The Duggalos: Jinger and the Holy Goalie

[Churchhoney]

2 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

With front end contracts, an influencer still has to fulfill their obligation. I'm thinking anything like that would involve more than a one time shill and that's where the Vuolos seem to struggle - their stick-to-itiveness is not very sticky.

Jing seems to have between 20,000 - 60,000 active followers out of the million that follow her. She, or they, could live very comfortably and then some, if they really made a go at influencing. Or course they would have to overcome having their sponsors contacted due to their beliefs.

Yeah, I think that's exactly it.

I know for a fact that some people do score a big upfront payment sometimes just because they have a big number of followers. But that's just one time. If the follwoers don't end up producing for a company, then you don't get that payment again. And they won't produce unless you work at it. And, as you say, JV doesn't shill, and shill effectively. 

And Jingle hasn't been good at working it, either, even when she's tried. She's made a ton of shilling blunders. So they're not getting what the long-term potential of those followers could produce. 

[SnapHappy]

How can they possibly maintain online relationships with vendors and distributors when at the very first sign of a partnership on social media, hoards of "Duggar Gatekeepers", bent on destroying EVERY opportunity they find for themselves, descend on the company sites?  

Every product most of these family members try to partner with, gets the viciously gleeful response from posters here & elsewhere to "Hey, let's ALL go bombard that company with SM messages about how horribly horrible and hateful everything is about these people and how nobody will EVER buy anything from you unless you ditch them!!" 

THAT'S practically a full-time job for some people on the Net.  We see them here. 

I'll criticize them & companies they hook up with, but I just don't have the time or need to do more than make a passing comment.  

Besides, these days, lots of influential people feel if you don't have a side hustle somewhere in Cyberspace, you're just a nobody with no ambition and no skills.    

[scriggle]

I've never watched (and never will) one of their YouTube videos. Do they have ads in them? You have to watch the ads for it to count for monetization. That's why adblockers are your friend.

Edited July 9, 2022 by scriggle
Damn you auto correct

[wilsie]

12 minutes ago, SnapHappy said:

How can they possibly maintain online relationships with vendors and distributors when at the very first sign of a partnership on social media, hoards of "Duggar Gatekeepers", bent on destroying EVERY opportunity they find for themselves, descend on the company sites?  

Every product most of these family members try to partner with, gets the viciously gleeful response from posters here & elsewhere to "Hey, let's ALL go bombard that company with SM messages about how horribly horrible and hateful everything is about these people and how nobody will EVER buy anything from you unless you ditch them!!" 

THAT'S practically a full-time job for some people on the Net.  We see them here. 

I'll criticize them & companies they hook up with, but I just don't have the time or need to do more than make a passing comment.  

Besides, these days, lots of influential people feel if you don't have a side hustle somewhere in Cyberspace, you're just a nobody with no ambition and no skills.    

The people I watch regularly on You Tube do something I'm interested in.  Shop, cook and share really good easy recipes.  Clean in way I don't mind watching.  If they have children they're not shown very much and pets.  One is renovating a home and that's really fun to watch.  They've already renovated their own home.  There's room decoration and one makes birthday cakes for her kids.  With Jinger and Jeremy, they seem to want to come across as young and cool... happening.  She likes to shop and he likes to eat at trendy places.  There's probably not a large market for them and when people know what Jeremy has signed and represents, it makes them less able to keep vendors.  What they show is pretty boring and even though some fans will still support them, they need to find places like Holly Lobby and Chick-fil-A to support them for ads.

[GeeGolly]

Some of the sisters - well now really just Jessa - post regular YT videos. Some of the Duggar posters on here wait for a recap specifically not to give them clicks. Jinger on the other hand rarely offers anything to click on, but her IG. From what I understand about SM, an IG click does nothing to line their pockets.

I still find her $100,000+ answer perplexing. 

[BigBingerBro]

37 minutes ago, scriggle said:

I've never watched (and never will) one of their YouTube videos. Do they have ads in them? You have to watch the ads for it to count for monetization. That's why adblockers are your friend.

I was going to post this exact same comment/question.  All this $$$ comes from ads and advertising so I also wonder what kind of ads are featured on their posts.  

[GeeGolly]

Came back to add, that I do wonder if Jing has any idea what the average American makes and maybe she just pulled that choice from the bunch.

[Ljohnson1987]

Is Jinger pregnant? Why is this thread hot? 

[Salacious Kitty]

1 hour ago, BigBingerBro said:

I was going to post this exact same comment/question.  All this $$$ comes from ads and advertising so I also wonder what kind of ads are featured on their posts.  

As I understand it, the YT creator doesn't have a say in the ads that pop up during their videos. And YT makes it easy enough to skip them. 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Salacious Kitty
Pop not pip!

[Cinnabon]

7 hours ago, CherryBelly said:

In the civil case against the Police releasing the Josh Police report, Jinger and Jeremy said Jinger was earning 100-200k a year on SM and with marketing partnerships. 

But they weren’t sure, lol. Huge discrepancy between $100,000 and $200,000. Jinger seems in the dark about their finances.

[Cinnabon]

4 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

With front end contracts, an influencer still has to fulfill their obligation. I'm thinking anything like that would involve more than a one time shill and that's where the Vuolos seem to struggle - their stick-to-itiveness is not very sticky.

Jing seems to have between 20,000 - 60,000 active followers out of the million that follow her. She, or they, could live very comfortably and then some, if they really made a go at influencing. Or course they would have to overcome having their sponsors contacted due to their beliefs.

But does she bother to interact with those who are currently active followers? She seems more like Anna - she posts and even  asks her followers for responses, then ignores them all. Even active followers won’t stick around forever with absolutely no give and take.

[Cinnabon]

4 hours ago, CherryBelly said:

Could be. But they could be making coin. It's a bit puzzling to me, on forums that are clearly really interested in the Duggars lives and watching their content, why it's assumed they're so boring that no-one cares so they can't be making money? (Not saying you've said that, commenting on other posts).

This forum among others, follow and watch the Duggars SM and contribute to their earnings that way. It might be smaller in terms of the people that are implicitly supporting them on SM but it's still playing a part in their views and success.

I can't say I care much if they're making money or not but wouldn't be surprised if they are. In a way, so long as they're not exploiting others in MLMs, I'm not offended if Jinger or any of the other Duggar kids (Josh excluded)  make money on the back of their 'fame' being brought up in a cult and exploited as children on TV for years.

Edit for spelling.

I can only speak for myself, but I follow them here for the snark only, and I have never watched a single one of their videos, nor have I followed or even checked out their SM posts. There’s plenty posted here to snark on! I don’t want even one of my pennies going to them because I watched an ad on YouTube. I don’t think I’m alone in this.

i feel for them due to their unfortunate upbringing, but the answer is not to support them exploiting their own kids, imo. And none have renounced the hateful beliefs they were raised with, and that’s the bottom line. They’re now adults who want to take rights from others, and want to whitewash this as much as possible so they don’t have to work too hard for a living. 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Cinnabon

[Cinnabon]

4 hours ago, SnapHappy said:

How can they possibly maintain online relationships with vendors and distributors when at the very first sign of a partnership on social media, hoards of "Duggar Gatekeepers", bent on destroying EVERY opportunity they find for themselves, descend on the company sites?  

Every product most of these family members try to partner with, gets the viciously gleeful response from posters here & elsewhere to "Hey, let's ALL go bombard that company with SM messages about how horribly horrible and hateful everything is about these people and how nobody will EVER buy anything from you unless you ditch them!!" 

THAT'S practically a full-time job for some people on the Net.  We see them here. 

I'll criticize them & companies they hook up with, but I just don't have the time or need to do more than make a passing comment.  

Besides, these days, lots of influential people feel if you don't have a side hustle somewhere in Cyberspace, you're just a nobody with no ambition and no skills.    

What “influential” people are you aware of that feel this way? Most people I know work hard at 40-80 hour a week jobs, and many have kids to raise as well.   
 
And yes, as long as they hold on to their hateful beliefs and want to take rights from women, LGBT, POC and other marginalized populations, people will absolutely complain to their sponsors. And I applaud that, because hate and bigotry must be called out at every turn, IMHO. 
 

4 hours ago, wilsie said:

The people I watch regularly on You Tube do something I'm interested in.  Shop, cook and share really good easy recipes.  Clean in way I don't mind watching.  If they have children they're not shown very much and pets.  One is renovating a home and that's really fun to watch.  They've already renovated their own home.  There's room decoration and one makes birthday cakes for her kids.  With Jinger and Jeremy, they seem to want to come across as young and cool... happening.  She likes to shop and he likes to eat at trendy places.  There's probably not a large market for them and when people know what Jeremy has signed and represents, it makes them less able to keep vendors.  What they show is pretty boring and even though some fans will still support them, they need to find places like Holly Lobby and Chick-fil-A to support them for ads.

I don’t think even Hobby Lobby or CFA would partner with a Duggar or Duggar-adjacent these days.

[Cinnabon]

3 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Came back to add, that I do wonder if Jing has any idea what the average American makes and maybe she just pulled that choice from the bunch.

I agree. Apparently she just hands her tax information right over to her headship when it arrives, and doesn’t even look at it. Sad.

1 hour ago, Salacious Kitty said:

As I understand it, the YT creator doesn't have a say in the ads that pop up during their videos. And YT makes it easy enough to skip them. 

If they’re skipped, does YouTube still pay them?

[Salacious Kitty]

5 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

I agree. Apparently she just hands her tax information right over to her headship when it arrives, and doesn’t even look at it. Sad.

If they’re skipped, does YouTube still pay them?

I don't know if it counts for an ad view to watch for the five seconds they force it on you before you can skip it. That might count as a view?

Edited July 9, 2022 by Salacious Kitty

[ginger90]

There are many ways to set ads. The user can eliminate types they don’t want to be associated with when they monetize their channel, for example. Besides actual ads, you can do a partnership and do your own ads within the video. Jessa has done this. You can also do product placement the same way.

I found their video boring. 

[wilsie]

1 hour ago, Cinnabon said:

And yes, as long as they hold on to their hateful beliefs and want to take rights from women, LGBT, POC and other marginalized populations, people will absolutely complain to their sponsors. And I applaud that, because hate and bigotry must be called out at every turn, IMHO. 

Exactly.  

[Zella]

Ad blockers are a snarker's friend. 

[Absolom]

5 minutes ago, Zella said:

Ad blockers are a snarker's friend.

I won't go on the internet without them.

[Zella]

10 minutes ago, Absolom said:

I won't go on the internet without them.

Same I've not seen an ad in years on YouTube. 

[galaxygirl76]

10 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I totally agree, but I think one has to put in the work. I'm sure Josie and Carlin Bates make a shit ton of money influencing and in Carlin's case, also YTing. Jinger's IG over the past years and the year in question in particular, was very lean in shilling anything. 

Yeah they are a lot of work, the Disney vloggers I follow post new content every day, same with the LEGO vlogger I follow. One of the disney guys' wife edits all his stuff and she put a good amount of work in their channel as well. 

[madpsych78]

The $100K that Jinger supposedly made is perplexing, but Jeremy also indicated in his testimony that he didn't make very much in terms of income. Not that I'm surprised by that, but it still astounds me that Jinger supposedly makes a lot. Supposedly.

[awaken]

7 hours ago, Cinnabon said:

I agree. Apparently she just hands her tax information right over to her headship when it arrives, and doesn’t even look at it. Sad.

If they’re skipped, does YouTube still pay them?

4 hours ago, Zella said:

Ad blockers are a snarker's friend. 

@Cinnabon and @Zellai love everything you post!  👏🏼

[canaanite2]

15 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

The $100K that Jinger supposedly made is perplexing, but Jeremy also indicated in his testimony that he didn't make very much in terms of income. Not that I'm surprised by that, but it still astounds me that Jinger supposedly makes a lot. Supposedly.

Jeremy wasn't very forthcoming, and I think I know why. He and Jinger likely get A LOT of gifts via his church as part of their effort to be the cool L.A. church - room and board, take-out from the hip L.A. restaurants, sports and entertainment outings, shoes, donuts, clothing, more shoes and more donuts. Their lexus might be on loan from the church too. He doesn't have much of an income. The L.A. lifestyle he and Jinger lives is thanks to "donations" from the church that is swimming in tax-free profits. 

Edited July 10, 2022 by canaanite2

[Cinnabon]

1 hour ago, CherryBelly said:

What hateful beliefs or opinions has Jinger spoken about having? Serious question. 

If I had lost jobs because my employers thought that I was homophobic, transphobic, pro forced birth, etc, I would run to the nearest mountaintop to deny those allegations. I hate being photographed, but I’d hold a press conference to clear my name. When Jinger was fired from several jobs because of such allegations, she didn’t protest, she didn’t refute them, she didn’t say anything at all. She just ran away with her tail between her legs, imo. On matters that are paramount, silence is complicity. As Sartre said: “Every word has
consequences. Every
silence, too.”

[Nysha]

1 hour ago, CherryBelly said:

What hateful beliefs or opinions has Jinger spoken about having? Serious question. 

I don't know if Jinger herself has posted hateful beliefs or opinions, but she belongs to a church that regularly shoots them from the rooftop and her husband frequently spouts them. As long as she doesn't refute them or explain her own beliefs, it's reasonable for people to think she has the same beliefs. 

[Salacious Kitty]

7 minutes ago, Nysha said:

I don't know if Jinger herself has posted hateful beliefs or opinions, but she belongs to a church that regularly shoots them from the rooftop and her husband frequently spouts them. As long as she doesn't refute them or explain her own beliefs, it's reasonable for people to think she has the same beliefs. 

As Jinger once said, "Jeremy loves books, so I love books." I think we can extrapolate a lot from that statement. 

And let's not forget that Jeremy was a primary signatory on that awful anti civil rights, anti woman, racist petition.

[Cinnabon]

A person who doesn’t have the courage to own their convictions is contemptible in my eyes. At least Derick came out and owned his transphobia. Still disgusting, but honest. 

[ginger90]

An excerpt from their book was  about Jinger changing  her views after marrying Jeremy.

What view was that? The definition of modest clothing for females. She said she studied the Bible and couldn’t find  anything that stated women shouldn’t wear pants. 🤦‍♀️ 

[Salacious Kitty]

Here is some information about the petition Jeremy signed, again as a PRIMARY signatory along with his hero Johnny Mac. 

1 minute ago, ginger90 said:

An excerpt from their book was  about Jinger changing  her views after marrying Jeremy.

What view was that? The definition of modest clothing for females. She said she studied the Bible and couldn’t find  anything that stated women shouldn’t wear pants. 🤦‍♀️ 

And Jeremy's fine with that, otherwise she would still be in skirts. 

[Cinnabon]

4 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

An excerpt from their book was  about Jinger changing  her views after marrying Jeremy.

What view was that? The definition of modest clothing for females. She said she studied the Bible and couldn’t find  anything that stated women shouldn’t wear pants. 🤦‍♀️ 

She’s just like the Bates - wants to keep her hateful beliefs hidden, hoping people will focus on the cute kids, pretty hair, fashionable clothing, and other attempts to be “relatable “ to the heathens, so they can keep on grifting off of their fame, such that it is. Utterly cowardly, and IMO they are all wolves in “fashionable” sheep’s clothing behind closed doors. 

Edited July 10, 2022 by Cinnabon

[GeeGolly]

I guess Jing and Jill are cut from the same cloth, but we knew that already. Jill's only comment when Derick was having his hate filled tirade was just because we don't agree with the sin doesn't mean we hate the person. But Jeremy's and Derick's beliefs are pretty much the same as the Duggars, so one can assume they've been pretty much on the same pages since they met.

[Cinnabon]

22 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I guess Jing and Jill are cut from the same cloth, but we knew that already. Jill's only comment when Derick was having his hate filled tirade was just because we don't agree with the sin doesn't mean we hate the person. But Jeremy's and Derick's beliefs are pretty much the same as the Duggars, so one can assume they've been pretty much on the same pages since they met.

Absolutely. I just have a smidgen more respect for those who can come out and own their beliefs and convictions, even if I find them despicable. 

[Cinnabon]

35 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

An excerpt from their book was  about Jinger changing  her views after marrying Jeremy.

What view was that? The definition of modest clothing for females. She said she studied the Bible and couldn’t find  anything that stated women shouldn’t wear pants. 🤦‍♀️ 

She was raised reading the Bible ad nauseum from birth and she didn’t realize this until after she got married? Guess what, Jinger, the Bible doesn’t say men can’t wear skirts (or tunics, lol) either. Our founding fathers also wore froufy wigs and even makeup, on occasion. Pink used to be a boy’s color. Your “god” likely doesn’t judge anyone for their hair, makeup, or clothing preferences. You should think harder about what this means in 2022.

[Future Cat Lady]

Jinger started wearing pants because Jeremy said she could/should wear them, After they got married, he basically gave her a makeover. He probably threw away all her old clothes. He can't have his wife look frumpy.

[canaanite2]

2 hours ago, Salacious Kitty said:

Here is some information about the petition Jeremy signed, again as a PRIMARY signatory along with his hero Johnny Mac. 

And Jeremy's fine with that, otherwise she would still be in skirts. 

All the signers were in leadership positions. Then there's Jeremy Vuolo, title: student. His fellow signer from Grace Community Church is John MacArthur. Jeremy is the ultimate teacher's pet. He and MacArthur are using each other. 

[Tasya]

I guess I'll never get why the rule for Jill seems to be "yay! let her thrive!" (i.e. it seems like no one ever calls for her stuff to be boycotted or her sponsors contacted) and for Jinger there's just the opposite sentiment. As far as public statements of their beliefs, I think Jinger and Jill are on similar footing, and both of their husbands have said or implied agreement with some pretty terrible things. Is it just because Jill "seems" more mainstream that she gets a pass?

Edited July 10, 2022 by Tasya

[Dehumidifier]

Orthodox Jewish women don't wear pants because the Old Testament says women shouldn't dress like men (and vice versa.) If she was looking specifically for the word "pants" she wouldn't find it since no one in that part of the world was wearing them then. [I'm thinking they probably existed in India, China, SE Asia...]

[Cinnabon]

40 minutes ago, Tasya said:

I guess I'll never get why the rule for Jill seems to be "yay! let her thrive!" (i.e. it seems like no one ever calls for her stuff to be boycotted or her sponsors contacted) and for Jinger there's just the opposite sentiment. As far as public statements of their beliefs, I think Jinger and Jill are on similar footing, and both of their husbands have said or implied agreement with some pretty terrible things. Is it just because Jill "seems" more mainstream that she gets a pass?

I just agreed with @GeeGolly that Jill and Jinger ultimately have very similar beliefs. Posters on Reddit have contacted Jill’s sponsors many times. All hate and bigotry should be called out, imo. I’ve never given Jill a pass on these issues. She never stood up and stated she disagreed with Derick’s opinions, so I assume she is also transphobic.

Has Jill even shilled anything lately? On the plus side, her husband seems serious about working to support the family without all of the scams Jinger and Jeremy can’t seem to give up. If Jeremy buckled down and took his own education and profession seriously, he wouldn’t have to draw so much attention to them and Jinger would have a quieter life (that she claims to want).

Edited July 10, 2022 by Cinnabon

[ginger90]

41 minutes ago, Tasya said:

I guess I'll never get why the rule for Jill seems to be "yay! let her thrive!" (i.e. it seems like no one ever calls for her stuff to be boycotted or her sponsors contacted) and for Jinger there's just the opposite sentiment.

It happens, even though you haven’t seen it.

[lascuba]

1 hour ago, Tasya said:

I guess I'll never get why the rule for Jill seems to be "yay! let her thrive!" (i.e. it seems like no one ever calls for her stuff to be boycotted or her sponsors contacted) and for Jinger there's just the opposite sentiment. As far as public statements of their beliefs, I think Jinger and Jill are on similar footing, and both of their husbands have said or implied agreement with some pretty terrible things. Is it just because Jill "seems" more mainstream that she gets a pass?

It's not that Jill is more mainstream. I would say that Jinger is much more mainstream than she is even with the preacher husband.  Jill has always a fan/hater favorite. Jinger had the eyerolling that fed people's fundie rebel fantasy and Jana had the "poor CinderJana" narrative going, but I think people mostly liked Jill because she was "sweet" and dorky and on the plain side of the pretty spectrum. There was a period after she got engaged and shortly after marriage where I didn't feel like the only one on the planet who couldn't stand her, but by and large people just  want to like her and so everything she does is viewed in a positive and/or sympathetic lens. 

That infamous episode where Jill told Jinger off for wanting to live in a city had people all over the internet insisting that Jill did that because she was worried that Jinger would get in trouble with their parents. I'm still picking up the pieces from the subsequent head explosion.

[canaanite2]

I think the main difference between Jill and Jinger is that Jill is a fighter. She was the one who "tattled" on Josh. She was the one rumored to have hit Josh when he was committing his crimes. She also got herself an education as a midwife, sort of. She ended up not getting a great education in that field, but she got more of an education than her sisters ever did, and (I assume) that's because she fought Jim Bob for it and had to accept his rules and limits ( only working with a family friend and being accompanied by the real tattler in the family, Jana). This is all before she met Derick. Jinger and Jill have  similar beliefs, but Jill has been the one who has had the ambition to make herself into a better person, whereas Jinger's only ambition is to be taken care of and have nice things and go along with whatever her husband says. It's possible Jill and Derick's beliefs will evolve. Jinger and Jeremy? That'll never happen. 

Edited July 11, 2022 by canaanite2

[Suzn]

1 hour ago, canaanite2 said:

 It's possible Jill and Derick's beliefs will evolve. Jinger and Jeremy? That'll never happen. 

Jill's changes look entirely superficial to me.  Neither she nor Derick have ever even hinted at changing their hateful opinions.  For me to believe that they have evolved at all would require words to that effect from them.

Jinger and Jeremy?  I agree that they will not evolve at all.  Jeremy is too invested in his path and Jinger is meek and apparently brain dead.

[GeeGolly]

Jinger pretty much dropped her photography interest once she married Jeremy. Jill revisited her midwifery interest for a brief period after marrying Derick to make herself more qualified for sponsored missions, but has done nothing with it since. Both photography and midwifery are Fundy approved for females.

Jill has gone on record saying she's basically raising the boys as she was raised, with the exception of public school. Jinger has never shared if she's using instant obedience, blanket training, etc and the girls are two young for school.

The only obvious difference I see between the two couples is Derick is open with his hate and/or disappointments, whether it be his homophobia or wanting to be paid more from TLC/JB and Jeremy is more subtle.

I also don't think any degree is better than any other degree (except fake and unaccredited ones), so being a lawyer rather than a pastor does not make Derick a better man in my eyes.

[Future Cat Lady]

I think a lot of people believes Derrick and JIll have changed because of the feud between Derrick and JB. They love that he has publicly said that JB is basically an ass. And they think that J&D have changed. Jill has because she's doing a lot of stuff that her parents are against. But Derrick is just the same guy he was. He was not raised quiverfull and in the Gothard cult.

But like J&J, J&D are living a more mainstream life but still have hateful beliefs.

[Ijustwantsomechips]

On 7/3/2022 at 9:22 PM, Salacious Kitty said:

He's aging in dog years.

He’s aging like a pumpkin. Yikes.

[Stevie Nicks]

On 7/12/2022 at 9:26 AM, Ijustwantsomechips said:

He’s aging like a pumpkin. Yikes.

Or a banana or avocado. 

[Cinnabon]

2 hours ago, CherryBelly said:

I guess I don't understand the cognitive dissonance required to say these women are parts of patriarchal cults/churches where women don't have agency and are oppressed yet say they should be assumed to have the same beliefs as their husband's until they say otherwise.

How does that work? Are they are in patriarchal cults that oppress women or not? 

She’s been fired from multiple gigs because of accusations of being homophobic and transphobic. She never chose to defend herself and disavow those accusations. This has happened over and over again. She could have corrected the record (if indeed they were false accusations) on SM, YouTube, her podcast, or her book. She didn’t. She has continued attending a church that openly and loudly espouses homophobia, transphobia, misogyny, racism, and forced births. Occam’s razor - the simplest explanation is usually the correct one. 🤷‍♀️

Edited July 15, 2022 by Cinnabon

[lascuba]

2 hours ago, CherryBelly said:

I guess I don't understand the cognitive dissonance required to say these women are parts of patriarchal cults/churches where women don't have agency and are oppressed yet say they should be assumed to have the same beliefs as their husband's until they say otherwise.

How does that work? Are they are in patriarchal cults that oppress women or not? 

They're not mutually exclusive, so no cognitive dissonance required.

[Scarlett45]

The #1 Rule here on Primetimer is Be Civil.

You are allowed to disagree with fellow posters, but please do so politely. Make your point once or twice and then move on- this is a tv discussion site, there are no prizes to be won for being “right”. 

 

This forum is a place to discuss Jinger, Jeremy and their family. Discussions of the psychology of cults, oppression etc in general terms are better suited to the Small Talk thread.