S01.E06: Career Days

[LJonEarth]

8 hours ago, PRgal said:

There are also public school programs for gifted kids.  They usually require testing and admissions is basically like a private school.  Except, of course, you save like $20-30K.

Which was why the private school thing was a bit strange. There were public school gifted programs in the 80s and 90s. I think this option would have been better for the show dramatically, since they're going for max-drama. That or having him moved up a grade. We even had a 4th grader in our high school match classes back in the day.

Quote

The mom of Randall's African American can tone down the attitude a bit.  I understand what she is saying, but both Jack and Rebecca's initial interactions with her over a simple question, this episode and at the pool, were so off putting and negative. 

I wonder if she has an attitude of "why did you get yourself and this child into this if you weren't prepared." And also a little bit of thinking it's not rocket science. They shouldn't need to ask those questions. It's a flaw and a real one and I like that they're showing it.

Edited November 3, 2016 by LJonEarth

[HeySandyStrange]

Quote

I am reading this a little differently - I am about the same age as the Big Three and I think there is some truth to the way that the parenting styles are being portrayed for the time period (at least in my experience and in the Northeast).  Fathers were becoming more involved with the kids in the early 80's, but - even in families where the mothers worked outside the home - they weren't really doing the heavy lifting of day to day parenting, even if they were doing more cub scouts and coaching teams and building rockets and taking kids to the office occasionally.  Dads weren't doing laundry, making meals, grocery shopping, managing report cards, etc.

I was thinking the same thing in regards to the differences between Rebecca and Jack's parenting styles. And yes, parenting wasn't the super-involved, super hands on thing that it has become today back in the 80s. Parents back then weren't trying to be their kids' best friends or 24 hour entertainment, they were too busy working and taking care of the family' needs to have all these one on one talks and activities together.

Add me to those who don't like Olivia. I find nothing compelling about the actress or the character, and I don't see a stich of chemistry between Kevin and her. I'd like to see Kevin with someone more down to earth, maybe someone outside of the entertainment industry. Even if he is an actor, and possibly has some real talent, he doesn't have the typical actor's temperament, imo (well, other then being somewhat self-involved). I can't see him with in a long term thing with Miss Theater Superior Artist Olivia. I'm really liking Kevin recently, I don't want him to be bogged down with a relationship like he'd have with her.

I'm wondering if and when we are going to get more background on Randall's bio mother. While Randall was lamenting his lack of shared interests/talents that he has with William, it would've been cool to find out that, Oh, your mom_______ was a science nerd who loved the original Star Trek, or something like that. Or heck, find out her name, period. It would be sweet (and possibly tear inducing) to find out he got his brains from her.

[femmefan1946]

Plus going to a school for gifted kids meant that he could really be himself since he was surrounded by other smart kids,

I missed part of the episode. I got that it was a private school, but was it also for gifted children. My experience of private schools is that their students are from diplomat families who can't take the kids with them, or for kids who have been kicked out of public schools, or wealthy. Probably because Canadian public schools are quite good and I lived in a capital city.

Doesn't the public system have a gifted program? My sister and I were in one in the 50s.

[Aliconehead]

6 minutes ago, femmefan1946 said:

Plus going to a school for gifted kids meant that he could really be himself since he was surrounded by other smart kids,

I missed part of the episode. I got that it was a private school, but was it also for gifted children. My experience of private schools is that their students are from diplomat families who can't take the kids with them, or for kids who have been kicked out of public schools, or wealthy. Probably because Canadian public schools are quite good and I lived in a capital city.

Doesn't the public system have a gifted program? My sister and I were in one in the 50s.

That is true for many boarding schools, schools where the students live at, but private schools in the US are different. Generally they are smaller class sizes, more individualized learning and often religious based. The wealthy often send their kids there because of the above factors and also because public schools in bigger cities pull from various areas, some might not be as "nice" as others but still go to the same school as very wealthy areas. Generally privates schools are thought to be better by some because with all the money people pay there can be more or better oppurtunities i.e. Bilingual education, smaller classes, better facilities, better teachers, less drugs, less teenage pregnancy etc. This is not necessarily true, in my opinion. 

[SueB]

Quick thoughts:

- Yes, I cry with random strangers unexpectedly.  The more you hold it in (I suspect), the more likely this is to happen.  Crying with a loved one is far harder.
- I thought Randall going to a gifted school (it wasn't just private) was also the Principle's way of taking out direct competition between The Big Three.  They aren't in the same classes.  Still, it's going to be hard for K2 not to have noticed Randall is smarter and that Mom and Dad have more financial worries to pay for his schooling.  They'll be some resentment there I suspect.
- Kevin having sex with Olivia totally makes sense to me.  He's starved for affection and sex is generally validating for him (I suspect).  Plus she's withheld her approval for so long.  So, it probably made him really happy to finally get the approval (or so he thought) of someone who was judging him harshly.
- Olivia seems to take actual notice of Kevin in this episode.  It certainly seems like it's all about the play to her but she may end up overestimating her ability to detach.  As for the 'no more sex', I think she wanted him to experience longing.  Not the heart-wrenching depth of losing a loved one (that was the memorial service 'lesson'), but the longing that a man has for a woman he can't have.  So, while I think her 'lessons' where pretty horrible, I can see it backfiring on her too.
- I kept waiting for the widow to say "you look just like that guy, The Manny".
- I literally had to mute the sound when Randall sung. TOO PAINFUL TO WATCH.
- I adore that Beth is so amused by Randall's early mid-life crisis.  What's funny, IMO, is that Randall is such an over-achiever... of COURSE he has his mini-mid-life crisis early. 
- I wouldn't have had the guts to leave the girl.  I would have driven back to her house and then left.  But IA that it was an affluent neighborhood, she had her phone, and seemed pretty competent.
- The ADR (the voice re-recording) was REALLY evident when Kevin's line about his age when his father died was changed.  Since they started the #Where'sJack hashtag, I'm presuming it's an intentional ploy to build suspense by keeping us guessing as to the "when".
- Kevin broke the airplanes because he was mad at his Dad for dying.  That says to me it was sudden, not a protracted illness.  Anger at being left behind is a pretty common reaction.  I'm so glad he gave that wisdom to the widow.

Can't wait for next week.

[hippielamb]

12 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

My aunt was the exact opposite. As soon as her baby fell asleep, she deliberately started making noise because she didn't want the baby to need silence to sleep. She would get out the vacuum, turn on the tv, or generally just make noise in the normal to loud range. By the time the baby was eight months old, my aunt was able to take me to the Hard Rock Cafe (hey, I was 12 so it seemed cool at the time) and my cousin slept in her stroller the entire time with all that music blaring. 

Yes exactly. If kids are exposed to noise, they will be less sensitive to its disruption. I'm not a musician but have spent most of my adult life around them. If you have kids, and there is music going on it allows them to get used to it without crying and waking up every 5 minutes. My eldest daughter could sleep through the noisiest rehearsal, and even now years later she can read/work while music is blaring. 

 

11 hours ago, JenE4 said:

i'm still not finding myself connecting to Kevin. It was nice seeing more backstory, and I get that his story is supposedly just as emotionally fraught as the other two. This was supposed to be his big episode, but, eh. Ok, Kevin, we get that you didn't get attention because you didn't have any problems, but you were jerky to your brother as a kid, and you are just as self-centered today--crying over pickles didn't change that for me. But, Rebecca is a strong contender to be even worse than Kevin, so you have that going for you in my book.

Lol his storyline leaves me cold. Maybe that's why I like Olivia. She takes the piss out of him at every turn and it's enjoyable to watch. I thought it was very selfish of him to unload about his deceased father to a woman who just lost her husband. 

 

4 hours ago, OtterMommy said:

What I didn't like? The actress...I can't be bothered to learn her name.  Crashing a funeral is just bad form.  Is it really worth it to your "art" to exploit other people's grief?  And even though Kevin can be self-absorbed, that was clearly something he would never do and she put him in an impossible position.  Also, I got distracted by a phone call, but did they have sex in the widow's house?  Really?  I mean, REALLY?  How is that even remotely okay?  And then when actress girl declared that they would never have sex again, it left me wondering if she is just a bitch or if she was prostituting herself?  Either way, it didn't endear her to me.

I just realized there was absolutely no Toby in this episode...and I didn't miss him.

I took it as Olivia is committed to this play and is willing to do what she has to, to get the best performance out of Kevin. I'm not convinced that sleeping with him wasn't in the plan all along, so he would feel rejected and would bring that to his performance. 

 

3 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

Disrespectful, tacky arrogance.  It is one of my pet peeves when shows go out of their way to try to be edgy or naughty.  I don't think the actress cares about art, or helping Kevin, so much as having her play not bomb. 

Yes, that's it exactly. The play is a very big deal to her, and while she was not happy by his casting, she's going to do everything she can to make it a success.

[cali1981]

Still loving this show and even more impressed at how seamless the time shifts are.  I hope they don't kill William off.  Ron Cephas Jones is wonderful actor who has had a big couple of years (this show,  Luke  Cage,  Mr. Robot) .  His daughter Jasmine was in Hamilton on Broadway as one of the Schuyler sisters.  She is outstanding. 

[LJonEarth]

45 minutes ago, femmefan1946 said:

Plus going to a school for gifted kids meant that he could really be himself since he was surrounded by other smart kids,

I missed part of the episode. I got that it was a private school, but was it also for gifted children. My experience of private schools is that their students are from diplomat families who can't take the kids with them, or for kids who have been kicked out of public schools, or wealthy. Probably because Canadian public schools are quite good and I lived in a capital city.

Doesn't the public system have a gifted program? My sister and I were in one in the 50s.

Private schools for the most part are just schools that are run privately rather than under state/local control. They are often religiously based and/or have perks that public schools don't have mostly because their funding comes straight from parents plus endowments. My experience in private school was that the kids came from wealthier families on average, but weren't any more or less intelligent than public school.

The gifted programs in public school in the 90s was one where they pulled you out of class for a few hours each week to do enrichment activities with other gifted kids.

Edited November 3, 2016 by LJonEarth

[SueB]

Forgot to say... I can't talk about Randall & Jack with generating a bunch of tears and snot... so, I'll just be mum on the topic for a while kbye

[cmahorror]

My take on Rebecca is she is the one who holds the house together. Jack works and makes the money; she does the laundry, the dishes, the homework, the driving, the cleaning, the grocery shopping and probably pays the bills. Being that parent, especially with three children, doesn't leave a lot of time to be the fun one. She let the kids play while she reviewed their report cards - so what? Maybe she had already asked if they had homework and it was done or she chose to give them a little down time between work and school. She is in the same room as them and isn't actively ignoring them to do something for herself - she is looking at their report cards and trying to figure out why Randall's teacher wants to meet with them.

I also think that saying to Kate that she has to wear the dress because it is the only thing that was clean and fit wasn't meant to be a dig on her daughter's weight. Kids at that age are constantly growing. The ice cream comment, while it should not have been said, was not meant to hurt Kate's feelings. I believe that Rebecca just wants to help Kate lose weight and has no idea how to do it. She's human, she makes mistakes, but she is not intentionally being cruel to her daughter.

Loved seeing Kate without Toby and Jami Gertz is always welcome on my screen. I am one of the few people who really liked The Neighbors and was sad when it was cancelled. I was wondering why she lived so far away from the rest of the family and her estrangement from her mom following her dad's death explains it. I do wonder if the biggest problem is her remarrying after Jack passed away and am curious as to how soon after he passed it happened. So far the kids do not seem happy with their mom's choice of a second husband.

Randall and his family are perfection.

Poor Kevin - it's obvious that he was the forgotten child because he just didn't need the attention Randall and Kate did. Kate had issues with her weight and Randall with being a highly intelligent black child in a white family, trying to fit in but not certain he ever will.

I have cried on a stranger's shoulder about my husband's death and, more recently, my grandpa's. Sometimes you need to talk to someone who didn't know you or your loved one because they will just listen and not judge or make comments. I didn't see anything wrong with the scene between Kevin and the widow in those terms but I do have a huge problem with that chick tricking him into attending the memorial service.

Can't wait to see the Randall and Kevin scenes in a couple of weeks but ugh to seeing Toby again.

Edited November 3, 2016 by cmahorror

[hiccup]

15 hours ago, Biggie B said:

I do wonder where his cat is, though...

This!  I'm so worried about William's cat!  I know cats are independent and if William is still going back to his home every day, then the cat is probably fine, but I would prefer that the cat not be left alone so much.  Maybe Beth & Randall can explore allergy meds for the daughter that is allergic to cats.  However, since I don't know how awful it can be for allergy sufferers, it may not be fair of me to say that.

I LOVE Jack!  And I love Milo's chemistry with the kids!  I've only seen Milo in Gilmore Girls, and I loved him there too.  Maybe he's just one of those actors that has chemistry with everyone. 

I agree with everyone else's thoughts on young Randall, he is adorable and awesome!

Kevin is fast becoming another favorite of mine with the way he can connect with people. 

I don't like Olivia.

[SlackerInc]

12 hours ago, ClareWalks said:

That's a good point. I wonder why the principal didn't suggest some other options (like a G&T program, or a tutor, or maybe even skipping a grade). 

Right?  I can't fathom a public school official recommending a child leave and go to private school (unless maybe they were really disruptive or something).  Nowadays, of course, it would be doubly stupid to make this suggestion because they'd be lowering their average test scores.  But even then, when that factor wasn't as important, a public school's funding is based directly on their enrollment.  Plus losing a black kid when you don't have that many to begin with can get you in trouble in terms of integration and so on.  Just didn't make sense.

12 hours ago, PRgal said:

There are also public school programs for gifted kids.  They usually require testing and admissions is basically like a private school.  Except, of course, you save like $20-30K.

Yes, exactly.  This is what my two older kids did in elementary and middle school, and my eldest in high school now takes several AP classes.

1 hour ago, Aliconehead said:

That is true for many boarding schools, schools where the students live at, but private schools in the US are different. Generally they are smaller class sizes, more individualized learning and often religious based. The wealthy often send their kids there because of the above factors and also because public schools in bigger cities pull from various areas, some might not be as "nice" as others but still go to the same school as very wealthy areas. Generally privates schools are thought to be better by some because with all the money people pay there can be more or better oppurtunities i.e. Bilingual education, smaller classes, better facilities, better teachers, less drugs, less teenage pregnancy etc. This is not necessarily true, in my opinion. 

The part I bolded is the real key, I think.  Most parents who send their kids to private schools don't want to admit this, maybe not even to themselves (especially if they are politically liberal); but you can read it between the lines.  Basically, by sending their kids to a school that costs too much money for poor people to afford, they get to "weed out the riffraff".  They don't have to worry about their kids running with a "bad crowd" or whatever.  Which is pretty silly, because at any public school with a decent-sized population of gifted kids, those kids hang out together, not with the gangbangers or rednecks.

The only case I know of that could be seen as a counterexample or cautionary tale is some family friends, a family with a brother and sister my and my sister's age, who were half-Native (the father is Native and the mother white; both of them were college professors like my parents).  They moved from a lily white college town to an inner city, the poorest neighborhood in the state of Minnesota, because they wanted their children to not lose touch with their culture and this neighborhood has a high percentage of Native population.  In that case, the sister went from always being a "good girl" with good grades to getting pregnant at age 15 by a gang leader and dropping out of school (yes, every parent's nightmare).  But their mistake, I think, was sending their kids to a school that was just 100% poor and inner city, with no other kind of crowd to hang with.  And even in her case, after having three kids she ended up going back to school and becoming a nurse.

So sure, if you want to make sure your kids don't mix with those from the "wrong side of the tracks" (and also not have to be around "special ed" kids), private school is a great way to do it.  But don't kid yourself that the teachers are better (usually they are less qualified than public school teachers) or that they have better facilities (except at a small minority of super rich schools, they spend less per student than public schools do).  The kids do fine because kids from wealthy families don't really need highly qualified teachers or to have much money spent on their education.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I think it really depends on the school. I went to a private elementary school and although my recollection is that the majority of students were white, we still had black and Latino students as well. In addition, most of us did not come from super rich families. I know that my sister and I were on a reduced tuition plan as were several of the other students in my class who were from lower income families. My mom started us there in first grade because she thought we would get a better education if we had smaller classes. Each grade had two teachers/classrooms with 15-20 kids so there were about 30-40 kids total in each grade.

In fifth grade, I moved to California and I was totally ahead of everyone at my new school. Back then we had Ginn reading levels that were numbered. I was in level 13 at my private school and at my new school, they didn't have that level available even for the GATE kids. My parents chose our new house/neighborhood in California based on the school district. The high school I attended was a California Distinguished School (which is an actual thing, not just me randomly capitalizing words) and a National Blue Ribbon School but for some reason the elementary school in that nice school district still didn't have the reading level I should have been in.

My sister and I were tested for GATE and put into GATE classes. Our school district did not have GATE only classes (they later experimented with having one class per grade that was only GATE students) so we were in class with regular non-GATE kids. The level of GATE activities depended on the teacher. One year each of the GATE kids had to do a presentation on any topic of our choosing in front of our class. I remember wondering at the time why they made me take all those IQ tests to be put into GATE when it just amounted to being given an extra assignment. One kid did a fingerboard demonstration with a mini ramp. Obviously I should have gone that route. What made a difference more than being in GATE was which classes we took. We were tested for math in sixth grade. There were a few smart kids who got put into algebra (which was normally for eighth graders) and two super smart kids who got sent to the high school for math classes every day.

I agree that in most cases, a kid who has average grades but tests well isn't going to be flagged by the principal to be sent to another school. Normally they would just recommend him for GATE testing and have him stay at the same school. The impression I got from what the principal said was that she wasn't just recommending any old private school but a school for gifted kids (which was the term used back then). Some private schools are known for focusing on math/science so maybe that's what she was recommending for Randall?

I feel like nowadays there are so many more options. A guy I know has a super smart son but instead of having him skip a grade or sending him to a different school, he hired a physics grad student to meet with his kid once a week. The kid just asks about whatever he's interested in and the grad student teaches him about it. I don't think that it even occurred to my parents to do that when my teachers wanted me to skip a grade (they said no because I was already a year younger than everyone else and they thought being two years younger than everyone might make things hard for me once I hit puberty, so I get Jack's concern about Randall moving to a different school - every parent wants to make sure that their kid will be comfortable and able to socialize with their peers).

I am another who didn't notice Toby's absence at all until I saw him in the preview for next week. That's when I realized hey, an episode without Toby is pretty nice! So as much as I like Kate at her new job, I'd be fine if she moved to New York and left Toby behind.

[PRgal]

5 hours ago, SlackerInc said:

Right?  I can't fathom a public school official recommending a child leave and go to private school (unless maybe they were really disruptive or something).  Nowadays, of course, it would be doubly stupid to make this suggestion because they'd be lowering their average test scores.  But even then, when that factor wasn't as important, a public school's funding is based directly on their enrollment.  Plus losing a black kid when you don't have that many to begin with can get you in trouble in terms of integration and so on.  Just didn't make sense.

Yes, exactly.  This is what my two older kids did in elementary and middle school, and my eldest in high school now takes several AP classes.

The part I bolded is the real key, I think.  Most parents who send their kids to private schools don't want to admit this, maybe not even to themselves (especially if they are politically liberal); but you can read it between the lines.  Basically, by sending their kids to a school that costs too much money for poor people to afford, they get to "weed out the riffraff".  They don't have to worry about their kids running with a "bad crowd" or whatever.  Which is pretty silly, because at any public school with a decent-sized population of gifted kids, those kids hang out together, not with the gangbangers or rednecks.

The only case I know of that could be seen as a counterexample or cautionary tale is some family friends, a family with a brother and sister my and my sister's age, who were half-Native (the father is Native and the mother white; both of them were college professors like my parents).  They moved from a lily white college town to an inner city, the poorest neighborhood in the state of Minnesota, because they wanted their children to not lose touch with their culture and this neighborhood has a high percentage of Native population.  In that case, the sister went from always being a "good girl" with good grades to getting pregnant at age 15 by a gang leader and dropping out of school (yes, every parent's nightmare).  But their mistake, I think, was sending their kids to a school that was just 100% poor and inner city, with no other kind of crowd to hang with.  And even in her case, after having three kids she ended up going back to school and becoming a nurse.

So sure, if you want to make sure your kids don't mix with those from the "wrong side of the tracks" (and also not have to be around "special ed" kids), private school is a great way to do it.  But don't kid yourself that the teachers are better (usually they are less qualified than public school teachers) or that they have better facilities (except at a small minority of super rich schools, they spend less per student than public schools do).  The kids do fine because kids from wealthy families don't really need highly qualified teachers or to have much money spent on their education.

You can "weed out the riffraff" by moving to another part of your town/county, where you'd be in a different catchment area.  I would have gone to school with the same type of kids had I gone to private or public school just because of where I lived.  However, because there were REAL international students at my school (due to a boarding program), I was exposed to a more diverse range of cultures and in a more "pure" form than at a public school where kids are more likely from "settled" families, whether they're immigrants themselves or fifth generation Canadian.  But I have to admit the school I went to was what many would call "old line." 

Your friends' parents made a very risky move by sending them to that school and paid the price with the girl.  At least she made changes.  "Keeping in touch" with one's culture didn't have to be done by putting kids in such schools.  I'm sure it made her feel even MORE different.  I wonder if they ever asked her about that. 

[luna1122]

12 hours ago, JoannKB said:

How long was Kate working for Jami Gertz before she left her daughter on the side of the road? Because that seems crazy that she would not get fired for that. Not only did she not get fired, but the boss instantly took Kate's side, apologized to her, and then gave her almost everything she asked for and begged her not to quit. That's bonkers. Even if Jami Gertz knows her daughter's a jerk, she barely knows Kate. We, as the audience, know that Kate is a good person and we see all of the underlying issues going into it, but there's no way for Jami Gertz to know that Kate is a saint and not a psycho who left a teenage girl by the side of the road with no ride home when one of her job duties was to drive the girl around, as had been explicitly stated during the interview.

Yeah, honestly, no matter how much of a brat the girl was being, Kate should have been fired over that, and expected to be. This show does that...takes situations that make you go 'wtf? that would never happen' and makes you believe them, til you think about it. It's what is best and worst about the program, really, for me. William, the magickal unicorn. Randall, the gifted kid going to private school.  Manipulative. But it does it well, at least for the most part.

Also, the girl IS a petulant brat, but she's just a little overweight. I do think, were I her, I'd be pretty pissed at my skinny mom foisting me off on the the new fat employee,  as if she's just sure this is my future. Like Kate is a cautionary tale. I'd be pissed if I was Kate, too. Well, I guess she was. I do hope SHE doesn't wind up becoming this girl's magickal unicorn.

The crying in front of strangers thing...yeah, I've done that too. I sobbed in a stranger's arms at a supermarket last thanksgiving when my cat was dying. I know, shouldn't compare the grief over a pet with the grief over a parent, but it was still real grief. I was wandering the aisles with tears streaming down my face and this woman just came up and hugged me, and I let her, and this is NOT characteristic behavior on my part at all. I'm not a hugger. So that part did not, anyway, strike me as unreal.

I don't hate Miguel yet, but am not sure that just because he spoke admiringly of her to Jack that he was yearning after her all those years and couldn't wait to make his move when Jack died, or maybe even before. But there is a serious hotness differential between the two men.

[Eeksquire]

Admittedly, I grew up in a pretty wealthy area, but the idea that private school kids get into less trouble makes me laugh - IME, those kids have access to more money for better and more drugs.  

[ClareWalks]

3 minutes ago, Eeksquire said:

Admittedly, I grew up in a pretty wealthy area, but the idea that private school kids get into less trouble makes me laugh - IME, those kids have access to more money for better and more drugs.  

Truth. They might not smoke as much weed, but they do WAY more coke.

[PRgal]

17 minutes ago, ClareWalks said:

Truth. They might not smoke as much weed, but they do WAY more coke.

And have better parties (I was a loser and never invited to any (other than the prom "after party" which was supervised (as in Mom and Dad are upstairs) by the hostess's parents, so not one of those WILD things.  Doesn't count, right?), but I heard about them).  And no teen pregnancies where girls carry the babies to term.  In Canada, it isn't because we have "better" healthcare - we all have the same - but maybe better education about prevention (I doubt it's necessarily because the families are more "liberal," meaning the girls are more likely to choose termination.  Foreign girls from Asia aren't likely going to have Canadian-style liberal parents - even those from Hong Kong).  At the same time, we didn't have to face the same budget cuts even the wealthier public schools were getting.  The public schools might have had good equipment - usually sports-related, but the good equipment wasn't paying for programs that the public school boards were cutting due to the lack of money (e.g. arts-related classes).  And we definitely had fewer students per class.  We never saw more than say, 22 or 23 kids per section outside of homerooms (doesn't count, since it's not an actual course).  My public school peers sometimes had 35 people. 

[ShadowFacts]

27 minutes ago, Eeksquire said:

Admittedly, I grew up in a pretty wealthy area, but the idea that private school kids get into less trouble makes me laugh - IME, those kids have access to more money for better and more drugs.  

Way back in the twentieth century, the parochial school kids all had to come to public high school, because there were no nearby parochial high schools, and often times they were the wildest kids.  Not so much because of money, but they were pretty much uncorked from the strict rules.  And they reveled in the freedom in the way adolescents do. 

[PRgal]

5 minutes ago, ShadowFacts said:

Way back in the twentieth century, the parochial school kids all had to come to public high school, because there were no nearby parochial high schools, and often times they were the wildest kids.  Not so much because of money, but they were pretty much uncorked from the strict rules.  And they reveled in the freedom in the way adolescents do. 

There are two types of kids like that.  There are the types you mention above, and then there are people like me - who "keep" the old rules well into adulthood.  Admittedly, my alma mater wasn't exactly religious-religious - it was affiliated with the Anglican Church of Canada, but marketed as a prep school - but even now, I won't wear "shower curtain earrings," wear "noticeable nail polish" on my hands (feet are okay - I wear greens and blues sometimes) or even feel comfortable wearing brightly coloured lipstick. 

[Clanstarling]

8 hours ago, SueB said:

What's funny, IMO, is that Randall is such an over-achiever... of COURSE he has his mini-mid-life crisis early. 

Thank you for my early morning laugh. Dead on.

46 minutes ago, luna1122 said:

Yeah, honestly, no matter how much of a brat the girl was being, Kate should have been fired over that, and expected to be

I agree, but I think she wasn't because the mother had a boat load of guilt about the unreasonable ulterior motives she had when she hired Kate.

[PRgal]

2 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

Thank you for my early morning laugh. Dead on.

I agree, but I think she wasn't because the mother had a boat load of guilt about the unreasonable ulterior motives she had when she hired Kate.

But Kate didn't know what to do.  Gemma was not about to give her Ashley's address.  What's Kate supposed to do?  Just keep on driving?  Was her boss even available to talk (if she called)?

[ClareWalks]

Yeah, I have zero problem with Kate dropping the girl off in a fancy suburban residential neighborhood. She had a cell phone and comfortable shoes on, she'll be fine. It's not like the kid is 6 years old, she's a teenager. I didn't even know where Kate was driving in the first place. I wouldn't have put the car in drive without knowing where I was going. How was she making turns and stuff without even having an address? And how was Gemma supposed to benefit from not telling Kate where to go? Did she WANT to just drive around with Kate for hours?

[Biggie B]

Quote

 I didn't even know where Kate was driving in the first place. I wouldn't have put the car in drive without knowing where I was going. How was she making turns and stuff without even having an address? And how was Gemma supposed to benefit from not telling Kate where to go? Did she WANT to just drive around with Kate for hours?

Perhaps Gemma assumed or expected that her mother would have provided Kate with the address. Gemma doesn't seem to talk to anyone but her friends, and even then, only via text, so I wasn't surprised that she (Gemma) didn't tell Kate where to take her. But yes, before even leaving the house, Kate should have nailed down where she was going.

I'm the one who originally asked 'who would cry about their dad to a total stranger?' and I'm saddened that so many of you all have experienced such loss and grief. I don't have either of my parents around anymore, my dad having died 11 months ago, but have never cried about either of them to strangers. I do, though understand how grief can overwhelm you at any give moment, with no warning, and how powerful that can be. That said, I just did not buy Kevin's interaction with the widow in her kitchen. I truly, truly, truly thought he was acting - not the part when he talked about the model-building - that was indeed right from his heart - but the crying hug part,  I thought he was doing that purely for the sake of the widow. I stand corrected.

[PRgal]

4 minutes ago, Biggie B said:

Perhaps Gemma assumed or expected that her mother would have provided Kate with the address. Gemma doesn't seem to talk to anyone but her friends, and even then, only via text, so I wasn't surprised that she (Gemma) didn't tell Kate where to take her. But yes, before even leaving the house, Kate should have nailed down where she was going.

I'm the one who originally asked 'who would cry about their dad to a total stranger?' and I'm saddened that so many of you all have experienced such loss and grief. I don't have either of my parents around anymore, my dad having died 11 months ago, but have never cried about either of them to strangers. I do, though understand how grief can overwhelm you at any give moment, with no warning, and how powerful that can be. That said, I just did not buy Kevin's interaction with the widow in her kitchen. I truly, truly, truly thought he was acting - not the part when he talked about the model-building - that was indeed right from his heart - but the crying hug part,  I thought he was doing that purely for the sake of the widow. I stand corrected.

Yeah, but Gemma was still rude about it.  Kate DID ask her.  And if Gemma assumed her mom told Kate, then the response should have been "didn't she tell you?" 

[Biggie B]

Quote

Yeah, but Gemma was still rude about it.  Kate DID ask her.  And if Gemma assumed her mom told Kate, then the response should have been "didn't she tell you?" 

Indeed. Gemma was horrible to both her mother and to Kate.

[Lady Calypso]

8 hours ago, hippielamb said:

Lol his storyline leaves me cold. Maybe that's why I like Olivia. She takes the piss out of him at every turn and it's enjoyable to watch. I thought it was very selfish of him to unload about his deceased father to a woman who just lost her husband. 

I don't think it was selfish, personally. He was trying to comfort her and he ended up breaking down instead. Unfortunately, it happened at a bad time, but the widow didn't seem to mind. Kevin even made reference to him breaking down at a bad time. 

I think it's because I relate to Kevin that I feel sympathy for him. I have a sister who takes up most of my parents' attention. Even in her mid twenties, my parents are always catering to her and I've always gotten the short end of the stick. So yeah, I definitely can see how Jack's death would affect him and why he would break down, maybe at an inopportune time. I don't know if he ever dealt with Jack's death. It seems like he's been suppressing it for a while.

Olivia is a very selfish person, if anyone is selfish. She takes pride on her work, which is fine, but her methods of teaching Kevin how to act are wrong, as she didn't even feel any remorse or guilt (that she expressed) about crashing a random memorial service. And then, for a job well done on I guess learning her lesson and breaking down, she rewards him with sex, which is very odd. I think she's just too intense and too selfish for my liking. Like I've pointed out before, she reminds me of Toby in that regard and with Kate and Kevin's self esteem issues, it makes sense as to why they're drawn to the same types of people. I hope that both Olivia and Toby are just a gateway for Kate and Kevin to find themselves. 

8 hours ago, cmahorror said:

I also think that saying to Kate that she has to wear the dress because it is the only thing that was clean and fit wasn't meant to be a dig on her daughter's weight. Kids at that age are constantly growing. The ice cream comment, while it should not have been said, was not meant to hurt Kate's feelings. I believe that Rebecca just wants to help Kate lose weight and has no idea how to do it. She's human, she makes mistakes, but she is not intentionally being cruel to her daughter.

I totally agree with this. Her intentions were probably good, but she handled it all wrong. 

[ChromaKelly]

One thing I didn't really get, and I suppose it will be developed more, is that Gemma didn't seem to have any issues related to being overweight. She presented more as a typical bratty teen. She clearly has friends, she's not hiding away. Yes, she's obnoxious to her mother, but I didn't see that it's necessarily weight-related.

[Indy]

On 11/2/2016 at 10:31 AM, ZaldamoWilder said:

I don't think she doesn't know what he does, but more like Randall himself, finds it difficult to articulate in a way people can digest easily.   Maybe it's a more-than-one-word-title kind of thing.  My guy has described my occupation to other people in several completely unrelated and inaccurate ways since we've met, which regularly leaves me in conversation with somebody who says something like:  I understand you're a wall street analyst....(Regulatory Compliance, it's not even close) but it's just easier to nod along and be Chandler Bing.  

ITA. Beth knows, but Randall has one of those jobs that is odd and unique and doesn't sum up nicely in a title or a few words.  I know what my husband does, but it's hard to describe that to other people without being to wordy and complex (essentially, he's a government transpondster). But around where we live, a lot of people have either really complicated jobs or jobs they can't talk in detail about so people don't ask too many questions. 

My love of Beth and Randall now extends down to mini-Randall. That kid is precious and the little boy who plays him is a sharp little actor. I feel like I just pay attention to the Randall-centric parts and the rest is kind of background noise.  I do feel like now I'm just holding my breath until our Wise Owl dies, though.  It makes me sad seeing Randall make plans like his piano recital knowing that William might not be there. 

It was nice to see Kate stand her ground and be confident.  And no Toby so hurray!!  I'm still kind of meh on the Kevin story line.  He seems like a fine guy but Olivia bugs and there's nothing really exciting going on there. 

[ItCouldBeWorse]

Did anyone notice when Rebecca was reading Randall's report card, that he had separate grades for "arithmetic" and "math" along with reading, spelling, history and science? Kind of silly.  Whoever designed the report card could have used "art" or "gym" instead if they needed another class.

Edited November 6, 2016 by ItCouldBeWorse

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

This Is Us Makes The Most Of Career Day

And Al Lowe loves this show as much as a human heart can.

[ZaldamoWilder]

10 hours ago, SlackerInc said:

Right?  I can't fathom a public school official recommending a child leave and go to private school (unless maybe they were really disruptive or something).  Nowadays, of course, it would be doubly stupid to make this suggestion because they'd be lowering their average test scores.  But even then, when that factor wasn't as important, a public school's funding is based directly on their enrollment.  Plus losing a black kid when you don't have that many to begin with can get you in trouble in terms of integration and so on.  Just didn't make sense.

Yes, exactly.  This is what my two older kids did in elementary and middle school, and my eldest in high school now takes several AP classes.

The part I bolded is the real key, I think.  Most parents who send their kids to private schools don't want to admit this, maybe not even to themselves (especially if they are politically liberal); but you can read it between the lines.  Basically, by sending their kids to a school that costs too much money for poor people to afford, they get to "weed out the riffraff".  They don't have to worry about their kids running with a "bad crowd" or whatever.  Which is pretty silly, because at any public school with a decent-sized population of gifted kids, those kids hang out together, not with the gangbangers or rednecks.

The only case I know of that could be seen as a counterexample or cautionary tale is some family friends, a family with a brother and sister my and my sister's age, who were half-Native (the father is Native and the mother white; both of them were college professors like my parents).  They moved from a lily white college town to an inner city, the poorest neighborhood in the state of Minnesota, because they wanted their children to not lose touch with their culture and this neighborhood has a high percentage of Native population.  In that case, the sister went from always being a "good girl" with good grades to getting pregnant at age 15 by a gang leader and dropping out of school (yes, every parent's nightmare).  But their mistake, I think, was sending their kids to a school that was just 100% poor and inner city, with no other kind of crowd to hang with.  And even in her case, after having three kids she ended up going back to school and becoming a nurse.

So sure, if you want to make sure your kids don't mix with those from the "wrong side of the tracks" (and also not have to be around "special ed" kids), private school is a great way to do it.  But don't kid yourself that the teachers are better (usually they are less qualified than public school teachers) or that they have better facilities (except at a small minority of super rich schools, they spend less per student than public schools do).  The kids do fine because kids from wealthy families don't really need highly qualified teachers or to have much money spent on their education.

 

4 hours ago, Eeksquire said:

Admittedly, I grew up in a pretty wealthy area, but the idea that private school kids get into less trouble makes me laugh - IME, those kids have access to more money for better and more drugs.  

^ pretty much what I wanted to say.   My daughter's in boarding school (her choice), I'm single and not wealthy by any stretch so I'll go so far as to add that children who don't come from privileged backgrounds take even more behavioral precautions than more well off counterparts because, as I've said to her more than once, I literally cannot afford it if you fuck up, so don't.

back to all wheel drive - what is most bothersome to me about Gemma is (I'm terrible at this lol, what's Jamie's character's name?) her mother's tolerance of her behavior.   She's kind of complaining to the lady who Gemma insulted by saying the seven words she used to insult Kate with were the most she'd said to her mother in two weeks.    Huh?  Mantra:  I know it's not real, I know it's not real, I must keep saying this to myself while watching this show but, huh?   Our CFO asked me how old my kid was yesterday because he remembered her as the 2 year old who would stalk him at the office children's party.  I said she's 17.  He said time flies, my oldest is 12 and the hardest part of that is all the yelling.  I said you don't seem like an (ole) yeller.  Sorry.  He said I'm talking about the 12 year old.    Brings me full circle to huh? 

[joanne3482]

I kind of like Olivia's ruthlessness.  I appreciate that she'll go to great lengths to make sure the show is a success because if it bombs it isn't just taking Kevin's career down with it, hers will be affected too.

I also kind of assumed that Randall wasn't just gifted but smart beyond the school's capacity to handle it. 

[Indy]

5 hours ago, Eeksquire said:

Admittedly, I grew up in a pretty wealthy area, but the idea that private school kids get into less trouble makes me laugh - IME, those kids have access to more money for better and more drugs.  

Truth. I went to a snooty private high school, on academic scholarship. My classmates threw awesome parties because their parents were gone all the time and they had access to the good alcohol and the good drugs. And mommy and daddy could afford to throw money at the problem if things went awry, in or out of school. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

I had a wealthy friend in high school whose parents were NEVER at their enormous mansion.  They were always on trips here or there or anywhere.  He threw awesome parties.  Oh man do I idolize his mom ; )  Meanwhile I definitely from a lower class was almost never allowed to go to parties but I think that is more because I am a girl / my mother's effed up cultural beliefs.  So yeah that's just one tiny example, but I went to school with a lot of rich crazy kids so I personally never associated a lack of money with teenage trouble.  Very much the opposite.  Immigrant parents like my mother were notorious for not allowing their children to have fun and instead forcing them to overachieve.  

Somebody posted that at private schools, the teachers could be less qualified than at public.  Is there truth to this?  Very interesting.  Something I'd like to discuss with my father.  He has a lot of shame about not sending us to private because he couldn't afford it.  But hell, I wouldn't want to go to private anyway ;)  

Edited November 3, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[BoogieBurns]

40 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Somebody posted that at private schools, the teachers could be less qualified than at public.  Is there truth to this?  Very interesting.

Depends on the school. But they don't have the same requirements for licensing (at least here in Texas) because they aren't funded by taxes. My good friend has her master's in History but zero knowledge about how to teach it and she is the head of the History department at a private middle school. A Master's in US History is much different than a Bachelor's in Secondary Education and her students would be behind if they transferred to public school. She never even took a certification test, and none of the teachers in 7th grade with her did either. 

[truthaboutluv]

Quote

Ugggg Miguel. I know the guy hasn't done anything wrong in the flashbacks, and we dont know the story between him and Rebecca and how they got together, but its just...weird watching him be Jacks best friend, knowing he marries his wife after he`s in the ground. It just adds a weird layer to all their interactions, like Miguel is just hanging around waiting for his chance with Rebecca. Thats probably unfair to him, but its just weird to me.  

Well if it makes you feel better, apparently you're not alone in that view. The people who live tweet during the show are not here for Miguel one bit, so much so the actor responded to someone saying he hopes to change their mind by the end of the season and thinks he will. But yeah people do not like the character and I think the writers had to realize that was likely going to happen, with how they've portrayed Jack and his and Rebecca's relationship. Also I think some viewers have started shipping Milo and Mandy because they're apparently adorable in real life as well. So yeah, poor Miguel is just not very appreciated right now. 

[topanga]

1 minute ago, truthaboutluv said:

Well if it makes you feel better, apparently you're not alone in that view. The people who live tweet during the show are not here for Miguel one bit, so much so the actor responded to someone saying he hopes to change their mind by the end of the season and thinks he will. But yeah people do not like the character and I think the writers had to realize that was likely going to happen, with how they've portrayed Jack and his and Rebecca's relationship. Also I think some viewers have started shipping Milo and Mandy because they're apparently adorable in real life as well. So yeah, poor Miguel is just not very appreciated right now. 

I think the writers did too much foreshadowing when they had Miguel go on and on in the pilot about how great Rebecca was. It was borderline skeevy since Jack was still alive and married. And Miguel was married--apparently happily married, if "The Game Plan" was accurate. 

[PRgal]

33 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I had a wealthy friend in high school whose parents were NEVER at their enormous mansion.  They were always on trips here or there or anywhere.  He threw awesome parties.  Oh man do I idolize his mom ; )  Meanwhile I definitely from a lower class was almost never allowed to go to parties but I think that is more because I am a girl / my mother's effed up cultural beliefs.  So yeah that's just one tiny example, but I went to school with a lot of rich crazy kids so I personally never associated a lack of money with teenage trouble.  Very much the opposite.  Immigrant parents like my mother were notorious for not allowing their children to have fun and instead forcing them to overachieve.  

Somebody posted that at private schools, the teachers could be less qualified than at public.  Is there truth to this?  Very interesting.  Something I'd like to discuss with my father.  He has a lot of shame about not sending us to private because he couldn't afford it.  But hell, I wouldn't want to go to private anyway ;)  

I think it depends on the area.  In Ontario, even private schools (in high school, anyway) have to follow a specific curriculum (though schools can have additional graduation requirements - more math or gym classes, for example).  Schools are inspected by representatives from the ministry of education to ensure that they meet provincial standards.

[truthaboutluv]

19 minutes ago, topanga said:

I think the writers did too much foreshadowing when they had Miguel go on and on in the pilot about how great Rebecca was. It was borderline skeevy since Jack was still alive and married. And Miguel was married--apparently happily married, if "The Game Plan" was accurate. 

This. They foreshadowed that twist WAY too blatantly in that episode, which is why I wasn't the least bit surprised when it was revealed. If they'd just kept Miguel subtle and just had him as a best friend tell Jack that he had a good life and needed to stop drinking before he messed it up, that would have been fine. It was the glowing praise of Rebecca that gave it away.

And so to have it revealed afterwards that in the aftermath of Jack's death (we assume, they may still throw the curve ball of Jack and Rebecca being divorced before he died) Miguel and Rebecca are now together, it makes it hard to not think on some level he sort of bid his time until he could make a play for his best friend's wife. 

Edited November 3, 2016 by truthaboutluv

[ProudMary]

I gotta tell ya, I was in the camp of never having yet cried from watching this show.  I usually will cry at touching commercials but up through the first five episodes, nothing from This is Us touched me enough to get me to tear up, although I like the show very much.  Until this week.  And it wasn't the Jack/Young Randall scenes either, even though those were wonderful.  Nope, it's the scene that seems to have pissed off most people; when Kevin cried in the arms of the widowed stranger. When someone hides those emotions for a long period of time, eventually they've got to come out and we don't get to choose who might release them.  I thought it was a terrific scene and put Kevin in a completely different light for me.  Well done, show.

Also, I had no problem whatsoever with Rebecca playing the piano as the infant Big Three slept.  In fact, I kind of hate hearing music being referred to as "noise." What might wake an infant would be something loud and jarring like dropping and shattering a glass platter or something along those lines.  There's a reason the expression goes, "Sleep like a baby."  Most--granted, not all--babies are sound sleepers and what wakes them is internal e.g. hunger or a wet diaper. Music is soothing to most little ones.  In fact, when my kids were infants, I left the radio on softly in their rooms at night to create a base level of sound so extraneous loud noises wouldn't affect them as much.  The added benefit was that when I was in their rooms for middle of the night diaper changes/feedings, there was always music playing which was relaxing for me too.  Yes, I have a musical brain!  YMMV.

[JoannKB]

Quote

The kid could have just given Kate Ashley's address and then she would have been dropped off by then. But no, she decided to torment her mother's vulnerable new employee (vulnerable because she is a new employee still sounding out the situation - most new employees would have put up with that abuse). She insulted Kate, implied she might get fired and was generally pretty awful. If my teenager treated an employee of mine like that, I'd be apologizing too. And so would my kid.

True, but the mother didn't know what happened. She wasn't in the car, and she doesn't know what her daughter said to Kate. All she knew was that her daughter was left by the side of the road and found her own way home. And the mother immediately believes and trusts a brand new employee and praises her? The mom may have kicked her own kid out of the car before, but that doesn't mean that she is cool with a stranger doing it. I may punish my child, but I wouldn't want someone else doing it for me when I haven't asked them to.

Kate was hired to do a lot of stuff, including driving the daughter around. The first time she did so, she didn't complete the task. She should at least be questioned about that. Why would Kate's first reaction be to kick the kid out of the car rather than call the mom and explain the situation (that she doesn't have Ashley's address and the kid is being a jerk)?

It just seemed unrealistic to me that the mom's first instinct would be to reward Kate for not driving her daughter and taking it upon herself to dole out a punishment, when she had asked Kate - a brand new employee - to drop her daughter off, as part of her job.

Edited November 3, 2016 by JoannKB

[stillshimpy]

On 11/2/2016 at 10:32 AM, deaja said:

Kevin and the widow in the kitchen broke my heart.  I'm neutral on Olivia so far, but thought she was awful for crashing that memorial.  That was so incredibly rude, insensitive and just plain wrong.  Worse, she didn't see anything wrong with it and didn't care.

 

 

 

I'm still pretty neutral on Olivia, but I did want to point out something: this essentially happens at every funeral in that, you never do know everyone there.  There are always strangers in amongst the mourners when you lose a spouse.  Long story super short:  my father-in-law died in an accident 15 years ago.  People who were present in surrounding cars showed up at his funeral because they read in the paper that he was survived by seven kids and a wife.  It was hugely traumatic to even witness, I'm sure, and they felt connected to my FIL because of that.   

That's just one example but that always happens in some form or another.  The person being buried always knows someone no one else has met through a variety of circumstances.   Sure, it's kind of tacky to exploit someone's grief like that but presumably the ad she read also said "services open to the public" which she did mention seeing an ad.  She didn't just dress in black and hopefully join a funeral procession. If she read the dude's obit (and it seemed she did...that or she was really willing to risk big, blow-up-in-her-face details on introduction to the widow) she did at least go in armed.  When she did greet the bereaved she told a nice (and again, hopefully inspired by an obit that described the guy as a liberal, open-minded, profane, straight-shooter whose wit was only out-matched by his passion, otherwise risky) story about the deceased that painted him as a benevolent, trailblazing, match-making, future-generation-starter.    So that was ....if not nice...at least not quite Hannibal Lecter behavior.   

So she was pretty much in-bounds on that escapade until she exposed untold strangers to her bodily fluids on the bereaved's belongings.  Yup, then she was into heinous-beasty-begone territory.   That was sort of my emotional evolution throughout that, first the wince of "oh god, funeral crashing, really? Okay, must have been a public service so....eh...okay...?? FUCK, I hope that was an informed story because if not, way to risk getting funeral-bounced in the social-media age with a highly recognizable (as the plot dictates) actor....oh, well that might have been plan B....scratch the general goodwill mark from earlier...."  to the scene where they abandon all human decency, "....well that's a disgusting thing to do....I hope one of the other funeral crasher's coats gives you both crabs."   

Edited November 3, 2016 by stillshimpy

[Clanstarling]

26 minutes ago, ProudMary said:

Nope, it's the scene that seems to have pissed off most people; when Kevin cried in the arms of the widowed stranger.

I found the scene pretty moving too. I thought his breakdown gave the widow a moment when she could let go of her composure as well, so I figured it was win/win, in a weird way.  And then they had to ruin it with the sex. Sigh...

I don't dislike Manuel, I don't really feel I have enough to go on to dislike him. So he thinks Rebecca is awesome, and yeah, sexy. That doesn't really mean he laid in wait for Jack to die so he could swoop in and take his woman. He seems a pretty loyal friend so far.

While I can't say I particularly like Rebecca, it's not her mothering that bothers me. I'm not sure what it is. It's easy to second-guess mothering. When I was a young mother in the 80's, I remember a conversation I had with a friend who was comparing herself (negatively) to some of the mothers on television shows. Sure, I told her, it's easy to be a great mother when you have a scriptwriter.

5 minutes ago, stillshimpy said:

So she was pretty much in-bounds on that escapade until she exposed untold stranger's to her bodily fluids on the bereaved's belongings.  Yup, then she was into heinous-beasty-begone territory.   That was sort of my emotional evolution throughout that, first the wince of "oh god, funeral crashing, really? Okay, must have been a public service so....eh...okay...?? FUCK, I hope that was an informed story because if not, way to risk getting funeral-bounced in the social-media age with a highly recognizable (as the plot dictates) actor....oh, well that might have been plan B....scratch the general goodwill mark from earlier...."  to the scene where they abandon all human decency, "....well that's a disgusting thing to do....I hope one of the other funeral crasher's coats gives you both crabs."

Love this. My reaction, only better.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 11/2/2016 at 3:57 PM, Amethyst said:

On 11/2/2016 at 10:31 AM, ZaldamoWilder said:

I was just coming to ask why Randall didn't think it was a good idea.   William's going to die soon? He didn't want it to be his last memory of his bio dad?  He doesn't want to be that close to him after all?  Music was his parents thing and he doesn't want William to intrude? I couldn't figure it out,

I didn't get this, either.  I just chalked it up to William's impending demise and how it's getting harder and harder for Randall to accept that.

The teacher/student dynamic can be difficult.  A good teacher may have to push a student, give accurate assessments of his ability or lack thereof. What if Randall has no talent?  That would be uncomfortable for both of them.  They don't have the (hopefully) typical parent/child history where the parent can be honest in his criticism without the child fearing that he is a disappointment or the parent worrying that the child will resent his telling the truth.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 11/2/2016 at 10:31 AM, ZaldamoWilder said:

Good call on NOT having William teach him. Randall strikes me as a perfectionist, so having a new family member teach him could potentially have problems.

Yes.

Edited November 3, 2016 by ItCouldBeWorse

[kili]

Quote

It just seemed unrealistic to me that the mom's first instinct would be to reward Kate for not driving her daughter and taking it upon herself to dole out a punishment, when she had asked Kate - a brand new employee - to drop her daughter off, as part of her job.

The Mom knew her child's behavior recently has been somewhere in the vicinity of heinous. On introducing her new employee, her child had been nothing short of exceedingly rude - not acknowledging Kate, speaking in the third person and insulting her. "I see you hired the fat one"?  That's when the first apology should have happened.

It's anti-social to treat employees like that. You don't get to treat them like sub-humans and insult them. You are wrong to treat anybody like that.

And Jami did have an ulterior motive. She had hired Kate to try to get her to connect with the daughter she could not. She didn't tell Kate that until later. If she had been upfront and said "My daughter is exceedingly petulant and rude and I can't get through to her. It's a lot to ask, but could you try?" at least she'd be giving Kate the option and explaining the true extents of the job. But, she did not.  Kate was there to get a job as a planning assistant, not to be the Super Nanny.

If the mother had believed that Gemma was a well-behaved child and had witnessed her being polite to Kate, she would have every right to demand an explanation from Kate when she dumped her on the side of the road. But, she knew her kid was a jerk and she knew her kid was very disrespectful to Kate and she knew this was a long shot. She could easily anticipate that the daughter would continue to be rude to Kate.

I would frankly not be surprised if Gemma came home and told her Mom exactly what did happen. It would be another way to defy her Mom telling her that she had been so rude that her new employee had quit. She would take great delight in telling her Mom that her plan had not worked and that she was back to square one getting an assistant. Gemma was being rude to Kate to punish her mother. There is little point in doing it if her mother doesn't know about it.

And I disagree that Kate was punishing or disciplining the daughter. Kate was not. Kate was simply saying to the teenager that she wasn't going to accept that level of abuse. Kate wants a job, but she isn't prepared to sacrifice her dignity for that job. She's not willing to be subjected to abuse of that kind. Good for her.  Kate is excellent at her job and she doesn't need to grovel and sacrifice her pride for one.

[ShadowFacts]

46 minutes ago, stillshimpy said:

That's just one example but that always happens in some form or another.  The person being buried always knows someone no one else has met through a variety of circumstances.

But that was not the case here, these were complete and total strangers, and it is dishonest to pretend to know the deceased and gain entrance to their home. 

46 minutes ago, JoannKB said:

Kate was hired to do a lot of stuff, including driving the daughter around. The first time she did so, she didn't complete the task. She should at least be questioned about that. Why would Kate's first reaction be to kick the kid out of the car rather than call the mom and explain the situation (that she doesn't have Ashley's address and the kid is being a jerk)?

Yeah, big unnecessary risk there, the kid could have up and disappeared no matter how nice the neighborhood.  Kate would never forgive herself.  All she needed to do was call the new boss or just turn around and go back.

1 hour ago, ProudMary said:

Also, I had no problem whatsoever with Rebecca playing the piano as the infant Big Three slept.  In fact, I kind of hate hearing music being referred to as "noise." What might wake an infant would be something loud and jarring like dropping and shattering a glass platter or something along those lines.  There's a reason the expression goes, "Sleep like a baby."  Most--granted, not all--babies are sound sleepers and what wakes them is internal e.g. hunger or a wet diaper. Music is soothing to most little ones.  In fact, when my kids were infants, I left the radio on softly in their rooms at night to create a base level of sound so extraneous loud noises wouldn't affect them as much.  The added benefit was that when I was in their rooms for middle of the night diaper changes/feedings, there was always music playing which was relaxing for me too.  Yes, I have a musical brain!  YMMV.

My mileage did vary.  As in most things, there isn't one-size-fits-all.  One of my infants could sleep through a tornado, and another never slept more than 10 hours in a 24 hour period, woke up at the slightest noise, and no amount of exposure "therapy" would change it.  Luckily that passed. 

[Empress1]

18 hours ago, femmefan1946 said:

Plus going to a school for gifted kids meant that he could really be himself since he was surrounded by other smart kids,

I missed part of the episode. I got that it was a private school, but was it also for gifted children. My experience of private schools is that their students are from diplomat families who can't take the kids with them, or for kids who have been kicked out of public schools, or wealthy. Probably because Canadian public schools are quite good and I lived in a capital city.

Doesn't the public system have a gifted program? My sister and I were in one in the 50s.

I went to private school and it was known for being academically rigorous, 99% matriculation rate, small class sizes (my graduating high school class had 75 kids in it total), the kind of place where if you got a B you'd say you'd done badly, blah blah blah.  In my experience there are tiers of private schools in terms of academic quality and cost. Randall's appeared to be one with a big focus on academics (and it was probably expensive).

Add me to the group who welled up when Jack was talking to Randall. When little Randall (who is the second cutest child on TV right now, after Blue on Queen Sugar) said he "didn't want to be different from them," I knew he meant his brother and sister. When Jack said "You are every inch my son," that's when it got a little dusty in here.

I can't stand Olivia. Sneaking into a funeral and fucking in the deceased's home is gross, and I don't see any chemistry between her and Kevin. I just find her annoying.

[Big Mother]

I'm still baffled how a person with incurable stage four cancer is still such a picture of health and good cheer.