S06.E17: The Train

[maggiemae]

Thing is Jack put Rebecca and Miguel in a bar to become friends. Before kids (?).

IMO it should have been Miguel to escort Rebecca through the train. He knew her, the kids, and married her. 

Rebecca was the love of his life and his favorite person in the world. 

IMO Miguel would have gladly escorted Rebecca to Jack through the train. Never did we see Miguel feel lesser than Jack...nor that he did not know Jack was her great love.

[sashabear21]

Too many emotions right now, but I can say if I had to watch a very emotional episode, that I'm glad I got to watch Dule Hill for at least part of it to ease the pain. I'm shallow and he's very pretty. Also I went glasses frame shopping with my husband last weekend and if he'd picked out the horrible frames that Randall was wearing, I might have filed for divorce. I want a red dress and a nice train with small things with meaningful stories behind them on the train for my grandmother when it's time to say goodbye. 

[bros402]

great episode, but I laughed my ass off when Dule Hill bumped into Jack.

why the hell was Jack out of his bed GETTING COFFEE when he was in for smoke inhalation? They should've been keeping him in the bed and on an IV, not having caffeine

[UsernameFatigue]

2 hours ago, Tango64 said:

When they first showed the family that had the car crash, I was so confused trying to figure out who they were, past, present, or future.

Then I started thinking surely they wouldn’t introduce an entirely new family to the story at this point. Now??? This late??? Surely not!

FFS, this show. They did. 

It's one of the reasons I have never been a devoted fan or even viewer of this show. Too much time wasted on random people. Like you, I was watching the opening and trying to figure out who the characters were. I finally turned to hubby and said "I have no idea who these people are". So annoying when the series is almost over to waste time on their storyline. 

I am not sure I understand why Randall and Beth were so happy about Deja being pregnant, given that she is just starting her residency, and Malik works so many hours at his restaurant that he is never home. Also made me wonder about his child who would be about 12 at this point? (Can't remember if she was about two when he went to Harvard?). Seems like he has his hands full already. 

[debraran]

A lot of people talked about Easter eggs on train. Two Mandy mentioned I might have missed or my memory of the post is not good. the "Taboo" game was there, the growth chart from the kitchen in the Pearson house. I don't remember the growth chart but wasn't deliberately seeking things. 

Mandy gave interview to EW and I was surprised when asked if she liked Dr K the best, Miguel or William etc. she never mentioned Miguel in her explanations. At first I was like he isn't getting any respect from her either, lol, but then I thought, maybe she wouldn't have written it that way and just ignored it.

I normally didn't mind strange new people being introduced either to find out it was another long lost relative or someone younger, but 2 episodes left and we get Marcus in lab, talking to boss, the clock is ticking and they do this? We have precious few minutes left and the only reason other than not wanting to show the main cast for some reason, Randall's kids, Sophie and Nicky and Toby etc. is that Dan really does have a plan just in his head to give these actors some spinoff a year or two from now if interest is there. I don't know if it would be, fans were more interested in the Big 3 and he might get a drop in now and then, but they'd have to be pretty strong to carry a show. Time will tell. If it was just to do it, thought it was cool, obviously many fans didn't think so. When he showed the hospital scene I was like "What is this? Why Dan, why". We needed to watch Jack die again in another version?

 

Edited May 19, 2022 by debraran

[Crs97]

A poster in another thread said that when the cast recently appeared at a big interview for the final season, someone asked what would happen if Rebecca met both Miguel and Jack in heaven.  The actor playing Toby exclaimed that was the best question of the night, and Mandy had both Milo and Jon stand up, linking arms with both of them.  Apparently the place erupted in applause.  It wasn’t hard, writers.

[circumvent]

On 5/17/2022 at 10:23 PM, cardigirl said:

I thought the episode was pretty clear. Like everyone else, I thought the researcher was the father of Deja's baby until Malik showed up in the end, and I'm not mad about it. But at no time was I confused about the family in the car accident, or who all those people were. 

I loved the idea of Rebecca revisiting her life by going through all the cars in the train with William. I have to admit, this episode made me cry. I think the writers did a pretty good job of showing life is a circle.

And the seasons, they go round and round
And the painted ponies go up and down
We're captive on the carousel of time
We can't return, we can only look
Behind, from where we came
And go round and round and round, in the circle game

Loved that Kevin's painting was there too. That episode from the first season is one of my favorites. 

I'm off to have a good cry!

Exactly how I felt so thanks fro writing this, no wI don't have to.

The writers always did well with the connections and this episode was no different. 

Circle Game is my Joni Mitchell favorite too so that's a bonus.

Do I wish there was more Miguel? Yes, but I am not mad because the train was moving fast and Rebecca needed to keep going. Also interesting, she seemed to be moving to the back of the train, in the opposite direction that the train was going. Just a small, nuanced detail that doesn't need explanations. 

The casting department deserves a special award for what they did with this show. The choice of actors to play child or adult versions of the siblings was so perfect, and the actors who played them also deserve kudos. In this episode it was the actress playing Deja. 

[JudyObscure]

7 hours ago, mostlylurking said:

One small nitpick..they didn’t seem to age Sofie or Madison at all. Philip neither really, just gave him a mustache.

They all had the jaw lines of twenty year olds.  Gray hair and frumpy sweaters do not old people make.

[cameron]

On 5/17/2022 at 11:28 PM, Lovecat said:

 

That’s what I thought was going to happen.  I actually didn’t realize little Kate was little Kate, and thought they for some reason were showing Kyle as a child. Derp.

SAME…and I just now remembered that I did indeed record New Amsterdam!

 

Thank you!!

Anyone else notice that Dr. K was polishing a glass behind the bar with a Terrible Towel, and that Jack’s coffee mugs (World’s Best Dad, with his picture on it, as well as one from Lundy, the company where he worked) were on display on shelves behind the bar?  Makes me wonder what other Easter eggs I missed…good thing I didn’t delete the episode!

Edited May 19, 2022 by cameron

[Johnny Dollar]

Alternative script idea that didn’t make the cut:

Kate - Hi mom. It’s me Kate. Bug. Your favorite. I would’ve been here sooner, but after my speech in Davos, George and Amal insisted we go back to the villa for some drinks. Neither one of them could keep their hands off me and I just wasn’t in the mood for a threesome. Luckily Brad rescued me and we jetted down to the Vatican for a quick late night snack. Mom, the pope is just the nicest guy! He couldn’t stop apologizing for being chosen over Randall. Queen Camila insisted that I take the royal jet and spend the night at Buckingham Palace. Charles is kind of a drip, but Cam and I were up hours going over script ideas for Kevin’s remakes of all of Shakespeare’s plays. We really think reimagining Lady Macbeth as a misunderstood late bloomer is going to be a massive hit, and everyone loved my idea of a Fast and Furious take on Hamlet. I just hope Vin Diesel Jr can clear his schedule. I got an early plane this morning, but of course the engines started failing. Luckily Dad’s stories to us about working in a gas station back in the 60s really came in handy. Changing out multiple hydraulic pumps at 35,000 feet isn’t as hard as it sounds. Then, to top it off, the entire flight crew ordered the fish so I had to land the plane. Again! I parked it on the roof of that little Chinese place in town, so I don’t think we’ll be able to get the Orange Chicken for a while. Anyway. Enough about me. You can go ahead and die now. 

[circumvent]

8 hours ago, mostlylurking said:

One small nitpick..they didn’t seem to age Sofie or Madison at all

I thought Madison was aged, I could see that. I agree with you on Sophie

[Blakeston]

3 minutes ago, Johnny Dollar said:

Alternative script idea that didn’t make the cut:

Kate - Hi mom. It’s me Kate. Bug. Your favorite. I would’ve been here sooner, but after my speech in Davos, George and Amal insisted we go back to the villa for some drinks. Neither one of them could keep their hands off me and I just wasn’t in the mood for a threesome. Luckily Brad rescued me and we jetted down to the Vatican for a quick late night snack. Mom, the pope is just the nicest guy! He couldn’t stop apologizing for being chosen over Randall. Queen Camila insisted that I take the royal jet and spend the night at Buckingham Palace. Charles is kind of a drip, but Cam and I were up hours going over script ideas for Kevin’s remakes of all of Shakespeare’s plays. We really think reimagining Lady Macbeth as a misunderstood late bloomer is going to be a massive hit, and everyone loved my idea of a Fast and Furious take on Hamlet. I just hope Vin Diesel Jr can clear his schedule. I got an early plane this morning, but of course the engines started failing. Luckily Dad’s stories to us about working in a gas station back in the 60s really came in handy. Changing out multiple hydraulic pumps at 35,000 feet isn’t as hard as it sounds. Then, to top it off, the entire flight crew ordered the fish so I had to land the plane. Again! I parked it on the roof of that little Chinese place in town, so I don’t think we’ll be able to get the Orange Chicken for a while. Anyway. Enough about me. You can go ahead and die now. 

You win the internet today! The Airplane! reference ("the entire flight crew ordered the fish") was the cherry on top.

[cameron]

19 hours ago, BC4ME said:

Me too. And I have to say I just gasped out loud and ugly cried over Beth's whole speech. The rest was a let down I wasn't expecting after that.

Maybe I'm just an asshole. Or maybe it was the mood I was in or my expectations, but I spent a lot of this episode being annoyed instead of sad. Mostly over the Marcus family business and how she basically just ran by Miguel on the train. And that stupid lemonade out of lemons thing was cringey for me. 

I think the train idea was a good one but could've been better executed.

Most of my complaints have already been voiced here so I'll just say that I'm normally a big softie who cries easily and this just didn't hit home for me at all. In contrast, I loved the Miguel episode.

I'm sure this episode had many well done parts I'm under appreciating right now because of my over all irritation over parts of it. I'm sure the cast, crew, director and writers all worked very hard on this episode and there was a lot of pressure to do it justice. It appears there were many people who loved it. 

As an aside, Chrissy Metz has certainly seemed more athletic and light on her feet for the past few episodes than I would've guessed. Good for her if she's getting in better shape.   

Actually, thought that Chrissy Metz looked larger than ever in this show.

[Cristofle]

7 hours ago, UsernameFatigue said:

I am not sure I understand why Randall and Beth were so happy about Deja being pregnant, given that she is just starting her residency, and Malik works so many hours at his restaurant that he is never home.

Well, Deja was smiling when she told Randall, so she gave off the impression of being happy. She's an adult at this point. She's gone through medical school. She has a job. As long as she's happy about it, I imagine Beth and Randall will be happy about it.

[Aloeonatable]

3 hours ago, Crs97 said:

A poster in another thread said that when the cast recently appeared at a big interview for the final season, someone asked what would happen if Rebecca met both Miguel and Jack in heaven.  The actor playing Toby exclaimed that was the best question of the night, and Mandy had both Milo and Jon stand up, linking arms with both of them.  Apparently the place erupted in applause.  It wasn’t hard, writers.

As was mentioned up thread, the Rebecca in the train car passing through her life was a young Rebecca. She wouldn't have related to Miguel romantically. She was glad to see him, but she ended with her love, Jack. 

[mostlylurking]

18 hours ago, PRgal said:

Considering how long it takes to get to that kind of award winning level, it's unlikely he would have developed a drug that Rebecca was supposed to be part of a trial for in 2020 or so. 

Yeah, I kinda thought the part where Marcus gets the award for the Alzheimer’s treatment was post-Rebecca dying. I was thinking the scene with him and his siblings in the diner was happening at the time of Rebecca’s death. I don’t think his research helped Rebecca, but obviously helped others in the future.

[peeayebee]

It was Jack who took the kids to see Mister Rogers Neighborhood, so why would the trolley car be in Rebecca's memories?

Edited May 19, 2022 by peeayebee

[Cristofle]

8 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

It was Jack who took the kids to see Mister Rogers Neighborhood, so why would the trolley car be in Rebecca's memories?

She's talked about taking train rides with her father as a child and how much she loved it. Also, she had that whole thing at the beginning of the season where she couldn't remember the word "Caboose". 

[Madding crowd]

10 hours ago, madmax said:

There was a trolley from Mister Rogers' Neighborhood.

Although, there are some mighty pissed off Steeler fans.  You don't use the Terrible Towel (TM) as, you know, an actual towel.  😄

I thought they kept her out of the flash forward teases in case she lost the weight or God forbid,  passed away.  Then they had to come up with some reason for her to be late.  And they chose the absolute best one...  🙄

To Deja:  "If you keep touching your belly, everyone will know you're pregnant" or something along those lines.  That's it.

 

I guess I'm a cold-hearted bitch, because I have never cried during this show, not Miguel's episode, not Jack dying, not this one.  I appreciated them all, but they didn't move me  anywhere near tears.

I liked William being the one to lead her thru her life.  Maybe because her life was so wrapped up in her children and William was there, more or less, when she had her children.  I hated her waiting for Kate before she passed because they had such a special relationship.  Please.

The casting for this show really is fantastic.  All the adult children really did look like and have the same speech patterns as their younger versions.  Especially Deja and Malik.  Unbelievable.  The only notable issue is the casting of Jack, but I totally understand that they are using blind actors and there is a limited pool.

Kate is one of her children, why wouldn’t she want to wait for her? Most people love all their kids and would want to say goodbye to them if they could. I also think she said goodbye to all her grandchildren even if it wasn’t shown.

[nlkm9]

9 hours ago, maggiemae said:

Thing is Jack put Rebecca and Miguel in a bar to become friends. Before kids (?).

IMO it should have been Miguel to escort Rebecca through the train. He knew her, the kids, and married her. 

Rebecca was the love of his life and his favorite person in the world. 

IMO Miguel would have gladly escorted Rebecca to Jack through the train. Never did we see Miguel feel lesser than Jack...nor that he did not know Jack was her great love.

Miguel as her escort through the train would have been absolutley wonderful. That and kates magical international cirriculum were the only negatives for me. But it was well done. 

[A.Ham]

18 hours ago, GeorgiaRai said:

I think Rebecca looked & acted unusual because the circumstances were unusual!  This wasn't Rebecca on a train; it was Rebecca's mind creating images based on reality and fantasy.  The wide-eyed wonder seemed appropriate to me, especially considering how long her dementia has had her locked away.  And her clothing and make up was IMO, a projection of what she saw as her most beautiful self.  It wasn't meant to look natural, because the whole experience was supernatural.

I liked this take about Miguel (from Reddit but shared by Good Housekeeping, which who knew was still a thing?)

• I feel like a lot of people are missing the fact that all of this was going on inside Rebecca’s head, in the mind of someone with Alzheimer’s. In a way, she’s her own unreliable narrator, and her recollection of the last few years of her life is unfortunately non-existent. She’s not the late 70s-aged version of herself; she’s Rebecca at her prime. All of the people she sees actually manifest as they would have been at that time. Of course Miguel gets short shrift - he was only ever Jack’s friend in the time frame in which she sees herself. The big three appear as adults, but her flash of recognition seems more palpable when she sees them as children and young adults. William symbolizes the confusion and self-flagellation that came with keeping secrets from Randal, and in her last moments, he (and the doctor) permit her to forgive herself for her life’s mistakes. I think his was incredibly well handled. I’m not sure if people really were expecting the metaphorical “life flashing before her eyes”, because what they got was something significant and profound: a woman, at the end of her life, forgiving herself and being forgiven.

Fair enough. And I presume the writers were working from the perspective that Alzheimer's patients can preserve long-term memories better than recent history. Usually the memories that fade the easiest are the ones right after diagnosis, so if you ask them what year it is, they can say the year of their diagnosis or the two or three years prior--even though you could be 8 or ten years forward. I am trying not to overgeneralize, but usually their most vivid memories are from the youngest years, which is childhood and young adulthood, so I can give them that point.

Here comes the nitpick, though, for me: with dementia, the brain is the first to go. I am not sure that her memories would be that intact while on her deathbed. End-stage dementia patients can be so affected that their brain forgets key functions, let alone have somewhat coherent thoughts--like being able to see the important people in your life in your last moments, or even hold on waiting for your daughter to say her goodbye. Some dementia patients are placed on feeding tubes because they forget how to swallow. That is just one example of how severely the brain is affected.

If they had used any other diagnosis that would not involve early cognitive decline, I would be completely and fully on-board with that theory and think it would have worked beautifully.  They could have followed that track with any type of cancer or other terminal illness. I, however, cannot connect to that theory just based on my life experience. I get the show can't please everyone and some people would really prefer to avoid the ugly or devastating parts of the disease.

Yeah, I know, long rant... this just hits a little too close to home.

[Ohiopirate02]

27 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

It was Jack who took the kids to see Mister Rogers Neighborhood, so why would the trolley car be in Rebecca's memories?

The Big 3 are Gen-Xers from Pittsburgh.  They watched Mr. Rogers Neighborhood every day on PBS for years.  That show would have been what Rebecca turned on to distract the kids for 40 minutes every weekday while she did laundry, washed dishes, went to the bathroom, etc.  Jack may have been the one who took the kids to a taping, but it was still a part of the Pearson childhood.

[PRgal]

48 minutes ago, mostlylurking said:

Yeah, I kinda thought the part where Marcus gets the award for the Alzheimer’s treatment was post-Rebecca dying. I was thinking the scene with him and his siblings in the diner was happening at the time of Rebecca’s death. I don’t think his research helped Rebecca, but obviously helped others in the future.

So many people are confused at the timeline though.  I blame the writers for this.  Not everyone is smart enough to realize (Marcus is probably 33 right now)!!  I mean, Kate and Toby are still married in the present-present!  They divorce next year.  Heh.  

[NoReally]

When Rebecca got to the caboose, I thought that maybe both Jack and Miguel would end up in bed with her.

But then I realized the show wouldn't imply an afterlife three-way. 

[Cristofle]

11 minutes ago, PRgal said:

So many people are confused at the timeline though.  I blame the writers for this.  Not everyone is smart enough to realize (Marcus is probably 33 right now)!!  I mean, Kate and Toby are still married in the present-present!  They divorce next year.  Heh.  

Yeah, the show has really rushed the timeline in the past few episodes, beginning with Kate's divorce, I think. They jumped ahead to Kate's wedding, then moved pretty quickly over the next couple episodes through Rebecca's decline and Miguel's death, to catch up to Rebecca's death. It's led to some confusion. 

[Pallas]

Quote

When Rebecca got to the caboose, I thought that maybe both Jack and Miguel would end up in bed with her.

It's her deathbed, and she's alone in it except for the voices of her  children, until she  passes. That's when she turns and can see Jack, for the first time in more than thirty years. She begins again.

[SunnyBeBe]

16 hours ago, Trillian said:

Wow. My beloved cousin died suddenly of a heart attack just this week, and your description of what must’ve happened - his wife described the efforts to save him as heroic - is hitting hard. Thank you for the last paragraph - I’m glad she wouldn’t have seen the worst of it. 

I guess this highlights the clumsy way they shoehorned Dr Marcus into the story. The whole circle of life with one dead and one saved in 20 minutes does sound like a total fail. What didn’t work for me (glaring on the rewatch I was able to do this afternoon) is Jack’s lemonade speech. It worked for Dr K, because the lemonade was baby Randall and, to be blunt, Kyle was already dead and the worst had already happened. But Jack told a father who was concerned about his son’s surviving surgery to make the best of a bad situation. He’s lucky the dad didn’t haul off and belt him. Time and place, Jack. 
 

Good point about the speech.  Because Jack is so perfect, whatever he says is sacred. 🙄 I’m not as impressed with the writers of this show as most.  

[Jeddah]

20 hours ago, DanaK said:

Once thing I'm confused about in regards to Deja being pregnant, if this episode was 10 years from the present, why is she only now getting pregnant for the first time and the first of Randall's kids having a baby? You would think within those 10 years, Deja at least would have had a baby before then given she was at least 18 in our present. If she became a doctor as I recall, maybe going to med school and establishing herself had her put off motherhood

The national average age for first time mothers is 26, and trending upwards. Ten years from now it will be even higher. Twenty eight is not at all unusual to be having a first baby. In general the Pearson haven’t had kids young. Randall and Beth were the youngest when they had Tess at 28. Kate was late 30’s, Kevin early 40’s. Rebecca was 30 and Jack was 36. But then there’s Malik who became a parent at 15, but technically he’s not  a Pearson! 

[peeayebee]

36 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

The Big 3 are Gen-Xers from Pittsburgh.  They watched Mr. Rogers Neighborhood every day on PBS for years.  That show would have been what Rebecca turned on to distract the kids for 40 minutes every weekday while she did laundry, washed dishes, went to the bathroom, etc.  Jack may have been the one who took the kids to a taping, but it was still a part of the Pearson childhood.

That may be; however, I'm sure the show put the Mr Rogers trolley car in there because of the episode where Jack took them to see it. I watched Barney with my son when he was growing up, but it would be really weird if there was a Barney figure in my death-bed memories.

[Violetgoblin6]

16 hours ago, debraran said:

i didn't ether but Miguel episode got me.  A couple who do reviews on youtube (MATT/JESS) felt the same way, tears with Miguel but nothing last night. Made me feel better that I didn't miss something but we all respond differently.  Seeing her bug eyed on the train, beautiful and glowing, but she seemed trying to hard to seem surprised and slightly confused. We all have different views of afterlife but I would hope when you transition or die, if you believe, you are healed, you are able to see and know things you didn't before. She seemed stuck in some ways and if that's how they wanted to play it, fine, but it didn't move me as much.

I was moved by Beth's speech, being a mom, she hit on real truths. The boys said what you would expect to their mom and it was touching but nothing was overly profound. I loved Toby's line and not quite sure why Madison brought up her "other bridal shower" and stripper. lol

I hope they scatter her ashes under the 2 trees her husband's liked and/or planted and maybe we can see them again. I KNOW we'll see a lot more Jack.

 

Yes. I think in my case I expected so so much. The whole Mandy Moore throwing up thing and Chrissy Metz being devastated. I cried for Miguel and last week. I didn't really cry this week. 

 

I do have a question: why was Rebecca looking above Beth and at the light behind her, during Beth's speech?

Edited May 19, 2022 by Violetgoblin6
forgot something

[PRgal]

1 hour ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

The Big 3 are Gen-Xers from Pittsburgh.  They watched Mr. Rogers Neighborhood every day on PBS for years.  That show would have been what Rebecca turned on to distract the kids for 40 minutes every weekday while she did laundry, washed dishes, went to the bathroom, etc.  Jack may have been the one who took the kids to a taping, but it was still a part of the Pearson childhood.

To be accurate, the Big 3, like me, are what many call Xennials, born in the last year of what is often consider GenX.  We were in middle school during the height of grunge, so old enough to dress that way but not old enough to go to a Nirvana concert unless our parents were verrrry, verrrry nice.  Our lockers and bedrooms probably had pin ups of Jason Priestley or Luke Perry (RIP) and NKOTB (Joey!!!!) for us straight gals and we played with Jem dolls!  Many boys (and this girl) wanted or had (so jealous of you, Kevin Pearson!) Gameboys and kids, regardless of gender, wanted Teddy Ruxpin (my parents thought he was a waste of $$$ since you had to buy tapes separately).  We didn’t watch Barney though.  Definitely Mr. Rogers and Mr. Dressup (if you’re Canadian or live close to the border)!!  
 

ETA:  I’m actually a year older than the Big 3 but still an Xennial.  Years tend to be 1977-1983

Edited May 19, 2022 by PRgal

[3 is enough]

I will say they got Rebecca’s last days right.  

My mother was taken to the hospital because she was not able to swallow and was very weak.  This was on a Wednesday. On Thursday the nurse told my brother that there was not much time.  We are scattered all over Canada and the US and started making our arrangements.  I got to the hospital Sunday morning (slowed down by Covid testing requirements).  She was asleep but woke up for a few minutes and knew I was there. We went back a couple of times a day for the next few days but she never woke up again.  I really don’t know if she heard us when we spoke to her at that point- there was no response at all. We got a call on  early Wednesday morning that she had passed.

While the show did gloss over the messier aspects of Alzheimer’s, they got the end right.

[mostlylurking]

51 minutes ago, Violetgoblin6 said:

I do have a question: why was Rebecca looking above Beth and at the light behind her, during Beth's speech?

She was looking at the speaker.  What Beth was saying to her at her bedside was coming through on the speakers in the train.  I thought that was a great touch and an acknowledgment that hopefully our loved ones can still hear us even if they can’t let us know.

[smartymarty]

10 hours ago, UsernameFatigue said:

It's one of the reasons I have never been a devoted fan or even viewer of this show. Too much time wasted on random people. Like you, I was watching the opening and trying to figure out who the characters were. I finally turned to hubby and said "I have no idea who these people are". So annoying when the series is almost over to waste time on their storyline. 

I am not sure I understand why Randall and Beth were so happy about Deja being pregnant, given that she is just starting her residency, and Malik works so many hours at his restaurant that he is never home. Also made me wonder about his child who would be about 12 at this point? (Can't remember if she was about two when he went to Harvard?). Seems like he has his hands full already. 

I said at the time that all we fans would complain about the intro of new characters in the 2d to last episode.... Also, the show not having Malik at the PA house so that we'd think that Marcus was Deja's husband. (I missed them saying that Malik worked at a restaurant. So again, he went to Harvard to do that? No culinary school? Maybe he just runs it, isn't the chef.)

12 hours ago, maggiemae said:

IMO Miguel would have gladly escorted Rebecca to Jack through the train. Never did we see Miguel feel lesser than Jack...nor that he did not know Jack was her great love.

I think this would have been so much more beautiful -- Miguel bringing her back to her Jack. Though I must say, I don't understand Rebecca and Jack being "the greatest love story." They met in a bar, dated, married, had kids, he died." Nothing unusual there.

5 hours ago, circumvent said:

Do I wish there was more Miguel? Yes, but I am not mad because the train was moving fast and Rebecca needed to keep going.

But it was the writers' decision to have the train moving fast at that point.

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Good point about the speech.  Because Jack is so perfect, whatever he says is sacred. 🙄 I’m not as impressed with the writers of this show as most.  

And it's not like Jack originated the "lemonade from lemons" saying. They make it seem so wise (except for Marcus and his siblings laughing about it). I thought the same thing about it not really applying to Marcus's dad's situation. "Your son may die, but you'll be able to make something good out of that." (Which raises the question, did Rebecca and the Big 3 ever make lemonade from Jack's death? Oh no, they never forgot it....)

[UsernameFatigue]

3 hours ago, Cristofle said:

Well, Deja was smiling when she told Randall, so she gave off the impression of being happy. She's an adult at this point. She's gone through medical school. She has a job. As long as she's happy about it, I imagine Beth and Randall will be happy about it.

I never mentioned in my post about Deja's happiness, I specifically referred to Randall and Beth. Most parents I know would be concerned about what their child (at any age) is about to encounter, having a child at the same time as putting in the long hours (60-80 hrs per week) of a medical residency. Even if Randall did not want to express that concern to Deja, I find it unrealistic that Randall and Beth would not do that between themselves. But then again the ending of this series is being rushed, and in a magical world where Kate is in England presenting her one-of-a-kind curriculum, it isn't a surprise that the writers didn't go there. 

[Tango64]

6 hours ago, Crs97 said:

A poster in another thread said that when the cast recently appeared at a big interview for the final season, someone asked what would happen if Rebecca met both Miguel and Jack in heaven.  The actor playing Toby exclaimed that was the best question of the night, and Mandy had both Milo and Jon stand up, linking arms with both of them.  Apparently the place erupted in applause.  It wasn’t hard, writers.

I liked the train metaphor for her passing. It worked well with all the memories and symbolism of what really mattered to Rebecca, what she valued and remembered. The actors who played all the ages of her kids interacting was really nice.

It's the writer in me, so I have to say what I thought would have been a nicer final scene. Instead of looking over to see Jack lying next to her, I would have a reveal that Jack is sitting on one side of the bed, Miguel on the other. They both reach out to hold Rebecca's hands. 

Then she looks to the foot of the bed to see a young boy standing there, and says "Kyle..." Fade out and we all start bawling. 

Edited May 19, 2022 by Tango64
typo

[mostlylurking]

On 5/17/2022 at 9:19 PM, LexieLily said:

I thought it was going to be a "doctor is called away on Marcus' case and doesn't have time for Jack to check him out" scenario. I was confused what was the point when that turned out not to be the case. 

I thought that kind of was the case?  The doctor who was attending to Jack left to take care of Marcus and it seemed he caught something the other doctors didn’t.  If he hadn’t caught…..whatever it was…… Marcus would probably have died.  But if the doctor had stayed with Jack it’s possible he would have been able to do something to prevent Jack from dying.  So the implication is that Jack died but this kid lived and he grew up to discover a huge treatment for Alzheimer’s, the very same illness Jack’s wife had.

[ams1001]

40 minutes ago, 3 is enough said:

My mother was taken to the hospital because she was not able to swallow and was very weak.  This was on a Wednesday. On Thursday the nurse told my brother that there was not much time.  We are scattered all over Canada and the US and started making our arrangements.  I got to the hospital Sunday morning (slowed down by Covid testing requirements).  She was asleep but woke up for a few minutes and knew I was there. We went back a couple of times a day for the next few days but she never woke up again.  I really don’t know if she heard us when we spoke to her at that point- there was no response at all. We got a call on  early Wednesday morning that she had passed.

My aunt was similar (except she was on home hospice, and did not have AD). The last picture of her was taken on a Friday, sitting in a chair with a glass of whiskey in her hand and a smile on her face. By Saturday she was pretty much unconscious. A number of family members (including her daughter and granddaughters who came up from several states away) went to the house through the day on Sunday. Monday morning I got a message from my mom saying she had passed around 3am. The only one still awake was the overnight nurse, but her children and (most of) her grandchildren and siblings and some others all got to say their goodbyes. I do wonder if she heard any of us. I like to think she did.

9 minutes ago, mostlylurking said:

I thought that kind of was the case?  The doctor who was attending to Jack left to take care of Marcus and it seemed he caught something the other doctors didn’t.  If he hadn’t caught…..whatever it was…… Marcus would probably have died.  But if the doctor had stayed with Jack it’s possible he would have been able to do something to prevent Jack from dying.  So the implication is that Jack died but this kid lived and he grew up to discover a huge treatment for Alzheimer’s, the very same illness Jack’s wife had.

Then again, considering the type of heart attack they said Jack had, if the doctor had been there he might not have been able to do anything, either, and perhaps they both would have died.

[Guest]

The episode did not need the random family to show the circle of life thing. It really dragged down the episode and felt like a random mystery for the sake of mystery, much like the season premiere that introduced adult Young Jack and Cassidy. 
 

Overall, the episode was underwhelming. There were some good parts but meh. 

[smartymarty]

I was surprised that everyone went to bed despite being told that Rebecca likely would not survive the night. Seems they would do an all-night vigil (as only Randall and Kevin did). I certainly would have stayed up with my husband while his parent was dying.

[circumvent]

29 minutes ago, smartymarty said:

But it was the writers' decision to have the train moving fast at that point.

I was paraphrasing William. It was an allegory - the rush to get everyone to say goodbye, to give time for Kate to arrive, and the inevitable ending to Rebecca's journey. I thought it was a very nice, subtle connection they did between the "outside" and the "inside Rebecca's mind". 

[Empress1]

26 minutes ago, mostlylurking said:

 I thought that was a great touch and an acknowledgment that hopefully our loved ones can still hear us even if they can’t let us know.

I expressed this to a friend of the family, a retired nurse, after my dad passed - I told her I was glad to have been with him and I hope he heard me and my sibling talking to him. She told me that hearing is the last sense to go, so he probably did. She may have been saying that to placate me but I choose to believe it.

Beth’s speech was what set me to bawling. I also liked that she told Randall that she hoped Rebecca was at peace. 

[circumvent]

34 minutes ago, smartymarty said:

I think this would have been so much more beautiful -- Miguel bringing her back to her Jack. Though I must say, I don't understand Rebecca and Jack being "the greatest love story." They met in a bar, dated, married, had kids, he died." Nothing unusual there.

Then the use of Circle Game would not make sense and as a fan of the song, I am glad they did the full circle. Miguel wasn't the "behind from where we came". This is Us begins with Rebecca and Jack, that's the only possible ending that fits the song. Miguel was in the middle, the "back". We can't go back in the circle game

I really loved all the nuanced, subtle references.

[Cristofle]

37 minutes ago, Tango64 said:

Then she looks to the foot of the bed to see a young boy standing there, and says "Kyle..." Fade out and we all start bawling. 

Honestly, this wouldn't have worked for me, I don't think. Not unless the show had been written differently all along. As weird and disconcerting as it is that the writers haven't shown more interest in writing about Rebecca's grief for Kyle, they just haven't. There was basically the third episode of the first season and that was it for any significant focus on Kyle as it relates to Rebecca. He's barely been mentioned in years, and more than once, it's more Randall either finding out about him or maybe bringing him up than a focus on Rebecca (or Jack). I just can't see him being the ultimate final moment in this episode. 

I also can't see Miguel getting any kind of place equal to Jack, but I would have been fine with him as her guide, that would have made sense and maybe better honored his significant position in her life in her later years, but while I hope Kyle comes up SOMEWHERE if Jack and Rebecca are still talking in heaven in the next episode, he just...wasn't who she has been waiting for all this time. There hasn't been ANY hint of that. She wasn't remembering Kyle when she was first diagnosed and afraid of losing her memories - it was just Jack. She wasn't crying at Tess' birth because Kyle would never grow up and have kids - she was crying because she wanted Jack there. Her arc has been that she remembers Jack as the true love of her life for all of these years. I would have been very, very surprised if this episode ended with the focus on any reunion besides Jack. In real life, yes, I think anyone who lost a full-term child in childbirth would be hoping, perhaps above everything else, to see them when they die. But in the context of this show, it has never been about that journey. 

[Tango64]

20 minutes ago, Cristofle said:

Honestly, this wouldn't have worked for me, I don't think. Not unless the show had been written differently all along. As weird and disconcerting as it is that the writers haven't shown more interest in writing about Rebecca's grief for Kyle, they just haven't. There was basically the third episode of the first season and that was it for any significant focus on Kyle as it relates to Rebecca. He's barely been mentioned in years, and more than once, it's more Randall either finding out about him or maybe bringing him up than a focus on Rebecca (or Jack). I just can't see him being the ultimate final moment in this episode. 

I also can't see Miguel getting any kind of place equal to Jack, but I would have been fine with him as her guide, that would have made sense and maybe better honored his significant position in her life in her later years, but while I hope Kyle comes up SOMEWHERE if Jack and Rebecca are still talking in heaven in the next episode, he just...wasn't who she has been waiting for all this time. There hasn't been ANY hint of that. She wasn't remembering Kyle when she was first diagnosed and afraid of losing her memories - it was just Jack. She wasn't crying at Tess' birth because Kyle would never grow up and have kids - she was crying because she wanted Jack there. Her arc has been that she remembers Jack as the true love of her life for all of these years. I would have been very, very surprised if this episode ended with the focus on any reunion besides Jack. In real life, yes, I think anyone who lost a full-term child in childbirth would be hoping, perhaps above everything else, to see them when they die. But in the context of this show, it has never been about that journey. 

You make a good point. I guess I'm assuming she had this everlasting thought about Kyle, the one whose death set off this whole story, but it really hasn't been shown.

[SummerDreams]

19 hours ago, LexieLily said:

Why was he up and wandering about?

To share the lemonade wisdom!

[Boo Boo]

On 5/18/2022 at 5:32 PM, Notabug said:

I think the 'going on a journey' metaphor is real, too.  I was with an elderly friend when she died and she kept talking about people who were there and what they were wearing, etc. I was with my sister and brother in law and we tried to get her to elaborate, but she was never clear; we also hadn't known her as a young woman and had never known the rest of her family, so that might've been part of it.  At one point she said, 'he wants me to come with him but I don't know if I should.' Another reference to the journey.

She was particularly close to my sister; she loved us all, but my sister was really special to her and vice versa.  At one point, she motioned to my sister and whispered in her ear.  She wanted me and my brother in law to leave the room and just my sister with her.  We stepped out and she closed her eyes and died not 2 minutes later.  Some people are given the chance to pick their moment;  I have no doubt that Rebecca waited for her last child to get there before finishing her journey just as I know our friend wanted just her closest friend on earth with her at that moment as she crossed.

My late husband was talking to his his mother who died six months before him.  He also told people that we were going on a vacation and our daughter was 8 (she was 14 at the time).  

I'm not a spiritual person; but I think the dying brain does a life in review when it's a slow death.

Edited May 19, 2022 by Boo Boo

[Aloeonatable]

12 minutes ago, SummerDreams said:

To share the lemonade wisdom!

I thought that Jack's hands were bandaged by the EMTs in the ambulance. When he was brought into the ER, and before he was examined, he went to get a cup of coffee. That is when he had the conversation with Marcus' dad. 

I thought the lemonade speech was appropriate to tell the dad, not telling him to make something good out of Marcus' injury, but the car accident itself. Just like Dr. K wasn't saying that the loss of Kyle wasn't tragic, but even in tragedy you can find some good from the experience. 

[Cristofle]

48 minutes ago, Tango64 said:

You make a good point. I guess I'm assuming she had this everlasting thought about Kyle, the one whose death set off this whole story, but it really hasn't been shown.

I'm sure she thinks of him (well, kind of sure the writers would say of course she thinks of him, lol) but he's been mentioned so rarely on this show - I'll use my family as an example. My mom watches the show, and my brother and SIL watch it together. If this had ended with Kyle, I think the average viewer such as my family would have gone "....Who's Kyle again?" I'd wager a bet that your typical viewer was very much expecting and hoping to see Jack - just Jack - in that moment, and either barely remembers Kyle or doesn't remember him at all, because it's not like the writers bring him up frequently. 

[Violetgoblin6]

1 hour ago, smartymarty said:

I was surprised that everyone went to bed despite being told that Rebecca likely would not survive the night. Seems they would do an all-night vigil (as only Randall and Kevin did). I certainly would have stayed up with my husband while his parent was dying.

Absolutely. I didn't get that either. Beth & Sophie went to bed.