S01.E03: The Confession

[Sake614]

I knew he was going with Aaron for his COS but was kind of surprised it was Aaron who leaked the tape. I would have sworn it was the General. That man was mighty pissed that Kirkman didn't immediately say 'let's bomb the SOB.'

I called the survivor as being part of the attack the second they pulled him out. There's no way he wouldn't have had much more serious injuries if he was truly buried under all that rubble.

Nice that I was right about Penny's age. I just had a feeling that she was only 8 years old.

[innocuouspuff]

13 hours ago, Netfoot said:

So, this guy leaks the top secret video, thereby forcing the US into a war with (possibly) the wrong people, and when he gets found out, he tenders his resignation?  I was expecting KS to tell him the resignation was unnecessary, because he's be spending the next 30 years in Leavenworth.  But no, the president makes him Chief of Staff !!?!

During the scene where they were arguing about whether it was "insubordination", I may have been yelling TREASON IS STILL A CAPITAL OFFENSE at my screen. Along with espionage. Whispering some rumours might have been one thing but passing along the full video? He'd be lucky to just get Leavenworth.

 

I'm enjoying this show but yeah it does lean on the Shondaland style, who needs procedures and realism when we have earnestness and feelings! soapiness.

[CatWarmer]

My first reaction to the terrorist video was that he was The Mandarin from Iron Man 3, played by Ben Kingsley.   Which would support the theory that the explosion was done by a domestic group.  Agree that Aaron committed treason by releasing that video.

Husband and I had a productive discussion where we agreed that the show was so fictional that it was pointless to determine whether anybody's actions were logical, sensible, legal, etc.   Just go with the flow, like time travel shows.

Also I am now guessing that every seat in the House chamber has a trap door with bomb protection.

[Quilt Fairy]

This show is going downhill quickly for me. Enjoyed the first 2 eps and was willing to suspend disbelief, but in this ep I just couldn't anymore. The most powerful man in the free world does not have a private family funeral where his estranged son gets to tell the new President he doesn't want him to speak. Ain't gonna happen.  And the political in-fighting at the time of the greatest crisis the US has ever known? Possible, I guess, but I'd like to think it's unlikely.

[shapeshifter]

I think some of the unbelievable legal and procedural stuff mentioned above would've worked better if the attack was more apocalyptic — like a nuke that flattened and irradiated the entire DC area — not that I want to watch that show. Kirkman needs a savvy judical/legal expert at his side.

Edited October 6, 2016 by shapeshifter

[thuganomics85]

I'm still enjoying the show enough, but this episode was probably the weakest.  Didn't feel like much happened.  The stuff about the media/public finding out that the original President was going to demote Kirkman was just another variation of "Kirkman has to prove himself to the world", which starts with him trying to be his normal nice self and it not working, and them having to play politics to come back.  Or in this case, Aaron being the one to do it.  If this was real life, yeah, he would totally be heading to prison, but I'm not surprised Kirkman made him Chief of Staff instead.  As soon as the show hinted it was Aaron vs. Emily, I knew it was going to end with Kirkman basically liking and being closer to Emily, but feeling Aaron will be who he needs to make-up for his weaknesses.  At least Emily gets to be Senior Advisor.  And I do think she could get a shot later on.  Either before or after she and Aaron hook-up, because that is so going to happen.

Man, is the stuff with the son a drag.  They just need to ship the kids off to a private school or something.  They aren't bringing anything new to this show.

Hopefully Kimble will continue to just be a somewhat political rival, but I still worry they are going to end up making her evil.

They now have video proof of a terrorist organization claiming credit for the attack, but since they've falsely claimed credit before for other attacks, Kirkman still doesn't want to pull the trigger yet.  But now that Aaron leaked the video, the clock is ticking to make some move.

The survivor from last week was a young Senator played by Ashley Zuckerman, who Hannah finds out just happened to leave his seat before the bomb went off, so he's probably top next suspect right now.  I could end up being a red herring, I guess, although I'm still suspecting it will end up being some kind of government conspiracy, instead of a simple terrorist attack.

[shapeshifter]

3 minutes ago, thuganomics85 said:

...The survivor from last week was a young Senator played by Ashley Zuckerman, who Hannah finds out just happened to leave his seat before the bomb went off, so he's probably top next suspect right now.  I could end up being a red herring, I guess, although I'm still suspecting it will end up being some kind of government conspiracy, instead of a simple terrorist attack....

The two outcomes are not mutually exclusive. Ashley Zukerman's charcter could be both a red herring and there could be a government conspiracy, which might be an interesting plot if handled deftly by the writers.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

Possible Wrong Decisions, By Possibly The Wrong Designated Survivor

Pressure mounts for Tom to make a move, thanks to moves made by others.

[mikem]

Twice in this episode, the writers made very specific time references that don't make any sense.  As was said before, no President would spend AN HOUR of their Cabinet's time talking about his son's concert.  What is there to say for AN HOUR?  And then to give everyone programs during a Cabinet meeting?  Really? 

And the six seconds to vanish is just too short.  Looking at the images, it looks like the rows are close together, as in a movie theater, so he would have had to have alerted the person next to him that he needed to leave, and that person would have had to have adjusted in some way to let him out.  That would take more than 6 seconds from start to finish.  Instead, the before and after photos look like MacLeish got pulled straight up into the sky, and the people next to him didn't even notice.  Very sloppy, and unnecessarily sloppy, by the writers in both cases.

Speaking of the writers, anyone else feel that "Kimble Hookstraten" is a weird name?  It's a very showy name, and out of place among "Thomas Kirkman," "Peter MacLeish," and the other pretty-ordinary-sounding names on the show.

Aaron's last name is "Shore."  Did we know that before?  I noticed that the show has a lot of people of color in the main cast, and they all have very Anglo names like Seth Wright and Aaron Shore.  (Adan Canto, who plays Aaron, was born in Mexico.)  Not saying it's good or bad that they have Anglo names, just noting it.

Edited October 6, 2016 by mikem

[BlackberryJam]

I thought the Congressman survivor video had been faked and he was never there. So they were looking at a video of him CGIed in and the lady with the camera showed he was never there.

I wasn't paying that much attention.

[paigow]

12 minutes ago, mikem said:

Aaron's last name is "Shore."  Did we know that before?  I noticed that the show has a lot of people of color in the main cast, and they all have very Anglo names like Seth Wright and Aaron Shore.  (Adan Canto, who plays Aaron, was born in Mexico.)  Not saying it's good or bad that they have Anglo names, just noting it.

This show is "Designated Hamilton"

[Netfoot]

8 minutes ago, BlackberryJam said:

So they were looking at a video of him CGIed in and the lady with the camera showed he was never there.

Now, that's an interesting theory.

[kili]

Quote

I thought the Congressman survivor video had been faked and he was never there. So they were looking at a video of him CGIed in and the lady with the camera showed he was never there.

That would be wicked hard to do unless they controlled the cameras remotely. Having to insert somebody into a live program when you don't know which camera might sweep him at any moment? How does one do that? They have no control over the people sitting next to him either. If the crowd suddenly does a standing O, is he the only guy sitting? If somebody decides to shift into his seat because he didn't make it, does it look like they are sitting in his lap? If the person beside him claps wildly, does it look like his arm is going through the guy's head?

That's not to say that this show won't go that way. They play fast and loose with reality, so live insertion into a crowd with multiple cameramen capturing the proceedings is just something they might try to say happened.  They do have a senator semi-standing taking pictures during the event like somebody at free shopping mall concert. Seriously, has anybody ever seen anybody do that during a State of the Union address? Won't that kind of activity get you chucked out of most government houses. Sit down and listen! Who is she taking pictures of anyway? Doesn't she work with these people everyday?

[Trillian]

9 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

Chief of Staff isn't necessarily better than Senior Adviser or some other nebulous position.  Sure, if you're Leo McGarry you essentially become the co-president, but in the Obama and Bush administrations the people with the closest ties to the president (Rove, Jarrett, Axelrod, Plouffe) have been given the senior adviser title. 

Do you have a best friend?  Is he smarter than you? Would you trust him with your life?  That's your Chief of Staff. 

I went back and replayed Pres. Bartlett's talk with his Designated Survivor (although I am proud to say, as a major West Wing geeky fan, that I remembered the above without the rewatch). Bartlett outlines to the DS what to do if a catastrophe happens: first thing, get your Commanders together, appoint Joint Chiefs, appoint a Chairman, take us to Defcon 4; have the Governors send emergency delegates to Washington; the Assistant Attorney General is going to be the Acting Attorney General; if he tells you to bring out the National Guard, do what he tells you. 

I'm enjoying this show, and I don't claim to be an expert of any kind in American government or emergency preparedness, but I think Aaron Sorkin got it much closer to what should (or would) happen than this show. 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lKWmlIExRAo

[Minneapple]

Nothing about this show works the way the real world should. The White House is hacked and everyone just sits around? ONE GUY goes to see about the president? The Secret Service doesn't burst into the Oval Office and carry off the president? The Secret Service wasn't standing outside (or inside) the room with the president? THIS IS THE WORST SECURITY DETAIL IN AMERICA.

Kirkman still has not named a Cabinet. It took him THREE episodes to name a Chief of Staff. Get it together, Kirkman, and make it snappy.

I love Maggie Q. Please give her something to do other than wander around and be sad. Nikita would have found the bomber by now and kicked his ass all the way to Division headquarters. And she would have worn a cocktail dress and heels while doing it.

Congresswoman Virginia Madsen has some amazing red lipstick. And I knew she wasn't on the up-and-up. I still like her though.

I see UNRESOLVED SEXUAL TENSION coming for Aaron and Emily. Maybe it will become resolved sexual tension if they have sex somewhere inappropriate in the White House.

Despite all the stuff they get wrong, somehow I still like this show. It's charming. The cast is stellar. 

[secnarf]

Re: the photos taken 6 seconds apart and the video, the point of that is that the timing doesn't make sense. I thought I heard one of them speculate that the video was on a loop to show the guy there, when he couldn't actually have been.

[preeya]

I noticed twice when Kirkman was annoyed he (Keifer) made the Jack Bauer sneer. Just wondering if it is now embedded in him or is it just his mannerism when he's acting pissed off.

[Danielg342]

7 hours ago, kili said:

I am more and more convinced that Kimble is on it. The conspiracy would surely have had somebody on the other side prepared. And that speech she had ready to go tonight? Either she plans for absolutely every contingency or she had a reason to think that would happen. I even find her cooperation suspicious.

This one thing I thought of and kept thinking about after watching the episode- no doubt the Democrats would be beside themselves hooting and hollering that Kimble Hookstraten is part of the conspiracy. Part of it is that I'm not sure the Republicans would designate their own "designated survivor"- they're not the ruling party, so that's already suspicious (although if I'm wrong and the non-ruling party also designates a designated survivor then I'll eat my words). The other part is that there were a few things that broke in her favour that allowed her to present herself to the public and make her look far more Presidential than Tom Kirkman.

A little too convenient, I'm sure some Democrats would think.

It's why I'm hoping she isn't made to be evil or actually part of the conspiracy, because it's, well, "too easy" and would be a pretty lazy writing choice. I also think it's an absolute waste of Virgina Madsen's talents to "reduce" her to the tired cliche character of the "conniving woman".

I still like this show. I think, overall, this was a fun hour. There was a lot going on but I still paid attention to it. So credit to the show for making it all enthralling.

...but, I can see it as the show's central problem. Kind of like Gotham, you could probably have four or five different shows out of just this one show:

1. President Kirkman and his adjustment to the Presidency
2. Hannah Wells and her investigations within the FBI
3. Kirkman's family drama
4. General White House/Capitol Hill drama
5. General worldwide political drama

Now, I know quite a few of those could be grouped together, and I feel No. 1 is what the writers are aiming for, but I do fear there's a lack of focus. Worst of which is probably Wells- she should have been a recurring character, not a main character, because after Wells investigates the conspiracy, what is left for her to do?

Not only that but Wells seems to be an afterthought in these episodes- they're really glossing over her investigation. It's a shame, because Maggie Q deserves more than to play a "useless" character...but, unless this show finds a way to use everyone effectively for the rest of the series, Hannah Wells may just be the odd one out.

Episode Grade: B+.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Danielg342

[txhorns79]

Quote

This one thing I thought of and kept thinking about after watching the episode- no doubt the Democrats would be beside themselves hooting and hollering that Kimble Hookstraten is part of the conspiracy. Part of it is that I'm not sure the Republicans would designate their own "designated survivor"- they're not the ruling party, so that's already suspicious (although if I'm wrong and the non-ruling party also designates a designated survivor then I'll eat my words).

I think I had read that Congressional leadership does designate someone to be the congressional "Designated Survivor."  I can't imagine there is anything that would stop a party who is in the minority in Congress from designating someone to carry on.  I'm not sure exactly what is meant by "ruling party" though.  I mean, you can have Democrat as President, but a Republican as Speaker or Senator Majority Leader.  Conceivably, if enough people are taken out of the line of succession, a Republican could end up replacing a Democrat as President.     

[Danielg342]

3 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

I'm not sure exactly what is meant by "ruling party" though.

What I mean by "ruling party" is the party whose nominee won the Presidency. I understand there would be Republicans and Democrats along the official lines of succession, but I would imagine that the "designated survivor" would be picked by the President. Since the Republicans don't have the Presidency, they wouldn't pick a "designated survivor", methinks.

[Minneapple]

13 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

 Conceivably, if enough people are taken out of the line of succession, a Republican could end up replacing a Democrat as President.     

I think it would just have to be two people -- if the President and VP died, the Speaker of the House is next in the line of succession, and right now that would be Paul Ryan. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

I suppose I shouldn't have started watching The West Wing (now on Netflix!) while watching this show, because the difference is vast and for all the issues I have with Sorkin, his show was far superior and had a better cast.

Ahem.

Just halfway through, but Tyler can just STFU. He's not 12. He looks like he's an adult, and my eyes rolled so fucking hard as he canonized his father, plus, he should know how things work. Acting as if Kirkman literally stole the Presidency from his dead father. The President and his or her cabinet aren't all Kumbaya; I'm sure there are personality conflicts, so his saying that Kirkman was not "Presidential" pissed me the fuck off. I'd like to see him try and rally the country after such an act of terror. He'd probably be pissing in his pants. And Kimble wasn't his father's VP, so his bullshit about how she better represents the country or whatever, just made me roll my eyes again. 

I guess my personal experience with 911 is coloring my opinion, but I remember how we all came together as a nation then. And the cooperation amongst Congress and the administration. And yeah, yeah, I get this is television, but the writers could have mined such good material from what actually happened and it would still be dramatic. So far, tonight's episode is a pile of shite. And I really wish this show had gotten someone else to do the interview, because Vargas was not playing herself, but a character; or rather just have her play a fictional reporter. As a journalist, she should know how this shit works. Again, Kirkman didn't steal the Presidency. Carp and Harp about it all you want after there is a new Cabinet, and the country has its leaders and we have a government again, before showing all this divisiveness. Gah.

And I'm liking less and less, that Kirkman's character is being shown as some uneducated, ignorant wide-eyed innocent who doesn't know how politics work and is such a fish out of water.  He has a finger on some things that tell me he's not stupid. 

I know what I'll be doing after I finish watching this.

Edited October 7, 2016 by GHScorpiosRule

[KaveDweller]

20 hours ago, BlackberryJam said:

Oh yeah, if bombing survivor was not actually there when bombing happened, how did he manage to smuggle himself into the cordoned off, being searched rubble and bury himself all nice?

YES, where are all the under secretaries and deputies that would not have been in the capital building? So much of this is a big no.

I was thinking he tried to leave and didn't get all the way out of the building. So he was far enough away from the blast(s) that he survived, but was still inside. Whether that was intentional or not is another question. I would think, if he was in on it, he knew he couldn't totally leave without looking suspicious. 

20 hours ago, Amy Beth said:

If I understood correctly, they said the 2 photos were taken 6 seconds apart. If someone got up in the middle of the President's speech wouldn't everyone else in his row be looking in his direction, trying to figure out where he was going?  The second photo made it appear as if the guy disappeared into thin air. 

The photos were 6 seconds apart and the explosion was another 24 seconds later. The timing doesn't make sense because in the pilot we saw the TV go out, and then Tom flipped channels and found a newscast talking about an explosion. Then he got up and looked out the window. That was all in less than 30 seconds. There wasn't time to be a gap that long.

2 hours ago, kili said:

That's not to say that this show won't go that way. They play fast and loose with reality, so live insertion into a crowd with multiple cameramen capturing the proceedings is just something they might try to say happened.  They do have a senator semi-standing taking pictures during the event like somebody at free shopping mall concert. Seriously, has anybody ever seen anybody do that during a State of the Union address? Won't that kind of activity get you chucked out of most government houses. Sit down and listen! Who is she taking pictures of anyway? Doesn't she work with these people everyday?

Maybe she said she was talking pictures for her Twitter feed.

Edited October 7, 2016 by KaveDweller

[Gladrags]

27 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I guess my personal experience with 911 is coloring my opinion, but I remember how we all came together as a nation then.

The country has become so much more polarized in those 15 short years, sad to say. 

[txhorns79]

Quote

Just halfway through, but Tyler can just STFU. He's not 12. He looks like he's an adult, and my eyes rolled so fucking hard as he canonized his father, plus, he should know how things work. Acting as if Kirkman literally stole the Presidency from his dead father.

I was a little confused by all this.  Didn't the First Lady die as well?  Where was her funeral?  It was just strange to me because I don't think Kirkman offered any condolences to Tyler regarding her (even if she was a step-parent, she would have at least been something to him), and I'm not sure her death was even mentioned. 

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

...I guess my personal experience with 911 is coloring my opinion, but I remember how we all came together as a nation then. And the cooperation amongst Congress and the administration. And yeah, yeah, I get this is television, but the writers could have mined such good material from what actually happened and it would still be dramatic....

This has bothered me about every other simularly plotted show since 9/11. As a middle-aged adult at the time, I also remember less road rage and people being patient while waiting in lines, but I have never seen that portrayed in any post-apocalypse or major terrorist strike plot since then. Instead the public is generally shown to be short-tempered and suspicious. I just wish here they would balance the attacks on Muslims with a multi-faith prayer vigil and/or a concert to raise funds for the victims families. That's how I recall things until troops were sent and the war started. The angry military guy on the show would look even more evil if they showed the change in public mood from Kumbaya to vengeful patriots and anti-war protestors after he gets his first strike accomplished.

[BW Manilowe]

20 hours ago, Bobbin said:

The 6 seconds between the photos of Sen. MacLeish were within the 34 seconds between cutting the national broadcast feed and the explosion. He may have been trying to get clear and didn't entirely make it. Or since this is likely internal terrorism, he may have pushed the button. Or planted the dummy bomb.

This is TV, not a blockbuster theatrical movie. They probably don't have the budget or resources to depict nationwide shock and panic. Still, they could do a better job of implying widespread chaos.

If the President had formally fired Tom, he wouldn't have been the DS. Rumors that he was going to fire him are irrelevant. But seriously, folks, declaring that the President obviously wanted him gone? Tom is more savvy than that. TMI, Tom.

Aaron said early on that Emily couldn't be CoS because she didn't have the security clearance. So how does she now have "full access"? Btw, Chief Advisor might have the same access as Chief of Staff, but it doesn't have any authority. That's why Emily wasn't thrilled at the move up.

I can only imagine that the reason the city isn't in lockdown is because of Kirkman's determination to present an image of normalcy. So astute and insightful in some ways, so naive in others.

The President was at his son's recital, incognito. Just like ghost Grandma in "Sixth Sense." Now, let's see some humility from Leo.

Emily wasn't named Chief Advisor to the President. She's either a Senior Advisor or Special Advisor to the President (I forget which). They're real, significant, titles in the White House staff (although most of the President's staff has 1 of those titles in addition to whatever position they were actually appointed to).

I'm just happy they finally have people/staff members in conversations/meetings with Kirkman saying "Thank you, Mr. President." at the end of their conversations/meetings, as is dictated by protocol.

[Haleth]

Would someone attending the SotU as a guest be allowed to have a phone?  I've been on the Capitol tour and we weren't allowed to take anything into the chamber.  And that was with no one present, certainly not the Pres.

I was so annoyed that Kirkman said yes, he was fired.  Despite what he had been told, he had no way of knowing how the meeting with the Pres would go.  He should have told the reporter that the Pres had scheduled a meeting.  Period.  Anything else is hearsay.

Virginia Madsen goes from being an interesting character to a cliche in record time.  Oh, writers!  Ditto all the comments about the silliness of the funeral, piano recital, drug dealer son, leaked video, hacking, etc.  Please surprise us, writers, and have the survivor not be a terrorist.

16 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

The two outcomes are not mutually exclusive. Ashley Zukerman's charcter could be both a red herring and there could be a government conspiracy, which might be an interesting plot if handled deftly by the writers.

I suspect "deftly" is not in the vocabulary of this bunch of writers.

[Raja]

21 hours ago, retired watcher said:

19 minutes ago, Haleth said:

 

I was so annoyed that Kirkman said yes, he was fired.  Despite what he had been told, he had no way of knowing how the meeting with the Pres would go.  He should have told the reporter that the Pres had scheduled a meeting.  Period.  Anything else is hearsay.

 

 

I think President Kirkman is a fantasy figure right now. We won't be presented with him telling a lie, even by omission. But then every episode will show him with the steel of Jack Bauer

[3girlsforus]

Setting aside the absurdity of the first family coming and going at will from the White House just days after the attack, what kind of mom finds out her kid is dealing drugs and then lets him go to a sleepover the same night???? 

[Evagirl]

On 10/5/2016 at 10:10 PM, shapeshifter said:

It was a bit painful for me too, @BlackberryJam, but for different reasons. It seems like it's just going to be Keefer Southerland lurching from one crisis to another — kind of one-note plotting, and not a good way to escape from the daily cares of this life, which I expect on some level for a show. Somehow Madam Secretary does this better, IMO.

I agree with both of you.  I told myself I would give this show a couple of more episodes and if the writers didn't give Kirkland a backbone I was done.  I don't like this weak, hapless, character when the nation obviously needs somebody to lead who has a spine.  If the Kirkland character really is going to be portrayed like this, he needs to resign.  It's obvious he's in way over his head.

I couldn't watch the whole thing.  I mean it's hard to understand what he's saying sometimes because he's mumbling like he's not sure he's saying the right thing.

[DoubleUTeeEff]

1 hour ago, 3girlsforus said:

Setting aside the absurdity of the first family coming and going at will from the White House just days after the attack, what kind of mom finds out her kid is dealing drugs and then lets him go to a sleepover the same night???? 

I thought the mom was just covering for him.  As in, he ran off and didn't tell anybody where he was going so his mom thought he would be a no-show but lied to cover for him.  Which leads me to what annoyed me about this episode.  I know her husband is prez and kind of busy right now, but she doesn't tell him ASAP that their son is dealing drugs?  What the hell?  This isn't Three's Company, there shouldn't be a story based on the mom not telling her husband what their son is up to.  A normal conversation between parents makes far more sense.

[orza]

2 hours ago, Evagirl said:

I don't like this weak, hapless, character when the nation obviously needs somebody to lead who has a spine.  If the Kirkland character really is going to be portrayed like this, he needs to resign.  It's obvious he's in way over his head.

As I understand the show, it is the story how a mind-mannered academic grows into the role of POTUS. It's not believable that Kirkman would change on his own within the space of 3 days to become that leader. It's a process. That was the point of Aaron's speech about wanting help Kirkman thrive. He is the one who will help Kirkman become the president he needs to be. Kirkman even said that is why he chose Aaron as his chief of staff.

1 hour ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

I thought the mom was just covering for him.  As in, he ran off and didn't tell anybody where he was going so his mom thought he would be a no-show but lied to cover for him.  Which leads me to what annoyed me about this episode.  I know her husband is prez and kind of busy right now, but she doesn't tell him ASAP that their son is dealing drugs?  What the hell?  This isn't Three's Company, there shouldn't be a story based on the mom not telling her husband what their son is up to.  A normal conversation between parents makes far more sense.

POTUS is not the kind of job where one can put the family first. It just isn't. His wife cannot call him at work in the middle of the day to talk about issues with the kids. Unless their child in the hospital with a life-threatening medical condition it has to wait until he comes home. In the grand scheme of things it is not that urgent or important. The Secret Service has no doubt vetted Leo and all his friends, knows about the drug dealing and will be keeping a lid on it. I suppose it's also mentioned in that file Aaron got, so he knows, too, and it's part of his job to handle it. There is nothing that Tom needs to know or do immediately that is so important that it would supersede the present crisis.

[Raja]

3 minutes ago, orza said:

 

POTUS is not the kind of job where one can put the family first. It just isn't. His wife cannot call him at work in the middle of the day to talk about issues with the kids. Unless their child in the hospital with a life-threatening medical condition it has to wait until he comes home. In the grand scheme of things it is not that urgent or important. The Secret Service has no doubt vetted Leo and all his friends, knows about the drug dealing and will be keeping a lid on it. I suppose it's also mentioned in that file Aaron got, so he knows, too, and it's part of his job to handle it. There is nothing that Tom needs to know or do immediately that is so important that it would supersede the present crisis.

Of course we have to suspend the belief that the kid's customers would not have sold the story to the press  already. I will head canon that things are still moving too fast for them to run the story .

[DoubleUTeeEff]

37 minutes ago, orza said:

POTUS is not the kind of job where one can put the family first. It just isn't. His wife cannot call him at work in the middle of the day to talk about issues with the kids. Unless their child in the hospital with a life-threatening medical condition it has to wait until he comes home. In the grand scheme of things it is not that urgent or important.

I totally get that she can't can't call him in the middle of the day, but they were at family dinner together at the end of the day and she covered for her son and let the whole thing go at that time.  She's being a terrible parent, wife and First Lady.  Parent because she's not following through with consequences to his actions. Terrible wife because she is holding something huge back from her husband.  Terrible First Lady because POTUS should know that there is a potential scandal in case a reporter hits him with a question on the subject.  Drug dealing is a pretty big deal.  I don't think it's something you can ignore even if you have an important job and especially if you have a job in the public eye.  Objectively it's not that important but in the current context, a 24 hour media cycle,  a public that loves salacious details about it's public figures and new untested president whose validity is being questioned, I think it's important for him to know. It's definitely something that could easily be leaked or uncovered.  Plus, even if he doesn't need to know as POTUS, I'm sure he would want to know as a father.

[orza]

1 hour ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

I totally get that she can't can't call him in the middle of the day, but they were at family dinner together at the end of the day and she covered for her son and let the whole thing go at that time.  She's being a terrible parent, wife and First Lady.  Parent because she's not following through with consequences to his actions. Terrible wife because she is holding something huge back from her husband.  Terrible First Lady because POTUS should know that there is a potential scandal in case a reporter hits him with a question on the subject.  Drug dealing is a pretty big deal.  I don't think it's something you can ignore even if you have an important job and especially if you have a job in the public eye.  Objectively it's not that important but in the current context, a 24 hour media cycle,  a public that loves salacious details about it's public figures and new untested president whose validity is being questioned, I think it's important for him to know. It's definitely something that could easily be leaked or uncovered.  Plus, even if he doesn't need to know as POTUS, I'm sure he would want to know as a father.

Yes, it's important for him to know but it doesn't have to be discussed the moment he walks in the door, and especially not with the kids present. It's fine to wait until after dinner when they are alone and say something like "We need to talk about the thing that was bothering me before the funeral. I said Leo was at a friend's house earlier for Penny's benefit. She doesn't need to know everything. Here's what's really going on..." And then from everything we've seen of Tom so far they would have a reasonable discussion. They need to discuss and decide among themselves how they are going to handle things and be on the same page when they inform Leo what the consequences are.

If the media stopped talking about Kirkman's supposed firing upon leakage of the terrorist video, they sure are not going to spend a lot of air time on First Son sells some pills to his friends when the country is on the brink of war. As I recall, the shenanigans of the Bush twins blew over quickly and didn't hurt Dubya's reelection. Billy Carter was treated as a joke in the press. Patti Davis also got some bad press and it didn't hurt Ronald Reagan.

[SanDiegoInExile]

On 10/6/2016 at 2:26 PM, mikem said:

Speaking of the writers, anyone else feel that "Kimble Hookstraten" is a weird name?  It's a very showy name, and out of place

I don't see anything official on the ABC website.  I had thought "Kimball Hook-Straten" seemed OK.   I have heard of Kimberly, Kimberlie, even Kimba, but never a Kimble.  The last name makes more sense with hyphenation.

I doubted this show would last longer than Geena Davis' "Commander in Chief", but it seems it will at least get a Season Two. 

[shapeshifter]

I wonder if the writers in Hollywood (in a state where cannibus is legal) don't think drug dealing is such a big deal as those of us who live in states where prisons are full of drug dealers and the mentally ill, which are not mutually exclusive categories. They made it sound like First Kid is done with it and that's all, folks.

[rab01]

1) I'm not sure I fully understand the issue with attacking the group that took credit for the bombing.  Even if they didn't do it, they took credit for it. Given the state the country is in during this fictional crisis, publicly announcing that you want to be known for having destroyed the U.S. Capitol is good enough reason to obliterate them (while continuing to look for the real bombers). ... I'm not bloodthirsty but I do think inaction might taken as a sign of weakness unless we had evidence enough to laugh off their claims.

2) The president backing down on delivering the eulogy is very much of a pattern with his reaction to being fired - he accepts other people's denigration of him and doesn't challenge it. He acts to protect others but hasn't displayed a whole lot of ego about himself.  I think it's to an unhealthy degree for a commander in chief and that we'll probably see him suffering fools less gladly over time.

3) I really, really don't think that 30 seconds is enough time to get out of the Capitol Building during the State of the Union so I'm guessing that Congressman Suspect Number 1 went to the safest room he could reach in that time span. (I really don't know who he could have even made it to a basement in that time but I've never been inside the building.)  

4) Whether the characters are being smart or not, I do think what we've seen so far of the First Family dynamics have been consistent to the characters so the inclusion doesn't bug me too much.  Though I will spend most of that time yelling at the TV "shut up kid."

[Raja]

2 minutes ago, rab01 said:

1) I'm not sure I fully understand the issue with attacking the group that took credit for the bombing.  Even if they didn't do it, they took credit for it. Given the state the country is in during this fictional crisis, publicly announcing that you want to be known for having destroyed the U.S. Capitol is good enough reason to obliterate them (while continuing to look for the real bombers). ... I'm not bloodthirsty but I do think inaction might taken as a sign of weakness unless we had evidence enough to laugh off their claims.

 

I can only figure that in this United States the government has stopped sending a drone strike after every al Qaeda, ISIS/ISIL/Daesh number two who we think we have a bead on

[Quilt Fairy]

Quote

Speaking of the writers, anyone else feel that "Kimble Hookstraten" is a weird name?  It's a very showy name, and out of place

I just assumed it was Dutch.

[Texasmom1970]

Love Keifer, love Maggie. I think the issue I am having with the show is I want them to focus more on the bombing and see more about the who, what and why. I also think it would be better if they get Maggie and Keifer in some scenes together. I know it is about him suddenly being thrust in the spot as President but I am already tired of the political side of the show. To me it could be better if they mix it together more. 

[secnarf]

On 2016-10-06 at 5:26 PM, mikem said:

Speaking of the writers, anyone else feel that "Kimble Hookstraten" is a weird name?  It's a very showy name, and out of place among "Thomas Kirkman," "Peter MacLeish," and the other pretty-ordinary-sounding names on the show.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoogstraten

Apparently means "high road".

There's also this guy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_van_Hoogstraten

[Craigles]

One thing that is driving me nuts is this is supposed to be January and yet all outside shots of DC show green leaves on trees

[dr pepper]

i'm pretty sure that if i were in that position, by the second day i'd be talking to all the governors, not just the rebellious ones, and ask them to appoint interim senators to be made available at the nearest air force base for expedited delivery, probably to a conference room at the pentagon.

[shapeshifter]

On October 6, 2016 at 4:26 PM, mikem said:

...Speaking of the writers, anyone else feel that "Kimble Hookstraten" is a weird name?  It's a very showy name, and out of place among "Thomas Kirkman," "Peter MacLeish," and the other pretty-ordinary-sounding names on the show.

Aaron's last name is "Shore."  Did we know that before?  I noticed that the show has a lot of people of color in the main cast, and they all have very Anglo names like Seth Wright and Aaron Shore.  (Adan Canto, who plays Aaron, was born in Mexico.)  Not saying it's good or bad that they have Anglo names, just noting it.

 

9 hours ago, secnarf said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoogstraten

Apparently means "high road".

There's also this guy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_van_Hoogstraten

I just Googled
   baby names girls kimble
and found it's a Welsh boy's name meaning Warrior Chief.

Both names are interesting choices for the character — assuming the writers didn't just fan open a baby name book and stick a finger on a random page with their eyes closed — which might also explain all the ethnically white surnames.

Edited October 8, 2016 by shapeshifter

[Ghost Ship]

3 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

 

I just Googled
   baby names girls kimble
and found it's a Welsh boy's name meaning Warrior Chief 

Just for the record, that is not a welsh name - there is no letter 'K' in the welsh alphabet and in 50 years of being welsh I've never come across it.

Edited October 8, 2016 by Ghost Ship
bad typing

[paigow]

17 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

I just assumed it was Dutch.

If Kiefer gets kicked out..will she have to show her birth certificate before taking over????

[shapeshifter]

24 minutes ago, Ghost Ship said:

Just for the record, that is not a welsh name - there is no letter 'K' in the welsh alphabet and in 50 years of being welsh I've never come across it.

I guess I should have checked with my Welsh BIL first. Ironically, the website where I read it is sheknows.com — I guess she doesn't know.

Another website claims it's of African American origin and means Regal Hill, which, true or not, would fit with the theme of "on the hill."

[orza]

Kimble is a pretty common surname. It's been trendy for quite a while to give girls surnames as first names, although that wasn't really a thing 50 odd years ago when the congresswoman was born. The main character on Conviction is named Hayes. So, yeah, Hollywood writers trying to be trendy.