S10.E05: Darlene v. David

[Chas411]

Roseanne wasn't as stiff tonight so really hope this improvement will last.

[HoboClayton]

So, talking to my "David" after the show, God this is just so damn bittersweet. Roseanne is what we bonded on and we spent hours playing Roseanne trivia the first night we met. We were talking about what moment got to us. Mine was when Darlene was looking at him in bed, and that pure genuine smile Sara had. Hers was when they were he was on the porch. Because the truth and love always comes out on that damn porch. *Siiiigh*... Anyways! I know part of what made Bev and her relationship with Jackie and Roseanne so funny is them being mean to each other. But, just sitting here thinking about how it really seems like they hadn't seen or spoken to each other in years, really made me sad. It's always been said with humor, like when Jackie wanted to tell Bev about her being pregnant because that news could have "killed her".. I hope they flesh it out and have them come together. Jackie literally, came at Bev physically, and while I don't think she would have pummeled her into the floor, though it was funny, on second thought, it just made me kind of sad. Like, I never saw it as outright pure hatred before tonight. Though, it doesn't seem like Bev is hurt by any of it either, because she's always been selfish. Now don't get me wrong. They need to always bitch at each other and get their jabs in.. But, I'm hoping for some sort of resolution with them. Sorry about all the rambling. This show man... It's messing with my feelings big time. You just never know from one day to the next. We just keep on trucking, acting like we have some sort of clue about what's going on. But, we all know, that we really know nothing. And that is so fucking hard. Try to find someone to love that loves you back, until you eventually die. I think you are royal bitch Roseanne. But, thanks for this. I needed it. I think a lot of people did. 

[Lily H]

I really didn't care for Dan thinking he could make the decision as to when David can see his children. Darlene isn't a teenager any more and David isn't her boyfriend -- it's none of Dan's business whatsoever whether Darlene gets back together with him or sleeps with him, and it sure isn't Dan's place to control David's relationship with his own children.

[Morbs]

I was thinking they will connect Mark's death to Roseanne's use of painkillers, or maybe they think it's disrespectful to Glenn Quinn's family to have Mark die of addiction (from personal experience some families' are too ashamed).  Becky seemed concerned about Roseanne so I thought it was coming from that point of view.

I guess a very special "heroin" episode of Roseanne might be too much but that's what I would do since the drug is hitting the heartland so badly and Roseanne is in a position of poverty and bad insurance that leads to it.

[Calm81]

I miss Darlene and David having their wild curly hair lol (I know it’s still curly but miss the super long look), but I love how this show came back just as the 90’s grunge came back in style - they could’ve kept Darlene’s old wardrobe and still been with the times and made some slight alterations on davids clothing lol. It feels like they just were put on the pause button - I’m going to dig out my doc martens from high school and rock them again. ?

I so wish they’d bring back Jackie to the Booker and Jackie days. She was so much more chill, witty with a lot more going for her. Wasn’t that the time when she started the police force? I want THAT Jackie back - not this wacky jacky character that was added during the fake lottery season. I can only handle this side of her in small doses but I still love her!!!

I’m not totally into the Harris character as some things seem forced but I’ll give her a chance. 

I’m shocked to hear that David hasn’t been around much as he was always the more emotional and nurturing type in the olden days - I’d figure he would be the overly doting dad at every soccer game and that Darlene would be too involved with a career with David being a SAHD. But I know they had to make David’s character like that since he’s dedicated to the Big Bang theory - a show I have never watched but might checkout now. 

I love Roseanne!!!!!! ❤️

Edited April 18, 2018 by Calm81

[HoboClayton]

Well, since it's a comedy sitcom, they'd have to make it funny.. And I think tying the two together might be a little much. They have to be really careful, I don't think they will go there directly. It would be interesting to see how they write it though. I mean the whole pot episode was funny I guess. It's a favorite. But, it's always annoyed the hell out of me. Those rolling papers or weed were obviously soaked with some old acid. Because that was ridiculous. Funny, but ridiculous. Bitch, you know you aren't in no damn sink. 

[Calm81]

6 hours ago, Lili said:

Yeah, my sister is a big fan of Shameless. I don't really watch it myself, but from what I've seen in Shameless, Emma Kenney seems to have a very similar personality in that show to Roseanne.

And talking about aging, Becky certainly doesn't look 43. I think she could pass as late 20's. Does anyone agree?

I wouldn’t say late 20’s but definitely 33/34. She’s so adorably quirky which also gives her a youthful appearance, too!!

[llewis823]

10 hours ago, chocolatine said:

Harris is still an out-of-control brat. Just because she's upset doesn't mean she gets to destroy store property and make her mother pay for it. There should have been consequences for that. And then she asks her father if he feels guilty enough to buy her weed - especially sad considering the actress who plays Harris has checked herself into rehab last week.

I don't think it is the actress, but I just cannot stand the character of Harris. Out-of-Control brat is an understatement. I don't care if your daddy isn't around, it doesn't give you excuse to be a jerk to everyone in every situation. With Darlene as a teen, we got the rough edges, but we also got some sweet moments where we could like her. That Harris would be in one stage of punishment at all times if she was my kid.

[Chicken Wing]

Gosh, I am struggling so much with the idea that David would leave his children and barely see them for years. Breaking up with Darlene because they just don't work no matter how much they try? Sure. Realizing that he's not cut out to be a full-time hands-on parent because he can't deal with responsibility? Okay. But leave them altogether? It makes my heart hurt. As much as I ship Darlene and David as a couple, I was rooting for her not to take him back just for that. He abandoned your children, girl. Give him another chance to be a dad for the sake of the kids having a dad in their lives once again, but he fails the test of a good husband. Don't walk away from your kids.

[Sakura12]

Everyone reacts differently to the death of a loved one, I think David like Becky couldn't deal with Mark's. I wish we got to see them talk about him. I think David was a hands on father to Harris and Mark when they were younger, then Mark died and he and Darlene were fighting all time and he couldn't deal so he ran. I did like seeing Darlene and David together again. I hope JG can make some more appearances next season. 

Also Dan, you don't get to decide if David can see his kids. Being in your house, sure. Seeing his own kids, no. Only Darlene and his kids can make that call. 

Roseanne was much calmer this episode which made Jackie's overacting stand out even more. Calm down Laurie, everyone knows you are a good actress let that show. I also wanted Sheldon's mom and Leonard to have a scene too. 

Estelle Parsons was on Grace and Frankie 2 years ago so I know she still looked good for her age. While I wouldn't want to imagine it ever, I'm all for older people enjoying themselves, if you still got it, get it. Lol. Except for the STD, that's gross. That nursing home as more issues than just Bev if that's the case. 

Edited April 18, 2018 by Sakura12

[qtpye]

12 hours ago, dorcastrilling said:

Very disappointed that this was pre-empted locally due to Barbara Bush's death. A little crazy how heartbroken I am that David and Darlene  don't make it. How long before Direct TV will have it on demand?

 

12 hours ago, dizzyd said:

Omg, I cheered and laughed and wept! This episode got me in all the right places ?

 

12 hours ago, JAYJAY1979 said:

Such a bittersweet episode tonight.

Darlene realizing after talks with both Becky and Roseanne that she and David just don't work as a couple then her saying good bye to David were so sad.  I was glad to hear Becky is trying to move forward and now I'm wondering how Darlene will move forward.

Roseanne seemed less stiff so it looks as if she's settling back into sitcom acting again.

Jackie needs to tone down.

 

12 hours ago, chocolatine said:

I'm so disappointed that David chose to be absent from his children's lives when he's suffered so much from his own father's abandonment. I don't care if he'd saved the entire world from poverty - his children should have always come first.

Harris is still an out-of-control brat. Just because she's upset doesn't mean she gets to destroy store property and make her mother pay for it. There should have been consequences for that. And then she asks her father if he feels guilty enough to buy her weed - especially sad considering the actress who plays Harris has checked herself into rehab last week.

I loved the interplay between Jackie and Bev - "God, please make it quick and painful, but not hereditary" - just like old times!

 

12 hours ago, Alexis2291 said:

That scene was a bit weird to me, too. 

It was awesome seeing them together again. It was as if no time had passed; they were just older versions of their characters. This scene really brought back memories from older seasons of Roseanne. 

I agree. The kooky Jackie - one can only take in handfuls. The more stable Jackie is the one who deserves more screen time. 

 

12 hours ago, Conotocarious said:

Harris may really resemble Darlene physically and they are trying to make her have that Darlene-like attitude but she really has none of Darlene’s charm.

 

10 hours ago, HoboClayton said:

Okay Johnny. I concede.. Nice job tonight. I was prepared to have my eyes rolled back when David returned. But.. It was nice, and their last conversation was very real to my life and a love, and my strings got pulled. I cannot attach to Harris, all I see is Debbie from Shameless. Agreed with the poster above who said she lacks the charm that Darlene had as a moody teen. I have only seen the actress on this and Shameless, and she's playing the same part. I'm happy that the kids pop in and out and it's mostly the old cast, because that's what I want to see. I really don't personally care about their children. Bev!!!! Get. It. Girl!! Kind of ick that she's spreading Gonorrhea though.. But, we'll just move on past that! Haha. Becky just flat out saying she has a drinking problem and drinking her "Mary".. Should have mixed herself up a tornado. It's not up to you Dan whether David can see his children, but, I get where he is coming from. Favorite episode so far. Will have to watch it again at least twice. Great job Estelle and Johnny! Estelle is just amazing, I hope we see a lot more of her. 

 

10 hours ago, Mu Shu said:

She’s awful.  Maybe she’ll leave with David.

in fact, I find all the grand kids annoying.  Send them all to summer camp.  We have Bev now.  And I really like original Becky now.

This was great minus the annoying kids. 

 

10 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

Best episode of the season.  I don't think I found anything really wrong with it.   Dan and Darlene had a close relationship and he would be exactly the kind of guy to take a hard line against a guy who walked out on his family considering his own father mostly walked out on him and his mother.  

I even liked how the show explained David's absence.  I could see Darlene and David riding along as they always did on a razors edge but then Mark dies and David's life just falls apart.  David and Mark never had a particularly good relationship but they did love each other and I can see David falling into his worst instincts and running and not knowing how to come back.  

I also like that Roseanne who always thought of David as a son would keep in touch with him and be in his corner but only for him being given another chance with his kids and not another chance with Darlene.   And her telling David she believed in him at the end.  That is the kind of relationship they always had.  In alot of ways she was closer to David then she was to Darlene.  

Sara Gilbert and John Galeki continue to have awesome chemistry.  I bought them as a married couple on the cusp of divorce but still deeply in love with each other.  

Estelle Parsons is a hoot.  I loved her stuff and am wondering if this was a one off for character or if she is going to be on the show for the remainder of the season.  Bev has always been hit and miss with me depending on the way the character got written but this episode was definetly a hit.  All the stuff that made her a fun character.

 

9 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

I completely bought this turn. David never really seemed like a guy who took a practical look at life, and I buy that he completely fell apart and never really got himself back together.

I don't think there's any vulnerability there. She comes off as a tough cookie without much of a heart. With Darlene, you knew there was always a heart underneath the mean shit she said, but with Harris, it just feels like meanness. I should have seen a glimmer of the sad, hurt rejected little girl that Harris was when David left in that scene with him, and I saw none of that. She's supposedly hurt enough by David's rejection that she smashed in a bunch of cakes, but when she actually sees him she seems to treat him more like an uncle who didn't make it to her last birthday party. Harris seems more like she's acting like a bitch because she's a bitch, rather than acting like a bitch because she's covering up how hurt she is about having to leave Chicago for a hick town and having a deadbeat fathe

2

This episode was amazing for me...it took me back twenty years and I felt like a little kid. David and Darlene had amazing chemistry but it was brave of the show to admit they do not work as a couple. JG did a fantastic job in stepping back as David and making him nothing like Leonard from the BBT. I hated how Darlene used to bully David and it was played for laughs because Roseanne was in a man-hating phase after she divorced Tom Arnold ( I actually saw a documentary where Roseanne got a tattoo that said: "Property of Tom Arnold" when they were married...it really grossed me out even as a joke).

I can imagine that after Mark died, David realizing that life is not a guarantee and freaking out over it. JG was able to make David sympathetic and vulnerable even though abandoning his children for so many years (to the point that he does not even know Mark) is despicable. I actually hated it when Dan told him he could not see his kids until he moved to Landford in two weeks, but I figured Dan was just protecting his grandkids from getting hurt again if David skipped out (which has been his pattern).

Roseanne and David always had a special relationship. They just got each other and I could see how she still loved him even though he really did leave her daughter holding the bag for children without any emotional or financial support. I can not believe how much I like current day David because I hate deadbeat dads and moms.

I feel like I saw glimpses of the good original recipe Becky in tonight's episode. I am happy that she is getting on with her life and can appreciate how she is also scared to try new things.

The actress that plays Harris is very lucky that she looks like Darlene facially because she is horrible. I can almost see her thinking "hit my mark, wait for the cue, and say my line in bratty voice before exiting stage right" when she is on the show...the acting is that obvious. I hated that there was no repercussion for smashing the cakes...why he hell is this child so violent? I get that her life has not been easy, but who would have thought that Darlene would be such a doormat of a mother?

[HoboClayton]

Darlene really needs to step it up a notch in the parenting department though. She is far too passive, and she should know better. Oh you smashed all those cakes. Now go wait in the car until your party later, and go wherever you need to go in the meantime and then show up to your party, which wasn't a party, whenever you want. 

[Calm81]

I still can’t get over how Estelle Parsons doesn’t look a day over 70 from her last appearance. And she still stands up straight and has great comedic timing. I really hope I’m like her at 90.

Edited April 18, 2018 by Calm81

[ErinV]

Wow, okay.  This was the first episode I've watched of the new season.  I was a big fan back in the late 80s/early 90s, but I'd avoided the new season because of all of the political hullabaloo.  But I ended up catching this ep last night; wow did this bring back memories.  It was really nice to see the Connors again!  This family...they snark and snipe at one another, but you can really tell that they love one another.  And I like Roseanne's relationship with David, too.  Becky used to irk me so much but I sort of liked her last night.  I've always enjoyed the relationship between Becky and Darlene - very true to life.  The acting from everyone (granted DJ wasn't on last night) is superb.  I was blown away by Estelle Parsons and how she has not aged!  Dan telling David when he could see the kids...Dan's loyalty is to the kids, and he's been there for them when David hasn't, and he's protecting their feelings in case David runs away again.  So it bugged but I get it.  

[Unconfused]

Top Warning Signs of a future serial killer: 1) Tortures animals 2) punches cakes

[hoodooznoodooz]

I really like Roseanne’s coat. 

I also liked her saying that her starting salary working check-out was bacon. (paraphrasing)

A celery stalk in a tall glass of vodka is nice visual.

I thought Darlene suddenly kissing David was off. 

[AM1418]

This one took me a lot longer to digest than the other previous episodes. Maybe due to the seriousness of it v. the lighthearted episodes so far. After watching it the first time it felt a little flat. The 2nd watch caught a few more things I missed the first go round and helped smooth me out. Overall, I liked this one.

Dan telling David when he can see his kids is perfectly in character. Like someone mentioned up-thread, Dan doesn't take kindly to men walking out on their families. He had too much of that in his own, and he knows how it affected his mom and himself. Then he watched Crystal, Lonnie, Little Ed and Angela all go thru it as well. As wrong as he is in determining when David can see his kids, his first instinct has ALWAYS been father bear protector and that shined thru tonight. I also agree with a previous poster that mentioned they think that he said David can see them in 2 weeks because he wants to make sure he's actually going to stay in their lives. 

Speaking of not seeing your kids, if Harris was my kid...I wouldn't wanna be around her either. I would gladly trade in Harris not existing for more Mark. Continuity be damned. Mark's quirky, cute and odd, a perfect blend of Darlene and David. Harris is a mouthy little brat that has no likeable qualities. I can do with far less of her. 

"Hit it Mary!" on the other hand was all sorts of adorable. Sure, teaching your grandchildren to steal is probably not the best of choices, but it made for good comedy. At first not having the store be named Buy N Bag bugged me, but I realized we've jumped ahead 20 years. I would bet almost anything the Buy N Bag went under long ago. A LOT of smaller grocery stores have since Wal-mart Supercenters came about. "It's because their prices are so LOW!"

I want to see Darlene become less of a pushover. I get she harbors some guilt for uprooting her family, and I get that she wants to tread lightly where David is concerned, however, that does not have to equate to total push over. I would have smashed Harris's face in the cake like she smashed them with her fist during the cake eating contest. 

I was not the biggest of Becky fans in the original go round, but I really like her this time. I find myself sympathizing with her more and more every week. I feel so bad that she went from someone that wanted to make something of her life to losing a husband, having a drinking problem, and stuck in 1998-2000's. I hope next season we see her blossom. That would be nice.

I think this is going to end up being an UO, but, I didn't really care for JG's David last night. I felt almost like he was trying TOO hard to be the old David, and while it's obvious he's still the same scared insecure kid he always was, if felt forced last night. It's the same reason David bolted when life got real. 1 kid was hard, 2 is harder. His brother died. I know he and Mark weren't the closest of brothers, but they loved each other, and Mark was the only family David had left. I don't know if I buy that he's been gone so long he doesn't even know who Mark is, that I find a little stretched, but him bolting in general? Fits David's character. 

Estelle Parsons continues to make me thankful that Bev is not my mother, which means she's playing Bev perfectly again. LOL.  While the gonorrhea thing is "ewwwww" it's actually REALLY true to life for senior living centers. STD's run rampant in senior living centers. It's gross, but like they say, if you still got it, get it! It appears that Alcoholic "Bev"rage has fallen off the wagon. I believe her going to AA and getting arrested for a DUI was prior to season 9. 

Jackie kills me every episode. I guess my other UO is that while she's not the more relaxed, has something going for her Jackie we all appreciated more in the earlier seasons, she isn't the Gilligan Jackie that I came to dislike in Season 8-9. Sure, she is over-acting a smidge on things, but I don't think she's THAT bad. The sickle comment, the lunging after Bev, and her facial expressions were awesome. I hope they flesh out her backstory a little more next year. I couldn't care less about Andy, but I want to see the other aspects of her life again. Before Fred, her dating was front and center for most of the earlier seasons. Return to that please. Would be great to see her get addicted to the internet again trying to find someone on "ourtime.com" LOL.

Edited April 18, 2018 by AM1418

[Unconfused]

13 hours ago, Conotocarious said:

Harris may really resemble Darlene physically and they are trying to make her have that Darlene-like attitude but she really has none of Darlene’s charm.

Agreed! Darlene could be a brat but she had a sarcastic, witty charm and in my opinion the best one-liners of the series. (Sometimes that drool on your pillow, it isn’t yours...LOL)

Harris is just an annoying brat, probably more like the young Becky than Darlene. 

[HoboClayton]

Yeah. Bev got busted in season 7 and showed up and crashed Dan's superbowl party. So Fred, Jackie, and Dan went out to the garage and got drunk. Beverage.. Non alcoholic beverage is in there! She really was a selfish asshole at times.

[Delphi]

"What am I going to tell Blue?"

"Tell her she has a stupid name. "

That's my Darlene. 

[AM1418]

3 minutes ago, Delphi said:

"What am I going to tell Blue?"

"Tell her she has a stupid name. "

That's my Darlene. 

"You're dating a crayon!"

[break21]

2 hours ago, Chicken Wing said:

Gosh, I am struggling so much with the idea that David would leave his children and barely see them for years. Breaking up with Darlene because they just don't work no matter how much they try? Sure. Realizing that he's not cut out to be a full-time hands-on parent because he can't deal with responsibility? Okay. But leave them altogether? It makes my heart hurt. As much as I ship Darlene and David as a couple, I was rooting for her not to take him back just for that. He abandoned your children, girl. Give him another chance to be a dad for the sake of the kids having a dad in their lives once again, but he fails the test of a good husband. Don't walk away from your kids.

I'm one of the few who didn't like the episode.  David was always the sensitive one.   It just didn't ring true to me that he would abandon his kids.  The acting all around was a lot better than previous episodes.  Liked seeing Bev but hated her storyline.  

[bichonblitz]

6 hours ago, Lily H said:

I really didn't care for Dan thinking he could make the decision as to when David can see his children. Darlene isn't a teenager any more and David isn't her boyfriend -- it's none of Dan's business whatsoever whether Darlene gets back together with him or sleeps with him, and it sure isn't Dan's place to control David's relationship with his own children.

That really turned me off. In fact, these characters are unlikable to me. They have lost their special chemistry, all of them.  I think I'm just not a re-boot kind of gal. Will and Grace sucks, too, and these two shows were favorites of mine.  Sometimes it's better to leave masterpieces alone and let their original genius shine through till the end of time..

[qtpye]

12 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

Best episode of the season.  I don't think I found anything really wrong with it.   Dan and Darlene had a close relationship and he would be exactly the kind of guy to take a hard line against a guy who walked out on his family considering his own father mostly walked out on him and his mother.  

I even liked how the show explained David's absence.  I could see Darlene and David riding along as they always did on a razors edge but then Mark dies and David's life just falls apart.  David and Mark never had a particularly good relationship but they did love each other and I can see David falling into his worst instincts and running and not knowing how to come back.  

I also like that Roseanne who always thought of David as a son would keep in touch with him and be in his corner but only for him being given another chance with his kids and not another chance with Darlene.   And her telling David she believed in him at the end.  That is the kind of relationship they always had.  In alot of ways she was closer to David then she was to Darlene.  

Sara Gilbert and John Galeki continue to have awesome chemistry.  I bought them as a married couple on the cusp of divorce but still deeply in love with each other.  

Estelle Parsons is a hoot.  I loved her stuff and am wondering if this was a one off for character or if she is going to be on the show for the remainder of the season.  Bev has always been hit and miss with me depending on the way the character got written but this episode was definetly a hit.  All the stuff that made her a fun character.

I have a question for the board about this episode. For some reason seeing David and Darlene again really made me miss Mark and I actually wished I could see Mark and Becky, just to see how their relationship would have progressed in the present day.

I was beginning to wonder, Roseanne was pretty forgiving and understanding of David's actions. It is clear that she loves him and has hopes that he will one day be a good father.  My question is: Do you think she would have ever been as forgiving of Mark if it was him that abandoned Becky to raise two kids on her own? I would think she would have been raging with anger and would not have welcomed him with a giant a hug.

[DkNNy79]

1 hour ago, AM1418 said:

Dan telling David when he can see his kids is perfectly in character. Like someone mentioned up-thread, Dan doesn't take kindly to men walking out on their families. He had too much of that in his own, and he knows how it affected his mom and himself. Then he watched Crystal, Lonnie, Little Ed and Angela all go thru it as well. As wrong as he is in determining when David can see his kids, his first instinct has ALWAYS been father bear protector and that shined thru tonight. I also agree with a previous poster that mentioned they think that he said David can see them in 2 weeks because he wants to make sure he's actually going to stay in their lives. 

 

Agreed.  Plus David knows he's in the wrong when it comes to the kids that's why he didn't put up a fight. 

[iMonrey]

Quote

Harris may really resemble Darlene physically and they are trying to make her have that Darlene-like attitude but she really has none of Darlene’s charm.

Nor her sense of humor. Even at her darkest, Darlene would crack a wicked joke. They just haven't really put any effort into fleshing out Harris as a three-dimensional character. That said, I'm not sure I care. I'm far more invested in the established veterans than I am in the new kids and I would prefer the episodes focus on them rather than the kids.

I'm surprised at how well Johnny Galecki was able to differentiate David from Leonard. Honestly, I would have said there was very little to distinguish one character from another after watching Big Bang for the past 10  years, but honest to God I really saw David again and not Leonard. Maybe it was just the lack of glasses or the familiarity of the sets, but there are very subtle nuances to the way David speaks versus the way Leonard does, and Leonard has some very particular quirks and tics that David lacks. I'm more impressed by this than I expected to be. 

Was also more moved by Darlene telling David it wasn't going to work than I would have guessed. Sara Gilbert really sold that scene.

[libgirl2]

1 hour ago, Calm81 said:

I still can’t get over how Estelle Parsons doesn’t look a day over 70 from her last appearance. And she still stands up straight and has great comedic timing. I really hope I’m like her at 90.

For a minute I thought I was in a time warp! She looks great! 

2 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Nor her sense of humor. Even at her darkest, Darlene would crack a wicked joke. They just haven't really put any effort into fleshing out Harris as a three-dimensional character. That said, I'm not sure I care. I'm far more invested in the established veterans than I am in the new kids and I would prefer the episodes focus on them rather than the kids.

I'm surprised at how well Johnny Galecki was able to differentiate David from Leonard. Honestly, I would have said there was very little to distinguish one character from another after watching Big Bang for the past 10  years, but honest to God I really saw David again and not Leonard. Maybe it was just the lack of glasses or the familiarity of the sets, but there are very subtle nuances to the way David speaks versus the way Leonard does, and Leonard has some very particular quirks and tics that David lacks. I'm more impressed by this than I expected to be. 

Was also more moved by Darlene telling David it wasn't going to work than I would have guessed. Sara Gilbert really sold that scene.

I was thinking the same thing too. I didn't see Leonard at all, he was David again. 

[AM1418]

16 minutes ago, qtpye said:

I have a question for the board about this episode. For some reason seeing David and Darlene again really made me miss Mark and I actually wished I could see Mark and Becky, just to see how their relationship would have progressed in the present day.

I was beginning to wonder, Roseanne was pretty forgiving and understanding of David's actions. It is clear that she loves him and has hopes that he will one day be a good father.  My question is: Do you think she would have ever been as forgiving of Mark if it was him that abandoned Becky to raise two kids on her own? I would think she would have been raging with anger and would not have welcomed him with a giant a hug.

Absolutely not. If you thought that Dan was too involved in telling David when he can and can't see his kids? Imagine this with Roseanne and Mark. She would go to the ends of the Earth to insure that Mark never saw those kids again. 

It would be interesting if the roles WERE reversed though. Dan was always warmer towards Mark than he was David. Roseanne was obviously warmer towards David. I would be MORE curious to see how Dan would react to Mark doing that, than how Roseanne would. We KNOW what Roseanne would do.

[WednesdayAddams]

Was it mentioned here and I missed it, but was Mark named Mark before the OG Mark died? Does this mean he was sick and they knew he was going to die, so they named their kid after him? In the episode and then on this board it was alluded to that David left after Mark died, or at least one of the many reasons he left. He either left after little Mark was born or when Darlene was pregnant. Or did I miss something?

[qtpye]

1 minute ago, AM1418 said:

Absolutely not. If you thought that Dan was too involved in telling David when he can and can't see his kids? Imagine this with Roseanne and Mark. She would go to the ends of the Earth to insure that Mark never saw those kids again. 

It would be interesting if the roles WERE reversed though. Dan was always warmer towards Mark than he was David. Roseanne was obviously warmer towards David. I would be MORE curious to see how Dan would react to Mark doing that, than how Roseanne would. We KNOW what Roseanne would do.

I think Dan's reaction to Mark would totally depend on the reasons for the hypothetical abandonment in my scenario. I think you are totally correct that Roseanne would never forgive Mark like David and Dan liked Mark more. However, Mark made a horrible impression the first time he met the Connors to pick Becky up for a date and he never recovered from that initial dislike. I think Dan eventually grew to respect Mark because he was a hard worker (refusing to fire him from the bike shop when Becky and he broke up). However, I do think Dan would blame Becky's failures on Mark, if somewhat unfairly, and not be as forgiving as Roseanne is to David.

[Chicken Wing]

2 minutes ago, WednesdayAddams said:

Was it mentioned here and I missed it, but was Mark named Mark before the OG Mark died? Does this mean he was sick and they knew he was going to die, so they named their kid after him? In the episode and then on this board it was alluded to that David left after Mark died, or at least one of the many reasons he left. He either left after little Mark was born or when Darlene was pregnant. Or did I miss something?

They haven't spelled it out, but I've assumed that Mark died before Little Mark was born and he was named after his late uncle. When David explains that his brother's death was part of why he left, I didn't really take that to mean that Little Mark was born before OG Mark died and then David left. I assumed it was something he struggled with for years -- before their second baby was born and continuing after, until he finally left when Little Mark was about three.

[WednesdayAddams]

2 minutes ago, Chicken Wing said:

They haven't spelled it out, but I've assumed that Mark died before Little Mark was born and he was named after his late uncle. When David explains that his brother's death was part of why he left, I didn't really take that to mean that Little Mark was born before OG Mark died and then David left. I assumed it was something he struggled with for years -- before their second baby was born and continuing after, until he finally left when Little Mark was about three.

This makes sense. The questions kept coming in my mind when he made that comment and we later learn that he doesn't even know little Mark.

[chocolatine]

13 minutes ago, WednesdayAddams said:

Was it mentioned here and I missed it, but was Mark named Mark before the OG Mark died? Does this mean he was sick and they knew he was going to die, so they named their kid after him? In the episode and then on this board it was alluded to that David left after Mark died, or at least one of the many reasons he left. He either left after little Mark was born or when Darlene was pregnant. Or did I miss something?

He could have left much earlier and little Mark could have been conceived one of those times when he and Darlene were trying to get back together. Maybe Darlene hoped that having another kid and naming him Mark would give David some closure and make him want to come back permanently.

Edited April 18, 2018 by chocolatine

[tomvilchez1999]

4 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

He could have left much earlier and little Mark could have been conceived one of those times when he and Darlene were trying to get back together. Maybe Darlene hoped that having another kid and naming him Mark would give David some closure and make him want to come back permanently.

No, Darlene wouldn't name her son Mark if David had already left the family.

[Madtown]

1 hour ago, AM1418 said:

"You're dating a crayon!"

Laughed out loud when she said that. Took me back to the Seinfeld episode where Jerry tells Elaine that George is dating a crayon, her name was Sienna.

I actually really liked Dan telling David he could see his kids in 2 weeks. Maybe I liked it because it was really old school Dan and I thought John Goodman nailed it. I also try to picture what my dad would do in that situation(no, I'm not in one)and he would've probably said the same thing.

I loved this episode and I agree with those that say Roseanne seemed much better and not so stiff. Johnny G was spot on and I loved watching him and Sara, took me right back to the beginning of their relationship. I also wondered if he had to go back and watch old scenes to get back in character, I doubt it though, he was really really good.

I'm on the boat wanting to know how Estelle looks so great at 90?!?!?!?

[chocolatine]

4 minutes ago, tomvilchez1999 said:

No, Darlene wouldn't name her son Mark if David had already left the family.

Darlene obviously still loves David and, until this episode, wanted to get back together with him. Plus, Mark was an integral part of the family, so I can see Darlene wanting to honor him even if she wasn’t on good terms with David at the time.

[Evie]

I thought Johnny Galecki did a good job with David, but it makes me sad that David abandoned his kids and doesn't know what Mark is like. I have a hard time buying it, but more than that I didn't like that they opened this can of worms when Johnny G isn't really available.  I feel like they could have achieved the same result - David and Darlene realizing that while they love each other, they will never work and David being around but off screen - without making David a deadbeat. 

Estelle looks great!

[TomGirl]

1 hour ago, qtpye said:

 

Best episode of the season.  I don't think I found anything really wrong with it.  

I really liked the episode too, but I found a lot wrong with it.  The show seems to be trying to demonstrate how everyone is moving forward, especially with the final decision for David and Darlene to remain apart, but there was a lot of juvenile throwback behavior leading up to that conclusion.

First, Darlene.  She wasn’t overly warm toward David for the first few minutes, but as soon as she found out that he was seeing someone, she immediately reverted to the teenage Darlene who couldn’t stand the idea of Molly flirting with - or, quite simply, even being nice to - her boyfriend, and pulled out the sexual moves to manipulate things toward her own goals, as well as decimating Molly in a way that was, admittedly, very funny but not very nice.

Second, David.  I like that he (belatedly) pushed back on Darlene’s aggressivenes as he was heading out the window, even telling her he’d changed in that regard.  But then why was he so quick to sleep with her and willingly to sacrifice what seemed like a very positive and loving relationship with Blue, which is what brought him to this point of being ready to move back into his children’s lives on a full-time basis in the first place?

I ship David and Darlene as much as anyone, and I understand that they love each other and that letting go is difficult and scary, but here’s how I wish the episode had gone.  Whether they had slept together or not, I wish Darlene and David had both recognized sooner that her sudden attempt to get back with David was primarily motivated by jealousy, fear, and the need to maintain power and control in the relationship.  It was very sugary-sweet to imply that the ONLY potential downside to their getting back together was the effect on the kids, but what about the effect on David?  He’s clearly gotten his life much more on track since being away from Darlene.  Would she not want this to continue?

One of my favorite moments last night was David standing up to Darlene and telling her he’s changed, but I also wish he had “walked the walk” by being the one to put the kibosh on getting back together.  I am interested in Blue, who sounded, from David’s brief description, like a kind, caring and supportive person, and I hope they cast someone in that role.  If she’s going to be living with him in Lanford, she might take on a quasi-step parental role which would present lots of fun possibilities...

Anayway, I’m glad the episode came to the conclusion it did, just wished it had featured a bit more growth and insight after 20 years!

David, when you get your house in Lanford, please take Harris with you asap!

Edited April 18, 2018 by TomGirl
ETA

[Mmmfloorpie]

Would have been funny if Blue was Sarah Chalke instead of that stupid egg storyline.

[TomGirl]

5 minutes ago, Mmmfloorpie said:

 

Would have been funny if Blue was Sarah Chalke instead of that stupid egg storyline.

 

Ha!  I had the exact same thought!

[StaceyNotStacie]

22 minutes ago, Mmmfloorpie said:

Would have been funny if Blue was Sarah Chalke instead of that stupid egg storyline.

They should bring her back next season as Blue and ignore the surrogacy storyline. Sarah C had decent chemistry with Johnny when she played Becky. 

If they have more than two seasons, they could bring her back every season as a different character as a side joke. 

[callie lee 29]

This was the best so far and I was never a huge Darlene/David fan. Their interaction was just heartbreaking.  And Roseanne was the best she's been in the scene with Galecki. They always had a great rapport, one ofrhe best in the show. And while I understand where Dan is coming from, he doesn't get to decide when David gets to see his kids, especially when the oldest just invited him infir cake.  For her birthday. 

So ya'll think their going to keep the "Harris is an absolute brat" the whole time,  because every scene she's in just sinks like a lead balloon. 

[peacheslatour]

Bev looks fantastic. David looks old as fuck. Jeez, Becky why even bother with glass, let alone the celery. Roseanne was much better this week. Jackie needs to take it down several notches. I hope John Goodman plays Robert Mueller in the eventual movie. Where is the dog? I hate it when TV shows treat animals as props. It must suck to be so poor you have to get small children involved in a little light larceny. I hated that stupid face in the cake eating crap at the end. The end.

[BeachDays]

Hi everyone, this is my first post on here even though I have been reading for weeks.   I have REALLY been loving this reboot, there are small things I would change, like making Harris more likeable.  But I am really sad with the direction they are going with David and Darlene to the point that I haven’t been able to bring myself to watch this episode yet.  It’s just frustrating bc I do think 2 adults who truly love each other and can work things out.  Marriage isn’t easy but.... I just feel like the Darlene I have seen so far this season and David could be great together.   At any rate, I’m curious to see what will happen next season if he returns.   Sara and Johnny have such amazing chemistry, I feel like if they are dating other people that they will still have the best chemistry in the room with each other.    At any rate, I might just skip this ep and resume next week.  

[hnygrl]

So Grandma's NOT Gay. Huh. But she IS a ho. And gave all the old dudes she was banging like a hammer on a nail and STD. NOW she gets to live in the basement. Think Dan and Rosie will let her Penis Posse crash down there? Git it Granny. She. Looks. THE SAME! Younger than her KIDS! Git it Estelle!

I loved Becky tonight. LOVED her. She spoke truth to Darlene. Straight no chaser.

So David NEVER DID grow a spine, huh? Things get hard so he abandon not only his wife but baby son and young daughter to *ahem* "help the needy all over the world." Gotta say...I HATED David tonight. HATED him. Oooh I turned the air blue with cussing him out through the TV!!!! HOW DARE HE?!?!?!

Loved the way Dan handled it. Typical Dan-the-man fashion. A look. A word. softly spoken, is scarier than a fist any day.

That 20-something-minutes FLEW by!

DJ NEXT WEEK!!!!

[TomGirl]

10 minutes ago, Stacey1014 said:

 

If they have more than two seasons, they could bring her back every season as a different character as a side joke. 

Kudos to you, that is a hilarious idea!  (And I don’t even care for Sarah Chalke.)

[Ria]

I enjoyed it up until Dan refused to allow David to see his kids and stay for the party. It wasn’t his call and both David should have stood up to him and Darlene put her foot down and insisted he be allowed to stay. I get why Darlene needs to stay with her parents for now but don’t want her to regress to a little girl who defers to her parents judgement. 

Edited April 18, 2018 by Ria

[threebluestars]

I thought you were all joking about Estelle Parsons being 90!!!! I am stunned. She looks amazing. She and Dick Van Dyke found some kind of fountain of youth and are hiding it from the rest of us.

[Sherilea43]

Estelle looks amazing! Better than her original appearances. David was a great touch and he seemed to be the most natural in the acting so far. 

[TigerLynx]

I thought Dan wouldn't let David see the children because he doesn't believe David will be back in two weeks.  He thinks David will just show up for Harris' birthday, then disappear, once again disappointing the kids.

I'm surprised Darlene wanted to get back together with David.

David not being able to handle Mark's death, and Darlene makes sense.  Darlene was the strong one.  David is the one who even after he graduated high school was still living at the Connors' house working part time.  It seems whatever ambition David had about going to college was tied to Darlene.  David also ended up living at the Connors originally because Darlene asked Dan and Roseanne if he could live there, and Roseanne caved after meeting David's mother.  Prior to that, David's plan was to run away because he didn't want to live with his mother.