Jill, Derick & the Kids: Moving On!!

[MargeGunderson]

No. It's a Christian music festival.

 

So then yes, the opposite of a Grateful Dead concert (gently teasing)

[Hpmec]

Their attendance in Texas signals that Derick now owes his allegiance to the dark side. His co-workers at Wal-Mart must be thrilled to see him using his paternity leave, the time when one parent helps the other new parent with their infant, to travel with his wife and newborn to a Gothard all hands shindig. It's not like that same event isn't taking place next year. And what's so important that they have to be there in the first place? Poor little Izzy. 2 weeks old, and being exposed to hard core Gothardism. He must be crying his little eyes out.

Looking at the faces in the big family photo, it's pretty telling that no one is smiling and most look downright miserable. While other kids are getting a real education, playing on sports teams, hanging with friends of diverse religious backgrounds, listening to music, reading books, watching a Disney channel show, the Duggar offspring are stuck at Big Sandy. I'd be miserable too.

Edited April 21, 2015 by Hpmec

[3girlsforus]

They don't get their first shots until they are 2 months old.

 

.

Unfortunately now they are administering the Hep b when the baby is just hours old even without risk factors so it's possible he was given that one.

[Wellfleet]

Family-centered Cesarean: a clear drape so the parents can see the baby emerge, changing the placement of EKG/blood pressure monitors to allow the mom to hold the baby and put him/her on her chest soon after the birth, not whisking the baby away, etc.

 

I grew up hearing sermons about the sin of pride at church and having older relatives, at least, who didn't use the word "proud" about another person as a compliment, so what Michelle said about not using the word on its face, didn't seem foreign to me, at least. It's just that in conjunction with Michelle's other behavior, where you can see the problem of it possibly creating a situation where she can only lavish praise/love on her daughters if they've caught a blessing or endured a tough birth experience, that you see the real problem. 

 

So I feel bad for Jill, if she is thinking of herself as a failure for how she gave birth or if she thinks that her mother will only really love her if she adds a new blessing to the world. Introspection and critical thinking skills aren't something you just easily pick up as an adult if they've been beaten out of you as a child, and you've been taught that you just have to follow the Gothard way and your life will be nothing but precious and special and blessed. I never held out much hope for Derick leading the way, since he went to Jim Bob for a wife—rather than local churches or Christian Mingle—for a reason.

 

Have to agree, and especially about Derick. I can see now that the optimism and hope many of us had for him was seriously misplaced. And for exactly what Dejana said - he went to Boob for a wife. I hope that move was a last resort for him, that he tried first through friends, through church, maybe even through Christian Mingle. But I'm not too hopeful about that either. Looked promising in Nepal, but DD has been one disappointment after another since he returned.

[doodlebug]

Unfortunately now they are administering the Hep b when the baby is just hours old even without risk factors so it's possible he was given that one.

 

Considering she's apparently a hardcore Bradley follower, I suspect Jill refused it.  There's a certain mindset that goes along with Bradley and it tends to be anti-vaccination.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

If Derick really said there is "no shame" in a C-section, he's a real ass.

 

I don't understand why so many women feel cheated if they don't deliver vaginally.  Really, isn't the goal a safe delivery and a healthy baby?

 

I think Derrick just repeated what he heard from Jill and Michelle and any other Duggar women who are stupid enough to think that.  What does he know about it in the first place?  Nothing!    

[Wellfleet]

Yesterday I saw the episode of Josh and Anna moving into their new home.  Jill turned into the general telling everyone what to do.  I hadn't seen her do that before. I'm afraid Derick is going to lose every battle--Derick will need to obey his marching orders.  And that includes his speech--before he talks he'd better know what Jill wants him to say or she will correct him.

 

Jill is clearly Alpha Female. She's spoken over her sibs for years. I once saw an interview on YouTube, regarding their "relationship" book I think, where Jill spoke the entire time, except for one or two very brief comments from one of the other girls. Jill answered every question, even those directed to another sister. And she's often been shown directing projects and events, telling who what to do and when. So far Derick has shown himself to be a remarkably passive male, IMO - and for a firstborn that's fairly unusual. But maybe he really does like it that way. Approaching the father first is, in this day and age, an extremely-passive way to find a wife, so maybe that's just who he is. I just can't imagine most guys tolerating that kind of behavior from a wife indefinitely.

[GEML]

When the trip was planned, it was reasonable to think the baby would be several weeks old. [snip]

I just think we don't know enough to say. Yes, it seems stupid. But I keep coming back to the idea of Jill staying home alone and something about that just feels worse. Babies get first rounds of shots in hospitals now. They could go in their own car. She will have plenty of help. Might as well hope for the best. It's not as though she will be doing follow ups with the medical community anyway.

Edited April 22, 2015 by Rhondinella
off topic

[Absolom]

Part of the keeping newborns out of crowds is pertussis making a comeback because of anti-vaxxers.  

 

 

Babies get first rounds of shots in hospitals now.

They only get one or two in most hospitals.  DPT which is one of the biggest issues is still given at 2 months at least in California.

[TEEVEE]

[snip]

Poorly. Real, legitimate depression doesn't exist in their world for either sex, for any reason. They've never been formally given skills for dealing with depression. PPD is just something made up, to them.

I don't believe that at all. The Duggar's use medicine. And I truly do not think they would hesitate to find a Christian psych doc to prescribe meds if Jill was suffering. Sometimes thoughts on here are a little extreme.

Edited April 22, 2015 by Rhondinella
off topic

[funky-rat]

I haven't read the article, but if Derek used "no shame" as in "There's no shame in a c-section" kind of thing, that may be a regionalism.  It's used where I live extensively, and it's meant to be reassuring - that someone shouldn't feel ashamed because they had to ask for help, or things didn't go as planned but they did the best they could.  The counselor my husband is currently seeing told him straight out that there was "no shame in asking for help".  I guess I don't see the big deal for that one.  Same with Michelle and her "proud" comment.  Pride is a deadly sin, and in her line of somewhat disjointed thinking, she may choose to use another word instead.

[msblossom]

I read something last night on Facebook that all of the Duggars, including Jill, Derrick and baby Israel are in Texas for the annual homeschool conference. Considering all Jill has been through, I can't imagine that she's up for this trip now. I guess Derrick must be on family leave from his job now. Josh and Anna seem to go every year, too. Just wondering, what is the point of bringing a newborn baby to an event  like this unless to show him off to the thousands of people who attend?

Somehow I'm not surprised. Her baby was in a life threatening highly traumatized state less than 2 weeks ago where she spent more than 70 hours trying to deliver and had an emergency c-section and now she's schlepping the newborn to Texas? This makes me angry, that girl has no common sense does she? My God, what sympathy I had for that bird-brained girl has gone out the window. There will be more homeschool conferences and weddings where you can catch up with your freakin fundie friends and show your baby off to in the future. What an idiot.

[truthtalk2014]

Not only the discomfort of traveling so soon after a csection, but I was pretty protective of not introducing my babies to germs those first few months of life. Why expose him to all of those strangers?

Looking around online, it seems most sites recommend not letting an infant out around big crowds for 6-8 weeks. The immune system isn't fully developed.

 

She is an idiot!  I will shout that from the rooftops. There is no way that baby should be around all those germs.  I'm sorry but those chances should not be taken.  [snip]  I think she just makes bad irresponsible choices- as in her birth.  AND DerrickDullard as well!!!

I will go against the grain and say that attending the conference might be helpful to Jill. Yes, to us it sounds like a nightmare and a health issue. But if she had been left behind alone, I think she would have felt isolated and abandoned. This way she will feel part of the family (which she obviously still craves) and everyone at the conference will flock to see her and the new baby, which might be good for her mental health.

Honestly, Jillymuffin needs to stop putting Jillymuffin first.  I'm sure she wanted to be the center of attention, but at some point, you need to put your baby first.  

Edited April 22, 2015 by Rhondinella
off topic

[3 is enough]

While I have to agree with GEML that missing the Big Sandy trip may have been devastating for Jill, it really goes to show how messed up the whole family dynamic is for the Duggars.  They claim it's "Leave and cleave, baby", but clearly it is anything but.

 

Jill's family is now Derick and Israel.  Boob, MEchelle, and the umpteen siblings have become her EXTENDED family.  Also, she conveniently forgets that Derick also has an extended family.  Derick and Israel come first.  Period.  Missing this trip should have been a given.  Because we all know the real reason for the trip is that Boob just wants to show off his ever-expanding brood ("Now my kids are having kids!").  Even if Jill really wanted to go, her son's needs should have come first.  That's what parenthood is all about.

 

We have seen this before, with heavily pregnant Anna travelling cross country on the stink bus for a book tour just before Michael was born.  It wasn't even HER book, but the dog and pony show has to have everyone present and accounted for.

 

[snip]

 

Jim Bob and Michelle don't seem to respect the fact that Josh, Jill, and Jessa have their OWN families now.  They can't let go.

Edited April 22, 2015 by Rhondinella
off topic

[JoanArc]

 

The Duggar's use medicine.

There's a big difference between having your c-section stitched up and seeing a psychotherapist. Medicine, education, nd the outside world are the absolute last resort for when shit gets too real.

 

 

And I truly do not think they would hesitate to find a Christian psych doc to prescribe meds if Jill was suffering.

Where, in their belief system, is there room for unhappiness or discord? Everything is prayed away. They've gotten lucky that no one has any mental health issues that can't be hidden easily (schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, etc). They might go for meds, but therapy, no way. Look a poor Josie with being a micropreemie (no EI therapy - it would've been apparent), the seizure, and the kids with 'learning disabilities' - nobody gets he help they need.

 

Though I would put the odd of Michelle taking every psychotropic known to man at 25%.

[hlemommy]

Ehh.. As of now jill and baby precious baby are old news

[graefin]

They've gotten lucky that no one has any mental health issues that can't be hidden easily

I would argue that Michelle isn't doing a very good job of hiding hers. ;)

[3girlsforus]

It seems so much has changed since I had my kids. My Doctor told me to get the kids out of the house as sonn as possible, that it builds up their immunity. Of course that does not mean hanging around sick people. My son was born while they were trying to discharge me. Two contractions is all it took. Two days later I took the kids grocery shopping. After all it was going to snow and I had kids to feed. I felt guilty but my Dr reassured me and he said "they are babies, not fine china as long as you don't drop them on their heads you will be fine." He was well-respected in the community.

I find it interesting how birthing/aftercare styles come and go with time.

 

I think there is a pretty big difference between going to the grocery store, running errands, even going out to dinner etc and going to a conferences with a bunch of people who are going to want to pass the baby around. I was out and around with at 3 day old baby but I would not have gone to an event like this.  But I sway the other way as well in this case because I really am worried about Jill and the potential for PPD. She seems to need to be with her extended family and to be part of the "action" so I think staying home may have increased the chance for PPD. And as GEML said, when the trip was planned he was going to be several weeks older. If she's dealing with any PPD, which can also cause resentment toward the baby, having to cancel because of his late arrival and required c-section could just exacerbate that resentment. Sure to us that sounds crazy. Who could resent a baby? But that's what PPD will do to a woman and even she doesn't understand why. 

[msblossom]

Who said Jill has PPD?

That's a pretty weighty diagnosis to throw around and I think quite unfair.

The speculation on these boards runs rampant...

I think there is a pretty big difference between going to the grocery store, running errands, even going out to dinner etc and going to a conferences with a bunch of people who are going to want to pass the baby around. I was out and around with at 3 day old baby but I would not have gone to an event like this.  But I sway the other way as well in this case because I really am worried about Jill and the potential for PPD. She seems to need to be with her extended family and to be part of the "action" so I think staying home may have increased the chance for PPD. And as GEML said, when the trip was planned he was going to be several weeks older. If she's dealing with any PPD, which can also cause resentment toward the baby, having to cancel because of his late arrival and required c-section could just exacerbate that resentment. Sure to us that sounds crazy. Who could resent a baby? But that's what PPD will do to a woman and even she doesn't understand why.

This is all conjecture where Jill is concerned.

[satrunrose]

 

Pride is a deadly sin, and in her line of somewhat disjointed thinking, she may choose to use another word instead.

Oddly, the pride comment is the part of the whole thing that is still making me irrationally annoyed. I get that Mechelle probably sees pride as a sin, so that isn't a word she uses a lot. My problem is that if she doesn't use it a lot, this is when she does? In a situation that was largely out of Jill's control, and the parts she could control were one set of bad decisions after the other? I know that a woman's only value is in the baby birthing for this screwed up gang, but to see it put so clearly is just heartbreaking.

[GEML]

No one had said that she has it, only that she is, statistically, at higher risk for it. And because of that, I'm going to give her the benefit of the doubt and not criticize her for going to the conference because I actually think it might help her fro getting it.

I'm actually NOT someone who thinks a woman gives up everything about her life the moment a baby is born or she gets married. To me, that's Fundy thinking 101. The woman's decisions matter as much as they ever did.

Doesn't mean I think what Jill and Derick are doing is smart, just that no matter what they do, they will be criticized. If they go, it's stupid. If they stay home, it's being clingy and trying for number 2.

That's what we're here for, after all! :)

[msblossom]

No one had said that she has it, only that she is, statistically, at higher risk for it. And because of that, I'm going to give her the benefit of the doubt and not criticize her for going to the conference because I actually think it might help her fro getting it.

I'm actually NOT someone who thinks a woman gives up everything about her life the moment a baby is born or she gets married. To me, that's Fundy thinking 101. The woman's decisions matter as much as they ever did.

Doesn't mean I think what Jill and Derick are doing is smart, just that no matter what they do, they will be criticized. If they go, it's stupid. If they stay home, it's being clingy and trying for number 2.

That's what we're here for, after all! :)

I don't agree and I think that speculating that she has PPD is really reaching. We have no indication that she's struggling with that and I'm uncomfortable labeling anyone with a mental health disorder, regardless of risk factor.

I think Jill is clingy and hates to sit at home while the family whoops it up in Big Sandy. Nevertheless, imo, it's irresponsible to drag a newborn that's had a very traumatic beginning to a homeschool conference exposing him to God-knows-what so that Jill can get out socially. YMMV.

[GEML]

Ok, but see, I think saying she's susceptible to PPD isn't any more or less rude than calling her clingy, which I'm not convinced that she is. But that's me. :)

[Wellfleet]

Interesting to read the "Does she or will she have PPD?" comments. In the end, I think there's only one thing we'll ever know for sure about that. That we'll never know for certain - either way. TLC will never show any indication, or anything done to help her if she was misfortunate enough to get it. Boob will never "give permission."

Edited April 21, 2015 by Wellfleet

[Ljohnson1987]

Jill and Derick's fame is more important than Iz. Just like J'Chelle's need to speak about a store selling liquor was more important than her micro preemie in the NICU. Not knowing if the baby would live or die. These people are ridiculous.

[DangerousMinds]

I wish that they would actually learn something useful about homeschooling, since they insist on attending these conferences. But I hold out NO hope for that.

[Ljohnson1987]

What the Duggars call home schooling is just religious BS. They have no education to get them past College Minus.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

I wish that they would actually learn something useful about homeschooling, since they insist on attending these conferences. But I hold out NO hope for that.

 

I hope they cover cities and countries on this journey.....LOL

[DangerousMinds]

Their attendance in Texas signals that Derick now owes his allegiance to the dark side. His co-workers at Wal-Mart must be thrilled to see him using his paternity leave, the time when one parent helps the other new parent with their infant, to travel with his wife and newborn to a Gothard all hands shindig. It's not like that same event isn't taking place next year. And what's so important that they have to be there in the first place? Poor little Izzy. 2 weeks old, and being exposed to hard core Gothardism. He must be crying his little eyes out.

Looking at the faces in the big family photo, it's pretty telling that no one is smiling and most look downright miserable. While other kids are getting a real education, playing on sports teams, hanging with friends of diverse religious backgrounds, listening to music, reading books, watching a Disney channel show, the Duggar offspring are stuck at Big Sandy. I'd be miserable too.

Well, at next year's conference Jill may have yet another infant, so it's all just going to get more difficult. So has Derick turned Gothard?

[EarlGreyTea]

I wish that they would actually learn something useful about homeschooling, since they insist on attending these conferences. But I hold out NO hope for that.

 

I bet it's more socialization for them than actual learning (there's stark evidence to show they are bad at homeschooling so they're not fooling anyone there). You're stuck with the same 18 other kids for most of the year, so this is kind of like going to the workplace/school in terms of being able to catch up with your friends. I'd definitely need some socializing with people not biologically related to me. Although I too am puzzled at Jill going. I wonder if Derick will take more time off work to do it?

 

And they're treated like gods there, most likely. If Jill is feeling crappy about having to do a c-section, she'll get a lot of people there to reinforce her decision. 

Edited April 21, 2015 by EarlGreyTea

[Foghorn Leghorn]

And because of that, I'm going to give her the benefit of the doubt and not criticize her for going to the conference because I actually think it might help her fro getting it.

I'm actually NOT someone who thinks a woman gives up everything about her life the moment a baby is born or she gets married. To me, that's Fundy thinking 101. The woman's decisions matter as much as they ever did.

Doesn't mean I think what Jill and Derick are doing is smart, just that no matter what they do, they will be criticized. If they go, it's stupid. If they stay home, it's being clingy and trying for number 2.

That's what we're here for, after all! :)

 

I have no idea how an unnecessary trip will help her avoid PPD.  And criticize her/them for staying home to heal and adjust to their new life? No it would be what most would expect and do themselves if in that situation.  Clingy does not come to mind nor does trying for number 2 because it physically isn't the right time anyway.  

Edited April 21, 2015 by Foghorn Leghorn

[DangerousMinds]

Someone mentioned Pertussis, and it is very common now and babies have died. But I think it's the adults and others around the baby who must be vaccinated in order to avoid passing it on to the infant. So it does seem to me like a bad idea to take a newborn to a conference.

[hlemommy]

Interesting to read the "Does she or will she have PPD?" comments. In the end, I think there's only one thing we'll ever know for sure about that. That we'll never know for certain - either way. TLC will never show any indication, or anything done to help her if she was misfortunate enough to get it. Boob will never "give permission."

Boob doesn't have to give permissions I don't think. I could be wrong but the kids over 18 had to sign a contract, they get paid differently from boob and mechelle. They are legal adults who can decide for themselves what they want shown and what not. Am I wrong?

[msblossom]

Ok, but see, I think saying she's susceptible to PPD isn't any more or less rude than calling her clingy, which I'm not convinced that she is. But that's me. :)

I said I'm uncomfortable with anyone making an assumption that someone struggles with a mental health issue based on risk factors. And imo, it's a little different than calling someone clingy. Apples and oranges.

[cereality]

They have lost their minds. She had a major surgery 10 days prior -- likely is still recovering from the surgery and bleeding all over the place -- and thinks it's a good idea to take herself and her unvaccinated child to a conference that will attract 1000s of people?? I'm sorry I'm not buying the whole -- it's good for her to go because it'll stave off PPD. Give me a break. We don't know if she even has PPD, if she has it -- I'm pretty sure the treatment for it is not to travel a few states away while recovering from surgery and bring your unvaccinated kid with you at a time when there have been measles and whooping cough outbreaks.

 

And why is there a picture of Iz in the car out of his car seat? I sincerely hope they were parked and took him out and snapped a picture; rather than riding around without him being in a car seat.

 

If she is really so desperate to see all the fundie families and show off the baby and talk about the delivery -- aren't there going to be other chances? Didn't Michaela Bates just get engaged? Chances are they'll be married this summer/fall -- so she can crash the Bates' party in a few months and show off the baby and fellowship with people then. I blame Derick as much as Jill. I'm sorry but is he so taken by his wife, that he can't say -- honey I know we planned on going to this conference but that's when we thought we'd have a one month old; I'm not sure it's a good idea to go 2 weeks after major surgery!?

[msblossom]

^^^Thank you.

Common sense does not prevail with this bunch.

[GEML]

Reasons Jill is statistically higher for PPD;

I think her mother had it so there is a genetic history (granted, this too is subjective, but bulimia and the laundry room incident, and her own admission that she used to scream at her children - thus the baby voice - bolster at least some history of depression)

She fell in love, married and had a baby quickly - that's a double hormonal rush flooding the brain biochemically.

Her birth experience was a very difficult one - no matter what we think, it was difficult.

She may - I stress MAY - feel shame for how that birth experience went.

There are unresolved issues with her own mother. This is a young woman becoming a mother who does not have a close relationship with her own and obviously longs for one.

She lives in a patriarchal world where negative feelings are considered a personal reflection on the family unit. She has been taught to smile even when she feels sad, for instance. Thus, she doesn't even have facial cues for dealing with bad emotions, let alone the language capabilities.

She comes from a culture where illnesses, even physical ones, are seen as spiritual as much as physical.

In all of those endless pages to of print, she said almost nothing about her baby.

Even a couple of the first combined with the last made me raise my eyebrows.

[Chai]

Somehow I'm not surprised. Her baby was in a life threatening highly traumatized state less than 2 weeks ago where she spent more than 70 hours trying to deliver and had an emergency c-section and now she's schlepping the newborn to Texas? This makes me angry, that girl has no common sense does she? My God, what sympathy I had for that bird-brained girl has gone out the window. There will be more homeschool conferences and weddings where you can catch up with your freakin fundie friends and show your baby off to in the future. What an idiot.

I agree with everything you said. I also am very angry at the stupidity of this. They are now the new parents to this baby and they have to learn to say NO when need be. 

[cmr2014]

Even if postpartum depression wasn't a real condition -- and, of course, it is very real and can be very serious -- Jill is on track for a serious let-down. She has literally gotten everything that she has ever wished for in life in the course of one year. Admittedly, it's a short list, but she has been taught for 20+ years that this list of "accomplishments" will guarantee her happiness. So, if she's not deliriously happy 24/7, she's got to wonder what is wrong with her.

 

Add to that, the fact that her parents have "protected" her from anything that might have helped her to develop some resilience. She never had a fight with her best friend in kindergarten, or fell off her bike, or worked hard at a sport and failed to win the big game. She never liked a boy who didn't call, or who took her best friend to the dance instead. 

 

And, of course, she has no friends. There is no one to call for advice or support, and if she did reach out to her mother, her only advice would be to "pray on it."

 

I think that Derick thought he stepped into something really good a year ago when he got handed a nice Christian girl and a television contract, but I think that the next few months could be rough sailing for them.

[SmallTownMom]

When I said the goal was a safe delivery and a healthy baby, I didn't mean to offend anyone suffering from PPD.

 

Of course, every mother wants a happy birth experience, but some people are so hung up on having things go as planned that they can't handle it when it doesn't.  To that I say, "Get a grip."

 

If somebody really does have PPD, they need to get help, and should be encouraged to do so.

[cmr2014]

 

Somehow I'm not surprised. Her baby was in a life threatening highly traumatized state less than 2 weeks ago where she spent more than 70 hours trying to deliver and had an emergency c-section and now she's schlepping the newborn to Texas? This makes me angry, that girl has no common sense does she? My God, what sympathy I had for that bird-brained girl has gone out the window. There will be more homeschool conferences and weddings where you can catch up with your freakin fundie friends and show your baby off to in the future. What an idiot.

 

I will cut her some slack on this. I agree completely that it is a stupid idea, but I don't think she really knows what else to do.

 

I think she's afraid to be alone in the house with the baby. Sure, she's taken care of a lot of babies, but they weren't hers, and there were plenty of other people to help. 

 

Also, in virtually every situation that I can recall, the grandmother (almost always the mother's mother) comes to help with the new baby for the first couple of weeks. Not only were her parents out of town for the birth, but they took off to Big Sandy when this latest "precious blessing" was a week old. Not only is J'chelle not at her daughter's house helping out, it clearly never even crossed her mind -- both of these events would have been planned well in advance, and they certainly knew Jill's due date.

 

Jill is incredibly immature and Derick is incredibly passive -- for Izzy's sake, I hope that Jill grows up and Derick grows a pair real quick,

[Chalby]

This family can stretch anything out to feel  like 2 hours any way.

What a perfect summation of Duggar 'sharing'.

[abseedee]

Question, I know that Josh and Anna had a honeymoon episode because I watched it.  I haven't watched the show for a while now but know that they are airing Blessa's and Bengermin's tonight.  Did Jill and Derick have a honeymoon episode?  I don't recall any mention of it here.

Edited April 22, 2015 by abseedee

[Seashell Lover]

How long do you think it will take Dill to upstage Jessa and announce her next Hey I am knocked up again.

[cereality]

I'm sure she feels the need to "keep sweet" -- the whole time she's at this conference; it's not like she's going to be able to say honestly to Kelly Bates or the Kellers or Paines or whichever fundie asks -- we're glad to have him, but I'm still in a lot of pain; or he's great but doesn't sleep. Hopefully she's not internalizing and thinking to herself -- what's wrong with me, this is supposed to be the time of my life. I mean -- I hope she cuts herself some slack and realizes this period is hard for everyone, and no one is blissfully happy at the physical pain/sleep deprivation of it all.

 

I agree with the poster above who says that they probably weren't raised with any resilience. I think people who are out in the world experience disappointment from a young age -- not getting admitted to their top choice college or getting admitted but not being able to go due to finances; having a friend who drops them; having to miss a sporting event they practiced for for weeks due to injury or even having to sit out a whole season of their sport etc. People are able to say -- that sucks -- and move on; and even then moving on isn't always easy and disappointment can linger for a LONG time for some people. Yet with Jill and her siblings -- they've never had a chance to be disappointed. School was run by their parents. Their "professions" were created by family friends who wouldn't dare tell them they aren't cutting it. And they never experienced any hint of heartbreak bc their daddy found and approved of their fundie husbands. So now the disappointment of how Iz's birth went in addition to maybe some disappointment that this isn't the time of her life yet -- it may take some time to get over.

[Rhondinella]

Ooookay, guys.  I just spent more than 30 minutes going through all posts from yesterday and today.  I deleted or edited a LOT of posts that were off topic. 

 

1) Just general discussion of childbirth or telling your own childbirth stories is OFF TOPIC!!! If you want to discuss that or swap C-section horror stories, head to the Small Talk thread and go to town.  This is my second time saying this, so I will now start handing out suspensions to people who can't figure this out.  

 

2) I think we should wind down the birthing discussion altogether.  It was 10 days ago, guys.  You've hashed out every possible side of her ordeal that you can (and frankly have discovered some that no one else even knew were there).  It's old news; unless you have something NEW to say (and I do mean NEW--as in, not something 14 other people have already said in different words) there's no need to keep beating that dead horse.  Plus I'm getting real tired of reading about it.  I will delete any future posts on this topic on site and possibly hand out warnings.

 

3) I have to concur with msblossom about the PPD discussion.  I know no one really specifically "diagnosed" Jill with PPD but some of the speculation comes pretty darn close, and eventually it morphs into "yeah, she probably has PPD."  Unless you're a psychologist who has specifically examined Jill (which seems unlikely) then STOP WITH THE PLAYING DOCTOR.  Thank you.

 

Yes, I'm cranky tonight.  You've been warned.

[Wellfleet]

I will cut her some slack on this. I agree completely that it is a stupid idea, but I don't think she really knows what else to do.

 

I think she's afraid to be alone in the house with the baby. Sure, she's taken care of a lot of babies, but they weren't hers, and there were plenty of other people to help. 

 

Also, in virtually every situation that I can recall, the grandmother (almost always the mother's mother) comes to help with the new baby for the first couple of weeks. Not only were her parents out of town for the birth, but they took off to Big Sandy when this latest "precious blessing" was a week old. Not only is J'chelle not at her daughter's house helping out, it clearly never even crossed her mind -- both of these events would have been planned well in advance, and they certainly knew Jill's due date.

 

Jill is incredibly immature and Derick is incredibly passive -- for Izzy's sake, I hope that Jill grows up and Derick grows a pair real quick,

 

[comment removed]

 

Oops - sorry. Just saw the warning. Wish those yellow suckers would pop up - it sure would save we posters some time and effort writing on topics that have been closed off. :>)

 

[Mod note: No problem.  I understand.  I will pass the programming suggestion on to Dave, but I have no idea if that's even possible]

Edited April 22, 2015 by Rhondinella

[WalrusGirl]

As long as it was really and truly up to Jill (and Derick, baby-wise), I'm not sure what the huge issue is with going to the conference so soon, especially since they wouldn't have flown (thinking of post-op concerns for her, not airport germs). Most of us wouldn't, but I think an inherent part of planning on tons of children is that life can't just stop every time one's born. We've at least seen that the family will take germ precautions and exposure restrictions with immunocompromised babies (Josie), so I do believe that Jill would keep Iz from crowds if medically advised to do so. On the one hand it seems ridiculous, but on the other hand I'm not just really sure how reckless it actually is.

The overlap with antivaxers and the subsequent risk of pertussis (measles has died down) seems the main risk. Even assuming the normal vaccination schedule, Izzy wouldn't have either of those shots at two weeks. But barring word of cases in their community, while it's not the call I'd make I'm neither particularly surprised nor upset that they went. And I think it's just as likely as not that, if the kid has a pediatrician or faux-pediatrician already, they know about the trip. (Odds are some doctor does, since I can see the timeline having come up due to the c-section and home IV.) They'll make far more questionable decisions for their kid than this one, and I'm not crazy about judging other parents without documented cause just because it's not what I think is best.

Statistically, the riskiest part of the trip for the baby is probably the drive between Arkansas and Texas. *shrugs* (Especially if they're part of what I think is a majority of parents who are totally unwittingly using carseats either improperly or by minimum guidelines vs the scientifically recommended ones. THAT I'll rag on them for.)

Question, I know that Josh and Anna had a honeymoon episode because I watched it. I haven't watched the show for a while now but know that they are airing Blessa's and Bengermin's tonight. Did Jill and Derick have a honeymoon episode? I don't recall any mention of it here.

I don't think so - I think we went from the wedding episode to Jessa's engagement to Jill's pregnancy, which were not accurate in order? Edited April 22, 2015 by WalrusGirl

[zenme]

Why in the world do Jill and Derrick NEED to be at a homeschooling conference right now anyway?  Unless they just want to show off the baby to their homeschooling friends, I can't imagine why the need to be there at this time.  So that they could go onstage with the rest of the Duggar clan and sing a song? By the way, they look so ridiculous, IMHO, when they do that.  They are no Von Trapp family.  If they simply MUST, maybe it should just be the Littles. 

[SpaghettiTuesdays]

Seeing Cathy with Iz is so freaking cute. I'm glad she was able to see him.

Edited April 22, 2015 by SpaghettiTuesdays