Jill, Derick & the Kids: Moving On!!

[Aja]

I don't get the "realist" vs "romantic" view of working.  Yes, being able to afford food...is super romantic? Not living in a cardboard box---RAWR? Being able to make my car, electrical and heating payments--oh my god, get my dreamy little head out of the clouds? Wtf?  Also: my grandmother was a nurse in the 1950s so my mom would probably be really interested to hear that she wasn't raised by a working mother.  Now yes, Derick, I know that it's my own fault, having to work. I know I could have latched myself onto a TV family like you did and then just beg for money on the internet and spit contempt at all those immoral whores like my grandmother who had/have careers. Or, less ambitiously, I could have latched myself on to a fundie headship who is in charge of how I dress, what I say, how I say it, where I go, who I hang out with, what I do with my day, what I do with my body, what I do with every second of my spare time, what I think, what my life goals are, what I eat, and how I should wear my hair. I know that, to you, that all sounds wonderful. But I'd seriously rather watch your Powerpoint presentation 75 times in a row with Josh massaging my shoulders and Jim Bob breathing directly onto my face. Some people actually feel like that, Derick. Now, I know that differs from how YOU think and therefore it's irrelevant, Satanic, immoral and just WRONG, but sorry...it's true.

[doodlebug]

14 minutes ago, Aja said:

I don't get the "realist" vs "romantic" view of working.  Yes, being able to afford food...is super romantic? Not living in a cardboard box---RAWR? Being able to make my car, electrical and heating payments--oh my god, get my dreamy little head out of the clouds? Wtf?  Also: my grandmother was a nurse in the 1950s so my mom would probably be really interested to hear that she wasn't raised by a working mother.  Now yes, Derick, I know that it's my own fault, having to work. I know I could have latched myself onto a TV family like you did and then just beg for money on the internet and spit contempt at all those immoral whores like my grandmother who had/have careers. Or, less ambitiously, I could have latched myself on to a fundie headship who is in charge of how I dress, what I say, how I say it, where I go, who I hang out with, what I do with my day, what I do with my body, what I do with every second of my spare time, what I think, what my life goals are, what I eat, and how I should wear my hair. I know that, to you, that all sounds wonderful. But I'd seriously rather watch your Powerpoint presentation 75 times in a row with Josh massaging my shoulders and Jim Bob breathing directly onto my face. Some people actually feel like that, Derick. Now, I know that differs from how YOU think and therefore it's irrelevant, Satanic, immoral and just WRONG, but sorry...it's true.

My grandmother cooked in the bakery her parents ran and then the diner she owned with her husband until it went out of business.  She then cleaned offices at night.  My mom was a waitress/barmaid who eventually found an 'easier' job on an electronics assembly line.  I don't know how Derick could expect that I or any other woman would find it 'romantic' to work for a living.  If anything, my mother and grandmother's work lives inspired me to work hard and get educated so I could have more and better choices when it came time to earn a living.  I sure didn't see it as 'romantic' when my mother left at 6 PM every night to work the dinner shift and got home from work at 3 AM once the bar closed.  She sure didn't act like it was any picnic, either.  Oh, yeah, both my grandmother and my mom also kept house and took care of their kids which is why they worked off-shifts (7 kids for my grandma, 6 for my mom).  My father and grandfather, who we lived with, kept an eye on us while mom was at work in the evenings and my dad got us up and ready for school while my mother slept in, recovering from the 'romance' of pouring drinks until the wee hours.  We won't even go there and speak of my great grandmother, widowed with 6 kids, the youngest only 2; alone in the US where she spoke no English.  She took in washing and her kids virtually raised themselves in the streets.   Wow! What charmed lives they led!

[Heathen]

2 hours ago, Annb67 said:

Jesus Jill!!! Clean the hell up!!

I give her a small pass -- it isn't as if she learned cleanliness growing up with a bunch of pigs. Also, some people are just slobs. My sister was raised better, but her house still looks like that. Hers is a combination of too much clutter and being lazy. 

[ginger90]

[jennblevins]

1 hour ago, Aja said:

I don't get the "realist" vs "romantic" view of working.

I hate the idea that I think the same way as anyone Derick quotes, but here’s what I took it to mean: there’s a certain sort of person (I’m related to some of them) who seems incapable of having an adult-like life without a job. When you talk to them, they’re so jealous of the deep, meaningful adult conversations that they think you have all day, and even more jealous of (and this is a big one) the fact that they think you don’t have to make your own coffee. 

It’s related, I suppose, to people who feel bad all the time because their life doesn’t look like what they see on social media?

If you have someone like this who’s forgotten the bad parts of having a job (or never had one), you have someone who’s set up to give a kid the impression that working (particularly in an office) is a nonstop parade of highly intellectual conversations punctuated by the occasional coffee break ... yeah, that could be romantic. Meanwhile, the realist knows to temper that with the, well, more realistic views of what working life is like.

Edited February 12, 2018 by jennblevins
Hit save too soon.

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

On 2/11/2018 at 1:58 PM, Marigold said:

Now there's an interesting question.

My guess is that they will move into the TTH because they are missionaries and Jim Bob is "supporting their mission work". 

Or, Jim Bob will "donate" money to his missionary son in law. 

I strongly suspect that Derrick's mommy is also helping out some monetarily.  Derrick can do no wrong, after all (or be expected to work).

22 hours ago, Vaysh said:

Ugh. The whole "women belong in the home and all secretly want to be there because history!" BS is one of my pet peeves. Until after World War II, when there was a huge propaganda campaign to get women out of the work force and into the home because governments were afraid that men would end up jobless after returning from the war, most women worked unless they were part of the affluent but small upper and middle classes. Working class women (the majority) have always had to work. And usually had to do all of the housework as well. If you were working class or peasant class you worked, whether man or woman. This whole idea of the cookie-baking, homework-helping, sweetly smiling angel of the home with her spotless home and garden who was just so fulfilled and happy with never having to go out into the nasty world and *gasp* work for pay instead of, you know, doing it for free, is essentially a 1950's propaganda piece. And the generations after that fought furiously to change that image and for the right for all women to work in all fields as well as for conditions that allow women to work even after having children (paid parental leave, subsidised child care, good pre-schools etc). I guess Derp slept through that history class.

 

THANK YOU. I wish I had more than one "like" to give to this post. I am always shocked when college students (I work in higher ed) talk about women working out of the home "now days." Um....my gradmother worked on her family's farm (doing the same work in the fields that the men did), my step-grandmother worked at the grocery store, and my other grandmother worked at a manufacturing plant (and as a riveter during WWII). My great-grandmother was a domestic.  My mother, the first in her family to go to college, was a member of the Women's Army Corps and later worked as a social worker. They also took care of their own homes, children, laundry, meals, etc. as well.  More careers are open to women today that were once male-dominated, but let's please not act like women did not work outside of the home until recently.  Erasing the work of working class women (and middle class women who were nurses/teachers) is just another example of misogyny at work in our culture. 

6 hours ago, Barb23 said:

I was thinking the same thing. Can't believe he would even think of saying what he did. Btw, what does he mean by a "romantic view of work?"  Does he mean someone loving her career so much she would rather work than be a stay at home mom? 

Our culture absolutely does glorify/romanticize being a SAHM (while at the same time undervalueing the unpaid work SAHPs do).  People think being a SAHParent is easy, "not a real job," etc. I will admit I thought that, too.  Then I had a kid (and then another). I play SAHM on school breaks/summers. Let me tell you, that is WORK. I had mad respect for SAHPs. It's got to be the toughest job out there. I love my kids, but I start missing adult interactions, intellectual stimulation, etc after a few days and start jonesing for my job.  My co-workers and I even joke that "Monday is the new Friday!" because on Mondays we get to have a break from our "little bosses" (the kids). Ha.  I wasn't built to be a SAHM and that's okay.  I may very well romantically love my job compared to being a SAHP. Haha. 

3 hours ago, jennblevins said:

THIS. I like to think of myself as a pretty calm person, but the idea that all women (mothers or not) have some sort of magical ability to choose whether to work outside the house or not makes me stabby.  (Was I sick the day that we all had to make that choice in school and someone chose “work” for me?) Worse yet, it shows up in both left-leaning stuff and right-leaning stuff (both with the assumption that any women who works chose to do so; the only difference is whether this is considered a good thing or not).  It’s a ridiculous rose-colored idea that doesn’t reflect reality for most women that I know. There’s a choice, all right, but it’s the same one that men have: work, starve, or find someone else that thinks you’re worth supporting. 

Clearly Jill thought Derick was worth supporting, Lord knows why.  

Derrick is lucky that he found a woman who chose to and can support him through the work she did outside of the home as a reality TV star (filming off location from her home), doing book tours, and giving lectures. Thank goodness Jill worked outside of the home so that she can support Derrick and his jobless self right now (and his two kids).  I hope Derrick thanks Jill every day for the work she's done over the years that have allowed him to "choose" to not work since he saw how romanticized the idea of work had been for him....  

Edited February 12, 2018 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[mythoughtis]

I hate to tell Derick this,but he doesn’t understand millennial women at all.  I have two nieces who are indeed SAHMs. Why? Well, because paying day care for 2 children under kindergarten age would have taken the majority of their net paycheck. Add clothing, transportation, etc, and non monetary costs and working wasn’t feasible. One is now working because her children are in school. The other’s husband  makes great money and is on call around the clock. So she is still at home. Not everyone can choose whether to work or not. I had to work. 

 

Fyi - I am a younger baby boomer. My mom worked, and so did one of my grandmothers. 

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

On 2/12/2018 at 4:42 PM, mythoughtis said:

I hate to tell Derick this,but he doesn’t understand millennial women at all.  I have two nieces who are indeed SAHMs. Why? Well, because paying day care for 2 children under kindergarten age would have taken the majority of their net paycheck. Add clothing, transportation, etc, and non monetary costs and working wasn’t feasible. One is now working because her children are in school. The other’s husband  makes great money and is on call around the clock. So she is still at home. Not everyone can choose whether to work or not. I had to work. 

 

Fyi - I am a younger baby boomer. My mom worked, and so did one of my grandmothers. 

THIS. Almost every SAHM I personally know might say she's staying at home because she can't leave her babies or wants to be home with them, etc. But in reality, they cannot afford the outrageous price of childcare if they did work, as almost all (or perhaps all/more than all) would go to childcare.

Source: I am an (older) millenial. Hubby & I have two toddlers. We pay more in childcare than we do for our mortgage. It takes 90% of my monthly take-home pay to cover daycare and my mortgage. Hubby's job pays insurance, car note, utilities, etc.  I'm not making tons of money by any means and it's always very tight at our house because of the daycare costs. I am very lucky that I am able to work (ie: my pay more than covers daycare).  Many of my college-educated friends  who have kids haven't been as lucky due to the economy (plus some of my friends who didn't go to college haven't been able to find jobs that pay what they'd need for daycare).  Add in that men generally make more money than women, and it's obvious who usually ends up staying home in a two-parent hetero family.  Most of the millenial SAHMs I know aren't actually doing it by choice, even if they won't tell outsiders that.  
I'll preface this by saying I do not want any more kids - two is perfect for me.  But even if I did, we COULD NOT have another child because of daycare costs. We could not afford to pay for three children in daycare. Almost every millenial, middle class couple I know plans how many kids they will have based on daycare costs...because the Lord only provides free/affordable childcare for middle class families in heathen, atheist places like the Scandinavian countries and I live in the Christian-majority, family-values-centered US. 

Edited February 14, 2018 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[Churchhoney]

On 2/11/2018 at 5:56 PM, Chicklet said:

 

Don't they teach history at that university in Oklahoma?

Christians of the Duggar ilk can be excused from history classes. Something about religious freedom. ... Also science. 

[ginger90]

Quote

Derrick is lucky that he found a woman who chose to and can support him through the work she did outside of the home as a reality TV star (filming off location from her home), doing book tours, and giving lectures. Thank goodness Jill worked outside of the home so that she can support Derrick and his jobless self right now (and his two kids).  I hope Derrick thanks Jill every day for the work she's done over the years that have allowed him to "choose" to not work since he saw how romanticized the idea of work had been for him....  

This is excellent!

[bigskygirl]

Jill is not working right now since he got both of them kicked off the show. Who is supporting his lazy ass now.

And while we may or may not be on the subject now...of all the people on the planet why the heck were the Dullards on the red carpet team for the one dance. Seriously...

[Sew Sumi]

1 hour ago, Churchhoney said:

Christians of the Duggar ilk can be excused from history classes. Something about religious freedom. ... Also science. 

That said, we don't know exactly what "ilk" Derelict fell under while he matriciulated at OSU. Even though Rick passed away, it didn't convert Dan. Maybe Derelict was more of a mainstream Southern Baptist type that wouldn't be bothered by regular history or science courses. He would have only been required to take one history class anyway, given his major, and it's possible that he got chemistry and biology out of the way in high school. I don't know how much more hard science would be required for an accounting degree (possibly physics?); I would assume his primary coursework was statistics-centric. 

[Arwen Evenstar]

4 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

I would assume his primary coursework was statistics-centric. 

We know how good Fundies are at statistics, right?  Facts don’t deter them, either.

[Catlyn]

Derrick and women working makes me stabby. My Dad had to take early retirement because of cataracts. ( This was before the in and out in one day, and because of sensitivities to certain pain killers had to be put completely under. ) Not that we were hurting, but Mom had to work to supplement Dad's pension.  She never worked before in her life. First she got a job with an upholsterer because they needed a seampstress.   After the company went bust she learned electronics and got a job as an assemblier. You know what? I think she enjoyed getting out of the house and meeting people she wouldn't have known before.  She upholstered a couple of chairs and also refinished a table.  She also could read schematics and would fix our dishwasher. She was skilled with a soldering iron no matter with electoronics or leaded glass. A hobby she took up later.  All of this was after she turned fifty.  Do I think Jilly-Muffin could do this? No.  

But also, Derrick doesn't see the enjoyment one can get from working. People,skills,etc.  Maybe if he tried it he might.

[bigskygirl]

Derick did tried at Wal Mart and we all know how well that turned out. Of course Cling A Long Jill would suck the life out of someone who may or may not work. And yes I have worked with a few Derick types and have been around a few men married to Jill types before to the point where I rolled my eyes, wanting to run away screaming, or count the minutes until I could go home.

Edited February 13, 2018 by bigskygirl
Learning to use proper English is hard.

[Sew Sumi]

I've been with my husband for 25 years and have only met him for lunch one whopping time. And that was only because I had a doctor's appointment next to the hospital where he works. Likewise, he's never shown up with a picnic lunch to share at any of my places of employment. The only couple I know who did lunch together did so because they worked in the same small building. The husband was a self-employed CPA (oh, the irony, Derelict!), so he could go to lunch whenever the wife, my co-worker, was free. 

[Absolom]

47 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

I would assume his primary coursework was statistics-centric. 

Most of his coursework would have been accounting.  It's a subject all unto itself.  Calculus for accounting or business and maybe one stat class would have been on the list.  Science and social science aren't heavy requirements and unless Derick had some novel ideas for a Southern Baptist, he would have been fine in almost any of his classes.  Philosophy might have thrown him if he'd taken it, but that would not have been a required class. 

[Sew Sumi]

Derelict is throwing another Twatter hissy fit and Mommy is "liking" it. 

Not sure why the original post won't show, but you can see the ongoing conversation if you click on the link.  

Edited February 13, 2018 by Sew Sumi

[Lady Edith]

On 2/10/2018 at 2:09 PM, Churchhoney said:

I've never actually seen much of the Duggars on tv, but I think this night-and-day-are-irrelevant thing-no-matter-what-age-you-are has been the longstanding family tradition, hasn't it? I seem to recall either hearing about or seeing instances where Duggar kids just fell asleep on the stairs or in a corner. No particular bedtimes. I guess for all the Duggarlings, including the married ones, this is just the norm that they've always known.

That seems nuts to me, but I also kind of see how you might get into those habits if nobody in the family went to a regular job or to school.  Without any externally imposed routine or expectations, I suppose you could all too easily let little slipups in the schedule slide more and more -- no impetus to fix them -- until there was no schedule at all. Partly explains their grazing eating habits too, I suppose. If nobody ever goes to bed or gets up at consistent, working-world-type times, the meal schedule would likely collapse right along with the sleep schedule, I guess. (especially if it were helped along by a major disinclination to fix actual food, on the part of the supposed housekeepers)

And actually, with the possible exception of Austin, nobody who's married in so far has all that much in the way of external schedule constraints either. We saw what happened with the Dullards when Der did. And right now, Jer may have the most, but it also looks as if he may actually have no regular out-of-the-house responsibilities except on Sunday morning either.

So unless some Duggarling wakes up to the fact that their family's traditional way of life is nutso and unhealthy, they may not get much pushback from any of the spouses. .... I wish I had faith that some Duggarlings would decided to change it up and believe in bedtimes and getting up times. But I wouldn't hold my breath for it. 

I get the focus and point of your rant, but I did a little digging and found that the event went from 6-9 pm. So not terribly late for the young   Duglings.

[Arwen Evenstar]

Derick is a knob, in addition to being a demented stick insect. That is all.

[Barb23]

37 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

I've been with my husband for 25 years and have only met him for lunch one whopping time. And that was only because I had a doctor's appointment next to the hospital where he works. Likewise, he's never shown up with a picnic lunch to share at any of my places of employment. The only couple I know who did lunch together did so because they worked in the same small building. The husband was a self-employed CPA (oh, the irony, Derelict!), so he could go to lunch whenever the wife, my co-worker, was free. 

Similar thing for me. My husband worked for a local newspaper & worked in several different offices but I never saw any of them. He did see mine when I worked in a doctor's office &  he changed his PCP to one of our docs. But he came for appt & no hanging around. He likes early appointments so not to miss too much work so having picnic lunch out of question. Oh, before that he did come in to pick me up when I broke my leg& couldn't drive.   Yes Derick,  I worked when I had a broken leg, with large leg brace & using walker BECAUSE I HAD TO. Same thing when I had joint replacement surgery on my dominant right hand. I worked with a brace on my hand  BECAUSE I HAD TO. (House & car payments still have to be made when injured.)

[Sew Sumi]

Game.set.match. Again, click on the hotlink to see what Derelict said to provoke this response. He thinks he's such a special snowflake, doesn't he?

eta: I normally wouldn't have seen this mess, but I'm all over Twatter during the Olympics looking for stuff to pin to my PyeongChang wall on Pinterest. 

Edited February 13, 2018 by Sew Sumi

[louannems]

6 hours ago, MyPeopleAreNordic said:

THIS. Almost every SAHM I personally know might say she's staying at home because she can't leave her babies or wants to be home with them, etc. But in reality, they cannot afford the outrageous price of childcare if they did work, as almost all (or perhaps all/more than all) would go to childcare.

Source: I am an (older) millenial. Hubby & I have two toddlers. We pay more in childcare than we do for our mortgage. It takes 90% of my monthly take-home pay to cover daycare and my mortgage. Hubby's job pays insurance, car note, utilities, etc.  I'm not making tons of money by any means and it's always very tight at our house because of the daycare costs. I am very lucky that I am able to work (ie: my pay more than covers daycare).  Many of my college-educated friends  who have kids haven't been as lucky due to the economy (plus some of my friends who didn't go to college haven't been able to find jobs that pay what they'd need for daycare).  Add in that men generally make more money than women, and it's obvious who usually ends up staying home in a two-parent hetero family.  Most of the millenial SAHMs I know aren't actually doing it by choice, even if they won't tell outsiders that.  

I'll preface this by saying I do not want any more kids - two is perfect for me.  But even if I did, we COULD NOT have another child because of daycare costs. We could not afford to pay for three children in daycare. Almsot every Millenial, middle class couple I know plans how many kids they will have based on daycare costs...because the Lord only provides free/affordable childcare for middle class families in heathen, atheist places like the Scandinavian countries and I live in the Christian-majority, family-values-centered US. 

We had two in day care until we decided to buy a house.  We couldn't afford day care and the mortgage, so I went on 4 to Midnight's and hubby worked 5 AM til 1:30.  No more day care needed and I loved our arrangement.

[Celia Rubenstein]

On 2/12/2018 at 7:36 PM, Lady Edith said:

I get the focus and point of your rant, but I did a little digging and found that the event went from 6-9 pm. So not terribly late for the young   Duglings.

Yes, and they were working the red carpet greeting people as they entered which means that video was shot early on, near 6 PM. Which coincides with the time of sunset that evening. So it was getting dark, but it wasn't really as late as it seemed.

Edited February 14, 2018 by Celia Rubenstein

[Heathen]

1 hour ago, Sew Sumi said:

Game.set.match. Again, click on the hotlink to see what Derelict said to provoke this response. He thinks he's such a special snowflake, doesn't he?

eta: I normally wouldn't have seen this mess, but I'm all over Twatter during the Olympics looking for stuff to pin to my PyeongChang wall on Pinterest. 

FFRF will eat Derelict for lunch. 

[Darknight]

Derrick wasted 4 years in college to do nothing. What ever happened to the man providing for his family? 

[graefin]

5 hours ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

Derick is a knob, in addition to being a demented stick insect. That is all.

Come on. There's no need to insult insects, now.

[Darknight]

On 2/10/2018 at 9:24 AM, toodles said:

Hmmm.  There COULD be gay or lesbian people on the team.  Or, shudder, transgender people on the team.  How will Cathy or her waste of a human being son know who to really cheer for?  There could be Jewish people or Muslim people or atheists on the team. I hope they did a thorough background check on each and every participate to make sure they are the right kind of person. Slippery slope here 

God could have blessed the wrong kind of person with the determination, ability and strong work ethic it takes to get to the Games.  And what if the athlete's hard work pays off and they achieve their goals?  Then what?  

But it must be comforting to know that if the  Olympics ever allows interpretive dance as event , Derwood is a shoe- in.

ETA:  I'm watching the opening ceremony. I hope Cathy covered her ears during the performance of Imagine. A godless song if ever I heard one.  No heaven or hell. People living together in peace.  Why I never.......

Theres a gay American figure skater.  They don't 3rd in the group event. Wonder how they feel about this 

[ginger90]

[cdp73]

5 hours ago, Darknight said:

Derrick wasted 4 years in college to do nothing. What ever happened to the man providing for his family? 

There is a man providing for Derick's family...only it's Jim Bob, not Derick.

[Lisa418722]

19 minutes ago, cdp73 said:

There is a man providing for Derick's family...only it's Jim Bob, not Derick.

Don't forget the woman who is probably providing for his family as well... Miss Cathy.  

[Churchhoney]

11 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

That said, we don't know exactly what "ilk" Derelict fell under while he matriciulated at OSU. Even though Rick passed away, it didn't convert Dan. Maybe Derelict was more of a mainstream Southern Baptist type that wouldn't be bothered by regular history or science courses. He would have only been required to take one history class anyway, given his major, and it's possible that he got chemistry and biology out of the way in high school. I don't know how much more hard science would be required for an accounting degree (possibly physics?); I would assume his primary coursework was statistics-centric. 

Absolutely true. Plus it's also true that many, perhaps most, history classes in America, and especially in conservative states, just gloss over anything that might conflict with majority views. Just like most high school biology courses mention evolution, but few actually treat it as the cornerstone of modern biological science, as it actually is. ... No matter what some say about liberal bias, a lot of American education just steers away from presenting things that challenge anyone's beliefs, if it can be avoided.)

(And obviously I need to label my jokes -- . I didn't mean this literally!)

[MargeGunderson]

1 hour ago, ginger90 said:

I'm pretty sure Jesus is shaking his head and saying "Dude, shut up already!" The irony of that sentence coming from Derick's mouth is overwhelming.

[Churchhoney]

10 hours ago, Lady Edith said:

I get the focus and point of your rant, but I did a little digging and found that the event went from 6-9 pm. So not terribly late for the young   Duglings.

Not only did I not dig, I was ranting without even knowing that there was any specific event!  I was just going off somebody else's comment that, by then, had totally disconnected itself from the event!

10 hours ago, Catlyn said:

 

But also, Derrick doesn't see the enjoyment one can get from working. People,skills,etc.  Maybe if he tried it he might.

The oddest thing to me is that his mother -- a woman who worked when she also had a husband who worked so her working seems to have been largely a choice, at least early on -- doesn't point this out to them. It seems as if both of them at some point fell down some weird rabbit hole where they forgot everything they may have known or thought previously.....Yet another reason why I suspect Duggarness is actually an undiscovered viral illness. 

Edited February 13, 2018 by Churchhoney

[tabloidlover]

11 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

I've been with my husband for 25 years and have only met him for lunch one whopping time. And that was only because I had a doctor's appointment next to the hospital where he works. Likewise, he's never shown up with a picnic lunch to share at any of my places of employment. The only couple I know who did lunch together did so because they worked in the same small building. The husband was a self-employed CPA (oh, the irony, Derelict!), so he could go to lunch whenever the wife, my co-worker, was free. 

Right there with you @Sew Sumi.   I can only remember meeting my husband for lunch once during our last 27 years.   He was having a shitty day and I was off, so we went to his favorite restaurant to cheer him up.   I will admit that very early on when he was working overnights and we were poor, I would cook dinner  and bring it to him so that he would have food.  (we couldn't afford fast food)  We worked opposite schedules for a good year and it was a chance for us to see one another for 30 minutes a day.  

He would think I lost my mind if I tried driving him to work, bringing him lunch and staying to eat with him, and driving back to pick him up every day.    I can hear him now, "Babe, are you ok?  No really - what's wrong?   Seriously, just tell me what's wrong!"    Hahahahaha

[Jynnan tonnix]

15 hours ago, MyPeopleAreNordic said:

THIS. Almost every SAHM I personally know might say she's staying at home because she can't leave her babies or wants to be home with them, etc. But in reality, they cannot afford the outrageous price of childcare if they did work, as almost all (or perhaps all/more than all) would go to childcare.

Source: I am an (older) millenial. Hubby & I have two toddlers. We pay more in childcare than we do for our mortgage. It takes 90% of my monthly take-home pay to cover daycare and my mortgage. Hubby's job pays insurance, car note, utilities, etc.  I'm not making tons of money by any means and it's always very tight at our house because of the daycare costs. I am very lucky that I am able to work (ie: my pay more than covers daycare).  Many of my college-educated friends  who have kids haven't been as lucky due to the economy (plus some of my friends who didn't go to college haven't been able to find jobs that pay what they'd need for daycare).  Add in that men generally make more money than women, and it's obvious who usually ends up staying home in a two-parent hetero family.  Most of the millenial SAHMs I know aren't actually doing it by choice, even if they won't tell outsiders that.  

I'll preface this by saying I do not want any more kids - two is perfect for me.  But even if I did, we COULD NOT have another child because of daycare costs. We could not afford to pay for three children in daycare. Almsot every Millenial, middle class couple I know plans how many kids they will have based on daycare costs...because the Lord only provides free/affordable childcare for middle class families in heathen, atheist places like the Scandinavian countries and I live in the Christian-majority, family-values-centered US. 

I guess I'm part  of a somewhat nonexistent generation or something because a lot of this conversation isn't part of my experience growing up. I was born in England in 1959, and neither my mother, the mothers of any of my cousins or the mothers of the vast majority of my friends worked outside the home after their children were born. After we moved to the USA, my mother got a job for a brief period of time, but found the extra income wasn't worth not being around to tend to her house and garden the way she preferred. I was more or less old enough to fend for myself by then, but I'm sure she was also more comfortable being there when I got home from school, etc. Most of my friends' moms there were always home as well (middle-class Connecticut suburbia). I just always saw the model of all those moms I knew growing up as the norm, and never had any particular drive for a career outside of being a wife and mother either. 

My daughter HAS always wanted a career, and is lucky that her situation will enable her to stay on that track even after she has her baby (only about another month left!) as her in-laws live only about a 20-minute drive away and we are even closer, plus her husband can arrange his schedule to work longer days four times a week and be home on the fifth, so child care will not be an issue.

It's honestly been a bit eye-opening to hear of all the working mothers going generations back. Hats off to all those women who made it all work by choice or necessity, and sympathies for  those who found themselves having to give up dreams of a career to make ends meet. I'm feeling very lucky about now.

[awaken]

18 hours ago, Aja said:

I don't get the "realist" vs "romantic" view of working.  Yes, being able to afford food...is super romantic? Not living in a cardboard box---RAWR? Being able to make my car, electrical and heating payments--oh my god, get my dreamy little head out of the clouds? Wtf?  Also: my grandmother was a nurse in the 1950s so my mom would probably be really interested to hear that she wasn't raised by a working mother.  Now yes, Derick, I know that it's my own fault, having to work. I know I could have latched myself onto a TV family like you did and then just beg for money on the internet and spit contempt at all those immoral whores like my grandmother who had/have careers. Or, less ambitiously, I could have latched myself on to a fundie headship who is in charge of how I dress, what I say, how I say it, where I go, who I hang out with, what I do with my day, what I do with my body, what I do with every second of my spare time, what I think, what my life goals are, what I eat, and how I should wear my hair. I know that, to you, that all sounds wonderful. But I'd seriously rather watch your Powerpoint presentation 75 times in a row with Josh massaging my shoulders and Jim Bob breathing directly onto my face. Some people actually feel like that, Derick. Now, I know that differs from how YOU think and therefore it's irrelevant, Satanic, immoral and just WRONG, but sorry...it's true.

Incredible!  Thank you. That is awesome. Especially the mental picture you conjure at the end!  

[Aja]

3 hours ago, ginger90 said:

Pot and kettle, meet Derick, who is even less self-aware than y'all are.

[Scarlett45]

1 hour ago, Jynnan tonnix said:

Most of my friends' moms there were always home as well (middle-class Connecticut suburbia). I just always saw the model of all those moms I knew growing up as the norm, and never had any particular drive for a career outside of being a wife and mother either. 

My daughter HAS always wanted a career, and is lucky that her situation will enable her to stay on that track even after she has her baby (only about another month left!) as her in-laws live only about a 20-minute drive away and we are even closer, plus her husband can arrange his schedule to work longer days four times a week and be home on the fifth, so child care will not be an issue.

It's honestly been a bit eye-opening to hear of all the working mothers going generations back. Hats off to all those women who made it all work by choice or necessity, and sympathies for  those who found themselves having to give up dreams of a career to make ends meet. I'm feeling very lucky about now.

That’s great your mom was able to be home with you guys!

But I think what irks people so much about Derrick is that he is equating a very specific situation, like yours above, “a predominately white middle class CN suburbia” during the post war years with a vast generalization about women working outside the home over decades.

For many women, especially women of color,  or lower income women, being a SAHM was a LUXURY (even Generations back), yes women did it when they were able, or they may have worked fewer hours than their husbands (and at lower pay) but working outside the home was expected at some point. My maternal grandmother was a SAHM Mom (a great point of pride for my grandfather) but my Mom was an only child (born about a decade before you) so they were able to make it work. 

For someone who’s lived all over the world and proclaims to want to minister to others Derrick is VERY ignorant to the ways in which anyone who isn’t “like him” lives or survives economically. Living abroad is supposed to open your world view- maybe he lived in Nepal and El Salvador with blinders on. The way Derrick spouts off unless you’re a woman in this very niche demographic that was able and willing to be a SAHM then you just don’t matter.

Edited February 13, 2018 by Scarlett45

[doodlebug]

59 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

That’s great your mom was able to be home with you guys!

But I think what irks people so much about Derrick is that he is equating a very specific situation, like yours above, “a predominately white middle class CN suburbia” during the post war years with a vast generalization about women working outside the home over decades.

For many women, especially women of color,  or lower income women, being a SAHM was a LUXURY (even Generations back), yes women did it when they were able, or they may have worked fewer hours than their husbands (and at lower pay) but working outside the home was expected at some point. My maternal grandmother was a SAHM Mom (a great point of pride for my grandfather) but my Mom was an only child (born about a decade before you) so they were able to make it work. 

For someone who’s lived all over the world and proclaims to want to minister to others Derrick is VERY ignorant to the ways in which anyone who isn’t “like him” lives or survives economically. Living abroad is supposed to open your world view- maybe he lived in Nepal and El Salvador with blinders on. The way Derrick spouts off unless you’re a woman in this very niche demographic that was able and willing to be a SAHM then you just don’t matter.

I've been to El Salvador.  I don't know who Derick met while he was there, but, most of the women I met worked for a living even if they were 'stay at home' mothers.  Virtually all of them raise chickens, have extensive home gardens for vegetables, even hire out to do cleaning and cooking for others while ostensibly home with their families. From my experience, it's fairly rare to meet a Salvadorean woman who doesn't do substantial work besides homemaking.  A lot of the elderly women do childcare for their daughters, grand daughters, nieces, etc so that they can work.

I guess I should clarify that my mother and grandmother dropped in and out of the workforce throughout their lives; staying at home when the kids were young or the economic times were good.  My mom was home full time until I was about 8 and her baby at the time was about a year old.  She then worked for the next 6 years or sometimes part time, sometimes fulltime,  until she got pregnant with my youngest sister.  She once again took about half a dozen years 'off'- while providing in-home childcare for other working moms.  Once my youngest sister was in school, she went back to work at a factory full time until her health failed.  Many of my friends' mothers did the same; worked outside the home or not depending on what was best for the family.

[WhineandCheez]

Quote

 

Derelict is throwing another Twatter hissy fit and Mommy is "liking" it. 

Not sure why the original post won't show, but you can see the ongoing conversation if you click on the link.  

 

Oy, the time he has on his hands. I wish I had that much free time!!!

[ginger90]

[bigskygirl]

Okay....

[JoanArc]

As a bear shitteth in the woods, so do the Dillards talk shitteth.

[Scarlett45]

1 hour ago, doodlebug said:

I've been to El Salvador.  I don't know who Derick met while he was there, but, most of the women I met worked for a living even if they were 'stay at home' mothers.  Virtually all of them raise chickens, have extensive home gardens for vegetables, even hire out to do cleaning and cooking for others while ostensibly home with their families. From my experience, it's fairly rare to meet a Salvadorean woman who doesn't do substantial work besides homemaking.  A lot of the elderly women do childcare for their daughters, grand daughters, nieces, etc so that they can work.

I guess I should clarify that my mother and grandmother dropped in and out of the workforce throughout their lives; staying at home when the kids were young or the economic times were good.  My mom was home full time until I was about 8 and her baby at the time was about a year old.  She then worked for the next 6 years or sometimes part time, sometimes fulltime,  until she got pregnant with my youngest sister.  She once again took about half a dozen years 'off'- while providing in-home childcare for other working moms.  Once my youngest sister was in school, she went back to work at a factory full time until her health failed.  Many of my friends' mothers did the same; worked outside the home or not depending on what was best for the family.

Exactly. It would be one thing if Derrick like the bio-Duggars had ONLY been exposed to one demographic of people in a small community; but he supposedly had a chance to broaden his world view by experiencing other cultures and he still spouts things that make little sense. 

Given his rants on other topics I’m not expecting him to be self aware but GOLLY. 

[kokapetl]

28 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

Ah, opaque Jebus quotes. Always clarifies things. 

BTW, did that strip club get the ambiguous yes/no that she wanted?

[Aja]

So Cathy is AGREEING with Climate Concerned? That's how it reads. Take that as a lesson on clarity, Chatty Cathy.

Also, the phrasing of the original verse Derick posted about his soul panting is...different.

Edited February 13, 2018 by Aja

[Sew Sumi]

7 hours ago, ginger90 said:

Uhm, no they weren't Derelict. They saw someone acting contrary to the First Amendment and called them on it. THAT, you moron, is their mission. 

[sometimesy]

Helicopter Cathy should back off. Derp doesn't need her spoon to stir the pot.

[Portia]

2 hours ago, Aja said:

So Cathy is AGREEING with Climate Concerned? That's how it reads. Take that as a lesson on clarity, Chatty Cathy.

I agree that she's not super-clear,  but I think she's definitely NOT agreeing.  She's replying to "God loves everyone" with "But no one gets saved except by accepting [my version of] Jesus."