S01.E08: You Found Me

[paulvdb]

Quote

Season Finale Time! Questions answered! Secrets revealed! Conflicts... conflicted! Characters exploded! And so much more!

Premiere date: July 26, 2019

[retrograde]

I enjoyed the whole series a lot, but dear god Karl Urban's "British" accent was Dick Van Dyke levels of bad. 

[kendi]

That's just not his natural accent, being from New Zealand? I know they kept referring to him as the British guy, but I honestly thought he wasn't trying to do a British accent.

I really enjoyed this series. I watched 3 episodes last night and finished the rest tonight. 

[retrograde]

6 hours ago, kendi said:

That's just not his natural accent, being from New Zealand? I know they kept referring to him as the British guy, but I honestly thought he wasn't trying to do a British accent.

That's one of the things that makes it so bad -- he is using his natural accent a lot of the time, then suddenly slipping in these god-awful "'ello 'ello 'ello" affectations. It was also dodgy in Thor Ragnarok but not this bad. 

[mac123x]

I enjoyed the series as a whole (binge watched it in one sitting) but I going into it I thought it was a self-contained story.  I was not expecting a cliff-hanger.  Season 2 will be what, another year or two?

[Shorty186]

1 hour ago, mac123x said:

I enjoyed the series as a whole (binge watched it in one sitting) but I going into it I thought it was a self-contained story.  I was not expecting a cliff-hanger.  Season 2 will be what, another year or two?

They're already casting it, so it probably will just be a year. They already announced Aya Cash has joined as another superhero.

[Richness]

I turned on the closed captions for all of Butcher's scenes so I could hear/see everything throughout the series. I love Karl Urban as Bones in Star Trek (and several other things), but this accent was difficult to follow at times, especially when there's other sounds going on at the same time.

After last episode, I was honestly expecting the big "surprise" at the end. I might not have known exactly what was going to happen, but it certainly fell into predictable place. I suppose that's my biggest complaint about the series. The dark side to superheroes has been done before, and done better. Maybe not in live-action (Hancock was atrocious), but it's been done.

I'm also not sure what to make of the Deep's shave down. Was it a  catharsis moment or further breakdown? As I mentioned for the previous episode, I really hope they empower him a little bit to subvert the Aquaman laughing stock trope. While I don't expect him to be redeemed, I do want him to actually help his beloved sea life instead of getting them killed. RIP dolphin and lobster.

And as I commented on the first episode, I'm definitely hooked on this series, and hope we get several seasons. The gore is a bit much, but it's the only original programming I've enjoyed on Prime so far. Of course, that's all going to change when the Expanse starts up.

[IndyMischa]

I binged the whole thing yesterday, and really enjoyed it. I came into it with no expectations, never read or even heard of the books, but got sucked in by a promo. Homelander is delightfully broken, as are most of the rest of the characters. Gustavo Fring showing up as the big boss, heading into season two without his right hand woman, is just icing. 

[moonshine71]

I need to rewatch that final showdown, but did we just see Butcher blow up a baby? Murdering innocent children  is about as terrorist as you can get, and when you factor in that he knew damn well he wasn't going to kill Homelander w/ that blast, wtf? He had already gotten to the point that I can't see him as the good guy, but now I can't watch anyone that even works with him and be in their corner.

[dini]

Is Homelander indestructible? Or would some C4 up his ass have the same effect on him as Translucent?   

Yeah, found the baby thing a bit off. I think Homelander is too selfish and was way too jealous of the baby to save him too, but maybe he had also been injected with compound V and was ok.  Any why did he save Butcher? (apart from Plot reasons)  Was a bit surprised about Elizabeth Shue at the end. Wasn't expecting that! 

But Butcher, really?  Seems like Becca wasn't that well hidden. could have tried harder...

[mxc90]

On 7/29/2019 at 1:59 AM, dini said:

Any why did he save Butcher?

Maybe to rub in: he got Butcher's wife pregnant and she's alive to raise his son all these years.

I too don't believe the baby was saved ( I doubt he time to save both). I was already down on Butcher for what he did to Mesmer. Now he reached a new low with the baby.

Now that Madelyn is out of the picture, what will be Homelander's weakness? 

[marketdoctor]

The only way the baby would have been saved is either if the baby is also super-powered (like laser-baby from a few episodes ago) or if Homelander grabbed them both on the way out.  I could see Homelander considering that, just to have future leverage.

As to why Homelander saved Butcher, I think this is a big part of it:

Quote

Maybe to rub in: he got Butcher's wife pregnant and she's alive to raise his son all these years.

Plus Homelander thinks he's invincible, so Butcher is no threat, and in the off chance Butcher does have another fail-safe, that fail-safe wouldn't be implemented.

I wondered how they were going to end it in an hour, and...they didn't.

Overall, it was darker than I thought it would be from the ads (I hadn't read the comics), but the production values were great,and I liked the acting.  I would have liked them to just let Karl Urban use his native accent, but 95% of the time, I wonder why they don't do that.  (5% of the time it's a docu-drama or there are important plot reasons to have someone from a specific place.)

[Miles]

Did Butcher just blow up a baby for no particular reason? Man, that's dark.

I mean he knew that it wouldn't do anything to homelander and the worst homelander was likely going to do was kill him anyway. So there was really no reason to pull that trigger.

I don't really buy how the american government responded to the situation. I thought the more likely reponse would have been to raid Vought for the compound V and make their own super soldiers. But oh well...

[Miles]

On 7/29/2019 at 7:59 AM, dini said:

Is Homelander indestructible? Or would some C4 up his ass have the same effect on him as Translucent?   

Vought lady said that he survived any weapon they've thrown at him without a scratch. I assume that would be quite a bit more than a little bit of C4. Not sure if something up his ass would work better, but good luck ggetting it there anyway.

[Spaceman Spiff]

I enjoyed this a lot.

What bothered me toward the end of the season was it seemed like they were trying to garner sympathy for A-Train and The Deep, which I had none. A-Train with his weeping over his dead girlfriend, that he killed, but blamed Hughie for and then the females assault on The Deep's gills and concurrent breakdown of him shaving his whole body.

Plus I didn't understand Annie at the party wearing the skimpy uniform when episodes earlier, in a slightly empowering move for her,  she insisted to Madelyn that she was going back to her old costume. Plus the subsequent throwing up in the bathroom. Does it make her sick to her stomach that she had to schmooze that guy at the party, that she physically gets ill? And then when she went to save Hughie she was back in her old costume. Just seemed off.

I picked up on the fact the baby had lived when Madelyn told Homelander a different version of the baby's death.

On 7/29/2019 at 12:59 AM, dini said:

But Butcher, really?  Seems like Becca wasn't that well hidden. could have tried harder... 

Do we even know where they ended up? That home could be anywhere in the US, like a witness protection program.

[revbfc]

I liked Hugh’s line about wanting to stop the neverending violence and gore.  Maybe it’s just me, but it seemed like a nod to how that was the weak part of the comic.

[Racj82]

On 7/28/2019 at 3:41 PM, moonshine71 said:

I need to rewatch that final showdown, but did we just see Butcher blow up a baby? Murdering innocent children  is about as terrorist as you can get, and when you factor in that he knew damn well he wasn't going to kill Homelander w/ that blast, wtf? He had already gotten to the point that I can't see him as the good guy, but now I can't watch anyone that even works with him and be in their corner.

Eh. 

But I may be cold and dead inside. Everytime someone is truly bothered or disturbed by something in fiction, my general reaction is eh. I understand where you are coming from, I just don't care. 

[Catfi9ht]

On 7/31/2019 at 5:51 AM, Spaceman Spiff said:

Plus I didn't understand Annie at the party wearing the skimpy uniform when episodes earlier, in a slightly empowering move for her,  she insisted to Madelyn that she was going back to her old costume. Plus the subsequent throwing up in the bathroom. Does it make her sick to her stomach that she had to schmooze that guy at the party, that she physically gets ill? And then when she went to save Hughie she was back in her old costume. Just seemed off.

I agree. I'm guessing there's a deleted scene where someone tells Annie she has to go to the party and wear the costume or else.

I guess I must be super jaded because I expected this show to be as zany as Preacher (and subsequently the comic), but it wasn't even close for me. While the writing was fine, overall tone of the show was too middle of the road, and I didn't really like any of the casting choices except maybe Frenchie.

The earlier episodes seemed to embrace the hyper realistic style more, like Frenchie's failed attempts to kill Translucent, but the tone was dropped an episode or two later. However, I thought the musical choices in each episode were excellent.

I'm not the type of fan that expects movies or TV shows to be 100% faithful to their original inspirations, but I would like them to be "in the spirit of". This show didn't capture that same spirit for me. I'm glad Amazon took a chance, but I wished they would have leaned in and embraced the tone of the comics instead of hovering on the outskirts.

[Sakura12]

Butcher blowing himself and the baby up seems like something he would do. He had nothing left. I also see him and Homelander as two sides of the same coin. They want what they want and screw everyone else.  

I loved Anthony Starr in Banshee, and his character on that show was practically super human so not too much of a stretch to play Homelander. Still I loved his portrayal as psychopath Superman/Captain America. Someone with that much power would be scary if they had no humanity. 

I hope next season we get more info on Queen Mauve and Black Noir. The former had the screen time but very little story. What even are her powers? Super strength? She can't fly so I don't really understand her character. And for their Batman stand in, he did nothing. I know he's supposed to be the dark and quiet one. But he was too quiet. They all seem to be bullet proof since Startlight was fine after Butcher shot her. 

[Racj82]

On 7/31/2019 at 5:51 AM, Spaceman Spiff said:

I enjoyed this a lot.

What bothered me toward the end of the season was it seemed like they were trying to garner sympathy for A-Train and The Deep, which I had none. A-Train with his weeping over his dead girlfriend, that he killed, but blamed Hughie for and then the females assault on The Deep's gills and concurrent breakdown of him shaving his whole body.

Plus I didn't understand Annie at the party wearing the skimpy uniform when episodes earlier, in a slightly empowering move for her,  she insisted to Madelyn that she was going back to her old costume. Plus the subsequent throwing up in the bathroom. Does it make her sick to her stomach that she had to schmooze that guy at the party, that she physically gets ill? And then when she went to save Hughie she was back in her old costume. Just seemed off.

I picked up on the fact the baby had lived when Madelyn told Homelander a different version of the baby's death.

Do we even know where they ended up? That home could be anywhere in the US, like a witness protection program.

I'm not sure why anyone is confused by Starlight at the party. She was acting out after finding out everything she did via Hughy. 

People do this all the time. Something shitty happens or someone gets their heart broken. That person, in turn, goes out and gets plastered.

She was literally doing everything opposite of how she usual is and presents herself. A drunk lush, skimpy hero outfit and looking to get laid. But that is not her. She doesn't drink like that, thus the vomiting.

She ultimately, with a little pep talk, embraced who she really is and wants to be. A hero.

[bosawks]

I wonder how much darker Homelander is going to get in season two after killing Stillwell who is now still and not well.

As jacked up as that relationship was it did seem to be the thinnest of threads tethering him to a degree of sanity.

[Whimsy]

On 7/27/2019 at 3:07 AM, retrograde said:

I enjoyed the whole series a lot, but dear god Karl Urban's "British" accent was Dick Van Dyke levels of bad. 

I thought he sounded like the Geico gecko lol 

[Morrigan2575]

 I'm not surprised Butcher set the bomb off, he was on a suicide mission anyway.  Storywise, Butcher is who Hughie would be if not for Annie. Maeve is who Starlight would be, if not for Hughie.  Hopefully Maeve and Butcher can find their way back.

I wasn't shocked by Becca being alive nor about Homelander killing Stillwell.

I'm really curious about S2, I want to learn more about Black Noir. I also want to know who/what is up with that damn fly.

As a Supernatural fan I was happy to see Him Beaver AKA Bobby Singer on The Boys...maybe Kripke will get his other Boys to make an appearance after SPN ends.

Edited August 3, 2019 by Morrigan2575

[Arynm]

7 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I also want to know who/what is up with that damn fly.

I read an AMA from Eric Kripke and he said that the fly was just a fly. He thought it added reality to the scenes so he left the fly noise in. Is he telling the truth? That I can't tell, he might be holding back a reveal for next season, but that is what he said.

[Morrigan2575]

1 hour ago, Arynm said:

I read an AMA from Eric Kripke and he said that the fly was just a fly. He thought it added reality to the scenes so he left the fly noise in. Is he telling the truth? That I can't tell, he might be holding back a reveal for next season, but that is what he said.

Oh damn that just ruined something potentially really cool 😁

[FishyJoe]

I don't believe for a second the fly stuff was random. They don't make it that obvious for nothing.

[PWHCHCH]

12 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

As a Supernatural fan I was happy to see Him Beaver AKA Bobby Singer on The Boys...maybe Kripke will get his other Boys to make an appearance after SPN ends.

I didn’t see Jim at all. What character was he playing ?

[Morrigan2575]

On 8/4/2019 at 4:34 AM, GSManiac said:

I didn’t see Jim at all. What character was he playing ?

He was the Government guy that met with Stillwell when they talked about how Compound V got into Terrorist hands and, how the Government now needed Vaught and it's heroes to protect the world against Super Villains.

I just looked it up on IMDB, his character is listed as Robert Singer, Oh Kripke 😁❤

Edited August 5, 2019 by Morrigan2575

[AuntiePam]

Are we supposed to believe that Madelyn kept Becca and the boy hidden away for eight years?  Homelander never looked for Becca?  I suppose if she was just a one night stand, he wouldn't care, so yeah, maybe that part is believable.

When was Madelyn going to tell him?  Or is there a chance Madelyn didn't know? 

I'm not at all familiar with superheroes or super-anti-heroes, so all this was new to me, and a lot of fun.  I'm sure I missed some gags and inside jokes -- like the one with the dolphin going through the windshield.  Wasn't that done -- successfully -- in a movie? 

I also enjoyed seeing some familiar faces, although I didn't twig to Antony Starr, and I loved Banshee.  Gus Fring, John Rawls, Bobby Singer, and Simon Pegg as Hughie's dad -- awesome.  I thought the casting was perfect. 

[Morrigan2575]

14 hours ago, AuntiePam said:

Are we supposed to believe that Madelyn kept Becca and the boy hidden away for eight years?  Homelander never looked for Becca?  I suppose if she was just a one night stand, he wouldn't care, so yeah, maybe that part is believable.

When was Madelyn going to tell him?  Or is there a chance Madelyn didn't know? 

Homelander doesn't care about people other than the enjoyment he gets out of hurting them so, I doubt he gave Becca a second thought.

Vaught most likely kept the kid hidden because Homelander (and possibly all Supes) were expected to be sterile. So a 2nd generation Supe would be a possible threat to their control of heroes (via Compound V). Plus, Stillwell was afraid of Home lander and the scientist that created him said that raising a child in the lab created something cruel. No doubt they both wanted to keep their new little experiment and, possible weapon against Homelander safe and loved and raised to be "good".

[Whimsy]

4 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Homelander doesn't care about people other than the enjoyment he gets out of hurting them so, I doubt he gave Becca a second thought.

Vaught most likely kept the kid hidden because Homelander (and possibly all Supes) were expected to be sterile. So a 2nd generation Supe would be a possible threat to their control of heroes (via Compound V). Plus, Stillwell was afraid of Home lander and the scientist that created him said that raising a child in the lab created something cruel. No doubt they both wanted to keep their new little experiment and, possible weapon against Homelander safe and loved and raised to be "good".

Did they say in the show that they're sterile?  I may have missed it if they did because all the way until Madelyn was killed I was waiting for it to come out that her baby was Homelander's. 

[marcee]

2 minutes ago, Whimsy said:

Did they say in the show that they're sterile?  I may have missed it if they did because all the way until Madelyn was killed I was waiting for it to come out that her baby was Homelander's. 

Homelander was shocked and said something like, "I thought I couldn't..." And with all the supes sleeping around, it would've happened already - and yet, there are no super babies running around. The company line is that those born with powers were chosen by God. Not one super claimed to be born of super parents. Now, the question is - are they sterile because of the Compound V or were they purposely sterilized by Vought so they wouldn't flood the market or have supe competition?

[Whimsy]

9 minutes ago, marcee said:

Homelander was shocked and said something like, "I thought I couldn't..." And with all the supes sleeping around, it would've happened already - and yet, there are no super babies running around. The company line is that those born with powers were chosen by God. Not one super claimed to be born of super parents. Now, the question is - are they sterile because of the Compound V or were they purposely sterilized by Vought so they wouldn't flood the market or have supe competition?

I guess that all makes sense.  I just didn't concentrate on that too hard, I guess.  

Good question about why they are sterile.  Either answer is pretty compelling. 

[Morrigan2575]

20 minutes ago, marcee said:

Now, the question is - are they sterile because of the Compound V or were they purposely sterilized by Vought so they wouldn't flood the market or have supe competition?

It's a good question and I hope it gets discussed next season. Think of just how evil this company is to not only experiment on babies but to chemically sterilize them (side effect/deliberately) in order to maintain control of their IP. They really don't consider these supes to be actual people. Which of coursakes me wonder do they not have contingency plans? Do they really think every super will be content with money/fame and not a single one will think World Domination?

[Potanical Pardon]

On 8/4/2019 at 7:15 AM, Morrigan2575 said:

I also want to know who/what is up with that damn fly.

It has to be an Atom/Ant-Man type of character spying on behalf of Gus Fring (who is Vought?)

[deerstalker]

All the Supes aren’t sterile. Mesmer has a daughter, and Translucent had a son that was mentioned. So probably just Homelander. 

I dont think Stillwell is dead, nor did Homelander replace the baby back upstairs. He whispered something in Stillwell’s ear to make her relax, and after that they seemed to be overtly acting. I don’t know all of Homelander’s powers, but this seemed a little too pat for me. 

[Morrigan2575]

6 hours ago, deerstalker said:

All the Supes aren’t sterile. Mesmer has a daughter, and Translucent had a son that was mentioned. So probably just Homelander. 

I can't believe I forgot about Mesmer's daughter. So yeah I wonder if/why they expected Homelander to be Sterile

[marcee]

11 hours ago, deerstalker said:

All the Supes aren’t sterile. Mesmer has a daughter, and Translucent had a son that was mentioned. So probably just Homelander.

Well crap, you're so right. I don't know why I made that leap. But yeah, I feel like they tried to make it clear that Homelander couldn't - for whatever reason. But I guess he can. Now I'm wondering if any of the other super-kids are super too? If Compound V mutated their genes enough to make them super, why couldn't/wouldn't it be passed down to their kids? And isn't that a concern for Vought?

[Sakura12]

Maybe because Homelander was raised in a lab they tried to make him sterile. And maybe Mauve too. Although in the comics she had 2 kids. 

[festivus]

Aww, man I'm going to miss Elisabeth Shue. She was such a good smarmy corporate type, I enjoyed her character.

So Homelander showing Butcher his son and the wife will have to backfire, right? Because now Butcher will have leverage. I mean, dude blew up a baby knowing it wouldn't kill Homelander cause he just doesn't seem to give a fuck. Why wouldn't he try to use the kid somehow and I can't see him forgiving wifey. I think Homelander is going to feel like it's important that this kid has a mother. I don't really want an answer, just thinking outloud, I don't read the comics so I don't want to know what's going to happen.

I do want to know what that shaving scene with The Deep was about though. I didn't really get that. Is he going back to the sea? What up dude?

[marcee]

17 hours ago, festivus said:

I do want to know what that shaving scene with The Deep was about though. I didn't really get that. Is he going back to the sea? What up dude?

It's reminiscent of a woman chopping off her hair after getting raped - just doing something drastic to your appearance to potentially make you less attractive. It also doesn't hurt that it reduces drag in the water - so maybe he's intending to "run away" and live under water for a while.

Edited August 8, 2019 by marcee

[Rambler]

This was one of the more enjoyable shows I’ve seen in the past few years. However, now that I've watched the entire season, I do have a question about the basic setup.

So Vought injects babies with a drug that gives them superpowers. According to Starlight, they have no knowledge of this, and they grow up thinking that God gave them these abilities. When they become adults, I guess Vought somehow gets them to join their company. Now is it entirely voluntary? If so, I would have to believe there would be a certain percentage that wouldn't want to take orders from a giant corporation, so I guess there would be superpowered people running around in this world who don't work for Vought?

If all this is true, why wouldn't the military or other government agencies recruit these independents to come work for them? From what I understood, the politicians didn't object to having superpowered people in the military per se, they just didn't want to have them there under corporate control.

So take Mesmer for example. I guess he got kicked out of Vought, because he squealed to Homelander in the hopes that he could get back in. So if he wasn't working for Vought anymore, why is he relegated to signing autographs and posing for pictures? You would think some agency like the CIA would kill to have someone with his abilities on the payroll. You capture a terrorist and instead of wasting time torturing him, you just have Mesmer come in and read his mind.

So is there some sort of contractual obligation where people with powers can only work for Vought? If so, then what is it and how is it enforced?

[Fukui San]

Yes, there are non-aligned Supes. Starlight talked about an ex-boyfriend in the speech at the Christian convention. I presume there are other, lesser Supergroups and people who aren’t aligned at all like Mesmer. Wasn’t A-Train’s speed rival in another group?

I don’t know of an in-universe reason the government hasn’t recruited them, just that it rarely happens that way in comics. I haven’t read the source comics though. 

[mac123x]

On 7/31/2019 at 4:51 AM, Spaceman Spiff said:

Do we even know where they ended up? That home could be anywhere in the US, like a witness protection program.

Down the street from Billy Batson's mother.

On 8/1/2019 at 6:45 PM, Sakura12 said:

I hope next season we get more info on Queen Mauve and Black Noir. The former had the screen time but very little story. What even are her powers? Super strength? She can't fly so I don't really understand her character. And for their Batman stand in, he did nothing.

My initial thought was that Black Noir was a satirical commentary on the tired trope of the black character getting the least development, but then A-Train is black and a major player, and we don't even know if Noir is African-American since he never takes off his uniform, so that theory is in the trash.

Then I read a summary of the character from the comic books.... no spoilers (don't know if the show is going that way anyway) but uh, wow, totally not a Batman stand-in.  Yikes.

On 8/5/2019 at 12:42 PM, marcee said:

Homelander was shocked and said something like, "I thought I couldn't..." And with all the supes sleeping around, it would've happened already - and yet, there are no super babies running around.

They probably assumed Homelander was unable to reproduce due to the Man of Steel Woman of Kleenex problems.

Edited August 9, 2019 by mac123x

[AuntiePam]

Regarding the theory that Madelyn isn't really dead -- I'm not up to rewatching, but didn't we see her sleep with a Senator -- and then she morphed into a schlubby guy, and Madelyn blackmailed him?  Or the schlub was a Supe who had morphed into Madelyn --- whatever.

Anyway, seems possible that there's a Supe with a power to morph, whether it's Madelyn or someone else -- she could "morph" into a dead-looking thing and make Billy think Homelander had burned her brain out.

[Raja]

14 hours ago, Rambler said:

So is there some sort of contractual obligation where people with powers can only work for Vought? If so, then what is it and how is it enforced?

I imagine that the fear of a Homelander fly by keeps most in line. And those who don't go missing like Translucent. 

[AnimeMania]

19 hours ago, Fukui San said:

Yes, there are non-aligned Supes. Starlight talked about an ex-boyfriend in the speech at the Christian convention. I presume there are other, lesser Supergroups and people who aren’t aligned at all like Mesmer. Wasn’t A-Train’s speed rival in another group?

I could be wrong but I think all the Supes are members of Vought. Vought creates them and has a contract with the parents that the Supe child will join Vought. Vought creates a hierarchy system where the top Supes get the major cities and all the others go to different cities based on how good their powers are.

15 hours ago, AuntiePam said:

Regarding the theory that Madelyn isn't really dead -- I'm not up to rewatching, but didn't we see her sleep with a Senator -- and then she morphed into a schlubby guy, and Madelyn blackmailed him?  Or the schlub was a Supe who had morphed into Madelyn --- whatever.

Anyway, seems possible that there's a Supe with a power to morph, whether it's Madelyn or someone else -- she could "morph" into a dead-looking thing and make Billy think Homelander had burned her brain out.

A Supe morphed into Madelyn, blackmailed the Senator, then morphed into a schlubby guy. The real Madelyn comes out to explain the deception.

[Kip Hackman]

On 8/8/2019 at 9:35 PM, AuntiePam said:

Regarding the theory that Madelyn isn't really dead -- I'm not up to rewatching, but didn't we see her sleep with a Senator -- and then she morphed into a schlubby guy, and Madelyn blackmailed him? 

Pretty sure that wasn't Madelyn ... or even Doppelganger posing as Madelyn.  Didn't look like Elisabeth Shue to me.

Edited August 12, 2019 by Kip Hackman

[The Companion]

On 7/28/2019 at 2:41 PM, moonshine71 said:

I need to rewatch that final showdown, but did we just see Butcher blow up a baby? Murdering innocent children  is about as terrorist as you can get, and when you factor in that he knew damn well he wasn't going to kill Homelander w/ that blast, wtf? He had already gotten to the point that I can't see him as the good guy, but now I can't watch anyone that even works with him and be in their corner.

I am not sure anyone working with him understands the depth of his apathy towards anyone other than himself. Well, I don't know that they DID understand. I think it became clearer as the season progressed. 

On 7/31/2019 at 4:51 AM, Spaceman Spiff said:

What bothered me toward the end of the season was it seemed like they were trying to garner sympathy for A-Train and The Deep, which I had none. A-Train with his weeping over his dead girlfriend, that he killed, but blamed Hughie for and then the females assault on The Deep's gills and concurrent breakdown of him shaving his whole body.

I think they were trying to balance out the characters a bit, but I agree. Being assaulted or being sad that the woman that you murdered is dead doesn't undo the prior actions. I do think there was an attempt to make them less black and white, and to contrast them against Homelander who is a complete narcissistic sociopath. 

On 8/1/2019 at 6:45 PM, Sakura12 said:

Butcher blowing himself and the baby up seems like something he would do. He had nothing left. I also see him and Homelander as two sides of the same coin. They want what they want and screw everyone else.  

Agree. In the end, Butcher and Homelander get there in different ways but they are the same. They only care about themselves. Butcher was on a suicide mission the entire season, and when his only leverage was gone, there was nothing left to do but blow himself up. Whatever Homelander was going to do wasn't going to be more pleasant. He didn't care about collateral damage because, honestly, he doesn't care about collateral damage. If he did, he would have made the deal with the CIA in the first place. Hughie realized it in this episode, but he never cared about the other supes. He never cared about doing the right thing. He cared about going after Homelander, and anyone who got in the way was immaterial. In the same way Homelander didn't care about the people on the plane (even if he was right) or criminal he killed, or honestly any mere mortal. 

On 8/8/2019 at 4:47 PM, Fukui San said:

Yes, there are non-aligned Supes. Starlight talked about an ex-boyfriend in the speech at the Christian convention. I presume there are other, lesser Supergroups and people who aren’t aligned at all like Mesmer. Wasn’t A-Train’s speed rival in another group?

I don’t know of an in-universe reason the government hasn’t recruited them, just that it rarely happens that way in comics. I haven’t read the source comics though. 

Vought managed more than the 7. They were negotiating with Baltimore for a hero. In the first episode, I seem to recall at the shareholders meeting discussions of having superheroes all over the country. I suspect Vought essentially takes a first right of refusal over anyone who works with them, and they dump those who turn out to have superpowers that are less impressive. Mesmer, for example, has a useful power for interrogation, but it isn't going to fight crime on the streets or sell merchandise. Also, I would expect admissibility and other issues when it comes to his power. 

I figured the baby survived last episode when the original story was told. Not faking Becca's death if they had a body, alone, didn't make sense. Beyond that, the story just didn't feel right. It wasn't clear to me whether Becca had a consensual affair or not, but given her non-reaction to Homelander I thought that was implied? 

I enjoyed that Starlight and Hughie ended up on the same side, and neither ended up on the side of the person they were originally working with. 

[blackwing]

I'm a bit confused about the entire story arc for The Deep as well.  Besides Elisabeth Shue, I would think that Chace Crawford is arguably the most recognisable "name" actor amongst the cast because of "Gossip Girl".  Curious as to the casting decision, and why he would want this role, assuming he could have lobbied for one of the other roles instead.

The character is a joke.  He's great in the water but out of the water all he can seemingly do is talk to sea creatures.  They could have at least have given him water blasts like Nicole Kidman could do in the Aquaman movie.  Because of this, I'm not sure if he suffers from low self-esteem.  Starlight mentions she had a crush on him, she turns around, and he drops his pants so she can get a look at him.  She freaks out.  He acts like it never happened and it was all a misunderstanding.

In the meantime, he tries and fails to save a dolphin.  Apparently the incident affected Starlight way more than he had thought.  She talks open in public with anguish about what was done to her.  Everyone at Vought knows it was him.  He apologises and gets banished to Sandusky.  He tries and fails to save a lobster.

He picks up some woman in a bar.  She sticks her hands into his gills, causing him pain.  If he was in so much pain, why not throw her off him?  He's supposed to have some degree of strength I thought.

So in this final episode, are we supposed to sympathise with him?  He assaulted Starlight by exposing his genitals to her.  Now he gets physically assaulted by this woman, so he now knows what Starlight felt?  And his response is to feel so bad about himself that he shaves his entire body?

I really don't understand the shaving... was it supposed to be some kind of self-mutilation?  I feel violated and I'm in anguish so I'm going to hurt myself?  Was it supposed to be a punishment?  Starlight had a crush on me and that made me do something bad so I'm going to shave my head and make myself less attractive?

Shaving the head, maybe.  But I truly am baffled by the leg and chest shaving.  I don't get what he was trying to say.