Jill, Derick & the Kids: Moving On!!

[cmr2014]

28 minutes ago, ozziemom said:

The rest of the Duggars are not interested in having their kids exposed to the evils of a public school or to anyone who doesn’t hold their same beliefs, so they will still feel superior no matter how much smarter Iz or Sam end up. 

I think that this is the case. The fact is that Spurgeon will learn some things in SOTDRT that Izzy won't learn in real school -- like "bankruptcy." Those differences will be used to "prove" that Spurgeon's home school education is superior to Izzy's. The flip side to this is that Izzy will talk about his friends at school. Izzy will talk about going to the movies with his friends. Izzy will talk about the t-ball league he is in with his friends.

And while Spurgeon will be considered to have a superior education by everyone at the TTH (bankruptcy means losing all your money because you don't love Jesus!), as time passes and Izzy learns real things like math and science, they will have more difficulty convincing themselves that real school doesn't have advantages over SOTDRT.

[MunichNark]

Oh my, i kind of watched a dullard video😱

first time ever and i did think it came across well-they seemed relaxed and not dismissive of their children for once. Going to school will be so good for all of them.

israel is going to pre-school, right?

[Genevrier]

1 hour ago, MunichNark said:

israel is going to pre-school, right?

Kindergarten, I think, which is the beginning of public grade school. First grade is the second year, confusingly, but kindergarten is the first year. It’s usually in the same building as the elementary grades (mine was K through 5, but it varies) and it’s very much part of the school system. Although it may be a half-day program. Pre-school is typically age 3 or 4, and it’s usually a private, tuition-paying program. It’s not part of required education, so public schools don’t have to offer it (except in some cases of kids with special needs), so they don’t. 
 

TL;DR Israel is starting the first year of elementary school, which is called kindergarten. Usually the kids have to be at least 5 years old.

[MunichNark]

39 minutes ago, Genevrier said:

Kindergarten, I think, which is the beginning of public grade school. First grade is the second year, confusingly, but kindergarten is the first year. It’s usually in the same building as the elementary grades (mine was K through 5, but it varies) and it’s very much part of the school system. Although it may be a half-day program. Pre-school is typically age 3 or 4, and it’s usually a private, tuition-paying program. It’s not part of required education, so public schools don’t have to offer it (except in some cases of kids with special needs), so they don’t. 
 

TL;DR Israel is starting the first year of elementary school, which is called kindergarten. Usually the kids have to be at least 5 years old.

Ah ta. That's why it's sometimes rather confusing me, when people talk about Kindergarten but expect the child to learn how to read, etc. Kindergarten here IS just that, a place for pre-school children to play, not that much is being taught there. Pre-school would be 5 year olds and typically, proper school starts at 6 or 7 with primary school. Fascinating how different school systems are.

[latetotheparty]

1 hour ago, MunichNark said:

Ah ta. That's why it's sometimes rather confusing me, when people talk about Kindergarten but expect the child to learn how to read, etc. Kindergarten here IS just that, a place for pre-school children to play, not that much is being taught there. Pre-school would be 5 year olds and typically, proper school starts at 6 or 7 with primary school. Fascinating how different school systems are.

That’s what kindergarten used to be back in my day but we don’t let kids be kids here anymore. :((((

[GeeGolly]

I hope we're not all jumping the gun here. While I think its evident that Jill has found some peace with the situation with JB, it doesn't seem any of the turmoil was her choice. If she really is in therapy and learning how to identify and feel feelings, its going to be a very bumpy road. I can't tell you how many clients struggle with wanting things to be the way they used to be, even if that way was unhealthy. Even to the point of wishing they didn't know what they know now. What complicates the situation, IMO, is that Derick's motives were about him and his ego, not about what's best for Jill.

Jill is like a foster child who was pulled from her unhealthy parents. How these kids manage depends largely on their foster home placement and their caseworker.

So when Jill is struggling at home alone on a night she knows the Duggars are having their weekly gathering, while Derick is out Grubhubbing, how does he respond? Does he say get over it? Its your dad's fault? Or does he support her and acknowledge how hard it must be? 

Its super hard for many adult children to acknowledge their parents' mistakes, even more so for enmeshed families. So while Jill is living this seemingly happy Gothard/Duggar free lifestyle she is going to need a lot of support to maintain it.

 

[hathorlive]

22 hours ago, leighdear said:

The point is not for this child to get a decent education, the point is for Deertick and his doormat to continue with the "screw you" to Michelle and Jim Bob, and their legacy of homeschooling. 

To be fair, you don't get a B.A. Degree and almost make it through law school if education isn't important to you.  Derrick clearly understands that the school of the dining room table did not do much for his wife and wants better for their kids.  Give them some credit for doing what is best for their kids.  If they want to screw with JB and Mechelle, then they can buy a flat screen TV and play Disney movies all day for the kids.  You can hate Derrick all you want but he clearly thinks education is important, he understands that the Duggar way isn't working, and he treats Jill with more respect than most of the Duggar husbands. You can dislike him for his reprehensible views but that doesn't negate what he's trying to do for his family.  Derrick and Jill may be the only ones to emerge from the post-TV era in good shape.  Small family size plus advanced degrees are good things.

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

I hope we're not all jumping the gun here. While I think its evident that Jill has found some peace with the situation with JB, it doesn't seem any of the turmoil was her choice. If she really is in therapy and learning how to identify and feel feelings, its going to be a very bumpy road. I can't tell you how many clients struggle with wanting things to be the way they used to be, even if that way was unhealthy. Even to the point of wishing they didn't know what they know now. What complicates the situation, IMO, is that Derick's motives were about him and his ego, not about what's best for Jill.

Jill is like a foster child who was pulled from her unhealthy parents. How these kids manage depends largely on their foster home placement and their caseworker.

So when Jill is struggling at home alone on a night she knows the Duggars are having their weekly gathering, while Derick is out Grubhubbing, how does he respond? Does he say get over it? Its your dad's fault? Or does he support her and acknowledge how hard it must be? 

Its super hard for many adult children to acknowledge their parents' mistakes, even more so for enmeshed families. So while Jill is living this seemingly happy Gothard/Duggar free lifestyle she is going to need a lot of support to maintain it.

 

Bears repeating. 

1 hour ago, hathorlive said:

To be fair, you don't get a B.A. Degree and almost make it through law school if education isn't important to you.  Derrick clearly understands that the school of the dining room table did not do much for his wife and wants better for their kids.  Give them some credit for doing what is best for their kids.  If they want to screw with JB and Mechelle, then they can buy a flat screen TV and play Disney movies all day for the kids.  You can hate Derrick all you want but he clearly thinks education is important, he understands that the Duggar way isn't working, and he treats Jill with more respect than most of the Duggar husbands. You can dislike him for his reprehensible views but that doesn't negate what he's trying to do for his family.  Derrick and Jill may be the only ones to emerge from the post-TV era in good shape.  Small family size plus advanced degrees are good things.

Also bears repeating. 

[Genevrier]

I suppose I started this topic by saying that Jill looks happier and more natural. I  didn’t mean anything more than that. Not, Jill’s life is now perfect, and certainly not, Derrick is no longer an ass. It looks to me like Jill is happier and more relaxed in herself and in her marriage. Probably because of this, the kids and Derrick also seem happier. Derrick will always be an ass, and probably sometimes he’ll direct his assholery at his wife and children. Jill is still pig-ignorant, and probably sometimes that will irritate her husband and embarrass her children. But I think the children will receive good educations and be able to support themselves as adults. I think they will have happy memories of their childhood-maybe not all happy memories, but some. I think the family will be all right.

I hope they have no more children. I have a feeling, just an intuition, that there won’t be any more because something went badly wrong at Samuel’s birth. If I’m wrong and they do start popping them out again, then my prediction becomes less rosy. Jill is likely to always be a bit fragile emotionally, and I don’t think a large chaotic family would be the best situation for her. But as things are now, they seem better than I’d expected.

 

[Triple P]

9 hours ago, cmr2014 said:

And while Spurgeon will be considered to have a superior education by everyone at the TTH (bankruptcy means losing all your money because you don't love Jesus!), as time passes and Izzy learns real things like math and science, they will have more difficulty convincing themselves that real school doesn't have advantages over SOTDRT.

If nothing else, they will be convinced when Israel is the first of his generation who is able to support himself in a professional career with no reliance on Jim Bob or love offerings. 

[GeeGolly]

28 minutes ago, Triple P said:

If nothing else, they will be convinced when Israel is the first of his generation who is able to support himself in a professional career with no reliance on Jim Bob or love offerings. 

Its almost sadder for Jessa's kids and their childhood. At least Jessa was exposed to the world around her through TLC and travel. The Seewald kids' world will likely be limited to the TTH and Fundy gatherings.

Lets hope Iz and Sam have more real world experience than their cousins and their mom, even beyond what public school offers.

[Zella]

3 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Jill is like a foster child who was pulled from her unhealthy parents. How these kids manage depends largely on their foster home placement and their caseworker.

Oh that's such an apt but sad comparison. 

[hathorlive]

59 minutes ago, Triple P said:

If nothing else, they will be convinced when Israel is the first of his generation who is able to support himself in a professional career with no reliance on Jim Bob or love offerings. 

I think this is the best we can hope for any of the third generation of Duggars.   Those that will have means and education to get a "real" job will adapt and be okay when the TLC gravy train stops.  Those who have played the game and flattered JB will probably face a rough future.  I don't care how much money JB has amassed, it can't feed 49 children, grandchildren and spouses for life.

[drafan]

On 8/21/2020 at 9:40 PM, JoanArc said:

 Derreck is going to have his firstborn son become pistol Pete, come hell or High water. That boy is going to go to school one way or the other and get admitted into college.

Nothing wrong with this at all. Lots of parents have goals for their kids like this. Izzy may decide for himself whether to try for Pistol Pete or not.

And who knows...Pistol Pete may become Peaceful Pete.

Aaaaand....chiming in on Crayola Crayons.....they are NOT what they used to be. They're very waxy and the colors are NOT bright. No different than Roseart (probably made in the same place)....very disappointed in them. Have an older box of Crayolas and no comparison....

[farmgal4]

On 8/20/2020 at 11:19 PM, madpsych78 said:

Also, I'm kind of impressed that Sam can show one-to-one correspondence when counting. He just turned 3. 

I expect that Israel will be recruited for the school’s basketball team, at some point, because of his height.  I know that this is far in the future, but it would be great if he excels enough in a sport to be able to get a college scholarship.  I truly wish Izzy, and his family, all the best.  It makes me so happy that they’re basically giving Lolli and Pop a big ole 🖕🏻.

[MonicaM]

Ironically, down the road, "Lollie" and "Pops" may end up benefiting from Jill and any other Duggarling who has managed to break free and live an independent life.  My parents ran their own lives very capably for many years, but as they aged, they began to rely more and more on my brother and I to help them make decisions and to carry out those decisions.  They were able to do this because they raised us to be capable, independent adults with life skills.  

Without some of their children becoming much more independent, the elder Duggar's could easily end up needing assistance, but surrounded by adult children who don't know how to do anything but wait for JB's next command.  Right now, if JB's health or finances falter, every member of his family except for Jill will be directly affected, and I don't see any of them having the maturity or skills to take over and salvage whatever can be salvaged.

 

[cmr2014]

7 minutes ago, MonicaM said:

Ironically, down the road, "Lollie" and "Pops" may end up benefiting from Jill and any other Duggarling who has managed to break free and live an independent life.  My parents ran their own lives very capably for many years, but as they aged, they began to rely more and more on my brother and I to help them make decisions and to carry out those decisions.  They were able to do this because they raised us to be capable, independent adults with life skills.  

Without some of their children becoming much more independent, the elder Duggar's could easily end up needing assistance, but surrounded by adult children who don't know how to do anything but wait for JB's next command.  Right now, if JB's health or finances falter, every member of his family except for Jill will be directly affected, and I don't see any of them having the maturity or skills to take over and salvage whatever can be salvaged.

 

I think that this is what keeps Josh going. He's waiting for the time that he can magnanimously take his parents into his home and humiliate his own father the way he say JB humiliate his dad.

[hathorlive]

1 minute ago, cmr2014 said:

I think that this is what keeps Josh going. He's waiting for the time that he can magnanimously take his parents into his home and humiliate his own father the way he say JB humiliate his dad.

I can't see Mechelle being the laundry bitch for the m kids.  I'm sure Josh has dreams of this, but JB and Mechelle are too lazy to be helpful.

[Zella]

22 minutes ago, cmr2014 said:

I think that this is what keeps Josh going. He's waiting for the time that he can magnanimously take his parents into his home and humiliate his own father the way he say JB humiliate his dad.

Like some weird fundie version of king lear. I can totally see it. 

[Nysha]

4 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Its almost sadder for Jessa's kids and their childhood. At least Jessa was exposed to the world around her through TLC and travel. The Seewald kids' world will likely be limited to the TTH and Fundy gatherings.

Lets hope Iz and Sam have more real world experience than their cousins and their mom, even beyond what public school offers.

Derick & Jill socialize with people who aren't related to them by birth or marriage, something most of the Duggars don't do. Derick seemed to have a normal American childhood and now that they're not tied to JB financially I think the boys will have about the same.

 

[Chicklet]

I don't think Josh cares about his parents at all except that they control the purse strings. As the oldest male abuser he will probably be named executor and will do what he wants. He will just lock the two of them in the bedroom and ignore them as he begins his late redemption tour of fundy-ville and starts preaching with his lovely bride by his side. And a side-piece. Or two.

 

[Scarlett45]

3 minutes ago, Chicklet said:

I don't think Josh cares about his parents at all except that they control the purse strings. As the oldest male abuser he will probably be named executor and will do what he wants. He will just lock the two of them in the bedroom and ignore them as he begins his late redemption tour of fundy-ville and starts preaching with his lovely bride by his side. And a side-piece. Or two.

 

I think Josh does have a general affection for his mother in the way many people have affection for their mothers. I could see him making sure she had a proper caregiver in her old age but other than that he will do exactly what he wants. I’m sure he likes his Mom more than he does Anna. 

[libgirl2]

2 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I think Josh does have a general affection for his mother in the way many people have affection for their mothers. I could see him making sure she had a proper caregiver in her old age but other than that he will do exactly what he wants. I’m sure he likes his Mom more than he does Anna. 

Yea, Hitler adored his mother. Not saying Josh is him but many not so good men adored their mothers.

[MonicaM]

44 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I think Josh does have a gl affection for his mother in the way many people have affection for their mothers. I could see him making sure she had a proper caregiver in her old age but other than that he will do exactly what he wants. I’m sure he likes his Mom more than he does Anna. 

I think he likes just about anyone more than he likes Anna.  I don't watch the show, but I've never seen one clip, not even from their wedding, where he seems to show the slightest bit of affection or respect for her.  Just my opinion, of course, but I think Anna needs to hope JB lives a loooong and healthy life, because without him to keep Josh under some measure of control, he may take his inheritance and hit the road.

[cmr2014]

3 hours ago, hathorlive said:

I can't see Mechelle being the laundry bitch for the m kids.  I'm sure Josh has dreams of this, but JB and Mechelle are too lazy to be helpful.

I don't think he wants to humiliate J'chelle (Anna may have her own plans). I think it's JB who will be the recipient of his magnanimity. I see more JB being pushed around in a broken office chair rather than either of them helping around the house -- no Duggars do that.

.

[Temperance]

Dan and Deena are having another baby. They have son named Jaxon. The new baby is due March 1. 

[ginger90]

 

4 pictures:

 

 

[Madtown]

4 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

 

4 pictures:

 

 

Love everything about Izzy's school pictures! I am thrilled that he is able to go(for however long that may be). I hope he has a fantastic first day and meets so many friends! Hoping Jill finds her way without him and has good quality time with Sam. I know she mentioned in the back to school video that Sam got construction paper for "school at home". This is a great time to do some home schooling(as well as she can)with Sam. There shouldn't be many distractions.
Hoping Jill does some voluteering at school(if allowed). As long as she isn't hanging there all the time like she did with Derrick at Walmart.

[GeeGolly]

Great first day of school pics. I remember those days with my kids.

Just one recommendation - put the damn sun BEHIND the subjects of the pictures.

[BigBingerBro]

23 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

put the damn sun BEHIND the subjects of the pictures

She will never learn.  

[BitterApple]

I'm happy for Izzy. I hope he has a good first day!

[BigBingerBro]

A historic day really.  Israel is the 1st Duggar offspring to actually step foot into a school.

[MonicaM]

Those pictures bring back many fond memories.  I hope Jill knows that it's normal to be happy and a little sad at the same time when sending your child off to school, particularly kindergarten.  It's an adjustment for both the parents and the child.  Hope this first week goes smoothly for everyone.

[GeeGolly]

3 minutes ago, BigBingerBro said:

A historic day really.  Israel is the 1st Duggar offspring to actually step foot into a school.

Technically the second, I believe Josh went to kindergarten.

[Minivanessa]

1 minute ago, BigBingerBro said:

A historic day really.  Israel is the 1st Duggar offspring to actually step foot into a school.

I thought that Josh as a young child went to kindergarten or even first grade? JB and Michelle weren't into the fundie/Gothard thing when they started their family. I thought Josh got some exposure to the Evil World of Public Schooling before they yanked him home and circled the wagons and started homeschooling. @GeeGolly's post just hit as I was finishing this, so good to know I wasn't imagining that, lol.

Certainly, Israel is the first Duggar descendant in a lonnnng time, to enroll in and enter a public school, and YAY!! for that. A million times.

[Absolom]

I thought Josh went to the same private, Christian school Jim Bob attended for that first year or two.

[BigBingerBro]

25 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I believe Josh went to kindergarten.

Well considering how he turned out, I think we can safely write that off like it never happened.

[Minivanessa]

5 minutes ago, Absolom said:

I thought Josh went to the same private, Christian school Jim Bob attended for that first year or two.

He may have. If so, then he wasn't exposed to the evils of public schooling after all. Probably a good thing, so he wasn't set on a path of misbehavior or anything. Heh.

[Girl in a Cardigan]

That last photo made me sad, if only because I'm scared for all the kids (and teachers and staff) in in-person school right now. But perhaps their part of AR is in the green zone and it'll be fine. But happy to see them all in masks (even if just for the photo) and praying that they stay safe because this is going to be SO GOOD for that child (and the whole family).

[GeeGolly]

11 minutes ago, Girl in a Cardigan said:

That last photo made me sad, if only because I'm scared for all the kids (and teachers and staff) in in-person school right now. But perhaps their part of AR is in the green zone and it'll be fine. But happy to see them all in masks (even if just for the photo) and praying that they stay safe because this is going to be SO GOOD for that child (and the whole family).

Their area is no longer in the red zone. Now that more kids have returned to school more data is being gathered and some of the preliminary findings are that covid positive kids carry a high viral load, meaning they can spread it easily. From what I've read, I'm not seeing any larger public school staying open for in-person learning, as I'm guessing there will be outbreaks, which not only causes the illness but puts the burden of quarantine on exposed families. But you never know!

[Tikichick]

59 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Technically the second, I believe Josh went to kindergarten.

No doubt the family is certain that's what corrupted him, that and the darned females who ruin his life. 

[crazy8s]

I have been happy for random kids I don't know before, but I have maybe never been happier for one than I am for Izzy going to school. I predict he will love it. after pandemic I hope Jill gets involved with other school parents and activities because she might also love it

[graybrown bird]

I'm happy for Israel on his first day of school. Not as important but it bothered me -- PLEASE Jill or Derrick, give that new little tree some water!  Weekly!

[Tikichick]

Despite having masks on I am surprised, and a bit discouraged, that BOTH parents AND a sibling who don't need to be there are obviously in the school building.  I want all schools to be able to remain in session, but I really don't need anything upsetting the applecart of Israel's (and no doubt Sam's) educational future.

[Dimi1]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

Their area is no longer in the red zone. Now that more kids have returned to school more data is being gathered and some of the preliminary findings are that covid positive kids carry a high viral load, meaning they can spread it easily. From what I've read, I'm not seeing any larger public school staying open for in-person learning, as I'm guessing there will be outbreaks, which not only causes the illness but puts the burden of quarantine on exposed families. But you never know!

yes...just saw on the news more and more people have the antibodies (herd immunity)...the people without antibodies are the healthcare workers...I am a get back to school kind of person...I have talked to TOO TOO many people in the know locally that tell me the suicide rate is up for kids 8-14 and the child abuse rate is down..yet when it is reported it is being reported from the ER and its bad...so yeah! for going back to school....and of course if there are some who are high risk , stay home and wear your mask while out and wash wash wash your hands....!!! cute pics of Izzy , he will have a blast.

[ginger90]

[Genevrier]

5 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

- put the damn sun BEHIND the subjects of the pictures.

“Um, how do I move the sun?“

      —Jill, probably.

 

[Ohiopirate02]

3 hours ago, Tikichick said:

Despite having masks on I am surprised, and a bit discouraged, that BOTH parents AND a sibling who don't need to be there are obviously in the school building.  I want all schools to be able to remain in session, but I really don't need anything upsetting the applecart of Israel's (and no doubt Sam's) educational future.

My neice started kindergarten last week, and the pictures my sister posted were all taken outside.   It looked like no parents were allowed in the building. 

[SMama]

On 8/20/2020 at 3:42 PM, Sew Sumi said:

Looks like he's going to in-person learning. As Jill said, we'll see how long that lasts.

I must have missed that on the video. 

[ginger90]

Jill has a bunch of videos in her stories, modeling clothing from Amy’s store, followed by this: