Season 3 Discussion

[jhlipton]

One thing I've noticed:  Back about 20 years or so ago, when we first started having H1Bs from India, they would be given "American" nicknames like "Dave" or "Sam" because Submaranian was just too hard to remember or say.  Now, Indian names a re common-place, and a name like Sanjay or Preya isn't going to be a stumbling-block to success (the way a Shaniqua still is).

Junior's real name of Andre is more black than not, at least to me.

 

Just now, Michel said:

Junior's storyline was comedy gold, though I cringed when he got his dinner with Shelly, and then ruined everything by inviting Megan over.  Like . . . wow.  How socially dumb can you get, Junior?

Junior was pretty dumb all the way around.  He would know (a) how to solve a Rubic's Cube and (b) what the current record is.  Inviting both girls for Valentine's Day was just another way for Junior to wind up without a girlfriend so Dre can pick on him some more.

 

Just now, Empress1 said:

And girlfriend: don't play games. Tell him what you want. Don't be on some "I don't believe in labels" shit if what you want is commitment. Better to learn that lesson in your teens, trust me.

Preach!

Just now, ElectricBoogaloo said:

As for who else was in Bow's top five, I was indoctrinated to believe the top three would be Boyz II Men, ABC, BBD! 

I think she said "Boyz 2 Men, Bell Biv Devoe..." before Dre stopped her.

[attica]

On 2/11/2017 at 0:05 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

they'd never be able to fit ElectricBoogaloo on one of those bike license plates!

Aww, come on: don't be greedy. You got a whole movie with your name on it!

[Ikki]

Okay, there are other people who feel like DeVonte (or however they choose to spell it) is a perfectly fine name, right? I definitely get the argument that the kid may face difficulties in a racist society because of the name, but just the name itself seems like a reasonable name to me.

[OtterMommy]

4 hours ago, Ikki said:

Okay, there are other people who feel like DeVonte (or however they choose to spell it) is a perfectly fine name, right? I definitely get the argument that the kid may face difficulties in a racist society because of the name, but just the name itself seems like a reasonable name to me.

I'm with you.  I saw no problem with the name (which made this episode less than successful for me). It's not a horribly unusual name and, when he's older, he could choose to go by a nickname if he doesn't like it.  As far as nicknames go, DeVonte is gold (Dev, Von, Te, Don, Devon....)

[Fostersmom]

On February 9, 2017 at 5:23 PM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I have an uncommon name (not quite as unique as Rainbow) so I too can testify that it's not as great as all the Emmas and Jennifers think it is. 

I'm named after the singer Cher, her real first name is Cherilyn. Let me tell you how my day goes….

Thank you for calling XXX, this is Cherilyn, how may I help you?

What did you say your name was? Carolyn? 

No, Cherilyn. 

Carol Anne? 

Cherilyn. 

Charlene? 

Sure. 

This happens pretty much at least once a day, usually about 50% of my phone calls I just give up and tell them sure, whatever wrong name they are calling me is right because I just can't anymore with them. Meanwhile Home Depot thinks I spell it Cherryillynn, I'm not sure which of my installers or their cashiers spelled it that way, but it's like a Toddlers and Tiaras spelling gone horribly wrong and I cringe every time I get an invoice from them when I pay for product over the phone. One of these days I'm going to actually go into a Home Depot and fix that shit!

[paulvdb]

On 12-2-2017 at 4:28 AM, jhlipton said:

Junior's real name of Andre is more black than not, at least to me.

That must be an American thing. Here in The Netherlands I can't think of any black people named Andre. Off the top of my head the most famous ones here are Andre Rieu, Andre Hazes and Andre van Duin. They are all white.

[LydiaMoon1]

On 2/11/2017 at 10:28 PM, jhlipton said:

I think she said "Boyz 2 Men, Bell Biv Devoe..." before Dre stopped her.

*clutching my pearls in horror*  Just no!  Rainbow must be out of her raggedy mind.   Jodeci > ALLLLLLL-ladem.  For once, Dre is absolutely right!

Edited February 13, 2017 by LydiaMoon1

[jhlipton]

On 2/12/2017 at 0:59 PM, attica said:

Aww, come on: don't be greedy. You got a whole movie with your name on it!

Not to mention every sequel!

19 hours ago, Fostersmom said:

I'm named after the singer Cher, her real first name is Cherilyn. Let me tell you how my day goes….

One of my FaceBook friends is named Cherilyn.  She probably has the same problem.

[PradaKitty]

Um... Isn't this the same family with a cousin Junebug?

[birkenstock]

I think that DeVonte is a fine name but the name sticks out from the rest of the siblings. I wish the show did flashbacks to reveal why each kid received the name they did.  It fits Dre's personality to want a Jr., but why did Rainbow pick Zoe and Diane? How did Dre decide on Jack? If it was Rainbow pushing for it, did Dre immediately agree or did he have a different name planned?  

I also wish they would have delved deeper into why Dre thought that a black sounding name would lead to the kid being "blacker"? Little DeVonte may be the black-ish-est one of all if he is raised the same way as the older kids.   I know it was connecting to Dre's culture, but how will naming him DeVonte allow little D a greater connection to that culture or "blackness"?  

June Bug is traditionally a nickname like Peanut, Ray Ray, Buffy or Kitty.

Edited February 13, 2017 by birkenstock

[possibilities]

My grandfather changed the family name to pass during WW2 (we're Jewish), and I have a friend who gave her and her brother the WASPiest sounding middle names I've ever heard so that "if the pogroms come, you can easily drop your last name and use your middle name to survive". Meanwhile, my first name is only slightly rare and spelled in a less common but not extreme way-- and yet I spend a ridiculous amount of time fielding incredulity and confusion over how to spell it. So I think this is an interesting subject.

The way the show treated it, it made me think a lot about how these things go back and forth over time. Sometimes people want to just slip by and make things easier. Other times, they feel more free to push back against oppressive norms. I appreciate that the show tries to look at it from multiple angles. Even Dre has changed his feelings about the issue within his own adult lifetime.

Rainbow isn't really a very Black name, though. It's more of a hippy name. I wonder if she'd feel the same way about not fitting in if the name she had actually did make her fit in somewhere significant to her.

I still find it upsetting and not funny when they make jokes about the parents choosing favorites among the kids, especially when they show the kids hearing and being upset by it. I know it happens, but it's so aggressive on this show, and so incredibly hurtful the way they insult junior, or talk about Diane like she's totally unlovable. I kind of get the way this episode it was all about how they favor the baby, because it often seems like when there's a new baby, that's all anyone talks about-- so it could have been a send up of that kind of babycraziness. But the way they did it, it was almost too serious, so it didn't come across as "the other kids feel jealous" and was more like "the parents really are hurtful." Maybe it was just too subtle for me, but I didn't like it.

Edited February 13, 2017 by possibilities

[Dee]

I'm surprised this episode didn't include a cameo from Rainbow's mom.

If any character would have an important POV about the pros and cons of culturally specific names, it would certainly be D'Alicia.

[EarlGreyTea]

Dre was annoying as hell this episode. Not about the name thing, I thought he made great points. But his blatant disappointment in Junior is annoying. I handwave a lot in sitcoms, because much of it is just for a laugh, but he was overly cruel this episode. I'm pretty cheesed he got what he wanted with a boy. I was hoping at the last minute it would be revealed to be a girl.

I don't remember the last time Diane and Junior had a bonding moment. I really hope they keep putting those two together. It's a hilarious contrast.

[needschocolate]

19 hours ago, birkenstock said:

I think that DeVonte is a fine name but the name sticks out from the rest of the siblings.

That was my problem with DeVante, that it was too different from the rest of the kids.  I like it when the siblings' names go together (not rhyming or sounding alike, but being the same types of names, such as all having old-fashioned names).  Then I remembered that Junior's name is Andre and deVante and Andre are part of the same "family of names" to me

I wonder if naming the baby a "real Black name" means that he is the child who will most take after the white side of the family.  

[doublek61]

I had the opposite problem growing up - everywhere we went there was a SPACE for the personalized item with my name on it, but it was always empty.  Oh the hazards of being a Kathy growing up in the 60's.  And yes, my first doll was a Chatty Cathy, even though she spelled her name wrong!

[PradaKitty]

Yeah... four of the six cheerleaders in my high school were named Debbie....

[OnceSane]

Quote

Dre is forced to participate in jury duty after Junior responds to the summons that was thrown away. The case is supposed to be open and shut, but when Dre sees that the defendant is a young African American, he feels a civic responsibility to give him a fair trial. Meanwhile, Bow decides to let the kids swear in the house since they are more open with her that way, but she and Ruby soon regret the decision.

[GHScorpiosRule]

FLORENCE!!!!!*

That was the only thing I loved about this episode.

*The Jeffersons

[Dee]

This was a good episode.

But this particular exchange had me howling:

Quote

Ruby: "Mabel! What're you doing here?!"

Grandma Mabel: "I dunno."

Edited February 16, 2017 by Dee

[Seelouis]

7 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

FLORENCE!!!!!*

That was the only thing I loved about this episode.

*The Jeffersons

Marla Gibbs is having a good month. First on This is Us and now here.

[Michel]

Loved this episode.

Diane actually showed some vulnerability, thanks to Junior!

Great to see Marla Gibbs, though I was actually a bit surprised to see that she's still alive.

I get that Dre meant well, but I also get the problem his old crew had.  There's generosity that's actually genuine, and then, there's generosity that almost feels condescending.

Very pleasantly surprised that they seem to be toning Connor way back now.  But I face-palmed when he, Stevens, and Josh all didn't know who Kevin Garnett was.  Also, Stevens saying, "A black Celtic?" had me face-palm again and mutter, "Oh, my God."

Even though Zoey dished out a backhanded defense for Bow when Ruby was criticizing her parenting, the way she resolved everything was kind of sweet.

So another good episode.  I think this season has finally been getting better.:)

[spaceytraci1208]

The lady singing "Freak Me" at the funeral was the highlight for me 

[shura]

1 hour ago, Michel said:

I get that Dre meant well, but I also get the problem his old crew had.  There's generosity that's actually genuine, and then, there's generosity that almost feels condescending.

And then there's Dre literally demanding expressions of gratitude for his generosity. What an ugly move. I am not sure I would as forgiving as his friends were.

"I am proud of you. You are not asking whether a working woman can have it all, you are answering - No!"

[MyAimIsTrue]

2 hours ago, Michel said:

Also, Stevens saying, "A black Celtic?" had me face-palm again and mutter, "Oh, my God."

And me wondering if he'd never heard of arguably the most famous Celtic of all time, Bill Russell.  Or perhaps that ignorance was an implied part of the joke.

[Empress1]

Marla Gibbs! I'm always glad to see her. She's a treasure. "Why am I still here?"

Diane melting down over "poo-tato" cracked me up.

56 minutes ago, shura said:

"I am proud of you. You are not asking whether a working woman can have it all, you are answering - No!"

She's not wrong. A doctor and an ad exec are going to miss some soccer games. The difference is that women and men are socialized to see that differently.

Also, Bow shouldn't be doing her kids' homework. Jack should be glueing those Popsicle sticks himself.

[peeayebee]

4 hours ago, Michel said:

But I face-palmed when he, Stevens, and Josh all didn't know who Kevin Garnett was.  Also, Stevens saying, "A black Celtic?" had me face-palm again and mutter, "Oh, my God."

I thought the racism was funny, not offensive, in this ep. It didn't seem mean so much as ignorant.

Poo-tato was great.

Jack: Diane, DIANE! Grandma's PIE! Come look at Jesus.

Loved the gag of Dre's beer bottle sliding off the patio table.

I was wondering when Junior mentioned survivor's remorse if that was a shoutout to the Amazon show Survivor's Remorse. I haven't watched it, but I've heard of it.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

2 hours ago, Empress1 said:

Also, Bow shouldn't be doing her kids' homework. Jack should be gluing those Popsicle sticks himself.

Yes.  And Diane shouldn't wait until the night before she needed the potato costume.  That actually seemed out of character.  What was she planning to use for fabric if she had made it herself?

Also, they seem to have retconned Bow's lack of cooking ability and absence of knowledge concerning the toaster.  We have seen her make complete, healthy meals for the family many, many times after a full day of work.  Ruby rarely cooks for them, and the big holiday dinner she does do turned out to be catered!

[Empress1]

2 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Yes.  And Diane shouldn't wait until the night before she needed the potato costume.  That actually seemed out of character.  What was she planning to use for fabric if she had made it herself?

Also, they seem to have retconned Bow's lack of cooking ability and absence of knowledge concerning the toaster.  We have seen her make complete, healthy meals for the family many, many times after a full day of work.  Ruby rarely cooks for them, and the big holiday dinner she does do turned out to be catered!

Neither of my parents can sew well enough to make an article of clothing from scratch (although my grandmother could and would have made me a potato costume), but regardless, if I had told them the night before that I needed a potato costume, they would have told me that I should have been better prepared and to work it out. It would have been a trash bag for me too. (And let's be real, many of those parents in Diane's class ordered their kids' costumes - and there is nothing wrong with that!)

[Traveller519]

Damn, Ron Funchess! Where are you going? Where's my cuddly Teddy Bear? Glad to see him branching out though.

Pouring out the Soda at the Drive Through in the Opener was a fantastic little visual gag.

"After only 100 hours of training, I'll be able to walk into any YMCA in the country and help people" ---- Frightening!

[DearEvette]

1 hour ago, peeayebee said:

I was wondering when Junior mentioned survivor's remorse if that was a shoutout to the Amazon show Survivor's Remorse. I haven't watched it, but I've heard of it.

GREAT show.  I had no expectations about it, but had a free 30-day STARZ trial and binged all three seasons.  Totally recommend it.  

[tennisgurl]

Hey, its Ron Funchess! Cool seeing you here dude!

I thought this was pretty good, but I think they could have gone in a more interesting direction. I thought it was going to be a "Dre feels guilty he made it out of the ghetto" story, and that's kind of how it started, but then he went back to a standard "Dre is an asshole" plotline. At least this time he started off as well meaning. But by the end, however, he seemed to be just doing things for his old friends so he can be the Best Guy Ever and bask in their gratitude. Really, it comes off as condescending as hell. He did learn his lesson, but Dre usually learns a lesson by the end of the episode, and it never sticks!

Loved seeing Diane and Junior bonding a little more. That was really sweet, and while normally I cant stand Ruby being mean to Bow for no reason, I did actually like Bows story. She's such a perfectionist, I can imagine that "losing" to Ruby in traditional "mom" tasks would drive her nuts.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

1 hour ago, Traveller519 said:

Damn, Ron Funchess! Where are you going? Where's my cuddly Teddy Bear? Glad to see him branching out though.

 

54 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

Hey, its Ron Funchess! Cool seeing you here dude!

He's currently co-starring in Powerless Thursday nights on NBC.

Edited February 16, 2017 by ItCouldBeWorse

[Jodie Landon]

5 hours ago, spaceytraci1208 said:

The lady singing "Freak Me" at the funeral was the highlight for me 

I was dying! It reminded me of this Youtube video I saw years ago when this lady decided that Mary J. Blige's " Seven Days" was an appropriate funeral song.

It seems like they might be trying to humanize Diane a bit. This week she cried on Junior's shoulder and last week she discovered hugs.

[spaceytraci1208]

52 minutes ago, Jodie Landon said:

I was dying! It reminded me of this Youtube video I saw years ago when this lady decided that Mary J. Blige's " Seven Days" was an appropriate funeral song.

I remember that!!! 

[mansonlamps]

10 hours ago, Empress1 said:

Marla Gibbs! I'm always glad to see her. She's a treasure. "Why am I still here?"

Diane melting down over "poo-tato" cracked me up.

She's not wrong. A doctor and an ad exec are going to miss some soccer games. The difference is that women and men are socialized to see that differently.

Also, Bow shouldn't be doing her kids' homework. Jack should be glueing those Popsicle sticks himself.

I have to disagree on one point.  I work in a previously all male dominated company and field (aren't they all), but nowadays people at the VP Level, male or female, can miss extraordinarily important meetings without anyone blinking an eye if the say it's "kid duty."  I, as a child of the seventies, find this bizarre.

[Racj82]

13 hours ago, Michel said:

Loved this episode.

Diane actually showed some vulnerability, thanks to Junior!

Great to see Marla Gibbs, though I was actually a bit surprised to see that she's still alive.

I get that Dre meant well, but I also get the problem his old crew had.  There's generosity that's actually genuine, and then, there's generosity that almost feels condescending.

Very pleasantly surprised that they seem to be toning Connor way back now.  But I face-palmed when he, Stevens, and Josh all didn't know who Kevin Garnett was.  Also, Stevens saying, "A black Celtic?" had me face-palm again and mutter, "Oh, my God."

Even though Zoey dished out a backhanded defense for Bow when Ruby was criticizing her parenting, the way she resolved everything was kind of sweet.

So another good episode.  I think this season has finally been getting better.:)

Never saw a dip in quality that the show had to raise up to but it was another good episode for sure. It's hard for me to see Marla so up there in age though. I don't want to have to see her mourned through tv characters anytime soon. She's a grandma on the Carmichael show and here.

[CaptainCranky]

Minor point but the writers need to research their content more carefully. It's not cement, it's concrete. Cement is but one component of concrete. Cement, water, aggregate (small rock) and sand.

[attica]

On 2/16/2017 at 0:14 PM, ItCouldBeWorse said:

And Diane shouldn't wait until the night before she needed the potato costume.  That actually seemed out of character.  What was she planning to use for fabric if she had made it herself?

Ahahahaha! As if there's ever* been a schoolkid who thought about practical things ahead of time!  Even a kid destined to be a super-villain, who can plot out evil machinations like a chess grandmaster, just doesn't think about earthly things like 'do we have fabric for a costume?' 

11 hours ago, CaptainCranky said:

It's not cement, it's concrete.

I love this comment with the whole of my heart.

*yes, that's hyperbole. work with me here. 

[DianeChambers123]

I had our local news on this week and one of the top stories was a murder. They arrested 2 people and one the suspect's name was DeVonte Anderson! I had to rewind to make sure that I heard that correctly.  

[Jade Foxx]

On 2/13/2017 at 7:24 AM, LydiaMoon1 said:

*clutching my pearls in horror*  Just no!  Rainbow must be out of her raggedy mind.   Jodeci > ALLLLLLL-ladem.  For once, Dre is absolutely right!

The proper ranking begins New Edition, Boys II Men, etc etc!!!

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I was howling at the woman singing "Freak Me" at the funeral. Loved when Dre and his friends all sang it again later.

ITA that Diane getting stuck with a poo-tato costume is partly her fault for waiting until the night before to tell anyone that she needed it.

Once again, Dre is a selfish baby. He only wanted to help his friends after (1) years of not seeing most of them (2) one of them died and (3) because he expected them to thank him and be grateful. If you truly want to help someone, you do it to HELP THEM, not because you want recognition for it. And if you really want to help someone, you actually help them instead of just giving them whatever is laying around your house (like your wife's bike).

We have seen Bow make dinner before (and healthy stuff like quinoa, which Ruby and Pops complained about) so it seems ridiculous to retcon that she doesn't even know which appliance is the toaster. I wish instead of making her seem incompetent in household matters like cooking and making costumes, they had addressed it a different way, like different people have different talents.

And while I think that everyone should know how to cook basic things, even if we're going to pretend that Bow can't cook now, so what? That doesn't make her a terrible mother. As an adult, I am very thankful that my mom was good at so many things, but she wouldn't have been a bad mother if she hadn't made me amazing Halloween costumes or hand beaded by wedding veil. Sometimes I jokingly tell Mr. EB it's a good thing that we aren't having kids because I can't sew and I can't do French braids for shit (two of my mom's many skills).

[Tiger]

On 2/16/2017 at 8:57 AM, shura said:

And then there's Dre literally demanding expressions of gratitude for his generosity. What an ugly move. I am not sure I would as forgiving as his friends were.

"I am proud of you. You are not asking whether a working woman can have it all, you are answering - No!"

 

On 2/16/2017 at 0:14 PM, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Yes.  And Diane shouldn't wait until the night before she needed the potato costume.  That actually seemed out of character.  What was she planning to use for fabric if she had made it herself?

Also, they seem to have retconned Bow's lack of cooking ability and absence of knowledge concerning the toaster.  We have seen her make complete, healthy meals for the family many, many times after a full day of work.  Ruby rarely cooks for them, and the big holiday dinner she does do turned out to be catered!

I was extremely annoyed on Bow's behalf because Ruby is job-less, able-bodied, and living rent free.  She sure as hell can do something to contribute to that household.  

[Dee]

Earl is also living there job-less, able-bodied and rent free too. Why isn't he expected to contribute to the household?

Edited February 18, 2017 by Dee

[Irlandesa]

On 2/16/2017 at 11:57 PM, CaptainCranky said:

Minor point but the writers need to research their content more carefully. It's not cement, it's concrete. Cement is but one component of concrete. Cement, water, aggregate (small rock) and sand.

Love this comment.  But to be fair to the show, it's a mistake non-experts would make and Ron Funches was shown to definitely not be an expert. 

[ItCouldBeWorse]

3 hours ago, Dee said:

Earl is also living there job-less, able-bodied and rent free too. Why isn't he expected to contribute to the household?

Because he doesn't constantly criticize Bow or complain about her cooking? We've even seen him drive the younger kids to activities, I believe.

Maybe Ruby drove Black Nanny away. They sure dropped that plot with no explanation.

Edited February 18, 2017 by ItCouldBeWorse

[Tiger]

30 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Because he doesn't constantly criticize Bow or complain about her cooking? We've even seen him drive the younger kids to activities, I believe.

Maybe Ruby drove Black Nanny away. They sure dropped that plot with no explanation.

Exactly, the issue isnt that Ruby and Earl dont contribute (and both of them should), rather that Ruby and the kids act like Ruby has to contribute only because Bow is unable or bad at something

Let me put it this way: if I ever have kids they will have chores and be paying jobs as soon as legally permissible, and if I ever have able-bodied family living with me they will be expected to contribute to whether its cooking, cleaning, driving kids, yard work, etc.

I'm not saying an able-bodied inlaw/parent needs to be treated like "the help", but they do need to contribute.

[Dee]

54 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Because he doesn't constantly criticize Bow or complain about her cooking?

Yes he does. He criticizes & complains about Rainbow and Andre every bit as much as Ruby does.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

8 minutes ago, Dee said:

1 hour ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Because he doesn't constantly criticize Bow or complain about her cooking?

Yes he does. He criticizes & complains about Rainbow and Andre every bit as much as Ruby does.

Dre for sure; he's always been abusive towards him, yet Dre accepts it and allows him to live in the pool house. However, I feel that he often compliments Bow and appreciates her far more than he does Dre. He also doesn't criticize her racial background.

Ruby rarely criticizes Dre, which makes her constant verbal abuse of Bow even more aggravating.

Edited February 19, 2017 by ItCouldBeWorse

[Dee]

Earl criticizes Rainbow all the time. From her parenting skills to her bad cooking to her naivete about the real world. 

Just this season, he spent a whole episode making her feel self conscious about her relationship with her children just so he could eat the kids food. And he told her (and Dre) that they were too snobby to appreciate how hard he and Ruby worked so Andre & Rhonda could do better than them; which is after he (and Ruby) spent an entire episode last season arguing with D'Alicia & Paul about their superiority complexes. 

And Ruby certainly criticizes Andre. As the seasons have progressed she's gone from reflexively babying him to mildly criticizing him when he's in the wrong. But that's no different than Rainbow's relationship with D'Alicia who would rather blame Andre for Rainbow's issues instead of herself or Rainbow.

And for all the victim playing Rainbow does about Ruby's supposed "verbal abuse" Rainbow never once stops D'Alicia from slamming Andre every chance she gets.

Edited February 19, 2017 by Dee

[Guest]

I don't mind the joke about the parents disliking their kids, but I also don't find it particularly funny.  Not because it feels abusive but because I have no context to relate to.  I don't know anyone who feels that way (or that lets on in the least if they do).  

I'm not a fan of odd names or using a kid to make some statement but I liked the premise.  It's a valid discussion and good grounds for comedy.