S10.E10: Andi's Men Tell All

[MsPH]

Yeah, I kind of feel bad for Andrew too, even if I do find him smarmy. Because even if he did comment on her picking the "black guys", I don't think it was meant to offend anyone. He didn't say it to Marquel or Ron, let alone confrontationally, so being held responsible for their hurt feelings is a bit much. If he hadn't shown any other signs of racism during the whole time they lived together, then why crucify him on national TV based on hearsay? If Marquel felt the need to ask him about it while they were still on the show, then that's OK, but they definitely should've left it at that. It just seems like a minor thing to get hung up on compared to how being remembered as the racist guy from the Bachelorette can affect Andrew's life.

[TheFinalRose]

The season was so boring and the drama so manufactured that this show was a snooze. Too much time on the Andrew/Marquel/JJ incident, but I totally laughed when they showed the footage of Andrew leaning over and whispering to JJ. Thing is, I need to see that Andrew didn't say something to JJ after every rose, sort of a running commentary on the proceedings, before that one clip means anything. Meanwhile I spent the whole night wondering why Marquel had a chocolate chip cookie on his lapel. 

 

I'm with those who can't see the charm of Marcus. He looks so deflated and wounded ALL THE TIME. Plus he's no fun. As for Chris, oh man, he is just chomping at the bit to be the Bachelor. He knows he has it in the bag and whoopee! LIfe on the farm is never going to be the same for him. I can just see the wheels in his head spinning with delight.  

 

That letter given to Andi at the end was weird. One, she wasn't in any of the outfits that we saw her in during the previews for next week's episode. She was clearly in some kind of studio setting in a room with the word PRIVATE on the door that Chris had full access to and not on location in the Dominican Republic. I'm betting it was filmed half an hour before the Men Tell All and we will never see it referred to again. They are so starved for any intrigue in this season that they are faking it big time. 

[bosawks]

I think Andrew is a dick but I just can't paint someone as a bigot based on JJ's drunken recollection.

 

All racists are assholes but not all assholes are racists.  I think JJ came off us as the biggest ass in that mess.  The fact that this is what took up time is a reflection of just how bland this season was....

 

ETA:  You know if they had done the lie detector in Juan Pablo's season Harrison would've trotted out every embarrassing "lie" there was to further humiliate JP.  And I'm not going to lie and say I wouldn't have found that entertaining. 

Edited July 22, 2014 by bosawks

[Alapaki]

I agree with JudyObscure re: Andrew and Marquel.

 

I got the sense that Marquel was almost enjoying playing the victim there, when we really don't know what, if anything Andrew said.  I really would've liked to have seen more push-back on J.J. to explain exactly what he heard, how he knows he heard that, and why he decided that the comment was an "issue" only that much later in the taping.

 

I can't read Andrew's mind, so I won't try to judge him one way or the other.  But the issue of Race on the Bachelor and Bachelorette has been widely discussed in the media.  Specifically, the small percentage of contestants cast each season who are of a different race than the "Star" (and since there's never been an African American "star", that means African American contestants) smacks of tokenism.  And, iirc, it's been rare for an African American contestant to make it very far into a season.  It may have happened once or twice, but it's certainly the exception rather than the rule.

 

To mix pop-media cliches, African American contestants on The Bachelor and The Bachelorette are the equivalent of the guys on Star Trek in the Red Shirts.  Are there any other contestants of color on Bachelor in Paradise besides Marquel?  I didn't see any.  The fact that, for all the seasons of this show, he's apparently the only minority contestant to be memorable enough (and that's probably because he's from the most recent season) speaks volumes about how this show treats Race.

 

All of which is to say, depending on the exact word(s) he used (if he did at all), I think there are entirely plausible "snarky", "sarcastic", "wise-ass", but not-necessarily racist motivation to whatever Andrew said.

 

And, finally, I do agree with those poster above that Marquel was being willfully blind if he really thinks that being tarred as a racist (assuming the accusation is false) is just as bad, if not worse, than being shown to have been the target of racism.

[MrsMcGoofy]

 

It amazes me that the show was 25% done before they even got to this season's cast!  And I'll admit, I thought the "Harrison's face in the ultrasound" gag was cute; I just wish they had done a really silly, cheesy animation with it... have the head wagging back and forth with maybe a twinkle in its eye towards the end or something.  So far as the real ultrasound went, I can rarely see anything in those anyway.... except this time I saw lots of ribcage.

I love all the snark here for this cheesetastic show.  As far as the ultrasound goes, instead of Chris Harrison's face, I would have have loved to seen  Bentley's head pop up. Now that would be good TV!

This show is so formulaic and strange. Why is it so hard to quit watching?

[Artsda]

I found it not endearing on Andi's side that the guys were the one to have to tell her not to read the Josh lie detector results. The guys look better than her by far. 

[sioux21]

 

The fact that, for all the seasons of this show, he's apparently the only minority contestant to be memorable enough (and that's probably because he's from the most recent season) speaks volumes about how this show treats Race.

 

People say this frequently, but there have been two Hispanic "winners" and two Asian "winners." This show (and this country) has a problem with African Americans and Caucasians being together, not race in general. We're more accepting of gay couples kissing on television than a black/white kiss. It's not just this show. It's all shows. It's too bad because everyone has worth and should be able to show affection to his/her loved one.

[Jaundiced Eye]

Does Chris Harrison have to refer to Chris as "Farmer Chris" all the time? I find it annoying as hell, and I think "Farmer Chris" does too. He's a millionaire farmer and businessman, and doesn't deserve to be painted as a rube.

I also think Chris Harrison and/or the producers went way overboard with the film "evidence" of Andrew saying "something" to JJ after Ron got the rose. Let it go, Harrison. I think everyone is sick of the whole topic at this point.

Was I the only one shocked to learn that "so desperately in love with Andi" Marcus has banged more than 20 women? And that he's a member of the Bachelor in Paradise cast? I know a lot of people think he is dreamy, but he does nothing whatsoever for me.

Dylan does clean up nicely. He looked way more attractive and seemed more personable on last night's show. Is he also a member of the Bachelor in Paradise cast?

I also noticed that many of the men were "shooting daggers" at Andi when she arrived on set. Thought that was hilarious. And, girlfriend, you can't handle the truth about Josh, I think. I'll bet he lied about the number of women he's slept with (if Marcus and Dylan have more than 20 conquests, can you imagine Josh's number?) and that he was there for the "wrong reasons." I will be completely shocked if their wedding day ever arrives. But I will laugh and laugh because I don't like Andi one bit. I think Nick may have dodged a bullet with that one.

[Zahdii]

I don't know, to me it seemed like the ultrasound was staged.

 

I have no doubt the ultrasound was staged, especially since the parents pretended not to know if they were having a boy or a girl.

 

Unless things have changed, the woman is supposed to have a full bladder when having a pelvic ultrasound, and she's supposed to lay straight.  Also, it takes some time to locate the markers before the technician can really focus on the baby.  I can't believe that Ashley would take the chance of leaking urine on stage if she were really having a real ultrasound.

 

For some reason the show felt like there wasn't enough real drama, so the producers were piling on as much filler as possible to flesh the hour out.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Zahdii

[Armchair Critic]

JJ's face last night was creepy and he looked guilty as hell. Andi dodged a bullet there.

[Jillybean]

Was I the only one shocked to learn that "so desperately in love with Andi" Marcus has banged more than 20 women? And that he's a member of the Bachelor in Paradise cast? I know a lot of people think he is dreamy, but he does nothing whatsoever for me.

Dylan does clean up nicely. He looked way more attractive and seemed more personable on last night's show. Is he also a member of the Bachelor in Paradise cast?

 

Yes, Dylan is on BIP.  I wasn't shocked about Marcus being on BIP.  I read Reality Steve and he spoiled the cast long ago.  I agree that I don't find Marcus especially attractive and I'm confused that he seems to be regarded as conventionally attractive.

[betha]

As Stephanie noted in her recap, I thought it was extremely interesting that there was some extra footage of Josh when they were going through the final two, including poetry. I think the episodes took great care to emphasize the concerns Andi had about Josh and hide a lot more romantic content.

 

In either case, it seems both men are genuinely in love with her, and it also seems from watching that she has very strong feelings for both of them. It will be a very interesting ATFR.

 

I also do not understand the Marcus love. I don't get why people think he is so beautiful. Yes, he is conventionally attractive with nice features. But... something about him just seems wan, and bland. I think many of the other guys are more attractive. But personality influences how I think about this so much, so maybe this is just because I think Marcus is boring and young.

 

Dylan looked a lot better with a haircut.

My recording cut off after Chris H handed Andi the letter. Did anything happen after that?

[leighdear]

Josh Tweets about his lies.......

 

“My full name is Joshua, not Josh (lie 1)...I always wash hands after bathroom except when I play golf & I go in the woods, no sink (lie 2).”

 

He Tweeted from Italy, according to the WetPaint gossip site.  

 

[note from mod: thanks for being sensitive, but spoiler tags not needed here]

Edited July 24, 2014 by Rhondinella
removed spoiler tags

[Adeejay]

I found it interesting that Eric was never mentioned.  And also, on the blooper reel, Andi told the producer that she had no idea why she gave Nick the first impression rose. 

[Padma]

I watched a few minutes of this spectacle.  I believe Andrew may have said, she kept the black guys. Maybe; however, I will never believe he would ever say blackies....JJ skeeves me out.

 

I was glad they showed the real time clip. Whatever he said, it was about 4 words long, very short, so it definitely wasn't the long sentence he claimed he said. I was disappointed he couldn't come up with something better and defend it. Like, "All the black guys". Which I don't think is necessarily bigoted and could be defended--while giving JJ an out too. Like saying, "All the blondes." Kind of sizing up her taste.

 

With all the time to prepare, he did very poorly. Which makes me think he -does- have some prejudice he feels like hiding, even though I don't believe ANYONE would say "blackies". And I think JJ's a manipulative little gossip. The name mix-up was embarrassing because he repeated it as if "Ron...right? What did I say?" as if he didn't even think about the difference. That seems impossible, of course, but it's how it came across.  I don't see why he couldn't just "own" saying "black guys", but anyway, he didn't help himself.

I like Chris since he told the truth on the lie detecter test.

 

I did, too, although I'm sure that if he's The Bachelor, he'll undo all my respect for him.  I liked Bryan, and maybe it was Dylan, telling Andi not to look at Josh's lie detector results.

 

The show was so long and weird--with that crazy infomercial audience (spot on, upthread description). There's no way attending this show could cause that amount of excitement unless they were paid, drugged or drunk.

 

I felt bad for Chris because Andi loved her HT date but just wasn't into him. That's a tough message to hear (I don't think he realized she was never into him and that's why she ignored his question, "What changed?"

 

I love Ashley and JP and girlfriend is huge! I thought they might be having twins, but the ultrasound was interesting, the CH gag was funny, and I hope that slip was genuine and they name the baby Harrison. Cool first name, and it'd be a nice shoutout for CH, the show, etc.  Better story, too, than "We named you 'John' because that was your great-grandfather's name."

 

Andi looked very happy so at least next week's "love story" should last for a month or two.

[Missy Vixen]

Does Harrison actually expect us to believe those ultra-sensitive microphones at the rose ceremony did not pick up EXACTLY what was said? Come on now.

 

The Bachelor/Bachelorette seasons get more and more boring. When they're ripping off Maury Povich to liven things up, perhaps it's time to finally put the show out of its misery.

[MarkHB]

My recording cut off after Chris H handed Andi the letter. Did anything happen after that?

No.  They did a slow, ominous zoom-in on it laying on the table, and then faded to black and the credits.

[truthaboutluv]

Was I the only one shocked to learn that "so desperately in love with Andi" Marcus has banged more than 20 women? And that he's a member of the Bachelor in Paradise cast? I know a lot of people think he is dreamy, but he does nothing whatsoever for me.

 

 

Not shocked at all but what I found particularly amusing is, I guess during the media done around the weekend of the taping, the guys were asked about Andi's F2 (I guess who they thought she would choose and opinions of the guys) and Marcus stated that watching the season didn't change his mind about Nick and he was more certain now that he was only there for camera time. I seriously had to "WTF...." at that. This from a guy who a half a minute after his deep heartbreak over Andi who was supposedly his soul mate was already on Bachelor in Paradise and according to spoilers

is already engaged.

.

[JudyObscure]

Was I the only one shocked to learn that "so desperately in love with Andi" Marcus has banged more than 20 women?

I wonder where they came up with that number? Nineteen women and you're Mr. Sincere, but 21 and you're a shameless, dirty hound dog. I was saying all that in front of Hubs and he just had this dreamy look on his face like, "Oh to be young and handsome in the 21st Century..."

Remember the guys at Ashley's, "Roast," making fun of how small her breasts were? Hah! JP junior has fixed that for her.

[Adeejay]

I am not condoning what Andrew said, if indeed he did say it, however, I am baffled by Marquel’s reaction.  I find it hard to believe that an African-American male, who is almost thirty years old, would be surprised, upset and hurt to find out that he is a victim of racism.  Not meaning to make light of the subject, but where has he been all his life?  It seems the only thing that will satisfy him is for Andrew to admit that he called him a “blackie” whether he did or not.

[truthaboutluv]

I find it hard to believe that an African-American male, who is almost thirty years old, would be surprised, upset and hurt to find out that he is a victim of racism.

 

 

I'm not sure I really understand this statement. Knowing something exists does not automatically negate one from being offended or hurt everytime it happens to them. What is he supposed to feel and say - "oh someone made a racist comment about me well yeah, I mean I'm black so it happens".

 

Yes intellectually most people recognize that ignorance and bigotry still exists in this world and by that token racism, misogyny, homophobia, etc. continues to exist. But knowing and being aware of something is still different than when it directly hits you. Which for the record does not mean I'm saying that I completely believe Andrew made those comments. 

Edited July 22, 2014 by truthaboutluv

[Adeejay]

Seems to me you answered your own question in the first sentence of your second paragraph.

[truthaboutluv]

Well no, because like I said, I still don't think it is strange that someone would be hurt by being a victim of racism whether or not they are aware that it still exists. But I think this is too sensitive a topic, especially in relation to a show as shallow as The Bachelorette so I'll just say YMMV and move on.

[Bugs Meany]

I wonder where they came up with that number? Nineteen women and you're Mr. Sincere, but 21 and you're a shameless, dirty hound dog.

 

In that Anna Faris movie "What's Your Number?" <20 for a woman = still marriage material, 20+ = damned to permanent slut-dom.  So apparently 20 is the arbitrary number that Cosmo articles have settled on.

[Armchair Critic]

The ads featuring Marquel on Bachelor In Paradise play Barry White, isn't that kind of a racial stereotype?

[Irritable]

I definitely do not think Andrew said the word "blackies", and while I have no idea what he did actually say, I do think that even if he said "She kept the black guys" that there is one way he could have intended it that, in my opinion, would not be in an obviously ugly racist way:  if he considered it notable because perhaps Andi has a preference for African American men, then it would mean that he and JJ's chances with her were lower than he first thought.  But even still, if meant with zero malice, I think Marquel's biggest problem with the whole thing which he clearly stated once when it first came up and never managed to convey very well again, was that it hurts that he thought he was fitting in as just one of the good catches that Andi had to choose from, only to find out that there are still people who see him as "the black guy".  And I agree completely, even though I am white and can never really understand this plight, that when you think you are being noticed and accepted for who you are as a person only to hear that someone still refers to you simply by your race as if that is the only thing that makes you distinguishable from the others, of course that would hurt terribly.  If Andrew had simply said to Marquel, "This whole thing is very unfortunate, and I am sorry that you were hurt by it.  I stand by my statement that I am not a racist and would not disparage you in that way, but I understand why hearing that would be hurtful", then Marquel would probably have been appeased and the whole thing could have been squashed quickly.  JJ is a total skeeze, and I do think he did this to stir up shit, but I don't think he made up the whole thing, maybe just twisted it up a bit to make it even worse than it already was.  In any event, the whole thing SUCKED, and I'm glad it's over.

 

I'm surprised so many people think Marcus is blah, but then, I think Chris is blah and would be the most boring Bachelor ever, so I guess there could be a chemistry thing that works even through television.  To me, Josh is also very good looking but he doesn't mesmerize me or make my heart do weird fluttery things like seeing Marcus does.  I see absolutely nothing attractive about Dylan or Nick.  To each his own, but it's definitely interesting to me that it's not necessary to even see someone in person to find them UBER attractive like woah vs. simply thinking they are good looking.  I have this same problem with James McAvoy.  Yes, other actors are good looking, but he does something to my brain that is weird, and Marcus does the same thing.  Anyway, like I said, I fully expect Marcus to disappoint me on Bachelor in Paradise.  I have no problem with him being hurt by Andi and then turning around to do that show, because when someone is dumped and heartbroken, isn't it pretty common for them to want to turn right around and find a new romantic distraction?  Isn't that where the term "rebound relationship" comes from?  Please don't gross me out on that show, Marcus.  Just show us that beautiful smile some more, have fun, and don't say anything that makes you look like an asshole.

[Alapaki]

My recording cut off after Chris H handed Andi the letter. Did anything happen after that?

 

No.  They did a slow, ominous zoom-in on it laying on the table, and then faded to black and the credits.

 

 

Was that supposed to have happened back-stage after the Men Tell All?

 

If so, presumably it has nothing to do with the FRC, which I believe would've already taped before the MTA was taped.

 

I guess they're trying to set the stage for The. Most. Dramatic. After. The. Final. Rose. EHHHHVA.

 

Chris described the note as being from "one of your final 2".  Of course, at the time the MTA taped (assuming I have the timeline correct) there were no F2, just a "winner" and the final rejectee.

 

My guess is that it's from the rejectee either begging her to reconsider, or possibly dishing some dirt on the "winner".  Presumably she's been in closer touch with the "winner", so why would he be writing her.

 

Unless, and boy do I hope (and if there's a novena for this I'd pray it) that it's a "Dear John" letter from Andi's "winner" stating that he's dumping her.

[Jaundiced Eye]

Am I the only one who can't get the spoiler tags to reveal the spoilers?

[Alapaki]

To me, Josh is also very good looking but he doesn't mesmerize me

 

 

Andi made an interesting remark to Josh in one of the flash-back scenes.  She said that she either "usually" dates athletes, or at least suggested that she's dated athletes a lot (or dated a lot of athletes).  

 

Maybe this is my dislike for Andi talking, but I really saw that as a #humblebrag.  The implication is that you have to be attractive to date athletes.  It would be the equivalent of a guy "complaining" about all the super-models he's dated.

 

Based on that, I'm inclined to think Andi would see a proposal from Josh as more impressive than she would see one from Nick.  

 

Either way, I'd be surprised if she's still with whoever she picks by the time Bachelor in Paradise is done airing.

[truthaboutluv]

My guess is that it's from the rejectee either begging her to reconsider, or possibly dishing some dirt on the "winner".  Presumably she's been in closer touch with the "winner", so why would he be writing her.

 

 

And my guess is it's a complete fake-out. It's either from neither of her F2 or her pick and it'll be some corny love letter/poem that he'll read to her during the live reunion. But it'll certainly be played up as more and it conveniently happens as US Weekly starts reporting that her F2 is or was trying to win her back recently. My guess is the US Weekly story was planted by the show and the letter an added ruse. Anything to increase interest in the finale since my guess is nothing as dramatic as Claire going off on Juan Pablo happens or a Brooks dumping Des type situation.

Edited July 22, 2014 by truthaboutluv

[alt0233]

I am not condoning what Andrew said, if indeed he did say it, however, I am baffled by Marquel’s reaction. I find it hard to believe that an African-American male, who is almost thirty years old, would be surprised, upset and hurt to find out that he is a victim of racism. Not meaning to make light of the subject, but where has he been all his life? It seems the only thing that will satisfy him is for Andrew to admit that he called him a “blackie” whether he did or not.

How exactly are people supposed to respond when they're the victim of racism? Just because someone has been the victim of racism before doesn't mean it doesn't hurt when it happens, and doesn't mean they can't be caught off guard if it happens at a time they're not expecting. I'm baffled by the idea that someone shouldn't be upset and hurt by racism just because it's probably happened to them before.

[MsPH]

Unless, and boy do I hope (and if there's a novena for this I'd pray it) that it's a "Dear John" letter from Andi's "winner" stating that he's dumping her.

 

That would be priceless!

[OhIKnow]

 

Does Harrison actually expect us to believe those ultra-sensitive microphones at the rose ceremony did not pick up EXACTLY what was said? Come on now.

My guess is that for the Rose Ceremony they use boom microphones and they're not as ultra-sensitive as the lavs they normally wear during dates and whatnot. Also, I'm with those who think Andrew said "black guys." 

 

I always had a soft spot for Dylan. I've felt his pain, having lost a brother as well (not by exact circumstances but similar enough). It was definitely too soon after everything that happened for him to be on a reality show.  It's nice to see that he seems to be in a better place.  During the season, I told my friend that if he cut his hair and smiled more, he'd be ridiculously hot. Glad to see I was right on that. :)  I hope Bachelor In Paradise doesn't make me change my opinion of him.

 

 

[chocolatine]

That was the most boring Anyone Tells Anything show in the history of The Bachelor/ette! The Ashley and JP segment made me think of the "I faked an ultrasound" scene from Sex And The City. I used to like them, but now they've reached Sean and Catherine levels of TMI.

 

I agree that Marquel absolutely has the right to be hurt by racism, but first it needs to be established that racism actually took place. Of which I'm none the wiser after last night's show.

 

I wish they'd stop with the lead explaining to the rejects why she didn't choose them. The answer, every time, is "because I had stronger feelings for someone else".

[Wowzer]

I don't think that Marquel was trying to play the victim or that he enjoyed being one.  Prior to JJ bringing it up, race wasn't an issue in that house. He wasn't overtly looking to start drama and didn't want to come off as "that" guy even after the statements were brought to his attention. He even said he didn't want his race to be the main identifier about him while on the show. Yes, it's part of his identity, but his fashion choices and love of cookies were played up more than him being of African descent. He trusted JJ and believed JJ was his friend. That's why he truly believes Andrew said it. Either JJ made the whole thing up to create tension, which is really shady and on par with a racist saying it, or Andrew is a racist who said "blackies" or something similar. Either way, Marquel was compelled to respond because of a situation he was put into. I see it as the race issue coming to Marquel and him having to walk a fine line to avoid being seen as whining about racism or just brushing it off and being seen as condoning it.  I also think production pushed the issue. 

I don't know what to believe - Andrew was right that it was a serious accusation and that it has long term consequences. I empathize with Andrew if  he didn't say it but understand where Marquel is coming from. 

It has been a lackluster season.

[CorgiNarnia]

I don't know, to me it seemed like the ultrasound was staged. Like it could have really been their baby, but I feel like they did the ultrasound prior and just rolled the footage. The technician's wand only stayed on that tiny section of her belly that was cut out from her dress.  Plus, what if the guy saw something wrong??? I feel like that's too risky/too personal to be "live".  Plus, they knew it was a boy three months ago lol.  I think they're adorable, btw. 

I think they HAD to have done this ultrasound earlier that day, just because of the live taping factor. Even if all their ultrasounds up to that day have been fine, let's say the last one was a week before, and then they do this one on the show-- how HORRIBLE would it be if they couldn't find the heartbeat or something like that?

[betha]

I think the lie detector segment was a dead giveaway that she picked Josh. Her reaction to potentially hearing what he lied about (curiosity mixed with fear) only makes sense if she picked him. If Josh were not F1, I think she either would have read the results just for fun OR quickly said no, let bygones be bygones. Her anxiety and indecision only make sense if Josh is F1.

 

Well, also, remember Josh was the one who got extremely upset with her about even having them take the lie detector test and they kind of fought over it. Even if she didn't pick him in the end, I'm sure that must have crossed her mind. Also, with the other exposed lies, she wasn't given a choice. She might have said no again to all of them if Chris H had left it up to her.

 

They might be nice sometimes, but Brian seems like he can be an angry dude, and so does Chris the Farmer. I think Chris has Jake potential, based on his attitude toward Nick and JJ. If Chris becomes Bachelor, I wonder if his DUIs will be an issue.  

 

I don't think JJ is a smarmy or bad person, just socially awkward and inappropriate.

[Kbilly]

Ashley was obnoxious with all the fist pumping. I can't believe JP faked an ultrasound reaction--tears and everything! Disappointed in you, JP.

 

As mentioned above, lots of red pants tonight. And the hot firefighter was wearing yellow pants!

 

I like Chris too much to want him to be the Bachelor but it is extremely slim pickings with this lot. 

 

What was with the commercial pimping Cody as some kind of draw for females on Bachelor in Paradise? Michelle Money and Graham should really move on at this point, it's kind of embarrassing. And for all the bluster about Chris Bukowski they sure let him fame whore a hell of a lot. 

 

He Tweeted from Italy, according to the WetPaint gossip site.

 

What do you mean Italy? NFL camps start this week!!! He needs to be there for his brother!!! The NFL player!!! Because football!!!!

[Temperance]

I like Andi for a reality show contestant I don't care about. I only saw part of last night's episode. 

I thought that was nice save effort from Dylan with his Purell. 

I think Josh may be  hiding something. I'm actually shocked Andi didn't find out what the lies were. If it were me, I would want to know, since they have already did the test and have the answers. I wouldn't make a date out of lie detector test, but if it was arranged, I would probably read the answers.  

I wondered if the note was from one of the F2s complaining about the week before with the fantasy suites. Like he was surprised he wasn't the only one she chose to share a room with...

I liked the bloopers, but in the plates one I was struck how huge Nick's family is. (Again!) 

[Jaundiced Eye]

Maybe this is my dislike for Andi talking, but I really saw that as a #humblebrag. The implication is that you have to be attractive to date athletes. It would be the equivalent of a guy "complaining" about all the super-models he's dated.

 

I wondered about this, too, Alapaki. Either Andi is a professional groupie (because who else has the opportunity to "date" so many athletes), or she's referring to boys who played sports in high school or college. I think Andi is reasonably attractive but she brings A LOT of baggage with her high-maintenance, diva personality.

[jumper sage]

My only wish last week was for Chris to tell Andi, "Ees OK" when she sent him packing.

this.is.gold.

 

I was soooooo bored.  The whole Andrew/Marquel incident......I thought we all knew that another contestant said that, not Andrew.  Someone who got cut right away but not the first night.  I thought at the MTA that Marquel would now be mad at JJ (?)  I forget who told Marquel.  Maybe Emil the guy who introduced himself as anal or something like that.

 

If this lie is being used as tv fodder, then shame on everyone.

[CorgiNarnia]

It was bad enough to rehash Blackiegate 2014 again, with no new information, but then when we are all ready to move on to Marquel's segment (which, did he really deserve given how far back he was cut? I know, BIP, but really...? And no update for Dylan or Brian? Anyway...) then JJ has to interrupt Marquel's big moment because he senses he came off shady. I'm sure Marquel was like, "really, dude? Thanks but this is my time."

[JenE4]

I don't understand the blame toward Marquel for talking about what Andrew allegedly said. It wasn't like he brought it up out of the blue (like the golfer I barely remember calling out why Andi didn't try to get to know him better the second week), but it was after production played all of the clips of blackiegate and Harrison asked him to tell Andrew how he felt that night--and Harrison continued to ask them all questions about it. I do think the video clip was telling. Andrew was laughing with a wide-eyed look when he leaned over to JJ so it was like a surprised, "get a load of this" kind of comment, so to me it did appear that he was saying what JJ said, though I'd presume much more likely "black guys" than "blackies." I also think the show focused on this so much because it was the only dramatic thing to happen, without mentioning Eric again or Nick who wasn't there to defend himself, and no one else needed another 18-minute segment on ultrasounds, although Harrison tried with Andi. Also, Bachelor Nation LOVED the way Marquel handled the initial confrontation with Andrew, so they were giving us what we wanted. Granted, it sounds like some on this board are over it (or perhaps were never on board with Marquel), but I loved Marquel on the show, and I loved every minute of him on TMTA, too, not least of which him giving the cookies to the audience members. I also thought he was adorable when he said he didn't get the memo that guys had started kissing Andi.

[aenea]

I don't buy that. Ron may have just spoken but they'd been sitting there for how many minutes with Marquel speaking to him, the situation/confrontation had been between him and Marquel which is what they were rehashing, he claims that Marquel was someone he thought was a friend, he claims that the accusation and confrontation they had affected his work - to me, with something like that, you don't confuse and mix up names because it's too significant. 

Except we have no idea how long that conversation took, or even who was talking to who, in what order.  The "live" show takes 5-6 hours to tape, so we see the edit that the producers want to show. Judging from the ways that they play around with voiceovers on the show (editing conversations from many different days down to a merged 20 second voiceover on an ITM),  I wouldn't read too much into the name mistake.  

[Jillibean]

I appreciated Dylan and Brian for steering Andi away from opening Josh's lie detector results. Regardless of whether or not she picked him, I think that would have been a mistake. Especially given how upset Josh was about the lie detector date even after Andi ripped up the results. It sort of seemed like she might have chosen differently if the boys hadn't clearly told her not to. Good for them. Although I personally would have loved to know what Josh lied about. 

 

I love Ashley and JP and was happy to see them. The ultrasound was a bit odd, but I would never think of them as "selling out" to the show. I think they are well aware that the show is the reason they have a marriage and a soon-to-be baby, and they clearly have a great relationship with Chris and production. The premise of finding out the baby's sex was stupid though, since it had already been announced. They should have just had Ashley and JP announce it and called it a day.

 

I fast-forwarded Chris' "date." I could tell from the previews that it was going to be way too uncomfortable to watch. And honestly, who would date an audience who threw herself at him at a reality reunion show while it was still actively taping? And since we all know he's almost certainly going to be the next Bachelor anyway, it seems entirely pointless.

 

I know it would be hard not to give the last couple of guys eliminated a chance to ask the B'ette questions, but I feel like very season, pretty much every question ends up being a variation on "Why didn't you love me?" and almost every answer is a variation on "Because I didn't love you." It's just very uninteresting to watch. The producers should help the contestants come up with more interesting and varied softball questions to throw at the Bachelor or Bachelorette.

 

Andrew has been put in a terrible position this season, but he has done nothing to help himself. At all. I understand nerves--really, I do--and I realize that Ron left early and Andrew might not have known him very well. But he spent weeks living in the same hotel rooms as Marquel, spending a ton of time with him. He had a whole conversation with him. He has presumably watched it back and dealt with the ramifications of this in his real-life. He should know the guy's name. 

[ribboninthesky1]

Maybe this is my dislike for Andi talking, but I really saw that as a #humblebrag. The implication is that you have to be attractive to date athletes. It would be the equivalent of a guy "complaining" about all the super-models he's dated.

 

I didn't watch this episode, but if this is in reference to earlier in the season, I can understand this interpretation.  I think that Andi has very specific ideas on what makes a man, and athletes are more likely the kind of guy to line up with that.  Of course, you have to take the bad with the "good," which is presumably why Andi allegedly has had issues with dating athletes.

 

As for JJ, Marquel, and Andrew, meh, I wasn't impressed with any of their reactions in the episode where all the drama occurred.  JJ was a shit-stirring coward, Marquel was futilely aggrieved over something he didn't actually experience (I am a black woman, and if I reacted to every aspect of alleged bigotry by hearsay by confronting the person, I'd commonly be on edge), and Andrew was a combo of "doth protest too much" and insensitive in his laughing reaction (in the original episode) to what was said. 

 

I've little to no sympathy for Andrew, mainly because I don't think being outed as a bigot has the adverse social/economic impact that is being assumed, not in everyday, non-public life. I'll assume Andrew doesn't intend to further pursue anything in entertainment, though.  But if Andrew mentioned that he lost his job or business over the allegations, I'll concede it in that context. 

[fib]

A poem for the fora, to lament the upcoming return of the terrible Bachelor poem: 

 

Oh no, not more Bachelor rhymes!

Must I suffer more poetry crimes?

 

Producers really should squash

Ballads from cleat-heads like Josh. 

 

After everything he has been through, 

From Dylan, I'd excuse a haiku,

 

From Chris, a rude limerick

if it coupled the word dick with Nick

 

But a page full of verse from a Jock?

Each couplet should be scored as a balk.  

 

(Not looking forward to next week)

Edited July 23, 2014 by fib

[lonestar]

Andy dumped the guys with the long hair the 1st night, and she kept the black guys.

Could it be that she likes black guys and doesn't like long hair on men?

It is now racist to point one of these out.  This is getting ridiculous.  

Kim K likes black men and members of her family have stated how she is attracted to black guys. Are they all racist?

 

Maybe Andrew said, "she likes black guys"  4 words.  However, I think JJ is a piece of crap liar.  He was sweating when confronted.

[panthergirl13]

Don't you love it when they cut to the same exact audience-member-reaction-shot multiple times? That's how bored I was during this episode.

 

The ultrasound was beyond stupid, and Chris Harrison's stupid sexist comments about how 'all men want boys' blah blah blah just made me want to puke. I used to teach childbirth classes and whenever a couple was hoping for a boy, I'd ask "Did it ever occur to you that the boy you ENVISION might not be the boy you get? That's a lot of pressure to put on someone before he's even born." (I'd say the same about hoping for a girl, although sadly fewer couples were pulling for that variety). So JP's dream of throwing the football around would be quickly dashed if he had MY son, who has zero interest in sports of any kind.

[truthaboutluv]

About the audience reaction shots, this is definitely one thing that's always kind of bugged me about this show. With the budget I know they have, considering all these location shoots they do, I don't understand why the MTA/WTA always comprise of these hideously dubbed audience reaction shots. Half the time there will be a shot of someone's "shocked" face like half a minute after the audio of a gasping sound. It's just strange and frankly incredibly distracting.