S13.E14: Blow Up

[UsernameFatigue]

13 minutes ago, Gromit said:

Shannon's been hurting ever since we met her - she was in a toxic marriage (of which she was one of the two tangoers, I don't deny), and now she's in a divorce with a guy who has always struck me as emotionally inaccessible and prone to abusive hostility.  She's at a low point among low points and is hurting and afraid.  The complaint about the house isn't about the practical aspect of having to move, it's the frustration of the endless change, the inability to set roots, and the worry about whether she's falling short as a mother because she can't keep a consistent home.

Is she acting self-centered, sure, she's deep in her shit.  But she's not a true narcissist; she just seems like it right now because she's in such pain.  The difference is that she's capable of apologizing and has the capacity for introspection, qualities you won't find in a real narcissist (ahem, Vicki).  The way to change the behavior of someone who's hurting like that isn't to yell at them.  It's to listen compassionately.  She needs to heal all this hurt with the help a good therapist and the company of kind people. 

She chose the worst possible "friend" in Tamra.  Tamra's the scorpion from the old fable, the one where the frog agrees (reluctantly) to give the scorpion a ride across a river.  Halfway through, the scorpion stings the frog.  As they're drowning, the frog asks why. The scorpion shrugs: "I'm a scorpion, it's what I do."

I love every word of your post. I also agree that Shannon is not a narcissist - I know a couple and Shannon isn't one. I also love that she announced that she is having her eyes done. When does a howife ever cop to having plastic surgery, even when it is obvious? And Shannon has announced hers beforehand. 

I think Tamra and Kelly are jealous of how much money Shannon is getting from David. Gina will be when she realizes that her Disney Divorce does not pay the bills. The fact that Shannon has money does not bother me in the least. I always thought that was supposed to be the premise of the Howife shows - that we are peaking into the lives of the rich? I would still say that is true for some of the RHoBH and RHoNY wives (though really many should not be called wives as many are not). But RHoOC has slipped into upper middle class territory at best. Heck, I have a nicer home than most of these ladies, and I am sure that is true for many here. But regardless of Shannon getting 22.5 thousand a month from David (which she asked to be reduced to from 30 thousand a month) she is out there hustling to make a living outside of her RHoOC gig. What are Tamra, Kelly and Gina doing? Nothing. Nada. Zipo. That earns Shannon a lot of respect from me. 

[MajorNelson]

3 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

This 100%! Shannon has been an entitled, hysterical bitch since day 1. Let's get real and not blame it on the divorce and depression. The woman drinks too much and is spoiled rotten. Because she was married to an ass in his own right,

it took the heat off of her. 

"it took the heat off of her. "  Great insight!

2 hours ago, Mr. Minor said:

13K is her rent, she's getting 22.5K a month from David.

Plus Bravo checks of 504k/yr less expenses and taxes

[walnutqueen]

1 hour ago, Kdawg82 said:

I believe it was stated in a past season that Shannon grew up wealthy . Horses, law school , etc. She stated David came from a blue collar family and was raised on meat and potatoes and would be fine eating that every day.  That's how my memory serves me but I'm open to corrections if wrong. 

Apparently, that meat & potatoes guy didn't embrace the other "blue collar values", like marriage vows.

[UsernameFatigue]

4 minutes ago, MajorNelson said:

"it took the heat off of her. "  Great insight!

Plus Bravo checks of 504k/yr less expenses and taxes

The fact that Shannon gets that much money on top of her Bravo paycheck tells you how much money David rakes in. Did they ever say how much of that money is child support for his three daughters? 

[smores]

Shannon has been really rude to Gina and Emily.  Whether she likes it or not, they are her coworkers and I've always thought it was shitty to have the whole "you're new and I don't have time for new people" or "I'm just not good with change" attitude.  It was crap with Vicki when she used to haze new people (and funny how she suddenly lost that attitude once cancer gate happened), and it's crap with Shannon.  She can damn well take the time to make small talk with new people, no one is saying she has to run around and be BFFs with them, but, you can spend 5 minutes and find out if they have kids, etc.  Especially since these women have listened to you whine about your divorce and they have shown up to support you with your QVC sales.  That's what a "kind friend" does.  But, we've seen that what they are saying is true, she won't even look at them.  So, it makes sense that they would speak up about it, and I don't fault them for doing it at the dinner table.  Shannon pretty much denied doing it, which led Gina to point out other instances and bring her not being there for Tamra into it.

At that point, I think Tamra was a bit surprised, as she wasn't expecting that to come up and wasn't quite sure what to say.  It's true that Shannon is fairly one-sided in the friendship and I think it's also true that Tamra and Kelly tend to keep quiet about it.  So, the hesitation read to me as Tamra deciding what she wanted to do in the situation, and Shannon was off to the races.  

I don't always like Tamra, and I used to hate Kelly.  But, regardless of how I feel about them, they are allowed to have boundaries in their friendships.  It's not ok for someone to just constantly dump their stuff on you, for someone to call you all the time, for you to be afraid of how they will react if you try to tell them how you feel about something.  That's just not ok.  And to say that if they were really friends, they would let Shannon act like that, it's just enabling her to continue with the behavior and means that they should just swallow however they feel and let the cycle continue.  It's totally understandable that things are out of balance once in a while, if your BFF's parent dies, of course your conversations would be about that and how they feel more than anything else.  But, they eventually balance back out.  If, after 6 months you are still talking ONLY about that, then, yeah, it's reasonable to say A) I think you maybe need to seek some help, and B) I need to find a bit of an outlet for myself.  It's part of being emotionally healthy and it's totally not wrong for Tamra and Kelly to do.  

[MajorNelson]

2 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

OMG .. you are right. $13, 000 for rent?  Isn’t that high?   It’s a house then, not an apartment?  The rest is quite a lot.  I guess they go by how she was used to living with David.  She could cut down quite a bit on all her quirky things and be alright.  Geeze, 22.5 a month.  I can’t imagine.  I have had to budget my whole life to live on Long Island.  Now I’m mad. Haha.

It's is (was) a house, 3260 sqft, 5 Br.   She's already moved out of it, but it was only in a "middle class" area of Newport.  Her house had no ocean view, though others in her neighborhood did.

I don't know what is up with her desire for stability and yet arranging things the way she did, renting a home on the market.

[Kiki777]

1 hour ago, SnarkAttack said:

Later - I'm going out to buy a lottery ticket (and if I win, sue to remain anonymous - which apparently you can do and win!).

Omg thanks for reminding me, I wanna get a ticket- I don't know how though but hope someone in the store will help.  I would have to be anonymous if I won- too many shady, money-grubbing relatives.  But I would anonymously help the relatives I do like.

I do think Shannon would be better off leaving the show.  But honestly, I think now that she's had a taste of D-level fame she won't leave, even if her QVC line takes off.

[KungFuBunny]

4 hours ago, VedaPierce said:

Vickie was the happiest I’ve seen her in a long time right after Shannon’s meltdown! Lol ordering up drinks for everyone, TWERKING for goodness sakes! She FLOVED the way things played out the night before!! She got Tamra back, a main howife had a pretty crazy episode, she wasn’t the villain for a change, yup, win win win for Vickie. Drinks all around! Let’s celebrate!

She’s so transparent and pathetic. 

Whatever that was, it wasn't Twerking.

It's the motion a dog makes when that piece of doody won't drop because it's hanging by a piece of hair. Or possibly a mating call from a species not yet discovered by anthropologists

[Mr. Miner]

https://www.google.com/search?q=emily+real+housewives+of+orange+county+photos&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=ZVNHkg0HdaVbYM%3A%2CLgtXvo0d4xQWvM%2C_&usg=AI4_-kS9Wytq6vn_5Qoph2-eedMDYPNcFA&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiC1Lq1lp3eAhXE11MKHZ5hCd8Q9QEwAHoECAAQBA#imgrc=iBoWgmIEtKJJPM:&spf=1540318736255

Emily just smelled Vicki's perfume

[lcarolynl]

1 hour ago, Gromit said:

Shannon's been hurting ever since we met her - she was in a toxic marriage (of which she was one of the two tangoers, I don't deny), and now she's in a divorce with a guy who has always struck me as emotionally inaccessible and prone to abusive hostility.  She's at a low point among low points and is hurting and afraid.  The complaint about the house isn't about the practical aspect of having to move, it's the frustration of the endless change, the inability to set roots, and the worry about whether she's falling short as a mother because she can't keep a consistent home.

Is she acting self-centered, sure, she's deep in her shit.  But she's not a true narcissist; she just seems like it right now because she's in such pain.  The difference is that she's capable of apologizing and has the capacity for introspection, qualities you won't find in a real narcissist (ahem, Vicki).  The way to change the behavior of someone who's hurting like that isn't to yell at them.  It's to listen compassionately.  She needs to heal all this hurt with the help a good therapist and the company of kind people. 

She chose the worst possible "friend" in Tamra.  Tamra's the scorpion from the old fable, the one where the frog agrees (reluctantly) to give the scorpion a ride across a river.  Halfway through, the scorpion stings the frog.  As they're drowning, the frog asks why. The scorpion shrugs: "I'm a scorpion, it's what I do."

I completely agree with all of this.

[ghoulina]

4 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

It looks to me like Tamra and Vicky are trying very hard to secure that orange.  Tamra overacting, and Vicky dressing like a young sexy girl with her boobs out down to her navel.  Don’t even get me started on her “twerking” with her big fat old ass.  Steve should run away after last nights display.

When Shannon, Tamra, and Vicki went away at the beginning of the season, Vicki was very restrained (by her standards). She even mentioned Steve not liking it when she gets too wild. I wonder what changed? Or if she's only able to hold her nastiness in for so long?

[kicksave]

On 10/22/2018 at 10:50 PM, Impalace said:

Tamra can go join Carole in the rotten friend club. I have not cared for Tamra for years but this just seals it for me. 

Huh...I would cancel Carole from that and insert Bethenny....who BTW, two months after her "soulmate" passed is jaunting around Boston and New York with a much younger boyfriend. But back to the women of Orange County...

Edited October 25, 2018 by kicksave

[Kdawg82]

2 minutes ago, lcarolynl said:

Shannon's been hurting ever since we met her - she was in a toxic marriage (of which she was one of the two tangoers, I don't deny), and now she's in a divorce with a guy who has always struck me as emotionally inaccessible and prone to abusive hostility.  She's at a low point among low points and is hurting and afraid.  The complaint about the house isn't about the practical aspect of having to move, it's the frustration of the endless change, the inability to set roots, and the worry about whether she's falling short as a mother because she can't keep a consistent home.

Is she acting self-centered, sure, she's deep in her shit.  But she's not a true narcissist; she just seems like it right now because she's in such pain.  The difference is that she's capable of apologizing and has the capacity for introspection, qualities you won't find in a real narcissist (ahem, Vicki).  The way to change the behavior of someone who's hurting like that isn't to yell at them.  It's to listen compassionately.  She needs to heal all this hurt with the help a good therapist and the company of kind people. 

I agree with this also. We've never really "met" a happy Shannon as she was always knee deep in a bad situation.  I think we've seen glimpses here and there of fun times out with "the girls" but I feel for Shannon. Something about her is broken and it's more than average Tamra or Icki stuff. 

[ghoulina]

39 minutes ago, smores said:

Shannon has been really rude to Gina and Emily.  Whether she likes it or not, they are her coworkers and I've always thought it was shitty to have the whole "you're new and I don't have time for new people" or "I'm just not good with change" attitude.  It was crap with Vicki when she used to haze new people (and funny how she suddenly lost that attitude once cancer gate happened), and it's crap with Shannon. 

I agree with you. But I did get the impression that Gina was coming hard for Shannon from day one.  I felt she came onto the show with a bit of agenda. She barely knew Shannon when she blasted her for not controlling Kelly with Emily's husband. There a few other instances too. I do think Shannon had a bit of a guard up (understandable when you're currently super vulnerable); but I also think Gina kind of drew a line in the sand very early. Didn't she also make some comment about where Shannon lived? 

Unfortunately Emily, who has been pretty chill, is getting wrapped up in Gina and Shannon's issues. 

41 minutes ago, smores said:

I don't always like Tamra, and I used to hate Kelly.  But, regardless of how I feel about them, they are allowed to have boundaries in their friendships.  It's not ok for someone to just constantly dump their stuff on you, for someone to call you all the time, for you to be afraid of how they will react if you try to tell them how you feel about something.  That's just not ok.

Agree again. My question is - have they ever tried talking to Shannon about this in a calm, non-confrontational way? Orrrrr, did they just let it all build up, become bolstered by the strong anti-Shannon sentiment on this trip, and suddenly unleash on her? Because that's not fair either. 

[smores]

I think Tamra has tried.  I'm not saying she's 100% honest, because, let's be real, we've been watching her on tv for ages.  But, she had the summit with Shannon at the flower place.  I think she's probably also tried at other times to kind of wade in and has gotten some push back or an immediate flare up, and so she backs off.  Tamra isn't exactly known for being a wallflower and keeping her feelings to herself, but it does seem as if she's been pretty subdued when it comes to Shannon and Kelly is saying the same things.  Kelly eventually tells on herself if she's lying, she just lacks the ability to keep something quiet, so I think she's telling the truth when she says that Shannon calls them both and keeps calling until they pick up.  

I also do think that Tamra was trying to go and de-escalate things when she went after Shannon while Shannon was screaming that they better not film her.  I think she felt that she had created the situation, so she would go in and try to calm it down, but it back fired, because Shannon won't hear anything other than people were coming after her.  I sort of see this like the recent blow up on Shahs of Sunset, where Mike and Reza went at it, and then Reza went back and was the one who was able to calm the situation down, despite being the one who blew it up.  (Yeah, I'm Bravo's bitch)  

I wish that Tamra hadn't read the text from Eddie on the bus.  I don't actually think Eddie is wrong in what he said, but it's one of those things that is best left unsaid in a group.  I feel for Shannon's kids, as they are stuck with a parent who is refusing to get the help that she needs and David.  It's not bad enough that they had to live through THE AFFAIR and the fallout being so public, now they have to deal with everything else.  

[politichick]

49 minutes ago, UsernameFatigue said:

I love every word of your post. I also agree that Shannon is not a narcissist - I know a couple and Shannon isn't one. I also love that she announced that she is having her eyes done. When does a howife ever cop to having plastic surgery, even when it is obvious? And Shannon has announced hers beforehand. 

I think Tamra and Kelly are jealous of how much money Shannon is getting from David. Gina will be when she realizes that her Disney Divorce does not pay the bills. The fact that Shannon has money does not bother me in the least. I always thought that was supposed to be the premise of the Howife shows - that we are peaking into the lives of the rich? I would still say that is true for some of the RHoBH and RHoNY wives (though really many should not be called wives as many are not). But RHoOC has slipped into upper middle class territory at best. Heck, I have a nicer home than most of these ladies, and I am sure that is true for many here. But regardless of Shannon getting 22.5 thousand a month from David (which she asked to be reduced to from 30 thousand a month) she is out there hustling to make a living outside of her RHoOC gig. What are Tamra, Kelly and Gina doing? Nothing. Nada. Zipo. That earns Shannon a lot of respect from me. 

This SO much and what the other person you responded to said. Tamra, especially, resents the hell out of Shannon's alimony--and that she's not spending a dime of it at Tamra's stupid gym. And while I, too, wish that Shannon would seek some therapy, I think one is allowed to wallow in sadness when necessary over the end of a 20-year marriage. She is in mourning. I also applaud her for trying to create a living with her QVC food and suspect that she's socking away her ho-wife money for retirement. Kelly and Tamra probably need theirs to keep up with the others. 

Gina was a such a fucking bitch to bring up at dinner what Tamra said about how Shannon behaved during Eddie's illness/hospitalization. And why are she and Emily so thirsty for Shannon's friendship? They have nothing in common. Like Shannon said, "Tamra told you how I am with new people, right?" Yes, she could be a bit more cordial, but they need to get over themselves. I wouldn't want to befriend Gina with her dreadful accent. Her life post-divorce is going to be a hot mess because all of the emotions are going overcome her, no matter how friendly things might be, and then she's not going to have half of what Shannon gets probably because her husband doesn't make that kind of money.

Vicki also was a bitch with the XL T-shirt crap. What a cow. I hope her butt implants flatten like a pancake.

[Mu Shu]

51 minutes ago, KungFuBunny said:

Whatever that was, it wasn't Twerking.

It's the motion a dog makes when that piece of doody won't drop because it's hanging by a piece of hair. Or possibly a mating call from a species not yet discovered by anthropologists

I call Vicki one of the tres monkies.

Tamra is the head monkey.  She’s a chimpanzee who will rip your face right off. 

Kelli is a howler monkey.  A shit flinging, follower monkey.

Vicki is a baboon.  Ugly, indolent, and bad tempered.  Likes to show her ass. 

[langford peel]

Shannon is a loathsome elitist and a drunken violent mess. I would not be surprised if she physically abused David in one pf her out of control out of body blow outs. The physical abuse of husbands by their spouse is a very under-reported problem. Most men are ashamed of it and would not report it or ask for help even if it gave them an advantage in their divorce proceedings.

Kelly Dodd of all people made a very perceptive comment. Imagine being married to that mess. Having to deal with that circus every day. Personally I would not have an affair but I would have divorced her and tried for full custody of the children. His big mistake was looking for solace before ending the marriage. That was not an honest response to this situation. He should have made a clean getaway and taken his children away from her pernicious influence. She is well on her way to screwing these kids up big time. I see them on the pole or in porno like some other kids of damaged Housewives.

Eddie was on point as well. I have the same heart ailment that he had and had several operations to correct it including a pace maker/defibrillator along with an ablation which I see in Eddie's future. My wife was very upset that several family members and friends did not even inquire about me when I was in the hospital. I didn't care because I just cut them out of my life. Still I understand exactly how Tamara and Eddie felt when Shannon didn't care about his health. You get to know who your real friends are when you need support with respect to your health.

Edited October 23, 2018 by langford peel
I don't know how to spell

[bichonblitz]

13 hours ago, straightshooter said:

I am guessing Shannon will be done with the show after seeing this episode (and WWHL) this evening

You would think but I don't know. Those two are weirdly co-dependent on each other. It will be interesting to see how they play the game in order to stay on the show. Tamra has proven that if she will make up with Vicki she will do anything to collect the check. She will probably apologize to Shannon and all will be right in the universe again. I don't follow Twitter, Are their any comments between them today? 

[ghoulina]

34 minutes ago, smores said:

I also do think that Tamra was trying to go and de-escalate things when she went after Shannon while Shannon was screaming that they better not film her.  I think she felt that she had created the situation, so she would go in and try to calm it down, but it back fired, because Shannon won't hear anything other than people were coming after her. 

Oh, see I don't see it that way at all. I think Tamra was playing her role, trying to keep the drama on camera. She should know Shannon well enough to know that when she's heated she needs to have a minute to calm down. The woman asked for 10 minutes. She should have given her that. 

[langford peel]

Tamra was just doing her job as you say. Keeping it on camera. That's why they get paid. Not to run off and end the dramatics. This is what pays the bills. Screaming. Crying. Drama.

Shannon should be smart enough to realize that. The only reason she is on the show is because she is a circus float of crazy from Day One. In fact I think you would be hard pressed to find a Housewives in any of the Franchises who are as big a mess as her. 

[SCS]

7 hours ago, VedaPierce said:

 

I thought Heather was vile when she first suggested that Shannon was having a mental break, but now I think she may have been right. Maybe Heather recognizes it right away due to her experiences with it....

Wha'?

[Reality police]

41 minutes ago, Mu Shu said:

I call Vicki one of the tres monkies.

Tamra is the head monkey.  She’s a chimpanzee who will rip your face right off. 

Kelli is a howler monkey.  A shit flinging, follower monkey.

Vicki is a baboon.  Ugly, indolent, and bad tempered.  Likes to show her ass. 

That is amazing. I bow to you.

[SCS]

6 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

 BTW, who’s minding the gym?  Eddie must like loud trashy insensitive women.

 

As long as the Bravo money rolls in, yes.

[langford peel]

A-fib takes a lot out of you. You get very tired and need to rest. Eddie is a very physical guy so this must be very hard for him. He is in denial as he is not taking his meds and still training and biking. He has to be very careful. I don't think they are treating it seriously enough based on what we have seen. I hope it is just for TV and that he is trying to take care of himself.

The best thing he could do is stay out of the women's business. He doesn't need to be involved in the drama. It can literally be heart-breaking.

[kicksave]

It's sad watching someone fall apart on TV...Shannon needs to get into therapy, stop drinking and give some thought to taking some Prozac or a mood stabilizer. She's clearly in distress and cannot continue to lean so heavily on her friends. I also think she should give some consideration to stepping away from the show for awhile to get her life in order... for her sake but also the sake of her daughters. And she really is self medicating at this point with alcohol...she needs to stop drinking...STAT!

Vicki wore the most inappropriate outfit possible for an outdoor activity. WTF? That was an outfit to be worn in the privacy of her home with her boyfriend. Good grief...these women continue to disgust me with their tone deaf behavior and clothing choices when they travel to other countries. 

Tamra: Ugh. Still stirring the pot and playing both sides. What a real friend would do is sit down with Shannon when they're both sober and have a heart to heart about her life and mental health well being. Trying to talk to someone who they've been drinking and others are around is counter productive. Shannon got defensive and felt ganged up on. Her reaction was to be expected...so nothing was achieved. 

[MajorNelson]

2 hours ago, UsernameFatigue said:

The fact that Shannon gets that much money on top of her Bravo paycheck tells you how much money David rakes in. Did they ever say how much of that money is child support for his three daughters? 

There was something like 10.K of "spousal support" and the rest for the kids.  David tried in October to lower the 22.5k but was denied, and while he paid her attorney fees for awhile, seems Shannon must pay her own "2018" lawyer fees (since she has Bravo income, seems to me)...of 25k.

There is a whole litany of expenses which Shannon claimed for her and the kids, here's some I found:

1900 childcare
5050 tuition and tutoring
2500 kids' sports
3925 groceries and dining
2250 clothing
6500 entertainment

Edited October 23, 2018 by MajorNelson

[Juneau Gal]

Apropos of nothing, except for flashbacks last week and previouslies this week, I will NEVER not laugh out loud at the sight of Vicki Blanket Jacksoning it out of the hotel in Iceland. Pure. Comedy. Gold. For moments like that, I can’t quit this show. 

[yourmomiseasy]

I forgot to mention in my previous post but there was an ad that said the show was brought to us by either Massengill or Summer's Eve and I thought "Of course it is, because they are all fucking douches." 

[MajorNelson]

50 minutes ago, bichonblitz said:

You would think but I don't know. Those two are weirdly co-dependent on each other. It will be interesting to see how they play the game in order to stay on the show. Tamra has proven that if she will make up with Vicki she will do anything to collect the check. She will probably apologize to Shannon and all will be right in the universe again. I don't follow Twitter, Are their any comments between them today? 

Reading your comment, I had a funny thought.  So Shannon's check is $504k and for next seasons, we'll see if she would be willing to keep going on this production.  Would she for $350k or $250k?   Would Tamra, would Kelly etc?   We need a reality show where we can see HOW LITTLE they will take to demean themselves as they do.

[VedaPierce]

32 minutes ago, SCS said:

Wha'?

The first season shannon was on, there was a party and Shannon lost it. Heather and Tamra and terry were watching her and whispering about possibly needing and ambulance because shannon seemed to be having a psychotic break. At the time I thought this is the height of assholery. I was disgusted with them trying to gaslight shannon...now I’m not so sure. When you’ve been around someone having a real breakdown, it’s something you recognize immediately again. There may not be exactly the same parts to it, but something in the eyes signals a loss of sense and sensibility. Maybe Heather really knew what she was talking about. Last night Shannon seemed similar to that night her first season. 

[Normades]

51 minutes ago, langford peel said:

Shannon is a loathsome elitist and a drunken violent mess. I would not be surprised if she physically abused David in one pf her out of control out of body blow outs. The physical abuse of husbands by their spouse is a very under-reported problem. Most men are ashamed of it and would not report it or ask for help even if it gave them an advantage in their divorce proceedings.

Kelly Dodd of all people made a very perceptive comment. Imagine being married to that mess. Having to deal with that circus every day. Personally I would not have an affair but I would have divorced her and tried for full custody of the children. His big mistake was looking for solace before ending the marriage. That was not an honest response to this situation. He should have made a clean getaway and taken his children away from her pernicious influence. She is well on her way to screwing these kids up big time. I see them on the pole or in porno like some other kids of damaged Housewives.

Eddie was on point as well. I have the same heart ailment that he had and had several operations to correct it including a pace maker/defibrillator along with an ablation which I see in Eddie's future. My wife was very upset that several family members and friends did not even inquire about me when I was in the hospital. I didn't care because I just cut them out of my life. Still I understand exactly how Tamara and Eddie felt when Shannon didn't care about his health. You get to know who your real friends are when you need support with respect to your health.

I agree with some of the things you said about David.  I don't think he did the right thing by a longshot, but I think he was at his wits end with Shannon.  He had been with her for years, dealing with her selfish, crazy behavior like having crystals in walls, spending a fortune with quacks, and acting out publicly.  He kept saying he wanted to enjoy his life.  I think he was tired and wanted a divorce and had told Shannon  many times before this came to a head.  She kept holding on and lashing out when he tried to put an end to things.  It seemed to me like he just shut down with her and sought someone else.  It was not the right thing to do, but I think it was an act of desperation.  He might have felt that if she refused to let go, he would just move on.  It can be really hard to get away from some spouses and I can see Shannon totally being that kind of person.  Meanwhile, she goes on about how hurt she is and what a horrible person David is.  She needs to grow up and act like an adult.  I think it's pretty disgusting that a woman in today's world would sit back an allow herself to be "taken care of" to the point of not even knowing about paying utilities.  There is no excuse for not educating yourself and being able to take care of yourself and your children.  What would have happened if David were hit by a bus??  Also, I know they've spoken about Shannon coming from money, but one things that stands out to me is Shannon's mother.  She seems very nice and down to earth.  I think they just completely spoiled Shannon and we're left with the selfish narcissist we see now.  

Also, I've said the same things you did about her girls.  I see them heading down the Curtin girls' path really soon if someone doesn't set them straight.  They've already snuck out at night (at the ripe old age of 9!!) and damaged their fathers expensive car while driving it without permission.  Sophie even sat there and stated how she would be driving the car again very soon.  She had no remorse at all. 

[MajorNelson]

2 hours ago, mytmo said:

Can someone tell me what was in Eddie's text?

I only caught bits and pieces and cannot bring myself to watch the screech and swamp ass fest. 

My dog was sleeping on the couch and I cannot help myself to start dozing off when he starts snoring softly.

Thanks much.

Tamra had texted Eddie to say that she had had it out with Shannon and told her no more.

Eddie texted back "FINALLY!"

And there was a bit more she read, but basically he couldn't believe Tamra had put up with all that nonsense, the calls, clinginess etc for this long.

[SCS]

1 hour ago, VedaPierce said:

The first season shannon was on, there was a party and Shannon lost it. Heather and Tamra and terry were watching her and whispering about possibly needing and ambulance because shannon seemed to be having a psychotic break. At the time I thought this is the height of assholery. I was disgusted with them trying to gaslight shannon...now I’m not so sure. When you’ve been around someone having a real breakdown, it’s something you recognize immediately again. There may not be exactly the same parts to it, but something in the eyes signals a loss of sense and sensibility. Maybe Heather really knew what she was talking about. Last night Shannon seemed similar to that night her first season. 

 

I remember that but I thought Heather was just being a vengeful bitch and Terry was just being happy-to-be-on-TV Terry. Actually, I still do, LOL!

[langford peel]

1 minute ago, Normades said:

He had been with her for years, dealing with her selfish, crazy behavior like having crystals in walls, spending a fortune with quacks, and acting out publicly.  He kept saying he wanted to enjoy his life.  I think he was tired and wanted a divorce and had told Shannon  many times before this came to a head.  She kept holding on and lashing out when he tried to put an end to things.  It seemed to me like he just shut down with her and sought someone else.  It was not the right thing to do, but I think it was an act of desperation.  He might have felt that if she refused to let go, he would just move on.  It can be really hard to get away from some spouses and I can see Shannon totally being that kind of person.

I think this is exactly right. He was totally wrong in having an affair before he ended the marriage. He needed to use the documentation of her behavior that the show provided to get a divorce and full custody of his children. Then he could have moved on with his life. Having an affair put him in the wrong.

I think her children are really at risk and nothing good will come of her continual employment as a housewife other than the service to her bloated ego.

[SCS]

5 hours ago, Mu Shu said:

Shannon is completely overwhelmed and has been for a long time.  She’s probably at the point where she doesn’t know where or how to start, so minor crises throw her into a tizzy.  Having money is great, and it would solve all my problems, but having money doesn’t fix everything for everyone.

these entitled bitches are the last people who should be lecturing her on how fortunate she is.

god I hope she makes a fucking killing on her business.  Just to spite these losers. Cough, cough wine by wives.  Vicki Lynn dumpy ass jeans. Dog hair diamonds.  And so on.

I agree. Remember Kimberly from the first season who made some pejorative remark about dancing with a *gasp* Puerto Rican, but was later arrested, along with her dweeb husband for assault in a local bar? Or Jeana and her kid who mocked the "bummers" (homeless) in Berkeley, and then it came out that Jeana was renting rooms to friends at her big estate because she needed the money? Or Tamra's big 40th party where Simon "gave" her a Rolex or some expensive trinket (did we ever see it again?) 

They all are fortunate financially, incredibly entitled and live in varying levels of delusion. It amuses me and keeps me watching.

One thing I would have appreciated seeing with Shannon but I imagine this ship has sailed: During one of their many bickerfests in Meghan's first season, Meghan said something to Shannon about attending charity  events and Shannon (who got offended) said something like "I don't attend charity functions, I give/start them." Words to that effect. I'd have liked to have seen this side of Shannon but maybe the orgs refused to be filmed.

[Normades]

1 hour ago, politichick said:

I also applaud her for trying to create a living with her QVC food and suspect that she's socking away her ho-wife money for retirement.

I think it's great that she's been given the opportunity with QVC, but when I keep seeing people go on about the wonderful work she has done, I really question it.  Did she do anything more than Ramona did with slapping her name on a bottle of wine?  I know she did the QVC appearance, but did she truly have any real input?  I don't like Bethenny very much, but that was true work.  We really saw B hustle and sweat over creating her product.  I think Shannon deserves credit for seizing an opportunity and I'm glad she's trying to step up and be self sufficient, but I am skeptical of the actual work going into it on her end.  Also, am I to believe that a woman who didn't know how basic utilities worked is now socking away money for retirement?  Has she become a whiz with 401Ks and retirement funds??  I'm sorry, not buying it. 

[langford peel]

If I were David I would petition the court for a physiological and physical evaluation of Shannon's fitness as a mother. Based on her performance the last few years on this show she seems to be a barely functioning alcoholic with severe mental problems. He should just put together a sizzle reel of her greatest hits and ask that she pee in a cup..

I have no doubt he would get custody even if his new girlfriend was Lizzie Borden.

[noveltylibrary]

20 hours ago, esco1822 said:

Anyone else think Gina kind of resembles a young Brianna? I really saw it in one early scene. 

Yes! I saw it for the first time this ep.

Quote

 

[snarts]

10 hours ago, ButterQueen said:

It seems like Tamra has gotten together with Gina and Emily to take Shannon down.   It’s not going to work....I hate them all.  

Tamra is a snake.

Shannon is taking herself down.  No one is forcing her to be rude/dismissive to Emily & Gina.  They've continually tried to reach out & connect with her and she's shot them down.  Tamra (who I absolutely hate to side with) told Shannon how it hurt her feelings when Shannon never asked about her or her life.  Did Shannon change her self-centered behavior?  Nope.

While Tamra is a snake, Shannon alienated everyone all on her own.  Her behavior at dinner is the perfect example.

[noveltylibrary]

16 hours ago, lunastartron said:

I’m mystified that Shannon has managed to retain distinction among certain viewers as classy 

《snip a lot of good stuff》

She is both demonstrably sick and profoundly ugly. 

Amen!!! I have said for a long time I don't know how David could stand her and was happy for him he finally got free!

[AnnA]

8 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

I agree with what you said about Gina, but after watching WWHL last night, I think she’s here to stay.  The callers like her and so does Andy, unfortunately.

 

8 hours ago, dosodog said:

She was quite smug.  And it didn't help that Mary McCormick fawned all over her.

The callers were in love with Gina too.  However, they all sounded slurry.  Like pills or alcohol slurry.  Andy pointed that out.

Well.  If we are stuck with her next season I guess we get to see Disney Divorcee next season.

I don't watch WWHL very often but  I've never seen it when a caller was NOT a fan of the HW on the show so I'm not sure that means anything.     Does Bravo even let those calls through?

Edited October 23, 2018 by AnnA

[SweetieDarling]

When Shannon wanted, desperately, to go back to the room, I think she was trying not to say "to take a Xanax". She knew she needed to calm down. I get why the cameras followed her, production are assholes looking for drama, but, seriously, she asked for 10 minutes to collect herself. Why, WHY was that so hard to do? If not for them, but for Tamra. OMG none of these women on ANY of these franchises can read a room (or immediate outside area). Is over the top drama in such demand that these women drive each other to psychotic breaks ( (TM) Heather Dubrow) just for Satan Andy's approval in the name of ratings? With coworkers like these,...jeeze Louise...

I felt for Shannon at that moment, but she really needs to put things in perspective. Kelly and Gina are also going through divorces, Eddie has had, at this point, what, like 3 (ineffective) heart procedures? Tamra, legit, broke her foot, not twisted her ankle, woe is me I need a scooter, but BROKE HER FOOT, SHE MIGHT NEED SURGERY IF IT DOESN'T HEAL PROPERLY. It's so easy to feel sorry for ourselves, but once in awhile we need to take a step back and look at things, as a whole, objectively, imo. I don't think Shannon is capable of doing that (not that she doesn't have a lot going on, but, children in the world are starving,...if you know what I mean...)

I FLOVE Fun Shannon and all her quirkiness, but Neurotic Shannon has to go. 

[TexasGal]

I am late to the party this week, but Tamra and Vicki, the queens of the unmitigated shriek, were not ssssh-ing Shannon at dinner!  WTF?

[thesupremediva1]

13 hours ago, Beachdreamer said:

Shannon may very well need help with depression and alcohol consumption, but anyone who is a real friend, or even a slightly caring human, would have that discussion with her in a calm sober setting off camera.  It also bears pointing out that she could risk custody of her children by being shown too often on camera as being volatile or having a drinking issue, and I think Tamra knows this, which makes Tamra's handling of the situation so much more vile.

Yes to all of this. Tamra is the worst kind of hypocrite. 

As someone who struggles with anxiety and panic disorder, I often rely on those I love to keep me in check and tell me if I'm sliding off the rails. The conversations aren't always pretty, but they're helpful and necessary. Some examples of how these can go productively:

"Are you seeing a therapist?"
"Have you thought about seeing a doctor talk about the possibility of medication?"

All of these are one-on-one, private conversations. The times someone has either yelled, screamed, or thrown insults my way have, obviously, not panned out well. A gang-up is not help. An impromptu, nasty intervention is not friendship. A pile-on is not caring. 

I would love to see Eddie's reaction if Tamra brought Ryan, their CUT partners, Eddie's friends/parents, etc. to scream at him for continuing to work out and not taking his meds regularly. If you are truly concerned about someone, you approach the situation with tact and delicacy. If you're looking for a reason to lash out and spew pent-up aggression and prove a point (you're right and good; they're wrong and bad), you do what Kelly, Vicks, and Tamra did to Shannon last night. Whether you think they're correct or not, their delivery was heinous and invalidates every single one of their "feelings." If you don't want to be around Shannon, walk the fuck away. Do NOT attack someone's mental health on camera.

Though, I must say, I found the irony stark: They refused to leave Shannon alone. She repeatedly and calmly asked for time alone. They whipped themselves into a FURY over it and wouldn't listen. Sort of reminded me of Ireland, after Kelly lost her shit and realized she shouldn't be drinking. Shannon and Tamra repeatedly and despite Kelly's firm protestations tried to pry her with booze. I'd say that was the most disgusting thing I'd seen on the show, but we cannot forget ol Tam-balls and Naked Wasted. 

Common denominator in all this? Tamra, of course.

Oh, and I really wanted Shannon to lob this gem at Gina at the dinner, instead of getting up to hide in the bathroom: "Gee, Gina, if I'm such a bad friend, why are you trying so hard to be friends with me? That doesn't make much sense."

I'm frustrated with Shannon the way I get frustrated with Ramona - their sentiments and observations are on point. Their reactions to their adversaries only obscure and weaken their cases. 

Edited October 23, 2018 by thesupremediva1

[SweetieDarling]

1 hour ago, Normades said:

I think it's great that she's been given the opportunity with QVC, but when I keep seeing people go on about the wonderful work she has done, I really question it.  Did she do anything more than Ramona did with slapping her name on a bottle of wine?  I know she did the QVC appearance, but did she truly have any real input?  I don't like Bethenny very much, but that was true work.  We really saw B hustle and sweat over creating her product.  I think Shannon deserves credit for seizing an opportunity and I'm glad she's trying to step up and be self sufficient, but I am skeptical of the actual work going into it on her end.  Also, am I to believe that a woman who didn't know how basic utilities worked is now socking away money for retirement?  Has she become a whiz with 401Ks and retirement funds??  I'm sorry, not buying it. 

I hate myself for defending that crazy pool noodle loving lunatic, but she knew her pinot grigio. She was even able to pick out her own brand (I think she said the wine was VERY much like hers) when Luann had Jacques try to fool her in a blind taste test. The hair extensions? yes definitely, but I don't think she took the wine thing lightly, and in retrospect, having seen it in my favorite wine store, I'm sorry I never tried it.

[UsernameFatigue]

1 hour ago, langford peel said:

If I were David I would petition the court for a physiological and physical evaluation of Shannon's fitness as a mother. Based on her performance the last few years on this show she seems to be a barely functioning alcoholic with severe mental problems. He should just put together a sizzle reel of her greatest hits and ask that she pee in a cup..

I have no doubt he would get custody even if his new girlfriend was Lizzie Borden.

What makes you think David wants custody of his daughters? There certainly has been no indication that he has even asked for custody. All he has done is complain about the amount of child support he has to pay. So one would think that if he wanted to decrease his child support he could ask for custody and let Shannon pay him support. But he hasn't. He isn't interested in having his daughters full time. 

His live in girlfriend already has two kids. I doubt very much that David wants 5 kids around. And IIRC when he was married to Shannon he was barely around. He was busy training for this or that (some of which appears to be a cover for his affair) and wasn't interested in spending time with his daughters. In addition I doubt very much that his daughters, who are 17 and 14 years of age, want to live with their father's new girlfriend and her two kids. They seem to be very supportive of their mother, and from what I can see are pretty happy where they are. David certainly did a number on them when he had an affair (which was discovered by one of his daughters), appeared to reconcile with their mother complete with vow renewal, then continued to ignore her, and finally left her (quite likely for the woman he is with now). I doubt they are interested in living full time with their father and his replacement family. 

Edited October 23, 2018 by UsernameFatigue

[MatildaMoody]

11 hours ago, lamujerdecente said:

Tamra is such a bitch, phony, gaslighting forever teenage mean girl.

 

It amazes me how Tamra has perfected the art of sidling up to the women on this show, becoming their friend, and then using that friendship against them. Right now, she is doing to Gina and Shannon what she did to Shannon and Heather (well she tried to do to Heather what she is doing to Shannon right now, but Vicki told her she would lose so she backed off).  

She is building Gina up while letting her know that Shannon is a bad friend (kind of like how when she met Shannon, she told her how much fun she was and how she wished Heather would take the stick out of her ass - because, KLASSY). 

In this case, she is now befriending Gina while telling her that Shannon is an awful, negative, and self-absorbed friend. So Gina is now calling Shannon out on being a bad friend to Tamra while Tamra sits back and plays the innocent caught in the middle. I mean, Tamra’s manipulation skills are unparalleled. 

I guess we should count ourselves lucky that Tamra backed away from the truly appalling. Naked Wasted was all about Tamra telling Gretchen to come and party because she needed a break from taking care of Jeff (pretending to be a supportive friend) when all the while, she wanted to get Gretchen drunk enough to cheat on Jeff on camera. Too bad she used her son in that endeavor and now he is forever known as the creepy guy who followed an incoherently drunk woman into the bathroom to come on to her. 

But, it’s the same Tamra manipulations, (she did the same to Alexis and Jeanna and Vicki at different times during her tenure on the show, we won't even get into how she played Simon and her son against each other, or how she played her son against his father - that was truly awful). 

My guess is that Gina will be back next season and Tamra will either fully turn on her (using the information she gained by pretending to be her friend) or she will serve Shannon up to her again and play the innocent stuck in the middle. She is bascially waiting for the chance to dump Shannon without looking like a heartless bitch who abandoned her friend during her lowest point. 

What I am hoping for though, is the thing I always wanted to happen with Shannon and Heather. I hope that Shannon and/or Gina and Emily team up and finally call Tamra out on her bullshit. I hoped and hoped that Shannon and Heather would team up and take on Tamra, but they were both either too afraid or too well manipulated to ever do it. 

Since Tamra has made it clear in real time that she believes Gina is a good fit and that Emily is not, I can only hope that they keep Emily and she is the one who finally calls Tamra out on her crap.

[MajorNelson]

2 hours ago, langford peel said:

I think this is exactly right. He was totally wrong in having an affair before he ended the marriage. He needed to use the documentation of her behavior that the show provided to get a divorce and full custody of his children. Then he could have moved on with his life. Having an affair put him in the wrong.

I think her children are really at risk and nothing good will come of her continual employment as a housewife other than the service to her bloated ego.

 

1 hour ago, langford peel said:

If I were David I would petition the court for a physiological and physical evaluation of Shannon's fitness as a mother. Based on her performance the last few years on this show she seems to be a barely functioning alcoholic with severe mental problems. He should just put together a sizzle reel of her greatest hits and ask that she pee in a cup..

I have no doubt he would get custody even if his new girlfriend was Lizzie Borden.

In David's March response to the court, he wanted joint legal custody and 50% physical custody of the kids.  And he pointed out her employment encourages excess drinking and travel.  He complained to the court that when she want on trips she did not inform him or give him the chance to have them stay with him

He did not bring up that she was a crazy bitch.

Edited October 23, 2018 by MajorNelson

[MajorNelson]

35 minutes ago, snarts said:

Tamra (who I absolutely hate to side with) told Shannon how it hurt her feelings when Shannon never asked about her or her life.  Did Shannon change her self-centered behavior?  Nope.

 

Tamra and Shannon supposedly aired out the problems in their relationship at Rogers Garden a month prior to Jamaica, but after that DID Shannon ever ask about Eddie or about anything going on in Tamra's life?  I doubt it.  Otherwise Shannon could just say "I've called you twice and asked about your life and Eddie" but she didn't, likely 'cause it never happened.  In which case you are right, no change in Shannon's behavior.