19 Things I Hate About You: How the Duggars Infuriate

[Growsonwalls]

There's no reason the girls can't be modest and also wear some nice clothing. Instead it's ugly horizontal stripe t-shirts, jean skirts, and flip flops. It seems unique to the Duggars, as the other Gothard families we've seen on the show have the girls dressed modestly, but also not in Walmart t-shirts and flip flops. 

[Fostersmom]

I think the girls like the style they've adopted. It's not like Michelle is a) shopping for them or b) dresses like that herself. It seems the girls do all the shopping for the whole family, with possibly the exception of Michelle's green shirts. Jessa and Jinger have started wearing much shorter and form fitting skirts lately and some more stylish shirts. I don't see Jana changing too much, but just like Michael Bates, it looks like she's not as ready to change her style as drastically. Joy still strikes me as a tomboy at heart and seems content with whatever she grabs out of the closet. Jill is between Jana and Jessa, style wise and another one who seems to be happy with how she dresses. I just wish the girls would buy some real shoes. Even $8 ballet flats from Walmart would be better than the flip-flops. I've seen a few pictures lately of the little girls wearing some cute sandals, so maybe there's hope. 

[fliptopbox]

I don't understand all the hate on the girls wearing flip flops. I wear em all the time in the summer, and to me as long as it's not the dead of winter and they're not playing a sport or doing a dangerous activity flip flops are fine.

[Fostersmom]

Do you wear them while hiking up or down a mountain? Or meeting members of congress? Or with every formal outfit you own while your bothers are in jackets and ties? Or have to be told that flip-flops aren't appropriate while horseback riding? Cuz the Duggar girls all have. 

[DangerousMinds]

I absolutely detest flip flops, and think the only time they're appropriate is when using a public shower or getting a pedicure. They are also horrible for your feet with no arch support.

[trimthatfat]

I absolutely detest flip flops, and think the only time they're appropriate is when using a public shower or getting a pedicure. They are also horrible for your feet with no arch support.

I agree. I cringe looking at the girls wear flip-flops with absolutely everything and for every occasion. A modest heel from a thrift store or Payless isn't an option when they are traveling for book tours and speaking engagements? How about plain comfy canvas tennis shoes when they are going site-seeing while traveling? I just don't get it. It's just not practical to wear flip-flops constantly, IMO. When their brothers are wearing suits and dress shoes, the girls need to wear more formal footwear.

Edited August 3, 2014 by trimthatfat

[BitterApple]

I don't have an issue with flip-flops when they're appropriate, however the Duggar girls wear them EVERYWHERE, even when the locale calls for a more formal type of shoe.

The Duggars are multi-millionaires, at the very least the J'Slaves should have a decent pair of pumps for doing appearances and book signings. Compared to the Bates girls, they look straight-up sloppy.

[Marigny]

I don't have an issue with flip-flops when they're appropriate, however the Duggar girls wear them EVERYWHERE, even when the locale calls for a more formal type of shoe.

The Duggars are multi-millionaires, at the very least the J'Slaves should have a decent pair of pumps for doing appearances and book signings. Compared to the Bates girls, they look straight-up sloppy.

High heels = Nike

[FunGirl]

 

I absolutely detest flip flops, and think the only time they're appropriate is when using a public shower or getting a pedicure. They are also horrible for your feet with no arch support.

I abhor flip flops as well.  I work in a large law firm and am listening to a Project Attorney "slappity slappity" by me as I type.  Why would you think any shoe that makes a "slappity slappity" noise is appropriate? When I first started working here (in the IT dept) I shied away from open toe/sling backs as too casual!!!

[Quof]

I second that emotion, FunGirl.  I hate flipflops, largely because of the stupid sound.   Although, as a practising attorney, I noticed the open back sandals I am wearing today (boss is out of town so office is casual today) are making that slappity slappity sound.  I'm trying not to leave my office too often.

[mbutterfly]

I second that emotion, FunGirl.  I hate flipflops, largely because of the stupid sound.   Although, as a practising attorney, I noticed the open back sandals I am wearing today (boss is out of town so office is casual today) are making that slappity slappity sound.  I'm trying not to leave my office too often.

lol, I'm a retired minister. One time I wore new open back sandals (very dressy in appearance) to church. There I was all nicely robed walking down the aisle -- then I heard it -- slappity slappity. Awkward! 

[kelslamu]

Personally, I have always thought the kids sleep in their clothes because it's one less thing to do in the morning. JMO The one thing that gets on my nerves the most is their utter obliviousness to their own ignorance.  

[Ivy26]

Someone above mentioned the Amish.  I prefer the Amish way of living to the Duggars.

The Amish get the period of Rumspringa.  See the world outside and then make a conscious choice.  The Duggar kids don't get that al all.  They are sheltered from the big bad world and told they are the only ones that are right.  BS

And for all of their blathering on about the kids "choose this way".... I call 100% absolute bullshit.  There is enough peer pressure to get them to do things the "right way".  Look at Michelle's face when Jill gave a scandalous full frontal hug.  Choice my ass.  Or the Bates pretty much convincing the one young bride about wearing skirts.  Yeah, she "prayed" about it?  Nope, not buying it. 

To make a choice is one thing.  Anna was brainwashed into this lifestyle, as was Josh.  But they are adults and can make the choice.  Even now we see small sparks of outside the Gothard life in them.  It's one thing to choose, it's another to force it upon them.  Give me the Amish anyday

[lottiedottie]

I can't stand how Michelle hisses her s's. Every time she makes an 's' sound, it hurts my ears.

Edited August 6, 2014 by lottiedottie

[Fostersmom]

I was a manager at a store in an highly Amish community for a couple years before the company went out of business. Like hitching posts for horse and buggies in the parking lot of our department store, Germanic speaking, no button using, Amish. Let me just say, the Amish kids had a lot more freedom than the Duggars. The boys learned a skill after 8th grade and the girls would work outside of the home too. Friday was Amish day out. Our store would be full of Amish teens on Friday night. They would either walk or bring a buggy, hitch it up in the parking lot, and then spend the night bouncing between our store, the chinese restaurant, the Dominos, or the three fast food places across the street. The girls would drag oversized purses with them, full of "Yankee" clothes, walk into a public restroom Amish and walk out English. We would find a line of bags in the vestibule for the store, full of their Amish clothes, just sitting there until it was time to come back and change before the store closed. The biggest thieves we had were the Amish girls. They were constantly stealing makeup, jewelry, and bras/panties since Amish mom was only buying plain white and nothing with lace or thongs. I will say the idea of Rumspringa is good in theory, but not in practice. It's supposed to be for them to see if they want to remain Amish, but if they decide to walk away, they are giving up their entire community, their families and friends. We had a cashier who was in her 50s who was living with her very ill and elderly father in a house with no running water or electricity. He had been Amish, but left well before she was even born. The older Amish women not only knew who she was, but went out of their way to shun her. They wouldn't even get in her line, and if they had no other choice, they refused to acknowledge her. It was really hard to watch. She was literally paying for the "sins" of her father.

 

Somehow I don't see the younger generations being quite as militant about shunning as the older ones, but I could very much see the younger generations of Gotherdism being much, much worse than the Amish ever dreamed of. We know these kids are nothing if not self righteous. God help Jinger if she wakes up tomorrow and says screw it, I'm moving to LA and enrolling in art school. Or if one of the Bates sons comes out. Or even if any one of these major fundy families ends in divorce. Look at Josh, Zach Bates, and Ben. All three of them are much more smug than their fathers. They are all so convinced that there's not another option or even allow for other opinions on their way of life. All these fundy parents have done is create little monsters who have no experience outside of their sheltered little worlds. At least the Amish know and acknowledge their views are vastly different than the rest of the world and aren't looking to convert the rest of us, they just want to be able to keep their views alive and be left alone to live it. 

[Marigny]

I can't stand how Michelle hisses her s's. Every time she makes an 's' sound, it hurts my ears.

Hissing "s" sounds work my last nerve! Couple it with her "I'm speaking with a two year old" voice and I'm fighting the urge to duct tape her mouth shut. 

[BitterApple]

Yeah, the "sssss" makes my ears bleed. I also hate how they pronounce Josie's name with that drawn out "s" rather than a "z" sound.

[cereality]

I was a manager at a store in an highly Amish community for a couple years before the company went out of business. Like hitching posts for horse and buggies in the parking lot of our department store, Germanic speaking, no button using, Amish. Let me just say, the Amish kids had a lot more freedom than the Duggars. The boys learned a skill after 8th grade and the girls would work outside of the home too. Friday was Amish day out. Our store would be full of Amish teens on Friday night. They would either walk or bring a buggy, hitch it up in the parking lot, and then spend the night bouncing between our store, the chinese restaurant, the Dominos, or the three fast food places across the street. The girls would drag oversized purses with them, full of "Yankee" clothes, walk into a public restroom Amish and walk out English. We would find a line of bags in the vestibule for the store, full of their Amish clothes, just sitting there until it was time to come back and change before the store closed. The biggest thieves we had were the Amish girls. They were constantly stealing makeup, jewelry, and bras/panties since Amish mom was only buying plain white and nothing with lace or thongs. I will say the idea of Rumspringa is good in theory, but not in practice. It's supposed to be for them to see if they want to remain Amish, but if they decide to walk away, they are giving up their entire community, their families and friends. We had a cashier who was in her 50s who was living with her very ill and elderly father in a house with no running water or electricity. He had been Amish, but left well before she was even born. The older Amish women not only knew who she was, but went out of their way to shun her. They wouldn't even get in her line, and if they had no other choice, they refused to acknowledge her. It was really hard to watch. She was literally paying for the "sins" of her father.

 

Somehow I don't see the younger generations being quite as militant about shunning as the older ones, but I could very much see the younger generations of Gotherdism being much, much worse than the Amish ever dreamed of. We know these kids are nothing if not self righteous. God help Jinger if she wakes up tomorrow and says screw it, I'm moving to LA and enrolling in art school. Or if one of the Bates sons comes out. Or even if any one of these major fundy families ends in divorce. Look at Josh, Zach Bates, and Ben. All three of them are much more smug than their fathers. They are all so convinced that there's not another option or even allow for other opinions on their way of life. All these fundy parents have done is create little monsters who have no experience outside of their sheltered little worlds. At least the Amish know and acknowledge their views are vastly different than the rest of the world and aren't looking to convert the rest of us, they just want to be able to keep their views alive and be left alone to live it. 

I agree the Amish put their kids in a better position than fundie families esp the men because most/all of them know a trade; if a typical Amish male were to leave, he could go pick up work with a contractor and make decent money -- enough to support a family. In contrast the typical fundie with no skilled trade and no college degree and no connections would more likely be relegated to retail or restaurant work, which doesn't pay nearly enough.

 

I don't know if I agree about the shunning long term. I agree that Josh, Ben and maybe Zach (and probably all the oldest brothers in this faith) are more smug than their fathers and they'd be the first to shun a sister who wanted to go to college or marry someone that daddy didn't approve of or a brother who came out or wanted to leave to pursue college/military etc. But I also think that is because life hasn't kicked them in the a$$ yet. It's very easy to be smug and convinced that your way is right when you are young and taken care of. Josh only has 3 kids and a cushy job in DC right now. Ben still has mommy and daddy paying his way. And Zach is likely doing well enough in his county commissioner gig that having a kid on the way isn't financially stressful. We'll see how "devoted" these guys are to their fundie faith when they are on kid number 8, the Duggar fame has gone away, and they are back in Arkansas realizing how hard it is to raise that many kids on a used car salesmen's salary. I'm not suggesting that they will suddenly become pro-college, but I'm thinking in that case if one of their much younger sibs wanted to go to college -- they may get tacit approval as their older brothers would recognize how hard life really is.

 

I also think that unlike the Amish if someone really wanted to bounce and was in fact shunned, it wouldn't be as big of a deal because they would have some community to turn to. There are people like Derick or cousin Amy who are affiliated with the fundie world but weren't raised in it and don't necessarily "believe" that way is right, as well as people like Anna's sister who left altogether who I think could provide some emotional support and maybe a place to go Christmas so a Duggar or Bates who wanted to leave would not be 100% alone. That in itself may inspire someone to leave at some point.

[Ivy26]

I agree.  Plus according to FreeJinger, doesn't Anna have a brother that married a non Fundie girl and they really aren't discussed?  Or is it the other way around?  I'm at work, dont have the time to investigate :-p

[BradandJanet]

I think Michelle's odd behaviors--and we've discussed them--are mainly to focus attention on herself in a passive-aggressive way. The woman is a fame whore hiding under a modest exterior. 

[Ljohnson1987]

Yeah. They also *GASP* adopted a baby.  She also has a sister who had a baby out of wedlock.

[Lillybee]

One thing that I dislike about the Duggars, is that after Anna births her babies, they didn't seem to help her out. For example, it doesn't appear that anyone even thought to bring a meal to Anna.

[Absolom]

All they seem to do is pile in on the new mother and baby and bring their germs.

[JessDVD]

Oh, I surely hope that those things are editing monkey things, not actually reality. I think that "Watching the Duggars pile in on Anna when her baby is a few hours old" is as boring and painful as clearly someone thought of "Watching Anna receive meals from the Duggars and other friends in the area during the baby's first couple months", but at least the second would leave a more positive impression.

[floridamom]

From what I have seen on TV a few times over now, is that I agree with you posters here that this group of people treat their women terribly. After poor Anna AND Priscilla delivered their babies, yes, it seems that no one helped them out at all. Anna has hard labors and deliveries, every one of them so far and when heavily expecting Marcus she had to make a trip to DC, walk around town looking for a house, and very soon after delivery had to hightail it and move to DC with a newborn in tow, two other kids under 4, and I know from experience, she was NOT healed from that delivery. She looked awful, tired worn out and old. Did Josh seem to give a care? Not at all.

Priscilla, also was drug around the country having to visit Florida with her fabulous husband a newborn in tow also, and having to endure being videotaped very soon after delivery for some stupid posting of his.

Many things bother me about this family and the like and they really need to examine how they are affecting all of their children in the process.

[BitterApple]

I'm irked by the fact that every time the Vanderhoff family comes to visit, one of the Duggars feels the need to mention some of their kids are adopted while all the Duggar kids are from the same parents. Considering 2/3 of the Vanderhoff kids are Black or Hispanic, it's like no shit Sherlock. I feel it's very disrespectful to differentiate between bio and adopted kids, as if one is more legit over the other.

[Ljohnson1987]

Why is Jordyn's birthday lumped in with Kenzie and Josie's because they're all the same age for 8 days? Jordyn is a year older. She deserves her own party. 

[Sew Sumi]

Annoyances at the moment:

 

I'm sick of their self-righteousness on social media. Yesterday, Jessa posted (as @duggarfam) a quote from Winston Churchill about enemies when you take a stand. She was totally doing damage control for BinBob.

 

Selfies. Please make them stop. I'm sick of seeing how Bin and Bless styled their hair TODAY. Also sick of Jessa's forced platitudes. Bring back the bitch!

 

Jerick doing public speaking about marriage with less than two months under their belts? Okey doke. Friendly Chapel (where they worshiped in Little Rock when Josie was hospitalized) is hosting this fete next Saturday.

[Marigny]

I highly doubt that anything about Churchill was included in those Wisdom Books nor the SOTDT required reading list. She wouldn't know who Churchill was if he rose from the dead and showed up for tater tot casserole. 

[Sew Sumi]

I bet the meme showed up in Blessa's conservative queue, and it spoke to her. Vison Forum was big into WWII in Europe (they totes forgot the second front in the Pacific). I think some Duggars went to their D-Day anniversary trip a couple years ago. But I bet they're taught that Churchill curtailed FDR, and THAT is what won the war. Because Democrats! Evil!

[Ljohnson1987]

I'm appalled by the fact that the Duggars can't express how they really feel. How in the Hell do these idiots think that stuffing your feelings and keeping sweet is good for anyone? It's not! They should be allowed to get real help, if they need it. 

[ShaNaeNae]

One of my many, many, many annoyances of Michelle is her inability to hold an adult conversation when Josie is present.

 

I was watching some reruns on my DVR and it was the family reunion episode. The whole extended family came over to The Duggars house and of course Michelle is nowhere to be found and it locked up in the bedroom with an about 6 months old Josie.  I know you can have to keep preemie's protected but sometimes Michelle way over uses that to her advantage.

 

One scene shows Michelle in her bedroom with various extended family members. She's holding the prodigal daughter in her baby voice, through Josie like she's talking for Josie says "say, this is the reunion for Josie! Everybody is here to see Josie! Say, I'm so precious!" while all these family members are standing around with the most second hand embarrassment look on their faces.  

[juneday]

I'm sure previous posters have said some of these but here goes nothing:

1. The lack of actual homeschooling. They don't actually "homeschool" those kids, at least not well enough and not for long enough. How many times have we actually seen the kids doing schoolwork? I know it's a TV show and not their full lives, but still.

2. Michelle's baby voice. It's like she talking to a 6 month old every time she speaks. Ughhh.

3. The fact that they are super controlling over their kid's lives, even the adult ones. Don't tell me that it was 22-year old-whichever adult is courting now's decision not to hold hands or even a "frontal hug" until marriage. And they can't even spend any alone time together to talk about serious issues-religion, money, their values and beliefs and personality, god forbid how many kids they want. It's not a healthy thing to do, IMO.

4. The older girls raising the younger ones. They are going to be tired of raising children by the time they do get married. Let them have their normal teen years.

5. No college. Why?!

6. Michelle's obsession with infants. Like, as soon as the baby is over 6 months-bye-no longer that "special blessing" anymore that she obsessed over.

That's just some, lol.

[Ljohnson1987]

The fact that the girls are only good for popping out babies and can't have careers of their own. 

[mimionthebeach]

The fact that the girls are only good for popping out babies and can't have careers of their own. 

 

It seems even worse than that. It's like, once married, they're not even supposed to have non-child/family related interests. Well, except religion. It's so stifling.

 

My sister and her husband married right after university (I'm Canadian), both with an undergrad and a professional degree. After their first child they moved from our large city to a rural community. My sister had no intellectual stimulation, no one to talk to about non-kid things. She was with her kids (eventually 4) 24/7. She went crazy. We didn't recognize her anymore. She just threw everything into child-rearing. She had nothing else. They moved back to the city. She became a rounded individual again.

 

This fundamentalism thwarts all intellectual curiosity particularly in women. No wonder they start to sound insane.

Edited August 20, 2014 by mimionthebeach

[Ljohnson1987]

The baby obsessed Duggars should watch MTV's True Life about infertility. Maybe then Anna will stop whining that it took her 4 months to conceive Kenzie. *Eye Roll*

[juneday]

Another thing that annoys me is that the children hardly ever show any "real emotion."

I know that they're being filmed, but there are a ton of kids and teens in that house, some very young. There has got to be *some* arguments, or hurt feelings, or annoyance, or problems sharing toys, or SOMETHING!

I admit to not having seen every single episode but the ones I have seen (a lot) I don't remember very many shows of real emotion at all.

Even good emotions besides besides that fake happy tone of voice Michelle and some of the older girls use.

[Lillybee]

In the Duggar world children are expected to stay sweet. No other emotion besides happy is accepted in fact some children are beaten because they look unhappy.

[Portia]

I shudder to think what will happen to any of the Duggar kids who might happen to be prone to depression. When my youngest child went from being a sunny, happy-go-lucky little girl to a dark, broody tween and teen, I have to admit I thought that she was just acting out and needed to snap out of it. Once she was diagnosed with depression I felt really guilty for failing to how much she truly struggled to control her emotions. She always tells me that the most difficult part of her struggle is not the bouts of depression and anxiety themselves but the judgment of others: "You've got a great life; are you just too spoiled to enjoy it?" or "Why are you having an anxiety attack when there's nothing stressful going on?"  It's hard enough for "outsiders" to understand what's going on with a clinically anxious or depressed person, but among religious types (and I could myself in that group), there's often the additional attitude that any mental/emotional problem is at its root a spiritual problem. "Just cast your cares on the Lord and act happy" . . . that attitude can be just about as dangerous "Pray the gay away."

[Ljohnson1987]

Why can't Boob and J'Chelle frontal hug their own children? So weird! 

[MarkySnark]

Don't know if this is the Duggars' or TLC's doing, but in their newest promo, the text says to join America's biggest family in their new adventure or something to that effect. The point is, calling them America's biggest family. Isn't the Bates family just as big? Or are they including JoshBob's M-ca$h cow$ so as to top Gil and Kelly? Either way, it gets on my nerves. That is all.

[HeyNow]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned before.  It's the way the young women (in this case, Jill and Jessa) need to have an "amazing", unique, overdone story about their courtship/proposal.  Because God so blessed them in an extraordinary way (in my mind, the implication being that they are just a tiny bit closer to God/better than the average).  

[crowsworks]

I never watched this show because the commercials gave me the willies. I did hear that after baby-rabies momma cranked out one that died - each pregnancy is more likely to end sadly for many reasons -she flashed (and Shopped i'm sure) the tiny corpse's photo around. It's like a form of Munchhausens.

 

Weird about the flip flops. I see little kids in stores shuffling and dragging their feet (not lifting them once) And I think foot doctors will be very rich in the future. Also there are websites where you can buy little girl shoes in size ten up into the high teens. Herring boxes, Clemintine? It's the new "barefoot and pregnant.   Uggg!  Just no.

[Hpmec]

The total control over the daughters that JimBoob exerts. He alone decides who they can "court" and eventually marry, and he has veto power over all potential suitors. Judging by how Derick went along with the bizarre courtship rules, his willingness to live in a Duggar owned home, and the speed at which Jill became pregnant, it's likely that he had to promise to go along with all of the Duggar beliefs. Otherwise Boob would never have "transferred authority" to him.

[Higgins]

 Look at Josh, Zach Bates, and Ben. All three of them are much more smug than their fathers. They are all so convinced that there's not another option or even allow for other opinions on their way of life. All these fundy parents have done is create little monsters who have no experience outside of their sheltered little worlds. At least the Amish know and acknowledge their views are vastly different than the rest of the world and aren't looking to convert the rest of us, they just want to be able to keep their views alive and be left alone to live it. 

That is very common in the young. I used to see the world much more in black and white than I do now in my 40s. People usually mellow their convictions as they become older and wiser.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Higgins

[DangerousMinds]

I probably thought I knew a lot in my late teens, but my beliefs were far far away from those of my parents!

[RazzleberryPie]

The Dollywood episode is on. None of them claim to know who Dolly Parton is. When asked what do they know about her, the kids half giggle and say "nothing" or "she's a singer." Just Nike say it. She's that woman with huge blonde wigs and huge boobs. She's a country singer and actress. 

 

The kids, ok, I give a pass. They're not supposed to know what boobs are evil unless a baby is dangling from one during a parade, wedding or other ostentatious public space. 

 

Now for Michelle to have no idea who she is, I call BULLSHIT with a capital everything. Twice. Michelle was a kid and teen when Dolly was everywhere, on a regular TV show, on country and pop and gospel radio, in movies, in magazines, on commercials, just everywhere. She may not be able to sing every lyric, but she'd know who Dolly is.

 

Oh, and Smugger and Smug Anna needed a hose. I know they invented sex and pregnancy, but they need a hose to separate them and wipe the smug off their faces.

[cereality]

It annoys and amazes me how much the older Duggar kids don't ever stand up to their parents. I don't even mean for the big things like college or career or courting -- because that kind of disobedience would get them sent to the prayer closet and/or ALERT. But I'm shocked that they don't whine for little things like TV, books etc. Maybe that's just how kids become when you beat the will out of them? But we all know how persistent teens can be when they want something. I think we've seen social media pics of some of the kids at Razorback games. You'd think Josiah or Joseph would come home from that and beg his parents for a TV. When they say no -- it's defrauding -- you'd think he'd try every argument in the book --- we could block everything but ESPN, games aren't defrauding; you could watch with us and make us turn it off if you thought it was inappropriate; but Josh and Anna have a TV don't you think they're good Christians -- and on and on. I feel like they could win on a few things as their parents are pretty much checked out -- if they only tried. Is this just a lack of critical thinking skills? Just giving up on life?

[JessDVD]

I'd be willing to bet that Joseph and Josiah go to JD's and watch the contraband TV normally hidden in a closet in a box marked "ALERT memorabilia" or something like that.

 

Actually I wouldn't be surprised if they have a TV hidden somewhere in the girls' or boys' room at the Duggar house either, but that might be less useful because of the lack of cable service. It would be really funny if the kids were secretly paying for cable TV on the side and plugging in the TV when JB & M are otherwise occupied.

 

I often wonder if the parents are really as controlling as discussed here... it would be an awful lot of work, and I do know people, who know people, who know the Duggars (which is exactly the same as actual information) and the people who I know say that the people who know the Duggars say that they are perfectly normal, if conservative, people. And really, it would be a ton of work to be that controlling over all those kids. I'll go to the mattresses to make sure my kids are kind, respectful, contributing members of society, but I can't imagine wasting any time being so controlling over their friends, their media consumption (yes, control to some point as is age-appropriate, but loosening as they age), who they date/marry, etc.

[charmed1]

The long skirts for any and everything, no matter how dangerous, really gets on my nerves. When Michelle hopped on an elliptical machine in a long skirt whilst pregnant, I was astonished.