The Annual Academy Awards - General Discussion

[tiramisue]

18 minutes ago, BW Manilowe said:

ABC pushes the start until 8:30 so they can have their own Red Carpet pre-show starting at 7--which they should be allowed (to have their own Red Carpet show) as the host network. All the cable network Red Carpet shows start before theirs, but I heard a long time ago that at least E!'s Red Carpet (really, probably all of the cable network shows) contractually has to be off the air before ABC's show.

That's interesting! Even in Germany the broadcast switches from the German one to the ABC Red Carpet... well used to switch. This year it didn't except for the last 5 minutes, so there might've been a change? Even if it's only for the international networks. (which is a shame, because the German Red Carpet mostly consists of the questions "Have you ever been to Germany?" and "Do you know any German?")

[BW Manilowe]

15 hours ago, KaveDweller said:

He said on his show last night that his first thought was how the host was going to have to come out and handle things.....and then it hit him that he was the host.

Well he would have had 12 envelopes left in his briefcase if there are doubles of everything. But I don't get why he didn't see the word "best picture" on one of them.

I read in one summary that after it happened the two accountants were trying to get to each other to confirm the right winner or something. Which seems weird, since part of their job is to memorize the winners. And it's not like this was a category at risk of being forgotten like the name of the sound editor or something. Then apparently they wanted to have the correct envelope (I guess so they could hold it up and show it like they did).

But they should have rushed out as soon as "La La Land" was said, and just said that was wrong and they were getting the correct envelope.

According to the Wikipedia page about the Academy Awards telecast, 24 awards are given out on the show not 12. Multiple, various articles I've read where they're quoted about what they do at the ceremony also say, more than once, the accountant's representatives each have a full set of 24 envelopes representing the awards being presented onstage that night in the briefcases they carry with them to their positions in the wings just offstage. But by the end of the night, each accountant should only have 12, unopened, envelopes if the presenters truly alternate which side they go onstage from (the other 12, opened, envelopes would've been given to the winner along with their Oscar).

[Inquisitionist]

10 minutes ago, BW Manilowe said:

But by the end of the night, each accountant should only have 12, unopened, envelopes if the presenters truly alternate which side they go onstage from (the other 12, opened, envelopes would've been given to the winner along with their Oscar).

There may be 12 unopened envelopes, but from a process control standpoint, the ones for categories already awarded should no longer be in the briefcase, or at least not in the same compartment where the envelopes for not-yet-awarded categories reside.  The PwC folks are accountants/auditors by training.  They have checklists and controls for everything.  It's just astonishing to me that the Best Actress envelope was anywhere near the Best Picture envelope once Best Actress had been awarded.

[BW Manilowe]

1 hour ago, starri said:

Whoopi is a legitimate EGOT.  She won all four awards in competitive categories, it's just that her Tony is for producing.  There's a reason why most of the other EGOTs are producers or composers.

The only performers that have awards for just for performances are Helen Hayes and Rita Moreno.  And depending on how you want to split hairs, John Gielgud, since one of his Tonys a defunct category called Best Company, which means it wasn't individual.

This is supposed to be a response to your second paragraph, but maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying in it. 

Barry Manilow--who is or isn't 3/4 of the way to an EGOT, depending on how you look at what constitutes a legitimate EGOT--received a "non-competitive" Tony Award in the 1970's for a series of concerts he played on Broadway (which were also recorded for his Barry Manilow Live album) at what was then the Uris Theatre & now (unless they've changed the name again) is the Gershwin Theatre. Most things I've read about EGOTs say "non-competitive" awards don't count towards the EGOT.

In addition to the possibly questionable for an EGOT Tony, he's won a competitive Grammy (Male Pop Vocal, 1978, for Copacabana [At the Copa]), & 2 competitive Emmys for the Outstanding Variety Special category. He hasn't won, or been nominated for, an Oscar (or received a "non-competitive" Oscar). He sang Ready to Take a Chance Again, from the mid-1970's Chevy Chase & Goldie Hawn movie Foul Play, which was an Oscar nominee, however.

So, he needs either a Tony & an Oscar or just an Oscar, depending on the Tony's legitimacy, to make EGOT.

[Artsda]

7 hours ago, aradia22 said:

Personally, I don't believe he's guilty. That is, I believe I don't know for sure one way or the other. BUT the fact that he refused to engage with the conversation at all, even to speak indirectly about women's rights issues and sexual assault/harrassment does bother me.

He did kind of comment.  I don't know what's in his arrangement but he is limited to what he could say. I do think he can do other things by just showing up and be there for woman's rights without addressing it.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/lifestyle/2017/02/28/casey-affleck/ZUd8B1mg84mzG8m9HqNiiL/story.html

Quote

but I heard a long time ago that at least E!'s Red Carpet (really, probably all of the cable network shows) contractually has to be off the air before ABC's show.

Yes E! has to finish at 8 and then the official part of the pre-show from 8-8:30 E! is not allowed to have their show still on air.

Edited March 1, 2017 by Artsda

[starri]

What I mean by "competitive" is that the person won the award over other nominees.  In the case of Whoopi, she won because Thoroughly Modern Millie was chosen as Best Musical over three other nominees (most notably Mamma Mia!).  

Barbra Streisand, OTOH, has a nonsense Tony for "Star of the Decade," and isn't counted.  Nor is Liza Minelli who has an honorary Grammy, James Earl Jones, who has an honorary Oscar, Alan Menken, who has an honorary Emmy, nor Harry Belafonte, who was given the AMPAS' Jean Hersholt Humanitarian award.

So, in your example, Barry Manilow needs--in as much as these sorts of things actually matter--two.

[ProudMary]

Oscars Producer Michael De Luca Breaks Silence on Backstage Chaos: "It Was Like the Hindenburg"

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/oscars-producer-michael-de-luca-breaks-silence-backstage-chaos-was-like-hindenburg-981842?facebook_20170301

[DollEyes]

15 hours ago, CherryMalotte said:

*sigh*

If only it was 2012 and the winner was actually Zero Dark Thirty, instead of Argo....or 2005 and the winner was Munich, instead of Crash.  Maybe even 1998 and the winner was Saving Private Ryan instead of Shakespere In Love.  So many possibilities.  Gear up the wayback machine Mr Peabody and move over Sherman!

Replace Munich with Brokeback Mountain and I would agree. 

[Milburn Stone]

The speech Barry Jenkins intended to give, if Moonlight had won under more orderly circumstances:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/moonlights-barry-jenkins-heres-oscar-speech-i-would-have-given-981581

I think it's magnificent.

[VCRTracking]

Casey Affleck always seemed kind of an introvert and when he does speak it's mumbly and that can be irritating. His brother Ben on the other hand has always been very outgoing and funny and a sociable person. If he had been in the situation he could have explained himself better and been charming enough to get more people on his side whereas Casey comes off as weird. The beard, either for a role or not didn't help.

Faye Dunaway on her Oscars snafu: “I really fucked that up”

Aww. She definitely thought Warren was kidding around by hesitating. She hasn't been in the spotlight for a while and Millennials are only going to know her for this and not for Bonnie and Clyde, Chinatown, Network, etc.

Edited March 1, 2017 by VCRTracking

[TheOtherOne]

Wow. Now Variety has pictures from backstage of the minutes leading up to the mixup, with Cullinan tweeting away (and with two envelopes in his possession).

[sadiegirl]

24 minutes ago, TheOtherOne said:

Wow. Now Variety has pictures from backstage of the minutes leading up to the mixup, with Cullinan tweeting away (and with two envelopes in his possession).

From above link: "He feels very, very terrible and horrible. He is very upset about this mistake,” PWC chairman Tim Ryan told Variety on Monday. “While I am concerned I hope we will be judged on how quickly we reacted and owned up to the issue.”

Which is my problem with this.  They did not react quickly.  It took them three minutes, when it should have taken 30 second at the most for one of the PWC people to rush on stage and stop everything.  It seems that if one of them had actually been paying attention to what was happening on stage (or just listening), as soon as LLL was announced, both of them should have known that was wrong (since they apparently memorize the winners).  So, no, you didn't react quickly.  Also, I can kind of see this happening in the middle of the show, when a lot of envelopes are still in play.  But it's the last award of the night.  You better be handing out the last envelope in your hand to the presenter.  You have to really not be paying attention to not notice that you still have an envelope left. (I know, he had two in his hand, but again, it's on him for not putting aside the Best Actress envelope once Emma came back stage.  Once she was handed the award, all envelopes, other than Best Picture, should have been put aside.  If that's not something they routinely do, then I have to question their process and am amazed it hadn't happen before).

[slowpoked]

29 minutes ago, TheOtherOne said:

Wow. Now Variety has pictures from backstage of the minutes leading up to the mixup, with Cullinan tweeting away (and with two envelopes in his possession).

So not looking good for Mr. Cullinan. Clearly not paying attention, not only on the mishap of not giving the correct envelope, but on course-correcting soon afterwards. It was only 3 minutes after the winner was announced that Cullinan was onstage to clear the mix-up - I thought their protocol was to immediately take the mic if they hear something is wrong. I wonder if he was still admiring Emma as the commotion was already happening onstage.

Being mesmerized and distracted by Emma Stone's beauty is clearly not a good thing.

[vibeology]

1 hour ago, TheOtherOne said:

Wow. Now Variety has pictures from backstage of the minutes leading up to the mixup, with Cullinan tweeting away (and with two envelopes in his possession).

Sorry. I know people say Warren or Faye should have noticed something or the other accountant, Martha, should have acted faster when something went wrong, but this is the person who fucked up and it is so clear when you look at the pictures exactly why. He was way more focused on hanging out with celebrities and "slaying" on social media and not even a little bit concerned about doing his fucking job! The fact that he and PWC dithered about taking responsibility for the mistake is disgusting when you actually see how it all played out.

Edited March 1, 2017 by vibeology

[moonb]

43 minutes ago, vibeology said:

The fact that he and PWC dithered about taking responsibility for the mistake is disgusting when you actually see how it all played out.

Maybe because however you look at it, they're just digging themselves into a deeper hole. Like, this guy isn't new; it's his 4th or 5th year handling the Oscar envelopes, so even if he's starstruck, he can't point to inexperience.  He also made the (now really unfortunate) point in the PwC interviews that there was a tiny chance that a mix-up could happen, and talked about the protocols and processes that didn't work in this case. So either they didn't bother with them, weren't as well-versed in what should happen if a wrong envelope was handed out (Ruiz and Cullinan couldn't communicate instantly backstage, I guess, hence the delay), or the protocol wasn't really workable anyway. And....that makes him look kind of arrogant or lazy, like he just wasn't on top of things because of celebrities. I'm not sure how you can really spin any of this positively, unless there's some new piece of information we don't know about. 

[ProudMary]

2 minutes ago, moonb said:

Maybe because however you look at it, they're just digging themselves into a deeper hole. Like, this guy isn't new; it's his 4th or 5th year handling the Oscar envelopes, so even if he's starstruck, he can't point to inexperience.  He also made the (now really unfortunate) point in the PwC interviews that there was a tiny chance that a mix-up could happen, and talked about the protocols and processes that didn't work in this case. So either they didn't bother with them, weren't as well-versed in what should happen if a wrong envelope was handed out (Ruiz and Cullinan couldn't communicate instantly backstage, I guess, hence the delay), or the protocol wasn't really workable anyway. And....that makes him look kind of arrogant or lazy, like he just wasn't on top of things because of celebrities. I'm not sure how you can really spin any of this positively, unless there's some new piece of information we don't know about. 

This is important.  Why don't they have headsets so they can speak to each other?  Nowhere in the plan did anyone ever think that it might be important for the two of them to be able to speak to each other?  I could fully understand that in the midst of a disaster like what happened Sunday night that even if the protocol dictates it, either of them might not have been secure in immediately rushing the stage after Faye Dunaway called out La La Land as the winner.  I'd imagine you'd want some form of corroboration on that.  Had they been able to communicate, I could see one of them saying, "She just announced the wrong winner.  Should we go out there right now and stop this?"  No one would want to make that decision on their own.  Safety in numbers.

[blackwing]

Agree with all of the above.  They didn't "react quickly" at all.  Reacting quickly would have been to immediately swoop onto the stage and announced the mixup.  I can't really blame the woman, Martha Ruiz, because she's the second partner.  The head partner is Brian Cullinan and she was probably letting him take the lead.  Unfortunately, I'm sure she had no idea that he created the problem.  I have absolutely no doubt that he was more focused on checking his phone to see how many people had already "liked" the tweet that he had just posted than trying to fix things.

Three people from "La La Land" gave their speeches before the mistake was revealed.  That's not "reacting quickly".  I find it ironic that in that interview that Cullinan gave regarding the procedures, PWC says they would instantly make a correction.  They didn't here.  But then again, without the mistake, I wouldn't have had the pleasure of seeing Jordan Horwitz talk about his "blue eyed" wife.  That was so very odd.  I'm assuming he has brown eyes and thinks that only blue eyes are beautiful?  And without the mistake, I wouldn't have gotten to see that third guy get up there and give his speech and end with "oh, we lost by the way" and give a little half-hearted chuckle.

Based on these photos showing Cullinan consumed with his phone, I really do think PWC needs to announce that Brian Cullinan is no longer in charge of the Oscars engagement.  That is, if PWC is lucky enough to keep it.  

[DearEvette]

Every new story or eyewitness account that comes out is really fascinating and some of them contradict each other.  But that is par for the course.

I feel extra terrible about Barry Jenkins.  Man it sucks he couldn't deliver his speech. Hearing what he would have said and probably how emotional it would have been in the room given that it seems like they had such a huge amount of support in there, it just super bites that he (and we) didn't get to experience that.

But everything else... I have an Ryan Gosling level smirk on my face.  This is such a delicious little story to follow and my cold dead heart is loving the drama of it all. 

And yeah,fuck that Fred Berger guy (the third La La Land Producer) who said in his own interview that he knew they hadn't won before he spoke, but he wanted to thank his wife anyway and he said 'Why not.'

[TheOtherOne]

39 minutes ago, blackwing said:

But then again, without the mistake, I wouldn't have had the pleasure of seeing Jordan Horwitz talk about his "blue eyed" wife.  That was so very odd.  I'm assuming he has brown eyes and thinks that only blue eyes are beautiful? 

I don't know why so many people are jumping on the blue-eyed wife comment. As it happens, his wife does have really striking blue eyes, that it appears she's passed on to their son. Maybe he finds them attractive about her. So that must mean he only finds blue eyes attractive? Okay.

23 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

And yeah,fuck that Fred Berger guy (the third La La Land Producer) who said in his own interview that he knew they hadn't won before he spoke, but he wanted to thank his wife anyway and he said 'Why not.'

Interesting. The Hollywood Reporter's Rundown yesterday had a much more charitable read:

Quote

Platt, also unaware of what had happened, wrapped up his speech and pushed Berger toward the microphone. At first Berger said no, but with the mic sitting open, he had to talk. And then, he ended his speech by saying: “We lost, by the way." Horowitz rushed in and said “There’s a mistake — Moonlight, you won best picture."

It was chaos. People don't always make the best choice in the moment. There was a lot of that going around.

Edited March 1, 2017 by TheOtherOne

[vibeology]

41 minutes ago, moonb said:

Maybe because however you look at it, they're just digging themselves into a deeper hole. Like, this guy isn't new; it's his 4th or 5th year handling the Oscar envelopes, so even if he's starstruck, he can't point to inexperience.  He also made the (now really unfortunate) point in the PwC interviews that there was a tiny chance that a mix-up could happen, and talked about the protocols and processes that didn't work in this case. So either they didn't bother with them, weren't as well-versed in what should happen if a wrong envelope was handed out (Ruiz and Cullinan couldn't communicate instantly backstage, I guess, hence the delay), or the protocol wasn't really workable anyway. And....that makes him look kind of arrogant or lazy, like he just wasn't on top of things because of celebrities. I'm not sure how you can really spin any of this positively, unless there's some new piece of information we don't know about. 

You can't spin it positively because the senior partner screwed up the biggest award of the night, but at the very least had he and PWC owned up to human error within hours rather than try to blame Warren Beatty, I could respect that more. Being a company who isn't afraid to admit to a mistake and create processes to do better is far preferable to being a company who looks to pass the buck when something goes wrong. (Obviously being the company that doesn't screw up is the best option but that ship had already sailed.) 

Because at the end of the day, the story was going to come out and people were going to put two and two together. The tweets were there, the screenshots were there, press was all over the place backstage covering the event, Emma Stone had her envelope and Warren refused to let go of what had been given to him until he was able to show Barry Jenkins and apologize and explain how he and Faye said the wrong movie.  So better to be the adult who owns up to an error than the child who tries to point fingers at anyone else.

[slowpoked]

35 minutes ago, ProudMary said:

 I could see one of them saying, "She just announced the wrong winner.  Should we go out there right now and stop this?"  No one would want to make that decision on their own.  Safety in numbers.

But from what I understand, and hearing, not only on the media, but on insider circles as well (because hubby works for one of the Big 4 Firms), is that the protocol in place is that either one of them could stop it - doesn't matter if it's the senior partner or the other one - as soon as either one of them heard the wrong name being announced. No need to confer, no need to discuss, etc. That's why one of the protocols is also memorizing the winners, so that either one of them could react quickly the very second something went awry, seeing as they're not stationed together backstage. 

IF PWC's protocol is for their partners to confer first before making a decision in times like this, then that's just really, really bad protocol. Live TV doesn't wait for accountants to discuss and make their decision, as shown in humiliating fashion on Sunday night.

[okerry]

I'm betting the Cullinan man was holding onto Emma Stone's duplicate card as a souvenir, and that's why he had both that one and the Best Pic card in his hand. Unfortunately, he gave the wrong one to Beatty.

[Pink ranger]

In the future, they should end the use of envelops and have a high level producer feed the result to the presenter via a head set. The risk for human error is reduced.

I know that breaks a long standing tradition but after this year I think that such a move would be understandable. 

[ProudMary]

1 minute ago, slowpoked said:

But from what I understand, and hearing, not only on the media, but on insider circles as well (because hubby works for one of the Big 4 Firms), is that the protocol in place is that either one of them could stop it - doesn't matter if it's the senior partner or the other one - as soon as either one of them heard the wrong name being announced. No need to confer, no need to discuss, etc. That's why one of the protocols is also memorizing the winners, so that either one of them could react quickly the very second something went awry, seeing as they're not stationed together backstage. 

IF PWC's protocol is for their partners to confer first before making a decision in times like this, then that's just really, really bad protocol. Live TV doesn't wait for accountants to discuss and make their decision, as shown in humiliating fashion on Sunday night.

I understand what the protocol said but in a crisis, human nature dictates.  That's a hard decision to make, to run out and stop a show running late and being broadcast live to billions of people all over the planet.  If a headset com was available to them, in a quick second they'd be able to say, "This is the disaster we hoped would never happen.  We have to go out there and fix it, right?" 

[ProudMary]

Casey Affleck has commented (minimally) to the Boston Globe about the elephant in the room.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/lifestyle/2017/02/28/casey-affleck/ZUd8B1mg84mzG8m9HqNiiL/story.html
 

Quote

Asked about those sentiments Tuesday, Affleck paused and sighed heavily. He said both sides in the case are prohibited from commenting on the matter, and none of the people who are condemning him online know what happened.

But, he added, “I believe that any kind of mistreatment of anyone for any reason is unacceptable and abhorrent, and everyone deserves to be treated with respect in the workplace and anywhere else.”

“There’s really nothing I can do about it,” Affleck added wearily. “Other than live my life the way I know I live it and to speak to what my own values are and how I try to live by them all the time.”

[ProudMary]

According to Cheryl Boone Isaacs, neither Cullinan nor Ruiz will work on the Oscars again.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/oscars-accountants-involved-best-picture-mistake-wont-work-show-again-academy-president-says-98?facebook_20170301

Quote

The president of the film academy says the two accountants responsible for the best-picture flub at Sunday's Academy Awards will never return to the Oscar show.

Cheryl Boone Isaacs tells The Associated Press that the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences' relationship with PwC, the accounting firm responsible for the integrity of the awards, remains under review.

Boone Isaacs broke her silence Wednesday following the biggest blunder in the 89-year history of the Academy Awards.

[moonb]

47 minutes ago, slowpoked said:

That's why one of the protocols is also memorizing the winners, so that either one of them could react quickly the very second something went awry, seeing as they're not stationed together backstage. 

Right. The mishap isn't so much handing out the wrong envelope, it's the two plus minutes afterward of letting it all snowball.

[iwasish]

Why not have color coordinated envelopes for the various categories? Each presenter is given a color coordinated paper wristband to wear and as they enter the stage the accountant removes the wristband and hands over the matching envelope.

As bad a mix up as this was, I think there will be more and more instances like it as social media popularity continues to explode. There are accidents with cars, trains, etc all the time that are shown to have been caused by a driver distracted by a call or texting, etc.

 At work I go to meetings and most of the attendees bring along cellphones and text, read email, make/answer calls, twitter etc, throughout and at the end of the meeting no one seems to have any idea what the topic of the meeting initially was or what its outcome was.

[blackwing]

1 minute ago, iwasish said:

Why not have color coordinated envelopes for the various categories? Each presenter is given a color coordinated paper wristband to wear and as they enter the stage the accountant removes the wristband and hands over the matching envelope.

I agree that this would have helped, but I just don't think it's necessary.  We are talking about a man in his 50s.  He's not in 1st grade.  All of this would have been avoided if he simply would have bothered to have paid attention to what he was doing.  I've seen some excuses made for his actions such as "oh, they changed the envelopes this year, they were red with gold printing and it was hard to see in the dim light".  BS.  If the light was dim, use a flashlight.  If he was more concerned about doing his job than he was about Emma Stone, then this wouldn't have happened.  

Good for Cheryl Boone Isaacs.  PWC wasn't addressing what was going to happen to Cullinan and he wasn't saying anything, so Boone Isaacs said it for them.  You're fired.  I wouldn't be surprised if PWC is still retained by the Academy, but it's good to hear that Cullinan will not be returning.  Too bad for Martha Ruiz that she got dragged down by him, but I suppose she could have followed "the protocol" and stopped the ceremony right away, and she didn't.

It's puzzling why Cullinan has been silent.  I'm sure he has retained a lawyer, or the firm gave him access to one, and maybe they are telling him to remain silent.  But really, what is he afraid of?  Legal liability?  It's not like there's any real damages.  There was no money at stake.  The error was corrected within a few minutes.  Is he afraid that the Moonlight or the La La Land people will sue him for emotional distress?  Why not MAN UP to your error, make a statement, and just hope the world moves on.  In the age of the internet, this is probably one of those things that will never be truly forgotten (a la Miss Teen South Carolina, "I personally believe that U.S. Americans are unable [to locate the United States on a map] because some people out there in our nation don't have maps....").  But certainly and undoubtedly, there will be someone else that comes around and makes a bigger gaffe and he won't be at the forefront of people's minds.

[Inquisitionist]

19 minutes ago, blackwing said:

I agree that this would have helped, but I just don't think it's necessary.  We are talking about a man in his 50s.  He's not in 1st grade.  All of this would have been avoided if he simply would have bothered to have paid attention to what he was doing.  I've seen some excuses made for his actions such as "oh, they changed the envelopes this year, they were red with gold printing and it was hard to see in the dim light".  BS.  If the light was dim, use a flashlight.  If he was more concerned about doing his job than he was about Emma Stone, then this wouldn't have happened.  

A-frickin'-men.

Plus, as soon as he heard Faye Dunaway say "La La Land," he just had to look at the envelope he still had in his hand to realize he hadn't given Warren the right one.  The flashlight on his iPhone should have been sufficient to read the gold lettering, or just tear it open and see what card is inside.  Yeesh.

Edited March 1, 2017 by Inquisitionist

[pennben]

My humble advice to the accountants who do attend the Oscars next year: 1. Do NOT go on an extended press tour prior to the awards; 2.  Do NOT walk the red carpet; 3.  Do NOT dress like you are going to a gala; 4. DO wear business attire as you are going to work; 5. Do NOT take your phone to the theater (or, if you need phone for emergencies, it stays in pocket/purse unless there is emergency); 6. Do NOT relax when you are close to the finish line, only relax after the show is over; 7.  DO act as if you are being filmed at all times (you probably are).

Edited March 1, 2017 by pennben

[dkb]

11 hours ago, DearEvette said:

And yeah,fuck that Fred Berger guy (the third La La Land Producer) who said in his own interview that he knew they hadn't won before he spoke, but he wanted to thank his wife anyway and he said 'Why not.'

 

11 hours ago, TheOtherOne said:

Interesting. The Hollywood Reporter's Rundown yesterday had a much more charitable read:

It was chaos. People don't always make the best choice in the moment. There was a lot of that going around.

I didn't have a problem with him going up to the mic, but, reading all the accounts, it seems like when he got up there he already knew that they didn't win, so why didn't he just say something like, "We're hearing that there might be a mistake......" 

I'm okay with him thanking whomever as well, but I didn't like they way he ended it with, "We lost by the way," That seemed childish and petty to me, like a sore loser. To me it seemed like that's what the Justin Horowitz producer also heard/saw, because that's when he came up to be like "No, I'm sorry there's been a mistake." He shook his head before he came up to the mic, and to me it came off as he didn't appreciate what the last producer said at the end.

But I'll cut him some slack because I have no idea what I would/say in that situation.

Edited March 2, 2017 by dkb
Their is the wrong there

[chitowngirl]

I always thought there was an asterisk by Whoopi Goldberg's EGOT because her Emmy was a Daytime Emmy award, which some think doesn't have the same prestige.

[ProudMary]

PwC's CEO is working overtime to maintain the business relationship with the Academy.  
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/race/oscars-top-pricewaterhousecoopers-exec-offers-meet-academy-governors-982048
 

Quote

Tim Ryan, the New York-based U.S. chairman and senior partner of the Academy's longtime accounting firm PricewaterhouseCooper, has remained in Los Angeles after attending the 89th Academy Awards and has offered to meet this week with individual members of the Academy's board of governors in an effort to preserve his firm's 83-year-old relationship with the organization, The Hollywood Reporter has learned.
Meanwhile, Academy CEO Dawn Hudson has reached out to the 54 members of her organization's board of governors and offered to set up one-on-one meetings between them and Ryan, ostensibly to address any questions or concerns they may have ahead of the next full-board meeting on March 28, at which the fate of the Academy's 83-year relationship with PwC could be a matter of discussion.

Ryan was seated in the audience as chaos broke out at the end of the ceremony on Sunday. After the show ended, according to The New York Times, he spent hours meeting with Cullinan, Ruiz, Academy officials and the telecast's producers, Michael De Luca and Jennifer Todd. “I spent the bulk of the night with Brian trying to understand what happened,” Ryan told the Times. “There wasn’t much in terms of parties last night.”

[blackwing]

2 hours ago, TheOtherOne said:

I don't know why so many people are jumping on the blue-eyed wife comment. As it happens, his wife does have really striking blue eyes, that it appears she's passed on to their son. Maybe he finds them attractive about her. So that must mean he only finds blue eyes attractive? Okay.

For me, it's because I think lots of people thank their wives ("my beautiful wife", "the love of my life", "my wife who is a fantastic partner and an amazing mother to our children" etc) but I don't think I've ever heard anyone thanking their "blue-eyed wife".  It indicates to me that he thinks he is lucky that his wife has blue eyes.  Or that that is her only distinctive feature.  I would have thought it equally odd if someone thanked their "brown-eyed wife" or their "hazel-eyed wife".
 

[Constantinople]

2 hours ago, ProudMary said:

According to Cheryl Boone Isaacs, neither Cullinan nor Ruiz will work on the Oscars again.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/oscars-accountants-involved-best-picture-mistake-wont-work-show-again-academy-president-says-98?facebook_20170301

A tad ironic given that I associate the phrase 'fail upwards' with Hollywood.

On the glass is half full side, it will finally be possible to make Leaving Las Vegas II. 

[slowpoked]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

I agree that this would have helped, but I just don't think it's necessary.  We are talking about a man in his 50s.  He's not in 1st grade.  All of this would have been avoided if he simply would have bothered to have paid attention to what he was doing.  I've seen some excuses made for his actions such as "oh, they changed the envelopes this year, they were red with gold printing and it was hard to see in the dim light".  BS.  If the light was dim, use a flashlight.  If he was more concerned about doing his job than he was about Emma Stone, then this wouldn't have happened.  

 

Exactly. To be honest, this is isn't rocket science. It's not that hard. You look at the envelope to make sure you're handing the correct one to the presenter. The process has worked for all these years, without having to resort to complicated tactics. IF the process is oh-so-complicated, all those years wouldn't have gone by without a hitch. 

Really, the breakdown wasn't so much that the procedure no longer worked - it's that someone who should have been paying attention to what he's doing, did not. It's as simple as that.

[doodlebug]

4 minutes ago, blackwing said:

For me, it's because I think lots of people thank their wives ("my beautiful wife", "the love of my life", "my wife who is a fantastic partner and an amazing mother to our children" etc) but I don't think I've ever heard anyone thanking their "blue-eyed wife".  It indicates to me that he thinks he is lucky that his wife has blue eyes.  Or that that is her only distinctive feature.  I would have thought it equally odd if someone thanked their "brown-eyed wife" or their "hazel-eyed wife".
 

How likely is it, though, that he actually believes that?  I don't think there's a lot of non-blue eyed discrimination out there. It sounded to me like a personal thing between him and his wife.  I've heard people make references to private jokes between themselves and their partner before.  I've certainly been in relationships where we had some sort of quirky lingo between us; it just didn't sound all that sinister to me.

[kili]

Quote

I would have thought it equally odd if someone thanked their "brown-eyed wife" or their "hazel-eyed wife".

I just assumed that he's a fan of Van Morrison's song "Brown Eyed Girl" and he modified it to suite his wife.  Is that song supposed to be weird and I just missed it?

[zxy556575]

If the guy had thanked his "long-legged wife," I would have chalked it up to some cutesy talk that's meaningful between them. I do the same for "blue-eyed."

[KaveDweller]

10 hours ago, BW Manilowe said:

ABC pushes the start until 8:30 so they can have their own Red Carpet pre-show starting at 7--which they should be allowed (to have their own Red Carpet show) as the host network. All the cable network Red Carpet shows start before theirs, but I heard a long time ago that at least E!'s Red Carpet (really, probably all of the cable network shows) contractually has to be off the air before ABC's show.

Yeah, ABC has a contract that no one else can be on the red carpet in the hour before the broadcast. E! keeps reporting with their fashion team, but it is a room somewhere else where they look at pictures they showed earlier. But if they started the show earlier they would just change the time other people had to stop their coverage. ABC also has coverage earlier while E! and others are still able to interview, so it's not like they only have that hour where it's just them. 

9 hours ago, BW Manilowe said:

According to the Wikipedia page about the Academy Awards telecast, 24 awards are given out on the show not 12. Multiple, various articles I've read where they're quoted about what they do at the ceremony also say, more than once, the accountant's representatives each have a full set of 24 envelopes representing the awards being presented onstage that night in the briefcases they carry with them to their positions in the wings just offstage. But by the end of the night, each accountant should only have 12, unopened, envelopes if the presenters truly alternate which side they go onstage from (the other 12, opened, envelopes would've been given to the winner along with their Oscar).

Right, I know they have 24 awards and that's why I said their would be 12 envelopes left over after he handed over the best picture one.

3 hours ago, ProudMary said:

This is important.  Why don't they have headsets so they can speak to each other?  Nowhere in the plan did anyone ever think that it might be important for the two of them to be able to speak to each other?

We know at least one of them had their phone in hand. Why not call her?

2 hours ago, ProudMary said:

According to Cheryl Boone Isaacs, neither Cullinan nor Ruiz will work on the Oscars again.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/oscars-accountants-involved-best-picture-mistake-wont-work-show-again-academy-president-says-98?facebook_20170301

That's the least surprising thing I heard all day. 

I feel like next year they presenters are all going to be holding up the card when they announce the category.

[phoenics]

56 minutes ago, ProudMary said:

PwC's CEO is working overtime to maintain the business relationship with the Academy.  
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/race/oscars-top-pricewaterhousecoopers-exec-offers-meet-academy-governors-982048
 

As a former PwC employee, this makes me sad for Tim Ryan.  Brian will likely be bought out - wow.  I feel badly for Martha Ruiz - if she had acted more quickly and rushed the stage when she heard the wrong name go out she might be okay but even if she had, it would still be tainted.  I can't even imagine the mood right now.

I think I'm gonna call some folks.

[Pink ranger]

It was obviously his way of coming out as a Neo-Nazi,  intent on promoting the blonde haired blue eyed Aryan race. ( sarcasm ).

[phoenics]

5 hours ago, sadiegirl said:

From above link: "He feels very, very terrible and horrible. He is very upset about this mistake,” PWC chairman Tim Ryan told Variety on Monday. “While I am concerned I hope we will be judged on how quickly we reacted and owned up to the issue.”

Which is my problem with this.  They did not react quickly.  It took them three minutes, when it should have taken 30 second at the most for one of the PWC people to rush on stage and stop everything.  

Pretty sure the chairman Tim Ryan is talking about how they reacted and owned up to the mistake they made - not the mistake itself (giving wrong card, and not stopping things faster).  I think he's talking about the fact that PwC released two statements (one late Sunday night - or monday morning taking responsibility, and the other later Monday morning after they'd done some investigation).  You have to understand - PwC is a very old and slow firm.  Accountants just are - they check and recheck - so they needed to investigate to figure out what happened.  And they don't release snap "statements", so late Sunday night and late Monday morning seem like they did react fast and take responsibility fast.

Again - I don't think Ryan was talking about how they messed up during the awards show, but how fast they sucked it up and took responsibility after the fact.  Which they did.  I saw two statements from them admitting fault.

[slowpoked]

More dirt is coming out now:

Quote

In the immediate aftermath of the event, much to Boone Isaacs' and Hudson's fury, nobody was prepared to accept blame, which instead seemed to accrue to Beatty and Dunaway. Beatty himself seemed upset in an email to THR two days after the show: "Rather than for me to respond to questions from the press about the Academy ceremony," he wrote, "I feel it would be more appropriate for the president of the Academy, Cheryl Boone Isaacs, to publicly clarify what happened as soon as possible."

This is funny. Props once again to topanga:

Quote

Now the focus is turning to Cullinan. A Harley-riding Malibu resident and self-proclaimed Damon look-alike (he has proudly announced that on Facebook), Cullinan is being blamed for allowing himself to be distracted by the celebrities who surrounded him. He tweeted a photo of Stone minutes before the mix-up despite reportedly being asked not to do so. His tweets from Oscar night, which have all since been deleted, included an image of the briefcase with the envelopes and one of supporting actress winner Viola Davis. He was described by PwC's U.S. chairman Tim Ryan as feeling "very, very terrible" about what happened, but did not return calls for comment.

Geez, the guy was distracted and starstruck the entire night.

More here: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/oscars-producer-michael-de-luca-breaks-silence-backstage-chaos-was-like-hindenburg-981842

[piequinn35]

It's funny that the last joke of Jimmy to Matt Damon (He's gonna ask Matt what is it like to be a loser?) was scrapped because of Matt Damon look-alike. :xD

[Gam2]

OMG! The SHOCK! The HORROR! This is the worst thing to ever happen!! They announced the wrong film as the winner of Best Film. In the cosmic world view, do any reasonable, thinking people even care about these over-compensated, living in an alternative universe from the rest of us people and their self aggrandizing "awards" program? This just makes me laugh and shake my head. How many people were murdered in that wonderful city, Chicago, today? Now that's a horror. 

[pennben]

Most of us are able to follow more than one story at a time, including both serious news as well as topics that are merely of interest to us. I don't believe us not discussing this would cause the number of murders in Chicago to change any more than I believed eating all of my lima beans as a child was imperative because there were children starving in India, as my mother used to insist. 

[KaveDweller]

29 minutes ago, piequinn35 said:

It's funny that the last joke of Jimmy to Matt Damon (He's gonna ask Matt what is it like to be a loser?) was scrapped because of Matt Damon look-alike. :xD

I wonder what was he going to do if Manchester by the Sea won best picture? There must have been a back up joke to end the show.

[anyanka323]

On 2/27/2017 at 9:06 PM, ShadowHunter said:

Whose face is better? lol I think Viola Davis.

Neither Viola or Emma look thrilled to be in Casey Affleck's company.  Viola's probably thinking "I survived dealing with Jared Leto while making and promoting Suicide Squad, I'm allowed to show some shade towards Casey Affleck.  Most people will understand."