S04.E10: Orphans

[Anela]

I think this was my favourite episode. I love it when they really tell a story, rather than just killing people off, and showing a lot of gore.This is the sweetest that I've seen Elsa, but I don't like that she got what she wanted, in Hollywood. She should have taken Pepper with her. And even though the Sister misconstrued Pepper's tears, I was happy to see her show her some real love and compassion, hug her, and get her out of the cell.

[RazzleberryPie]

Pepper's backstory was poignant and heartbreaking. Now that we know how she got to Briarcliff in "Asylum", maybe a future season will deal with what happens to her after "Asylum" (perhaps a season about alien abduction)? Nice seeing Lily Rabe as Sister Mary Eunice, that's my favorite character of hers on AHS. Did Dr. Pepper pay for the product placement during Ma Petit's flashback?

I presume they paid for it, or it would've been some generic label.

[Starchild]

I presume that, unlike Coke for example, it had to be a unique, low profile brand that was probably not readily available in India in the 1950s, even to the very rich.

[Madding crowd]

I can't imagine Stanley and Maggie making enough money by selling off the dead freaks to make this worthwhile. It seems like it would be more profitable to 'fleece the customers' of the freak show as Maggie stated. In general, people don't pay huge amounts of money to go to museums, and the the dead are not going to look recognizable after a time. I also don't see how looking at Jimmy's dismembered hands would even remotely compare to seeing the freak in person. 

 

Pepper's story was strongly hinted at in Asylum so it wasn't surprising, but I agree it was sad. I have a hard time seeing or hearing about babies or children being hurt, so I was uncomfortable with that killing scene. So, in general, everyone but the freaks is a horrible person (the one doctor was nice).

[LittleIggy]

I saw Naomi Grossman on a Food Network a couple of months ago (she was a judge on a Halloween themed series). I was amazed when they said she was Pepper. She is an outstanding actress and AHS has some great make-up people.

I can't wait until Stanley gets his amazing dick cut off and shoved down his throat.

[Snookums]

Also why wouldn't the museum want Salty's body in order to show the contrast?

 

 

THANK YOU. Stanley is horrible at this. Any museum is going to shell out considerably more for the entire body as opposed to just one part--to, as you said, show the  contrast between the "freak" and "normal" bodies. This especially epically bugs me when they keep showing Stanley's fantasy of selling the twins' heads. Why the hell would the museum want a DISMEMBERED corpse of cojoined twins? They would most definitely want the entire body to study/display exactly how the cojoined body was put together, which organs were shared and which not, etc. How the hell has Stanley kept Maggie believing that he's thisclose to making them rich all these years??? 

 

Poor Pepper. Ryan Murphy has a really dark, almost Kubrick-esque view of innocence--that while it attracts its defenders, those defenders contain the seeds of the eventual destruction of the very qualities they profess to treasure. Pepper's cycle of abandonment was made even crueler by having, for a little while, the very best she could hope for--a woman who understood that even though she was mentally retarded that didn't mean she was an infant, that she had desires for grown up things like physical love, mothering, etc. Elsa gave her a family, a context, a husband--and it was all taken from her. Elsa may have truly meant as well as it was possible for her to mean anything, but what good did it do, in the end? The fact that Pepper retains her purity of heart to the end is supposed to be its own reward, I guess. How depressing.

[WearyTraveler]

The thing with traveling this episode didn't bother me because they showed people making the decision to travel and then showed them at their destination withouth telling us how long it took them to get there.  For all we know, Elsa delivered Pepper to her sister 2 weeks after her conversation with Desiree and it took Maggie and Desiree over 48 hours to get to Mass.  Had they shown us Elsa back at the freak show the very next day, or Maggie and Desiree immediately attacking Stanley while wearing the same clothes they had on when they went to the museum, I might have noticed something.  But the show was careful to not make any time references.

 

Just because one scene follows another, it doesn't mean it happened the very next hour, day, or even week after the first scene.  It may appear so to us watching because see them one after the other, but the show was actually careful to not mention time.  In the next episode, Dell might ask Desiree where she went to for an entire week, and it would establish a timeline.  But, even if he doesn't, how are we to know how many days they were supposedly gone in the show's universe if the characters don't make any time reference? Like I said, for all we know, Murphy is doing the timeline right, but he just doesn't think it's important to specify exactly how many days it took people to get from A to B and back again.

 

FWIW, I once drove from Philadelphia to Miami in 26 hours (only stopping for gas - and yes, I can stay up that long because my sleep patterns are very weird).  The roads in the 50s were probably not as good and connected as they are today, but if Desiree and Maggie took turns driving, they might have been able to make the trip to Boston and back in 7-8 days.

 

I also found the episode to be sad, but I wouldn't say it had no horror.  I find the most terrible horrors are not supernatural or pseudo-scientific, I think there's nothing scarier than a truly evil human being.  Pepper's story was scary because it is plausible, and I have no doubt that many mentally challenged people have been framed for a crime by someone who just wanted to get rid of them.  Evil.  Real, plausible evil.  That scares me more than the ghost of Edward Mondrake!

I'm hoping against hope that the hands displayed at the museum are not Jimmy's, but I don't have a lot of faith that they will not be his :( Poor Jimmy!

Edited December 19, 2014 by WearyTraveler

[Surrealist]

I think this was my favourite episode. I love it when they really tell a story, rather than just killing people off, and showing a lot of gore.This is the sweetest that I've seen Elsa, but I don't like that she got what she wanted, in Hollywood. She should have taken Pepper with her. And even though the Sister misconstrued Pepper's tears, I was happy to see her show her some real love and compassion, hug her, and get her out of the cell.

 

I have to agree. I just watched this episode a couple of hours ago. I re-watched the final scene a few times. It tugged at my heart strings and normally, I'm not an emotional person when it comes to TV and movie stuff.

 

Elsa's a dirty person, but I couldn't hate her this episode. I thought she referred to Ma Petite as the only one she really loved. She whispered that in French to Ma Petite, while MP slept next to her. It was nice to see that Elsa appeared to have a genuine, unconditional love toward Pepper too. What a sad backstory Pepper had.

 

I'm hoping Dandy takes out Pepper's sister and brother-in-law. Also, I can't wait to see Stanley get his comeuppance.

 

I was kind of surprised that it appears as though Elsa achieves Hollywood fame. I'll be interested to see how that all goes down too. At this point, I feel like the only character I'm left rooting for his Desiree. I want her to get away from that freak show.

 

And Neil Patrick Harris playing a shady magician? Are we to assume his character is as jacked up as Dandy? If so, then the upcoming episodes will be really interesting.

Edited December 19, 2014 by Surrealist

[RedheadZombie]

I couldn't stand Pepper in Asylum - she totally creeped me out.  I was ashamed of my response because I didn't realize that it was makeup and prosthesis.  I wasn't crazy about her this season, and actually thought Salty was her twin sister - which goes to show I didn't pay much attention to them.  This past episode was very moving, and makes me want to go back and watch Asylum to see if I react differently to her character. 

 

My only concern with this episode, is it seemed a very heavy-handed attempt to redeem Elsa.  I don't want her to have a happy ending.

[Captanne]

I really liked this episode -- it felt, calmer for some reason.

 

I did have all kinds of problems with the timing, though.  The travelling great distances through a TARDIS wasn't as problematic for me as was understanding what was a flashback, what was present day and how those two timelines intersected.

 

SO glad to see Lily Rabe.  I had never heard of her before AHS but, manoman is she a breath of fresh air.

[jnymph]

Did I see Jamie Brewer in the upcoming previews? As the ventriloquist dummy ?

If so, YAY!

Looks like the blood and gore will be making a comeback. Woohoo !

Edited December 19, 2014 by jnymph

[designing1]

 

SO glad to see Lily Rabe.  I had never heard of her before AHS but, manoman is she a breath of fresh air.

 

Same here. Sarah Paulson seems to get all the love, and yes, she's very, very good, but to me, Lily Rabe is a far more compelling actress. Sometimes I feel like I can see Paulson acting, while Rabe more fully inhabits her characters.

[gunderda]

Ma Petite was a 'pet' before she was sold for Dr Pepper.  Elsa took off her pretty little "chain" to "free" her.  So we don't know what kind of life Ma Petite left but since she smiled so big when she was bought I gather it maybe wasn't so nice. 

[jnymph]

When Elsa gave the Maharja the Dr Pepper, & winked at Ma Petit................the way MP snickered was the cutest thing ever!

I interpreted Ma Petit had some sort of other worldly connection with Elsa & the rest of the freaks. She seemed to embrace her new life cheerfully. Also loved the way she gave that lovely smile to Pepper on their first meeting & was not afraid.

RIP Ma Petit; you were too sweet & good for this world.

[Captanne]

I just got the feeling that Ma Petite was a genuinely nice person.  She'd make the best of any situation and was delighted to be taken by Elsa.  I never got a hint, though, that the Maharaja mistreated her.

 

Other than, of course, the whole "on a leash" thing.  Which is pretty God-damned awful.

[Zima]

No Dandy? No thank you.

[mustbekarma]

Ma Petite was a 'pet' before she was sold for Dr Pepper.  Elsa took off her pretty little "chain" to "free" her.  So we don't know what kind of life Ma Petite left but since she smiled so big when she was bought I gather it maybe wasn't so nice. 

 

 

I interpreted Ma Petit had some sort of other worldly connection with Elsa & the rest of the freaks. She seemed to embrace her new life cheerfully. Also loved the way she gave that lovely smile to Pepper on their first meeting & was not afraid.

RIP Ma Petit; you were too sweet & good for this world.

 

Ma Petite on a leash was one of the most disturbing scenes on this show. I was also wondering if Ma Petite understood English in that scene, and she didn't realize at that time she was being given away. I think Elsa taking off the leash and holding "The Untouchable" while Pepper doted on her also had an effect. They treated her like a person, not a pet.

 

I complained quite vociferously about Elsa's happy ending. I originally resented it because how dare the talent challenged, amoral Elsa get a happy ending in Hollywood. Stanley is a con man selling the body parts of the freaks. He's not a Hollywood talent scout. How the hell did Elsa make it as a star when Stanley wasn't actually trying to jump start her career? Her fake histrionics when Ethel "died" surely showed what a bad actress she was. It doesn't make any sense that the flash forward showed her on the cover of Life Magazine, that Elsa was discovered in Hollywood.

 

Pepper better have just been hallucinating, and just imagined Elsa on the cover.

[Watermelon]

All we know is Elsa ended up in Hollywood. I'm not convinced yet she actually became the star she hoped for.

[Blakeston]

Elsa had to become a pretty big star to end up on the cover of Life, with a caption about how she "still owns Friday night." I'm not sure if she's supposed to be an actress or a talk show host, though. She doesn't seem like a good candidate for either.

 

I presume they paid for it, or it would've been some generic label.

 

I don't know if the people at Dr Pepper paid for the advertising or not, but regardless, I don't think they would have gone with a generic label. The writers were going for a connection between Pepper and the name of the soda.

 

Pepper's cycle of abandonment was made even crueler by having, for a little while, the very best she could hope for--a woman who understood that even though she was mentally retarded that didn't mean she was an infant, that she had desires for grown up things like physical love, mothering, etc.

 

I found it odd that Elsa recognized this about Pepper, but treated Ma Petite like a doll half the time, and a small child the rest of the time.

Edited December 20, 2014 by Blakeston

[Betweenyouandme]

I also found the episode to be sad, but I wouldn't say it had no horror. I find the most terrible horrors are not supernatural or pseudo-scientific, I think there's nothing scarier than a truly evil human being. Pepper's story was scary because it is plausible, and I have no doubt that many mentally challenged people have been framed for a crime by someone who just wanted to get rid of them. Evil. Real, plausible evil. That scares me more than the ghost of Edward Mondrake!

So...American Thriller Story

[WearyTraveler]

So...American Thriller Story

 

I suppose it depends on where you are when you look at it.  If you are, let's say, a woman running away from a serial killer who chained you to a wall in his basement, made you help him recruit other women to be his slaves, and then fed you their bodies when they died, you'd think you are living a true horror story.  BTW what I described is not an exaggeration.  I've forgotten the name of the woman and the killer now, but that was a real case.

Edited December 21, 2014 by WearyTraveler

[LoneHaranguer]

 

I'm not sure if she's supposed to be an actress or a talk show host, though. She doesn't seem like a good candidate for either.

She could have been hosting a variety show or game show. The latter would not have been a happy ending if the show was later hit by the scandals.

[Betweenyouandme]

I suppose it depends on where you are when you look at it. If you are, let's say, a woman running away from a serial killer who chained you to a wall in his basement, made you help him recruit other women to be his slaves, and then fed you their bodes when they died, you'd think you are living a true horror story. BTW what I described is not an exaggeration. I've forgotten the name of the woman and the killer now, but that was a real case.

That definitely is horrible. I just meant the standard difference between horror and thriller. Horror usually means that there is some element of the supernatural, but not everyone agrees with that definition, especially it seems when talking about "torture porn" films.

[Dirtybubble]

All we know is Elsa ended up in Hollywood. I'm not convinced yet she actually became the star she hoped for.

The cover said she still owns Friday night. That leads me to believe that at one point in time, however brief, that she was a popular tv personality but perhaps now her fame is fading and the article is one of those please don't forget about me because I've still got it things. And the magazine was dated 1958 and this was 1962 when pepper saw it.

I could be reading too much into this but one thing RM is good at is things aren't what they appear in his world.

As nice as Elsa appeared to pepper I always felt she was only thinking of herself so it made my blood boil at bit when I saw her on life magazine.

[Mattipoo]

I hate that Elsa even became a star in Hollywood, however brief it was. Hopefully Dandy kills her right after she shot that magazine cover.

[WearyTraveler]

I think Elsa is going to become a "star" when she tells some reporter about the horrors she lived through with Stanley.  She will cry and say she lost all her children to that murderous psycho who just wanted to sell them off.  Then, Mordrake will come and take her away, and all the freak ghosts will be there to see it happen.

[Guest]

Mare had a couple of good lines in this episode.

I thought it was hilarious when Elsa was telling her that Pepper knows how to make drinks and asks if she likes cocktails and Mare's character says "Yes. Yes, I enjoy many cocktails."

The other mean but funny line was when she told her husband that Pepper was so dumb it makes her hurt.

 

I liked "My clogs are piped."  

[English Teacher]

...but how does she make it to Hollywood? Stanley is a grifter...he has no connections. And if he makes it out of juniper alive and intact, I'm boycotting the show.

Such a poignant episode. Incredible acting from all except Roberts. I didn't see Coven so I wasn't on the anti Emma bandwagon. But she plays drunk, sober, happy, and sad with the same exact affect.

[Captanne]

Zima  

 No Dandy? No thank you.

 

I actually misread your post, Zima.  Sorry.  I thought you said, "No Dandy? Thank you."  Italics mine.

 

Sorry but I have to take my upvote back.  

 

Because the less of that character, the better.

[shanti]

This was one thing that kept bothering me through the show - Ma Petit was supposed to be an untouchable, but she was sitting in the Maharaja's lap? Seriously? That would never happen.

[CharmCollector]

 

I suppose it depends on where you are when you look at it.  If you are, let's say, a woman running away from a serial killer who chained you to a wall in his basement, made you help him recruit other women to be his slaves, and then fed you their bodies when they died, you'd think you are living a true horror story.  BTW what I described is not an exaggeration.  I've forgotten the name of the woman and the killer now, but that was a real case.

 

That would be Gary Heidnik.

From Wikipedia:

Heidnik signed his girlfriend Anjeanette Davidson's sister, Alberta, out of a mental institution on day leave and kept her prisoner in a locked storage room in his basement in 1978. After she was found and returned to the hospital, examination revealed that she had been raped and sodomized and that she had contracted gonorrhea. Heidnik was arrested and charged with kidnapping, rape, unlawful restraint, false imprisonment, involuntary deviant sexual intercourse, and interfering with the custody of a committed person.

 

On November 25, 1986, Heidnik abducted his first victim, Josefina Rivera. By January 1987, he had five women held captive in the basement of his house at 3520 North Marshall Street in North Philadelphia.

The captives, who were all African-American women, were raped, beaten, and tortured.[14]

One of the women, Sandra Lindsay, died of a combination of starvation, torture, and an untreated fever. Heidnik dismembered her body but had a problem dealing with the arms and legs, so he put them in a freezer and marked them "dog food". He cooked her ribs in an oven and boiled her head in a pot on the stove. Police came to the house due to the complaints of a bad odor, but left the premises after Heidnik's explanation: “I’m cooking a roast. I fell asleep and it burnt.”[15][16]

 

Several sources state that he ground up the flesh of Lindsay, mixed it with dog food, and fed that to his other victims.[17][18] His defense attorney, Chuck Peruto, said that upon examination of a Cuisinart and other tools in his kitchen, they found no evidence of this. Peruto said that he made up the story to support the insanity defense.[19] The defense attorney said that he started the rumor of cannibalism in public and that in fact there was no evidence of anyone eating human flesh.[19]

 

Heidnik used electric shock as a form of torture. At one point, he forced three of his captives, bound in chains, into a pit. Heidnik ordered Josefina Rivera and another woman to fill the hole with water and then forced Rivera to help him apply electrical current from a stripped extension cord to the women's chains. Deborah Dudley was fatally electrocuted, and Heidnik disposed of her body in the New Jersey Pine Barrens.[16]

 

On March 23, 1987, Heidnik and Rivera abducted Agnes Adams. The next day, Rivera convinced Heidnik to let her go, temporarily, in order to visit her family. He drove her to a gas station and said he would wait for her there. She walked a block away and called 911. She told the police the story and they were somewhat unconvinced at first. The police made her repeat the story and she told it exactly the same way again. The responding officers, more convinced after they looked at her leg and noted the chafing from the chains, went to the gas station and arrested Heidnik. His purported best friend, Cyril ("Tony") Brown, was also arrested. Brown was released on $50,000 bail and an agreement that he would testify against Heidnik. In part, Brown admitted to seeing Sandra Lindsay's death in the basement while in chains and Heidnik dismembering her.[20]

 

Shortly after his arrest, Heidnik attempted to hang himself in his jail cell in April 1987.[21]

[jnymph]

That would be Gary Heidnik.

From Wikipedia:

Heidnik signed his girlfriend Anjeanette Davidson's sister, Alberta, out of a mental institution on day leave and kept her prisoner in a locked storage room in his basement in 1978. After she was found and returned to the hospital, examination revealed that she had been raped and sodomized and that she had contracted gonorrhea. Heidnik was arrested and charged with kidnapping, rape, unlawful restraint, false imprisonment, involuntary deviant sexual intercourse, and interfering with the custody of a committed person.

 

On November 25, 1986, Heidnik abducted his first victim, Josefina Rivera. By January 1987, he had five women held captive in the basement of his house at 3520 North Marshall Street in North Philadelphia.

The captives, who were all African-American women, were raped, beaten, and tortured.[14]

One of the women, Sandra Lindsay, died of a combination of starvation, torture, and an untreated fever. Heidnik dismembered her body but had a problem dealing with the arms and legs, so he put them in a freezer and marked them "dog food". He cooked her ribs in an oven and boiled her head in a pot on the stove. Police came to the house due to the complaints of a bad odor, but left the premises after Heidnik's explanation: “I’m cooking a roast. I fell asleep and it burnt.”[15][16]

 

Several sources state that he ground up the flesh of Lindsay, mixed it with dog food, and fed that to his other victims.[17][18] His defense attorney, Chuck Peruto, said that upon examination of a Cuisinart and other tools in his kitchen, they found no evidence of this. Peruto said that he made up the story to support the insanity defense.[19] The defense attorney said that he started the rumor of cannibalism in public and that in fact there was no evidence of anyone eating human flesh.[19]

 

Heidnik used electric shock as a form of torture. At one point, he forced three of his captives, bound in chains, into a pit. Heidnik ordered Josefina Rivera and another woman to fill the hole with water and then forced Rivera to help him apply electrical current from a stripped extension cord to the women's chains. Deborah Dudley was fatally electrocuted, and Heidnik disposed of her body in the New Jersey Pine Barrens.[16]

 

On March 23, 1987, Heidnik and Rivera abducted Agnes Adams. The next day, Rivera convinced Heidnik to let her go, temporarily, in order to visit her family. He drove her to a gas station and said he would wait for her there. She walked a block away and called 911. She told the police the story and they were somewhat unconvinced at first. The police made her repeat the story and she told it exactly the same way again. The responding officers, more convinced after they looked at her leg and noted the chafing from the chains, went to the gas station and arrested Heidnik. His purported best friend, Cyril ("Tony") Brown, was also arrested. Brown was released on $50,000 bail and an agreement that he would testify against Heidnik. In part, Brown admitted to seeing Sandra Lindsay's death in the basement while in chains and Heidnik dismembering her.[20]

 

Shortly after his arrest, Heidnik attempted to hang himself in his jail cell in April 1987.[21]

 

Now THAT is truly an American Horror Story.

*shudder*

[JenE4]

I didn't really like this episode. However, there were a few entertaining tidbits:

1) Ma Petite being traded for 3 cases of Dr. Pepper 

2) I'm assuming Jimmy cut off his hands while still alive to give to Stanley to pay for his lawyer, but Stanley will keep the money, I presume, leaving poor, clawless Jimmy to rot in jail--until Maggie and the other ladies save the day, I can only imagine.

3) How does Elsa actually become a TV star when Stanley is a fake agent?

4) Desiree called "Esmerelda" "Maggie" early in the espisode--before Maggie told her the truth about her and Stanley. Was that a continuity error or did she let her real identity slip earlier? Actually, I think I'm dense and Jimmy has been in love with "Maggie" all along. For some reason I thought only Stanley knew she's Maggie and she came into the freak show introducing herself as Esmerelda. But now that I think about it, I suppose Esmerelda is just her stage name and they DO know her as Maggie. Lol. I'm leaving this in because my own stupidity over the name was at least entertaining TO ME--and there's not much else more to comment on!

5) Malcolm Jamal Warner is looking good all grown up, and Mare Winningham was entertaining.

 

I hated the forced Pepper storyline to tie into Asylum. Just because "Pepper" was apparently a popular character according to RM, he suddenly decides to tie all of the seasons together to show more Pepper? I think if it was a part of that season I would have liked it more, but it was just so out of place here. At least they did have Pepper's future tie to Elsa's future with the Life magazine. So, if that will become relevant in the last few episodes, then, okay. If it doesn't, and we ONLY see Pepper's future, then maybe it would have worked as bonus material for DVD sales or something. (Do people still buy DVDs? Bonus material on Netflix, maybe.) But within this episode within this season, it didn't work for me. YMMV.

[RazzleberryPie]

Speaking of Orphans, where is Penny/Lizard girl's mother? Last time we saw her dad, he'd been tarred and feathered. First episode in the hospital, she says it was be a Candy Striper or go to reform school, a few episodes later her dad says she's shaming her mother for staying out all night with carnies. So where is this mother?

[JellyFishQueen]

Wow- Roberts bad acting truly shines in this ep for me. It felt like she was purposly doing a bad actress. All I kept on thinking with each scence was, I'M ACTING!!!! Seriously how is she related to her mother? Acting gene got skip?

[designing1]

I'll agree that the acting gene seems to have skipped a generation but that's because her father is Eric Roberts who, when he's not overdoing it, is (I think) a far, far better actor than his sister, Julia Roberts. Emma's mother is also an actress, someone named Kelly Cunningham, whose most recent film is a gem called Gutter Slut, in which she plays the title role. Kelly's IMDB catalog is filled with cheesy-sounding films in which she has roles like The Girl in Glasses, Religious Woman, Model, Pin-up, and -- I swear I'm not making this up -- Rachel's Boobs.

 

So perhaps Emma did indeed get her acting talent from her mother.

[evilandproud]

I have always loved Pepper as a character, but she was quite one dimensional. Naomi Grossman made her fully realized this episode and I am excited that the writing finally gave her a chance to make Pepper more than just the adorable microcephalic. The relationship between her and Elsa, her love for Salty, her devotion to the baby, her desire to please those around her, etc. all just brought the whole character together for me. I'm not a cry baby but that episode made me tear up a few times. It was nice to see that she found a little bit of happiness in Asylum. You could see that she quickly became devoted to Sister Mary Eunice and was very excited to be her pet project. I just....loved everything about this episode. 

One problem I had was a continuity thing, and I realize that complaining about continuity in this show is kind of pointless but anyways. In Asylum Sister Jude told Lana that she had shaved Pepper's hair like that as punishment. I forgot about that until this episode. 

[millahnna]

Didn't she also say that Pepper killed her whole family? I mean in the context of that season I can work with it as a lie of Jude's but I wasn't sure if I was remembering it right.

[jnymph]

It was Shellys head Sister Jude shaved as a punishment, not Peppers.

Also, Sister Mary Eunuce only mentioned Pepper killing her sisters baby, not the whole family.

Edited December 26, 2014 by jnymph

[rubinia]

Off-topic, but I remember hearing about Heidnik's case on a show called "Most Evil." I was horrified by the story until the very end, when the narrator said that when the cops found the women chained up in the basement, Heidnik's response was, "They were there when I moved in."

 

Great episode; I agree with everything said above. I liked seeing Elsa's genuine love and understanding toward Pepper and was sad when she left her with the horrible sister. Also confused as to how Elsa actually made it to Hollywood since Stanley isn't a real agent. And I said it before, but I'll say it again--Stanley's dong will end up in the museum by the end.

[rubinia]

Also--was it sort of implied that maybe the husband raped Pepper? I think the sister said something to her husband like, "Any excuse to get her alone."

[WearyTraveler]

Also--was it sort of implied that maybe the husband raped Pepper? I think the sister said something to her husband like, "Any excuse to get her alone."

I thought this too.  And that the baby was Pepper's.

[hatchetgirl]

Jaysus this was sad. Pepper! How could Elsa take her from all she had ever known to her sister? I get that it was for stupid Asylum tie in, but Damn.

[rubinia]

 

And that the baby was Pepper's.

I didn't think *that* when I saw the show, but now that you mention it, it would make sense, especially given the baby's "deformities." I just don't think this show is quite that subtle, though.

[morgankobi]

I just figured whatever genes caused Pepper's condition was dormant in her sister, but showed up in the baby. 

[Valny]

Watched this ep three times and still cried at the same scene with Pepper and Else saying goodbye. And also when she was in the Asylum.

There was one really nice shot just as Sister Eunice was untying her straight jacket and we have a close up of Pepper slightly turning her head and a tear streams down her face. It was like that tear was on perfect cue or something! 

[basil]

I didn't think [the baby was Pepper's] when I saw the show, but now that you mention it, it would make sense, especially given the baby's "deformities." I just don't think this show is quite that subtle, though.

 

 

Funny, I thought it was obviously Pepper's baby, because of the wife's remarks about the husband wanting Pepper alone. I can see it either way, though.

[DiegoBurger]

I have a hard time believing the sister's husband raped Pepper (because I have an extremely hard time believing that would be consensual.) I think the sister and her husband were just disgusting people - real American horrors. I thought Mare W. was awesome as usual. I don't think I've even seen her play someone so unlikeable.

 

One of the things I loved about this episode was the music - it was very different from the other episodes. It had a melancholy, other-worldliness to it. I wish the season had more of these intense and well-written episodes where you learn a lot and time is not wasted on certain fake fortune tellers and rich serial killers.

[Mattipoo]

Is this the last we see of Pepper? Hopefully she will make an appearance in subsequent seasons. Would be cool to find out what happens to her after "Asylum" if there is a season set in the 1970s or 80s.

[Watermelon]

I have a hard time believing the sister's husband raped Pepper (because I have an extremely hard time believing that would be consensual.) I think the sister and her husband were just disgusting people - real American horrors. I thought Mare W. was awesome as usual. I don't think I've even seen her play someone so unlikeable.

 

One of the things I loved about this episode was the music - it was very different from the other episodes. It had a melancholy, other-worldliness to it. I wish the season had more of these intense and well-written episodes where you learn a lot and time is not wasted on certain fake fortune tellers and rich serial killers.

I got the impression Pepper's brother in law either was raping her or doing something inappropriate. The wife said he would stare at Pepper, and I'm assuming not in disgust.