S05.E04: Honestly

[movingtargetgal]

14 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

Ah, I guess I missed that explanation. Still don't buy that he wouldn't check the camera and that the live steam ended.

I ALWAYS put a post-it over the lens of my computer's camera just before I log off Zoom. 

[phalange]

As soon as the word "livestream" was mentioned, I knew something was going to go wrong. Randall handled it well though, and I liked his talk with Malik. I was wondering how the grandpa was going to find out about Randall and a video going viral makes sense. So clearly Laurel talked to him about her past since he recognizes William's name. 

I also noticed the box said "ovulation test" and normally this show is on top of everything, props included, so I have to believe that was a deliberate choice and not a mistake. Which makes me very worried for teenage Kate. 

I liked how pre-teen Kevin asking Randall for studying advice tied in to the present with Kevin using Randall's flashcard method to work on his acting. I didn't like how once again the show made Jack right about every parenting decision and made Rebecca look like the bad parent, especially when it came to letting baby Kevin cry. I know that was the prevailing advice at the time, but it was shitty advice. Comforting a crying baby is not the same as encouraging Kevin to stick with football. (And Rebecca was right about not taking parenting advice from Miguel and his wife cause clearly their kids didn't turn out great!)

[txhorns79]

58 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

but he really does need to figure out how to make this internship and his family work if he wants to keep working with Randall.

I just kind of roll my eyes at this. He's a 16 year old (who looks 12) with a baby at home.  Under zero circumstances are his parents going to let him take on an internship in addition to his already existing responsibilities. 

[ByaNose]

Now, I know why I’m single and don’t have kids. I didn’t notice Kate’s kit not being a pregnancy test. Who knew? LOL!!!

[mommalib]

Good episode and Randall continues to be the shows best character. One thing that irked me is when Kate was talking to Kevin about Randall and Kevin was dismissive about Randall's experience being the black kid in an all white family. Unfortunately that's par for the course with non-black people more specifically white people.  

[ByaNose]

5 minutes ago, mommalib said:

Good episode and Randall continues to be the shows best character. One thing that irked me is when Kate was talking to Kevin about Randall and Kevin was dismissive about Randall's experience being the black kid in an all white family. Unfortunately that's par for the course with non-black people more specifically white people.  

I thought it was interesting that Kevin thinks that Randall was their (Jack & Rebecca’s) favorite even now. He holds a lot of resentment towards Randall from back then and now. 

[memememe76]

Lovely episode. Teen Kate is not only my favourite Kate, she is my favourite character on the show except Rebecca. Her storyline with Marc just fascinates me. 
 

Seeing young Randall and Kevin get along for a few minutes always gives me the warm fuzzies.   

[mommalib]

1 hour ago, ByaNose said:

I thought it was interesting that Kevin thinks that Randall was their (Jack & Rebecca’s) favorite even now. He holds a lot of resentment towards Randall from back then and now. 

Yeah he does and that's why he told Randall he wish Randall didn't exist. At the end of the day all three of those kids got plenty of love, affection and attention. As Kevin said out of his own mouth  Jack and Rebecca wasn't perfect but thy were great parents. That's why Kevin's resentment of Randall always seemed misdirected to me. It's crazy that even as an adult he has no way to empathize with what it must have felt like for Randall being the different one.

[chocolatine]

I rewound the Kate flashback, and she did take an ovulation test (I wasn't able to tell the brand) out of her nightstand drawer, but later in the bathroom she was holding a (positive) Clearblue pregnancy test.

3 hours ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

Dammit, Malik. You had ONE JOB! He really has some cajones to ask for an internship after that. Jeez, where do people get that kind of moxy?

He gave a Pearson-esque speech about always putting his daughter's needs first, so Randall sees him as a kindred spirit now.

3 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

I don't think she could have hidden a pregnancy and delivery.  She wasn't particularly heavy when Jack was alive.

It was mentioned in an earlier episode (last season, IIRC) that Kate gained 25 pounds after Jack died, and that was before the pregnancy. I think she would be able to hide the pregnancy and let everyone else assume she's just continuing to overeat and gain weight because of her grief. And I can see Rebecca not saying anything or asking any questions because she didn't want to upset Kate even more.

3 hours ago, ams1001 said:

I almost forgot Annie channeling Little Women. "My hair's a fright!" 😂

She also called Beth "mother," which I thought was hilarious. On a tangential note, I noticed that Deja calls Randall "dad" but Beth is still Beth. I think from Deja's POV it's because she had never known her biological father but had a close relationship with her mother (despite Shauna's troubles and later giving up her parental rights), but I'm sure it still stings for Beth every time she hears that.

2 hours ago, KaveDweller said:

I don't buy that Randall would just stand up and start undressing knowing Malik was right outside the door. I don't buy him undressing at the office at all. It would be one thing if he was doing the live steam at home.

Randall was changing into workout clothes to go for a run, but I still found it strange that he didn't check with Malik first to make sure Malik had actually stopped the livestream. Or he could have just closed the little shutter on his webcam. I always do that when I have a break between video calls, because there have been so many stories of hacks that make webcams or computer cameras continue filming even when you think you've turned them off. I also found it strange that right after making an emotionally charged speech, he started dancing and stripping like he didn't have a care in the world.

I find it anti-climactic to have to take a six-week break after only airing four episodes. Another thing to chalk up to 2020.

[kili]

Quote

 I didn't like how once again the show made Jack right about every parenting decision and made Rebecca look like the bad parent, especially when it came to letting baby Kevin cry.

They did have Kevin over-hear Jack calling him "soft".  That's probably Kevin's version of Jack's "Jack of all trades" story and feeds in to him believing Randall when he says that Jack died disappointed in Kevin.  It's also another layer of disappointment for Kevin losing football because he worked so hard at it to try to prove to his dad he wasn't "soft". 

And Jack could probably use some of his own advice to fix the way he behaves with Kate. 

[debraran]

I feel since Kate was so low on self esteem and had no friends (why Rebecca believed the Molly line?) she tried to get pregnant as women have done in the past and thought shockingly, Mark would be okay with it and change into Jack. That alone needs a therapist but no one unless pushed ever got help. I can imagine the evil Mark telling her she trapped him and she's an idiot etc. Imagine having to tell Mom you are still seeing the Mark and pregnant?

I always felt rape/abortion and the fact Chrissy said Fogleman had to meet with her about story line, pretty much to me says abortion. She was good with it and thought it would be something people could relate too. You know it can't be adoption, there are so many stories about that. Since that isn't their child later, I doubt Toby and Kate get "Chloe" but I do resent the time taken with it if so. It's so soon after Jack Jr and why the rush? Why not older child? IDK, might be minority on that but I feel like FF when anything about adoption is on. I feel the talk with Toby will be good though and cathartic.

I did like the humor and other scenes. You could see how Kevin was just "sports" and Randall "the A student" but were they really just that. Lots of stress on both ends but Kevin wasn't stupid and Randall was more than an A. As parents we all fall into these traps but with an anxious child, I wish Kevin knew football wasn't his life and Randall wasn't just a grade. Kate, she felt unimportant in anything really. I loved seeing Kevin use Randall's tactic though later. ; )

Edited November 18, 2020 by debraran

[Haleth]

What a coincidence that the Vietnamese grandpa sees the Randall video and makes the connection based on the name William Hill.  I wonder how many dozens of William Hills lived in the Philadelphia area 40 years ago.

Malik is a nice boy but I just don't care.  I do like that Randall had a sense of humor about the video snafu.  It's a good thing he's fit so the reaction from the viewers is "wow!" rather than sporting a dad bod with a bunch of even more embarrassing memes.

The director should have told Kevin what he was looking for.  You know, direct.

If that wasn't a prop screw up and the story line is that Kate is trying to trap her jerk bf with a pregnancy, I'll scream.

I had a rabbit named Chloe.

January 5?  Seriously?  We just got the show back!  I'm sorry we'll miss a Thanksgiving episode but maybe because of covid they didn't want all the cast on set.

[Bulldog]

6 hours ago, ByaNose said:

I thought it was interesting that Kevin thinks that Randall was their (Jack & Rebecca’s) favorite even now.

I thought the show had always been very clear that Randall was their favorite.  Not that Jack and Rebecca didn't love Kate and Kevin, but Randall always received the lion's share of attention/praise.  

[bybrandy]

I wonder, if teen Kate is trying to get pregnant, it isn't as much about trapping Marc as it is about doing something that would make her family have to accept him.   Obviously, he's horrible and this is going to backfire, but right now it isn't just that they've broken up it is also that her family loathes him.  She can't bring him back around.  But if she's pregnant then they have to accept him.... or at least in her sadly messed up head they do.

I can absolutely see Rebecca believing Kate about doing whatever with her one friend exactly because Rebecca so wants it to be true that Kate has a close friend.  

I like that adult Kate is still taking in what Randall said to her in the opening it, that she's still evaluating and coming to terms with her part in it.  

I'm not sure that the Ivy League is the way to go if is his dream is hotel/restaurant management..  And less so if his goal is being a 3 star Michelin chef.  But google tells me Cornell has the best hospitality program in the country, so maybe I'm wrong there.  Also, if he changes his focus that Ivy education puts him in contact with the right people in whatever field it is he ends up going in.

[gameshowjunkie]

9 hours ago, ams1001 said:

I know babies go through a lot of clothes, but does he really need to do her laundry every morning, too?

She may not have a lot of clothes - I understand money is tight but he should check out thrift shops where you can baby clothes for next to nothing. I would think they qualify for assistance but perhaps they don't want to take it?

 

My son wore cloth diapers for about a year. Separate liners and diapers and I washed them every night because they were crazy expensive and he went through a lot.

[gameshowjunkie]

15 minutes ago, bybrandy said:

I wonder, if teen Kate is trying to get pregnant, it isn't as much about trapping Marc as it is about doing something that would make her family have to accept him.   Obviously, he's horrible and this is going to backfire, but right now it isn't just that they've broken up it is also that her family loathes him.  She can't bring him back around.  But if she's pregnant then they have to accept him.... or at least in her sadly messed up head they do.

I can absolutely see Rebecca believing Kate about doing whatever with her one friend exactly because Rebecca so wants it to be true that Kate has a close friend.  

I like that adult Kate is still taking in what Randall said to her in the opening it, that she's still evaluating and coming to terms with her part in it.  

I'm not sure that the Ivy League is the way to go if is his dream is hotel/restaurant management..  And less so if his goal is being a 3 star Michelin chef.  But google tells me Cornell has the best hospitality program in the country, so maybe I'm wrong there.  Also, if he changes his focus that Ivy education puts him in contact with the right people in whatever field it is he ends up going in.

His whole dream made no sense no offense. You don't go to an Ivy for a business degree. And he wants to get a Bachelor's and then go to culinary school? If he wants to be a chef he needs to already be working in restaurants and focusing on that. And to be prepared for years of struggle and a probable eventual failure.

If he gets into an Ivy I'm sure he would get tons of financial aid. I think pretty much if your family income is under 100k it should be free for him, and the presence of a daughter will help him. Who's watching her while he gets his degree? I guess if he went to Penn he could keep living at home.

[gameshowjunkie]

7 hours ago, ByaNose said:

Now, I know why I’m single and don’t have kids. I didn’t notice Kate’s kit not being a pregnancy test. Who knew? LOL!!!

As someone wwho conceived with the help of ovulation test kits, I noticed right away 🙂

I was in a bad relationship in my 20s where I actually was kind of sad when I didn't get pregnant(I wasn't actively trying to and used BC but nothing is 100%)because I was trying to hold on to the relationship. I'm ashamed to even remember that now. Kate is an insecure teenager, so the storyline makes sense but it's heartbreaking.

[Jillybean]

Where is Baby Jack???

[kili]

Quote

I wonder, if teen Kate is trying to get pregnant, it isn't as much about trapping Marc as it is about doing something that would make her family have to accept him. 

Maybe it's not about trapping Marc, but for the same reason she had Baby Jack: she wants to "carry on a piece of" her father.  She thinks that if she has a baby, it will be somebody she can love and she can reconnect with her father. But Marc continues being a jerk and she ends up aborting her father's grandchild (her perception) and that further messes her up. Or Marc beats her and she loses the baby - losing her dad again. She already blames herself for her dad's death, now she's blaming herself all over again (her perception - she isn't responsible for either death). 

[Jeddah]

6 hours ago, mommalib said:

Yeah he does and that's why he told Randall he wish Randall didn't exist. At the end of the day all three of those kids got plenty of love, affection and attention. As Kevin said out of his own mouth  Jack and Rebecca wasn't perfect but thy were great parents.

Kevin never said he wished Randall didn’t exist. What he said was awful, but it wasn’t that.

Rebecca admitted she gave Randall more attention, and had an easier time raising him. In season one Kevin nearly drowned because his parents were paying attention to his siblings and not him. The show has established that Rebecca favored Randall and Jack favored Kate. Kevin’s not imagining that.

[MissLucas]

Best episode of the season so far. And given how difficult post production must be during pandemic time I appreciate the efforts of the team. 

Randall had a great episode, I loved all his scenes. Him bonding with Malik over Deja's plight was golden. And Annie got some lines!

And after all the discussions of previous weeks we did see this episode that Kevin was aware of some of Randall's struggles at the time. But he clearly had no idea how to respond. Still, the brother bonding moment was very sweet as was their parents excitement. Interesting that Kevin is still so hung up on the big fight and that Kate picked it up quickly when he used the word 'tired'. The show finally remembered that these two are supposed to have a special bond. I wonder what it means that Kevin seems to be still bothered so much by the fight (as he should be) while it's hardly anymore on Randall's radar? Also: That director was an ass and I would have returned that gift basket. I hate thinly veiled abuse pretending to be inspirational tough talk.

Whatever is going on with young Kate is not good. Present Kate on the other hand had a good episode, she was throughout the episode tuned in to others emotions and tried to be there for them. She handled Toby's anxiety pretty well, picked up on Ellie's reaction to her naming the baby and registered that Kevin was still dealing with the fight. Huge difference to early seasons Kate.

I'm dreading more parental drama for Randall. Give the character a break and let him deal with all the stuff already heaped on his shoulders. Of course that's not going to happen *sigh*

 

[ams1001]

56 minutes ago, Jillybean said:

Where is Baby Jack???

I'm assuming they (or maybe his parents) don't want little ones on set for covid-safety reasons. In the season premiere they referred to him sleeping in the other room a couple times but we never saw him. I noticed we never saw the babies in the flashback, either, just heard them (well, I guess we just heard Kevin) crying from behind closed doors.

[RedDelicious]

1 hour ago, gameshowjunkie said:

I would think they qualify for assistance but perhaps they don't want to take it?

 

1 hour ago, gameshowjunkie said:

I think pretty much if your family income is under 100k

Where is this Malik's family is poor coming from?  His dad has a busy garage and his mom has a job where she wears business attire to work.  I never got the impression that they were poor, just that both parents worked and they had to coordinate their busy schedules to help their teenage son care for his baby daughter.  They don't have money like Beth and Randall, but they seem to be comfortable.

[Blakeston]

I was glad Randall wasn't too hard on Malik, because Randall clearly bore some responsibility for what happened.

If you assign a yawning 16-year-old to do a job for the first time in his life, and he isn't even in the room with you, why on earth would you assume he did it correctly?

[Neurochick]

11 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

This is my favourite episode in a while. The flashbacks were relevant and well done, and I actually felt for all three Pearson kids without wanting to smack anyone. Points to all who predicted the Kate pregnancy.

When 18 year old Kate was leaning up against the sink looking at the test, I would have bet money it was a younger Chrissy Metz. Wow, that is some casting. And I love Jack Pearson and I'm not sorry.

I really liked this episode because the Big Three really need each other.  I liked seeing young Randall and Kevin, how Randall taught Kevin how to study; how Kevin realized that if he wanted to be a great actor, he would have to do the work, and it ended with him studying the way Randall taught him to.  I liked it when Randall told Kevin that he HAD to study for every test because in his private school, he couldn't be just average, he had to be outstanding.   

I had a feeling Kate got pregnant by that abusive boyfriend and had an abortion; just got that sense.  Should it have come up when Kate was dealing with fertility issues?  I won't should on Kate; I think she could have been in denial about it; but when Elle mentioned that SHE almost had an abortion and decided it wasn't for her, that was the trigger that caused Kate to remember.  

 

[gonzosgirrl]

7 hours ago, chocolatine said:

I rewound the Kate flashback, and she did take an ovulation test (I wasn't able to tell the brand) out of her nightstand drawer, but later in the bathroom she was holding a (positive) Clearblue pregnancy test.

You're exactly right (the ovulation test appears to be "Effortless"). And she is wearing the same clothes and hairstyle in the bathroom scene, so I believe we are to assume she went directly there when the family left. So it's either a super twisty-twist gotcha!, or a prop screw up. I am going with screw up.

 

[Quark]

Enjoyable episode. It only clicked this episode that the old man with his granddaughter had a connection to Randall and Laurel. I was thinking last week that the granddaughter would be the girl that Kate and Toby end up adopting. I suppose that could still happen though :p.

Edited November 18, 2020 by Quark

[Jillybean]

31 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

I'm assuming they (or maybe his parents) don't want little ones on set for covid-safety reasons. In the season premiere they referred to him sleeping in the other room a couple times but we never saw him. I noticed we never saw the babies in the flashback, either, just heard them (well, I guess we just heard Kevin) crying from behind closed doors.

I totally get not having babies on set, but they don't even mention him, at least not in the past couple of episodes. Toby and Kate are out and about and it's like Baby Jack doesn't exist.

[ams1001]

7 hours ago, chocolatine said:

I rewound the Kate flashback, and she did take an ovulation test (I wasn't able to tell the brand) out of her nightstand drawer, but later in the bathroom she was holding a (positive) Clearblue pregnancy test.

12 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

You're exactly right (the ovulation test appears to be "Effortless"). And she is wearing the same clothes and hairstyle in the bathroom scene, so I believe we are to assume she went directly there when the family left. So it's either a super twisty-twist gotcha!, or a prop screw up. I am going with screw up.

FWIW, I googled "Effortless ovulation test" (which didn't come up so if it was a real brand at the time it may no longer exist under that name) and the first results were Clearblue's "Easy" ovulation test kit, which contains ten ovulation tests and one pregnancy test. So I'm not sure that tells us anything.

 

[gonzosgirrl]

4 minutes ago, Jillybean said:

I totally get not having babies on set, but they don't even mention him, at least not in the past couple of episodes. Toby and Kate are out and about and it's like Baby Jack doesn't exist.

They did mention him being in dirty diapers. 😕

[Empress1]

5 minutes ago, Jillybean said:

I totally get not having babies on set, but they don't even mention him, at least not in the past couple of episodes. Toby and Kate are out and about and it's like Baby Jack doesn't exist.

They did mention him and a sitter last episode - that was when we found out that Kate only buys one pack of diapers at a time.

[gonzosgirrl]

2 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

 

FWIW, I googled "Effortless ovulation test" (which didn't come up so if it was a real brand at the time it may no longer exist under that name) and the first results were Clearblue's "Easy" ovulation test kit, which contains ten ovulation tests and one pregnancy test. So I'm not sure that tells us anything.

 

But this stick in the bathroom is clearly a pregnancy test. It has the words 'pregnant' and 'not pregnant' on it.

Edited November 18, 2020 by gonzosgirrl

[callmebetty]

I thought Randall played HS football at some point? I remember an episode where him and Kevin both had uniforms on and I think Jack and Rebecca had to split up to watch the games.

I love Annie and I feel her, I was very much the same way when it came to reading or watching things.

This was a very solid episode. 

And yes to Randall taking off his shirt anytime. 

Though I thought when they talked about it going national that we would have seen a Today show clip showing it, because they always have a segment hot viral clips. I was surprised case I was expecting to see that.

With everyone else that Jan 5th feels like a long way away.

I'm wondering if the Vietnamese Grandpa was maybe a doctor on duty when Laurel was brought in and that's how they met. I guess we'll find out next year. 

[Empress1]

34 minutes ago, RedDelicious said:

Where is this Malik's family is poor coming from?  His dad has a busy garage and his mom has a job where she wears business attire to work.  I never got the impression that they were poor, just that both parents worked and they had to coordinate their busy schedules to help their teenage son care for his baby daughter.  They don't have money like Beth and Randall, but they seem to be comfortable.

Yeah, they've established that Malik's family has less money than Randall and Beth (Malik's father has made some comments that indicate that the Pearsons have more), but that doesn't make them poor. I am not sure if Malik and his daughter qualify as their own family unit; if so, they probably don't have much in the eyes of the state, but we don't know that Malik's parents are at an income level that would qualify them for aid. I don't think they are. 

I went to an Ivy and I knew a girl in my major who had a child - she got pregnant sophomore year, had the baby over the summer, and she graduated on time. She had a lot of help from family and the baby's father, who wasn't a student. She either lived with the father or her family, I forget which (no babies in the dorms). I really liked the moment where Randall told Malik to dream big, he said he already was, and Randall was sufficiently chastened.

[shoovenbooty]

I missed recording this. Does anybody know when new episodes are available to watch on the NBC app, without linking to my TV provider? I would rather not, because I only downloaded the app to watch this episode. Against my better judgement. I think I'm hate-watching the show at this point.

Edited November 18, 2020 by shoovenbooty

[CSunshine76]

48 minutes ago, Quark said:

Enjoyable episode. It only clicked this episode that the old man with his granddaughter had a connection to Randall and Laurel. I was thinking last week that the granddaughter would be the girl that Kate and Toby end up adopting. I suppose that could still happen though :p.

But we’ve seen grown up Jack’s sister, and she isn’t Asian.  So I think they are connecting them to Randall’s mom...which in my opinion, is a ridiculous story line. Quit bringing dead folks back, show!

[3 is enough]

I'm not sure exactly when they started shooting this season, but I am wondering if they are rushing to get all of Mandy Moore's scenes filmed before she has her baby and, as a result, they are still working on missing scenes to complete the next episodes.  As I recall from previous seasons the show always went on hiatus around Thanksgiving/ early December until after the holidays, but with the late start this year in filming they just didn't have that many episodes in the can.

I did like this episode.  Aside from not being thrilled that Marc will be back, but that storyline never really wrapped up so it's not surprising.

I am confused that the Vietnamese man knew William's name.  Could it be that he was with Laurel before she was with William?  Or did Laurel ever get in touch with William again, or try to find Randall? And if she was still alive when William reunited with Randall did he try to contact her to tell her their son found him?  If so,  I can see them bringing back Ron Cephas Jones to film that storyline. 

  How long will this get dragged out?  I'm sensing how and when Jack died version 2.0.

Edited November 18, 2020 by 3 is enough

[Blakeston]

1 hour ago, MissLucas said:

And after all the discussions of previous weeks we did see this episode that Kevin was aware of some of Randall's struggles at the time. 

In the flashbacks, it seemed like the opposite to me - that we saw Randall becoming aware of Kevin struggling (with studying/memorizing).

In the present day, when Kate brought up Randall's issues with being Black in a white family, Kevin's reaction was, "But he was the favorite child!" I don't think he's been putting much thought into Randall's struggles - but that may change now.

1 hour ago, RedDelicious said:

Where is this Malik's family is poor coming from?  His dad has a busy garage and his mom has a job where she wears business attire to work.  I never got the impression that they were poor, just that both parents worked and they had to coordinate their busy schedules to help their teenage son care for his baby daughter.  They don't have money like Beth and Randall, but they seem to be comfortable.

I think the impression that Malik is poor probably comes from the episode where he wanted to sell drugs to send his daughter to daycare. He hardly seems like the same person now.

[Neurochick]

2 minutes ago, 3 is enough said:

I am confused that the Vietnamese man knew William's name.  Could it be that he was with Laurel before she was with William?  Or did Laurel ever get in touch with William again, or try to find Randall?  And if she was still alive when William reunited with Randall did he try to contact her to tell her their son found him?  How long will this get dragged out?  I'm sensing how and when Jack died version 2.0.

He could have met Laurel after her overdose, maybe he worked in the hospital?  Maybe she went to rehab and he was there too?  She could have told him William's name, and that they had a child.  

Why do we think Laurel tried to find Randall?  Maybe when she was in rehab she just hoped Randall had a better home than she could give him.  

I think she's been dead for awhile though.

[3 is enough]

1 minute ago, Neurochick said:

He could have met Laurel after her overdose, maybe he worked in the hospital?  Maybe she went to rehab and he was there too?  She could have told him William's name, and that they had a child.  

Why do we think Laurel tried to find Randall?  Maybe when she was in rehab she just hoped Randall had a better home than she could give him.  

I think she's been dead for awhile though.

I agree that the possibilities are endless.  I also tend to think that Laurel is no longer living.  But we all thought Nicky was dead too, so who knows?

I guess we will just have to be patient.  I really hope this does not prevent them from showing us the Miguel/Rebecca story.  That is long overdue.

[Empress1]

6 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

I think the impression that Malik is poor probably comes from the episode where he wanted to sell drugs to send his daughter to daycare. He hardly seems like the same person now.

I don't even remember that (I'm sure it happened, but I don't remember!) but honestly, day care is so expensive that he probably wouldn't be the first person to consider that.

[txhorns79]

7 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

I think the impression that Malik is poor probably comes from the episode where he wanted to sell drugs to send his daughter to daycare. He hardly seems like the same person now.

My impression was that they are a blue collar family.  I also vaguely recall part of the blow up during that dinner the families had together being over class. 

[Blakeston]

Just now, txhorns79 said:

My impression was that they are a blue collar family.  I also vaguely recall part of the blow up during that dinner the families had together being over class. 

Yeah, they're working class but not poor. But so much emphasis was put on the class conflict with Randall and Beth that I'm not surprised that some viewers think of Malik's family as being poor.

[Neurochick]

10 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

I don't even remember that (I'm sure it happened, but I don't remember!) but honestly, day care is so expensive that he probably wouldn't be the first person to consider that.

Day care IS expensive; a person doesn't have to be poor to be struggling with that, these days.  

[Ohiopirate02]

5 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

Yeah, they're working class but not poor. But so much emphasis was put on the class conflict with Randall and Beth that I'm not surprised that some viewers think of Malik's family as being poor.

And while Malik's parents are helping him raise his daughter, Malik is her primary caretaker.  

[tennisgurl]

9 hours ago, chocolatine said:

I also found it strange that right after making an emotionally charged speech, he started dancing and stripping like he didn't have a care in the world.

Randall makes so many big impassioned emotional speeches, often about William, that they're just business as usual now, he can give a big speech, and then move right onto doing a post speech dance, its just a typical day for Randall.

[callmebetty]

How rich would it be if William did know Laurel did live but William lied to Randall? After Randall was so mad at Rebecca for keeping William away from him, to find that Saint William kept a secret would be interesting. 

[memememe76]

With Covid and me not wanting to go to the gym, I will run near my workplace and change in my office. I don’t dance around, however. 
 

I also like the casual Asian representation on the show. The grandfather and granddaughter, Jae-Won, and the actress who played Mulan on Once Upon a Time playing Kevin’s costar. 

[Quickbeam]

1 hour ago, shoovenbooty said:

I missed recording this. Does anybody know when new episodes are available to watch on the NBC app, without linking to my TV provider? I would rather not, because I only downloaded the app to watch this episode. Against my better judgement. I think I'm hate-watching the show at this point.

The show streams on Peacock a week later. Not sure if that helps.....

Edited November 18, 2020 by Quickbeam
Typo

[nexxie]

Lots of good stuff this episode - loved that moment when Deja said something like, “You know you just ruined my life - thank you.”