Current Plots Discussion: Actually Today's Episode

[peachmangosteen]

51 minutes ago, Petunia13 said:

Maybe they wil retcon Charlie has DID or was brainwashed or some shit. 

I've been assuming that for awhile now. Ron loves DID and he loves doing the same shit over and over again so it seems almost inevitable really. 

Honestly, I think the actor playing Charlie is one of the best they have. He's really compelling. I hope they keep him. And yea, I'm over the endless 'they were mentally ill so you can't blame them for the bad stuff they did!' shit but whatever lol.

[Silver Raven]

Who was Allie talking about when she said her grandpa thinks it's a possibility that Tripp didn't rape her?  Roman thinks Tripp did it.  Bill Horton is dead. John? Speaking of which, I hope we see Roman and Lucas apologize to Tripp.

Why is Nicole dressed like she's going to a fancy dress ball?

 

[FilmTVGeek80]

Not that this show doesn't do nonsensical things all the time, and ReRon isn't nicknamed that for nothing, but I don't see them going the DID route. I know people point to the glasses thing, but Charlie has been "good" Charlie and "bad" Charlie whether he's wearing his glasses or not. His personality changes aren't dictated by whether he's wearing glasses. Most alternate personalities do not answer to the host's given name and he's never answered to anything other than Charlie.  Yes, the actor is doing a good job of showing how Charlie can sometimes turn on a dime and be more sinister, but that just seems like somebody who's true colors are showing when they're pushed, not as some symptom of an alternate personality. It was especially evident in his scene with Ben where he realized the innocent act wasn't working and got a little more aggressive.

If they keep the actor, they'll just have him get away with the rape the same way so many other assholes get away with the things they do on this show. It's still a he said/she said rape, so it's unlikely London would change their mind about pressing charges. They might just keep him around as an antagonist for the younger scene. I am interested in seeing the dynamic play out between him and Tripp.

Edited January 12, 2021 by FilmTVGeek80

[norcalgal]

1 hour ago, Silver Raven said:

Who was Allie talking about when she said her grandpa thinks it's a possibility that Tripp didn't rape her?  Roman thinks Tripp did it.  Bill Horton is dead. John? Speaking of which, I hope we see Roman and Lucas apologize to Tripp.

Why is Nicole dressed like she's going to a fancy dress ball?

 

The show is so incestuous that the writers probably couldn’t remember who are Allie’s grandfathers. I know that I sometimes can’t keep all the relationships straight! 

[FilmTVGeek80]

2 hours ago, Silver Raven said:

Who was Allie talking about when she said her grandpa thinks it's a possibility that Tripp didn't rape her?  Roman thinks Tripp did it.  Bill Horton is dead. John? Speaking of which, I hope we see Roman and Lucas apologize to Tripp.

Why is Nicole dressed like she's going to a fancy dress ball?

 

Yes, she was referring to John. He's married to her grandmother and considers Sami like a daughter. He's referred to her as his granddaughter several times and she's called him grandpa.

[Frozendiva]

How can Allie just walk in to the interrogation room to talk to the suspect? No beat cops or Admin staff around? The door doesn't lock from the outside too? Rafe just can't take off - well, he is the only cop around now. That should not happen. There should always be back-up.

Tripp was sure surprised at finding out he has a half-brother, maybe, depending on DNA tests. Yeah, phones can die so someone can miss a few calls. Did like Steve filling him in. And also Kayla. And Kayla not screaming at Steve about this and handling this like an adult, and having some sympathy for Tripp and Allie. She is also flabbergasted. Maybe she will see her error and apologize.

Eventually, Ava will realize that Kayla was helping her by keeping her sedated. Kayla did call Tripp and he did come. Hopefully the tox screen will show what sort of drug she was given.

No idea if telling Brady that Philip is laundering money is the best idea, but this storyline does need to move along.

Nicole and Allie shouldn't be hearing second hand stuff. Allie should have waited for Grandpa John to come to the pub to talk to her. At least Allie has been more open that her memories are not solid and that maybe Tripp was telling the truth after all.

Charlie is one cool cucumber.

[Silver Raven]

1 hour ago, norcalgal said:

The show is so incestuous that the writers probably couldn’t remember who are Allie’s grandfathers. I know that I sometimes can’t keep all the relationships straight! 

I was musing on the fact that Philip is Brady's uncle.

 

[DaphneCat]

30 minutes ago, Frozendiva said:

How can Allie just walk in to the interrogation room to talk to the suspect? No beat cops or Admin staff around? The door doesn't lock from the outside too? Rafe just can't take off - well, he is the only cop around now. That should not happen. There should always be back-up.

Tripp was sure surprised at finding out he has a half-brother, maybe, depending on DNA tests. Yeah, phones can die so someone can miss a few calls. Did like Steve filling him in. And also Kayla. And Kayla not screaming at Steve about this and handling this like an adult, and having some sympathy for Tripp and Allie. She is also flabbergasted. Maybe she will see her error and apologize.

Eventually, Ava will realize that Kayla was helping her by keeping her sedated. Kayla did call Tripp and he did come. Hopefully the tox screen will show what sort of drug she was given.

No idea if telling Brady that Philip is laundering money is the best idea, but this storyline does need to move along.

Nicole and Allie shouldn't be hearing second hand stuff. Allie should have waited for Grandpa John to come to the pub to talk to her. At least Allie has been more open that her memories are not solid and that maybe Tripp was telling the truth after all.

Charlie is one cool cucumber.

OK, Rafe is OFFICIALLY the worst cop EVER.  No competent cop simply spills everything to someone because they walk in and demand he tell them.  You can't reveal what was said in an official interview, moron.  And who didn't see it coming several miles away that, of course, Allie was going to walk away and double back?  She then demands answers and isn't leaving until she gets them.  She already tried that with Tripp.  Even though WE know Charlie did it, she doesn't.  This is incredibly bad writing.  It's like they are going out of their way to make a rape victim unlikeable.  

And while I like Kayla, I didn't care much for her sympathy about "what those kids have been through."  If she hadn't been such a shitty doctor and had run a proper DNA test, they wouldn't have had to "go through" anything and possibly, someone (i.e. Steve or John) could have started investigating sooner.  Didn't she watch "The Genetic Detective"?  Forensic DNA is a big topic now.

[FilmTVGeek80]

16 minutes ago, DaphneCat said:

OK, Rafe is OFFICIALLY the worst cop EVER.  No competent cop simply spills everything to someone because they walk in and demand he tell them.  You can't reveal what was said in an official interview, moron.  And who didn't see it coming several miles away that, of course, Allie was going to walk away and double back?  She then demands answers and isn't leaving until she gets them.  She already tried that with Tripp.  Even though WE know Charlie did it, she doesn't.  This is incredibly bad writing.  It's like they are going out of their way to make a rape victim unlikeable. 

Rafe (and a lot of cops on this show) have done bonehead things, but I didn't think anything he did today was anywhere close to the worst. I guess I've just gotten used to this show's lax adherence to HIPPA laws and exhibiting real world rules for how police stations would be run. Allie's sucked a lot during this storyline, but I didn't have a problem with anything she did today. I can't blame her for wanting answers. She didn't go in there screaming that Charlie raped her. Yes, we know he's guilty and she doesn't, which is why she has questions. And knowing that Charlie is guilty, I don't care about his rights being violated or that he'll face some tough questions.

[Frozendiva]

If Jerry Springer or Maury can have a paternity test of 99.9% accuracy, what is Salem Hospital using?

[Petunia13]

Bish they have $99 home paternity tests.

yeah I’m pretty sure I should be rooting for Allie and Lani in their storylines but I get so annoyed seeing and listening to them. I hope the aftermath of these stories usher them off. 

That actor playing Charlie is doing a great job. That speaks highly of him since they have no set coach and get virtually no feed back from the slackers in charge. 

[enchantingmonkey]

Salem, USA exists in an objective reality in which there's a doctor who's capable of bringing dead people back to a state of living, which to suggests that it's a different objective reality than ours.  If they want to say that DNA testing plays by different rules, too, it's not that difficult for me to accept that.  Although, I still haven't figured out how Gabi was able to carry Abigail around without assistance.

It was odd to me that John sent Rafe to Charlie's apartment, where he found Ava, but Steve had no idea that Ava had been found there.  Why did Rafe, John and Steve all quit communicating with each other?  

I liked that Charlie was so calm, cool and collected while being questioned be Rafe, and, later, Tripp asked, "What kind of monster would do this?" when Steve was filling him in on the newly discovered details.  

Also liked the tables-have-turned dynamic of Kayla sedating the restrained Ava.  

If anyone watches the credits at the end of the show, there was an interesting name credited at the end of today's show.  Previously, Anna and Tony were credited a day or two before they were on screen.  

Spoiler

Ivan

 

Edited January 12, 2021 by enchantingmonkey

[kitmerlot1213]

I liked how Tripp's first thought upon finding out that Charlie might be the rapist was to ask if Claire and Allie were okay and that they might be in danger--good for him for still being a compassionate person despite all the crappy things done to him.  There is a long list of people who need to give him a heart-felt apology and I'm not sure who I need to see first:  Allie, Nicole or Kayla, maybe Lucas?

[boes]

I tuned in for about 5 minutes and saw a bit of Tripp with Ava - all the tears in the world isn't going to make that one mother of the year - but then I saw Philip's face....every time I do it shocks me into jumping back.  

Does his second job involve living in a sewer and abducting children?  

He needs a new skin care routine in the worst way.

But even moreso, Who on EARTH goes to Brady for help, unless the "help" requested involves what dipilatory he uses that gives him that warm ham glow?

[FilmTVGeek80]

3 hours ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

I liked how Tripp's first thought upon finding out that Charlie might be the rapist was to ask if Claire and Allie were okay and that they might be in danger--good for him for still being a compassionate person despite all the crappy things done to him.  There is a long list of people who need to give him a heart-felt apology and I'm not sure who I need to see first:  Allie, Nicole or Kayla, maybe Lucas?

I think Lucas owes him a big apology, especially for going after him physically, but the other three played a bigger part in starting this and keeping this going. Nicole was the one who pushed Allie to remember what happened. She was right that Allie was raped, but as someone who was advising her she should have pushed her just as hard to truly remember what happened before starting to throw around accusations. I think Allie and Kayla owe him the biggest apology. Allie was the one who lead the charge in making the accusation and, like Lucas, went after Tripp violently. I can sympathize partly with Allie maybe not wanting to relive her own rape, but if you're going to accuse someone of something so serious you should have more than just some vague memory to go on. Part of why Kayla probably owes him a bigger apology is there were a couple of times Allie expressed some doubt but constantly pointed to the DNA test as why it had to be him.

I want to blame the writers more since they're the reason why this half-assed test was used so they could increase "suspense" in this storyline. Obviously a DNA test, in this situation, needed to be done but again, not the test they did. To be fair to Kayla, she did run the test several times, but I feel like as someone who knew Tripp personally she should have questioned things more. I know they have a complicated history, but still she should have had some doubts. She should have explained better that the test didn't prove Tripp was the father just that they shared DNA. She's the one who made it seem like there were no other possibilities and yet when Steve presented the alternate theory that it could have been a cousin of Tripp's finally she pointed at that yeah it basically could have been any other close blood relative. 

[Pearson80]

17 hours ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Not that this show doesn't do nonsensical things all the time, and ReRon isn't nicknamed that for nothing, but I don't see them going the DID route. I know people point to the glasses thing, but Charlie has been "good" Charlie and "bad" Charlie whether he's wearing his glasses or not. His personality changes aren't dictated by whether he's wearing glasses. Most alternate personalities do not answer to the host's given name and he's never answered to anything other than Charlie.  Yes, the actor is doing a good job of showing how Charlie can sometimes turn on a dime and be more sinister, but that just seems like somebody who's true colors are showing when they're pushed, not as some symptom of an alternate personality. It was especially evident in his scene with Ben where he realized the innocent act wasn't working and got a little more aggressive.

If they keep the actor, they'll just have him get away with the rape the same way so many other assholes get away with the things they do on this show. It's still a he said/she said rape, so it's unlikely London would change their mind about pressing charges. They might just keep him around as an antagonist for the younger scene. I am interested in seeing the dynamic play out between him and Tripp.

Has a man ever suffered from multiple personalities on a soap? It is always women usually a heroine who is given that story.  It would be cool to see a male character have it just because it would be something different to see play out..

[FilmTVGeek80]

2 minutes ago, Pearson80 said:

Has a man ever suffered from multiple personalities on a soap? It is always women usually a heroine who is given that story.  It would be cool to see a male character have it just because it would be something different to see play out..

I'm not sure if a male character ever has. I know on OLTL (not sure if Carlivati was writing at the time) they toyed with Todd having it, but I think ultimately it turned out that he was faking it.

[norcalgal]

14 hours ago, Silver Raven said:

I was musing on the fact that Philip is Brady's uncle.

 

OMG - yes!  I kept thinking that as well throughout their scenes in that outdoor cafe. [And is it really the best idea to talk about a crime - money laundering - out in a public place like that?!]

[methodwriter85]

1 hour ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

I'm not sure if a male character ever has. I know on OLTL (not sure if Carlivati was writing at the time) they toyed with Todd having it, but I think ultimately it turned out that he was faking it.

They kind of did it with Powell Lord, where he becomes a serial rapist and thinks that he's doing it because he's becoming Todd. I think there was even a scene where he's looking in mirror and sees Todd instead of himself.

Then there was Brent on Guilding Light, who went in drag as Marion as a means to terrify the town after he was turned into a social pariah for raping Lucy. He's finally sent away but he's consumed by his Marion personality. So maybe that's DID? Not entirely sure. They never brought Brent back which kind of surprises me because he was a very popular storyline.

I like Mike Manning's acting but I don't need the character of Charlie to stay on. There's something to be said about a villain not overstaying their welcome. Or, y'know, taking a villain and turning him into the town Golden Boy because Dr. Marlena said so.

He's playing this character like a Sociopath who puts on this sweet guy persona without actually being that way.

Edited January 12, 2021 by methodwriter85

[RunningMarket]

20 hours ago, norcalgal said:

I didn't see today's show.  My thoughts specifically on the above:

1) I could see how Charlie could still sweet talk his way out of the Allie rape

2) How the heck can they expect Charlie to claim ignorance on the Ava situation?!  Hasn't Charlie been living at home on the regular these past weeks? Charlie can't say he's been out of town for the last X days/weeks.  How does he explain to Rafe he (Charlie) didn't see a woman gagged and tied to a chair in his freaking living room?!  

Re #2: He'll probably get Claire involved and have her explain how she was there on Christmas (Christmas Eve?) and she didn't see anyone gagged and bound to any chair in his living room! And knowing the Salem PD, this will be all the defense he needs.

[DaphneCat]

28 minutes ago, methodwriter85 said:

I like Mike Manning's acting but I don't need the character of Charlie to stay on. There's something to be said about a villain not overstaying their welcome. Or, y'know, taking a villain and turning him into the town Golden Boy because Dr. Marlena said so.

He's playing this character like a Sociopath who puts on this sweet guy persona without actually being that way.

I know of a GREAT plot that hasn't been done on Days before AT ALL.  The love of a good woman (Claire maybe?) can transform him from a monster into the greatest hero of Salem.  Of course, Marlena would have to be involved in the transformation, but the woman MUST run around town screeching that "HE'S CHANGED" and treating anyone who still has residual bad feelings about his actions as the most judgmental, terrible and just plain mean people in the universe.  At some point, Allie must become besties with him.  Marlena must constantly reassure him that he is a good person.  Maybe a Father of the Year award for his involvement with Henry (this, of course, after a fraught court case where he gets visitation)?  Yup.  This is IT!!!!!

[Peanut6711]

While in the real world I'd never want to see a rapist go free, I do want to see Charlie stick around on screen longer as he's become an intriguing character and the actor shows range. We don't get that often enough on Days these days so I hope Ron doesn't do one of his abrupt wrap ups.  I'd like to see more character exploration on the fact that Charlie is Henry's father and his portrayal thus far is that he's trying to divorce that fact in his mind, and I'd like to see his own father come in to play for additional character development with him and Ava. I would love to see this all come full swing with an 'aha' reveal for Jake to turn out to be his dad. After all, he came from Philly where Charlie supposedly grew up and the Vitali's still are, and Jake had ties to the mob. I think there'd be great potential for the dynamics between Jake and Ava. And it could even throw some interest into Jake's eye-roll worthy infatuation with Kate. How would Kate feel if she found out she was sleeping with the father of her granddaughter's rapist?  dun-dun-dun-dun

Edited January 12, 2021 by Peanut6711

[FilmTVGeek80]

Claire's motivation was pretty plainly stated today in that she wants to believe Charlie is a good person and that she knows him because he's the first person who has loved her unconditionally (though I wonder about that. I wasn't watching when her and Theo first got together, but she was relatively normal then and he liked who she was. It was only when she got crazier and started doing stupid things that he broke up with her.) But I still find it eye-roll worthy how she keeps talking about how well she knows him and how he couldn't possibly have done it. They've only known each other a short time and just started dating. She knew Tripp for a lot longer and was quickly willing to believe he was Allie's rapist even before the DNA test. I can sympathize with her in some way because she finally has someone who has chosen her, but it's hard to feel too much sympathy or investment given the relatively short nature of this relationship.

Though, I was thinking about this the other day, and I wonder if they are setting this up for Claire to forgive him. If there's anyone on the canvas who would understand Charlie's motivation in being crazy jealous of a relative, it would be Claire. She went insane because of her jealousy for Ciara.

[Peanut6711]

5 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Claire's motivation was pretty plainly stated today in that she wants to believe Charlie is a good person and that she knows him because he's the first person who has loved her unconditionally (though I wonder about that. I wasn't watching when her and Theo first got together, but she was relatively normal then and he liked who she was. It was only when she got crazier and started doing stupid things that he broke up with her.) But I still find it eye-roll worthy how she keeps talking about how well she knows him and how he couldn't possibly have done it. They've only known each other a short time and just started dating. She knew Tripp for a lot longer and was quickly willing to believe he was Allie's rapist even before the DNA test. I can sympathize with her in some way because she finally has someone who has chosen her, but it's hard to feel too much sympathy or investment given the relatively short nature of this relationship.

Though, I was thinking about this the other day, and I wonder if they are setting this up for Claire to forgive him. If there's anyone on the canvas who would understand Charlie's motivation in being crazy jealous of a relative, it would be Claire. She went insane because of her jealousy for Ciara.

Good points. I too was rolling my eyes today when Claire was talking about her relationship with Charlie as if they'd been serious for months when in fact they've only been on a few dates and have been rushing the relationship at every turn.  They both come off awkward and desperate more than they do two people who have really gotten to know each other. 

For the sake of entertainment, I kinda hope they follow your idea of Claire understanding and relating with him. Would keep him on canvas and give Claire something better to do than mope around about another failed relationship. Too bad Old Claire wasn't still around so we could see how their 'crazy' works together. 

[FilmTVGeek80]

Another thing about today, I really loved the Tripp/Steve scenes (Lucas Adams and Stephen Nichols really do have great chemistry together) and Steve advising him - based on his own past experiences - not to take matters into his own hands. I'm not sure if it's a little sad, or sketchy, though that Steve could have taken that further and reminded Tripp that Steve has his own rapist brother. I wasn't watching at the time, so I don't know how long it took for Jack and Steve to become close, but I wonder if Steve would actually advise Tripp to forgive Charlie or to get to know him, considering that history.

[rcc]

For the first time I saw some great acting from the new Claire. She is finally making me forget ORK.

[RunningMarket]

Claire, why on earth would your grandparents want to destroy your relationship with Charlie? Seriously girl.

If I were Tripp, I would running around Salem like Mr. Green from the incredibly hilarious movie Clue, "I TOLD YOU I DIDN'T DO IT!"

[Peanut6711]

38 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Another thing about today, I really loved the Tripp/Steve scenes (Lucas Adams and Stephen Nichols really do have great chemistry together) and Steve advising him - based on his own past experiences - not to take matters into his own hands. I'm not sure if it's a little sad, or sketchy, though that Steve could have taken that further and reminded Tripp that Steve has his own rapist brother. I wasn't watching at the time, so I don't know how long it took for Jack and Steve to become close, but I wonder if Steve would actually advise Tripp to forgive Charlie or to get to know him, considering that history.

As a viewer on and off since the early 80s, I saw Jake rape Kayla and the story around it. It was very violent with Kayla screaming 'no' the whole time. Very disturbing (bothered me then and still does as I recollect it), and not any kind of dubious consent like we've seen with some other characters on the show. While Kayla was married to him, she was not attracted to him nor did she ever want to have sex with him.  She was emotionally manipulated into that marriage by both Jack & his adoptive family (as Jack was battling cancer at the time) as well as by Steve who dumped her so she'd marry Jack and give him a will to live. Jack and Steve did not get along even before this, and then their relationship became violent when Steve found out about the rape. Days actually had action/fight scenes back then so Jack being beaten and thrown off the roof by Steve was a dramatic scene. (I can still see Steve screaming, "You filthy pig! You raped her!") Jack had a personal vendetta against Steve and Kayla after that and tried to use his political power to make their life miserable at one point. He came off as entitled (the 'son' of a senator) and reacting as if it all was a blow to his ego.  There were several years where Steve and Jack remained at odds. I suspect Steve's capacity to forgive later on went back to the fact that Steve had felt protective of Jack when they were taken from their abusive home and put into an orphanage as children. (Steve was 5 and Jack was a baby.) Steve definitely grappled with loving his baby brother Billy and reconciling that that innocent child was a corrupt Jack Deveraux as an adult. 

So it will be interesting how the shows deals with Steve/Jack past alongside Tripp/Charlie (provided they even do).  Since they were never together as children, Tripp won't have the nostalgic connection that Steve had with Billy-Jack, but Tripp's personality is overall more laid back than what Steve's was back then as he mentioned today. Other notable differences would be that right now neither are in love with Allie as both were w/Kayla in the 80s.  I think there's more of a psychological angle/motivation that I really hope they explore with Charlie that wasn't there with Jack. Charlie has some serious mommy issues. 

Edited January 12, 2021 by Peanut6711

[Irlandesa]

48 minutes ago, rcc said:

For the first time I saw some great acting from the new Claire. She is finally making me forget ORK.

I've long felt she's a competent/good actress but I couldn't really get a sense of her Claire.  Today was the first day I felt like she really started to own her own version of the character. It's different than OKR's version and I won't completely forget about her but this is also a version I can like and feel for even when the dedication to Charlie she has is relatively weak given how long they've known one another.

20 minutes ago, Peanut6711 said:

I think there's more of a psychological angle/motivation that I really hope they explore with Charlie that wasn't there with Jack. Charlie has some serious mommy issues.

True.  Jack's psychology was related to his daddy issues.  Charlie's is related to Ava.

I can see how Charlie doesn't spend a day behind bars, though.  If the police couldn't go after Tripp for rape, that should equally apply to Charlie.  And I can't see London wanting to touch this one with Allie already having accused Tripp.  I also see Ava dropping charges for kidnapping.

But what I am curious about is why Allie wants so badly for her rapists to acknowledge Henry.  Why do you want him to matter to his father?  You want to share custody?
 

2 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

They never brought Brent back which kind of surprises me because he was a very popular storyline.

I think cast changes were the reason behind them never bringing him back.  Brent's story was mostly associated with Alan-Michael and Lucy.  Rick Hearst left the show a few months after the Brent story wrapped.  They recast his character but wrote off both Lucy and [recast] Alan-Michael when Sonia Satra also decided to leave at the end of her contract a few months after Rick.   There were also the issues with Frank Beatty (Brent) being unable to finish that story because of some sort of illness or breakdown. I don't think we ever got the full story there.  He was scheduled to do one of those soap reunion shows with Rick and Sonia but he ended up being a no show.  In theory, he was going to do a later show but I don't think that ever happened.

[Peanut6711]

5 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

True.  Jack's psychology was related to his daddy issues.  Charlie's is related to Ava.

I can see how Charlie doesn't spend a day behind bars, though.  If the police couldn't go after Tripp for rape, that should equally apply to Charlie.  And I can't see London wanting to touch this one with Allie already having accused Tripp.  I also see Ava dropping charges for kidnapping.

But what I am curious about is why Allie wants so badly for her rapists to acknowledge Henry.  Why do you want him to matter to his father?  You want to share custody?
 

Agree that Jack had daddy issues. There's a funny rant Jack made emotionally one time where he details his twisted history at that point which included that he's the son of both a man who raped his own daughter and a senator who tried to kill his [Jack's] wife.  BUT, Jack didn't know he had daddy issues when he raped Kayla as he hadn't found out he was adopted yet then.  In fact, he kinda idolized Harper as a wonderful man before Harper was revealed to be the Riverfront Knifer.  So while I think Charlie's mommy issues play into his rape of Allie who he doesn't seem to have any romantic interest in, Jack's motivation for rape was his bruised ego over Kayla choosing Steve, a dude w/one eye, many arrests, and little respect in town, over him, the rich and educated guy from a reputable family. 

Now Allie, she's still got some psychological issues to deal with when it comes to Henry. I think she briefly touched on it today. She feels as if Henry is something she didn't want but is stuck with, even if she's slowly coming to love and bond with him, and she wants his father to acknowledge that and admit his responsibility. None the less, she'd be smart to draw up legal papers for Charlie to give up his parental rights while he's still feeling uninterested in parenthood.  Too bad there's only 2 lawyers in town and one of them is bound to show up in the next episode to represent Charlie.  (Will it be Justin or Belle???)  His legal case could be a bit different than Tripp's since he admitted the rape to Ava and if he breaks down and admits it to anyone else. A confession would change things. 

[Silver Raven]

Claire's jacket is very pretty.

I wonder if this is going to damage Claire and Allie's relationship.

 

[Peanut6711]

1 hour ago, RunningMarket said:

If I were Tripp, I would running around Salem like Mr. Green from the incredibly hilarious movie Clue, "I TOLD YOU I DIDN'T DO IT!"

For you:

I love that movie too!

7 minutes ago, Silver Raven said:

I wonder if this is going to damage Claire and Allie's relationship.

If it's more compelling than the two of them sitting around talking about boys like 7th graders, I'd be for it. 

[norcalgal]

1 hour ago, Peanut6711 said:

So it will be interesting how the shows deals with Steve/Jack past alongside Tripp/Charlie (provided they even do).

ITA!!! I can't wait to see how - or if - show brings the past back into the present.  

On a slight tangent:  does anyone know why Jack chose to keep the surname Devereaux?  When Lucas found out who was his "real" father, he changed his name to Horton.  

[Peanut6711]

14 minutes ago, norcalgal said:

ITA!!! I can't wait to see how - or if - show brings the past back into the present.  

On a slight tangent:  does anyone know why Jack chose to keep the surname Devereaux?  When Lucas found out who was his "real" father, he changed his name to Horton.  

I remember thinking back at the time of the Jack is Billy reveal that some day he'd probably be known as Billy Johnson instead of Jack Deveraux.  Seems funny now since that never happened. I might have missed a scene/explanation on why Jack kept the Deveraux name though. I can't recall a conversation/dialogue on it so good question!

[Irlandesa]

18 minutes ago, norcalgal said:

On a slight tangent:  does anyone know why Jack chose to keep the surname Devereaux?  When Lucas found out who was his "real" father, he changed his name to Horton.  

I don't know that it was ever discussed but he was adopted and grew up as a Deveraux.  It's not like his biological father is someone whose name he'd necessarily want to adopt. 

 

[norcalgal]

3 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

I don't know that it was ever discussed but he was adopted and grew up as a Deveraux.  It's not like his biological father is someone whose name he'd necessarily want to adopt. 

 

Well, both of Jack's dads were no great shakes.  One was a murderer and the other was an abusive asshat.  So I guess poor Jack was stuck no matter what name he took...

[Peanut6711]

6 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

I don't know that it was ever discussed but he was adopted and grew up as a Deveraux.  It's not like his biological father is someone whose name he'd necessarily want to adopt. 

 

2 minutes ago, norcalgal said:

Well, both of Jack's dads were no great shakes.  One was a murderer and the other was an abusive asshat.  So I guess poor Jack was stuck no matter what name he took...

THIS! I was thinking the same thing.  Jack might have been better to close his eyes, drop his finger, and pick a name out of the phone book LOL  Unless there's a conversation that explains his rationale, I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't still a social class thing that Jack hadn't fully gotten past. Though in the real world, people are more likely to remember a US Senator convicted as a serial killer after his murderous spree and rant to 'cleanse the world' than a low-life man who beat his wife and raped his daughter. One sadly happens probably too frequently and makes local news; the other would be historical and make national.  Seems like Harper would be harder to live down than Duke from a public sentiment standpoint.  

[CanaryFan98]

3 hours ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Claire's motivation was pretty plainly stated today in that she wants to believe Charlie is a good person and that she knows him because he's the first person who has loved her unconditionally (though I wonder about that. I wasn't watching when her and Theo first got together, but she was relatively normal then and he liked who she was. It was only when she got crazier and started doing stupid things that he broke up with her.) But I still find it eye-roll worthy how she keeps talking about how well she knows him and how he couldn't possibly have done it. They've only known each other a short time and just started dating. She knew Tripp for a lot longer and was quickly willing to believe he was Allie's rapist even before the DNA test. I can sympathize with her in some way because she finally has someone who has chosen her, but it's hard to feel too much sympathy or investment given the relatively short nature of this relationship.

Though, I was thinking about this the other day, and I wonder if they are setting this up for Claire to forgive him. If there's anyone on the canvas who would understand Charlie's motivation in being crazy jealous of a relative, it would be Claire. She went insane because of her jealousy for Ciara.

Theo had a crush on Ciara but it was one sided as she wanted Chad at the time. Theo then moved onto Claire but he wanted Ciara first. Ciara wrote him a letter saying she loved him before she went to Hong Kong with Shelle which Claire kept from him for a good while. Course they rewrote the whole thing as if Ciara wanted Theo and Claire stole him from her etc even though Theo was with Claire and Ciara wanted to stake her claim via letter. Nobody except Claire seemed to point out how wrong Ciara was for that. 

[wurdalak]

I had to laugh at Tripp saying that Charlie should have no objection to a DNA test if he is innocent. Which is exactly what got him into a self-righteous huff just a few weeks ago, puffing that everyone should take him at his word and that the very idea of a DNA test was insulting. Either the writers chose do depict him as dumb, or they are just glossing over such details in order the advance the rape plot.

So Nicole missed her first opportunity to apologise to Tripp.

John had plenty of time to tell Claire about Ava being tied up in Charlie's apartment during a rather awkward pause that occurred during their exchange; either the scene was badly directed or one of the actors missed their cue.

But it is a common trope in soaps that people miss an obvious opportunity to tell each other the crucial information needed or do not listen to the other person. For example, If Marlena had told Ben about the suspicions regarding Charlie, perhaps he would no have let him slip out so casually.

Claire may be heading back to cuckoo-land.

Especially if Charlie sticks around; he does have a lot of potential, including his paternity of Henry: months and months of conflict and angst to be expected.

Edited January 13, 2021 by wurdalak

[Thatoneshow]

I never liked the rape story and hoped that all speculations about it were wrong until spoilers came. But now it is like everything is starting all over, just with Charlie instead of Tripp. Allie confronting him, maybe John will punch him. Everyone will hate him. Great.

I can't help but think it is a little gross that they decided to have the rapist be the hated son. He doesn't belong to Steve and Ava hates him so its ok if he is the bad guy so Ava's "golden" child is safe. Charlie being the rapist only solves Tripp's problem. Allie is still in the same position, if not worse. If Ava gets a burst of motherly love or Charlie blackmails her, she may not press charges. So Charlie skirts prison and now he decides he wants to be in his childs life. I don't want Ava, also a rapist, to be the hero in this story. She doesn't deserve it. I don't want Kayla being made to feel like she owes Ava something.

1 hour ago, wurdalak said:

I had to laugh at Tripp saying that Charlie should have no objection to a DNA test if he is innocent. Which is exactly what got him into a self-righteous huff just a few weeks ago, puffing that everyone should take him at his word and that the very idea of a DNA test was insulting. Either the writers chose do depict him as dumb, or they are just glossing over such details in order the advance the rape plot.

They were hoping we forgot that they had to go behind his back for a DNA test because he objected.

[nilyank]

3 hours ago, norcalgal said:

ITA!!! I can't wait to see how - or if - show brings the past back into the present.  

On a slight tangent:  does anyone know why Jack chose to keep the surname Devereaux?  When Lucas found out who was his "real" father, he changed his name to Horton.  

Lucas found out he was a Horton but he didn't change his name for YEARS. When he finally did change, it was because he was upset with Kate and wanted to have nothing to do with her. It was around the time came back from Mexico intent on breaking up Sami and Lucas' who were going to get married much to Kate's displeasure. It may have been after the twins were born.

Edited January 13, 2021 by nilyank

[Peanut6711]

16 minutes ago, Thatoneshow said:

They were hoping we forgot that they had to go behind his back for a DNA test because he objected.

I was kinda surprised Steve didn't just go over to Charlie's apartment and "borrow" his toothbrush. 

[Frozendiva]

How do Allie and Claire simply walk in to an interrogation room to interrogate a suspect? They have zero business being there.

No, Allie, Charlie is not going to admit to anything. He is innocent til proven guilty and will most likely not admit to anything unless he is forced to do so. He will probably even fight getting a DNA test to prove paternity. What do you want from him? To admit that he attacked you? That is it? Do you want child support from him? Shared custody? That he signs a document to have no parental rights? You didn't even want Henry.

Claire, Charlie will also be the sweet boyfriend of yours. You do notice how much he adjusts his glasses when he lies, right?

Marlena maybe should have given Ben some idea that Charlie is not a good person and to keep an eye on him. Or maybe she figured he'd use his Spidey Sense to do so.

Had no idea Belle and Shawn went on any sort of honeymoon. Why? And now he has to go back to work?

Why was Nicole allowed to question Ava? And then tell Allie what she learned? That should not happen until there are actual charges. And maybe say something to Tripp, Nicky. Apologize. Ava is still out of it and Nicole has no idea if she is being truthful or is in a drugged state.

Yeah, Tripp, you consented to the DNA test? LOL.

[DaphneCat]

Boy does the Salem PD have great security!  No one, and I mean NO ONE can get in without authorization.  I was waiting for several random people, who had ALL been told about Charlie by Rafe, to walk in and start having a conversation.  I'm surprised some random dude didn't walk in with take out.

And Claire, do you really think that if Charlie was guilty he would simply tell you?  Are you REALLY that stupid?

Have to admit, I really like watching Charlie cold bloodedly lie to both Allie and Claire.  He had potential to be a great villain.  Too bad they wrote him in to such a corner.

[Frozendiva]

Claire wants to believe. Charlie is the first guy she has had anything to do with since Bayview Times. He understands her, she isn't a leftover or a second choice. It's good that she knows, because she could easily become his next target.

[bunnyblue]

Yeesh, simmer down, Claire. She's been dating Charlie for 3 months (tops) but she's acting like he's her soulmate and that she knows everything there is to know about him and therefore everyone else is wrong about him. I was especially annoyed at her for going off on her grandparents when they've been in her corner since she was released from Bayview. I'm glad she settled down by the end of the episode and, while still weepy, seems willing to listen to some hard truths. 

I'm also annoyed that neither Kayla or Nicole showed any remorse or shame when they saw Tripp at the hospital. I was like "WTF?!" when Kayla's first thought after Steve told her Charlie could be Allie's rapist was "poor Claire". What about "poor Tripp", who's been threatened and labeled a rapist by half the town based (partly) on Kayla's crappy DNA test that she insisted could not be wrong & was proof enough of his guilt. And there goes Nicole, AGAIN, demanding that Rafe get a young man to admit what he did to Allie. Yes we know Charlie is guilty, but Nicole doesn't but that doesn't stop her from basically judging and convicting another young man based on faulty memories, feelings, and circumstantial evidence. I get that she wants to be supportive of Allie but Nicole makes things worse with her meddling. And since she now is so sure Charlie is the rapist, where the hell is her apology to Tripp?? I won't hold my breath and neither should Tripp.  

Edited January 13, 2021 by bunnyblue

[FilmTVGeek80]

28 minutes ago, bunnyblue said:

I'm also annoyed that neither Kayla or Nicole showed any remorse or shame when they saw Tripp at the hospital. I was like "WTF?!" when Kayla's first thought after Steve told her Charlie could be Allie's rapist was "poor Claire". What about "poor Tripp", who's been threatened and labeled a rapist by half the town based (partly) on Kayla's crappy DNA test that she insisted could not be wrong & was proof enough of his guilt.

Yeah, Kayla's blasé attitude with Steve annoyed me a lot. Maybe she's waiting for more confirmation of Charlie's guilt, but she didn't seem to experience much remorse that she could have been so horribly wrong and accused him of something so heinous, even going so far as to having Steve kick him out of the house.

[enchantingmonkey]

5 hours ago, wurdalak said:

Which is exactly what got him into a self-righteous huff just a few weeks ago, puffing that everyone should take him at his word and that the very idea of a DNA test was insulting. Either the writers chose do depict him as dumb, or they are just glossing over such details in order the advance the rape plot.

The human mind is ripe with potential for hypocrisy.  You don't have to look that hard to find it.  I didn't see it as writing Tripp as dumb but, rather, a flawed human being a hypocrite.  It made me chuckle when he said it.

 

Another vote for today being, possibly, the first episode where I appreciated Isabel Durant's performance as Claire, and didn't imagine how every scene would have been played by ORK.  

2 hours ago, Frozendiva said:

Why was Nicole allowed to question Ava? And then tell Allie what she learned? That should not happen until there are actual charges. And maybe say something to Tripp, Nicky. Apologize. Ava is still out of it and Nicole has no idea if she is being truthful or is in a drugged state.

It made me wonder if they were setting up possible complications down the road with Ava clearly not being in her right mind as she told Nicole what happened, and Nicole now thinking she has discovered the truth.  It felt similar to Nicole deciding that Allie's drunken memories of the night she was raped were the truth.  We believe what we want to believe, especially if it's convenient.  

36 minutes ago, bunnyblue said:

I get that she wants to be supportive to Allie but Nicole makes things worse with her meddling. And since she now is so sure Charlie is the rapist, where the hell is her apology to Tripp?? I won't hold my breath and neither should Tripp.  

Perhaps she is behaving more like the old Nicole than I have been giving her credit for.  

[Frozendiva]

9 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Yeah, Kayla's blasé attitude with Steve annoyed me a lot. Maybe she's waiting for more confirmation of Charlie's guilt, but she didn't seem to experience much remorse that she could have been so horribly wrong and accused him of something so heinous, even going so far as to having Steve kick him out of the house.

For Steve’s sake, she could have been a bit more objective and helped Steve and Tripp figure out why he ‘shared’ DNA. Even if she did not believe Tripp.

[peachmangosteen]

I personally don't give a shit whether anyone apologizes to Tripp or not. Also, speaking of Tripp, his hair is so high. It delights me lol.

I thought ID was fantastic yesterday. Even though it makes little sense for Claire to be all 'CHARLIE LOVES ME!' already, ID sold me on it tbh.

I kinda hate that they seem to be going for Charlie just being like a sociopath now. Well, on one hand I don't mind because I'm interested to see what MM does with it but I was still hoping they could make Charlie a viable long term character. Now I'm afraid I'll just end up hating him.