S10.E04: Patriot Love Games

[shok]

if we believe that the lead is SUPER SERIOUS about all the remaining guys, then it makes it more okay that she's encouraging them to pour their hearts out and 'put themselves out there' and whatnot. Except that Eric realized that this was what Andi was doing and called her bluff - he realized that even though she asked him to open up, she wasn't doing the same thing, because he was one of the B-roll guys (I'm pretty sure that 'our relationship is moving more slowly' is bachelor speak for 'I'm just not that into you.')

So he tried to talk to her about it - basically, he said, hey, I feel like I'm being real and vulnerable and I'm not getting that from you - and what Andi heard was "I see through the facade, and you're a bad bachelorette." And then the explosion, where he said she was acting and not being real, and she started going on and about HOW HARD she was working. 

 

Spot on. Eric's comments to Andi weren't just him calling her out tonight, it was a continuation of their conversation a couple of nights earlier when she had lit into him for not being open. He had been surprised by her accusations but he certainly didn't go off on her but she sure did tonight when he tried to explain to her that it's a two way street and it's difficult for him to be open when she's not open and welcoming in return. I thought that Eric was very classy about the whole thing.

 

Andi on the other hand showed her true colors and was very unlikable and antagonistic and egotistical. Hope all the other guys took note.

[NikSac]

I'm just now catching up via DVR but I'm also still catching up on the boards. I tried so hard not to laugh because it was a very sad story but I cracked up so hard when Andi said "It's okay" on her date. Really Andi? At least she didn't stahhhhp him. Ooh and I got a "that being said" too. C'mon stahhhhp and "at the end of the day.." I know you've got it in you....

Edited June 3, 2014 by NikSac

[chocolatine]

It was bittersweet to hear that he traveled the country to see all his siblings before coming on the show - I'm glad they got that time with him before he died, but of course nobody thought it would be the last time. I think both he and Andi could have handled themselves better, but then again, most of us aren't at our best when we're upset about something. I only wish Andi hadn't taken out her frustration on innocent bystanders - again.

 

I thought it would have actually been kinder not to give Dylan the rose. The guy needs to deal with his grief privately, and it's going to take time. He needs a real, stable support system, not just the bro-meradarie of this show.

 

"Dylan and I's relationship" and "leap of faith" in the same episode. Egads!

[GuiltyPleasures]

"Dylan and I's relationship."  What is so goddamned hard about getting that right?

 

Dylan just broke my heart.  I lost a sibling a few years ago, and only one, not two like Dylan did, and I'm still a mess.  I can't even imagine.  He's just raw with grief and isn't in any shape to be on this show.  I can see he's trying very hard to move forward, and I give him a ton of credit for that, but it does take time and he's not there yet.  It had to be so, so difficult for him to go back "home" and relive all his memories of the three of them growing up together.  And then having to talk about it to Andi - and he did have to tell her -- oh, my.  I'm impressed he was able to keep it together as well as he did.  I thought she handled the situation very well.

 

Eric, not so much.  She sure doesn't like to be challenged.        

[Padma]

Spot on. Eric's comments to Andi weren't just him calling her out tonight, it was a continuation of their conversation a couple of nights earlier when she had lit into him for not being open. He had been surprised by her accusations but he certainly didn't go off on her but she sure did tonight when he tried to explain to her that it's a two way street and it's difficult for him to be open when she's not open and welcoming in return. I thought that Eric was very classy about the whole thing.

 

Andi on the other hand showed her true colors and was very unlikable and antagonistic and egotistical. Hope all the other guys took note.

 

ITA with you both. I was stunned that Eric had given it enough thought to talk with her about how to improve their (mutual) communication. I agreed that he shared some things--like giving up his religion--that were very important in his idea of who he was as a person. I was really impressed by the way he tried to get through to her--kind of a shame that all she could hear was criticism because I didn't think that was it at all. The conversation at least was the kind that he would leave thinking "Whew! What a relief!"

 

It was surprising, since she's done this before, that she was so offended by the word "actress". After all, it's a show, she's the "star" and she IS kind of an actress. "TB-ette" is built around a certain amount of sustained deception and contrivance and even, let's admit it, insincerity. So, while I really was impressed by Eric trying to get a better idea of who -she- really was, I think her ego would get in the way of the kind of conversation he wanted to have, even if they weren't on television..

 

As for Andi, she's back to being the woman I disliked so much in the "I'm telling you off, but don't dare criticize ME!" scene with Juan Pablo. I really think she's one of those people who can dish it out but not take it, who has a quick (and bitchy) temper when she's not being flattered, and is quite arrogant.

 

I was really surprised by the "love letter" she got at this early stage--haven't seen that before. It's probably from one of the guys I think seems so cute and nice (like Chris) but who she already has decided isn't good enough for her.

Edited June 3, 2014 by Padma

[Pollock]

Ok, I cried at the end. Boy, I suck in those kind of situations.

 

I'm excited to see next week episode in my country (if only I've known beforehand, I would have stalked them !). I heard accordion in the preview and cringed but you will get to see the beautiful Marseille's new boardwalk with the museum it seems. Quite a beauty, I hope they'll do great shots of it !

Edited June 3, 2014 by Pollock

[JenE4]

That guy's name is Dylan? I know Andi said that it wasn't a pity rose...but it was definitely a pity rose! Ugh. Wow. That date was more uncomfortable than the Eric confrontation. Dylan has no personality--from what they showed. He seems to be very depressed. Most of the times contestants use their tragic life story as a way to demonstrate how much they've grown, but Dylan is just deep in his pain. I mean, it wasn't even funny for the viewer like AshLee's abandonment story, which you've had to have seen the season to laugh at, I suppose. He even gave her an out saying not to give him the pity rose. Even HE realized there wasn't anything there.

I liked Marcus so much more after their date. That was so sweet the way he was saying, Andi, don't look down; look at me. But that was crazy that they repelled in that wind!! That had to have been breaking safety codes! But, we need our Leap of Faith to Fall in Love metaphor!!

I think Brian is my new second favorite (first is still Marquel). Actually, I think I had mentioned Brian as a favorite, but tonight just solidified it. He is just too cute! Love that he's so genuine and shy, but really manly on the court. (Fanning myself)

I think Andi handled herself decently with Eric directly. But it was just taking it out on the rest of the guys that was uncalled for! If Eric were alive, I think she'd be apologizing to the guys (at TMTA) not to Eric.

[nutty1]

Not sure if this is considered spoilerish, but since there seems to be a lot of Dylan conversation…..

 

Dylan is going to be on Bachelor Paradise.

[alexa]

Eric. Not to speak ill of the dead but what the fuck was that? You can't come at someone who you want to to connect with more deeply with and accuse them of being fake and acting for the cameras. That will not endear you to anyone. If I was Andi, i would have thrown a shitfit as well.

 

 

I agree...I think it was fine of him to continue that conversation, but not to outright say she was being fake.  Obviously, that will not endear anyone to you.  Plus I think when they had discussed it earlier she was trying to make the point that "they" had a hard time in those formal situations, meaning perhaps there was something about the two of them not gelling in that way.  I don't think she was particularly blaming him...just trying to get the conversation going.

 

I do think it was wrong of her to have her little freak out with the other men though....don't bring them into the Eric drama when they had nothing to do with it.

 

Dylan is obviously not ready for this, so I am not picking on him.  But I hate when people come on the Bachelor and just have to tell their life story or something dramatic.  Yes, down the line the person can learn about all of that, but they don't need to know it right away.  Let the person get to know your personality a bit first rather than being drummed over the head with the sad story on the onset.

[leighdear]

 

I'm definitely on Team Andi when it comes to the Eric situation. RIP and all, but I absolutely hate guys who insult women in a passive-aggressive way and then are all "why are you so upset? You're taking it the wrong way. What did I do?" Total bullshit gaslighting behavior. Good on her for cutting him loose. I think he's a stealth drama queen and gets bored when he's not the center of attention because he's such a special snowflake, what with his world travelling and all

Exactly! 

And for a man that traveled the world, "communicating" with so many different cultures and types of people, why did he suck so bad at talking to a normal, American woman?  Maybe he couldn't get his point across unless he was squatting in a Yurt and miming what he wanted to say.  Weird!

[JudyObscure]

I don't know where Andi went to law school, but I was waiting for someone from the Registrar's Office to ride up on horseback beside the olden times train and revoke her degree for dropping the "Dylan and I's..." bomb.

Maybe they cut some of the grammar curriculum to work on that special ability to yell at a group of bewildered people until they all look ready to plead guilty without even knowing the charge. I also noticed how she could take the lamest defense, "up late," "exhausted," and put it out there with enough self-righteous emphasis to make any jury take her side. The use of rhetoric questions was pretty awesome, too. If I'm going to commit a crime I want Andi delivering my final plea to the jury: "Was she the last person to see her husband? Was his food poisoned? Did she take out a million dollar life insurance policy the day before he died? SURE SHE DID! But do you have any idea how irritating that man was? Do you know how she had to struggle to get even one turn at the remote control? Go think about that and I don't want to hear you say the word "guilty," just don't even think about saying it!"

[MsPH]

Maybe it's just the fact that I didn't like Eric before either, but I was on Andi's side. I definitely don't enjoy watching her hissy fits and I don't think the other guys deserved to be lectured, but I do get why she was offended. Their conversations had been centred around Eric's travels, which I thought might be editing, but then she confirmed it when she confronted him during the group date. I do think she was a bit too confrontational there and he was taken aback by it, so even though she left that little talk feeling good, he felt like he'd taken all the blame for the relationship stalling and then wanted to turn the tables on her at the cocktail party. Instead of saying he thinks they should both be more open and themselves, he said he felt totally the opposite of how she felt, that it was her not opening up to him and essentially called her a TV actress. So I think it was really him who wasn't very good at taking criticism. He had to turn the tables completely instead of reaching for the middle ground. Not a very appealing quality in a mate. And if Andi really was taking things seriously and doing the best she good, then of course she'd be offended being called an actress. I don't know how he thought she'd respond to that, but it felt like he was expecting an argument since he didn't even want to sit down with her. Makes me doubt his motivation for being on the show, as much as it pains me to speak ill of the dead. And he didn't even seem ready for marriage based on what he said on the show. I got the sense that marriage to him is a necessary evil in order to get the family he desired, like only kids could be more important than his "mission". Andi annoyed me at the beginning of the season and I thought she seemed fake too, but who doesn't meeting a bunch of strangers? I've appreciated how real she's been with the guys in the last couple of episodes, even thought about it during her dates in this ep. I think she's doing a better job than most bachelorettes so far.

 

Dylan seems like a nice guy, but I don't think he should be on this show. When did he say his brother died, last November? Because if so, then no wonder he seems totally overcome by sadness. I feel really bad for him, but this is not the time to be looking for love on a dating show. I hope he can cheer up a bit, but still... it's just too soon.

 

Marcus still creeps me out a bit. Maybe it's just that he's too young and naive.

 

I still think Nick could turn out to be this season's Brooks. He's trying so hard to get past his scepticism, but I'm not sure if I'm buying it yet.

 

I can't believe they wasted 5 minutes showing the disappointment of the losing team. It was like the end of the world. Except it wasn't. Yawn.

[bosawks]

Complaining about "The Bachelor" or "The Bachelorette being an actor/actress seems, at best, disingenuous.

 

RIP Eric may you find yourself surrounded by non-thespian extreme sports enthusiasts world travelers wherever you are.

[Vivigirl10]

 

Dylan is obviously not ready for this, so I am not picking on him.  But I hate when people come on the Bachelor and just have to tell their life story or something dramatic.  Yes, down the line the person can learn about all of that, but they don't need to know it right away.  Let the person get to know your personality a bit first rather than being drummed over the head with the sad story on the onset.

 

Dylan was way too morose on his date.

I totally agree.  Everyone has something sad or private, or whatever, that needs to be shared with a partner.....but the timing needs to be right and you need to get to know them first.  Dylan's story is terrible and I'm not taking that away from him but that reveal made for one awkward date.  How do you come back from that?  Oh - I know!  By blowing a choo-choo whistle!  Toot-toot!

 

I think Eric is the type that if you don't kiss his butt and find him to be the most fascinating thing since sliced bread, then something is wrong with YOU and he is definitely going to tell you what it is.  Andi flared a little bit too much and it overshadowed her point, but no one likes to be called a "fake". 

 

I thought the follow-up sit down with Andi and Chris was kind of stupid, honestly.  It would be disrespectful to show the rose ceremony?  Why did they keep driving that point home?  I could see if it was because Eric didn't get a rose....but he wasn't even there at that point.  Andi certainly didn't know him well enough to eulogize him. 

[Bugs Meany]

I also thought it was cute when Josh snuck up behind Brian during his interview.  Brian didn't even whip his head around to see who it was; he just laughed.  There's more comfort and affection among the guys than between them and Andi.

 

That said, the Makeshift Uniforms totally should have boycotted the game.  You can't put Brian and Marquel on the same team!  (And not because he's black.  If a guy can brick a one-handed alley-oop then he can definitely make a regular ol' dunk.)  The Rosebuds had a deep threat and a serious rim presence.  Total B.S.

[waving feather]

Oh, I was totally on Eric's side. I didn't think he was directly calling HER a TV actress. It was just an example to emphasize the point that he likes the glimpses of Andi that he sees sometimes and wants her to let her guard down and not always show her "on" side all the time. Because that's exactly what she does! When she's on dates, it's comfortable for the viewers to watch because she's basically acting the part of the audience, getting to know all the guys and wanting them to open up and tell their stories. I don't feel like she's getting to know the guys FOR HERSELF. Even though Desiree (the previous Bachelorette) may not be as smooth or "intelligent" as Andi in holding conversations, I felt like she was genuinely being herself without being "on" all the time with a big fake smile on her face (almost to a fault with the Brooks thing). You can totally tell when Des felt awkward or uncomfortable. With Andi, she does have a pokerface. No wonder she said she's exhausted! Everyone will be exhausted being "on" all the time. She strikes me as someone who aims to be the "best bachlorette" and give people good television instead of someone who really wants to meet someone on the show. Which is nothing wrong, but don't freak out when people call you on it.

 

But of course, true to typical Andi's fashion, as soon as she feels slighted, she went batshit. It's fine if she was upset or pissed off, but no, she has to throw a huge tantrum not only in front of Eric but the other guys as well (who have done nothing to her). She did that with Juan Pablo too when she wasn't hearing what she wanted from him. I still remember her picking, harping and lecturing him on his use of "It's okay" for TEN MINUTES or more. You can express what you like or dislike, but it's the way she does it that bothers me. Eric wasn't pleased with where the conversation was going too but did he throw a tantrum just because she did? He actually seemed bewildered with a WTF look on his face. I bet he couldn't have ran from there fast enough.

 

Andi has mentioned several times that she typically dated the athletes... She might as well call it a night and have a final 2 of Josh and Brian the way she was freaking out about how hot guys playing sports is.

[Lamb18]

I'm siding more with Andi in her conversation with Eric.  I think she was willing to have this discussion until he called her a Hollywood actress.  He lost her at that point.  Calling her "poker face" wasn't that bad because she has to have that at times.  To be honest, I don't really understand what the whole issue was but the "Hollywood actress" comment was a slap in the face.  Maybe he felt there was a hidden script in which everyone else seemed to have a part but he didn't.  He might be used to controlling his situations, not so much controlling people, but understanding the dynamics - what's going on - in all situations.  And he doesn't have that here.  I would have liked to have seen a montage - him and the guys goofing around.  I agree Andi did talk too much about her feelings, but you could see how bad she felt in her expression.  I also felt bad for Tasos because they didn't show his farewell and final words.  Maybe they will at the beginning of the next episode.

 

Go Rosebuds!  Go fighting Rosebuds!  (Isn't that the name of a sled, too?)  What kind of halves did they have anyway?  It was only 6 to 6?  Were the halves only 2 minutes? I did like seeing that 30 to 8 score in women vs. men.  They really should have had them play the MN Lynx but maybe that would have been too rough on the guys.  I liked Nick's commentary: "There were the 85 Bears, the 90 [forgot the team] and then there were the Rosebuds."  I just realized who Nick reminds me of in the way he has his head lowered, then looks up with his eyes:one of the law students on "Legally Blonde."  He was trying to ask a girl out and Elle came to his rescue.

[Lovecat]

Oh, I was totally on Eric's side. I didn't think he was directly calling HER a TV actress. It was just an example to emphasize the point that he likes the glimpses of Andi that he sees sometimes and wants her to let her guard down and not always show her "on" side all the time. Because that's exactly what she does!

Yup.  And Andi unwittingly validated his feelings, sitting there with her chin balanced delicately on her hand, finger extended up the cheek ever-so-gracefully, "Mm-hmmm"-ing thoughtfully... Whether she realizes it or not, she is extremely aware of those cameras and constantly on guard.  She said it herself:  "I try SO HARD to open up to y'all and be myself..."  Well, Andi, Yoda said it best:  Do or not do, there is no try.  If you have to TRY so hard to be yourself, then you're not.

 

Oh, and there's something about Nick (his curly hair, coupled with certain speech cadences) that reminds me of Jason Segal.

 

ETA:

Oh hey, by the way, Tasos went home.

 

I feel cheated out of whatever he would have said in his exit interview.

Right??!?  Maybe we'll get to see it at MTA.

Edited June 3, 2014 by Lovecat

[Etta Place]

Oh hey, by the way, Tasos went home.

 

I feel cheated out of whatever he would have said in his exit interview.

[Gregg247]

The funniest part of the basketball game was that after they really got going, if you had told any of these guys, "Hey, Andi's watching you", they would have said, "Who?  Oh, yeah, that's right." LOL

 

6-6 at the half?  Wow, the 2 teams scored 3 baskets EACH!  That's pretty sad.  No wonder they didn't show the final score after the Rosebuds "really turned up the heat".  What was the final score, 12-8? haha

 

So, singing and basketball aren't exactly these guys' forte.  Maybe we'll stumble on to something they're good at sooner or later.

[seacliffsal]

I have been trying to like Andi as I didn't care for her on the Bachelor-especially after her tantrum with Juan Pablo (I just had to come back to tell you that you suck).  It would have been impossible for me to roll my eyes any further back in my head when she complained to everyone about how HARD this is and how EXHAUSTED she is.....Excuse me, but she knew exactly what she signed up for-it's not like she's new to the franchise.  And how hypocritical can she be?  She's throwing tantrums when someone says something similar to what she said to Juan Pablo when she went off on him (and wouldn't let him respond).  I can't believe that I'm actually kind of defending Juan Pablo as I didn't care for him during his season.  

 

During the eulogy, I couldn't even follow what Andi was saying.  Also, I think that it was inappropriate to even have Andi talk about Eric as we had just watched the scenes where he stated he didn't even know her and she said that their relationship had slowed down.  So, how did she know so much about him after one one-on-one date and two group dates over a 2 or 2 1/2 week span of time?  

[eversotrue]

Oh, I was totally on Eric's side. I didn't think he was directly calling HER a TV actress. It was just an example to emphasize the point that he likes the glimpses of Andi that he sees sometimes and wants her to let her guard down and not always show her "on" side all the time. Because that's exactly what she does! When she's on dates, it's comfortable for the viewers to watch because she's basically acting the part of the audience, getting to know all the guys and wanting them to open up and tell their stories. I don't feel like she's getting to know the guys FOR HERSELF. Even though Desiree (the previous Bachelorette) may not be as smooth or "intelligent" as Andi in holding conversations, I felt like she was genuinely being herself without being "on" all the time with a big fake smile on her face (almost to a fault with the Brooks thing). You can totally tell when Des felt awkward or uncomfortable. With Andi, she does have a pokerface. No wonder she said she's exhausted! Everyone will be exhausted being "on" all the time. She strikes me as someone who aims to be the "best bachlorette" and give people good television instead of someone who really wants to meet someone on the show. Which is nothing wrong, but don't freak out when people call you on it.

But of course, true to typical Andi's fashion, as soon as she feels slighted, she went batshit. It's fine if she was upset or pissed off, but no, she has to throw a huge tantrum not only in front of Eric but the other guys as well (who have done nothing to her). She did that with Juan Pablo too when she wasn't hearing what she wanted from him. I still remember her picking, harping and lecturing him on his use of "It's okay" for TEN MINUTES or more. You can express what you like or dislike, but it's the way she does it that bothers me. Eric wasn't pleased with where the conversation was going too but did he throw a tantrum just because she did? He actually seemed bewildered with a WTF look on his face. I bet he couldn't have ran from there fast enough.

Andi has mentioned several times that she typically dated the athletes... She might as well call it a night and have a final 2 of Josh and Brian the way she was freaking out about how hot guys playing sports is.

 

Oh, I was totally on Eric's side. I didn't think he was directly calling HER a TV actress. It was just an example to emphasize the point that he likes the glimpses of Andi that he sees sometimes and wants her to let her guard down and not always show her "on" side all the time. Because that's exactly what she does! When she's on dates, it's comfortable for the viewers to watch because she's basically acting the part of the audience, getting to know all the guys and wanting them to open up and tell their stories. I don't feel like she's getting to know the guys FOR HERSELF. Even though Desiree (the previous Bachelorette) may not be as smooth or "intelligent" as Andi in holding conversations, I felt like she was genuinely being herself without being "on" all the time with a big fake smile on her face (almost to a fault with the Brooks thing). You can totally tell when Des felt awkward or uncomfortable. With Andi, she does have a pokerface. No wonder she said she's exhausted! Everyone will be exhausted being "on" all the time. She strikes me as someone who aims to be the "best bachlorette" and give people good television instead of someone who really wants to meet someone on the show. Which is nothing wrong, but don't freak out when people call you on it.

But of course, true to typical Andi's fashion, as soon as she feels slighted, she went batshit. It's fine if she was upset or pissed off, but no, she has to throw a huge tantrum not only in front of Eric but the other guys as well (who have done nothing to her). She did that with Juan Pablo too when she wasn't hearing what she wanted from him. I still remember her picking, harping and lecturing him on his use of "It's okay" for TEN MINUTES or more. You can express what you like or dislike, but it's the way she does it that bothers me. Eric wasn't

Completely agree. Eric even said as he was leaving that he just wanted her to be comfortable with him and be open. He just unfortunately didn't say the "right" words in regards to that, he didn't express himself the way he actually meant. The guy honestly seemed like a great guy. From everything since his passing, people who knew him personally or people he just met on his travels have said what a truly amazing person he was. And like many people have said, he should be remembered for his philanthropic work as opposed to a girl he knew on a dumb "reality" show. This was only a small portion of his life.. He obviously lived and was much more than "that". Edited June 3, 2014 by David T. Cole
Fixed quote

[MsPH]

I wouldn't call Andi a hypocrite just yet. Her main gripe with Juan Pablo was that he didn't even try to get to know her despite taking her as far as the fantasy suite. Instead he just talked about himself and even the other women. Now Andi on the other hand has definitely been trying to get to know all the men, at least the ones she's been on a one-on-one date with. In fact she's been so wrapped up in getting to know them that she maybe hasn't been talking about herself enough. Quite the opposite of Juan Pablo as far as I can tell. I think she was well aware that being the lead involves dragging along a certain number of guys you know you're not gonna end up with, but the least you can do is to get to know them as people. I mean just macking on people you have no interest in otherwise makes them feel cheap.

[Bugs Meany]

I was also thrown off by the 6-6 score. They must have been scoring baskets as one point. For whatever reason, no pickup game I've ever played in, in either the north or south, has used standard scoring. It's always one point for a basket, two behind the arc and no free throws.

[woodscommaelle]

Conversation during the rappelling:

"What's your mom like?  Is she like you?"

"She's nice...errr.  She plays mah jong."

 

LOL!

Thought that was cute.

 

I don't know why but Nick is starting to creep me out.

Brian for the win.  Or for the next Bachelor!

[Alapaki]

Having had a night to think about it, I'm even more firmly on Team-Anti-Andi. (I'm not 100% on Team-Dead-Guy, but I don't think it's either/or).

 

Several people upthread have hit Eric on his "Hollywood actress" comment.  I disagree.

 

First of all, Andi started losing her shit when Eric said she had a "poker face".  "Do I have a poker-face now? Do I have one now? Do I have one NOW?!?!?"

 

I understand that critiques like Eric's, which are more indictment of the format of the show itself rather than the Lead, are difficult for the Lead to defend against.  But other Leads (most recently Sean with Des' brother and Juan Pablo with Andi's own father) have handled those criticisms with much more tact and grace.  

 

Further, compared to Des' brother and Andi's father, Eric's conversation with Andi was not confrontational or antagonistic at all.  I got the sense that, on at least a small level, he genuinely wanted to see if there was some "relationship" (as that term is defined by the show) worth pursuing.

 

And ultimately, unlike Sean or Juan Pablo, it is Andi's professional trained job to deal with adversarial situations.  

 

Finally, with respect to the "Hollywood Actress" comment, Andi is the one who's been squawking about how the guys have to "open up" because this whole thing is So. Fricking. Real. To. Her.  Okay.  Take her at her word.  Aren't the guys entitled to know if the person they're "opening up" to is the real Andi as opposed to the character of The Bachelorette?  She's the one who's defining the parameters.  If she'd been approaching the whole thing with an attitude of "let's have fun and see where things go", then I agree that Eric over-reacted.  But Andi's the one who's committed herself to the proposition that "this process works" and that she's there "to find her husband" who she'll be with "till death do us part".

[JenE4]

I was also thrown off by the 6-6 score. They must have been scoring baskets as one point. For whatever reason, no pickup game I've ever played in, in either the north or south, has used standard scoring. It's always one point for a basket, two behind the arc and no free throws.

 

 

And yet we saw Brian get at least 2 or 3 3-pointers, and they also showed someone getting a free throw. But, don't ask me. I think that was all in the second half when the Rosebuds blew up the court. Poor Five of Hearts with their makeshift inside-out Rosebuds shirts. Someone in wardrobe really screwed up there. Oh, that's right, it was supposedly a last-minute suggestion for the guys to play against each other for the chance to spend time with Andi. Although, don't they always do something like that? I recall one time there was a volleyball game on a beach and Harrison showed up just to tell them that the losing team would have to go back to the hotel. (I have no doubt someone will clearly remember the season; I'm not even sure whether it was -or/-ette.) Yeah, back to wardrobe screwing up! 

[Alapaki]

I'm not sure what to think about Dylan.

 

On the one hand, I thought that their time together on the train (before he talked about his family) was one of the most awkward one-on-one dates I've ever seen.  I absolutely believe that he got a pity-rose, in that I'm certain he would've been bounced had he not broke out that story.  I can't blame Andi for giving him a pity-rose, because he put her in a really shitty position on that.  But it does show that she knows how to lie when it makes it her look better.

 

I really don't think it was necessary or appropriate for Dylan to bring that story up.  It was the wrong time and place.  If he's really so consumed with it (and I take it that filming was not all that long after his brother passed), then he has no business being on the show.  Otherwise, it seems like the kind of thing you let someone in on once you've gotten to know them better.

 

If it was a ploy to make sure he got a rose or get camera-time, I think it makes him a piece of shit.  

 

And, can we add to the list of Bachelor(ette) tropes "[insert sad backstory], but, you know, it made me who I am"?

[LakeGal]

I believe they were doing damage control for their Bachelorette with the Chris H sit down.  There was no reason they couldn't show the rose ceremony.  Unless Andi did go on and on about Eric.  That would cause the guys to say their share against him too.  It would not have been pleasant for any of us to watch.  Must protect the franchise. 

 

Andi lost it and blew up at JuanPab.  I thought she was a bit out of line then.  But this time the way she lost it on Eric really showed her out of control.  He hit a little too close to the truth and it irritated her.  I suspect she knew the guys were listening and hoped to be rescued.  She seems to enjoy the guys playing the white knight for her.  She cries and the guys think Eric is doing something awful and Andi needs to be consoled.  I am surprised Josh and some of the others didn't swoop in and shove Eric away from her.  They made a big enough stink about Andrew and a girl's phone number.

 

My hubby keeps saying that Josh looks like Mark Cuban's little brother.  Now that is all I see when I look at him.  He looks like a mini-Mark.   

[Sarah D. Bunting]

Stephanie's thoughts on the episode!

[waving feather]

Josh is so unappealing to me with his gym muscles and that "manly" growl he loves to do. And I side-eye anyone who adamantly claims they hate losing, like they're something special. Newsflash guys, NO ONE likes to lose. I also can't with his faux flustered/nervous act in front of Andi. Let's be real, someone who is truly nervous will try their very best to hide it, not declare it every 5 seconds.

[MyFangirlLife]

I love how much discussion this episodes sparks...I enjoy when there are two sides to a debate instead of everyone just acknowledging that one person is an ass :)

I just posted my commentary on the episode as part of my weekly Bachelorette-themed blog series...check it out if you want to:

Tuesday Walk of Shame: Bachelorette Edition - Poker Face (S10E04)

Oh Bachelorette, you will never not be entertaining.

[rlc]

Brian sounds so much like Edward Burns that I have to like him.

[Etta Place]

Conversation during the rappelling:

"What's your mom like?  Is she like you?"

"She's nice...errr.  She plays mah jong."

Oh, I totally forgot that, but it cracked me up. Particularly right after that when Marcus said, "Mah jongg? That's a Chinese game, right?" and Andi answered, "She golfs."

[MSP]

I thought the follow-up sit down with Andi and Chris was kind of stupid, honestly.  It would be disrespectful to show the rose ceremony?

 

Yeah, I could have done without the damage control sit-down. I actually thought it was insulting to Tasos - sorry Tasos, you're still alive so we don't even get to see your exit.

 

Re: Eric

I think he's a stealth drama queen and gets bored when he's not the center of attention because he's such a special snowflake, what with his world travelling and all.

 

Jodio, I think you nailed it! Of course I think Andi was a bit of a harpy about it too, so it was just a lose-lose situation. Especially for Tasos.

 

But let's not pick on Andi, she's SO EXHAUSTED from being on an all-expenses paid extended vacation with a bunch of hunky men, you guys.

 

I'm still torn on Andi. She is fairly intelligent and seems to genuinely want to find a husband, but her tantrums are unflattering and a bit over-the-top. My issue with her freaking out on Juan Pablo was that she basically broke up with him and THEN got angry at him for not being more upset. Once you break up with someone, you don't get to scold them for their subsequent behavior!

 

She does seem to have that unfortunate "I just want to be rescued" quality. Another one of her dramatic overtures I could have done without was all the fuss over the rapelling date that "she" supposedly "planned".  Although huge points for how awesome and supportive Marcus was.

[Bugs Meany]

I'm not sure about the damage-control angle. They could have trimmed her and Eric's spat so that the gist was "we both know this isn't going to work," rather than "how dare you question me." And they could have cut out her scolding the other guys, which didn't advance any storyline other than "Andi takes this VERY seriously."

[Alapaki]

I'm not sure they could've edited Eric's exit to appear to be mutual and civil and still explain the cancelled Cocktail Party

And the segment at the end really was more about how everyone else felt about Eric dying than it was about Eric himself.

[leighdear]

 

During the eulogy, I couldn't even follow what Andi was saying.  Also, I think that it was inappropriate to even have Andi talk about Eric as we had just watched the scenes where he stated he didn't even know her and she said that their relationship had slowed down.  So, how did she know so much about him after one one-on-one date and two group dates over a 2 or 2 1/2 week span of time?

Andi didn't give a eulogy. 

 

My impression was that Andi was there ONLY to speak about how she and the rest of the guys were told about Eric and their reactions to the tragedy. 

 

I never saw that quick sit-down as damage control or an explanation of her interaction with Eric, who was right or wrong. 

 

She wasn't there to give commentary on anything else. 

 

To me, that was perfectly appropriate.  None of them knew Eric well enough to do anything more than what they did.

 

They paid a brief tribute TWICE and resumed the show. 

Edited June 3, 2014 by leighdear

[JenE4]

But it does show that she knows how to lie when it makes it her look better.

 

 

Like a Hollywood actress with a poker face?! How DARE you! She's exhaused, y'all. And takes this. Very. Seriously. ;-)

[WordFreak]

Not much I can say about this episode that hasn't already been said. I felt so terrible for Dylan when he was telling Andi about his siblings. That guy needs to go and get some help with processing his enormous grief. He seems like a nice enough guy, so I hope that he can find happiness down the road, but for now, being on The Bachelorette is the last thing he should be doing.

 

I don't want to weigh in on the Eric / Andi issue because the big points have already been covered here. I just want to say that I am kind of relieved that Eric's time on the show has ended, since I found it incredibly awkward watching him, knowing that he died. My heart goes out to his family and friends for their loss, but seeing him on this was uncomfortable for me. How unfortunate that his final scenes showed him in a bit of a negative light. Anyway, RIP Eric.

[leighdear]

Maybe Tasos was fine with not having the rose ceremony televised.  I don't actually care for that part myself.  It's not as if they do an in-depth interview post-booting.  Unless there's a lot of drama, that is.  He seemed pretty fun & mellow, so I can't imagine he gave them much on his way out the door. 

 

I'm sure there are plenty of contestants that would LOVE to have their shining moment of being exiled unavailable to the viewing public. 

 

Maybe they asked him if was ok it it wasn't shown, and he said "Really? I don't have to have that humiliating moment available for people to watch over and over on their DVR's for the rest of my life?"  I'll bet most exiting would be happy about that kind of thing.  :)

[LakeGal]

Maybe we will get a recap of Tasos leaving on the next episode.  They will be getting us up to date since it will be a couple weeks since the last episode.  They can quickly show him saying goodbye if they want. 

[legaleagle53]

What I'm still not clear on was why Eric left the Church he had grown up in for 26 years.  What was his explanation for that?

 

In case you can't tell, I was raised in the same faith as Eric, and even though I don't always see eye-to-eye with the Church, I just can't fathom completely abandoning it the way he did.

Edited June 3, 2014 by legaleagle53

[backformore]

Alapaki:  I think that was 100% damage control for Andi being an ass.  I wouldn't be surprised if she was real drama queen at the Rose Ceremony and kept whining about her conversation with Eric and that's why they didn't show it.

 

First of all, Andi started losing her shit when Eric said she had a "poker face".  "Do I have a poker-face now? Do I have one now? Do I have one NOW?!?!?"

 

RIGHT!!!! 

Basically Andi says Be open with me, which Eric takes to mean something like "tell me what you're feeling and thinking", when Andi really means "Tell me how awesome I am and how much you want to be with me, then tell me something about yourself that will make me choose you."

 

Eric is treating it like a dating situation, where both parties take turns being "open and honest", and a personal disclosure by one is followed by a personal disclosure by the other.   He was open and honest in expressing his discomfort at not knowing who Andi really is. 

Andi is treating it more like a job interview - She's in the position of power, she makes the rules, the guys folow the rules.  Eric is not a guy who follows someone else's rules of how to be in a relationship.

 

"Poker face"  means "I'm being honest with you and I have no idea how you're feeling because you're not giving me any honest feedback"

Andi didn't feel like actually HEARING Eric.  She latched on to "actress"  and "Poker face" and  blew up at him.   Then she blew up at the other guys too.   I assume that the rose ceremony was more of the same - she's exhausted, this is real, she's not fake, she's here to find love, etc etc.  And how DARE anyone accuse her of not being real!   anyone else who thinks she's not real can go out that door NOW!

 

Andi's tantrums are a glimpse at what it would be like to have a relationship with her.  She says she wants "open and honest', but what she really wants is biceps and athletic ability  and feeling protected.  And if you try to express yourself, she will take a word or phrase, and shout it back in your face -  POKER FACE!!!!   OOOOkay!!!!!!!!!!  ACTRESS!!!! 

[FlyingEgret]

So, singing and basketball aren't exactly these guys' forte.  Maybe we'll stumble on to something they're good at sooner or later.

 

Finding free clinics all over the world?

[truthaboutluv]

In case you can't tell, I was raised in the same faith as Eric, and even though I don't always see eye-to-eye with the Church, I just can't fathom completely abandoning it the way he did.

 

 

He didn't just abandon it. He said that he struggled with the decision and that he still accepted parts of it and the beliefs, he likely just wasn't practicing anymore. That was more or less the story we heard with Jef. He still had some beliefs and parts of the church and faith in him but he was no longer fully practicing. Everybody's different. While some can't imagine giving up their church, others come to a place where they may realize it doesn't really give them what they want or there are parts of it they can no longer reconcile with. 

[Lamb18]

Maybe Tasos was fine with not having the rose ceremony televised.  I don't actually care for that part myself.  It's not as if they do an in-depth interview post-booting.  Unless there's a lot of drama, that is.  He seemed pretty fun & mellow, so I can't imagine he gave them much on his way out the door. 

 

I'm sure there are plenty of contestants that would LOVE to have their shining moment of being exiled unavailable to the viewing public. 

 

Maybe they asked him if was ok it it wasn't shown, and he said "Really? I don't have to have that humiliating moment available for people to watch over and over on their DVR's for the rest of my life?"  I'll bet most exiting would be happy about that kind of thing.  :)

 

Maybe Bradley should be glad he was eliminated the previous episode!  If it had been last night, America wouldn't have been able to see him leave as the tragic hero, on his quest for true love and never feeling good enough, spouting the man-tears.

[legaleagle53]

He didn't just abandon it. He said that he struggled with the decision and that he still accepted parts of it and the beliefs, he likely just wasn't practicing anymore. That was more or less the story we heard with Jef. He still had some beliefs and parts of the church and faith in him but he was no longer fully practicing. Everybody's different. While some can't imagine giving up their church, others come to a place where they may realize it doesn't really give them what they want or there are parts of it they can no longer reconcile with. 

OK, that makes more sense, and that much of it I can relate to.  I simply missed what he said because for some reason, he spoke a little too quietly when he was talking about it with Andi.

Edited June 3, 2014 by legaleagle53

[TheFinalRose]

 

I was really surprised by the "love letter" she got at this early stage--haven't seen that before. It's probably from one of the guys I think seems so cute and nice (like Chris) but who she already has decided isn't good enough for her.

 

 

 

The love letter and the flower delivery make me think that part of the pre-filming pep talk from the producers this year included "Feel free to step out of the box and do romantic gestures for Andi as if she was a girl back home that you were interested in!" So, I guess in the future we will be seeing a balloon delivery, some kind of singing telegram, a box of chocolates, and any other cliche romantic gestures that the producers can convince the stooges to pick as their "romantic gesture."  

 

I think Brian is my new second favorite (first is still Marquel). Actually, I think I had mentioned Brian as a favorite, but tonight just solidified it. He is just too cute! Love that he's so genuine and shy, but really manly on the court. (Fanning myself)

 

 

Me too. Has any Bachelorette contestant in the history of Bachelorette-dom ever done anything as amazing as that half-court shot? And he was so humble about it. Way to impress! He and Marquel are battling it out for first and second favs in my book too.  

 

Okay, Dylan is just too sad to be on this show. I felt worse for him than for Eric last night. As for Eric (God rest his soul) and Andi, eh, neither of them handled that conversation right.  But I was really surprised at how fast Andi flipped on him. I think Andi thinks its endearing and a crowd pleaser when the Bachelorette flips out on the guys, ala Emily's righteous indignation when Kalon called Little RIcki baggage, or when she went off on Juan Pablo. But I think Andi has a major bitchface lurking underneath her poker face all the time and it doesn't take much to set her off. So far, I'm still not liking her.

 

And ABC still can't get anything right. I thought it was very sensitive to cut to Chris Harrison after Eric's departure; then the sensitivity went downhill with Andi (Grumpy Cat) sitting there having to put her two cents in about losing a "member of the family." I am just sure Eric's grieving real family loved how ABC hung on to that terminology for someone they hardly knew. A few simple words from Chris would have been enough. However, I didn't see why the Rose Ceremony had to be cut, but then they can cue the blaring promo of "IN TWO WEEKS ON THE BACHELOR!!!!!"  I mean, when Game of Thrones ends one of their patented shocking episodes they maintain the shock and awe by airing the closing credits with no background music. ABC should have just faded out and skipped the preview if they wanted to maintain some modicum of respect. 

 

 

 

 

[Stella MD]

The look on the faces of the other guys was priceless as they overheard the fight between Andi and Eric - the sheer terror as they all collectively realized what a lifetime with Andi would look like and they started mentally looking for the exit. I think it's telling that not a single one of them came around the corner to defend "their girl".