[greekmom]

Question. Was teen Kate wearing padding under her clothes to make her look a bit bigger?  It looked like it could be or that her clothes were really super baggy.

[Ohiopirate02]

1 minute ago, greekmom said:

Question. Was teen Kate wearing padding under her clothes to make her look a bit bigger?  It looked like it could be or that her clothes were really super baggy.

I think she was.  She was wearing a baggy babydoll dress with a large mens sweater over it, but I saw the padding.  

[Aloeonatable]

5 hours ago, Ana88 said:

Toddler Kate was also completely adorable but the whole story and scene seemed a bit.. tacky? I didn't really follow how it had such a big meaning that it had to get so much screen time? Wish it had been done better. I love seeing this interesting childhood flashbacks in general and how they have formed the people the big 3's are today. I didn't really feel this one gave me anything. Not to forget that they could have used all that extra screen time to freaking tell us what happened in the cabin!!!! Ugh. Oh well, we will see next week. 

I think those scenes were to show us how Kate got her "bug" nickname and how much she loved and needed her mother. Jack's and her story ended with her in her mother's arms. 

 

4 hours ago, Veronica said:

2 hours ago, Cementhead said:

I'm trying to watch this right now but I am always so irrationally annoyed at all of the Bug and Katie Girl nonsense in the Kate episodes.  It's just so forced and over the top to me.  I'm only 20 minutes or so into the episode and Rebecca has called Kate Bug so many times already that I just stopped watching and came here to read about the episode instead.  Admittedly, I have a way of being annoyed by things like this for some odd reason, but on this show in particular, it drives me crazy.

Gregory loves and accepts little Jack and does things like buy him the beeping toy. Meanwhile,  Toby is struggling to accept their child and his disability. Gregory is with little Jack what Toby should be. Gregory would have been all in on that retreat. Gregory was the one Kate called. 

I thought the “my son” was more to try to prove he loves and accepts little Jack, disability & all, maybe to himself more than anyone else. In my family,  it’s “my child” when the kid does something brilliant and “your child” when the kid acts a fool. 

Lord, no, just no. 

[SilverLake0315]

That was so much better than I was expecting. I was dreading a Kate centric ep, but I actually enjoyed it.

(Was also glad to see that Kevin and Madison did NOT sleep together in Kate's house.)

[Ohiopirate02]

15 minutes ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

 

I can see why Kate is so worried about her marriage with Toby after he told her that he "wants" to be a good husband and father. I really want to tell Toby that Jack having a father who is neither fully present nor invested in his upbringing will be way more of a disability in his life than his being blind will. I think a weekend for Toby and Jack to bond is an excellent idea and I'm glad Toby is willing to do that for a start.

For Toby, I think the only way out of the funk he is in is through.  He has to put in the effort to bond with his son so he can get over his hangups.  He needs to see that he can have a wonderful relationship with Jack that is different than what he imagined.  Different does not equal worse.  What he cannot continue to do is go down the woe-is-me parent of a disabled child rabbit hole he is currently barreling towards.  Spending your free time researching "cures" for blindness instead of bonding with your wife and child is not good.  Especially when you are doing it in front of your wife.  The woman who is taking care of said child while you go to work everyday and hit up the gym.  The woman who cleans your home, who cooks your food, does your laundry, who plans a surprise party for you with your Crossfit friends, etc.  Kate is doing a lot of stuff to keep her family together and Toby wants to wallow in his self-pity because Jack is not what he imagined.  

[izabella]

2 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Good catch on that, Ams.  

My take is that when Toby says, "my son," he's thinking of the mythical son he has had in his mind all his life. "Someday, my son and I will go fishing and I'll teach him..." 

It reminds me of the "Holland " story that parents of disabled children often tell.  The parents have dreamed all their lives of going to Paris.  They've saved up for it, they've talked about seeing the Eiffel Tower and eating the food, they're just so excited when they get on the plane.  Then they get off the plane and they're in Holland.  It just takes them awhile to put aside their expectations, readjust, and start to appreciate that Holland is a really cool place.  In fact they love Holland!

I think this weekend will give Toby time to bond with baby Jack and he'll realize that this isn't how he pictured "his son," but he adores him the way he is.

I get this example and it's a good one. Toby is definitely disappointed to unexpectedly and inexplicably find himself in Holland.  But I think there is an equal measure of feeling sad and disappointed for Jack that he will never SEE Paris OR Holland.

2 hours ago, Cementhead said:

I'm trying to watch this right now but I am always so irrationally annoyed at all of the Bug and Katie Girl nonsense in the Kate episodes.  It's just so forced and over the top to me.  I'm only 20 minutes or so into the episode and Rebecca has called Kate Bug so many times already that I just stopped watching and came here to read about the episode instead.  Admittedly, I have a way of being annoyed by things like this for some odd reason, but on this show in particular, it drives me crazy.

I have to admit, I always want to slap Rebecca when she calls Kate "Bug." 

[BusyOctober]

I am not a big fan of adult Kate (I like the actress a lot though), but this episode was pretty good.  I am very glad she spoke up and basically told Toby to Step Up or Step Off. Whether you’ve been in an abusive relationship or not, the biggest factor in making a healthy one work is communication.  Honest, straightforward talk from both parties about what each needs/wants and what are the deal breakers.  It doesn’t mean everybody always gets what he/she wants 100% of the time, but once it’s out there, the couple can go into negotiating mode.  Nothing will kill a relationship faster or harder than unspoken desires or frustrations.  I told my now husband when we while we were dating that if I do something that he really can’t tolerate, big or small, let me know! Because I sure as Hell will be letting him know mine.  I told him I refused to let “loading the dishwasher wrong” be the reason for a divorce.

What kind of jobs do Kate and Toby have that they can keep affording all the round trip LA-to-PA plane rides?  Or fancy seminars at luxury resorts? And what jobs allow them to take so much time off?   I can TV-splain away Kevin’s ‘money is no object’ flying budget...he’s a movie star.  Even Randall’s finances have to be questioned though.  He’s a full time City Council member but I don’t imagine that salary, minus a mortgage, 2 car payments, Beth’s dance studio, the 3 kids’ activities, food, clothes, iPhones, etc.etc.etc. leaves a lot of discretionary income for monthly flights to check in on his mom and sister.

 

 

 

[ShadowFacts]

3 minutes ago, BusyOctober said:

What kind of jobs do Kate and Toby have that they can keep affording all the round trip LA-to-PA plane rides?  Or fancy seminars at luxury resorts? And what jobs allow them to take so much time off?   I can TV-splain away Kevin’s ‘money is no object’ flying budget...he’s a movie star.  Even Randall’s finances have to be questioned though.  He’s a full time City Council member but I don’t imagine that salary, minus a mortgage, 2 car payments, Beth’s dance studio, the 3 kids’ activities, food, clothes, iPhones, etc.etc.etc. leaves a lot of discretionary income for monthly flights to check in on his mom and sister.

Kate doesn't seem to be in the paid workforce currently. She finished her degree so she could become a teacher so maybe she will eventually do that. I guess we are supposed to think Toby makes a good living at whatever IT work or start up he is in. Randall could have made a load of money on Wall Street, and they sold a big house in Alpine, NJ. But it's generally kind of unbelievable how much traveling they do in terms of time off from work.

[Haleth]

Something occurs to me. If it does turn out that Mark has a medical issue that causes such wild mood swings it makes it more understandable why Kate would be impatient with Toby’s moodiness. She’s been down this road before and she’s not going to let his wishywashiness drag her and Jack down. 

[RedDelicious]

1 hour ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

Her swimsuit really covered her up, it was practically a dress. I wouldn't mind finding a suit that went that far down my legs, skirt or shorts.

Both Lands End and L.L. Bean have swim dresses, and Lands End in particular is always having a sale! Both have excellent return/exchange policies.

Kate/Chrissy always dresses so beautifully in my opinion, on and off the show. I realize she has a stylist and wardrobe department etc. but having a stylist doesn't automatically equate to looking good, and she always looks great. I liked that her swimsuit had fluttery straps and was in a pretty, bright color. Very on-trend.

They're doing such a good job with the 90s look on all of the characters. I was in my twenties then, lordt the memories! 🙂 

[sara416]

3 hours ago, Cementhead said:

I'm trying to watch this right now but I am always so irrationally annoyed at all of the Bug and Katie Girl nonsense in the Kate episodes.  It's just so forced and over the top to me.  I'm only 20 minutes or so into the episode and Rebecca has called Kate Bug so many times already that I just stopped watching and came here to read about the episode instead.  Admittedly, I have a way of being annoyed by things like this for some odd reason, but on this show in particular, it drives me crazy.

Aww...I kind of like it. Admittedly though, it's because I have a neice that I call bug. For her first Halloween her parents dressed her as a lady bug and called her FirstName Bug all night. For some reason with me it just stuck and now, at 11, I still call her Bug. 

[izabella]

2 minutes ago, sara416 said:

Aww...I kind of like it. Admittedly though, it's because I have a neice that I call bug. For her first Halloween her parents dressed her as a lady bug and called her FirstName Bug all night. For some reason with me it just stuck and now, at 11, I still call her Bug. 

Oh, boy, you might want to rethink that! 

[kicksave]

While I really enjoy this show, I have a few problems with some of the characters. So Rebecca voices her concern over her daughter's boyfriend and the response from Kate is belligerent and nasty...Rebecca just allows this kind of disrespect? I have a daughter that was a teenager at one time and I would never have tolerated that level of disrespect and then allowed my teen daughter to spend the weekend at a family vacation home with an older guy. Come on This is Us writers...give me a break. The Rebecca character is soft on all her kids while they walk all over her. After Rebecca marries Miguel, the kids, now adults, launch their verbal brattiness onto Miguel. I don't know...just seems like an unrealistic portrayal of a parent's reaction to the tone and language of a mouthy kid. 

[memememe76]

Kids on TV these days seem to be rather mouthy. The TIU kids don't seem as unruly as, say, the kids on The Affair. In this specific kitchen scene between Rebecca and Kate, Rebecca was probably more concerned about Marc, expecting Kate to lash out. It was the remark about Miguel where Rebecca mentioned Kate's behaviour, because it was unexpected. 

[kicksave]

3 hours ago, Higgins said:

I really don't ever need to hear such a lack of empathy but I do all the time. You will see fat people and too fucking bad. I'd rather be fat than mean.

I agree...however...it worries me to see someone be morbidly obese at such a young age. I worry for her health as this much weight puts her heart and other organs in a high risk category...high blood pressure, heart failure, diabetes...all are risk factors for her. At this juncture, she would probably have to have a gastric band procedure followed up with a dietician/coach to help her make the diet transition successful. Her health would improve and her life would be extended. Her weight is centered around her middle which is considered to be the worst place to carry it. I think Chrissie Metz is a very talented actress/singer and I hope she makes some personal changes that will help her to live long life.

[gonzosgirrl]

Oh, teen-Kate, run. Run away, please?

But of course she won't. I believe more of us have some version of a Mark in our past than not. I married mine, despite all the warning signs, and advice from older women with experience. It did not end well. I have a feeling Kate's story will play out similarly (with Mark's death), although if it does, it seems odd that they have never brought it up before now, given all her many issues.

This may be the most I've ever liked Rebecca. Good on ya, writers and Mandy. I was always a daddy's girl, (and I love me some Jack), but I loved my mother and that scene with toddler-Kate's 'fairy tale ending' being running into her arms was just delightful.

Is there an Emmy for casting? If there isn't, there should be, and if there is, this show should have a shelf full of them.

[Higgins]

11 minutes ago, kicksave said:

I agree...however...it worries me to see someone be morbidly obese at such a young age. I worry for her health as this much weight puts her heart and other organs in a high risk category...high blood pressure, heart failure, diabetes...all are risk factors for her. At this juncture, she would probably have to have a gastric band procedure followed up with a dietician/coach to help her make the diet transition successful. Her health would improve and her life would be extended. Her weight is centered around her middle which is considered to be the worst place to carry it. I think Chrissie Metz is a very talented actress/singer and I hope she makes some personal changes that will help her to live long life.

That's an entirely different matter. Its really her business and ridicule never helps.

[ams1001]

Here's another thing that's been nagging at me a bit, about them going to the cabin. Rebecca said they hadn't opened the cabin that year, so presumably the heat hasn't been turned on in months, the water and power are probably shut off... but she's letting Kate and her boyfriend go there, late at night, when it's cold and snowing a bit... what if there's a problem with the pipes or the furnace or something, and these two kids are there in the woods with no one around..? If I were Rebecca I wouldn't want to risk that. Even if everything's working, it's going to take a while for the furnace to warm up the place (especially at night since there's no sun to help).

[RedDelicious]

The health concerns are absolutely a valid and important point. However it can take munts (© Dr. Now) or even years to reach a healthy weight, and you can't and shouldn't hide until you reach a weight/size where people won't ridicule you for your appearance. I admire her style and I think she sets a great example in that regard. I loved the dress she was wearing when she was packing for the retreat.

[Ohiopirate02]

5 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

Here's another thing that's been nagging at me a bit, about them going to the cabin. Rebecca said they hadn't opened the cabin that year, so presumably the heat hasn't been turned on in months, the water and power are probably shut off... but she's letting Kate and her boyfriend go there, late at night, when it's cold and snowing a bit... what if there's a problem with the pipes or the furnace or something, and these two kids are there in the woods with no one around..? If I were Rebecca I wouldn't want to risk that. Even if everything's working, it's going to take a while for the furnace to warm up the place (especially at night since there's no sun to help).

I wouldn't say Rebecca is letting Kate and Mark do anything.  They are both adults and the keys are at the cabin not at her house.  She can't stop Mark from taking Kate and driving there.  Kate and Mark are both idiots for not thinking those things through, but weren't we all at that age?  

[AuxArx]

Who was in Kevin's bed?  She turned over, but I can't tell one blonde from another.

[ams1001]

7 minutes ago, AuxArx said:

Who was in Kevin's bed?  She turned over, but I can't tell one blonde from another.

Kate's friend Madison.

[ShadowFacts]

17 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

Here's another thing that's been nagging at me a bit, about them going to the cabin. Rebecca said they hadn't opened the cabin that year, so presumably the heat hasn't been turned on in months, the water and power are probably shut off... but she's letting Kate and her boyfriend go there, late at night, when it's cold and snowing a bit... what if there's a problem with the pipes or the furnace or something, and these two kids are there in the woods with no one around..? If I were Rebecca I wouldn't want to risk that. Even if everything's working, it's going to take a while for the furnace to warm up the place (especially at night since there's no sun to help).

It also stuck out to me that at the diner Rebecca said they hadn't opened the cabin for the season. Well, no, you wouldn't have in February. It's not the season yet, unless for ice fishing and winter sports but then you wouldn't have closed it. In Rebecca's place I would have said no, don't go. It's hers and she gets to decide what's a good idea and what's not regarding her property. And that was not a good idea. I think she was just trying not to escalate the situation.

[kicksave]

37 minutes ago, Higgins said:

That's an entirely different matter. Its really her business and ridicule never helps.

Uh...ok...I wasn't  ridiculing her I was merely voicing concern for her health. How is that off topic? 

23 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I wouldn't say Rebecca is letting Kate and Mark do anything.  They are both adults and the keys are at the cabin not at her house.  She can't stop Mark from taking Kate and driving there.  Kate and Mark are both idiots for not thinking those things through, but weren't we all at that age?  

Wait what? Kate is an adult in those scenes with Mark? I thought she was 16 or 17...the actress playing her doesn’t look 18 and they have dressed like she’s still in high school.

[Ohiopirate02]

4 minutes ago, kicksave said:

Wait what? Kate is an adult in those scenes with Mark? I thought she was 16 or 17...the actress playing her doesn’t look 18 and they have dressed like she’s still in high school.

Kate is 18 in those scenes, and Mark is 23.  At the same time Randall is a freshman in college dating Beth who is the same age, and Kevin has started an acting career while married to Sophie a college student.  

[ams1001]

3 minutes ago, kicksave said:

Uh...ok...I wasn't  ridiculing her I was merely voicing concern for her health. How is that off topic? 

Wait what? Kate is an adult in those scenes with Mark? I thought she was 16 or 17...the actress playing her doesn’t look 18 and they have dressed like she’s still in high school.

They're 18 in those scenes (Kevin is married and Randall is a freshman in college). The actress (Hannah Zeile) is 22.

If my parents owned a cabin like that they certainly wouldn't let me just decide to go there in the middle of winter when it's been closed up for months, at age 18. I mean, yeah, they're legally adults, but Rebecca is still well within her rights to say no to that plan.

(But I agree, she probably just didn't want to argue. But it was a bad idea.)

[RedDelicious]

7 minutes ago, kicksave said:

Uh...ok...I wasn't  ridiculing her I was merely voicing concern for her health. How is that off topic? 

I think Higgins was referring to the OP who made the unfortunate comment. And you're right too, it is very much an important issue. I'd love for Kate to succeed with her weight loss to show viewers it CAN be done. 

[Quiet1]

Rebecca is celebrating the 40th birthday party with Kate and Kevin but not with Randall. I wonder if Rebecca had a say in that. She seems closest to Randall. 

[chitowngirl]

I still call my son “bug” it’s short for “bugaboo”. He’s 25. I only do it between us, never in a public setting. It’s just a term of endearment. 

[hula-la]

Can we stop with the concern trolling about weight, and the "medicalising" of abuse (he's not abusive, he's got bipolar disorder!).

[Madding crowd]

I thought Kate looked great in her swimsuit and people shouldn't have to hide out because someone shallow doesn't want to see them. People come in all colors, shapes and sizes. And I think Kate has been trying to talk to Toby, he just isn't responding. It takes time to get used to a child with disabilities, but no mother wants to hear her husband say he is sad whenever he looks at his child. Kate is doing what she can to prepare herself as Jack's mother. And talking to a neighbor in passing is not cheating-I talk to men every day and I am certainly not cheating on my husband.

I agree that Mandy Moore did a great job here and this was one of my favorite episodes. I do get a little tired of the scenes with adult Jack, but his one was well done. 

[OhSarah69]

Really liked this episode and didn't want it to end.  Little-girl Kate was adorable and I loved the dreamy quality of her scenes with Jack.  I liked the pacing of the episode.  As someone mentioned upthread, I too have a sinking feeling that Teen Kate's boyfriend will try to or succeed in committing suicide.  He is clearly fighting demons and it's sad to watch.  That said, he is also a dick to Kate.  I get why she seems to give him a pass - he made her feel seen, though in a different way than her Dad did, and what girl doesn't desire that? 

Mandy Moore as Older Rebecca is....everything.  She gets the nuancing and way of speaking and even her way of physically being near the actors who are playing her adult children just right.  If I were a casual watcher and didn't know she was just playing older in those scenes, I wouldn't have guessed it.  Last night she blew me away.  I absolutely loved that while she still can, before it's too late, she shared all these detailed memories with Kate in the pool.  Also kudos to the writers for making Rebecca tell Kate about the memory issues now; I was so afraid she was only going to tell Randall and then hell would break loose when the truth came out later.  I mean, it seems like Kevin may not find out until later, so maybe hell will still break loose, but at least 2 out of 3 kids will have heard it directly from her.

Kate/Chrissy in that red swimsuit, in the moonlight...dreamy.  Gorgeously shot and not gratuitous.  The whole scene had a kind of other-worldly quality to me at times.  Earlier in the episode when they mentioned going to the pool, I have to admit that I did wonder whether she would physically get in the pool and what that would look like (I mean the whole scene, not just the bathing suit, but you know what I mean).

Oh Toby...poor miserable, slimmed-down Toby.  I totally agree with someone earlier who said (better than I'm about to say it) that Toby's pointed references to "MY SON" seemed to be him fighting between what he thought his son would be and would be able to do, and what his son will actually be able to do and not do (sorry for my awkward phrasing there).  That said - I think it's fair that Toby be allowed time to "grieve"; not for his son who of course is healthy and alive and a joy, but for the loss of things that are not to be (his son will never see a sunset, etc).  I am not an expert but it seems that that would be reasonably normal feelings to have.  However we see that Kate is moving forward, celebrating her son and giving her all to make sure he will have the best life possible.  So what is a couple to do when they are at different spots in the road? 

For a moment when Toby sat down and looked like he was going to throw up or something, I thought, "oh shit, he's going to tell Kate he slept with someone else".  I'm glad he didn't and I hope he doesn't. That would be so trite.

 

 

 

Edited February 12, 2020 by OhSarah69

[Empress1]

3 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

The way forward for Toby is to spend hands-on, one-on-one time with Jack. He will see from experiences they have that the two of them will have a different future than he imagined/hoped for, but a good one. As to Gregory, he can be a wonderful support, but Kate still needs to be communicating with Toby.

I agree. I actually thought Toby spending the weekend with Jack was the right call, rather than Kate taking him with her.

As someone else said, I don't think there's anything wrong with couples having friends that are just theirs (I actually think it's quite healthy), but the fact that both of them have people that they're sharing emotional things with and not sharing them with each other is problematic.

20 minutes ago, Quiet1 said:

Rebecca is celebrating the 40th birthday party with Kate and Kevin but not with Randall. I wonder if Rebecca had a say in that. She seems closest to Randall. 

I don't think she did - in that flash forward she asked if Randall was there and Kevin said no, you know Randall and I aren't speaking. I'm sure if she had her way she'd have celebrated with all three of them. 

1 hour ago, memememe76 said:

Kids on TV these days seem to be rather mouthy. The TIU kids don't seem as unruly as, say, the kids on The Affair.

I stopped watching The Affair well before it ended (I think I lasted two seasons), but I commented often about how shitty those kids were. Just awful people.

44 minutes ago, ShadowFacts said:

In Rebecca's place I would have said no, don't go. It's hers and she gets to decide what's a good idea and what's not regarding her property.

Teenage Kate is mouthier than my parents tolerated, but most TV and movie kids are mouthier than my parents tolerated. If 18-year-old me had snapped that my boyfriend and I were going to the cabin right then, my mother would have asked me if I had ever paid a house note on said cabin and shut it down.

I didn't realize Mark is 23 - I assumed he was 18 or 19 like Kate.

Edited February 12, 2020 by Empress1

[Aileen]

46 minutes ago, kicksave said:

Uh...ok...I wasn't  ridiculing her I was merely voicing concern for her health. How is that off topic? 

Wait what? Kate is an adult in those scenes with Mark? I thought she was 16 or 17...the actress playing her doesn’t look 18 and they have dressed like she’s still in high school.

She's past high school. Jack died during senior year and they're already living in the new house. This is well into what would be her freshman year of college.

Edited February 12, 2020 by Aileen

[deirdra]

With all the money this show is making, why can't they get Rebecca a wig that doesn't look so fake.  It is distracting.

[Empress1]

3 minutes ago, deirdra said:

With all the money this show is making, why can't they get Rebecca a wig that doesn't look so fake.  It is distracting.

I noticed that with her late 40s wig. It has no part. She needs a lace front.

[PRgal]

43 minutes ago, chitowngirl said:

I still call my son “bug” it’s short for “bugaboo”. He’s 25. I only do it between us, never in a public setting. It’s just a term of endearment. 

I have a cousin who was called "Baby" because he's the youngest.  I'm not sure if he's still called that, but he's in his 30s now. 

 

1 hour ago, kicksave said:

Uh...ok...I wasn't  ridiculing her I was merely voicing concern for her health. How is that off topic? 

Wait what? Kate is an adult in those scenes with Mark? I thought she was 16 or 17...the actress playing her doesn’t look 18 and they have dressed like she’s still in high school.

Teen Kate's 18 during yesterday's episode.  I don't know how old you are, but that's how many of us dressed in the late 90s.  

[JudyObscure]

38 minutes ago, chitowngirl said:

I still call my son “bug” it’s short for “bugaboo”. He’s 25. I only do it between us, never in a public setting. It’s just a term of endearment. 

When my brother and I were very little we watched an old gangster movie where the little weaselly guy was called "punk."  He started calling me punk and to this day the whole family calls me Punk or Punkie when they're feeling particularly affectionate.  I don't mind a bit. We hear the love in those terms of endearments, however silly they are.

I have a friend who is an ER nurse and her son a police officer.  He came in her ER with a bad accident one time and, in the stress of the moment he called her Mama which he hadn't done since he was a toddler.  That was so sweet to me.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

3 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

Kate doesn't seem to be in the paid workforce currently. She finished her degree so she could become a teacher so maybe she will eventually do that. I guess we are supposed to think Toby makes a good living at whatever IT work or start up he is in. Randall could have made a load of money on Wall Street, and they sold a big house in Alpine, NJ. But it's generally kind of unbelievable how much traveling they do in terms of time off from work.

Kate is home with Jack. Toby said work was blowing up, so maybe it is tough for him to take a lot of time off, depending on what project he is currently working on. We've seen that Randall can clear his schedule when he needs to; it just means he is unavailable for meetings with constituents and other politicians,  which could ultimately hurt him come election time. He still gets his salary, whether or not he shows up for work.

[Crs97]

Feel like I should start this by saying I have two kids with special needs.  I understand Toby, and I thought he was very open and upfront with Kate when he told her he needed to spend some time researching the girl’s procedure and just wanted to have an evening with hope.  Also, don’t forget that when we’ve seen Toby with Jack, he’s been loving with him and Kate has been upset that Toby didn’t have the right toy or outfit for Jack.  She surprises him with this planned weekend and takes it away when he doesn’t react exactly like she wanted.  I am not surprised he didn’t want to go, but he was packing and I bet if he had gone he would have gotten the hope he was looking for.  She took that from him.  Now he wants to take care of Jack for the weekend, and she doesn’t think he can do it.  I thought she was the unreasonable one, especially considering she micromanages his interactions with Jack in a way that makes him doubt his abilities.
 

They both need therapy desperately.

Edited February 12, 2020 by Crs97

[ams1001]

3 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

When my brother and I were very little we watched an old gangster movie where the little weaselly guy was called "punk."  He started calling me punk and to this day the whole family calls me Punk or Punkie when they're feeling particularly affectionate.  I don't mind a bit. We hear the love in those terms of endearments, however silly they are.

My mom and I go by the same name (it's her middle name and my first name). Everyone in the family refers to us as Big A--- and Little A---, respectively, (even though I've been taller than her since about middle school).

My dad calls me Bunky but only when I seem like I'm not feeling well ("what's the matter, Bunky?"). No idea where it came from. He also calls me Al (also starts emails with that), which is the first syllable of my name, and which I don't actually like as a general nickname. (He doesn't call my mom that, either.) But he's my dad and I like it from him. 

Somehow I don't think she'd like other people to pick up the nickname, but Kate doesn't seem to mind being called Bug by her mom.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

2 hours ago, ams1001 said:

Here's another thing that's been nagging at me a bit, about them going to the cabin. Rebecca said they hadn't opened the cabin that year, so presumably the heat hasn't been turned on in months, the water and power are probably shut off... but she's letting Kate and her boyfriend go there, late at night, when it's cold and snowing a bit... what if there's a problem with the pipes or the furnace or something, and these two kids are there in the woods with no one around..? If I were Rebecca I wouldn't want to risk that. Even if everything's working, it's going to take a while for the furnace to warm up the place (especially at night since there's no sun to help).

Of course you are right about the cabin, but how would she stop them from going? Race them to the cabin and get to the hidden key first? Call the local police and have Kate and Marc arrested when they get there?  Tell Kate that she can't return home if she goes with Marc? Her options are very limited since Kate is over 18, and reasoning with her will not work. (In real life, though, a brief discussion about birth control would have been appropriate, as this is Kate's first away time with a boyfriend.)

Edited February 12, 2020 by ItCouldBeWorse

[slasherboy]

17 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

I can think of one brother who's going to want to pound him into the ground.

I can think of TWO!

 

17 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

I don't know if Kate is doing anything better by calling Gregory than Toby was in confiding in his Crossfit female friend.  A little bit different, but maybe a little bit dangerous.

I know what you're saying, but I kind of don't think it's as bad because at least Gregory knows Toby and Toby knows he and Kate are friends, whereas Kate didn't have a clue about Toby's crossfit friend.  That seems a bit more clandestine to me.

 

17 hours ago, bettername2come said:

The boyfriend is a jerk. I hate that Kate doesn't see it...

Oh, Kate sees it.  She just doesn't want to acknowledge or believe it.  But she sees it.  She's not stupid.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

1 hour ago, kicksave said:

Wait what? Kate is an adult in those scenes with Mark? I thought she was 16 or 17...the actress playing her doesn’t look 18 and they have dressed like she’s still in high school.

Perhaps this is your first season watching, but it has been well established that Randall is in college and Kevin is married. Kate opted out of college after Jack died and got a job in the music store where she met Marc. No one is in high school.

Edited February 12, 2020 by ItCouldBeWorse