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Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

maraleia

By maraleia
in Counting On

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hoosier80
hoosier80

New show title: 10 to 20 Years and Counting 

MargeGunderson
MargeGunderson

Someone on Reddit just described Josh’s face as a glistening glazed ham. I am considering divorcing my husband and marrying that poster. 

doodlebug
doodlebug

Well, for many of us, it's the difference between 'imperfect' and 'non-PC' and being a criminal.  Josh is a child molester and his parents actively intervened in his situation to avoid him being punis

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Aja

Aja

(edited)

He knew it was wrong, that's why he was sneaking it. He just didn't care.

Exactly. Also, JMO, while it was disturbing enough on its own how many people didn't think molesting children was any big deal because he was 'only' 14, that is only one aspect of Joshgate I that blows my mind. The interviews, the People articles, the blatant lies, the appalling excuses, the absolute INSISTENCE that what Josh did is totally benign because they were asleep. I think that's worse than a d-bag husband trying to hook up on Ashley Madison. I get all sins are the same in God's eyes, but not in mine.

Edited by Aja
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TaxNerd

TaxNerd

(edited)

Exactly. Also, JMO, while it was disturbing enough on its own how many people didn't think molesting children was any big deal because he was 'only' 14, that is only one aspect of Joshgate I that blows my mind. The interviews, the People articles, the blatant lies, the appalling excuses, the absolute INSISTENCE that what Josh did is totally benign because they were asleep. I don't think that's worse than a d-bag husband trying to hook up on Ashley Madison. I get all sins are the same in God's eyes, but not in mine.

100% agree. I know several people who loosely follow the family and they fixated on the reports of a minor being "illegally" released for their outrage.

Maybe the AM release is more back and white wrong? Ironic considering the release was the result of an actual illegal hack.

Edited by TaxNerd
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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

(edited)

Who is saying Joshgate 1 is a lesser evil than Joshgate 2? I would think the opposite opinion would be true for most, considering cheating on a spouse is so common.

 

Joshgate 1 is worse on it's own, then throw in the fact that survivors were outed and invalidated, the awfulness of 1 & 2 aren't even in the same hemisphere.

 

Edited cuz through & throw are two different words.

Edited by GeeGolly
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kokapetl

kokapetl

Who is saying Joshgate 1 is a lesser evil than Joshgate 2? I would think the opposite opinion would be true for most, considering cheating on a spouse is so common.

Joshgate 1 is worse on it's own, then through in the fact that survivors were outed and invalidated, the awfulness of 1 & 2 aren't even in the same hemisphere.

Joshgate 2 implies Josh's 7+ year marriage is a sham on his part, and he is totally culpable/responsible for the suffering of his family. Joshgate 1 is more harmful to his family, his behavior was also clearly also criminal, but his culpability was markedly less due to his age.
truthtalk2014

truthtalk2014

I realize that some people may think that Anna is working on her appearance more to win Josh back - but the other possibility is that she is working on herself for a change.  When my scumbag cheated on me, I went through the depression but then I was pissed.  I realized that I had concentrated so much time on him, the kids (nothing wrong with devoting time to kids) and the house that I had not really concentrated on me.

 

I started working out more, more makeup, better clothes and simply felt better about me.  I'm hoping above hope that Anna is feeling empowered.  She really does hold all the cards IMO.  Plus, the poor girl has been out from under the daily pregnancy test crap for a while now.  I hope they never release him from RU. 

 

I'm really happy to see her hanging out with Amy.  Amy is pretty much the only one in that family that is going to give her some honest advice about her scumbag husband. 

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zenme

zenme

Oh, how I wish I felt Anna's working on her looks was totally for herself, but I think she's doing it to be attractive to Josh, but the results have her feeling better about herself. My friend was married to a sex addict. Initially, she tried to give in to his every whim. She wanted her family intact. The guy never changed. Good luck, Anna.

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zenme

zenme

It never occurred to me that Anna's weight loss was deliberate. I assumed it was due to the stress and devastation she's been dealing with. Couple loss of appetite with breastfeeding and you're going to see the pounds fall

 

Definitely.  I think it's a combination of not wanting to eat because she's sick with stress and wanting to appear "hot" to Josh. 

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MrHufflepuff

MrHufflepuff

Regarding the various Joshgates, I think there are several issues here that are distinct:

 

1.  Is non-consensual sexual activity (such as molestation) worse than consensual activity?  I think clearly it is.  In Joshgate 1, we have non-consensual activity with his sisters, and in Joshgate 2, I'm assuming that Josh wasn't upfront with Anna about his escapades, and if that's the case, any sex he had with Anna after he started cheating, would, in my view, be non-consensual.  But, I would classify the molestation as "worse" than the sex with Anna, since in Joshgate 1, there was no consent, but in Joshgate 2, Anna "consented" with bad information.  I guess, the distinction in my mind is the use of coercion vs. the use of lying.  Both are wrong, but if I have to rank "wrongness," I'd put the molestation as worse.

 

But, Josh's sex with the porn stars in Joshgate 2, is to my mind, completely consensual, and there's nothing wrong with consensual sex.  And I think (based on stuff I've read), that there are a lot of people who don't see it this way.  There are people who think that the consensual sex with strippers is "worse" than the non-consensual molestation or the sex under false pretenses with Anna.  And that to my mind is wrong.

 

2.  Should juvenile offenders be treated differently than adults?  In my mind, yes, but I'm not the one pushing draconian sentencing laws on juvenile offenders.  And some of the people I have personally seen defending Josh for Joshgate 1 are the same people who I see routinely push for harsh sentencing laws on juveniles.  But, the issue of how to treat juvenile offenders is a distinct issue from consent/non-consent sexual issues.  And I do quite often see people defending Josh on Joshgate 1 by pointing out his age, which, just no.  His age is not a defense of what he did, nor does it lessen the wrong he committed.  What his age does mean, in my view, is that after we've acknowledged what he did was wrong, we can discuss how we would treat him because of his age.  But that discussion has to come after the acknowledgement that what he did was very, very wrong.  

 

3.  How should adults behave with juvenile offenders?  As I said, I'm okay with treating juvenile offenders differently than adults.  But that's a two-way street.  These offenders have committed a wrong and we still as a society have to protect ourselves from them.  And that means handling juveniles with proper treatment and counseling or whatever the best we can make available to them so that they won't re-offend.  And I'm aware that this doesn't often happen in the US.  But when the adults (such as JimBob and Michelle) have the resources to deal with this appropriately, and they choose not to, then I'm going to criticize them.  Because the fact that Josh was a juvenile in Joshgate 1 doesn't let them off the hook for their culpability here.

 

YMMV and all that, but this is my view.

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MyPeopleAreNordic

MyPeopleAreNordic

(edited)

Speaking as someone who suffered from anorexia as a teen/young adult and still has issues with disordered eating to this day, I wonder if part of Anna's weight loss has to do with how everything in her life is so out of her control. Josh had an affair - for whatever reasons (she didn't do enough of what he wanted/he's a jerk/whatever she feels). She couldn't control it and stop it from happening or coming out. She (seemingly) lives with Duggars or very close by them. The Duggars basically control everything in Josh's absence. The money, the decisions, her kids, etc. In their culture Anna controls nothing aside from home schooling...and does she really control that? Can she decide to change to secular or Catholic homeschool curricula? Or decide to send the kids to public school? Nope.

Maybe controlling what she eats or doesn't eat is a way to exercise some form of control in her life because it's one thing she CAN control. I know at times when I felt my life was out of my control my disorder was "louder." As a teen with very strict and overprotective parents, controlling my calories, what I ate/didn't eat and how much/often was one of the only ways I could feel some control and autonomy. I'm not saying Anna has an eating disorder or anything, but maybe she is using her diet to control at least some small part of her life.

Edited by MyPeopleAreNordic
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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

Speaking as someone who suffered from anorexia as a teen/young adult and still has issues with disordered eating to this day, I wonder if part of Anna's weight loss has to do with how everything in her life is so out of her control. Josh had an affair - for whatever reasons (she didn't do enough of what he wanted/he's a jerk/whatever she feels). She couldn't control it and stop it from happening or coming out. She (seemingly) lives with Duggars or very close by them. The Duggars basically control everything in Josh's absence. The money, the decisions, her kids, etc. In their culture Anna controls nothing aside from home schooling...and does she really control that? Can she decide to change to secular or Catholic homeschool curricula? Or decide to send the kids to public school? Nope.

Maybe controlling what she eats or doesn't eat is a way to exercise some form of control in her life because it's one thing she CAN control. I know at times when I felt my life was out of my control my disorder was "louder." As a teen with very strict and overprotective parents, controlling my calories, what I ate/didn't eat and how much/often was one of the only ways I could feel some control and autonomy. I'm not saying Anna has an eating disorder or anything, but maybe she is using her diet to control at least some small part of her life.

Sorry about your struggle with this, glad it has improved.

 

I was wondering the same thing.

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Marigold

Marigold

I guess I'm the minority. I think Anna looks nice.

She has lost a lot of weight. Joshie was clearly the muncher (haha) and must've encouraged Anna to eat junk foods with him. Anna was thin before she married Josh. Maybe being free from that fast foodie Josh has given Anna the freedom to eat healthier meals and focus a little more on herself.

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truthtalk2014

truthtalk2014

(edited)

I guess I'm the minority. I think Anna looks nice.

She has lost a lot of weight. Joshie was clearly the muncher (haha) and must've encouraged Anna to eat junk foods with him. Anna was thin before she married Josh. Maybe being free from that fast foodie Josh has given Anna the freedom to eat healthier meals and focus a little more on herself.

Yea, as in "Hey Anna, have a bite of this iced donut burger and then watch me swing my not so in shape arse from the trapeze. After this, I will go home and pay hookers to have sex with me."  

Yea, I would say she is over that load of tilapia chickenetti donut burger dinner stuff.  She probably bought a few carts of microwave foods from Whole Foods on his credit card and told him to go trapeze himself.  

 

ETA:  Yes, I think she looks nice.

Edited by truthtalk2014
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Marigold

Marigold

She does look really different.

I think it's the weight loss, better make up, better hair and seems her teeth are fixed.

I'm sure there is a little of "aren't you sorry now, joshie" and a little of "I need to pay attention to myself. I can be pretty and nice looking if I put a little effort into it". And no fat Josh bring crap food into the house.

Maybe the Duggar girls encouraged a make over? Take her mind off things, feel good about herself etc. The Duggar girls really don't know too much about anything but they enjoy clothes, make up and hair stuff. They probably tried to boost her spriits with "girlie" stuff.

I hope it's not an eating disorder.

I hope Anna is starting to take back a few parts of her life, even if she stays with the jerk.

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cmr2014

cmr2014

I wonder if Amy -- and maybe even Jill and Jessa -- are encouraging her to leave Josh. They may buy into all that Gothard stuff, but they are married now and I can't help but wonder how they feel about Anna being called out for not putting out for Josh.

 

I can particularly see Amy and Jessa wanting to send a message to their own men that straying isn't going to be tolerated at all, and that they won't be accepting any blame for a straying spouse.

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NikSac

NikSac

(edited)

Now I can see why Jessa does her "modern modest" thing and is so fixated on her look. The older girls are scarred, y'all !!!! Gah.

 

Modest?!  haha... now that's funny...

 

But I agree that's why she (eta: Jessa) dresses the way she does.

 

I think Anna looks good but I'm worried about her. What she's going through is horrible even when it's not publicized for all the world to see.

Edited by NikSac
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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

 

I think Anna looks good but I'm worried about her. What she's going through is horrible even when it's not publicized for all the world to see.

 

This. .... And especially when people around you are wildly urging you to minimize it all, as I'm sure is what's happening, at least on the part of Jim Boob and Michelle, if not the whole damned family.

 

People who go on national television to proclaim that a molestation wasn't very serious because it occurred while a child was sleeping obviously have absolutely no clue about the ethics and psychology of sexual things. (Sorry, but I still haven't stopped reeling over the Duggar clan's insistence that molesting a sleeping person is only an itty bitty peccadillo when it's the very worst thing in this whole mess. Everything this bunch of arrogant yahoos thinks is upside down and backwards, so I'm quite sure they're doing and saying the very worst things possible to Anna right now.)

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yogi2014L

yogi2014L

I bet Anna's weight loss is due to stress. I really hope for her sake it is not due to a conscious effort to starve herself or a new eating disorder. Anna has had enough pain!!!

 

I guess we will see if she loses more or not. 

When my FIL spent 25 days in the critical care unit ( ie intensive care) almost dead I dropped weight really fast due to the stress and nerves. I looked great. LOL didn't stay off though, once things stopped being so stressful I went back to normal. 

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Marigold

Marigold

Anna's weight loss is probably a mix of many things.

No Joshie bringing all that junk food and fast food in the house. I bet he likes greasy, fat, processed cheap crap foods and Anna cooked what he wanted.

Stress

Aren't you sorry now...I look hot.

Hey, I'm loosing some weight and I look good...maybe I will try out some new make up and fix up my hair.

Speaking of Joshie and his greasy overprocessed boxed foods...wonder if he will emerge from RU having lost his sin and fat too. Do they allow McDonald's runs? Is he trapped there with only a Bible, a red pen, a blue pen and a notebook?

  • Love 7
Cherrio

Cherrio

Anna's weight loss is probably a mix of many things.

No Joshie bringing all that junk food and fast food in the house. I bet he likes greasy, fat, processed cheap crap foods and Anna cooked what he wanted.

Stress

Aren't you sorry now...I look hot.

Hey, I'm loosing some weight and I look good...maybe I will try out some new make up and fix up my hair.

Speaking of Joshie and his greasy overprocessed boxed foods...wonder if he will emerge from RU having lost his sin and fat too. Do they allow McDonald's runs? Is he trapped there with only a Bible, a red pen, a blue pen and a notebook?

If he is buddies with Cisco, they are hanging out at the Golden Corral.    

  • Love 5
truthtalk2014

truthtalk2014

Anna, if you are reading... YOU LOOK GOOD GIRL!  Keep it up.  

 

I hope the only thing Josh has to look forward to each night are images of the speakers at RU and he dreams of being tied to the chair during the Friday night sermon.  

 

Nah, I won't even send myself to the prayer closet for that.  Laughing myself silly.  

  • Love 3
doodlebug

doodlebug

Can she apply for WIC? 

Eligibility for WIC (Women, Infants and Children) is based on income and, if she qualifies, Anna would receive aid whether she is breastfeeding or not.  Nursing mothers get vouchers for nutritious foods for themselves while moms who bottle feed get formula for the baby.  Vouchers would also be given to any children under the age of 4 in the household. It probably depends on whether Josh got a severance package from FRC; which he probably did.  The family's income has to be somewhere between 100-185% of the federal poverty level depending on the state in which they live.  Even families who are not eligible for other assistance (ie, they have health insurance from their jobs) can receive WIC.

 

I think it's a combo of having a lot of the stress of keeping up the façade of the perfect fundie marriage gone (because I do think Anna had at least an inkling that Joshie was misbehaving but couldn't do anything about it before the scandal), as well as breastfeeding and the fact that she is now in charge of the menu in her home instead of being forced to stock the kitchen according to her headship's preferences.  I doubt she has an eating disorder; I am hoping the turmoil of the last few months has allowed Anna to realize that she needs to take care of herself so she can care for her kids because she cannot count on the worthless POS she married.

  • Love 6
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