Unpopular Opinions

[dusang]

I really enjoy Russell Brand. This audition tape amazes me.

http://youtu.be/rrBiR5lJICI

[ratgirlagogo]

 

Spartacus is the only Kubrick film I have any interest in ever re-visiting

My own favorite is Paths of Glory. 

[Crs97]

I really disliked Terms of Endearment.  And by "dislike" I mean hate with the fire of a thousand suns!  I didn't find any of the characters likable, including the children.  Aurora was a horrible mother.  Emma was a horrible mother.  I thought their relationship was toxic, and it was a travesty that Aurora ended up getting Emma's children so that she could ruin them, too.  I saw it almost 30 years ago; yet, I can still remember vividly the final scene with Aurora getting her granddaughter to move over closer to her.  In my mind, that played like a horror film and I wanted the little girl to run screaming away from the monster grandmother.  The Academy Awards show was unwatchable that year for me.

[Pickles Aplenty]

Going back to the hot Disney dudes conversation: I'm all about Robin Hood.  Yes, I know he's a literal fox, but I don't care.  He has charisma.

Edited May 31, 2015 by Billina

[Wiendish Fitch]

I really disliked Terms of Endearment.  And by "dislike" I mean hate with the fire of a thousand suns!  I didn't find any of the characters likable, including the children.  Aurora was a horrible mother.  Emma was a horrible mother.  I thought their relationship was toxic, and it was a travesty that Aurora ended up getting Emma's children so that she could ruin them, too.  I saw it almost 30 years ago; yet, I can still remember vividly the final scene with Aurora getting her granddaughter to move over closer to her.  In my mind, that played like a horror film and I wanted the little girl to run screaming away from the monster grandmother.  The Academy Awards show was unwatchable that year for me.

 

I hate Terms of Endearment, too. Aurora and Emma both grated my nerves, and I feel it started that loathsome trend of shaming the audience into liking an insufferable character by having them die of some vague, cancer-like illness (the absolutely horrid The Family Stone also employs this tactic). A good writer shouldn't care all that much whether or not people like their characters, and I'm sure not going to like them more just because they croak. Sorry, but the fact that Emma died didn't alter how irritatingly shrill, immature, and not even all that interesting she was to me.

 

You want to write unlikable characters? Fine! It takes all kinds, but don't you dare try to manipulate my opinion on them with cheap sentimentality and Love Story-variety tearjerking!

Edited May 31, 2015 by Wiendish Fitch

[Ohwell]

Speaking of The Family Stone, that's when my Rachel McAdams hatred began.  I know it was just a character she was playing, but I haven't wanted to see her in a movie since.  Actually, I hated everyone in that movie except for Luke Wilson's and Sarah Jessica Parker's characters, and that nice, poor SOB that Rachel married.  I was hoping that SJP wouldn't marry into that toxic, insufferable, self-righteous family but I guess they accepted her in the end. 

Edited May 31, 2015 by Ohwell

[CatMack]

I don't like Blade Runner.  I can appreciate the artistry and understand how it's influenced scifi as a genre, but I still hate it.  Nobody is likeable, and it's a slog to get through.  

[latetotheparty]

I also think Marilyn Monroe is criminally overrated, and the ongoing deification of her kind of nauseating. An ardent fan of hers told me that she felt bad for Monroe, and wished she could have "been her friend and helped her through her problems". I think Judy Garland, Vivien Leigh, Rita Hayworth, Gail Russell, and Gene Tierney needed friends much more than Monroe did, but no one seems to care about them.

 

And, sweet juggling John the Baptist, enough with the onslaught of Monroe biographies!! I swear we must get 10-20 new Monroe biographies a year (meanwhile, I have found all of two biographies of Myrna Loy, a woman who outclasses Monroe in every respect)! The woman has been dead for over 50 years, we are not going to learn a single new thing about her! Trust me on this!

 

Screw Some Like it Hot, I think The Apartment has the greatest final line in a Billy Wilder movie ever (with Sunset Boulevard nipping at its heels).

 

"Shut up and deal."  God, I love Jack Lemmon.

[Wiendish Fitch]

I think Anna Kendrick is funnier than Jennifer Lawrence. Sorry.

[Athena]

I think Anna Kendrick is funnier than Jennifer Lawrence. Sorry.

 

Hmm. I didn't know this was an UO. I don't really have much opinion on Lawrence these days, but Kendrick is the one I want to have drinks and hang out with at the end of a week to catch up.

[Princess Sparkle]

And my UO is that I can't stand Anna Kendrick at all.  Her entire personality seems so inauthentic to me, like she's trying WAY too hard.

 

Since I was just mentioning him in a different thread, my UO is that I actually think Mark Wahlberg is a pretty good actor.  Obviously, he's not winning any awards for the Transformers movies, and he'll even admit he was bad in The Happening, but in the right roles, I think he can be really great.  I thought he was fantastic in The Fighter, and his performance was overshadowed by the flashier performance of Christian Bale (which, even in his acceptance speech, Bale alluded to the fact that he'd played non-flashy roles, they often get overlooked no matter how good you are).  I loved him in The Departed, I thought he was hysterical in The Other Guys and Date Night.  I think he's a more charismatic actor than he often gets credit for.  

[dusang]

And my UO is that I can't stand Anna Kendrick at all.  Her entire personality seems so inauthentic to me, like she's trying WAY too hard.

 

Since I was just mentioning him in a different thread, my UO is that I actually think Mark Wahlberg is a pretty good actor.  Obviously, he's not winning any awards for the Transformers movies, and he'll even admit he was bad in The Happening, but in the right roles, I think he can be really great.  I thought he was fantastic in The Fighter, and his performance was overshadowed by the flashier performance of Christian Bale (which, even in his acceptance speech, Bale alluded to the fact that he'd played non-flashy roles, they often get overlooked no matter how good you are).  I loved him in The Departed, I thought he was hysterical in The Other Guys and Date Night.  I think he's a more charismatic actor than he often gets credit for.  

 

So agreed.  I have a strange love for Mark Wahlberg -- he's done some seriously fucked up things in his past and he can be a bit of a douche but he also seems to have grown up and recognizes some of his douchiness (I think, Entourage has to have a bit of self-awareness right?  I'm not sure, I've never watched it but it must, right?).  But what I really love about him is the sheer improbability of Marky Mark of "Good Vibrations" fame eventually being an Oscar-nominated actor.  That I would someday look at that guy and say, "you're better than Transformers 4."

Edited June 8, 2015 by dusang

[Princess Sparkle]

So agreed.  I have a strange love for Mark Wahlberg -- he's done some seriously fucked up things in his past and he can be a bit of a douche but he also seems to have grown up and recognizes some of his douchiness (I think, Entourage has to have a bit of self-awareness right?  I'm not sure, I've never watched it but it must, right?).  But what I really love about him is the sheer improbability of Marky Mark of "Good Vibrations" fame eventually being an Oscar-nominated actor.  That I would someday look at that guy and say, "you're better than Transformers 4."

I always remember him making fun of himself on SNL after Andy Samberg did his "Mark Wahlberg talks to animals".  He started by playing it really straight, but then ended up doing everything Andy Samberg had used in his imitation ("Amy Poheler, you're pregnant.  What's up with that?" "Josh Brolin! You were in the Goonies!  I produce Entourage!  Say hi to your mother for me, alright", etc) and I thought there was a level of self-awareness and humor that wasn't there before (compare that to when he was on TRL and Eminem called him Marky Mark).  

 

Like you, I think I just have a real soft spot for Mark Wahlberg.

Edited June 8, 2015 by Princess Sparkle

[caracas1914]

I thought Laurence Olivier was very hammy in many of his film roles, you could see the wheel turning as he got into his "acting" mode.  

[Dandesun]

Going back to the hot Disney dudes conversation: I'm all about Robin Hood.  Yes, I know he's a literal fox, but I don't care.  He has charisma.

 

I hope this isn't unpopular. It certainly doesn't seem to be among people I know. Most of the ladies I've hung out with agree that Foxy Robin Hood is the dreamiest.

 

Also, Justin from The Secret of NIMH even though that's Don Bluth and not Disney. (Well, Bluth did work for Disney and then left and created his own studio.) But still... animation has managed to make some impossibly sexy anthropomorphic animal characters.

[VanillaBear85]

I will never like Mark Wahlberg. Yes, it goes back to his teens, but I find him unremarkable regardless. I will also never like an actor, director, producer etc whose known views I disagree with. Just another movie to avoid. I have no issue with avoiding something associated with someone or something I find repugnant.

Edited June 11, 2015 by VanillaBear85

[NoWillToResist]

Dude, that film makes my teeth itch and my right eye twitch.  I actually wouldn't mind a "girls behaving badly" film, but my goodness,

 

I feel like Spy is the movie I was told Bridesmaids would be (i.e. a raunchy comedy featuring ladies with potty mouths).

 

Today's UO is that I didn't hate Aloha, which surprised me. Considering the reviews I'd read, my general apathy re: Breadley Cooper, and my Emma Stone exhaustion, I was VERY hesitant to watch it.

 

I'm not going to defend the movie or anything because it's certainly not great, but I don't think it deserved the scorchingly hateful reviews it received. I've seen way  worse movies.

[Schweedie]

Going back to the hot Disney dudes conversation: I'm all about Robin Hood.  Yes, I know he's a literal fox, but I don't care.  He has charisma.

 

 

I hope this isn't unpopular. It certainly doesn't seem to be among people I know. Most of the ladies I've hung out with agree that Foxy Robin Hood is the dreamiest.

 

Also, Justin from The Secret of NIMH even though that's Don Bluth and not Disney. (Well, Bluth did work for Disney and then left and created his own studio.) But still... animation has managed to make some impossibly sexy anthropomorphic animal characters.

 

Right there with you guys. I had the biggest crush on Fox!Robin Hood when I was a kid. And I remember seeing a screencap of Justin from NIMH as recently as a few years ago and before I recognised where it was from the thought "Wait, who's that handsome rat?" went through my head. I'm not proud. I think you're right, though - I know many who've said the same thing, so I don't think it's unpopular. *g*

 

Here's one I don't usually flaunt: I hated Million Dollar Baby. That movie just did absolutely nothing for me, and although I could see I was supposed to be wrecked by the ending I just got annoyed that they were trying to emotionally manipulate me and sort of turned off. The final scenes of Pay It Forward (ugh) and Dead Poets Society have a similar effect on me.

[dusang]

Here's one I don't usually flaunt: I hated Million Dollar Baby. That movie just did absolutely nothing for me, and although I could see I was supposed to be wrecked by the ending I just got annoyed that they were trying to emotionally manipulate me and sort of turned off. The final scenes of Pay It Forward (ugh) and Dead Poets Society have a similar effect on me.

 

I will never be able to hear the words "Dead Poets Society" without thinking of that episode of Friends where Monica had her wallet stolen and stalked and befriended the thief who was using her credit cards.  When the thief explained why she had turned to a life of crime, as it were, she cited the absolute stupidity and melodrama of Dead Poets Society, saying "I realized that was two hours of my life I could never get back."  I don't know that I dislike DPS that much, it's been so long since I actually saw it, but sometimes in life I pause and think, "is this going to be time that I'll think back on as wasted and unrecoverable?  Should I just do something else?"

[harrie]

I never made it through Dead Poets Society - what I saw of it just seemed so hoky and hollow.

 

I feel like Spy is the movie I was told Bridesmaids would be (i.e. a raunchy comedy featuring ladies with potty mouths).

 

Today's UO is that I didn't hate Aloha, which surprised me. Considering the reviews I'd read, my general apathy re: Breadley Cooper, and my Emma Stone exhaustion, I was VERY hesitant to watch it.

 

I'm not going to defend the movie or anything because it's certainly not great, but I don't think it deserved the scorchingly hateful reviews it received. I've seen way  worse movies.

 

Cameron Crowe has been in a box office slump for a while, and I can't help wondering whether Aloha (or Elizabethtown or We Bought a Zoo, for that matter) would have been better received if they'd been allowed to quietly open.  With a cast like Cooper and Stone, I guess that's not possible, though.  

 

I found both Elizabethtown and We Bought a Zoo, for which Crowe was absolutely skewered, not that bad and kind of charming.  But since Crowe's movies are few and far between, and since he's done films like Almost Famous and Jerry McGuire in the past - whether or not you like them, they were massive box office and critical successes -- there's a certain sense of anticipation, followed by disappointment.  Because when you anticipate something too much, a letdown is almost inevitable.  I realize Aloha suffered some justifiable criticism for Crowe's casting choices, but I was wondering myself just how bad it could be, and may catch a matinee to find out.  Thanks, dusang, for mentioning  Aloha. 

[caracas1914]

Anna Kendrick is fine as an actress, more than fine, actually, but I find her singing on film shrill and almost painful. It worked in her first film "CAMP" where her character embodies this ruthless and driven teenager who is , so help me, singing "Ladies who lunch" but after that her onscreen singing is painful to hear.

Edited June 12, 2015 by caracas1914

[JustaPerson]

Thank god I'm not the only one. I like her a lot, but most of the time I find myself avoiding hearing her actually sing. I told a friend who is obsessed with Pitch Perfect, and she gave me dirty looks while watching the finale performance for the upteenth time. 

 

My other one is that I didn't love Pitch Perfect. I liked it certainly, but not to the degree everyone else seems to. Weirdly enough I really like Pitch Perfect 2. Maybe because of DSM?

[DeLurker]

 Weirdly enough I really like Pitch Perfect 2. Maybe because of DSM?

Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders?

[harrie]

Anna Kendrick is fine as an actress, more than fine, actually, but I find her singing on film shrill and almost painful. It worked in her first film "CAMP" where her character embodies this ruthless and driven teenageer who is , so help me, singing "Ladies who lunch" but after that her onscreen singing it painful to hear.

 

 

Thank god I'm not the only one. I like her a lot, but most of the time I find myself avoiding hearing her actually sing. I told a friend who is obsessed with Pitch Perfect, and she gave me dirty looks while watching the finale performance for the upteenth time. 

 

My other one is that I didn't love Pitch Perfect. I liked it certainly, but not to the degree everyone else seems to. Weirdly enough I really like Pitch Perfect 2. Maybe because of DSM?

 

This is kind of funny, because I get the feeling that Anna Kendrick really enjoys singing, but it turns out not everyone want to hear her do it.  (She and I have something in common!) 

[caracas1914]

At first I was intrigued by the prospect of Lt. Uhura being in a relationship with Spock in the Star Trek reboot, but I realize  now it's just another trite  GF role for a character who was  refreshingly  independent in the original concept.  Uhura was an officer, black and a woman back in the mid 60's when Star Trek came out, and to have her reduced to relationship arguments with Spock is so disheartening.

[KatWay]

 

At first I was intrigued by the prospect of Lt. Uhura being in a relationship with Spock in the Star Trek reboot, but I realize  now it's just another trite  GF role for a character who was  refreshingly  independent in the original concept.  Uhura was an officer, black and a woman back in the mid 60's when Star Trek came out, and to have her reduced to relationship arguments with Spock is so disheartening.

Seconded. The only times she was awesome was in scenes that had nothing to do with Spock. And I can't even with the writers congratulating themselves for giving her a bigger role - because apparently the only way they could think of to do that was "let's make her a main character's girlfriend!". Cause, yeah, what else could a female character possibly be doing in a movie like that. God forbid she be allowed to be independent and competent and not attached to a male character's hip.

[Danny Franks]

I will never like Mark Wahlberg. Yes, it goes back to his teens, but I find him unremarkable regardless. I will also never like an actor, director, producer etc whose known views I disagree with. Just another movie to avoid. I have no issue with avoiding something associated with someone or something I find repugnant.

 

Agreed. He is so workmanlike and ordinary, in everything he does. I guess that's his appeal, but whenever I see him, I just see a bland, humdrum guy who is the same in every movie. Not much will dampen my enthusiasm for a film more than seeing that it stars Mark Wahlberg.

 

I guess this is an unpopular opinion, because the guy is a complete fruitloop who gives me (and a lot of other people) the creeps, but I actually like Tom Cruise in movies. I was reminded of this when I finally watched Edge of Tomorrow, the other day. He's charismatic, funny, engaging and can definitely hit every beat he's supposed to. Even though he's been one of the most recognisable men in the world for three decades, I always find myself forgetting he's Tom Cruise, and completely buying the character he's playing.

Edited June 12, 2015 by Danny Franks

[harrie]

Agreed. He is so workmanlike and ordinary, in everything he does. I guess that's his appeal, but whenever I see him, I just see a bland, humdrum guy who is the same in every movie. Not much will dampen my enthusiasm for a film more than seeing that it stars Mark Wahlberg.

 

I guess this is an unpopular opinion, because the guy is a complete fruitloop who gives me (and a lot of other people) the creeps, but I actually like Tom Cruise in movies. I was reminded of this when I finally watched Edge of Tomorrow, the other day. He's charismatic, funny, engaging and can definitely hit every beat he's supposed to. Even though he's been one of the most recognisable men in the world for three decades, I always find myself forgetting he's Tom Cruise, and completely buying the character he's playing.

 

When I run across Knight and Day, another Tom Cruise flick, I usually end up sticking with it.  Agreed that Cruise is a nutjob, and the idea of Cameron Diaz as a semi-helpless female is kind of ridiculous, but I find it very watchable.  I never forget that he's Tom Cruise, but I do think he's quite savvy and possibly aware of his limitations, and puts out some fun movies.  Just don't drink the Kool-Aid.

Edited June 12, 2015 by harrie

[Shannon L.]

 

I guess this is an unpopular opinion, because the guy is a complete fruitloop who gives me (and a lot of other people) the creeps, but I actually like Tom Cruise in movies. I was reminded of this when I finally watched Edge of Tomorrow, the other day. He's charismatic, funny, engaging and can definitely hit every beat he's supposed to. Even though he's been one of the most recognisable men in the world for three decades, I always find myself forgetting he's Tom Cruise, and completely buying the character he's playing.

I agree with all of this.  He really commits to his roles and it shows.  I've enjoyed most of his movies.

[caracas1914]

God knows she was an untrained actress, but there was something quite appealing to me about Sofia Coppola in Godfather 3.

[dusang]

I guess this is an unpopular opinion, because the guy is a complete fruitloop who gives me (and a lot of other people) the creeps, but I actually like Tom Cruise in movies. I was reminded of this when I finally watched Edge of Tomorrow, the other day. He's charismatic, funny, engaging and can definitely hit every beat he's supposed to. Even though he's been one of the most recognisable men in the world for three decades, I always find myself forgetting he's Tom Cruise, and completely buying the character he's playing.

 

He is a fruitloop but I tend to think of him more like a victim of a cult -- he's been brainwashed and it's a bit sad.  But he does make good movies (I really enjoyed Edge of Tomorrow) and every person who's ever worked with him speaks well of him.  And in a sincere way, not "I better suck up because he's Tom Cruise" kind of way.

[methodwriter85]

I never made it through Dead Poets Society - what I saw of it just seemed so hoky and hollow.

 

I feel like a traitor because Dead Poets Society was filmed in my home state and everybody seems to have a story about it, but yeah, it never did it for me. I just thought Robert Sean Leonard's character was just annoying, and I felt nothing when the guy offed himself.

[proserpina65]

God knows she was an untrained actress, but there was something quite appealing to me about Sofia Coppola in Godfather 3.

I didn't mind her in that movie.  She wasn't good, but I've seen worse performances from better trained actors/actresses, and I certainly didn't think she was so awful that she ruined the whole film.  Plus, a lot of her scenes were with Andy Garcia, so . . .

[Princess Sparkle]

I guess this is an unpopular opinion, because the guy is a complete fruitloop who gives me (and a lot of other people) the creeps, but I actually like Tom Cruise in movies. I was reminded of this when I finally watched Edge of Tomorrow, the other day. He's charismatic, funny, engaging and can definitely hit every beat he's supposed to. Even though he's been one of the most recognisable men in the world for three decades, I always find myself forgetting he's Tom Cruise, and completely buying the character he's playing.

 

I have to try and ignore the Scientology stuff, because yeah, he is someone who I think is the proto-typical movie star.  And up until he let the Scientology stuff fly (he should never have fired his publicist), he was one of those rare people whose movies were guaranteed to make 100 million just based on name alone.  We don't really have movie stars like that anymore.  The closest person now is probably Leonardo DiCaprio.

 

My other Tom Cruise UO is I actually think he's a great actor, even in the non-action movies.  Born on the Fourth of July is a really great film, and he puts in a fantastic performance.  I mean, he had no chance that year of beating Daniel Day Lewis, but that performance was Oscar-worthy.  He was also fantastic in A Few Good Men and Collateral.  I even very much liked him in the (much derided) Vanilla Sky.  

Edited June 18, 2015 by Princess Sparkle

[Shannon L.]

 

My other Tom Cruise UO is I actually think he's a great actor, even in the non-action movies.  Born on the Fourth of July is a really great film, and he puts in a fantastic performance.  I mean, he had no chance that year of beating Daniel Day Lewis, but that performance was Oscar-worthy.  He was also fantastic in A Few Good Men and Collateral.  I even very much liked him in the (much derided) Vanilla Sky.

I thought his portrayal of Charlie in Rain Man was really good, too.

 

ETA:

 

He is a fruitloop but I tend to think of him more like a victim of a cult -- he's been brainwashed and it's a bit sad.  But he does make good movies (I really enjoyed Edge of Tomorrow) and every person who's ever worked with him speaks well of him.  And in a sincere way, not "I better suck up because he's Tom Cruise" kind of way.

I have a friend who gives historical tours where she lives.  One day, she was asked to come in one evening for a private tour and discovered that one of the people in the group was Tom Cruise.  She thought she'd have to "suck it up" and deal with it, but it turned out that she really liked showing him around.  She thought he was a bit ADHD (kept running off the path saying "what's that over there?" and that kind of thing), but all in all it was an enjoyable night for her.  She also believes that he's a victim of Scientology.

Edited June 18, 2015 by Shannon L.

[ratgirlagogo]

 

My other Tom Cruise UO is I actually think he's a great actor, even in the non-action movies

I've always agreed with this - who cares what his religion is? The man's a movie star, not the President.   I liked him in all the movies you mentioned (Collateral especially) and would add Interview with the Vampire - his Lestat is the best thing in that movie.  So funny that Anne Rice didn't want him in the part. 

[GreekGeek]

I feel like a traitor because Dead Poets Society was filmed in my home state and everybody seems to have a story about it, but yeah, it never did it for me.

I feel bad hating on DPS because of what happened to Robin Williams, but to me, those "inspiring lessons" were just Williams doing schtick. Actually, there aren't any "inspiring teacher" movies I really like except Stand and Deliver, because the kids actually learned math. (I can accept a bit of artistic license when it came to how fast they learned it and whether they cheated on the AP exam.)

[dusang]

I feel bad hating on DPS because of what happened to Robin Williams, but to me, those "inspiring lessons" were just Williams doing schtick. Actually, there aren't any "inspiring teacher" movies I really like except Stand and Deliver, because the kids actually learned math. (I can accept a bit of artistic license when it came to how fast they learned it and whether they cheated on the AP exam.)

I've always had a soft spot for Mr. Holland's Opus.

[GreekGeek]

I've always had a soft spot for Mr. Holland's Opus.

Fair enough. That's one of the few movies that captures the day-to-day year-in-and-year-out work of teaching. I was thinking more in terms of the "amazing maverick teacher does amazing things for kids and faces hostility from non-amazing administration" formula.

Edited June 20, 2015 by GreekGeek

[bubbls]

I assume this is an unpopular opinion. I think the "beautiful" Katie Holmes is....ahem....unfortunate in appearance. She looks like she had her nose rebuilt by a bad and untalented plastic surgeon. She's attractive enough by small-town-in-the-middle-of-nowhere standards but by Hollywood standards? No. I don't get her fame at all.

[Julia]

I assume this is an unpopular opinion. I think the "beautiful" Katie Holmes is....ahem....unfortunate in appearance. She looks like she had her nose rebuilt by a bad and untalented plastic surgeon. She's attractive enough by small-town-in-the-middle-of-nowhere standards but by Hollywood standards? No. I don't get her fame at all.

 

Up until she had one of the most successful leading men on the planet destroying the springs on Oprah's couch all for the love of her and her wedding picture was on the cover of People, I think her fame mostly came from playing a small-town-in-the-middle-of-nowhere girl next door.

[ribboninthesky1]

I remember people swearing that Katie Holmes was widely known and a household name before she became involved with Tom Cruise.  That always made me chuckle.  I don't have any strong feelings about her either way, but it's amusing to me that, at the time, "popular on the Internet, and even then a few sites" translated to "household name." That might be true now, since mainstream media takes it cues from social media a lot more, but in 2005? Nope, not buying it. 

[topanga]

Here's my UO, and I feel like a traitor to the black community for feeling this way: I will never sit through "Malcolm X" again because the movie bored me to tears. Granted, Denzel Washington gave arguably his best performance ever--and IMO he deserved the Oscar that year, not Al Pacino. And with "The Autobiography of Malcolm X" being one of my favorite books of all time, I was afraid what Spike Lee would with it. But Spike Lee used those three-plus hours to tell a great story of Malcolm X's life and death. Maybe that's the problem: the three-plus hours.  I just can't do it again. I think Malcolm X is in important movie, especially for people who haven't read the book. But I've done both, so I'm finished with my Black People homework on this topic.

[harrie]

I dunno, Katie Holmes had been a main character on Dawson's Creek  since 1998; and even if I didn't watch the show, I knew about it and that people made "Pacey" (another character on the show) jokes, so I would say Katie Holmes was known to a good number of people.  Dawson's Creek may not have been Shakespeare, but it was trendy, popular, and on the air for five years (and I think the WB's #1 show).   I knew of Katie Holmes before 2005 because she starred in Pieces of April, one of my semi-favorite movies (despite its flaws, which I acknowledge) and an indie with a solid cast.

 

I'm not saying Katie Holmes is a great talent, or that her pre-Tom Cruise level of fame was Kardashianesque, but I didn't watch her TV show and still knew who she was.  Household name might be a stretch, depending on the household, but KH had a life and career of her own going on before Tom Cruise spotted her, jumped on the couch, etc. (or, according to some, before she agreed to the contract terms)

Edited June 22, 2015 by harrie

[ribboninthesky1]

I'm not debating Katie's career.  I guess when I think of household name, at least at the time, I think Julia Roberts, Sandra Bullock.  That Dawson's Creek was #1 on the WB is fine, but it's...the WB.  I knew of her as well without watching the show, but I was also in that teen/young adult demo when the show was popular.   But then, I think like-minded people tend to congregate in online spaces. That's not the same thing as being a household name. As I said, it's different now, because of the proliferation of social media. Ten years ago, not really.  

 

Besides, I can't recall ever reading any references to Joshua Jackson, James Van Der Beek, or Michelle Williams as household names. I'm not even debating Katie's talent, but for better or worse, Tom Cruise WAS a household name, and her relationship with and marriage to him put her in the mainstream.  I mean, if we were talking someone like Jennifer Aniston when she got involved with Brad Pitt, I could see the argument. But Katie? Well, that's why I'm in the UPO thread, heh. 

Edited June 23, 2015 by ribboninthesky1

[harrie]

ribbon, I hear you.  My definition of a household name would be if someone said "Hey harrie, did you hear Person X did such-and-such" and I'd know who they were talking about.  Maybe that's too generous a standard, but in my case the pre-Cruise Ms. Holmes fits that bill.  Or maybe, because I live near where James Van Der Beek is from, I heard more about Dawson's Creek than the average bear and think everyone else nationwide got the same treatment.   For me, Michelle Williams is is a household name because of her Oscar-TM nominations and association with Heath Ledger at the time of his death.  But that's my household, not everyone's.  It's all part of what makes opinions, popular or unpopular. 

 

For the record,  I was well past the teen/YA demographic when Dawson's Creek was popular and didn't watch it.

Edited June 23, 2015 by harrie

[DeLurker]

  I knew of Katie Holmes before 2005 because she starred in Pieces of April, one of my semi-favorite movies (despite its flaws, which I acknowledge) and an indie with a solid cast.

 

I liked Pieces of April very much too.  I seem to recall liking her in Go too, although I can't remember very much about the plotline.

[Princess Sparkle]

I remember being insanely jealous that she got to roll around with a very hot, very shirtless Timothy Olyphant.  

[ribboninthesky1]

ribbon, I hear you.  My definition of a household name would be if someone said "Hey harrie, did you hear Person X did such-and-such" and I'd know who they were talking about.  Maybe that's too generous a standard, but in my case the pre-Cruise Ms. Holmes fits that bill.  Or maybe, because I live near where James Van Der Beek is from, I heard more about Dawson's Creek than the average bear and think everyone else nationwide got the same treatment.   For me, Michelle Williams is is a household name because of her Oscar-TM nominations and association with Heath Ledger at the time of his death.  But that's my household, not everyone's.  It's all part of what makes opinions, popular or unpopular. 

 

I understand your point.  I know several actors by name that probably wouldn't register with the average movie-goer, so my litmus test is something like: child-free adult who isn't much of a computer person knowing an actor by name. Not a perfect barometer, but that's my line of thinking about being a household name.  And I need to emphasize that, in context of Katie Holmes, we're talking 2004-2005. That's why I didn't draw parallels between Holmes, and say, a Kardashian. The media landscape is a lot different now compared to then.     

[ratgirlagogo]

I liked her a lot in both Pieces of April and Go (plus one on the Olyphant) but I was also a late follower of Dawson's Wrap on TWOP, meaning I had a campy awareness of her without having actually seen minute one of the show that made her famous.  Perhaps others here could say the same.

Edited June 24, 2015 by ratgirlagogo