S07.E01: The Day Will Come When You Won't Be

[AngelaHunter]

2 minutes ago, CletusMusashi said:

He wouldn't be able to hide and sneak up on him, though. Negan's chewed all the scenery.

It's worth it to stay up this late just read this! Ha!

Quote

I really do hope Daryl is killed off next when they kill off another major character.

I agree with that. He's merely become a mopey irritant, IMO, and lately a real liability.

[CletusMusashi]

25 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Also, Coral grew three inches in 12 hours. I legit LOL'd when he stood up.

This will be how they finally defeat Negan. Coral will grow to gigantic size and stomp Thugville into the ground.

And, yes, his hat will continue to change size with him.

[Unusual Suspect]

I dunno, as brutal as those beatings were ... at least then you don't have to listen to Negan talking.

[JyDanzig]

I have a bit of a split-decision on this premiere... I thought this episode itself was really powerful and well-done, and they actually did convince me it was a good idea to cut last season where they did.  That being said, I'm just not sure how interested I am in the story they're setting up going forward.  I could see myself getting enormously frustrated by a protracted Negan arc... I keep thinking of how perfect the cannibals story was, precisely because they didn't belabor it.  I'm not sure I can take a whole year (or more?!?) of this.

But they exceeded my expectations with this first ep, so I'm going to maintain cautious optimism.  I was most concerned that I just wasn't going to be able to take JDM, because I find him intolerable in almost everything I've ever seen him in -- but finally I'm supposed to hate him, so that wasn't much of an issue!

[biakbiak]

At what seemed like the 11th hour of Neegans monologues I told my boyfriend he could watch alone and maybe I would join in if Neegan ever shuts the fuck up.

Edited October 24, 2016 by biakbiak

[CletusMusashi]

So... are there still Wolves? Or did Carol murder them all while we were listening to Negan talk?

[J----av]

8 hours ago, Racj82 said:

People can leave but it won't hurt the ratings much. I have feeling that the people who complain about this and that regarding the show are the minority. The strong minority. 

 I would bet money 99% of the people saying they are leaving will watch every episode this season

[Glaze Crazy]

I'll probably not watch this episode again, at least this season. I say that knowing they'll play it again before next week's show and probably the week after that. For me, it did what it needed to do, tell me who died and how Negan "broke" Rick into serving his agenda for the near future. As a long time watcher of this show there are several episodes I don't need to see again during the regular "marathons" AMC puts on. This one goes into that bucket.

That said, I'm still in. I want to see how these characters try to heal and adapt to this new arrangement. I want to see, as mentioned above, how Negan has such a crowd of armed people who willingly stand by supportively and watch him be the total asshole he is, without trying to take him down and set up a better living arrangement for themselves. Will they play this as Negan being able to have somehow attracted every Beta-Psychopath still alive in this world to his Alpha-Psychopath self?

Like mentioned already, at least Woodbury had walls/fences, food and other forms of comfort for the occupants, most of whom didn't know what a jerk their governor was until they saw it when they went to the prison the first time. And then most of the "good" people realized he was an unhinged psycho. So he mowed them down right there. So what does Negan have to keep any possibly good and normal people as his foot soldiers and mercenaries?

And I also want to see how some guy gets to call himself King Ezekiel and have a pet tiger and another bunch of different people at his beck and call, under the guise of safety and security.

[Morgan of Hed]

And I'm out. It's no longer fun or enjoyable in any way. 

[J----av]

6 hours ago, ZoloftBlob said:

Yeah but really Daryl did just get Glenn beaten to death.

 Not really. It was realy obvious that Negan was just looking for an excuse to further break Rick. If not for Daryl, Negan would have found some other excuse to kill Glenn

5 hours ago, Morgan of Hed said:

And I'm out. It's no longer fun or enjoyable in any way. 

 Anyone who is a big enough of a fan to post on a forum is probably not "out"

[kelslamu]

3 hours ago, jcin617 said:

I know it's the zombie apocalypse and all, and I understand how mob mentality works - but seriously, I can't fathom how all those people are just OK with his methods.   Did he "Carl's Arm" every one them too?

Right!  I was thinking they need to get someone to talk and find out if they can get some of his people to form a resistance of sorts with them.  I get why Darrell had to do something at that point.  Hell, in the same situation I know I would be dead. lol  

[Zella]

10 minutes ago, J----av said:

 Anyone who is a big enough of a fan to post on a forum is probably not "out"

Not necessarily. I gave up on the show 3 seasons ago and still check out and post in TWD forums, but I am much less of a fan than someone who never frequents forums but also never misses an episode. Nothing I've read about the show's direction has enticed me to start watching again, but morbid curiosity makes me want to know what's going on. 

Edited October 24, 2016 by Zella

[kelslamu]

3 hours ago, EllenC said:

I should feel devastated by those deaths, right? But it just seemed anticlimactic. (Admittedly, I was spoiled b/c of the cliffhanger nonsense.) Plus the excessive gore, blah. And the nattering of a villain who makes me long for the Governor. Who at least wore a jacket that fit.

The fact that I would rather listen to the Governor over Negan says a lot.   I'm now wondering if Negan became a zombie if he would be the only one who actually talked?  Perhaps he would just grunt incessantly?

Edited October 24, 2016 by kelslamu

[Racj82]

23 minutes ago, J----av said:

 I would bet money 99% of the people saying they are leaving will watch every episode this season

People can leave but it won't hurt the ratings much. I have feeling that the people who complain about this and that regarding the show are the minority. 

I wouldn't take that bet because would be throwing money into your pockets.

[Morgan of Hed]

13 minutes ago, J----av said:

  Anyone who is a big enough of a fan to post on a forum is probably not "out"

The alternative view is that if the show has alienated ptv forumites, it has stepped too far. 

When I say I'm out, I'm out. There is far too much good tv these days to waste time on something you don't enjoy. 

[Michel]

You'd think some of the others besides Sasha would've given condolences to Eugene and Rosita over Abraham.  Before they joined Rick's group, they'd been a tight trio for quite some time.  They were both just destroyed by his death.  You'd think someone would've shown them some kindness, too.

You can tell how strong Carl and Michonne's bond is when she tried to plead for his life along with Rick.  I did like that moment from her.  And I liked that Carl was willing to lose his arm if it kept everyone else alive.

I'm not a loyal watcher of this show, so I have no idea who Aaron is.  Could someone tell me who he is, when he arrived, and what his relationships with any of the group members are?  Seeing his reactions to Abraham and Glenn's deaths, you'd think he'd known them for life.

As much as I also wanna see Negan bite it sooner rather than later, Jeffrey Dean Morgan is billed among the regulars, so I think he's in it for the whole season, unfortunately.  Guess it'll make it that much more worth it when he does finally bite it.

[panthergirl13]

I've said it before but this episode sealed it for me: TWD is a bad show in a good-show costume. I continue to watch but it doesn't move me at all. Black Mirror is shaking me to the core this season (I'm only 4 in) but this show? Nothing.

(I haven't read all the comments, but why was there an axe on the roof of the RV? I was really confused by that)

[AwesomO4000]

4 hours ago, Reghan said:

Ironically we had to put my cat, Maggie, down today.  R.I.P Glenn and Maggie the cat

Please accept my condolences for the loss of your Maggie.

3 hours ago, oakville said:

Agreed. I am shocked that no one from Negan's group would try to assassinate him. Does he ever sleep?

3 hours ago, NorthstarATL said:

He probably talks in his sleep.

Hee. All the more reason to kill Negan in his sleep.

[natyxg]

5 minutes ago, Michel said:

You'd think some of the others besides Sasha would've given condolences to Eugene and Rosita over Abraham.  Before they joined Rick's group, they'd been a tight trio for quite some time.  They were both just destroyed by his death.  You'd think someone would've shown them some kindness, too.

You can tell how strong Carl and Michonne's bond is when she tried to plead for his life along with Rick.  I did like that moment from her.  And I liked that Carl was willing to lose his arm if it kept everyone else alive.

I'm not a loyal watcher of this show, so I have no idea who Aaron is.  Could someone tell me who he is, when he arrived, and what his relationships with any of the group members are?  Seeing his reactions to Abraham and Glenn's deaths, you'd think he'd known them for life.

As much as I also wanna see Negan bite it sooner rather than later, Jeffrey Dean Morgan is billed among the regulars, so I think he's in it for the whole season, unfortunately.  Guess it'll make it that much more worth it when he does finally bite it.

Aaron was the dude who found them and brought them to Alexandria. Later he and Daryl would go out and look for other people to join. He joined in the last leg of season 5.

[scrb]

Well the comparison to GoT that they want you to make is to equate Negan to the greatest villains in GoT -- Joffrey, Ramsey, etc.

So that you'll stay with the show, waiting for the eventual payback.

But GoT made viewers hate the villains in a much more deft way, at least in the case of Joffrey, with a couple of scenes early on in the first season, if not the pilot episode.

Here, they made Negan into a boring loudmouth sadist and produced this drawn-out torture porn.  They're probably patting themselves in the back about how realistic they made the effect of hitting human heads with a bat.  Not just Abe and Glen but all the other people that Rick imagined being bludgeoned.

When they finally get Negan, the show runners will show up on Talking Dead and bray about how you can't rule by terror or how resilient the human spirit is or some similar nonsense.

ISIS also rules by terror and when they took over territory, they liked to do these sociopathic demonstrations as well.  Unfortunately, the civilians trapped in those cities they took over are not fighting back.  They're trying to survive and hope help will arrive.

[Dobian]

I guess making fans wait through two whole commercial breaks to finally find out who Negan killed was the producers' way of punishing them for bitching about last season's cliffhanger.

I don't know how much longer this show can continue on this path and have any kind of a point.  What's left of humanity it seems is a bunch of sadistic biker gangs ruling the land ISIS-style.  The walkers seem to keep walking long past their shelf life.  The people you would most expect to survive and thrive in the ZA because they have all the resources for this sort of thing - you know, the military industrial complex - are nowhere to be found.

Well at least Maggie maybe can beat Negan over the head with his own baseball bat in the season finale.

[millennium]

6 hours ago, J----av said:

 I would bet money 99% of the people saying they are leaving will watch every episode this season

Yup, and the writers know it.  Hell, they are Negan, and the audience just bitches, kneeling there, waiting for the splatter to paint their faces.

I took a two-season break after they killed Herschel.   The only reason I started again was I'd run out of other things to watch on Netflix.   Season 4 had some interesting stories (i.e., The Grove), Carol's arc especially.   Season 5 and 6, meh.  

I've read articles about "the writers get it, fans are pissed by the cliffhanger" and "we never meant to make fans angry," blah blah blah.  Then they pull the same damn thing for the first 15 minutes of the episode.   These are writers who apparently hate the audience and take sadistic glee in seeing just how much shit people will swallow.   The audience manipulation was off the charts in this episode.

I didn't find anything particularly terrifying about the deaths of Abraham and Glenn.   This wasn't horror.   It was sadism.  Cruelty.   The person who concocted this mess probably has a history of torturing and killing small animals.  The only lingering emotion is depression, and no small amount of shame for having allowed myself to be a participant when deep down we all knew better (admit it, we did).    I had to stop my DVR during the scene with Carl's arm and read ahead in the live broadcast thread just to see if they went through with it.   I would have ended it right there if the outcome had been different (to be honest, I am truly surprised they didn't carry it out). 

Negan is a big nothing.   He overplayed his opening hand.  There's really not a whole lot worse that he can do now.   Jeffrey Dean Morgan's super-hammy performance made it impossible to take the character seriously.   Honestly, he's more or less the same character he played on The Good Wife, just on a bigger and bloodier set.   All that smarmy dialogue was like a bad Stephen King pastiche.

I will say this: I think the appearance of Negan, and the subjugation of Rick and his people, is a VERY timely development given current events in the real world.   As I watched the episode, I started saying to myself, "No way would all those Saviors have let this one lunatic get so much power.   Surely some of his followers would rise up against him.  They wouldn't just stand around supporting him while he did such vile things.   They can't all be as bad as he is."

Then the ten o'clock news came on.

Edited October 24, 2016 by millennium

[Giselle]

I may have an unpopular opinion but I didnt mind that Abraham got popped, his story was boring and uninteresting, he was zombie fodder.

I've been waiting for Glenn to die since his implausible dumpster survival. That was the time when I would have cared about his loss. Now I didn't care at all. My thought was "Finally."

Maggie was responsible for Glenn and Abraham's deaths and the crap day they had . She offered up her group as paid assassins to kill the Saviors. This little pinata party was all her doing. Couldn't understand a damn word she was saying tonight sounded like she was channeling babbling busted up Glenn using a piss poor southern accent.

I found Neegans breaking of the group and Rick interesting but damn I wished he would have shut up. 

Had no emotions about the show. As someone said up stream they should have busted skulls at last season's end for emotional impact and started this season with the Negan's breaking of Rick.

I didn't watch TD, I don't really care to see gratuitous verbal blowjobs.

[Richness]

That was a brutal, difficult episode to get through. It wasn't an enjoyable episode, but it was a good episode despite some scenery chewing and a bit of fluff filler. The cliffhanger didn't bother me, as I don't expect instant payoffs being a child of classic 80's cliffhangers like "Who shot, JR?". The ones who died will allow for a lot of character development and soul searching for those who left.

After seeing the hatchet in the teaser, and the way it was present throughout the episode, I thought for sure they were finally going to fulfill another comic element that hasn't happened in the show. But boy did they sure flipped the script and put that on poor Carl though. That was an excellent way to break Rick. While drawing the line on the arm was a bit over the top, that entire scene had me wanting to not watch further.

By the way, did anyone notice one of Neegan's men taking a Polaroid instant picture of one of the bodies during the slow-mo out of focus shots at the end? DI don't recall if that was Glenn or Abraham, but I thought that was a clever call back to the raid on the observatory.

Also, I thought I saw another hatchet on top of the RV with Rick. But then he went running around looking for the hatchet that Neegan threw on the ground. I suppose the black shape could have been something on the RV, but it looked like a hatchet to me while watching.

[Sofinn]

I'm so glad that my country finally isn't behind on this show. Got to watch first episode ever with subtitles. But I was still kinda bored. All this Negan talking and being rude a.hole isn't what I signed up for. Too much violence.

I was spoiled but forgot that for a while. When Abe died, I was like "yeea Glenn made it" and then.. oh well. 

[AwesomO4000]

3 hours ago, mustbekarma said:

Personally, I'd just poison all the food I gave them.

Agreed. I said as much over in the "Spoilers" thread. I didn't know why none of the groups had tried that yet. Unless Negan makes someone from the group taste test it that is.

1 hour ago, ShadowSixx said:

I'm really hoping Maggie knocks the fuck out of Daryl when she sees him. I'm sorry but Daryl is coming off really stupid. Bad enough he goes running off in S6 where he, Rosita, Michonne, & Glenn are captured and Daryl is shot as a result but after Abe's death and Negan antagonizing Rosita, Daryl felt the need to punch Negan after Negan clearly said he would only allow one person to get out of line which was Glenn when he saw that Maggie has been captured. Daryl may not have been close to Glenn like he is to Carol or was to Beth and being fond of Denise but it was fucked up what he did. I really do hope Daryl is killed off next when they kill off another major character.

I agree with whoever it was above who said that Negan was likely going to goad until someone messed up... or he'd find another excuse, or say someone "looked at him wrong." Typical abusive asshole behavior - he'd find an excuse even if there wasn't one. And Darryl didn't know that it wouldn't be him who took the consequences.

Also did Glenn know at the time that he acted out that Negan was going to give them the "first one for free?" If not, then Negan could've done the exact same thing for Glen acting out that first time, saying now he'd add an extra victim to the one he already promised... maybe even killed Maggie. Yes, Darryl screwed up, but it very well could've been Glenn to screw up if Negan wanted it to have been... and I suspect Negan hoped someone else would mess up, or would somehow make it so, because Glenn had acted out beforehand and he wanted an excuse to punish him anyway. I am guessing that is why he chose Glenn to be the next one killed. Then Darryl, the defiant one, is the perfect one to use as a prisoner and scapegoat for any future person acting out. Darryl will blame himself for Glenn, and so then likely accept his "punishment."

I agree with those who were dismayed by the threat to Carl. And the one Negan killed from Hilltop was also a kid - only 16. To me it's just unbelievable that so many people follow Negan and accept this as acceptable behavior instead of saying "Screw this. How long until Negan decides I should lose a part/get my head bashed in/etc?" As someone above said, they have guns. Just shoot him.

For me, my favorite part was how brave Carl was, keeping it together for Rick and saying "Just go ahead and do it." Made me even more sure that Carl is my favorite. I hope he and Rick take Negan out together. I just hope I don't lose my patience before that happens. I'm almost there already, because I couldn't be less interested in seeing the groveling Rick and gloating Negan show. If it weren't for Carl, Michone, and hoping for a Darryl redemption, I'd be out of here already. (It used to be Rick, too, but see my above comment about groveling Rick and gloating Negan.)

Hee - I know it used to be "Shut up, Carl." Can we replace it with "Shut up, Negan!" ?

Edited October 24, 2016 by AwesomO4000

[MVFrostsMyPie]

So the season 7 finale will be Maggie's baby going all Bam Bam Rubble at Negan's head with Lucille right?

There will be no satisfying way for him to die. I think Noah's manner of death has stuck with me as most brutal in terms of suffering, so I guess they could stick Negan in a glass case (of emotion) and throw some walkers in there and have them tear away at his face and ladies' leather jacket. But dying from walkers is too easy. No, let's stab him repeatedly and pull out his fingernails, stick a bunch of ticks and brown recluse spiders in his pants and make him watch Donald Trump on repeat.

Based solely on the show itself and not the comics, I wonder if Glenn was the second person killed because of where he was kneeling. Like what if Rosita and Glenn switched places? You knew he was going to go for the swing around as the element of surprise, but I wonder if he cared that it was Glenn he aimed for or whoever was in that general direction.

As for the Saviors and why they let Negan do his thing - well I guess it's "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em". They're cowards and figure they have a better chance of survival this way. When there's nothing left to lose and the world has gone to shit, I guess for people with questionable morals anyway pre-apocalypse, this wouldn't be a big leap to make. They probably sleep at night by thinking, "at least I'm not as bad as him". Also, see Manson, Charles. And well, Hitler.

ETA: How convenient that dude had a sharpie in his pocket...

Edited October 24, 2016 by MattDuffysCat

[Muffyn]

I am worried it will be a season of me saying "Shut up, Negan." Was there any oxygen left for the other actors by the time he was done?  This show has moved off of my live watch list.  I'll try to keep up but it is no longer a priority.  At least Michael Cudlitz can shave off that horrible mustache and go back to his natural blond.   

[kelslamu]

The only thing I can think of for all of his followers is that they are scared to say what they really think.  If they told someone they wanted to kill Negan, that person could run and tell him and then they die.  Trust doesn't seem very big in the ZA.  

[GaT]

I didn't watch the episode, I just read the comments. Then I deleted the episode from the DVR & canceled my future recordings. I am done.

[pythonite]

Found this ep ponderous, indulgent & boring like many of you it seems. Already fast forwarded in my head how I want to see Negan die. Tied up and stripped from the waist down with a prone walker crawling toward him, jaws snapping, fade to black. At least it didn't mar my fav character Carol because she was no where to be found. She's off with those silly horse people.

[Wryly]

I don't know how much more humiliation and spirit breaking I can tolerate. I really hope they don't drag that on too long. If they make me wait forever before the group gets a win, however small, I may not be able to hang in here.

[GreyBunny]

So long to GREATM and the Atlanta Five.  

At least Aaron is still alive.  Love him.

[Scribbles]

This episode felt like a comic book.  It was panels of art and dialogue on TV.  They just filled the time with more threats and gore, then heaped on an extra death to up the ante. 

Personally, I didn't enjoy the episode on any level.  It just didn't seem to me that Rick needed two brutal deaths, a zombie surge and his son's limb threatened to break into compliance with the new regime.  It felt oversold.

An aside.....I loathed the line from Sasha to Rosita that went something like..."I am going to take him now".  It was just irksome. 

It struck me that Maggie without Glenn is not that compelling to me.  Something in those final moments with all her angst just felt off for me. 

Sadly, I felt more toyed with and annoyed than what I think they intended me to feel when the episode ended.  I wont rage quit watching in the future, but my expectations for being enthralled are gone.  

[nurse1]

Awesom0400 said:

Quote

For me, my favorite part was how brave Carl was, keeping it together for Rick and saying "Just go ahead and do it." Made me even more sure that Carl is my favorite. I hope he and Rick take Negan out together.

Agreed...I was actually impressed with Carl, who I have to admit hasn't been one of my favorites. But he is now.

Man, this episode was so intense and boring and sad all at the same time.  But the acting was very good.  I admit that I got teary about glenn.

I'm going to continue watching, yes it was awful but this show has been evolving toward this awfulness for a few seasons.

But as stated by someone earlier, I can only watch this episode once!

[CrazyDog]

This was a disturbing, joyless episode...but I'm still in and kind of hoping the worst is over, shock-gore wise. Maybe? I want to see what happens with Carol and Morgan. I want to see how Maggie moves forward. Carl has become one of my favorites, and Daryl can go anytime now. I am not stressed at all that Negan has him. Probably not the reaction Kirkman was going for.

I want to see more of Hilltop and for someone to ask Jesus WTF, dude.

I want to see Rick recover from this and most of all, I want Negan to shut the hell up. I assume he's going to be a major part of the season but there will hopefully be nice breaks from him. His presence has been made, I don't need the monologues, mustache twirling and bat every episode.

I'll miss the humor that Abe brought as cheesy as he could be.

Edited October 24, 2016 by CrazyDog

[nachomama]

2 hours ago, millennium said:

  These are writers who apparently hate the audience and take sadistic glee in seeing just how much shit people will swallow.   The audience manipulation was off the charts in this episode.

I didn't find anything particularly terrifying about the deaths of Abraham and Glenn.   This wasn't horror.   It was sadism.  Cruelty.   The person who concocted this mess probably has a history of torturing and killing small animals. 

I think Kirkman hates the audience. I think he doesn't like that he doesn't have total control on the show where he does writing the graphic novel. If he didn't have a creative outlet to kill people on paper I'm not sure if he wouldn't be Ed Harris' character on Westworld, killing for kicks on vacation. He gleefully spouted Glenn's death on several appearances, probably banking on most people's disbelief that they would actually go there. Yes he threw in other potential deaths but I knew it was Glenn based on Kirkman. Kirkman is negan to me. 

I want to see how the Tiger and Ezekiel play out, obviously they will provide the army to take on Negan and help our merry band out but as we've seen up to now all the leaders turn out to be cuckoo, this dudes got a tiger so their utopia gotta be messed up too, right? 

Edited October 24, 2016 by nachomama

[Roselle]

Clearly, I'm in the minority here but I'll put my head above the parapet to admit that I thought that was really great TV - Thought JDM played it brilliantly and Andrew Lincoln's acting was utterly phenomenal. Fantastic. Laura Cohen too. I resented the same things that others here are critical of during the previous season (fake deaths; Carol's character oddness; Morgan etc etc) but this opener was just so tense I could actually feel my heart rate going up. I couldn't watch the beatings (gotta admit I often watch TWD through my fingers) but that wasn't just because I'm squeamish but because I cared for the characters (so so sad that Glenn's gone) and the tension built on that expertly.  Yeah, Neegan talks a lot but to me that's OK because it adds to the anxiety of what he's actually going to do at the end of it. Personally, I thought the speechifying, and the directing of it, with all the low shots and foreground close ups of Lucille and her 'debris' (?) and the well acted reaction shots, carried the episode brilliantly - everything hung from it (oh, and that reminds me...Rick's leap onto the hanging Zombie and its inevitable neck-stretch-decapitation was cool wasn't it?) and it was devastating. 

Thought it was a very clever way to re-set the show yet again, to put these people in a place they have never been before despite all the other horrible places - I can't wait to see how Rick will proceed now. I'm only anxious about what I'm sure will be some upcoming episodes that will feature the other break-away groupings (Tara and Carol and Morgan, and now Maggie) that will inevitably annoy me by distracting from the main storyline, as they have done in other seasons. 

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

I have to be honest and say I don't really quite understand the visceral hate and anger directed at this episode (& now Show, overall). 

I thought we all knew this show was more about the horrific levels that humanity has sunk to - by this stage of the game - and the walkers (zombies) are just there for the horror!gore fanatics.  I get that people hate Negan and want him dead ASAP, and that's fine, I feel the same way... but isn't this what we signed up for?  Watching just how depraved, sick, and vicious some humans devolve to in the midst of an apocalypse, whilst watching and wondering how the protagonists will survive and ultimately fight back??

Just stating an opinion, but the general sentiment seems overly extreme currently.   <YMMV>

[candall]

7 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

[,,,]

Anyway, I had predicted either Abraham or Glenn to be "Lucilled," so yay for me, for it ending up being both?

Either way, I found this entire episode to be pretty weak.  Just a whole bunch of Negan gloating, smirking, cracking lame jokes, and getting off on torturing Rick.  It was like seeing a troll on an internet comment section come to life.  It sucks since I like Jeffery Dean Morgan, but I'm already tired of

 

7 hours ago, econ07 said:

Good writing should make you want to see the villain get what is coming to them.  All I want to see is the writers/creators get what is coming to them ... for this show to flame out this season.  I'm never been less interested in seeing how this unfolds.

It would have been so much better to end the season with Abraham getting clubbed, letting people chew that over for six months, then letting the premiere be about the characters' shock . . . and SURPRISE--another important character gets Lucilled.

 

7 hours ago, oakville said:

I do think ratings will drop after this episode.

So do I.  And they will conclude "We were right--cliffhangers keep the people coming back" instead of "Viewers appreciate great storytelling a lot more than they appreciate being slowly strung along, monologues and gore."

[cmfran]

I agree with those who said the violence was excessive. Did Eli Roth direct this ep? I'm no prude, but it was a bit much. And I say that as a lifelong horror fan who has pretty much seen it all. I don't deal well with head trauma scenes in general, and the ones in this ep were almost as bad as the ones in "Irreversible." Well, not quite, but still. Glenn's/Abraham's deaths were definitely R-rated in terms of intensity, so not sure how they got them past the network.

[Door]

I can't believe that, in a show about zombies, my suspension of disbelief snaps at Maggie's apparently neat, self-resolving miscarriage. 

Sad about Glenn ultimately dying just as an example to others at the hands of a psycho but I can spin it as a "futility of goodness in a nihilistic world" thing, though that means I've just given it more thought than the writers did. 

Speaking of, that dinner table bit was ridiculous and manipulative even though it was SO NICE to see our team calm and successful and thriving for two seconds. 

Neegan. I like JDH's acting here but really it's his silences and facial expressions that make the character moreso than the (endless) dialogue. The writers should realize this and cut back some of the speechifying. Less is more on that front. 

Edited October 24, 2016 by Door
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[Reghan]

For those of us that are going to miss the Gleggie <3 Definitely going to miss my OTP :(

[sigmaforce86]

9 hours ago, minamurray78 said:

I need a shower after that.

And a set of earplugs if I'm gonna make it through a season of this guy's constant yapping.

Yeah..not a fan of Neegan from the comics either and episodes of JDM (as much as I love the guy as actor) striding around preaching Neegans particular brand of crazy to anyone who'll listen doesn't get my "must watch" sense tingling.  

Spoiler

Especially if he takes Carl under his wing, convinces him to ditch the eyepatch etc. 

Not looking forward to those little chats at all

I sort of feel bad that I couldn't seem to feel bad for Abraham or even Glenn, the speculation and endless articles on every website wore out the suspense for me until I pretty much didn't care and just wanted it done.  There were moments though - Rick on the hanging walker, Neegan after hearing Daryl's name.  And the one real fake out - Carl's arm; since that should be Rick right now it was easy to believe they might just do it.  

Yes it's very well acted and yes it's a study in characters and survival and what some humans will do, not just a constant zombie fight.....but it's still missing  something they used to have that made it much more interesting than it is the second half of last season and now.

[ChromaKelly]

I am angry that this show subjected me to the line "Lucille is thirsty." God I just can't with Negan. 

[halgia]

And here's your first reminder of the season to keep the discussion about the show, not the fans. :)

[millennium]

20 minutes ago, ChromaKelly said:

I am angry that this show subjected me to the line "Lucille is thirsty." God I just can't with Negan. 

I feel bad for B.B. King.

[lmsweb]

Because I'm an idiot who apparently forgets she needs to sleep before work the next day I rewatched it.

Nice touch at the end of the episode with one of Negans henchmen taking a Polaroid of Abe. It was just a quick, background shot but it added a little element of "ugh" to an already traumatic episode. 

[lulee]

49 minutes ago, cmfran said:

I agree with those who said the violence was excessive. Did Eli Roth direct this ep? I'm no prude, but it was a bit much. And I say that as a lifelong horror fan who has pretty much seen it all. I don't deal well with head trauma scenes in general, and the ones in this ep were almost as bad as the ones in "Irreversible." Well, not quite, but still. Glenn's/Abraham's deaths were definitely R-rated in terms of intensity, so not sure how they got them past the network.

I think Greg Nicotero, the special effects guy directed it. I guess he wants to show off his team's handiwork. 

 

I was ok with the graphicness of the character deaths - not that I liked it - but it didn't seem wrong to me like others have commented. Everyone eventually becomes a body on this show - either dead or undead, and I think that includes characters. I didn't that Abe and Glenn's deaths were more horrific than Herschel's, more graphic yes but horrific no. 

[Bad Example]

5 minutes ago, lmsweb said:

Because I'm an idiot who apparently forgets she needs to sleep before work the next day I rewatched it.

Nice touch at the end of the episode with one of Negans henchmen taking a Polaroid of Abe. It was just a quick, background shot but it added a little element of "ugh" to an already traumatic episode. 

Even though I hated seeing Rick broken down and I was genuinely worried about Carl's arm, that little moment with the camera made me more organically angry than all of the Negan stuff.