S05.E04: Episode 4

[LoveLeigh]

Noah, Margaret (Kathleen Chalfant) and Stacey (Leya Catlett) bond over their mutual distaste for Sasha (Claes Bang). Noah attempts to sabotage Helen and Sasha's relationship. Whitney and Colin (Max Fowler) face the hardships of their relationship. Joanie (Anna Paquin) visits the graveyard.

Edited September 15, 2019 by DakotaLavender

[LoveLeigh]

1. What was the song at the very end.... it sounded like "fall to pieces." 

2. Again with the 3 minute teaser of "Joanie" at the very end. 

3. Poor Whitney. Is she a masochist? The best part of the episode was Margaret. 

[LotusFlower]

The show seems to continue its screw-you attitude to Ruth Wilson/Alison by giving her story yet another barely five-minute segment tagged on at the end.  Why do they even bother?

[DiabLOL]

When I was younger I worked in quite a few galleries in NYC and I know tons of people who have as well both in NYC, L.A., etc and I've never heard of anyone having to open a gallery at 7AM the way Whitney does. 

Possible? Whatever. 

I have no idea what she sees in her loser boyfriend. More importantly having to put on a live sex show for some voyeur who can "get her" her very own gallery?! Again. Never heard of such a thing. WTF writers?

Wasn't the voyeur supposed to be a very big deal collector? So how exactly would he "get her" a gallery? It makes no sense just like Whitney's fiance studying for his immediate US citizenship.

At this point Furcat and Sasha are the same person in my mind.

Trevor is getting the Huge Bitch edit. How original.

The scene where Noah was actually going to plant the sex toys in Helen and Sasha's bedroom was ridiculous enough then it got even worse with that bra and then he got caught! I didn't think they could top last week's near fatal second hand shame karaoke scene but hello! Noah left that woman topless without a second thought. I guess his brain was fried after seeing his ex MIL vigorously penetrate a Fleshlight with a horse tail butt plug. It happens!

[LoveLeigh]

50 minutes ago, LotusFlower said:

The show seems to continue its screw-you attitude to Ruth Wilson/Alison by giving her story yet another barely five-minute segment tagged on at the end.  Why do they even bother?

It is a teaser designed to get the audience to keep going back. It is soooo manipulative at this point. 

[NeenerNeener]

9 hours ago, DakotaLavender said:

What was the song at the very end.... it sounded like "fall to pieces." 

I googled the lyrics, I think the song is called "Noise" by Zsela. It wasn't as easy to find as it should have been; there are a lot of lyrics with "fallen angel" in them these days.

I don't know why Helen is so proud of Whitney. I'm horrified by the life she's living now, and I alternate between feeling sorry for her and thinking she's getting what she deserves for being such a brat in the earlier seasons.

If anybody asked me how many cousins I personally have I would have to think long and hard and would probably need a piece of paper and a pen to list them all so I wouldn't count some of them twice. To ask me how many cousins my SO has....nope, couldn't come up with the right answer. 

ETA: and is Whitney settling down with a "tortured artist" because he reminds her of dear old Dad?

Edited September 15, 2019 by NeenerNeener

[Stad15]

RIP Cole.  Now the question is how he died.

[LoveLeigh]

1 hour ago, NeenerNeener said:

I googled the lyrics, I think the song is called "Noise" by Zsela. It wasn't as easy to find as it should have been; there are a lot of lyrics with "fallen angel" in them these days.

Is it "I Fall to Pieces," by Lana Del Rey? 

[NeenerNeener]

11 minutes ago, DakotaLavender said:

Is it "I Fall to Pieces," by Lana Del Rey? 

The song at the end of the Whitney segment and all through the Joanie segment is "Noise":

https://genius.com/Zsela-noise-lyrics

There's just a little instrumental through the credits.

[DoubleUTeeEff]

I laughed a lot this episode. Trevor was on his A game.

Margaret: If you have to be gay, can't you at least be elegant?

Trevor: Like Grandpa?

--------------------------

Noah: You told him?

Margaret: Look at him! He's practically a woman!

Trevor: More so than you.

-----------------------------

Margaret demonstrating the pocket pussy and Noah saying "Are you sure it's Bruce who's losing his mind?

Also laughed at "Andrea Rossman. I love your vaginas" to Furkat. I never thought we'd see him again.

11 hours ago, DiabLOL said:

Wasn't the voyeur supposed to be a very big deal collector? So how exactly would he "get her" a gallery? It makes no sense just like Whitney's fiance studying for his immediate US citizenship.

I just thought he was rich, so he could provide the funds for her to open her own gallery. It would up to her to make it a success.

Why can't Whitney and her fiance get legally married at City Hall so that he could work and then still have the wedding they were planning later? There really wouldn't be any reason they couldn't do that, is there?  Isn't that the obvious solution?

[weaver]

Did all the writers quit last year ?  Noah’s POV was ludicrous.   Helen BUTLER is treating him like an errand boy.   Trevor is an entitled,  rude, snobby brat, and Noah himself tries to execute a ridiculous prank conceived by Margaret.  I think Margaret has become senile.  I love Kathleen Chalfant but I think she doesn’t know how to say her lines anymore because they don’t make sense.  Helen is proud of all these kids and thinks Whitney is very successful because she can name three currently famous artists whose work would fit on any wall.  

Then we get to the brilliant Whitney slaving away for an unknown artist while paying all the bills for her opportunistic would be green card holder.  Oh, just like mommy did at the bagel store while Daddy Noah wrote his novel.  Mommy just never happened to mention it in 20 years.  Helens father wouldn’t fund them?  Is this all a dream?  

I never thought Furcat would appear on my screen again.  He did and it was too soon. 

At least the writers brought in one realistic element.  Helen needs money.  

They really hate Noah.   

So Cole just recently died.  

Edited September 15, 2019 by weaver

[cardigirl]

I enjoyed this episode quite a bit. Noah's point of view was fun. The whole "get Sasha" plan was hilarious until it wasn't.  

I've never known what they were trying to do with poor Whitney. Furkat remains a jerk. 

So, Cole made it to 2053.  What year is Joanie in? Have they told us?  He was 74, according to the headstone, when he died.

[chocolatine]

4 hours ago, Stad15 said:

RIP Cole.  Now the question is how he died.

9 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

So, Cole made it to 2053.  What year is Joanie in? Have they told us?  He was 74, according to the headstone, when he died.

I think Joanie's POV must be not too long after. It looked like the house hasn't been touched since Cole's death, and Joanie was finally ready to clean it up after a period of grief/denial. There were many prescription pill bottles, which suggests that he died of an illness. Also, IICR, Joanie was born in 2015, so she would have been 38 when Cole died. Anna Paquin is 37 in real life, and I don't think Joanie is supposed to be significantly older than that in her POV.

Whitney's story is just so cliche. Why must every college-educated, 20-something woman on TV be struggling in a creative field? It would be so refreshing if she had gone for a high-paying field so that she'd never have to depend on her dysfunctional family's money. She's always been disdainful of Noah even before he left Helen for Alison, why is she now so devoted to a man who is just like Noah?

And biggest WTF of all, Helen claiming she worked in a "bagel factory" in Europe to support Noah when they were in their 20s. I've lived in several European countries and traveled to most of the others. Bagels were not a thing in Western Europe in the 90s.

[NeenerNeener]

15 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

Whitney's story is just so cliche. Why must every college-educated, 20-something woman on TV be struggling in a creative field?

Did Whitney ever get a degree, or just "life experience" from chasing Cole's brother and wandering the world with Furkat? Mostly I just remember her acting like a totally entitled snot in the first 3 or 4 seasons.

[chocolatine]

16 minutes ago, NeenerNeener said:

Did Whitney ever get a degree, or just "life experience" from chasing Cole's brother and wandering the world with Furkat? Mostly I just remember her acting like a totally entitled snot in the first 3 or 4 seasons.

I thought she did at some point. The interlude with Furkat was pretty brief as far as I recall, and she's 24 now, so she must have done something in the intervening years.

[preeya]

COLIN:  "Let's go to city hall and get it over with so I can take this idiotic test so I can work in this godforsaken country."

Fuck you you little shit.

Edited September 16, 2019 by preeya

[preeya]

17 hours ago, LotusFlower said:

The show seems to continue its screw-you attitude to Ruth Wilson/Alison by giving her story yet another barely five-minute segment tagged on at the end.  Why do they even bother?

Is Paquin on a part timers salary?  Four episodes in and she's been on screen less than ten minutes. And why has Whitney become a focal point? I could care less about her, her siblings, and her artiste friends! This episode was a total waste of time.

ETA: How long before Helen is in rehab? Best part was the mother-in-law with the sex toys. 

Oh yeah, "he likes to watch"

Edited September 15, 2019 by preeya

[chick binewski]

18 hours ago, DiabLOL said:

At this point Furcat and Sasha are the same person in my mind.

Sasha instantly reminded me of Furcat during the premiere. Good to know FC is still a creepy shit. I was doing my best Church Lady impersonation during her sex scene.

I love that Margaret warmed a little towards Noah, in a very Margaret fashion (except possibly for the pocket pussy).

I am flummoxed by Europeans making their bagels in factories, basically bc they take their bread seriously and tend not to go for Wonder bread disguised as something else. More puzzling and much less realistic is Helen's new career as a decorator for multi-million dollar homes. 

[texassunflower]

RIP Cole. I thought it was possible that Joshua Jackson might make an appearance or two this season. I guess not unless it's a flashback. I could care less about Whitney and her point of view. She was half the show this week. I am surprised that Anna Paquin took this role. She's an established actress and she has had less than 30 minutes of screen time so far. I am not sure why I am watching at this point. I am not invested in any of the current storylines. I am waiting for Joanie's storyline to advance. I am interested in whether or not she discovers that Alison was murdered. 

[nara]

19 hours ago, DiabLOL said:

When I was younger I worked in quite a few galleries in NYC and I know tons of people who have as well both in NYC, L.A., etc and I've never heard of anyone having to open a gallery at 7AM the way Whitney does. 

Possible? Whatever. 

Unreliable narrator. Whitney clearly sees herself as Cinderella. She may be working hard for the first time in her life and she’s unable to use her sexuality with her boss. In her mind, she she’s this as working ridiculous hours in sweatshop conditions.

11 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

I don't know why Helen is so proud of Whitney. I'm horrified by the life she's living now, and I alternate between feeling sorry for her and thinking she's getting what she deserves for being such a brat in the earlier seasons.

If anybody asked me how many cousins I personally have I would have to think long and hard and would probably need a piece of paper and a pen to list them all so I wouldn't count some of them twice. To ask me how many cousins my SO has....nope, couldn't come up with the right answer. 

Again, I think it’s Whitney’s perception that her mom thinks she’s successful. I don’t think we’ve heard that from Helen’s POV.

I think the writers‘ perception of the immigration interview is different from reality. I think a couple that met in college and is actually living together and having sex would not have that much trouble demonstrating that they are an actual couple. The question would be whether they have been together long enough to be wanting to marry each other and questions like favorite color would be less relevant.

7 hours ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

I laughed a lot this episode. Trevor was on his A game.

I laughed a lot too, but it was all about Noah and Margaret. Him thinking that a woman in her 70’s would have tampons was pretty funny.

6 hours ago, chocolatine said:

And biggest WTF of all, Helen claiming she worked in a "bagel factory" in Europe to support Noah when they were in their 20s. I've lived in several European countries and traveled to most of the others. Bagels were not a thing in Western Europe in the 90s.

I may be giving the writers too much credit but I assumed that it meant that Whitney wasn’t really listening to what her mother was saying.

A couple of people mentioned that Sasha resembles Furkat. I suspect we may see Sasha hit on Whitney in the future...That would definitely be a dealbreaker for Helen.

[izabella]

Every sex scene on this show is always cringe-inducing.  And ewww to Whitney getting right into bed with her fiance after having cheated on him and not even cleaning up one little bit.

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Noah holding a dildo - a dick holding a dick.

Helen and Noah's kids, still insufferable.  Shut up, Trevor!

Helen has never looked more dour than she did in the Cleopatra wig. 

[LoveLeigh]

Next week is already episode 5 and Joanie's story is not even developed. I am really getting pissed. I like the show a lot but the Whitney plot is boring for me and the Trevor plot seems shtiky and shoe horned in and Helen is annoying.

If I do not get more Joanie next week I am going to go crazy on twitter. 

[ScoobieDoobs]

Shitty, shitty, shitty writing in this ep.  I was ducking all the cliches being thrown fast & furious.  Ugh, baby-gay Trev had to go as Frank-n-furter?  Really?  Eyes rolling hard at the predictability.  Ugh, please don’t turn him into Jack McFarland before the season is out, will ya, Treem?  

Now, if Trev slyly perked up at the sight of Margaret’s dildo, that would have been funny!  Guess I could write this season better than any of Treem’s talentless shitheads. 

The idiotic storyline of Noah planting that stupid shit in Sasha’s bedroom seemed like an update on something Treem’s hack writers stole from Wally, the Beav & Eddie Haskell from a hundred years ago.  Seriously, Treem, what the fuckety fuck with this crap?  Made me cringe, it was so unoriginal & stupid.

And thanks a fucking lot, Treem, for totally rejecting the Me Too Movement & showing us how a twit like Whitney is fine & dandy to cheat on her loser bf with that ugly old hipster wannabe & fuck her way to get ahead.  Real nice.

Oh, and yet another ep where I beat the absolute shit outta Joel thru my TV.  Yet again, I just had to do it . . .

Wait a sec, was Trev implying that Helen’s father is bi?  Hmmm, now that’s kinda interesting.  Margaret said (last ep) that he spent their marriage “fucking anything with a hole” & I was puzzled at that.  Guess it doesn’t mean much — just more shit Treem is throwing at us.

2 minutes with Joanie & that’s 2 minutes of my life I won’t get back.  OK, so we learned Cole dies 34 years in future.  So what? Confirmation we won’t see Josh in oldster makeup?  

[Razzberry]

Poor poor overworked Whitney.  I also wondered if Sasha and Furball were played by the same actor.   I can't remember If she's supposed to be an artist.  I've never seen anything she's done besides fucking people, and that guy looks old enough to be her grandpa. Give me a break. 

Margaret's dildo-gate backfired big time.

[stormy weather]

On 9/15/2019 at 8:55 AM, DiabLOL said:

I have no idea what she sees in her loser boyfriend. More importantly having to put on a live sex show for some voyeur who can "get her" her very own gallery?! Again. Never heard of such a thing. WTF writers?

Like I wrote on this forum last week, the only two items missing from the "list of current topics of interest" this show seems so keen on compiling were the Me Too movement and gun violence. This week, thanks to the scene you mentioned, we got Me Too. Only one to go, guys. I repeat, I don't enjoy being ironic about these things at all, but honestly it's getting ridiculous. 

Noah is being treated like proper shite by Sasha and Helen and I admit I kind of felt bad for him because even though planting the sex toys was a very dumb idea and he did leave that poor groupie half naked in the tool shed, I would react waaaay worse if I found out my ex-wife's new bf is going around telling my own kids I'm a loser, has banned me from the set of the film he's shooting thanks to me and is also sharing writing credits for a book I spent 10 years of my life writing.

In the Joanie segment, apart from the fact that she inexplicably threw out all the pictures and Gabriel's chest (does she even know about Gabriel?), we also learned that she can fix solar panels and that tires on bicycles that haven't been used in 30 years can still be fully inflated, which are both very interesting things.

To conclude, I hope Helen gets more money so they can send Trevor to a boarding school in Switzerland and we never have to see him again.

Edited September 16, 2019 by stormy weather

[cardigirl]

11 hours ago, chick binewski said:

Sasha instantly reminded me of Furcat during the premiere. Good to know FC is still a creepy shit. I was doing my best Church Lady impersonation during her sex scene.

I love that Margaret warmed a little towards Noah, in a very Margaret fashion (except possibly for the pocket pussy).

I am flummoxed by Europeans making their bagels in factories, basically bc they take their bread seriously and tend not to go for Wonder bread disguised as sng elseomethi. More puzzling and much less realistic is Helen's new career as a decorator for multi-million dollar homes. 

Yes, the millions of Europeans are all fed by boutique bakeries.

Edited September 16, 2019 by cardigirl
Duplication is not good.

[bc1795]

Is Whitless and Furball's little trist going to be on display at a gallery at some point?

If I only cared about any of this.

[Milburn Stone]

I can understand Noah's temporary insanity caused by his exile from the movie set and other humiliations at the hand of Sasha. But it has surprised me that he expected his novel not to be altered by Hollywood. The general public has known for most of the last hundred years that writers, once they sell their work to the movies, lose control over it. I don't blame him, however, for considering arbitration over the screenplay credit. Just as I agree with those two guys who are his "representation" that it would be counter to his own interests to pursue that.

Edited September 16, 2019 by Milburn Stone

[LibertarianSlut]

 I realized why I have been loathe to comment on this show, even though I like it:  the format has become insufferable.  It's not Rashomon anymore, which portrays different perspectives on the same events.  It's just the unreliable narrator now.  Which means that if I were to say, "Collin is such a piece of shit not to get Whitney coffee grounds when he said he would," anyone could (justifiably) respond with, "but that was Whitney's perspective.  In real life, he could have gotten her 5 lbs of coffee."  And no one has the answer!

I have given this a modicum of thought, and I decided I am just going to take any material that is unrebutted as true, sort of the way Judge Judy will take one litigant's story as true if the opposing party tells her they can't remember.  

Without some governing principal in place, the show means literally nothing.  There is nothing to say Margaret was even in the house, let alone provided sex toys, nothing to say there was even a party at Sasha's--all of that stuff could have emanated out of Noah's imagination as he watched TV on the couch.  That is absurd.  

So, taking everything as true (if an enhanced version of the truth), I have observations:

I love the Margaret scenes.  She is good.  I thought she and her husband lived in the city, and the Montauk home was only a vacation home.  Did I miss something, or are we just hand-waving it?

This is the second episode that Margaret was sent out to get something (first, formula, this week, pads).  Are we supposed to get something out of that?  Perhaps she's disposable.  I also noticed an 'invitation' theme in this ep.  There was the question of who was invited to Sasha's party, and then Fukrat's gallery opening.  Is this a theme of inclusion vs exclusion, or am I reading too deeply?

Why was Noah staying "in case Stacy needed anything"?  The girl needed a damn maxi-pad, Noah, damn.  Way to be dramatic.  When she wouldn't come out of the bathroom, I thought for sure she was miscarrying, so maybe my expectations for drama are a little high.

I thought it was sweet that Stacy wasn't going to go to the party unless her dad was invited.  Can Trevor be killed off?

I thought Margaret was broke.  Those were several thousands of dollars of sex toys there.  People in the know told me...

Was I the only geography nerd to be annoyed that Sasha referred to his home as being "down here" two episodes ago, only for it to be mentioned twice that he lives in Malibu?  Malibu is "up" not "down" from almost every other party of LA, and certainly up from the part where Helen lives.

Since I'm nitpicking, I found that shows never get school scenes right.  A teacher and a principal wouldn't be speaking openly at full volume about something private, even in an empty classroom.  At one point they both had their backs to the door, so any kid could have been eavesdropping.  Also, they got the bell wrong.  The bell rang and students immediately begin filing into the classroom.  That bell meant that class was out, which meant the kids have 3-4 minutes to get to their next class, and, believe me, they use it.  Even if your last class was across the hall, you're not getting to get to your next class that early.  What everyone used to do when I was in school would be to go over to the other class, put down their things, and go back into the hallway to talk, until just before the bell that began class rang.  I only point this out, because how lazy can you be to get high school social politics wrong?  I'm in my thirties, and as soon as those kids started filing in at the sound of the bell, I was like, "oh, ok, well that's wrong."  Is Treem sleeping on the job?

I know I said I was going to take this as true, but Whitney's story has got to be exaggerated, right?  There is no one as bad as Collin in real life, is there?  From not refilling the coffee, not knowing how to unclog a goddamn toilet or even look for a plunger, not handling the landlord's notices and letters, "working" on art all day and quizzing Whitney about details of his life that no one is ever going to expect her to know when she's exhausted, so that he can work legally in this "godforsaken country" (hey, at least they're switching up the dialogue a little; Luisa merely called it "this fucking country"), and making cliched critiques about art, he was a figment of her imagination, right?  And the icing on the motherfucking cake was when he characterized the book he was reading as "an investment."  You mean, you had Whitney "invest" in a library card that you can use to take out as many free books as you want, you pretentious dick?  He's fake.  I made up my mind.  

And if he's real, there are plenty of opportunities to work illegally in this country.  Go stand in the parking lot of Home Depot, wait for a construction van to cruise up and hire you, do a few days of back-breaking work and get paid in cash so that you can, I dunno, keep a roof over your head?  (My dad has a construction business and he said these guys who wait in the parking lot charge and get a lot of money, so don't give me shit about not being able to work, lazy bastard).  If construction's not your thing, walk up to the back door of two dozen restaurants and someone is bound to need a dishwasher for $10 an hour.  I'm a citizen, but I've worked a half dozen "illegal" jobs in my life.  It's not rocket science to get one.

Call me the biggest whore in the window of Macy's (callback to Bethenny Frankel), but when Fukrat walked in the gallery, my immediate thought was "Go to him.  Sleep your way up.  Do anything to get away from that awful man and your terrible boss."  If a guy can get Whitney a gallery (I know nothing of the art world, but it seemed possible on its face), get it girl!  Get money from Noah, which he offered in a past episode.  Get money from Helen when she asks how you're doing financially, even if she's in her own financial dire straights.  I realized there was something worse that prostitution, and it was Whitney's life and future as it was portrayed.  

I thought I had been in some shitty situations in my lifetime, but I always had access to AC and indoor plumbing!  I've had awful bosses, but I've never had to come home to a lazy slob.  <Shivers>

If Whitney were really in love with this guy, I'd say, ok, whatever, they're two kids, let them go for it, but I don't think she likes him, let alone loves him.  I think she's with him out of some misguided sense of responsibility to keep him in the country (which, I agree, is being written nonsensically).  Life is too short to live steeped in guilt and trying to not be like your dad.  If this guy wants to stay in the country in this manner, fair enough.  But find someone else to go along with your half-baked plan; someone who is just as desperate as you in a different way. Dr Phil is littered with people who would work this scheme with Collin, so it's not like Whitney or bust. And, just cause this is how the world works, maybe Collin should try to work his scheme with someone who is less hot next time. 

I care not about Joanie and her side-zippered sweatshirt from the future.  Alison and Cole are over.  I don't think we're going to learn anything of value from her, especially given that she too is an unreliable narrator.

[HC87]

OK,  I'm oldish but am I the only one who thought Whitney had on only a slip or something not an actual dress?

The ridiculousness of this show marches on....carry on.

[preeya]

1 hour ago, LibertarianSlut said:

I know I said I was going to take this as true, but Whitney's story has got to be exaggerated, right?  There is no one as bad as Collin in real life, is there?  From not refilling the coffee, not knowing how to unclog a goddamn toilet or even look for a plunger, not handling the landlord's notices and letters, "working" on art all day and quizzing Whitney about details of his life that no one is ever going to expect her to know when she's exhausted, so that he can work legally in this "godforsaken country"

I don't trust the "little shit" Colin. The painting bullshit is probably just that, bullshit. He's a user and is likely going to dump her when she finally realizes he's a loser. Actually she should dump him. All that said, I couldn't care less about this and hope it ends sooner than later.

[stormy weather]

1 hour ago, LibertarianSlut said:

Why was Noah staying "in case Stacy needed anything"?  The girl needed a damn maxi-pad, Noah, damn.  Way to be dramatic.  When she wouldn't come out of the bathroom, I thought for sure she was miscarrying, so maybe my expectations for drama are a little high.

Yours and mine both, because although I called "first period" on Stacey (but only 'cause she's like 11), I was 100% sure Whitney was going to find out she was pregnant, judging by the amount of huffing and puffing and sweating and almost passing out after lifting one painting at the gallery. Okay there was no A/C but it was still a tad too much.
Well, while I am SO, SO glad she isn't, I must say this could've been a great opportunity for Sarah Treem to add "anchor babies" to my aforementioned list of "issues this show is dealing with for no reason".
Also, if my dad had waited outside the bathroom the day I got my first period it would've been so creepy I would've probably called social services on him myself. Helicopter parenting has ruined everything.

[preeya]

1 hour ago, HC87 said:

OK,  I'm oldish but am I the only one who thought Whitney had on only a slip or something not an actual dress?

The ridiculousness of this show marches on....carry on.

I'm also oldish and thought the exact same thing.

[Razzberry]

2 hours ago, stormy weather said:

Also, if my dad had waited outside the bathroom the day I got my first period it would've been so creepy I would've probably called social services on him myself. Helicopter parenting has ruined everything.

If my dad made such a BFD out of it and hung around the bathroom "just in case I needed him" I would have him removed from the home.

Funniest moment was Trevor worrying about being embarrassed by having his grandmother drive him to the party.  

How does he think Grandma feels?

Edited September 16, 2019 by Razzberry

[LuvMyShows]

On 9/15/2019 at 2:56 PM, weaver said:

Helen needs money.  

Yes, so she hires an assistant.  Way to go realism!

22 hours ago, chick binewski said:

More puzzling and much less realistic is Helen's new career as a decorator for multi-million dollar homes. 

Such BS.  And she's so incredibly busy already?  I guess they want us to believe that doing Sasha Mann's house really launched her career big-time?

21 hours ago, nara said:

Him thinking that a woman in her 70’s would have tampons was pretty funny.

But what I didn't understand was that Margaret had apparently figured out that Stacy had gotten her period, but did nothing about getting the supplies.  And I bet that somewhere in the house are plenty of supplies, given that Whitney undoubtedly stays there sometimes and Helen probably had leftovers (if she's even been through menopause).

21 hours ago, PrincessPurrsALot said:

Helen has never looked more dour than she did in the Cleopatra wig. 

And the partygoers at Sasha Mann's famous party would certainly love being handed Halloween swag by a bunch of kids! 

[Toodleoo]

Noah’s wide-eyed disbelief at Sasha’s script takeover was really stretching it. There have been plenty of public instances of script control wrangling between authors, actors, screenwriters, directors...come on, he’d have to have been living in a cave not to know this.

His whole portion of this episode was just stupid and borderline Three’s Company crap.

[WaltersHair]

I'm not a Paquin fan, so I've been avoiding this season. But, heck, I've watched all the  seasons as they've aired and commented so why stop now?

Quote

COLIN:  "Let's go to city hall and get it over with so I can take this idiotic test so I can work in this godforsaken country." Fuck you you little sht.

A frickin men. Considering I sponsored my SIL, my brother paid untold thousands to an immigration lawyer to do the paperwork and she just took the test and oath with great pride, Colin can blow.

I need to go back and watch the first three, but I fear without Ruth Wilson (or J. Jackson?) I'm going to be hard pressed not to FF.

[scrb]

On 9/15/2019 at 1:16 PM, NeenerNeener said:

Did Whitney ever get a degree, or just "life experience" from chasing Cole's brother and wandering the world with Furkat? Mostly I just remember her acting like a totally entitled snot in the first 3 or 4 seasons.

It's not impossible that she would grow up.  But they haven't shown why she would.

Now if she felt alienated from the way her mother depended financially on her parents all those years, I can see her willing to be a martyr and sticking it out with the artist-with-integrity boyfriend.

But we've seen her as spoiled throughout the series until this season.  Why wouldn't she jump as soon as Furkat the successful artist came?  Well she did succumb didn't she?

Then she has that little sordid scene with the guy watching -- he's rich, he could hire people to do that in front of him all the time, without buying anyone a gallery -- and then crawls back in bed with Colin without showering?

If you thought Helen making sandwiches without washing her hands after sneaking around with Vik in the basement was bad, then what was that about?

Was that an act of affection towards Colin or an act of hate or spite?

In any event, they must not have enough material to fill Noah and Helen's stories or Joanie's so they first interject Janelle's little arc and now Whitney, who's never had her own POV segment before, AFAIK.

[scrb]

On 9/15/2019 at 1:16 PM, NeenerNeener said:

Did Whitney ever get a degree, or just "life experience" from chasing Cole's brother and wandering the world with Furkat? Mostly I just remember her acting like a totally entitled snot in the first 3 or 4 seasons.

She's suppose to know art.

Yet she took up with Furkat, who is suppose to be a fraud with his vagina photos.

At the tender age of 24, her dream is to champion new young artists.

[scrb]

16 hours ago, stormy weather said:

Noah is being treated like proper shite by Sasha and Helen and I admit I kind of felt bad for him because even though planting the sex toys was a very dumb idea and he did leave that poor groupie half naked in the tool shed, I would react waaaay worse if I found out my ex-wife's new bf is going around telling my own kids I'm a loser, has banned me from the set of the film he's shooting thanks to me and is also sharing writing credits for a book I spent 10 years of my life writing.

In the Joanie segment, apart from the fact that she inexplicably threw out all the pictures and Gabriel's chest (does she even know about Gabriel?), we also learned that she can fix solar panels and that tires on bicycles that haven't been used in 30 years can still be fully inflated, which are both very interesting things.

Looks like the endgame for Noah and Helen is whether they reconcile.  Have a sneaky feeling they're going there, though the previews for next episode has Helen saying "I'm not in love with you any more" to Noah.

Whether they do or not, who cares at this point.  They've alternated between hooking up and then wanting to be rid of each other more than once.  So wherever they are at the end of the series, they could keep doing this back and forth thing again and again the rest of their lives.

They made a big part of this final season about Noah and Helen's relationship, which just goes to show you they didn't have many ideas for continuing after Ruth Wilson left the show.  Probably Showtime offered them money to do one more season and they accepted even though they didn't have very good ideas.

For Joanie, maybe they will wrap up the present story line and the last few episodes will have longer Joanie POV segments.

In any event, surprised she went for the car first rather than go with the bike first.  Or maybe they had one of the electric scooters laying around the garage.

She's getting settled in there, rather than worrying about her job or her family back home.  So she didn't go to Montauk with plans of investigating her mother's death apparently.  She's taking her time getting comfortable there rather than play detective.

[preeya]

30 minutes ago, scrb said:

They made a big part of this final season about Noah and Helen's relationship, which just goes to show you they didn't have many ideas for continuing after Ruth Wilson left the show.  Probably Showtime offered them money to do one more season and they accepted even though they didn't have very good ideas.

↑↑ Hitting the nail on the head ↑↑  Absolutely true, because so far this shit has been abysmal. The assumption was the added season would be to solve Allison's death.

[izabella]

I don't remember how Joanie arrived at the house, nor how she got to and from the bar in the last episode.  Didn't she have a rental car?   I hated Alison's little bicycle, so was irritated to see it again.

Edited September 17, 2019 by izabella

[TexasGal]

9 hours ago, izabella said:

I don't remember how Joanie arrived at the house, nor how she got to and from the bar in the last episode.  Didn't she have a rental car?   I hated Alison's little bicycle, so was irritated to see it again.

She walked from the train station when she first got there.  I guess she walked to the bar too.

Other than echoing the thoughts above about Whitney's POV - was it necessary?  was she wearing a slip? - my other random thoughts were:

• They are so broke they can't pay the rent but she just THROWS WINE DOWN THE SINK because she thinks he doesn't want her to drink?  
• As much as I can't stand Whitney, that scene where they are in bed and he's practically snuggled on top of her and she tries to move away only to have him re-establish the snuggle - very effectively conveyed how suffocated she's feeling.  I was getting antsy watching it. 

[MaggieG]

I had to laugh at Margaret buying the sex toys. So ridiculous. 

I watched this before going to sleep and had a dream that my mother was dating Furcat. I'm not sure what to make of that but will be having a talk with my mom about her taste in men 😆

[AngelaHunter]

On 9/15/2019 at 9:42 PM, chick binewski said:

much less realistic is Helen's new career as a decorator for multi-million dollar homes. 

I was wondering how much time had passed since the last episode and how Helen became qualified to be an interior decorator in those million dollar homes. This is not a career one can just take up on whim.

37 minutes ago, MaggieG said:

I had to laugh at Margaret buying the sex toys. So ridiculous.

And really, did Noah think Helen would be so shocked and horrified at her big-time actor boyfriend owning sex toys? Is Noah that naive or does he think Helen is? That whole interlude was ridiculous  as the woman who, in a whole house full of hot guys, just wants Noah Sex God Solloway so badly she's willing to have a knee-trembler with him out by the recycling bins or wherever they ended up. Well, yes - it holds to what I said last time that any woman who meets Noah's gaze just drops her panties. He's kind of like a reverse Medusa. AND she's okay with him taking her bra, leaving her there half-naked and saying, "I'll be back."? Noah sticking the pink bra for Helen to find, just the way she found the same thing when he was having the affair with Alison - can't the writers make him just a bit more of a dick?

Of course Trevor can't just be a normal, maybe confused teen who is gay. He has to be Super Gay, just as (whatever is the name of the new co-principal?) can't be just a little kooky. He has to be over-the-top Super Kooky, just to make sure we Get It. FurKat - over-the-top Super Sleaze. Characters are being turned into cartoons, with very little humanity.

Whitney is now a martyr who is willing to slave away in a dumpy sweatbox where she is treated like an indentured servant, then go back to her dumpy apartment where her annoying, pretentious, lazy asshole boyfriend is taking naps. Poor little "Cinderella."  And would FurKat's rich friend be willing to pay what amounts to a fortune for Whitney to open her own gallery just for the thrill of watching her have clothed sex with Furkat? He could hire hundreds - thousands - of top-tier prostitutes to put on elaborate shows for him for that amount of money. Oh, and Whitney coming home and getting into bed with Colin without even taking a shower or washing first? Tacky!

Just for comparison, I rewatched the very first episode of this series the other night. Wow, what a difference. I saw what hooked me on this immediately when I found it by accident. It really is another show now, like an x-rated sitcom.

*ETA: I just saw this last night, and haven't had time to read all the comments so apologies for any repetitions!*

Edited September 17, 2019 by AngelaHunter

[Snewtsie]

Ridiculous. The whole hour. Why are we getting these random POV segments?- Janeen, Whitney, ...who next?  And who cares?  The only thing I enjoyed in this episode was learning Helen is tapped out financially. That was the only moment of the hour that made any sense to me.

And what will we see next week in Joanie's life?  Her sitting & eating a bowl of cereal?

[msrachelj]

On 9/15/2019 at 11:17 PM, izabella said:

Every sex scene on this show is always cringe-inducing.  And ewww to Whitney getting right into bed with her fiance after having cheated on him and not even cleaning up one little bit.

She acts like a moron all the time. A doormat, a kept woman. Her family has bucks, she doesn't have to live like that with that loser who only wants a green card. And he sure as hell is gonna smell another man on her. 

[AngelaHunter]

4 hours ago, Snewtsie said:

And what will we see next week in Joanie's life?  Her sitting & eating a bowl of cereal?

Only if she has a little Cereal Drone to pour the milk, and she has to fight with it to give her some extra over the daily allotment.

4 hours ago, msrachelj said:

Her family has bucks, she doesn't have to live like that with that loser who only wants a green card.

I still have not seen what is so compelling about him that would motivate her to live that way. From what we've glimpsed of him, he's boring, lazy, superior, sarcastic and seems to care only about himself. But maybe it's a "trip" to play at poverty when you know you can quit whenever you like. 

[EtheltoTillie]

Possible unpopular opinion here but Helen has a lot of chutzpah treating Noah so badly given that he went to prison for her crime.  Yes, Noah is an asshole but still . . .   They act like they even forgot this plot point. It's like traditional soap operas where they can't keep the stories going for thirty years so they just throw arrows at a dartboard.   People who once hated each other end up married to each other and so on. 

ETA. This show is a mixed up mess but I keep watching. 

Edited September 18, 2019 by GussieK