S05.E01: Episode 1

[Tara Ariano]

In the Season 5 premiere, a couple disagrees about the future of their child, who was born with severe deformities. In other events, Delia's mother wants her to move back home to Wales.

[Primetimer]

In spite of it all, our beloved Trixie is keeping fit.

Read the story

[stopeslite]

Oh, man. As soon as Rhoda looked nauseous and took a swig from that bottle I was all "OH NO SHE IS DRINKING THALIDOMIDE NO SHOW NOOOOOO". 

That said, though, I hope they keep it as a thread through the season, and it wasn't a one special episode and done. If they're in 1961, it's going to take another year for everything to hash out in terms of realizing what's causing it and putting a stop to it. 

 

How cute was Sister Monica Joan? I loved everything she did tonight, including falling asleep while she was helping with the dishes. 

 

I loved the Sister Julienne save at the end. I wasn't expecting that.  :) 

 

I also loved the storyline with Olive. Nice to see them having female bonding and helping and empowering moments across the age spectrum.

 

Go away, Tom.

 

I hope we see Fred and the new Mrs. Fred next episode.

[Hero]

I loved this episode. 

 

How many years was Thalidomide prescribed to women before doctors realized it was causing all these problems?

 

I love Patsy. I would love to be friends with her. She seems like she is so much fun. 

[Blackie]

Great episode.  I loved Sister Moncica Joan at the fitness class.  But if they eat eclairs before they go to the fitness class, stop for tea and bickies half way through and then eat chips  on the way home, I don't think they will get the benefit that they want.

[Kohola3]

It really took quite a while for the issues with thalidomide to be identified.  It was first introduced in Germany in 1957 and was eventually sold over the counter.  It was banned in England in late 1961 but by then a whole lot of damage had been done.  A lot of those kids did have significant issues besides the malformed limbs.  I think about half of them died.

 

Loved the Maundy Thursday eclairs! 

 

I love how balanced Sr. Julienne always manages to be.  She really listens to everyone and changes her tune when it's warranted.  

Edited April 4, 2016 by Kohola3

[doodlebug]

Thalidomide was developed in Germany and was available there from 1957 to 1962 as a medication for morning sickness.  At one point, it could be purchased over the counter.  Not sure how long it was around in Britain but it was less than 5 years.  The majority of thalidomide babies were German and British.  The FDA never approved thalidomide in the US, the only thalidomide babies born to Americans were those born to US military families stationed in Germany who had access to the medication there.  Thalidomide does have some legitimate medical uses, just not in pregnancy.

 

I think this storyline is going to reverberate throughout the season.  Remember last season the doctor and Sheila were so excited to have a new drug that was so effective in treating hyperemesis?  That's going to come back to bite them as time progresses and the reports start to come in.  The doctor is pretty angsty as it is, no doubt he's going to feel guilty and perhaps be faced with the anger of parents when they discover the cause of their babies' terrible malformations.  I think this is going to be a major arc this season.  This was also a time when medicine was moving forward quickly and wonder drugs were everywhere and people had a lot of faith in medicine's ability to enhance their lives.  This is the era where penicillin and other new antibiotics were curing diseases that were almost invariably fatal less than a generation earlier.  The polio vaccine was just developed, eradicating a disease that had terrorized families for decades. Thalidomide was one of the first chinks in the armor of modern medicine.

Edited April 4, 2016 by doodlebug

[LittleIggy]

I remember reading that it was a woman doctor at the FDA who was instrumental in keeping Thalidomide out of the U.S. Bless her.

[Hero]

I can't imagine how terrible it must have been to have taken that medicine when pregnant and to then find out that your baby was born with deformities or died because of something that the doctors thought was harmless.

 

So, did the doctors in England and Germany know that this medicine was harmful to babies? If it was banned in the U.S., wouldn't the doctors in other countries know that it might have harmful effects when taken while pregnant?

[MaryHedwig]

I remember reading that it was a woman doctor at the FDA who was instrumental in keeping Thalidomide out of the U.S. Bless her.

 

It was Canadian doctor Frances Kelsey. She died last year at 101.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/canadian-doctor-who-kept-thalidomide-out-of-us-dies/article25873611/

[Thumper82003]

It really took quite a while for the issues with thalidomide to be identified.  It was first introduced in Germany in 1957 and was eventually sold over the counter.  It was banned in England in late 1961 but by then a whole lot of damage had been done.  A lot of those kids did have significant issues besides the malformed limbs.  I think about half of them died.

I was on thalidomide. First, it is now about $15k/month, you must not be able to get pregnant etc. But when I was researching the drug, one article said that the reason it was on the market so long was it's German maker. Because Hitler had targeted those with birth defects among all the others, Germany did not allow/want reporting of birth defects or disabilities. This delayed the realization that it was a teratogen.

[GaT]

I think this storyline is going to reverberate throughout the season.  Remember last season the doctor and Sheila were so excited to have a new drug that was so effective in treating hyperemesis?  That's going to come back to bite them as time progresses and the reports start to come in.  The doctor is pretty angsty as it is, no doubt he's going to feel guilty and perhaps be faced with the anger of parents when they discover the cause of their babies' terrible malformations.  I think this is going to be a major arc this season.

I agree. At some point his patients are going to find out it was the drug he prescribed that did it, & even though it wasn't his fault, I can't imagine that they aren't going to blame him. I don't know what I would do if my baby was born deformed because of a drug I was prescribed. I would be blaming everyone.

[Beldasnoop]

From what I have read, the parents and their thalidomide-affected children didn't blame the doctors, for the most part. The drug company was really to blame, and survivors are still fighting for compensation from the company for the effects of the drug. The doctors who prescribed it and the medical professionals who gave it out didn't know about its harmful effects. The drug wasn't taken off the market in the UK until late 1961. It was used as a sedative in addition to being prescribed for morning sickness. Also, Rhoda wasn't drinking thalidomide in the beginning of the episode. She was drinking Milk of Magnesia. Perry (Rhoda's son) asked Shelagh for it in his first scene when he came into the surgery. Shelagh told Perry that if Rhoda wants a prescription drug she has to come in and see the doctor. Also, thalidomide had to be taken in early pregnancy to cause the effects that it did for babies like Susan. 

 

I'm frustrated that PBS is still editing this show. There are several scenes that have been cut from this episode (I have the UK DVDs). 

Edited April 4, 2016 by Beldasnoop

[NoThyme]

<<<<<<<<I'm frustrated that PBS is still editing this show. There are several scenes that have been cut from this episode (I have the UK DVDs). >>>>>>>>>

Where do you buy the UK version. I assume the one that PBS sells is edited.

[Beldasnoop]

The US DVDs aren't edited either (unlike Netflix, which is edited), but they aren't released until after it airs here. The UK ones are already out. You can order them from Amazon UK, but you have to have a way to watch non-US DVDs, like a multi-region DVD player. 

[doodlebug]

I can't imagine how terrible it must have been to have taken that medicine when pregnant and to then find out that your baby was born with deformities or died because of something that the doctors thought was harmless.

 

So, did the doctors in England and Germany know that this medicine was harmful to babies? If it was banned in the U.S., wouldn't the doctors in other countries know that it might have harmful effects when taken while pregnant?

At the time it was causing birth defects, the doctors had no idea that the drug was responsible.  As noted above, the German government did a very poor job of collecting data on birth defects.  Eventually, after clusters of phocomelia, a very uncommon birth defect, were popping up everywhere, it became clear that a teratogen was involved.  The timeline was easy to pinpoint as well as linking it to a new drug being used specifically in pregnancy.  The FDA never banned thalidomide, it never got past the approval process here; in part because there was so little data available from Germany.

[JudyObscure]

I knew they would have to have an episode showing the results from the doctor's "new miracle drug" for morning sickness, but I wasn't expecting it in this premiere.  Well done, show.  It was terribly sad, but the reaction of the nurses, the father's initial shock, the mother's acceptance was all so real.  I loved the little speech from the young nun to the father about how his family would, quite shortly, not even see Susan's disability, but it would be their job to protect and defend her from others.  I'm crying this morning just thinking about it.

 

On a lighter note -- I still have my black leotard and tights I once wore to adult ballet and "exercise class."   One thing about that outfit, you can't outgrow it, it stretches with you. I'm glad they're getting into the 60's and the changing thinking that women should actually know all about their own bodies and be able to make decisions  with their doctors.

 

Love the Trixie story, her alcoholism and her sadness over seeing her  lost love moving on. 

 

Four tissue episode.

[craziness]

I liked the older lady with the prolapse uterus. Her funny comments during the class reminded me of me. I hope she comes back, but I doubt it (we almost never see the patients again).

[BusyOctober]

It's a good thing Sister Julienne and Nonantus House are progressive thinking nuns.  If the idea of women being photographed in leotards was shocking, I can't imagine the first reaction if/when the Sisters discover Patsy & Delia's secret.  Fortunately, they seem to have a very open minded stance on a lot of issues.  They've dealt with incest, addiction, inter-racial relationships, teen pregnancy, prostitution, mental illness, birth defects etc.  If they can see the humanity in all of these patients and be empathetic, loving and compassionate, I have high hopes the Sisters will be able to handle homosexuality.

 

Tom is an idiot if he thinks he can date Barbara without causing major drama. 

[Kohola3]

It was Canadian doctor Frances Kelsey. She died last year at 101.

 

Which is why it is ironic that Canada was later in banning it than other countries. http://www.thalidomide.ca/the-canadian-tragedy/

 

Definitely some great acting in this one.  The poor dad, coming across the deformity with no warning, reacted so naturally.  And the brother and sister were typical kids and I can see them stepping up to defend Susan.  A lot of siblings who are faced with this are such champions, mostly because they grow up seeing the handicapped child as normal. just different.

[attica]

I wish that the scene of Trixie getting catcalled as she bicycled by hadn't been played as though catcalls are a compliment. It's exhausting to beat that mindset back.

[SunnyBeBe]

I missed Chummy and her husband. Are they returning this season?

[whatsatool]

They all reminded me of RCAF exercises.

[sigmaforce86]

I missed Chummy and her husband. Are they returning this season?

 Miranda said she wouldn't be in this season because she had other commitments.  I really hope she comes back to the show eventually.  It's funny that I don't miss Jenny (or Jessica) very much and when she first left I thought it would ruin the show.  I miss Chummy more.  It looks though like Peter is in the credits for some 5th season episodes so IF that's right I guess he'll be back from time to time.

 

I thought it was unusually shortsighted of Sister Julienne to call Trixie's AA meetings a "club", she's always seemed a little more progressive and insightful than most.  Considering AA had been around for nearly 20 years by then (the "big book" was first published in 1939) and considering the area where they worked she should know something about alcoholism and treatment.   It came across as though she was implying that this something optional for Trixie.  But other than that odd note the episode was as great as this show as always been.

 

I was amazed at the realism of the baby they used but they seem to put a lot into making them that realistic; link if anyone is interested.  http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2016-02-07/how-call-the-midwife-filmed-thalidomide-birth-scenes

Edited April 4, 2016 by sigmaforce86

[anna0852]

The midwives are back!

 

My take away from the show is that we are beginning to see the growing changes between the nuns and the lay midwives. While I think Sister Julianne had a point about so many of them being off the roster at once (for Trixie's Keep Fit class), her objections to the leotards and her lack of understanding about AA both underscored the different lives being led under the Nonnatus roof. It was very strange to see SJ in that sort of more judgemental role but I think as social mores relax more moving to the Sixties, this is something that will come up again. What would have been seen as open-mind in 1957 will be viewed as much more hidebound by 1967.

[izabella]

Tom is an idiot if he thinks he can date Barbara without causing major drama.

 

He really is!  Trixie isn't the right one for him, and she seems to know that, but that doesn't mean she won't feel hurt anyway. 

 

This show is so heartbreaking - I always forget that until the next season starts.  And, wow, what are baby Susan's chances of survival under the circumstances? 

[mbutterfly]

I loved this episode. 

 

How many years was Thalidomide prescribed to women before doctors realized it was causing all these problems?

 

I love Patsy. I would love to be friends with her. She seems like she is so much fun. 

I was expecting a baby in the summer of 1962 and the thalidomide babies were shown on the cover of Life Magazine -- I'm thinking Sept. So it was all out by then. 

[Kohola3]

And, wow, what are baby Susan's chances of survival under the circumstances?

 

It all depends on any internal abnormalities.  Many kids adapted and went on to lead full lives. It all depended on their support system.

[SunnyBeBe]

Afterwards, I think it was Trixie's voice that said they started at the end of 1961 and were going into 1962, though, I've read otherwise.  Did anyone else catch that?  So I guess there will be a jump in time somewhere in the season, since last night was at Easter time.

 

I think that having the Rev and a new girl get together is rather odd.  That girl reminds me of Winona Ryder.  lol 

[marceline]

I was amazed at the realism of the baby they used but they seem to put a lot into making them that realistic; link if anyone is interested.  http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2016-02-07/how-call-the-midwife-filmed-thalidomide-birth-scenes

 

Just a heads up for anyone clicking on that link. There's a pretty big spoiler in the comments. I've seen the whole season so it didn't bother me but if you want to stay unspoiled, do not read the comments. 

[OtterMommy]

Also, thalidomide had to be taken in early pregnancy to cause the effects that it did for babies like Susan. 

 

Apparently, my memory is short.  At the end of last season, a mother was having extreme morning sickness (I know there is a name for it, but I can't think of it off the top of my head) and Dr. Turner prescribed thalidomide.  What that mother Rhoda?

[J-Man]

After reading the recap, I was distressed at how many scenes/interactions from this episode seem to have been cut by PBS. Why are they doing this? They have time at the end of each show for some filler material, so why can't they show the complete episode?

[willowk]

I loved the mix of light and dark in this episode, the promise of spring and Easter against little Susan's deformities. I think Delia living in Nonnatus will be a disaster. They could have lived as two single women and kept their relationship a secret, the here they are sure to be found out. I can't imagine it will go well. Patsy seems to realize the dangers by the look on her face, while Delia is totally for it.

I agree with the poster who said they miss Chummy but not Jenny. Its weird to have older Jenny still narrating since the character left the show (realize that is because show started based on Jenny memoir).

"After reading the recap, I was distressed at how many scenes/interactions from this episode seem to have been cut by PBS. Why are they doing this? They have time at the end of each show for some filler material, so why can't they show the complete episode?"

J-Man, what did they cut?

[J-Man]

 

J-Man, what did they cut?

 

From memory, these are the things in the recap that weren't in the US episode (please correct me if I'm wrong):

 

1. Family Planning Soufflé: Nurse Crane has some weird ideas about how having the choice to use diaphragms makes women think they're "entitled to pick and choose" other things in their lives. Um, yeah...how crazy of them.

 

2. Complicating Factors: She was hoping she could have a nun deliver the baby, "not one of you young 'uns," she tells Patsy. "I bet you've all got lovely bleedin' bums!"

 

3. Who called the meeting? Sisters Winifred and Mary Cynthia. What's it about? Fixing up a box of castoffs for Baby Susan. How'd it go? Sister Winifred wonders if there's not "something in the atmosphere" causing the recent rise of recent birth defects. Sweet little Sister MC reveals that she had a brother who was born with hydrocephaly. Her mother would advise that if people stared, she should stare back. But she never got to, because the staring jerks had already looked away to shake their heads in judgment. She resolves that Susan should have her own clothes, from her own family.

[willowk]

J-Man I didn't see those moments you mention in last night's show, I was thinking I'd missed something, but that they cut it makes more sense. PBS did that with Downton Abbey also, think they do it to keep it to an hour while getting all their promos and underwriting (commercials in). I agree they shouldn't though, would be better to run things over.

Wanted to mention that I loved how Rhonda chose the name Susan as it would be a name that she wouldn't have to spell or explain. That is one of the kindest things I've seen a mom do and very clear sighted of her.

[MissLucas]

Nurse Crane's exact line was: "These young wives get themselves a diaphragm, and once they can pick and choose their family size, the picking and the choosing never stops."

 

One of the hardest things when writing historical fiction is to find the right balance when it comes to ideas, concepts and mentalities that might be offensive to a modern audience. It's a cheap trick to hand them to characters the audience won't like anyway. I appreciate that this show occasionally allows their lead characters to express opinions that are no longer considered acceptable. They did something similar last season when it came to the young family father who turned out to be gay. I think it was Sister Winifred who did not mince her words. And in this episode even Sister Julienne was briefly struggling. It's stuff like that that makes me defend the show against accusations of white-washing and sugar-coating the past and being nothing but nostalgic trash.

[Driad]

I didn't understand the big pile of clothes for Baby Susie.  There was an earlier scene in which two of the nurses put a diaper (towel?) on Susie and one said her feet would get cold, so they could modify clothing for her.  But the pile of clothing included at least one ordinary dress.  Mum had a daughter so presumably she had some hand-me-downs for Susie.  Special clothing for Susie was a thoughtful idea, and Mum appreciated getting something new or different.  But if most of those clothes were things that any baby could wear, why not give some of them to families that didn't already have baby clothes?  (It is possible that the nurses gave every family a big pile of clothes but I don't remember seeing that.)

[willowk]

"I didn't understand the big pile of clothes for Baby Susie. " --I assumed they altered them to fit the small arms and legs. Otherwise it was just a nice gesture for someone who's going to have a lot of challenges to deal with.

[JudyObscure]

I think Delia living in Nonnatus will be a disaster. They could have lived as two single women and kept their relationship a secret, the here they are sure to be found out. I can't imagine it will go well. Patsy seems to realize the dangers by the look on her face, while Delia is totally for it.

I agree. I'm nervous already. They will be constantly tempted to spend time together after work, will become less and less careful, and ultimately will get caught. After all, this is not a house where people go to bed and stay there, nurses are up getting calls and Sister Monica Joan is making trips to the kitchen. If the nuns are completely understanding about it all, I'll be the first to look doubtful, because it just wasn't accepted at that time. In fact the "kind," thing to have done would have been to recommend therapy. Yikes.

[izabella]

I didn't understand the big pile of clothes for Baby Susie

 

Those clothes were her own clothes, clothes that Rhonda had ready for the new baby when she came home.  Cynthia and the others altered them for her arms and legs.  Cynthia went to get the clothes at Rhonda's house when Rhonda told her her husband wouldn't come back to the hospital and bring them because he didn't want the baby to come home.

[dargosmydaddy]

 

Apparently, my memory is short.  At the end of last season, a mother was having extreme morning sickness (I know there is a name for it, but I can't think of it off the top of my head) and Dr. Turner prescribed thalidomide.  What that mother Rhoda?

 

No, that lady had a toddler and an absent husband if I'm remembering correctly.

[wonderwoman]

"I was amazed at the realism of the baby they used but they seem to put a lot into making them that realistic; link if anyone is interested. http://www.radiotime...de-birth-scenes"

"Just a heads up for anyone clicking on that link. There's a pretty big spoiler in the comments. I've seen the whole season so it didn't bother me but if you want to stay unspoiled, do not read the comments. "

Thanks for both heads up (heads ups?).

While I appreciate the care and effort that went into the realism of the baby, I was so curious about how they did it that I found it difficult to fully experience the emotional impact.

[Driad]

Thank you folks for the background information and clarifications.  I often have trouble understanding what the characters are saying, and closed captions do not help, so I probably miss a lot.

[Clanstarling]

I thought it was unusually shortsighted of Sister Julienne to call Trixie's AA meetings a "club", she's always seemed a little more progressive and insightful than most.  Considering AA had been around for nearly 20 years by then (the "big book" was first published in 1939) and considering the area where they worked she should know something about alcoholism and treatment.   It came across as though she was implying that this something optional for Trixie.  But other than that odd note the episode was as great as this show as always been.

My take on Sister Julienne in this scene was that she used the word "class" as a delicate way to refer to it, rather than being dismissive. Trixie was rightly offended by it, but I thought the intent was not what it sounded like, given Sister Julienne's character over the years.

It ticks me off that scenes are cut, but most often they haven't seemed significant. From the description I think Cynthia's revelation about her own experience was actually pretty relevant and informed all of her scenes, especially the one where she spoke to the father. Without that scene, I took it that she really didn't know anything about how families respond, when in fact she did.

I was first amused that the son's space helmet had the Soviet acronym(CCCP) instead of a US symbol - but that was accurate as it turns out, as the first Mercury flight was May 5, 1961. I had the dates mixed up, and thought Glenn's flight in 1962 (the third mission) was in 1961.

Edited April 4, 2016 by clanstarling

[Hero]

Thanks for everyone who answered my questions about thalidomide! 

[maraleia]

I remember reading that it was a woman doctor at the FDA who was instrumental in keeping Thalidomide out of the U.S. Bless her.

Most of the time the FDA is a good thing and here's a great example of how it works to our (the US) advantage. Glad they took the advice of that Canadian woman doctor.

Edited April 5, 2016 by maraleia

[mojito]

 

My take on Sister Julienne in this scene was that she used the word "class" as a delicate way to refer to it, rather than being dismissive. Trixie was rightly offended by it, but I thought the intent was not what it sounded like, given Sister Julienne's character over the years.

Agreed. Sister Julienne realized the error of her ways as soon as Trixie pushed back. 

 

I loved Chummy, too, and love how the show is carrying on without Jenny. Even with her as the main characters, the plots were evenly distributed among the characters, so it was an easy transition from With Jenny to Without Jenny.

 

 

...I have high hopes the Sisters will be able to handle homosexuality.

 

As long as the two remain chaste, they'll be okay. It's not the person, it's the act.....

 

 

Because Hitler had targeted those with birth defects among all the others, Germany did not allow/want reporting of birth defects or disabilities. 

 

When did they finally allow such reporting? Makes me wonder how long it took the country to rid itself of everything Hitler-ish. Considering what he did, how he brought down the country, and then took the easy way out, twelve years would've been more than enough time to cleanse.

 

Is this the final series?

Edited April 5, 2016 by mojito

[dustylil]

Is this the final series?

 

No. Happily there will be at least one more season/series.

[Beldasnoop]

It ticks me off that scenes are cut, but most often they haven't seemed significant. From the description I think Cynthia's revelation about her own experience was actually pretty relevant and informed all of her scenes, especially the one where she spoke to the father. Without that scene, I took it that she really didn't know anything about how families respond, when in fact she did.

 

 

Yes. That cut really surprised me. They have cut out some fairly important scenes in past seasons, though. For the most part, I think this was one of the better editing jobs except for the Sister MC scene and one other small moment that has relevance to the rest of the series but I can't really clarify because it would be a spoiler. I do get the impression often that the editors don't watch the whole season before editing individual episodes, because they do sometimes cut scenes that may not seem as relevant in the episode, but that are very relevant in the context of season-long story arcs.

Edited April 5, 2016 by Beldasnoop

[j5cochran]

 

Apparently, my memory is short.  At the end of last season, a mother was having extreme morning sickness (I know there is a name for it, but I can't think of it off the top of my head) and Dr. Turner prescribed thalidomide.  What that mother Rhoda?

 

No, that lady had a toddler and an absent husband if I'm remembering correctly.

 

According to IMDB, the woman who was prescribed the thalidomide was Maureen Gadsby (played by Lucy Phelps), in episode 4.8. To me, it seemed that this was the first time that Dr. Turner had prescribed the drug, but as it was so successful, he undoubtedly used it for other patients.