S08.E15: All Bets Are Off

[Beden]

2 hours ago, Sai said:

Totally agree.  Neither does being super rich, having Mommy issues, bleeding through every orifice of your body, going through the worst divorce in history....etc.  She truly is a raging asshole and uses every exaggerated excuse she can come up with to justify her nastiness.

And what I find interesting is that she feels the need to justify it--if she's that aware of it, obviously knows she's being criticized for it (hence the need to justify it), then frigging stop. And no, I don't care how many reasons or excuses she has; she's an obnoxious, entitled, alienating  bitch.

[Primetimer]

Remember when Bethenny used to be a likable everywoman? Neither do I.

View the full article

[SparkleznConfetti]

17 minutes ago, Cherrio said:

I loved that too !       So true too.     It is also 8 carats of fake.

Maybe thats the same canary "fugazy" that Joe passed off to Tree-sa :-D 

[ScoobieDoobs]

Bethenny's excuse for mocking Jules' ED was so fuckin' lame.  Actually, it makes me really angry.  Why?  Because it was such an outright lie.  Oh sure, I believe her when she says she's sensitive about ED's because she grew up with them.  But she's implying the ED's were only her mother's.  You're lying to us here, Bethenny!!!!!  Come clean, hun.

You are being such a vile disgusting asshole to Jules because of your own ED's, Bethenny.  Come on, Bethenny, who do you think you're fooling here?  No wonder Bernadette wants nothing to do with her.  She's 45 & still blaming shit & crap on her.  Ugh, she's just so vile.

And btw, Bethenny, having had ED's is absolutely no excuse for mocking anyone who suffers from them.  It just makes you a completely & totally cruel, insensitive, thoughtless, nasty, vile asshole for doing so.

[Yours Truly]

11 hours ago, WireWrap said:

Then Bethenny should have told Jules this when they first talked about Jules/ED. Instead, Bethenny has treated Jules like she has some crazy disease that is extremely contagious and fears she will catch it.  

Exactly!

Just because there may be good reasons behind Beth's discomfort around Jules doesn't mean she gets a pass for behaving extremely hurtful and tactlessly. It's called adulting. Beth "protects" herself at ALL COSTS even when it's unnecessary to take it to that extreme. It's like all that matters is that BETH'S okay. Even if that means fuck the person who is actually relapsing and facing a very serious medical condition. But yeah, lets make sure the special snowflake doesn't melt. That's the priority here, of course.

[RHJunkie]

47 minutes ago, archer1267 said:

LuAnn is competitive. I'm sure she sees this as a victory rather than a red flag. Also, I watched her Bravo TV special. She basically ran off with the Count while she was living with a boyfriend in Italy. (The boyfriend was out of town at the time.) I think LuAnn just goes for what she wants when she wants it - the pirate is a good example. She had Jacques at home and the cameras were rolling, but she wanted Tomas, propriety be damned!

LuAnn seems like she would be a very confident partner. So she probably isn't bothered by Tom's past because she feels that she's the woman that's converted him into a monogamous, family seeking man. Maybe she has but if that's her thought, she is not the first, nor will she be the last woman to think that she had such powers over a man.

[KFC]

5 minutes ago, RHJunkie said:

LuAnn seems like she would be a very confident partner. So she probably isn't bothered by Tom's past because she feels that she's the woman that's converted him into a monogamous, family seeking man. Maybe she has but if that's her thought, she is not the first, nor will she be the last woman to think that she had such powers over a man.

Or maybe she's not bothered by Tom because birds of a feather and all, and they've already got an open arrangement in place.

[MerryMary]

I thought Ramona gave Luanne really good advice about not having experienced bad times with Tom yet.  Of course, Lu didn't listen and won't listen. Between everyone knowing Tom and Rocco, NYC feels like a very small place.  I was embarrassed for Sonya's interns.  Are they getting paid?  I hope so otherwise they're just being exploited.  I'm sure none of these girls went to college to learn how to open a security door or wrap care packages.

Good for Jules going hard at Bethenny.  It's about time someone did.  

Next week they're going to a casino?  Sheesh, that's what I do for fun.  Where's the wish fulfillment?  Luxury living?  Habits of the 1%?  This season is slumming.

[KFC]

3 minutes ago, MerryMary said:

Good for Jules going hard at Bethenny.  It's about time someone did.  

I just keep thinking, "why oh why does it have to be Jules?"

Even Kristen was more articulate and less flustered when dealing with Bethenny than Jules has been.

[Yours Truly]

11 hours ago, smores said:

I think Bethenny did explain that she had a history and knowledge of eating disorders to Jules because of her mother when they first had the private conversation about it.  That conversation seemed to go pretty well, they each came away with an understanding of the other one, and for the most part, I don't really remember Bethenny bringing that subject up again until Jules went and baked silverware into the calzone so she could avoid having to eat it.  And, that's really not a joke, that's some messed up eating behavior.  

I do think they got off track a bit during the "I need a verb" conversation, but, Jules was (in retrospect) likely kind of melting down due to the stress in her personal life and on some pretty heavy duty pain killers.  She was on word safari, and going in circles and no one could understand what she was trying to say.  Bethenny was also experiencing a health issue and in pain, so probably was a bit sharper than she might have been under normal circumstances, and it ended badly for both of them.  

But, here's where I have an issue with Jules.  She has my total sympathy for her marriage issues, and also with her eating disorder struggles.  My issue comes when someone has some sort of disorder/situation that basically requires everyone else around them to pretend that something isn't happening or everything is normal when there is obviously a major health problem going on, and then any time that health problem is broached, those who mention it are accused of not "being supportive"  I'm not saying they should monitor her eating, but baking flatware into food can't be ignored.  Mentioning it doesn't make them "not supportive" of her.  

So by this logic a person fighting cancer can't expect to be in a social setting without others tittering about, or outright expressing their concern about the health battle the person is fighting. A cancer patient can't expect to get through an evening where others won't  pepper them with awkwardness and concern for the health issue if gasp the cancer patient wants to continue life with a "business as usual" attitude. Even if they have an episode of nausea and has to excuse themselves for a few minutes while composing themselves? I think this whole, blaming the patient for the awkwardness of those around them and acting as if it's a rude imposition on others is truly disgusting. There's nothing wrong with trying to get through your days as normally as possible and nothing wrong with expecting people around you to be tactful and supportive adults who don't find the need to trump your challenges by, and this is the disgusting kicker, by being INSULTED at the idea that they buck up and oh I don't know NOT highlight an already somber circumstance. Do we really have a society where someone's awkward sensitivity of illness is to be catered to more than a person fighting something real? Something life threatening? I am so sick of it being way more important that a relatively healthy person not be inconvienence with such troubling details of anothers ailments because it strikes a fucking nerve than the feelings of the person who is actually in the middle of handling a health issue. The IMMEDIATE health risks are always what trumps all other "woe is me" secondary (mental) health issue triggers. It's amazing how someone's DISCOMFORT is somehow more valid on these shows than the person actually fighting a REAL and PRESENT and CURRENT medical problem. This pissing contest gets on my fucking nerves cause it's so damn insulting.

[Muffyn]

Taking a beat to thoroughly enjoy this description of Adam from the recap:

Quote

Arugula on top of baked cauliflower isn't pizza, you walking vape pen.

Brilliant!

[Booger666]

This is the first episode where I actually liked Jules. I thought she was spot on calling out Bethany for being mean to most of the girls.

Jules has an actual eating disorder and Bethany thinks her 30+ year old baggage about someone else's eating disorder is more important?!  Good grief, Bethany! Get over yourself!

[WireWrap]

17 minutes ago, MerryMary said:

 

Next week they're going to a casino?  Sheesh, that's what I do for fun.  Where's the wish fulfillment?  Luxury living?  Habits of the 1%?  This season is slumming.

I suspect the reason there is no big OTT trip this season is because Bethenny wouldn't/couldn't go because of her fibroid problem so they have these short trips and the Miami trip (no Bethenny in Miami).

[Yours Truly]

4 hours ago, Atwood said:

I can barely believe it, but Ramona is making so much sense to me. I can actually kind of see the person who raised what at least appears to be a very well adjusted young lady. LuAnn's certainty about Tom isn't about a real person, it's about the person she's made up from the scraps of him she knows. Maybe they really are soul mates, and maybe she will end up liking him that much once she actually knows him that well. But if you haven't seen someone have a bad day, or had a crappy vacation with them, you don't know if you're compatible enough to happily spend the rest of your days together.

Also, Jules is driving me crazy. You're not in any kind of stable in recovery if you threw up three days ago. Just because she's managed to find some strategies that keep her weight in the merely medically underweight category (and yes, I can see that she's clinically underweight. She has no body fat AND her muscles are half atrophied. Unless her bones have twice the density of normal bones, it's impossible for her to have a bmi over 18,5.) rather than so severely underweight that she's acutely risks death, doesn't mean that she's not smack dab in the middle of her illness. If she used to restrict her calories to 300 per day and is now up to 900, that doesn't make her well. 

She's delusional if she thinks that people won't talk about how she avoids eating pizza by baking utensils into it. Also, she "loves her bones!" I know  Carol isn't popular right now, but "oh Jesus" was what I said at the exact same time (Jinx!).

But damn. She's working the problem. What the hell else is she supposed to do? I don't get this criticism like Jules is fucked up for not being completely healthy and cured. And so when she's experiencing a rough patch she's supposed to be A OK with others being disgusted by her troubled behavior? Someone in the midst of fighting their disease should just have to suck up others tactless and hurtful responses to her obvious struggle. What world is that from? Oh yeah, that's right Bethenny's world.

[teapot]

12 hours ago, smores said:

 

I do think they got off track a bit during the "I need a verb" conversation, but, Jules was (in retrospect) likely kind of melting down due to the stress in her personal life and on some pretty heavy duty pain killers.  She was on word safari, and going in circles and no one could understand what she was trying to say.  Bethenny was also experiencing a health issue and in pain, so probably was a bit sharper than she might have been under normal circumstances, and it ended badly for both of them.  

 

This reminds me of my husband.  He sometimes ventures into Homer Simpson territory, going, "I need to get that thing for that guy..."

and I'm like "FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, MAN,  USE NOUNS!"

 

so I can't hate BetheME for that (but I can hate her for a whole lot of other reasons...)

[ScoobieDoobs]

OK, maybe Jules wasn't the best person to point out what a monster Bethenny is.  But other than Lu, she's all we got.  Moaner sure as fuck ain't gonna do it now.  We'll be seeing NO repeats of Moaner talking to Bethenny like she did on the bridge all those years ago.  Nope, Moaner is now living in Bethenny's crowded asshole.  Nah, she's way too fearful of getting kicked off the show, to say ANYTHING negative about her or to her.

Hey, I for one applaud Jules for her courage in speaking up for herself & pointing out what a vile pig Bethenny has been to her.  Maybe it sounds stupid, because it's not like she's saving lives or fighting wars, but this was courageous nonetheless of her to do.  She didn't know what Bethenny would do to her in return.   To me, Bethenny is now capable of anything -- anything evil, horrible & awful.  Idk, she could have thrown a glass at Jules (or is that only Moaner's style?) or physically attacked her.  I was surprised she didn't.

At a minimum, Jules risked being tossed off the show for daring to speak against Bethenny & her reign of cruelty & terror.  Also, at the barest minimum, I was just really glad she was able to get out that Bethenny's nasty vicious sense of humor is ALWAYS at someone else's expense.  OK, she was blathering & nervous when she said this, but at least someone said it -- FINALLY!!!!

Edited July 14, 2016 by ScoobieDoobs

[Yours Truly]

4 hours ago, ryebread said:

or D) Just ignore her and pretend you've never met her before. 

Like Kelly did.  And we KNOW that damn near drove Bethenny crazy.

I've always been a Kelly supporter but this is one of the reasons I really did like Kelly. She expressed it after the fact somewhere that she just didn't get good vibes from Beth each time they were in the same company which is why she was never very interested in prolonging her hellos whenever she did see her at an event. Hell I've seen a few people multiple times at gatherings but still wouldn't be able to remember their names since we never continued a friendship outside of seeing them at a friend of a friends party a few times a year. The fact that Beth EXPECTED Kelly to remember her speaks more about our Beth than it did about Kelly. It's funny but I truly feel a part of her issue with Lu is that she see's Lu as someone who wasn't very impressed with Beth either and Beth can't have that. Beth has framed both situations as if they felt they were so much more important than Beth that they didn't care to remember who she was but shit. I don't remember people either who don't matter to my life directly. WHO DOES? It's Beth's anger that people didn't view her as a celebrity that had her throwing shade. That narcissism is dripping all over her.

[Neurochick]

1 hour ago, archer1267 said:

LuAnn is competitive. I'm sure she sees this as a victory rather than a red flag. Also, I watched her Bravo TV special. She basically ran off with the Count while she was living with a boyfriend in Italy. (The boyfriend was out of town at the time.) I think LuAnn just goes for what she wants when she wants it - the pirate is a good example. She had Jacques at home and the cameras were rolling, but she wanted Tomas, propriety be damned!

LuAnn puts herself first and goes after who and what she wants; qualities that are admired in men IMO.  If a woman dares to put herself before anybody else, she's looked down on.  I'm not saying that I agree with LuAnn, but if she were a man, other men would probably say, "atta boy, you go for what you want, don't let anybody stand in your way."

[Mondrianyone]

14 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

I feel like Bethenny only reconciled with Sonja because she could do it in front of Jules and demonstrate that she, Bethenny, is nice. It was a complete power play.

This, 100%.  Anything else would've required at least a subatomic particle of empathy somewhere in Bethenny, and there's no evidence of that.  Maybe she bled the last one out.

Also, from where I'm reporting, the Department of Almost Totally Irrelevant Pedantry, Grammar Subdivision, Bethenny who knows it all apparently doesn't know from parts of speech.  While she was viciously hammering at Jules with the "I need a verb, I need a verb" command, Jules had already given her three verbs, several times:  "I'm gonna do . . . I'm gonna do . . ."  That's "I am going to do."  What she needed was a noun.  "I'm gonna do yoga, I'm gonna do my nails, I'm gonna do damage to your nasty ass if you don't stop hectoring me for a verb, you ignorant twat." 

[ScoobieDoobs]

Bethenny's horribleness to Jules is a definite reminder (to me) of how awful she was to Kelly -- right from the very second she started on the show.  And it's also a reminder that much of what Kelly was babbling about Bethenny on Scary Island was dead on correct.  The prob was she was also babbling some really incoherent shit too -- so her message got totally lost in the sauce.

It's also a reminder to me how Bethenny zeroes in on people she thinks she can easily crush -- like Kelly, and now Jules.  Oh sure, Bethenny will pretty much direct her horribleness to anyone near her.  But the ones she assumes are easy to crush (like Jules & Kells) are merely low hanging fruit for the monster that is Bethenny to obliterate & destroy.  

Thanks a fuckin' lot, Satan Andy, for killing this show for me & handing it over to this hateful monster woman.

[OhGromit]

3 hours ago, njbchlover said:

I agree with you, Scoobie - especially what I have bolded.

Bethenny may think that her sense of humor revolves around laughter, but what she fails to recognize is that her her humor and laughter is almost always at someone else's expense.  She is a very poor, very mean imitation of Joan Rivers (RIP).  Joan was the Queen of biting, sarcastic humor at someone else's expense, especially during her tenure on Fashion Police, but I don't recall her ever going as low as Bethenny can go.  I used to chuckle at Joan's comments- Bethenny's usually just make me cringe for the other person.  Unlike Joan, Bethenny may start out with humorous comments, but then, when she doesn't get the response she is hoping for, she devolves into an insulting, loud shrew.

I wonder if Bethenny's head exploded off her body when she read Jules' blog?  

Thing about Joan Rivers was, she joked about herself and was as mean about herself as she was to anyone else.  

[beaker73]

14 hours ago, Neeners said:

Jules's blog is Everything. EVERYTHING. http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-new-york-city/season-8/blogs/julianne-wainstein-we-are-on-planet-bethenny. It's so good I want to quote the entire thing, but will refrain. Here's a snippet to whet your appetite:

Today they were filming the reunion, and if she brought just 1/10th of what she can deliver in her blog posts, and especially this one, it's gonna be *good*.

AMAZING!!  I especially liked this part:

"I also learned that on planet Bethenny, anything can be reversed at any given moment - pure hatred and animosity like what Bethenny displayed towards Sonja just a few weeks prior can be turned into feelings of affection and admiration on a dime. Nothing actually changed between the time that Bethenny unleashed her fury on Sonja and the Mohegan Sun bus ride — Sonja didn't change her course of action or behaviors — yet for some reason Bethenny went from, "I don't accept your apology and I never want to see your face again" to "I really miss you" in an instant. Could it be to make sure I was as uncomfortable and alienated on that bus and trip as possible? Common sense or paranoia? I guess that depends on what planet you live on."

Re: the bolded part - She nailed it!

[Yours Truly]

21 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

LuAnn puts herself first and goes after who and what she wants; qualities that are admired in men IMO.  If a woman dares to put herself before anybody else, she's looked down on.  I'm not saying that I agree with LuAnn, but if she were a man, other men would probably say, "atta boy, you go for what you want, don't let anybody stand in your way."

True.

I get that it doesn't look good but as I too get older and am still single with a lot of relationship woes behind me I find it very tiresome to continue living by this strict guidelines of romance. It sounds to me that they were both dating. Dating means non exclusive so even if Tom was dating this woman for a while it's pretty clear they weren't in an exclusive relationship was most likely dating others at the same time which is something she would have surely known about. Lu traipsing off with Tom that same night, yeah I can't help my girl on that one but at the same time I can't really care all that much. I've been so disillusioned about commitment and til death do us part I can't really get up in arms about dating world infractions. Ehhh, it's not all that serious. It seems to me that Lu being in the same boat as Tom understands that playing the field means anything goes and anyone participating in their dating circle understands the loose parameters of their pairing until an official commitment is made. Otherwise all bets are off and it's every (wo)man for themselves. I hate to sound so callus about it but it rings true to me and kinda fit what I'm used to. When you get older and you're still on the scene some of us just throw caution to the wind don't really impose to much of the traditional junk towards the dating scene until there's a REALLY STRONG reason to convert back to a more traditional, committed relationship.

I'm really not trying to defend Lu I'm just pointing out that the seriousness of the whole concept loses steam after awhile and after a lifetime of romantic experiences. Magical and beautiful aren't automatic go to's like when you were in you 20's therefore creating the need to immediately impose and follow all the rules right from jump because that walk down the aisle is the goal. As you get older you realize dating is supposed to be about finding out whether or not you want to pursue something serious not just assume seriousness right away then shoehorn yourself into those parameters. Dating in your 40's keeps you optimistically detached until there's something of significance to shift gears. So I believe Lu when she says it's serious with Tom because considering the mode they were both in when they met it usually takes something much more different than the same ole same ole wham bam thank yous that they've been experiencing during their singles tour.

Edited July 14, 2016 by Yours Truly

[RHJunkie]

1 hour ago, KFC said:

Or maybe she's not bothered by Tom because birds of a feather and all, and they've already got an open arrangement in place.

Yeah, that could be one possibility as well.

[UsernameFatigue]

2 hours ago, archer1267 said:

LuAnn is competitive. I'm sure she sees this as a victory rather than a red flag. Also, I watched her Bravo TV special. She basically ran off with the Count while she was living with a boyfriend in Italy. (The boyfriend was out of town at the time.) I think LuAnn just goes for what she wants when she wants it - the pirate is a good example. She had Jacques at home and the cameras were rolling, but she wanted Tomas, propriety be damned!

This is what makes LuAnn's whole pearl clutching storyline of last year - that Carole stole Adam from her niece when in fact they were not even dating any longer - so funny. I have not one doubt that if it had been a friend of LuAnn's having dinner with Tom at the Mark when LuAnn met up with him - even Ramona - LuAnn would not have given a second thought to going home with Tom. She did it to Sonya with Harry. And though some have said they were with other people who left with the two of them at the same time I remember just LuAnn and Harry getting into the cab. She could just as easily have fallen for Harry that night. Harry dodged a bullet. 

[RHJunkie]

3 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

True.

I get that it doesn't look good but as I too get older and am still single with a lot of relationship woes behind me I find it very tiresome to continue living by this strict guidelines of romance. It sounds to me that they were both dating. Dating means non exclusive so even if Tom was dating this woman for a while it's pretty clear they weren't in an exclusive relationship. Lu traipsing off with Tom that same night, yeah I can't help my girl on that one but at the same time I can't really care all that much. I've been so disillusioned about commitment and til death do us part I can't really get up in arms about dating world infractions. Ehhh, it's not all that serious. It seems to me that Lu being in the same boat as Tom understands that playing the field means anything goes and anyone participating in their dating circle understands the loose parameters of their pairing until an official commitment is made. Otherwise all bets are off and it's every (wo)man for themselves. I hate to sound so callus about it but it rings true to me and kinda fit what I'm used to. When you get older and you're still on the scene some of us just throw caution to the wind don't really impose to much of the traditional junk towards the dating scene until there's a REALLY STRONG reason to convert back to a more traditional, committed relationship.

I'm really not trying to defend Lu I'm just pointing out that the seriousness of the whole concept loses steam after awhile and after a lifetime of romantic experiences. Magical and beautiful aren't automatic go to's like when you were in you 20's. Dating in your 40's keeps you optimistically detached until there's something of significance to shift gears. So I believe Lu when she says it's serious with Tom because considering the mode they were both in when they met it usually takes something much more different than the same ole same ole wham bam thanks you that they've been experiencing during their singles tour.

Yeah while the optics of knowingly walking away with some other woman's date hardly looks good, I don't disagree about the general outlook of the situation. If a man or woman is dating but not in an exclusive relationship, I don't see any reason to feel bad if you meet with that person, connect with them and then choose to enter an exclusive relationship with one another.

[Yours Truly]

3 minutes ago, UsernameFatigue said:

This is what makes LuAnn's whole pearl clutching storyline of last year - that Carole stole Adam from her niece when in fact they were not even dating any longer - so funny. I have not one doubt that if it had been a friend of LuAnn's having dinner with Tom at the Mark when LuAnn met up with him - even Ramona - LuAnn would not have given a second thought to going home with Tom. She did it to Sonya with Harry. And though some have said they were with other people who left with the two of them at the same time I remember just LuAnn and Harry getting into the cab. She could just as easily have fallen for Harry that night. Harry dodged a bullet. 

It was the intimate nature of everyone involved. Also one player was her niece. I don't get how anyone wouldn't understand that logic usually doesn't flow exactly the same way when its a close loved one involved in a hurtful or awkward situation. Do people not distinguish their feelings from family vs. acquaintances?

[HunterHunted]

7 minutes ago, Mondrianyone said:

This, 100%.  Anything else would've required at least a subatomic particle of empathy somewhere in Bethenny, and there's no evidence of that.  Maybe she bled the last one out.

Also, from where I'm reporting, the Department of Almost Totally Irrelevant Pedantry, Grammar Subdivision, Bethenny who knows it all apparently doesn't know from parts of speech.  While she was viciously hammering at Jules with the "I need a verb, I need a verb" command, Jules had already given her three verbs, several times:  "I'm gonna do . . . I'm gonna do . . ."  That's "I am going to do."  What she needed was a noun.  "I'm gonna do yoga, I'm gonna do my nails, I'm gonna do damage to your nasty ass if you don't stop hectoring me for a verb, you ignorant twat." 

Bethenny's has a limited ability to be empathetic, but that's because you need to not be an unrepentant narcissist to be capable of empathy.

Bethenny has also been pulling this stage whispering bullshit. I don't recall her doing that before she left RHoNY, but she loves to pull that since she returned. She did that last season with Heather at Dorinda's party in the Berkshires and with Sonja when Sonja was babbling about her projects and connections. She's pulled that multiple times with Jules this season.

[Yours Truly]

What I see when I hear that Jules negatively impacts Beth or anyone around her with her disease and is ridiculous to expect support:

"Oh God that girl fighting cancer with her bald head and lack of eyebrows is so disturbing to look at and there she is incorporating herself in the real world like nothings wrong meanwhile it's so disturbing for me to look at since I saw my cousin go threw her battle with cancer and it was so sad I was so traumatized... Just seeing her is drudging all that up for me and she's obviously not taking care of her problem which is so distressing..  Ugggghhhh, the nerve of her making me so uncomfortable".

[walnutqueen]

Quote

Jules's blog is Everything. EVERYTHING.

Word on the street is that Jules used a ghostwriter.

[kassa]

I definitely saw Bethenny's olive branch to Sonja as a power play.  No matter how sweet her spot is guaranteed to be vis a vis production, she can't be having serious beefs with Sonja, Luann AND Jules.  Especially when Sonja and Luann are already sympathetically/real life entwined.  

By resolving the issue with Sonja, she not only drops her disputes with the other women to a mere 2/6 instead of 3/6, but she also weakens the potential Sonja/Lu dynamic operating against her.   

Plus she got to do it right in Jules' face.  The message was clear.  "Luann and I might have issues, new girl, but YOU'RE the one who's going to be moving on in a few months."

Ramona and Sonja and Dorinda have all been egging Jules on and it's giving me flashbacks to Alex getting brave and speaking her mind in her final hour on the show. 

As for Lee Radziwill, I had been thinking that was an actual twitter account and she'd gone quite savage in her old age.  She CAN'T be happy about the condition her sofa was in, and that Carole highlighted it by having the ladies sit on it (between the pulls and tears).  A couple of years ago Carole talked about it being a treasure.. now the cats/dogs must have taken a toll, and she doesn't give a hoot who knows it, including Lee.

[OhGromit]

4 hours ago, njbchlover said:

I think they will marry, and I'm betting that Luann is negotiating with Bravo to pay for film it.

My boyfriend noted the timing is perfect for it to be featured on next season of RHONY.  Coincidence?

[film noire]

1 hour ago, ScoobieDoobs said:

OK, maybe Jules wasn't the best person to point out what a monster Bethenny is.  But other than Lu, she's all we got.  

LOL.

I think you're right that Jules was risking being tossed off the show by confronting Bethenny.  I've wondered how much power Bethenny really wields, but Ramona's comment to Luann last night finally answered that for me. (Roughly  "I've tried to get you back into the good graces of Bethenny and Carole" -- to quote Carole: Jesus. As if they're all sister wives living on a compound, and Ramona is trying to patch things up between Luann, First Wife Carole and Daddy Husband Frankel.)  The pride with which Ramona offered that as proof of undying friendship made it clear that Bethenny controls the dynamics on this (now) shit show.

 

Quote

 

Edited July 14, 2016 by film noire

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

35 minutes ago, beaker73 said:

AMAZING!!  I especially liked this part:

"I also learned that on planet Bethenny, anything can be reversed at any given moment - pure hatred and animosity like what Bethenny displayed towards Sonja just a few weeks prior can be turned into feelings of affection and admiration on a dime. Nothing actually changed between the time that Bethenny unleashed her fury on Sonja and the Mohegan Sun bus ride — Sonja didn't change her course of action or behaviors — yet for some reason Bethenny went from, "I don't accept your apology and I never want to see your face again" to "I really miss you" in an instant. Could it be to make sure I was as uncomfortable and alienated on that bus and trip as possible? Common sense or paranoia? I guess that depends on what planet you live on."

Re: the bolded part - She nailed it!

Yuppers! And the other thing that changed was Bethenny was liquored up. The scenery of NYC and the Cross Bronx had changed out the window to the wider CT upper I95, sound view Old Saybrook territorry. She had the perfect storm of bully and buzz on board to orchestrate that alienation of Jules- she hadn't had enough to get to crabby and mean quite yet. 

[UsernameFatigue]

31 minutes ago, Yours Truly said:

It was the intimate nature of everyone involved. Also one player was her niece. I don't get how anyone wouldn't understand that logic usually doesn't flow exactly the same way when its a close loved one involved in a hurtful or awkward situation. Do people not distinguish their feelings from family vs. acquaintances?

Apparently LuAnn doesn't since Sonya was/is a long time friend which to me is as close or closer than family since you can't choose your family but you can choose your friends, and Sonya was a long time one.  As I recall Harry even somewhat declared his feelings for Sonya at the same party (and gave her a ring of some sort?) before LuAnn whisked him off in a limo.

[ZaldamoWilder]

15 hours ago, shoegal said:

Ramona: "If LuAnn doesn't care, then what is she so upset about?.."

LOL, LuAnn isn't doing so well with this zero fucks thing!

Singer Stinger strikes again lol! You know I never noticed this about Ramona before, but she's unflappable during a conflict.  Before or after it?  Straight up pinball but that whole time they were walking Lu is like 6 inches off the end of her nose and Ro doesn't even fast blink.  Yo, respect.

15 hours ago, Sai said:

So Jules is upset with Bethenny and she tells her how she feels and now Bethenny is done with her?  Gimme a break.  Jules was nowhere near as nasty as Bethenny was to LuAnn or all the zillions of other people she's so nasty to.  

No matter what an ass Bethenny has been in the past I always gave her a pass because I think she's super smart, she can be funny and I think her ex is a real asshole who royally screwed her.  I even buy her products  but she's really, really losing me this season.  If you're not kissing her ass and, God forbid, you have something even slightly negative to say she's done with you.  And what grade is she in that when she's upset with you she ignores you but then talks about you when you are two feet away.  Cripes!!!  Jules specifically said she doesn't like to be talked about behind her back and Bethenny is doing exactly that but in front of her, if that makes any sense, lol.  So freaking childish.  

This.  There have been times (with Sonja) I have been shouldershruggy about her going whole ham with somebody, based solely on what preceded it and how it involved her.  And time (with Lu) where I simply couldn't justify the reaction.  She was actually near tears when Jules was yelling.   @smores I totally get what you said, I *liked* your posts, I just wished you'd been in the production booth speaking into in a earpiece we couldn't see on Beth.  Because had she said this to Jules the way you said it to us?  That talk would have ended in peace-daps all around.   I get that Jules came on a show about established conflict and new/old grudges but I don't believe in being unkind to someone who hasn't been unkind to you.  I know, shame on me for applying my own standard to these heffas.  Bethenny isn't about to run out of storyline time, she doesn't need to pick at a girl who is obviously fragile, despite her protestations.  If she says anything other than I saw my behavior in these episodes and I can see that I've treated you unkindly.  With less empathy than I myself would enjoy. I'm very sorry - I can no longer be here for her in any capacity.   Mom triggers aside, that girl is pouring out her heart and hasn't done shit to you and all you know is you're being yelled at?  {{popsgum}} so?

 

14 hours ago, SnarkKitty said:

Texted 100 times...or, you know, 3. Same difference. Jules saying "I don't appreciate you portraying me as "a" stupid" made me giggle .

Dorinda, stop acting brand new. You know damned well it's not the place or the party. You keep bringing the same damned PEOPLE to these events and you know how it goes. And it won't change so quit playing. 

Ramona and Lou walking on Madison Avenue*, loved the film, it looked classic housewives. Funny they acted like they were walking but really didn't move 10 feet from the corner for all their movement during the whole conversation. Ha! *Cheap thrills to see them on my avenue. Even if it was 40+blocks away.

"When you know, you know, I'm going to my deathbed with this guy." Yeah, this will end well.

Sooo... thought DORINDA set LuAnn up with Tom, and Ramona's story was fabricated from thin air?  But now there's something to it, except Lu claims she didn't jump on the guy when he was with another girl; she merely saw him with her and he allegedly fell in love at first sight, let HER hand go, took yours, and you left with him. Because that's the kind of man you want to be with - one that would ditch someone he was dating for several months and close enough with to be holding hands while on a date to leave with another woman. Even if that woman is you. Oh Lu. You double talking, double dealing shitty version of womanhood, you. You're a lying liar who lies and makes up her own versions of shit with her own justifications that supposedly makes everything okay. 

I dunno. Every guy that ever tried to get with me even after being told I had a boyfriend/husband just made me think less of him - I would even ask "why would you even WANT me for yourself seeing how easy I go off with someone else?"

It's times like this I reflect on the wisdom of Mint Condition. "What kind of man would I be, and what kind of girl would you be, if you did the same?" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORva1mGyyJ0

Oh wait, I know. One who has clearly been working on bagging a Real Housewife for years now. Ramona was too nuts and Sonja clearly only wanted him for his ... benefits. I'm sure he picked up on Lu's absolute thirst and realized this was a closer. We'll soon see why he wanted one.

Dorinda. So shitty, you are. A liar and collaborator and kissing Bethenny's ass while stabbing Carole in the back. Why has she turned on her so suddenly after their London lovefest?

Somebody needs to look into Sonja's intern scam. Call them bitches volunteers or something.

For someone who doesn't want to talk about this ever again, Jules, ya just keep talking about it. And how exactly does Dorinda keep getting a pass when she's doing the same 2 feet away talking about Jules that Bethenny is doing? I'm ready for someone to call her out on her two-faced antics.

Ahh, liquor. While trapped on a bus. Truth serum in a situation that forces people to deal. I'm not mad at them though. Day drinking is my shit. As is forgiving people after enough cocktails.

baby teeeeease me, I don't want it if that's easy...(™Tupac Shakur)

14 hours ago, steelcitysister said:

 Can't wait. Beth is due for a smackdown.

Moaner grows increasingly twitchy with each episode. What the hell is she on?

When Rocco entered, for a brief moment I thought it was Lu's ex Alex.

It appears Sonja has engaged Moaner's MD for those massive funbags that dominate her THs. Bad teeth, dark roots, no AC in the summer but some serious implants. Ah, the life of a faded UES matron.

Sonja's way too old for him.   I did wonder if he was a European Count though.

Can somebody help me with the JPM pillowcase story though?  I heard heirloom, napkins, rings...what else? why are they so important?  If this is all she got in the settlement:

 

14 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

I can't applaud Jules' confrontation of Bethenny because Jules spent the first couple of weeks portraying herself as an incompetent nitwit and is now angry that they think she's an incompetent nitwit. If that's Jules' self deprecating humor, then it worked perfectly. Joke's on you dumbass. Additionally, the calzone thing wasn't a joke. It was fucking weird. Just say that you were loopy on pain meds that you shouldn't have mixed with booze.

I don't like Bethenny. I want to be on Jules' side in this stupidity, but I can't because I think she's so dumb and boring. It's clear that she's intimidated by Bethenny and starts stumbling over her thoughts, but none of this is entertaining. Her husband is a shitbag. She's a moron who is probably too sick to be on this show.

Dorinda Meddler is right. She's been messy as fuq this season. I'm also going to call bullshit on her labeling Bethenny as the one with the good heart and Carole as mean. Both of these heifers are mean. Dorinda is so afraid of being on Bethenny's bad side that she'll say stupid shit like that.

I feel like Bethenny only reconciled with Sonja because she could do it in front of Jules and demonstrate that she, Bethenny, is nice. It was a complete power play.

I think it's been 3 years since we've seen an event at Sonja's house. I'd say it was a pretty good effort on her part, except for her swanning around her own dinner party at her own home with her handbag and her letting it slip that they use the intercom in case it's Con Ed at the door. Girl, why you so scared of Con Ed at your door unless your power is about to be turned off.

Not surprised that LuAnn sidled up to Tom when he was on a date. You can't steal a man, but you can sure show up with a 90% off coupon.

Thing of beauty all of it.  Normally I'd also have to agree about Jules/Beth.  But B made self awareness and honesty her thing.  That can't only apply in one direction.   I'm mad at Jules for thinking this was the kiddie pool.  But I'm disappointed at Beth for how she reacted to another woman's truth.

R.O.T.F.L.M.A.O.!!!   You better come through door-slamma!

14 hours ago, SparkleznConfetti said:

As much as it pains me to admit it. I can understand why Jules gets easily flustered. I was an only child that was raised in a very sheltered environment and as a result thinking quickly on my feet has always been my achilles heel. Add that in with my introverted personality and u can see why I abstained from playing the dozens. Which is where self- preservation kicks in. Because I know, I can't run with the big dogs is the exact reason I stay behind on the porch and am not on reality tv :-) bloop!

Still giggling at your edit.  Yo mama is an automatic dozens disqualifier.  You got heart though!  Lol!

14 hours ago, charmed1 said:

Did I read a caption that said "Jules's Husband?" I haven't been in school for years and I'm no grammar nazi, but I remember my possessives lessons. "Jules's" can't be correct, can it?

Jules reminds me of myself in some ways. I'm very articulate when I'm angry. Crystal Pepsi clear. Normally, I'm not a talker, but when I'm pissed, I am a walking, talking, bulleted white paper on why you ain't shit. 

I thought it was funny that Bethenny claimed she never said anything about Jules to her face. That's exactly what she accused you of, fool. And if you don't care about Jules being on the bus and she's just a "ficus tree" sitting in the corner, then why the hell are you talking about her on the bus? 

Dorinda's gesticulations are insane. I use my hands to talk, but not my arms too. I thought she was going to elbow Jules in the forehead.

This is a gift I wish I had.  Don't.  I'll think of the perfect thing to say HOURS after the encounter.   I was rooting for her.  I think she actually did well at first and got distracted by responding to the responses.  If you know you're a word fumbler you have to commit to sticking to script.  You can always address questions at the end.  I also think she was thrown off by the aggression because she immediately backed down when Beth said I'm talking now you don't get to be the only one to talk.  {{bonquiquivoice}} ruuude.

12 hours ago, smores said:

I do think they got off track a bit during the "I need a verb" conversation, but, Jules was (in retrospect) likely kind of melting down due to the stress in her personal life and on some pretty heavy duty pain killers.  She was on word safari, and going in circles and no one could understand what she was trying to say.  Bethenny was also experiencing a health issue and in pain, so probably was a bit sharper than she might have been under normal circumstances, and it ended badly for both of them.  

But, here's where I have an issue with Jules.  She has my total sympathy for her marriage issues, and also with her eating disorder struggles.  My issue comes when someone has some sort of disorder/situation that basically requires everyone else around them to pretend that something isn't happening or everything is normal when there is obviously a major health problem going on, and then any time that health problem is broached, those who mention it are accused of not "being supportive"  I'm not saying they should monitor her eating, but baking flatware into food can't be ignored.  Mentioning it doesn't make them "not supportive" of her.  

It's getting harder and harder to tell but I liked Bethenny for whole entire seasons.  This is one of the moments I don't.  A lot.  When someone is flustered while they're talking, don't say shit.  They'll work it out or they won't but she wasn't trying to help, *I need a verb* is dismissive and impatient.    I love the term word safari.  Sometimes your mind is on a hunt for the perfect way to say something, but it's up to the speaker when to decide to let it go.

4 hours ago, bosawks said:

Yeah, I've done this.  It looks like a bucket of fuck but it really is tasty...

it's mine now, don't be mad when you see it in the threads again.

3 hours ago, abbottrabbit said:

Agreed -- the only real question is what the special and/or spinoff will be called. I'd like them to do a take on one of her song titles, the way they did with Don't Be Tardy for the Wedding, but I also think it would be delightful to watch Bethenny's head explode if they just called it LuAnn Getting Married?

My favorite moment of the evening? Sonja shading Lu's engagement ring. "Four carats is old school. Eight is a little bit nouveau." BOW DOWN. 

LMAO!! {{patsbenchseat}} come sit next to me Petty Pendegrass.   I can see glimpses of her former bistro hostess life, because mother has been serving!  Yesss. 

1 hour ago, RHJunkie said:

LuAnn seems like she would be a very confident partner. So she probably isn't bothered by Tom's past because she feels that she's the woman that's converted him into a monogamous, family seeking man. Maybe she has but if that's her thought, she is not the first, nor will she be the last woman to think that she had such powers over a man.

@RHJunkie please forgive me for the following edit:  nor will she be the last woman [in his life] to think that she had such powers over a man.

3 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

LuAnn puts herself first and goes after who and what she wants; qualities that are admired in men IMO.  If a woman dares to put herself before anybody else, she's looked down on.  I'm not saying that I agree with LuAnn, but if she were a man, other men would probably say, "atta boy, you go for what you want, don't let anybody stand in your way."

That's pretty much what Ramona said to her at the end of their scene.  Lu said I don't like being single, but I'm good at it.  Ro said yeah you're like a man that way.  It didn't sound like a compliment. lol.  

Randomly:

are these chicks really invited to Lu's wedding?  I know reality and real life get blurry but assuming it wasn't a contractual obligation would ya'll do that?

I can't recall what Carole said when she saw Jules get on the bus but it made me call her a bitch.

Rocco.  I don't know what to think yet.

Dorinda = lady pointing to the grassy knoll.   But no under arm jigglies?  Girl, mazel.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Sheesh, I remember thinkin' how faboo Carole's apartment & her leopard couch was.  When was that?  2 million years ago?  Now her icky joint looks to me as ratty, dingy, cramped & shitty as Seinfeld's was.  

Hey, I'm wondering if someone peed on that now icky couch (like on Seinfeld).  Maybe monster Bethenny?  I'm sure Carole would be just fine & dandy with her doing that -- er, cuz Bethenny's pee is golden to Carole, right?

I can just picture it.  "I gotta go now, so I'm peeing on your couch", Bethenny sneers & laughs sinisterly.  Carole then says quickly, "Anything you want (panting like an obedient doggie), anything you want, your highness, just please, please, please, keep me on the show, please, please, please,.  And she says this while licking Bethenny's toes.  Yup, that's who you are now, Carole.

Edited July 18, 2016 by ScoobieDoobs

[Anna525]

I've been feeling bad for Jules since the beginning of the season. She was clearly nervous with her one-on-one's with Bethenny, couldn't articulate her thoughts, so Bethenny decided she's a non-threat and dumb (and I've seen many posts here that also called Jules dumb  :(  ). Anything Bethenny says about Jules is demeaning and dismissive, with Carole agreeing with her. I can see what they mean about them not "talking" about her - they have not discussed Jules at length at all because they don't care for her. So I think what Jules meant as back talk is the adjectives they have tacked onto her when her name comes up. They have not shown Jules any respect at all or even welcomed her as a newbie, walked out of her home in the morning and not have breakfast. The little interaction they had with Jules were not nice at all. I thought they bonded over their skinniness during Dorinda's bra party but I guess that was short-lived.

[ScoobieDoobs]

You know, when I watched Bethenny loudly talk about Jules 2 feet away from her on that bus, I cringed at her thoughtless cruelty & evil vileness.  But it also took me back decades & reminded me how I witnessed little girls doing this exact same thing to one another on those awful yellow buses I would be on in day camp, when I was maybe 7 or 8.  

OK, so that's the mentality of Bethenny -- and one she seems to be fine & dandy defending herself proudly for being?  That of a thoughtless & cruel 8 year old?  Nice, Bethenny, you evil & hateful monster, real nice.  

Remind me again, Satan Andy, why you are forcing this monster at us ?  Oh yeah, ratings.  Silly me, I momentarily forgot.  Ah, what watching an evil horrible woman & this summer heat does to one.

Edited July 15, 2016 by ScoobieDoobs

[lunastartron]

So Carole is on Twitter declaring "it's not mean if it's true" and that it's irresponsible for Jules to film just because she has a chronic mental health issue. 

She's every bit as big of a pig - and obviously possessed of the same degree of self-awareness - as Vicki Gunvalson. 

The suggestion that Jules is repugnant and unworthy of basic humanity let alone cordiality because she still has relapses with purging and disordered eating patterns (it's just a reality of managing an ED) s idiotic in the context of the actually discomfiting and horrific narratives this franchise has aired: a woman exhorting her son to sexually assault her co-worker; Vicks and Brooks' season-long charade; etc. A man's suicide was literally a focal point for five months on Beverly Hills. 

For all their flaws, I've never seen any red flags for sociopathy between Jules and Lu. But they really should have unleashed the motherfuckin' dragon on the reunion set and see if Carole still spouts "not mean if it's true" bullshit. 

[Castina]

WOW!  Just watched that episode and all I can say is wow, I thought Bethenny and Carole came off horribly.  I applaud Jules for having the balls to challenge Queen B.   Things that really stood out to me:

• The irony that Bethenny can't handle the truth
• That Carole really is a mean girl.  I kind of saw her more as B's sheep but I think this episode cemented her ranking as the real thing. 
• I think Jules struggles to find her words is because Jules isn't the type of person to have big confrontations.  I understand it, still kudos to her for what she managed at the dinner.
• I think Bethenny apologizing to Sonja was a result of Jules giving her a brutal dose of reality.  
• Bethenny talking about Jules while she is sitting there hearing everything.  Reminds me of the scene where they first meet for lunch with Dorinda, John, Jules, Michael and Bethenny and B literally gossips about Jules to Dorinda sitting beside her talking about how much she freaks her out with her thinness and long hair, just like her mother, and then called Michael R2D2.  But wait, maybe I'm wrong because B said she never spoke about it until Jules brought it up.  So I guess I must have imagined the bra party where the two cool kids went after Jules for being so thin and when Jules said to not worry, she still gets her period etc...Carole's response was that it a concern that she would even say that.  Because that also happened before Jules brought up her eating disorder and B and C didn't do that right?
• Luann DID ask Bethenny if she was all right during that infamous conversation over drinks.  In fact she showed more concern for Bethenny in that situation then Bethenny did in her "hope you are feeling ok" text she tried to use as proof to Jules that she did show concern.  So to do a TH asking what more Jules expected is freaking hilarious considering her own behaviour towards Luann for not showing enough concern for her.  Which I repeat was a hell of a lot more and sincere then B showed Jules. 
• I hate when Bethenny uses situations to try to prove she is right.  Why WOULD Luann text her to tell her she was officially engaged.  Why?
• Luann and Tom may work, they may not.  Ramona is also not wrong in that 4 weeks is quick to rush get engaged, about waiting four seasons to really see.  It's advice I would give my daughter.  Having said that I met my husband in 1988, instant connection and I surprised myself when I pictured us getting married when we'd only been dating a month.  I never had any doubts with him, people told me to watch out, that his reputation was more toward the one night stand.  We are still together and the first rough patch we hit was in 2012/3 .  Sometimes you do just know.  

Edited July 14, 2016 by Castina

[OhGromit]

3 minutes ago, Castina said:

WOW!  Just watched that episode and all I can say is wow, I thought Bethenny and Carole came off horribly.  I applaud Jules for having the balls to challenge Queen B.  

I totally agree!  

[Castina]

A final note.  I understand now why Jules isn't on next season.  She either walked away from the insanity that is Bethenny or Carole or they were so outraged and pissed off they got her fired. 

[Knuckles]

1 hour ago, Yours Truly said:

Dating in your 40's keeps you optimistically detached until there's something of significance to shift gears.

That is so well said, and so true. Though you may have to be past 40 to know how true it is.

[Maire]

Quote

Hey, I'm wondering if someone peed on that now icky couch (like on Seinfeld).  Maybe monster Bethenny?  I'm sure Carole would be just fine & dandy with her doing that -- er, cuz Bethenny's pee is golden to Carole, right?

Isn't that the famous Lee Radziwill couch? It looks like hell.

[Knuckles]

13 minutes ago, Castina said:

Why WOULD Luann text her to tell her she was officially engaged.  Why?

Lu was right again...no need to alert the raging beast. She has no interest in Lu's happiness, there is no need to tell the bitch anything. 

[whydoievencare]

20 hours ago, smores said:

So, it's not like the other women were wrong to be concerned about her.  

To me, the only thing about this is that a friend's concern would normally also include some degree of kindness - Bethenny and Carole haven't seemed very kind in their discussions about Jules.  More like schadenfreude really.  Carole doesn't seem able to emote - perhaps she's too cool to do that and Bethenny's only emotion is anger.  

Edited July 15, 2016 by whydoievencare

[WireWrap]

12 minutes ago, Castina said:

A final note.  I understand now why Jules isn't on next season.  She either walked away from the insanity that is Bethenny or Carole or they were so outraged and pissed off they got her fired. 

They only filmed the reunion yesterday, so no contract offers have been handed out yet. So, we don't know if Jules will be asked back for next season or if she will accept if asked back. Bethenny tweeted that she is now the "only" married HW on the show a week or so ago but Jules was at the reunion so Bethenny was not the "only" married HW on the show when she tweeted that.

[bosawks]

1 hour ago, ZaldamoWilder said:

it's mine now, don't be mad when you see it in the threads again.

 

Far be it from me to inhibit the pursuit of heightened public discourse.......

[escatefromny]

Out of the mouths of babes ....

Yes Bethanny, Jules laid some truth on you in pointing out your "sense of humor" relies on tearing someone else down.  For someone so enamored of speak the truth despite the consequences ("can't handle the truth, can't handle me") her shocked, hurt and entirely too over the top reaction just shows how little self awareness she has.  Jules "yelled" at you??  I don't think so, "yelling" at some is when you scream at them at the top of your lungs, slinging arrows and quoting hearsay.  Do you need an example Bethanny, check the tape of your wildly inappropriate "yelling" session at Luanne in the Berkshires.