Rent Live! (Fox) - General Discussion

[Cherrio]

19 hours ago, callie lee 29 said:

I have seen it live three times (one on Broadway) and truthfully the best version was a tour that came to my University in the 90's. Second was a revival tour in the 2000's ( my friends was asst tour manager and I got to see it a few times and helped with merch). See it live if you can, just to see it live, but nothing can beat that movie with original cast.

I agree about the touring company, although there were several. The best was the Angel Tour, which I bet you saw. Roger was played by Christan Anderson and his voice is out of this world. I was lucky enough to see this company many times, one visit to Broadway and other places.  Total around a dozen times. 

 Last year I saw it and I found out after the fact it wasn't an Equity production. Made up of cruise ship performers and Disney folks.  It was terrible.

Last night there were a few good moments. Collins had a good voice, Mimi did pretty good with her hard to sing score. Angel was pretty bad. I think Joanne and Angel tied for flat notes.

[satrunrose]

6 hours ago, Florinaldo said:

Wheelchairs are indeed sometimes used in live theater when a lead gets injured; the blocking needs to be adjusted, although in the case of this particular play it probably would have been near impossible to do it throughout in the short time they had. But it was quite lazy to just plop him on a table and leave him there until the final fade-out.

Very amateur (i.e. high school) anecdote, but I was involved with a production of Into the Woods where the Prince turned up with a broken foot. We found a wheelchair somewhere, covered it with black fabric to snazzy it up a bit and the show went on swimmingly. It is a smaller part and a less dance-y show, but if we could do it in 2 hours, I'm not sure why they couldn't. 

5 hours ago, Duckie30ca said:

You know what...you’re absolutely correct.  I apologize if I appeared flippant. 

Me too! I should specify that I think the 'I should tell you's in the middle of La Vie Boheme work just fine, as you say because of the awfulness of revealing HIV status at any time, and most definitely in the 80s. What I stand by not loving is the way it becomes the Roger and Mimi thing that keeps repeating until the finale. 

[kilda]

I have a feeling there were some pretty epic meetings about what had to be cut and what didn't.  I too am baffled that "think twice before you poo poo it" got changed.  I mean, what?  that's not even....it's something a grandma might say! 

I think a lot of it had to do with what could be cut without doing too much damage.  Cutting "poo poo it" didn't really hurt anything, and changing dildos to latex wasn't too bad.  It was still kind of risqué and slipped pretty seamlessly into the song.  They probably gave up lines like that up as bargaining chips, to get some latitude to keep things that really would have been hard to change.  I was pleasantly shocked that "sodomy, it's between God and me" made it through, and also "to faggots, lezzies, dykes, crossdressers too!"  But really, how could you cut either of those without totally messing up the song?

[Eolivet]

For my money, I absolutely lost it at "super weird" for "f***ing weird" in Tango Maureen. Freaking (or effing) was too much to ask? Agree with everyone who said they should've just bleeped the curses/mature references.

To me, the most bizarre change was in the Life Support song: "Because reason says I should've died six months ago" (instead of three years ago). I have no earthly clue why that was changed. There also seemed to be a couple changes because the references were dated or obscure (Benny was no longer a lapdog to "a wealthy Daughter of the Revolution," for example). And a heck of a lot of changes just so Mark (or others) could play exposition fairy (if one of the slides says it was the early 90s, do we really have to specify "December 24, 1991?")

But they can shoot those ridiculous "fake Bohemian government titles" in La Vie Boheme straight into the sun.

Edited January 28, 2019 by Eolivet

[ElectricBoogaloo]

2 minutes ago, Eolivet said:

To me, the most bizarre change was in the Life Support song: "Because reason says I should've died six months ago" (instead of three years ago). I have no earthly clue why that was changed.

That one was definitely weird too. I was like "But...WHY?! There wasn't even swearing!"

[Jillibean]

6 hours ago, kilda said:

yeah, I think it's hard for people who weren't around then to realize what that part of the AIDS epidemic was like.  I remember stories of people being turned away by hospitals and funeral homes because people were so terrified of catching the disease.  There are very few diseases with a 100% mortality rate, but in the early 1990s, AIDS was one.  Think how scared we get of diseases like cancer that *might* kill you.  At that time, this was a disease that if you had it, it DID kill you.  It wasn't until at least the mid90s, long after Mimi, Roger and Collins would have been dead, that people started thinking that *maybe* HIV could be managed like a chronic disease and people could live more than a couple of years with it. 

I was saying to my sister while watching this that I almost feel like this show needed an introduction of some kind, like the one they did for South Pacific in its broadway run a while back, to set the stage of the time and setting. I don’t know that the generation a production like this was staged for has the inherent awareness of what it meant to have AIDS in the late 80s/early 90s, and without that understanding I wouldn’t think show resonates in quite the same way.

Quote

While I thought Vanessa Hudgens outshone everyone with her energy (with "Over the Moon" and "Take Me or Leave Me" both standouts for me), I realized that the most anachronistic character in this is Mark. The ironic, detached narrator is sort of a 90s relic, and his energy may have been the most difficult to duplicate. I liked what Jordan Fisher did with the role, but it was a totally different Mark in terms of tone. And I think that's nobody's fault, only that it's impossible to replicate that feeling today.

I thought Vanessa was great. I was initially disappointed to see her cast in this because I remember her disastrous Mimi, but she really prepared for this role and turned in a very strong performance, I thought. I felt she elevated the energy in every scene she was in, and most of act one suffered for not having her in it. Kudos to her for giving it her all at dress, because I certainly don’t think everyone did, and it ended up having a huge impact. 

I realize this was an unforeseen circumstance, but the sound mixing was terrible, the audience screaming was totally out of hand, and multiple cast members turned in pretty subdued performances. Angel looked the part, but ouch, those high notes. (None of the notes were great, but the high notes were painfully and embarrassingly bad). Keala Settle sounded off key in dress, cleaner live. Brandon Victor Dixon was very good, as was the actor who played Benny. I thought Mimi was great. A very hard role, and I thought she did it justice. She might not be the strongest singer or actress, but I thought she was beautiful overall. Without You is one of my favorite songs, and one of my favorite numbers in last night’s show as well. 

I, like many others, adore Adam Pascal. I saw him live a couple of years ago, and as noted above, he absolutely can still sing One Song Glory like no one else. This actor was fine, I guess. I thought he over-relied on a growl in his singing instead of hitting the notes cleanly, and his performance lacked energy overall. It improved as dress went on, and his live performance was much better and makes me wonder what could have been. 

And now for my unpopular opinion: I didn’t much care for Jordan as Mark. I don’t know if it was the energy or what I found to be a sort of understated performance, but I was underwhelmed. I think Mark is a tricky character because if you’re not careful he can become the “and he is also there” member of the ensemble, and I didn’t think he did quite enough to distinguish himself here. Also, where was his scarf?

Overall it wasn’t as horrible as I feared, but it also...sort of wasn’t very good. 

[ClareWalks]

Trying to figure out why I didn't care for Brennin as Roger and I know now: he seemed more concerned with looking good than performing well. He had the one brooding look and it was super handsome but not very nuanced.

[GaT]

So, is this worth watching? I recorded it yesterday & planned to watch tonight, but I'm reading the comments & I'm not feeling the love. I don't want to spend 3 hours of my life on something that's crap.

[TattleTeeny]

Quote

I have a feeling there were some pretty epic meetings about what had to be cut and what didn't.  I too am baffled that "think twice before you poo poo it" got changed.  I mean, what?  that's not even....it's something a grandma might say! 

Reminds me of the Hallmark channel; when Frasier says "ass," it's bleeped but those Golden Girls say "slut" all over the place!

[callie lee 29]

9 hours ago, jcin617 said:

That's always been my one beef with Mark and his job offer at Buzzline;  getting a job like that does not have to mean you're selling out.  You use the money from that job to finance whatever artistic projects you want to do,   Or more pragmatically, when you have two close friends with likely terminal diseases who may need your help.  

I think that's an issue with all of them (and maybe just being that age in general), there's no grey, it's all or nothing, black and white. I think it's one of the reason's I appreciated Benny, for everything the others are going through, and even though Benny can be a douche, he also seems like the only actual grown up . Same thing for the homeless woman - them standing out there protesting, pissing everyone off is just creating a worse environment for them to live in.  

18 hours ago, Eolivet said:

I realized that the most anachronistic character in this is Mark. The ironic, detached narrator is sort of a 90s relic, and his energy may have been the most difficult to duplicate.

Yeah, I can see this. I always thought the most telling line for Mark was where he says to Roger that he'll be the only one left (in the scene where they are fighting). The first time I heard that, it was like damn.  His two closest friends, Benny being gone, (and at that age, probably the two people who matter the most to him ) are both HIV positive, which in the early 90's was essentially dying of AIDS, or at least that's how it felt.  His ex-girlfriend is now in a relationship with a woman, and now enters two new people, bot who  are HIV positive and one with an addiction. Yeah. I can get how he felt like give it another few years and he'll be alone. 

[marketdoctor]

Quote

So, is this worth watching?

My advice would be to watch it up to "Light my Candle", and if you don't like it by that point, you won't hate missing the rest of it.   Or fast-forward to the singers you like, since the plot was uneven.

For me whenever they announced the date, I was trying to remember what I was doing that day.  (Mostly trying to find a better job.)

The curtain callback was really cool. 

Also, the lack of dancing didn't bother me--but what did was the sound mixing, after they promoted heavily how many cameras and cast they had.  If you're going to promote the production values, have production values. 

I thought they handled the damaged foot pretty well--and that it heals quickly.  And I liked Vanetina (but I hated the dog killing.)

[mightysparrow]

I didn't get through the first act.  These made-for-tv musicals are getting worse and worse.  Stunt-casting is all well and good but being a good musical performer isn't just hitting the occasional glory note, not that most of this cast was even capable of doing that.  Roger, Mimi, Maureen and all the others are CHARACTERS in a play.  In order to play these CHARACTERS, the performer has to not only be able to sing but to ACT as well.  Broadway is littered with tv actors and reality TV stars who might put bums in seats but stink up the theatre.  I could have given the producers the name of a drag performer who could have done a better Angel in their sleep.  It's not a matter of hair and makeup.  Watching these amateurs high-fiving the idiots in the mosh-pit down front was horrifying.  They need to get out of the way and let the professionals get back to doing their thing.

'Rent' is definitely a period piece.  So is 'Company', 'Les Miserables' and 'Damn Yankees'.  It's a period that a lot of people seem to have forgotten, when friends and loved ones were dying in the streets.  Every time I hear 'Will I?', my heart breaks.  I had dying friends say those words to me.  Personal dignity was one of the casualties of the plague years.  People act like that's all in the past because affluent White men are living with HIV/AIDS now, but women of colour and LBGTQ people of colour are STILL dying.  Most of the friends that I had planned to spend my middle aged/senior years being crazy and FABULOUS died when we were so young.  It's so lonely without them.

Bringing the original Broadway cast was just adding insult to injury.  And I couldn't help wondering what Johnathon thought (wherever he is) of his musical being televised by FOX of all the networks on earth.  That was one of the reasons why I couldn't watch.  Seeing that logo, a symbol of intolerance and bigotry (in my opinion) super-imposed over the show was too much for me to take.

And Angel didn't kill Evita.  Evita killed herself by jumping out of the window.  As someone who lives next door to several dogs who bark non-stop for HOURS on end, I would welcome Angel and her drums to show up in my neighbourhood.

[Ruby Gillis]

1 hour ago, callie lee 29 said:

10 hours ago, jcin617 said:

That's always been my one beef with Mark and his job offer at Buzzline;  getting a job like that does not have to mean you're selling out.  You use the money from that job to finance whatever artistic projects you want to do,   Or more pragmatically, when you have two close friends with likely terminal diseases who may need your help.  

 

I think that's an issue with all of them (and maybe just being that age in general), there's no grey, it's all or nothing, black and white. I think it's one of the reason's I appreciated Benny, for everything the others are going through, and even though Benny can be a douche, he also seems like the only actual grown up . Same thing for the homeless woman - them standing out there protesting, pissing everyone off is just creating a worse environment for them to live in.  

I think someone on these boards turned me onto Lindsay Ellis's video essays a long time ago.  She has a good one about the characters in Rent being jerks.  (It also gives a lot of context for the AIDS crisis.)

 

[SmithW6079]

1 hour ago, Ruby Gillis said:

I think someone on these boards turned me onto Lindsay Ellis's video essays a long time ago.  She has a good one about the characters in Rent being jerks.  (It also gives a lot of context for the AIDS crisis.)

 

 

Thanks for the link. Just spent 45 minutes watching the video. Totally agree with her analysis.

I completely forgot "Rent" was on last night. Judging from the comments here, I didn't miss anything.

I never saw "Rent" on Broadway, although I always wanted to (but I think that was more because of Jonathan Larson's sudden death). I did see it as a regional production. I liked it well enough. By the time I saw the movie, I despised the characters, except Benny, for pretty much the reasons Lindsay Ellis says.

I especially hate Angel, the dog killer. I have no sympathy for the character. 

Edited January 29, 2019 by SmithW6079

[MVFrostsMyPie]

5 hours ago, Eolivet said:

To me, the most bizarre change was in the Life Support song: "Because reason says I should've died six months ago" (instead of three years ago). I have no earthly clue why that was changed.

Yeah that really threw me off when I was singing along. What the? Felt so not right. 

2 hours ago, marketdoctor said:

Also, the lack of dancing didn't bother me--but what did was the sound mixing, after they promoted heavily how many cameras and cast they had.  If you're going to promote the production values, have production values. 

And the lighting... at some points it felt as dark as The Walking Dead, which is not a compliment.

[MVFrostsMyPie]

4 hours ago, ClareWalks said:

Trying to figure out why I didn't care for Brennin as Roger and I know now: he seemed more concerned with looking good than performing well. He had the one brooding look and it was super handsome but not very nuanced.

He has really tiny eyes (random observation).

[legaleagle53]

I watched this online last night (it was worth staying up late for), and I enjoyed it. I agree with everyone that unless you lived through that time and knew the terror that HIV/AIDS struck into the hearts of people, especially in the LGBT community (as I did), it's hard to understand the somewhat self-absorbed "Fuck it!" mentality of these people.  As "Will I?" and "Seasons of Love" point out, it's impossible to plan for the future when you know that you don't have one, so that's why these people have convinced themselves that living for the raw hedonism of the moment is their only option and they deliberately take an "eat, drink, and be merry, for tomorrow we die" approach to life because that's their reality.  Think about it. How would YOU live your life if you knew that you were living on borrowed time that you knew was going to run out sooner or later, and not in the most pleasant way?

Edited January 29, 2019 by legaleagle53

[Was-MArsenault]

https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/rent-live-fox-ratings-1203120397/

Yikes. Now this is not good at all.

[mightysparrow]

1 hour ago, legaleagle53 said:

I watched this online last night (it was worth staying up late for), and I enjoyed it. I agree with everyone that unless you lived through that time and knew the terror that HIV/AIDS struck into the hearts of people, especially in the LGBT community (as I did), it's hard to understand the somewhat self-absorbed "Fuck it!" mentality of these people.  As "Will I?" and "Seasons of Love" point out, it's impossible to plan for the future when you know that you don't have one, so that's why these people have convinced themselves that living for the raw hedonism of the moment is their only option and they deliberately take an "eat, drink, and be merry, for tomorrow we die" approach to life because that's their reality.  Think about it. How would YOU live your life if you knew that you were living on borrowed time that you knew was going to run out sooner or later, and not in the most pleasant way?

Very well said.

Ms. Ellis extremely long analysis shows that she knows very little about the 'bohemian' life.  Most of the 'bohemians' I've known have been rich (or relatively well off) kids who were 'slumming'.  It's always been like that.  In 'Rent' most of the people are choosing the life they lead.  Only Angel and Mimi don't have escape routes.  They both also happen to be people of colour. 

And to slam the characters in 'Rent' because they're not 'nice people' is kind of funny since most characters in most plays, films, novels etc since the beginning of time, aren't NICE people.  Who wants to sit in a theatre for 2 hours watching someone be nice?  You have characters trying to be nice and failing.  Or you have characters who are good people at heart, forced to do terrible things.  Or, you have the real fun characters who are bad people who LOVE being bad.  Mark is the 'nicest' character in 'Rent' and he's the most passive.  He does nothing to drive the narrative, he just serves as the surrogate for the audience, watching.

[Duckie30ca]

Ok...there was a moment in the live portion when Joanne and Maureen are carrying Mimi up the stairs and Roger says, “Noooo!” and the camera pulls in on him and I cannot watch it without cringing and laughing at the same time. It was like some kind of SNL sketch. I feel bad for laughing because clearly Roger was table-bound and all, but still...

[Neurochick]

14 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

'Rent' is definitely a period piece.  So is 'Company', 'Les Miserables' and 'Damn Yankees'.  It's a period that a lot of people seem to have forgotten, when friends and loved ones were dying in the streets.  Every time I hear 'Will I?', my heart breaks.  I had dying friends say those words to me.  Personal dignity was one of the casualties of the plague years.  People act like that's all in the past because affluent White men are living with HIV/AIDS now, but women of colour and LBGTQ people of colour are STILL dying.  Most of the friends that I had planned to spend my middle aged/senior years being crazy and FABULOUS died when we were so young.  It's so lonely without them.

Bringing the original Broadway cast was just adding insult to injury.  And I couldn't help wondering what Johnathon thought (wherever he is) of his musical being televised by FOX of all the networks on earth.  That was one of the reasons why I couldn't watch.  Seeing that logo, a symbol of intolerance and bigotry (in my opinion) super-imposed over the show was too much for me to take.

Thank you for this.  I did not watch simply because...well, I saw it on Broadway two times.  The second time was right after 9/11, when people were afraid to come to NYC and Giuliani was asking people to support Broadway, a few shows closed during that time.  So my friend and I went to see Rent....again and we LOVED it.  

Rent is a period piece.  AIDS was fucking scary.  I worked in a university in the early 80's and I remember when a high ranking administrator died; people wouldn't even say what he died of, it wasn't until years later that we were told it was AIDS.  I also remember a man who died of AIDS in probably 1990, when he died they took his chair and burned it, true story.  When Magic Johnson gave that press conference and said he had HIV, that really changed a lot of people's minds about things, it also caused a LOT of people to go out and get tested.  

[GaT]

3 hours ago, MikaelaArsenault said:

https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/rent-live-fox-ratings-1203120397/

Yikes. Now this is not good at all.

I think a lot of people (like myself) didn't watch when they heard it wasn't going to be live. I recorded it, but ended up only watching the very end when the original cast showed up.

[Neurochick]

Fun fact:  When I saw Rent, I think in 2000, Mimi was played by Lorraine Velez, who is the twin sister of Lauren Velez (Dexter, Oz, How to Get Away With Murder).

[Lovecat]

5 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Rent is a period piece.  AIDS was fucking scary.  I worked in a university in the early 80's and I remember when a high ranking administrator died; people wouldn't even say what he died of, it wasn't until years later that we were told it was AIDS.  I also remember a man who died of AIDS in probably 1990, when he died they took his chair and burned it, true story.  When Magic Johnson gave that press conference and said he had HIV, that really changed a lot of people's minds about things, it also caused a LOT of people to go out and get tested.  

I worked in a pharmacy in the late 80's/early 90's, and one day, after completing a register transaction, the pharmacist came rushing over and was very insistent that I wash my hands, because the gentleman at my register had just picked up his HIV medication.  The PHARMACIST.  A HEALTH CARE PROFESSIONAL.  Now I was just a lowly undergraduate biology major at that time, but I did respectfully lay down some truths to the guy.  30 years later and I'm still appalled by that incident.

Then again, we did learn some interesting shit about that pharmacist when he was out on vacation and a customer showed up asking for "Mr. [Name Redacted]" so he could get some Percocet (Did he have a prescription?  No, no he did not.).  When we told him no, he asked for Percodan.  "Same thing as Percocet??" he asked hopefully.  Still no.  Seems Mr. [Redacted] was up to something fishy...

Anyway, to bring this back on topic, I had some mixed reactions to RENT (sort-of) Live.  Angel and Mimi were definitely the weakest links.  I enjoyed Mark and Roger, though I thought the latter was channeling Adam Pascal something fierce.  The highlight for me was definitely the I'll Cover You reprise, because Collins was finally unencumbered vocally by poor, dead Angel, and brought the damn house down.  I cried some ugly tears.  I was *horrified* at the staging for Seasons of Love ("Blasphemy!" I raged to a friend), but let it go a bit when the OBC came out and performed in the classic line of overhead spots.  The directors were probably "saving" that staging for that moment, but not knowing that at the top of Act II, it really creamed my corn that they would mess with such an iconic image from the show.  I guess Vanessa whatserface was OK as Maureen, but I very rarely enjoy Over the Moon (it's just something to endure until we get to La Vie Boheme), so I declined the invitation to moo ;)  And speaking of LVB, I was disappointed they cut the part where the waiter takes their order:  And one pasta with meatless balls!  Ew.  It tastes the same...if you close your eyes!  And thirteen orders of fries!  Is that it here?  WINE AND BEER!  

Someone upthread was talking about how annoying the "I should tell you" motif is (and I took that in the musical sense, not the content)...for my money the part of the score that grates on my ears the most is the clumsy modulation from the end of I Should Tell You into La Vie Boheme B:  Here goes...here go-oes...here goeeeeeees...here goooooo-ooooooes...  Jesus, just GET THERE already!!    I thought that RENT (sort-of) Live did a really great job with Will I? but thought the audio could have been better on Christmas Bells.  There's *so* much going on in that number; I know the libretto pretty damn well, and even I couldn't make heads or tails out of what was going on at a couple of points.  I can't imagine what someone who had never heard it before thought.

Overall, I'm glad I watched, but unlike JCS, I'm not going to watch the whole thing again.  I'll probably skip through and re-watch a couple of numbers, especially the ending, and then delete it from my DVR.

[buffy11bnl]

On 1/28/2019 at 1:00 AM, Eolivet said:

 

While I thought Vanessa Hudgens outshone everyone with her energy (with "Over the Moon" and "Take Me or Leave Me" both standouts for me), I realized that the most anachronistic character in this is Mark. The ironic, detached narrator is sort of a 90s relic, and his energy may have been the most difficult to duplicate. I liked what Jordan Fisher did with the role, but it was a totally different Mark in terms of tone. And I think that's nobody's fault, only that it's impossible to replicate that feeling today.

But for a show that is so dependent on the energy of its cast to elevate its material, like I believe Rent is, that low-energy dress rehearsal really did them no favors.

I thought Vanessa did a great job with the vocals and she’s as cute as a button and I didn’t really get a “Maureen vibe” from her acting - Idk if it’s because she was so clearly excited to play the role or what but in Over the Moon especially it seemed like she was “in on the joke”(the “joke” being that over the moon is terrrrrible)

 

My boyfriend (who is not the fan that I am) loved Jordan’s performance because of how cheery it was/ what high self esteem he seemed to have  - I was trying to explain that those things are the exact *opposite* of Marc’s character but he wasn’t hearing it lol.

[ClareWalks]

59 minutes ago, Lovecat said:

Someone upthread was talking about how annoying the "I should tell you" motif is (and I took that in the musical sense, not the content)...for my money the part of the score that grates on my ears the most is the clumsy modulation from the end of I Should Tell You into La Vie Boheme B:  Here goes...here go-oes...here goeeeeeees...here goooooo-ooooooes...  Jesus, just GET THERE already!!

I cannot even express how much I hate that part. The whole scene comes to a screeching halt.

[Florinaldo]

23 hours ago, callie lee 29 said:

I think it's one of the reason's I appreciated Benny, for everything the others are going through, and even though Benny can be a douche, he also seems like the only actual grown up .

Benny is the one character whose positions and actions I am always most sympathetic to (even when played by Taye Diggs), something probably not intended by the author. Poor Benny has to deal with that bunch of entitled spoiled smoochers, who feel that other people should subsidize their "bohemian" endeavours, be it sloppy street films or crappy performance art, which means they are justified for example in depriving landlords from rent money they are ligitimately owed, not paying for what they consume and stealing from ATMs.

Is Rent a dated "period" piece as some have said? I suppose every work set in a specific era close to when it is written and dealing with real-life issues or events can be seen as such; from that perspective the original, La Bohème, is also dated, as are Euripides' The Trojan Women or Death of a Salesman and Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf?. But new productions of these can manage to make them relevant to later audiences, including in our century. It could be the same with Rent, assuming of course that there is enough substance there that can be mined to do so; productions like this live one show little evidence that there is.

 

22 hours ago, Ruby Gillis said:

I think someone on these boards turned me onto Lindsay Ellis's video essays a long time ago.  She has a good one about the characters in Rent being jerks. 

That was an interesting watch, thanks for posting it. She makes many clever points, not all I would agree with, including about the early years of the AIDS epidemic and how society was dealing with it.

Edited January 30, 2019 by Florinaldo

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I agree that Benny is not the evil guy that Mark, Roger, and Maureen make him out to be. He's still not a great guy. He cheated on this wife. He told Mark and Roger he could live in this building for free, demanded a year's worth of rent on absolutely NO notice, and then threatened to evict them unless Mark convinced Maureen to cancel her protest/performance.

But it's clear that Mark, Roger, and Maureen had already turned on him before the events of Christmas Eve. Benny tells Allison that since their wedding, they've been pissed at him but even knowing that, he says, "They'll see I can help them all out in the long run." His plan to create a studio "that lets us do our work AND GET PAID" and have condos on the upper floors isn't the equivalent of, say, kicking puppies or eating babies. If he was a total asshole, he would have just thrown them out and done what he wanted. Instead, he very logically pointed out that it would be nice for them to have a place where they can produce films and write songs, and he offered to put their deal (living in the building rent free) in writing if they convinced Maureen to cancel ONE of her many performances.

I don't want to sound like a paranoid parent, but at least Benny has a plan for the future, especially compared to Mark and Roger who act like there's something noble in being so broke they can't even pay for tea at a cafe. What is their long term plan? Do they still want to be squatting in a building where the power blows 10-20 years from now? At least Collins and Mimi have jobs to pay for some of their expenses. Mark and Roger seem to have no source of income and no intention of ever finding one. Oh, sorry, I guess their grand plan is writing one great song and cutting together a "film" made up entirely of your friends fucking around.

Don't get me wrong - I still love this show, but as an adult it's a lot easier to see them for who they really are (as opposed to just loving the music). I'm trying to imagine what my mom would say if I told her that I was voluntarily living in an abandoned building in Alphabet City where people piss on your stoop every night (oh, sorry, Fox, where people PUKE on your stoop every night) so that I could "shoot my film."

[legaleagle53]

14 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I agree that Benny is not the evil guy that Mark, Roger, and Maureen make him out to be. He's still not a great guy. He cheated on this wife. He told Mark and Roger he could live in this building for free, demanded a year's worth of rent on absolutely NO notice, and then threatened to evict them unless Mark convinced Maureen to cancel her protest/performance.

But it's clear that Mark, Roger, and Maureen had already turned on him before the events of Christmas Eve. Benny tells Allison that since their wedding, they've been pissed at him but even knowing that, he says, "They'll see I can help them all out in the long run." His plan to create a studio "that lets us do our work AND GET PAID" and have condos on the upper floors isn't the equivalent of, say, kicking puppies or eating babies. If he was a total asshole, he would have just thrown them out and done what he wanted. Instead, he very logically pointed out that it would be nice for them to have a place where they can produce films and write songs, and he offered to put their deal (living in the building rent free) in writing if they convinced Maureen to cancel ONE of her many performances.

I think of Benny to some extent as the personification of the idea that for Mark, Roger, Mimi, and Angel, they've been living on borrowed time since Roger, Mimi, and Angel were first diagnosed, and their borrowed time is about to come to an end.  Remember that at this particular point in history, AIDS was 100% fatal, and unlike Benny, it won't later change its mind and let them continue to live on borrowed time indefinitely.

15 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I don't want to sound like a paranoid parent, but at least Benny has a plan for the future, especially compared to Mark and Roger who act like there's something noble in being so broke they can't even pay for tea at a cafe. What is their long term plan? Do they still want to be squatting in a building where the power blows 10-20 years from now? At least Collins and Mimi have jobs to pay for some of their expenses. Mark and Roger seem to have no source of income and no intention of ever finding one. Oh, sorry, I guess their grand plan is writing one great song and cutting together a "film" made up entirely of your friends fucking around.

Roger and Mimi won't be alive 10-20 years from now, so it won't matter to them if the power in the building frequently blows then.  As I noted earlier, it's impossible to make long-term plans for the future when you know that you don't HAVE a future.  Roger fully expects to be dead within the next year or so.  That's why he's obsessed with writing "one great song" as his way of making his mark on the world before he dies. And Mark knows that he'll be the only one left alive after everyone else (including Collins) has finally succumbed to AIDS. So for him, he might as well concentrate on enjoying the time he has with the friends he loves now, because he won't have them for too much longer. That's why he quit his job almost as soon as he'd accepted it -- he doesn't want anything to take away from his remaining time with his friends, especially Roger. And by the way, before she fell in love with Roger, Mimi had been sleeping with Benny behind his wife's back.  So it's highly likely that HE'S been infected, too, which means that even HE probably won't be around 10-20 years from now.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

7 minutes ago, legaleagle53 said:

I think of Benny to some extent as the personification of the idea that for Mark, Roger, Mimi, and Angel, they've been living on borrowed time since Roger, Mimi, and Angel were first diagnosed, and their borrowed time is about to come to an end. Remember that at this particular point in history, AIDS was 100% fatal, and unlike Benny, it won't later change its mind and let them continue to live on borrowed time indefinitely.

Roger and Mimi won't be alive 10-20 years from now, so it won't matter to them if the power in the building frequently blows then. As I noted earlier, it's impossible to make long-term plans for the future when you know that you don't HAVE a future. Roger fully expects to be dead within the next year or so. That's why he's obsessed with writing "one great song" as his way of making his mark on the world before he dies. And Mark knows that he'll be the only one left alive after everyone else (including Collins) has finally succumbed to AIDS. So for him, he might as well concentrate on enjoying the time he has with the friends he loves now, because he won't have them for too much longer. That's why he quit his job almost as soon as he'd accepted it -- he doesn't want anything to take away from his remaining time with his friends, especially Roger. And by the way, before she fell in love with Roger, Mimi had been sleeping with Benny behind his wife's back. So it's highly likely that HE'S been infected, too, which means that even HE probably won't be around 10-20 years from now.

Yes, I understand the whole "why bother if I'm on borrowed time" attitude that many people with terminal illnesses face, but it doesn't seem that Mark and Roger suddenly decided that this was the kind of life they wanted. They have that "I'm an artiste" attitude that glamorizes poverty as a noble thing. I've known people like that (and they usually come from affluent or, at the very least middle class, families who do not understand why their children would choose to live in squalor when they don't have to) and they seem to think that choosing to be poor is something romantic to aspire to, that they can only make REAL art if they are like Mark and Roger (mocking people who have day jobs, hating their parents/rejecting their comfortable suburban lives, burning their stuff to stay warm). Mark didn't quit his Buzzline job because he wanted to spend what little time Roger and the others have left on earth (Angel had already died, Mimi was in rehab, and Roger had just left for Santa Fe). He quit because he saw it as selling out which meant he wouldn't be an artiste anymore. He told Alexei that he needed to finish his own film aka complete his artistic vision. Working for Buzzline didn't fit with his self-image as a starving artist with integrity. It took him months (almost a full year!) to finally accept that job offer because he didn't want to be a sell out.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I should clarify that I don't think Mark or Roger are terrible people either. They are young adults figuring out who they are in the midst of the AIDS crisis. I know I made some questionable choices in my late teens/early 20s too that I wouldn't want people dissecting. When you add facing your own mortality at such a young age (even before you factor in the whole artist thing), it definitely affects the way they see things.

I'm not suggesting that Roger should have gotten a desk job or anything. It's just interesting as an adult to see how much Mark and Roger demonize Benny for daring to leave the starving artist flat lifestyle. The show focuses on Benny's actions from Christmas Eve and later, but based on what the various characters say during the show, it's obvious that they no longer saw Benny as one of them because he had the nerve to marry someone who wasn't a poor artist and then move out of the neighborhood - and that was all before the threat of eviction.

[bosawks]

I always gave Roger a bit of a break.  He's still in that white knuckle sobriety face and doesn't seem to have fully dealt with discovering his dead girlfriend in the bathroom who left a note that might make her death a result of possibly killing him due to AIDS or him killing her due to AIDS.

Dude's got some stuff he's got to work through....

[buffy11bnl]

I finally realized “One Song Glory” is SO much better than “Your Eyes” because Glory is an inner monologue - anyone whose ever tried to write something creative knows there is sometimes a massive disconnect between what’s in your brain and what finally makes it to the page.

[Richard]

The queens of RuPaul's Drag Race All Stars react to Valentina's performance as "Angel" in RENT LIVE!

 

 

[SnoGirl]

Think Fox will ever release the real live version we didn’t see? I know there are clips on Hulu of parts of songs (they’re calling it Concert Rent) but I want to see it all. And frankly, I think they owe it to everyone whose worked on it to release it too.

[Lois Sandborne]

On 1/29/2019 at 4:02 PM, Lovecat said:

I thought that RENT (sort-of) Live did a really great job with Will I? but thought the audio could have been better on Christmas Bells.  There's *so* much going on in that number; I know the libretto pretty damn well, and even I couldn't make heads or tails out of what was going on at a couple of points.  I can't imagine what someone who had never heard it before thought.

Agreed. The audio and the direction of that left a lot to be desired. I guess there's only so much you can do with the direction, because yeah, Christmas Bells is crazy involved, but I don't think the quick jumps and pans were the solution.  And enough has been said about how awful the sound mixing was, but it really hurt my heart with this one, because the repeated motifs and the counterpoint and the good old Broadway-style tie-it-all-togetherness make it one of my favorite numbers, and I was already smarting from how they truncated it.

I liked more about this production though than I disliked.  My unfamiliarity with most of the cast notwithstanding, my little RENT-loving heart couldn't help but cherish secret hopes for greatness, so it wasn't all that I wanted it to be, especially with this dress rehearsal foolishness. But it was good; I don't regret that they did it or that I watched it, and now I know Jordan Fisher is bomb, and Mario can kinda act!  And I rilly hope somehow we get to see Rent on Wheels someday, even if somebody just throws it up on Putlocker.

[Juneau Gal]

I have to say, I watched this again via the FOX app and I don’t know if they had fine tuned the tape or what, but it was better on second viewing. Valentina still could not sing, but her chemistry with BVD was really good, hell BVD is so awesome his chemistry while relating to any of the other characters was great. Angel and Collins were the only ones that I believed as a couple and Cover You reprise had me ugly crying big fat tears. 

Since I knew the iconic line of singers starting Act 2 was not going to happen, the way the song was presented ended up being pretty affective, for me; framing it in the support group. 

I guess readjusting my expectations and just relaxing allowed me to see the good in the production. 

[Hanahope]

So I finally finished watching this via On Demand.  Having never seen a stage version of Rent, only the film done by most of the original cast, I thought it was decent enough.  I was only familiar with Vanessa Hudgens and I recognized the actor who played Tom from JCS, both of whom I thought were really good.  I agree that Angel and Mimi were definitely weak links, the rest of the cast was decent enough.  I thought in general the acting was well done.

Since I've never seen a stage version, I did wonder about the staging of Seasons of Love, because I assumed it was always the iconic line.  With the way Fox did it, I wondered if it was in order to give Kealy Settle the main female voice (again, partly because the cast as a whole only ok at singing).  I thought it was an interesting way to stage the song, different, but effective with the message they were trying to convey.

Agree with others that the live finale was nice to see the original cast, but definitely Adam Pascal and the new Roger got screwed with being stuck back on the table while everyone else moved significantly further away from them.  That could have been handled a lot better.

[TattleTeeny]

Finally watched it and found it a bit lackluster. Still, I cried, damn it!

ETA: I have been trying to find original Nederlander footage of One Song Glory all the livelong day! I keep finding just tiny clips.

Edited February 2, 2019 by TattleTeeny

[whiporee]

Anyone who watched this probably knows, but there is a filmed version of the last first-run performance out there. Renee-Elise Goldsberry does a great Mimi, and they have the same kind of first-cast reunion. It's available all over the place -- I bought my DVD at an Office Depot a decade ago. 

I didn't mind any of the changes, not really. I liked the staging of "Seasons of Love" because I'm tired of seeing everyone lined up doing it, and I thought that integrating it into the storyline was a good touch. I thought Angle had a great presence to her -- kind, warm and accepting, but the part's too big to give to someone who can't sing well. They did a better job than a lot of productions of showing the rank amateurism of Maureen's performance, and this was far and away the best -- or at least the most dynamic -- Mark I've seen, and I've seen the show a half-dozen times (I live in a smallish, rural-ish Colorado town, and one of our local high school casts is doing it this spring. We'll see how well "I'll Cover You" goes). I don't remember him being as much a narrator in other performances as he was here. 

I have a nit to pick, though. By tying it directly to 1991, a lot of little references were out of date. No way Maureen -- or Joanne for that matter -- has a cell phone in 1991. Those things were at least a buck a minute back then. Joanne makes a Gingrich reference ("Newt's lesbian sister") and Gringrich won't be  a known name until the 1994 elections. Something like Cyber Arts would probably be 94 or 95 as a legit investment. If they had set it in 96 or 97, it still has the feel -- and What You Own fits better -- a lot of these things would make more sense. 

I thought it was otherwise good -- I actually prefer the "perfect/reject" line to the "do/poo-poo" one. I didn't mind super weird, and I didn't mind latex in place of dildos (I actually think it fits better). The lack of dance ability was really apparent in "Tango Maureen," the whole point of which is fantasy, so the dancing needs to be nearly professional. And I think not having an understudy was criminal -- the guy wasn't a big enough star to say the show doesn't work without him. You could do that with Legend in Superstar, but all I knew about this guy was that he'd been on X Factor. 

[rmontro]

I don't have much to say other than that I love Rent and I enjoyed the broadcast.  Every version I've seen of this musical has each brought something of its own to the table, and this was no exception.  For some reason, the Roger/Mimi romance really popped out for me in this one, they had great chemistry.  I do wonder why they didn't just use an understudy for Rodger though, although this guy seemed quite popular with the crowd.  Which reminds me, the audience was great, they really added to it.

[chitowngirl]

There was no understudy.

[SomeTameGazelle]

On 1/30/2019 at 9:24 PM, Lois Sandborne said:

now I know Jordan Fisher is bomb,

Oh! He was the kid I liked in Grease Live singing Those Magic Changes.

[Totale]

This sat on my DVR until last night when we finally had 3 hours to sit and watch it.  I hadn't kept up so didn't know it was the dress rehearsal until the first break.  I don't regret watching it at all - all the snipes above may be valid but I got into it over the course of the show.  I was mostly disappointed at the American Idoling of some of the songs and the audience's reaction to it.  The sound design was super-spotty and I was glad I had CC on.  But I for one really liked the overall stage design and camera work - I thought it was a refreshing take on the only other version I've seen (the OC film). 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Somehow this won two Emmy awards:

Outstanding Production Design For Variety Special

Outstanding Lighting Design/Lighting Direction for a Variety Special