Season 1 Talk

[Donny Ketchum]

Zoe may have thought that she had a lot of good qualities as well, and if her (now ex) boyfriend couldn't see that, maybe he's not worth her time.

Perhaps.  But it would've helped, perhaps, if they'd thrown in a line of her saying something along those lines.  As it was, she ended up sounding proud of being shallow and unable to see the deeper qualities in people other than their surface charm and appearance.  I like Zoey otherwise, but . . . if she is proud of that, then that's really not a good color on her.

 

ETA: Pretty much what @sinkwriter said.

Edited February 20, 2015 by Donny Ketchum

[twoods]

It's more how Zoey is, that she would rather be called shallow than ugly. That's high school for you, I guess. I still can't believe that her parents didn't think she was shallow- who are they kidding?

Jack is so damn adorable. Those eyelashes and that smile- so cute.

[Rinaldo]

I liked a lot of this episode, found a lot of it to be really funny, but that particular message... I didn't love.

Is everything a message? Her reaction was (for me) amusing evidence that she is shallow, which... we knew already, right? We see evidence of it nearly every episode. She has her better qualities as well, of course. But I wouldn't get much pleasure out of a conclusion that had her saying, "Oh, he found me shallow? Ah, I have seen the light and now understand that this is a matter which I will endeavor to correct. I think we've all learned a valuable lesson here." That's not the style of the show, thank goodness.

 

(And returning to what I wrote earlier this morning, I want to stress that my ridiculous quote was not directed at anything said by anyone here, but at a style of hugging-and-learning family sitcom that I've seen too much of over the years, and never liked that much in the first place. I like people to remain a little bit unredeemable, within limits of course.) 

Edited February 20, 2015 by Rinaldo

[Athena]

It's more how Zoey is, that she would rather be called shallow than ugly. That's high school for you, I guess. I still can't believe that her parents didn't think she was shallow- who are they kidding?

 

It is indeed very high school. Zoey is amusing and has some good qualities, but girl seems to be a Queen Bee type. Looking good is part of her life and it's not an ugly message; she probably thinks taking care of her looks is good. She may not fully understand the implications of that comment on her personality. With time.

 

Dre and Bow are a bit shallow though. Dre and Zoey even get along because of it. This is a sitcom - a sometimes very insightful one - but a comedy none the less. I can accept those sort of exaggerations for comedic effect once in awhile.

[sinkwriter]

 

Is everything a message? Her reaction was (for me) amusing evidence that she is shallow, which... we knew already, right? We see evidence of it nearly every episode. She has her better qualities as well, of course. But I wouldn't get much pleasure out of a conclusion that had her saying, "Oh, he found me shallow? Ah, I have seen the light and now understand that this is a matter which I will endeavor to correct. I think we've all learned a valuable lesson here." That's not the style of the show, thank goodness.

 

That's not exactly what I meant. I'm not looking for this show to be anything less than its unusual self, I'm not looking for it to turn all "after school special." So maybe "message" was not the right word for me to use.

 

What I'm saying is, there is a way to allow Zoey to be herself, shallowness included, but also to show kids who might be watching this that there is more to her than just that shallow side. It doesn't have to be hit-you-over-the-head "lesson of the week" but to have her simply be happy with being seen as shallow does send a message that I think is not great for kids to absorb. Zoey doesn't have to change or see the light or "learn a valuable lesson," she doesn't have to change at all. But I do believe there is more to her than the shallowness (or along with her shallowness), and I wish Dre had said that. In a funny way, of course.

[xaxat]

Funny tid-bit: the actress who plays Diane is named Marsai Martin. I wonder if that's why Andre was from Marseille and not Paris, for example.

 

"Paris, is that near Compton?" Not quite as funny.

[shura]

Dre and Bow are a bit shallow though.

 

Bow is shallow? How so? I don't think I've seen anything that showed her being any more shallow than any regular person.

[Athena]

Bow is shallow? How so? I don't think I've seen anything that showed her being any more shallow than any regular person.

 

I do think Dre is the more shallow one. Bow is probably not more shallow than your average person. I loved the storyline of her trying to show their neighbour that they were still well off including wearing all her expensive clothing & jewellery and taking an expensive car for a test run just to show off. I do love how flawed she is though.

[dirtypop90]

Most (if not all) high school kids would rather be called shallow than ugly

Edited February 21, 2015 by dirtypop90

[mojito]

I thought that Dre's reaction to his daughter dating a white boy was so very George Jefferson-ish and more in keeping with humor of the 1970s.  Why in the world would he discuss this with his white co-workers, particularly considering his point of view? I can handle a good amount of exaggeration for comic effect, but reverse discrimination as humor is tired and outdated.  I think it would've been funnier and more realistic if Andre had tried to pretend that he didn't care about the boyfriend's race to prove how much he's evolved while we, the viewers, could see that he was biting his tongue and trying to contain himself. Of course, he could express his thoughts in private to Bow. But at work? No.

 

As usual, there were a few chuckles throughout the show.

[maggiemae]

OTOH I think either Bow or Dre should have planted a seed with Zoey.....ie I wonder why he said that? 

 

And then gone on to something else. Like the grilled cheese!

[topanga]

I thought that Dre's reaction to his daughter dating a white boy was so very George Jefferson-ish and more in keeping with humor of the 1970s.  Why in the world would he discuss this with his white co-workers, particularly considering his point of view? I can handle a good amount of exaggeration for comic effect, but reverse discrimination as humor is tired and outdated.  I think it would've been funnier and more realistic if Andre had tried to pretend that he didn't care about the boyfriend's race to prove how much he's evolved while we, the viewers, could see that he was biting his tongue and trying to contain himself. Of course, he could express his thoughts in private to Bow. But at work? No.

So far this season, Andre has been a classic extrovert who processes his thoughts out loud, usually in the privacy of his home, but sometimes not. We've already seen him have big discussions with his co-workers about racial issues and parenting issues, so nothing seems like a taboo topic at work. I think Dre feels comfortable discussing any topic with anyone, especially his co-workers.

 

And in terms of interracial dating, many parents, even the most progressive, tolerant, and sophisticated parents, prefer that their children would date within the same cultural or religious group. I don't have any hard data. Just speaking on anecdotal evidence from my black, white, Jewish, East Indian, Latino, and East Asian friends and family members.

 

"Paris, is that near Compton?" Not quite as funny.

So true!

Edited February 22, 2015 by topanga

[Mrs OldManBalls]

Most (if not all) high school kids would rather be called shallow than ugly

I'd rather be called shallow over ugly. ( For the record neither is true) (if you ask my mom)

[Empress1]

 

[channeling my inner Zoey] Where can I find that raspberry dress that Bow wore to her pampering appointment?! [/channeling my inner Zoey]

YAAAAAAAASSSSSSS. Want want want! Tracee Ross looked GORGEOUS in that scene.

 

I wasn't surprised by Dre's reaction but I was surprised that he'd be surprised that his daughter would date a white kid. Statistically, given the environment they're in, it's likely to happen. I remember when I was in (a private, predominantly white) high school, there really weren't enough black boys to go around - there weren't a lot of black students, period, and most of them were female. 

 

Bekeisha. No God, honey.

[mojito]

 

We've already seen him have big discussions with his co-workers about racial issues and parenting issues, so nothing seems like a taboo topic at work. I think Dre feels comfortable discussing any topic with anyone, especially his co-workers.

It's one thing to take racial stances against inequality and insensitivity at work; it's another thing to take a bigoted stance yourself. I would never admit such a thing to my white co-workers. Best case: they'd challenge me on my hypocrisy. Worst case: they'd be disgusted with me and I'd lose a lot of credibility with them.

[ridethemaverick]

Loved this episode. Brilliant use of Bump and Grind.

I agree that Zoe is shallow and that was kind of the point. But hell, I'm twice her age and I'd rather be called shallow than ugly.

Diane continues to be a little TOO cute for me, but the dimples are so adorable that I guess I'll get over it.

MS is great as junior. My favorite kid, by far.

[kia112]

It's one thing to take racial stances against inequality and insensitivity at work; it's another thing to take a bigoted stance yourself. I would never admit such a thing to my white co-workers. Best case: they'd challenge me on my hypocrisy. Worst case: they'd be disgusted with me and I'd lose a lot of credibility with them.

 

One thing I like about this show is how the people at work talk about these issues, but no one actually changes their minds.  It didn't bother me because, whatever they thought of Dre, this wasn't going to change it.

[Rinaldo]

Also, fathers' unhappiness with their daughters' first boyfriends, on whatever or no pretext, seems to be pretty much par for the course -- in life no less than in sitcomland, if what I hear from work colleagues in the hall is any indication. I would take any such complaint not as hypocrisy but as everyday blather over lunch, and at most think "Eh, it'll be something else tomorrow."

[mojito]

 

I would take any such complaint not as hypocrisy but as everyday blather over lunch, and at most think "Eh, it'll be something else tomorrow."

My corporate world experience  is clearly different than yours. Friends at work would pounce all over me if I were to admit that I didn't like my child dating a white kid. They would quickly remind me that I was being a bigot and ask me why it's okay for me to discriminate but not them. Even if you've not experienced this yourself, you must watch the news enough to know this happens all the time.

 

I know this is a comedy. I just can't help but see this incident (Dre talking to his co-workers about this) to be a major misstep of the writers. In real life, Dre would be too smart to express these feelings at work.

 

Now, take race out of the equation, and I'm in total agreement with you about people dismissing his gripes.

[ridethemaverick]

My corporate world experience is clearly different than yours. Friends at work would pounce all over me if I were to admit that I didn't like my child dating a white kid. They would quickly remind me that I was being a bigot and ask me why it's okay for me to discriminate but not them. Even if you've not experienced this yourself, you must watch the news enough to know this happens all the time.

I know this is a comedy. I just can't help but see this incident (Dre talking to his co-workers about this) to be a major misstep of the writers. In real life, Dre would be too smart to express these feelings at work.

Now, take race out of the equation, and I'm in total agreement with you about people dismissing his gripes.

I have a different experience than you as well. My white, black, and Indian colleagues and I have had this conversation at a happy hour. I guess they're just progressive*, but we all shared our preferences. Some of us preferred for our kids to marry within our race/culture, others of us didn't care one way or the other.

The scene rang true to me, particularly in such a liberal setting.

*And they would never play that "reverse racism" bullshit. Ever. They're too smart.

[mojito]

Poor comparison, happy hour at a bar with selected co-workers vs a conference room where people have no doubt gathered to discuss business. In my world, those are two totally different environments.

Edited February 24, 2015 by mojito

[jhlipton]

Diane brings comedy and cuteness to every scene she's in. I can't believe I never noticed her adorable dimples till she delivered that line to Bow.

 

When the three women were sitting on the couch with Andre (the French one), Diane was looking at him with such awe!  I had to pause to show my wife -- it was so cute.

[Tiger]

This episode was firing on all cylinders. Zoey's throwaway line about publicly acknowledging Junior as her cousin had me rolling for some reason. The actress' dry delivery is just perfect.

The final Shinning-esque creeped me out and now I can't sleep. TER killed it though. I liked her on Girlfriends, but I don't remember her facial expression game being this damn good.

Also, the younger white co-worker who looked like he rolled around in cheeto dust? Gold. Or, uh neon orange!

Edited February 26, 2015 by Tiger

[formerlyfreedom]

Dre, determined to make up for the no-frills, last-minute wedding he and Bow had, organizes an amazing vow renewal for their 15th anniversary. But when Bow's hippie-dippy parents, Alicia and the very white Paul show up unannounced -- bombshells are dropped and old disagreements re-ignite between the two families, especially with Pops and Ruby.

 

 

[Writing Wrongs]

"The Adam's apple is like the throat's balls." LOL

[Eegah]

The stuff with the co-workers finally crossed the line of believability. They've always been kind of cartoon strawmen, but you could still kind of buy that someone would be that oblivious. But "They were bullying us by being different"? That's Captain Planet level writing there.

 

Luckily, the rest was awesome. My mother was laughing a little too hard at Bow's story, which I imagine brought back some memories.

[Expat]

It was nice to see Diane act like the little girl that she is for once.

 

I hated the Dre/Junior thing. Dre is getting more unlikeable by the eppie. It's mostly the writing I think. I've liked AA since Hang Time, so I don't wanna dislike this character, but it's not looking good.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Where did the photons go?

[funkopop]

Bow wanting to assure the principal that "black people don't randomly break out into dance. This is a big moment for him." was hilarious.

Edited February 26, 2015 by funkopop

[peeayebee]

What I don't get is how Cody wasn't suspended after punching the janitor.

 

But I liked this ep. It really was nice seeing Diane as a little girl. And it's weird that I often find her to be a bad actress but a great comedienne.

 

Bow: The dark is the absence of photons. That's it.

Diane: Wait. So there's no photons?
Bow: Nope.
Diane: Where did the photons go? Did they go into me? Oh God. I'm full of photons!

 

Diane: No one's safe. Night is coming.

 

She just has great delivery.

 

Of course Junior is outstanding as usual. He got to deliver a bunch of funny put-downs, but I also loved the way he said, "This website says that home schooling isn't just for weirdos."

 

It was clear early on that Junior was going to become the bully, but I still enjoyed it. 

 

Diane and Jack as the twins from the shining was fantastic. My DVR cut off at the very end when Bow started talking to the person on the phone. What did she say?

 

Also, what did Andre say when Diane woke him up in bed?

[funkopop]

What I don't get is how Cody wasn't suspended after punching the janitor.

 

But I liked this ep. It really was nice seeing Diane as a little girl. And it's weird that I often find her to be a bad actress but a great comedienne.

 

Bow: The dark is the absence of photons. That's it.

Diane: Wait. So there's no photons?

Bow: Nope.

Diane: Where did the photons go? Did they go into me? Oh God. I'm full of photons!

 

Diane: No one's safe. Night is coming.

 

She just has great delivery.

 

Of course Junior is outstanding as usual. He got to deliver a bunch of funny put-downs, but I also loved the way he said, "This website says that home schooling isn't just for weirdos."

 

It was clear early on that Junior was going to become the bully, but I still enjoyed it. 

 

Diane and Jack as the twins from the shining was fantastic. My DVR cut off at the very end when Bow started talking to the person on the phone. What did she say?

 

Also, what did Andre say when Diane woke him up in bed?

 

Andre said no Oprah, my wife is coming

[peeayebee]

Thanks!

[teebax]

I loved this episode and also think it was firing on all cylinders. There aren't any characters on the show I dislike, so it's hard for there to be a bad episode from my viewpoint. If I had to pick my least favorite character, it would probably be Charles, but he doesn't even really bother me. (I think I still harbor a little resentment toward him for putting on Dre's Jordans, which is a huge no-no in my book.)

 

This episode had so many repeatable lines that I am going to re-watch it just so I can memorize some of them. Junior's insult to Dre about parting his teeth had me howling. 

 

Little Diane is absolutely hilarious. The whole subplot with her and Bow was really well done. 

 

I grew up in a black household with four siblings, so I could completely relate to the insults flying back and forth. I remember the first time my now-ex girlfriend met my family. She asked me afterward if we even liked each other. She was an only child and had no idea how siblings talk to each other. It didn't take her long to realize there's actually a lot of love behind the teasing. 

 

ETA another one I just remembered:

"Guys, I've got bad news"
"Kim Kardashian stopped messing with black guys?"
"Worse."
"Zoe Saldana stopped messing with white guys?"

Edited February 26, 2015 by teebax

[Luciano]

I was cracking up with the Yo Mama montage, complete with the President's SOTU burn. I was wondering where they were going with the cartoon bits since slavery was part of Dre's history lesson, but they did nicely by just putting that the producers thought best not to animate that part because it was "too much of a bummer."

[Granny58]

I thought TER really nailed then delivery when she had the answer to her prayers and was shocked!!!  "God you heard me?  Are you listening???"

[Whitley Trillbert]

The Raven Symone with a fade insult that Andre threw at Junior took me completely under. I laughed for about a good five minutes.  

 

I swear I just want to spend a day with this entire cast, their chemistry just shines throughout the show and makes it more enjoyable than it already is. 

[ChromaKelly]

I LOVED this episode! Probably one of my favorites. The burns took me right back to middle school. I could also relate to Bow's storyline with getting no sleep and being so thankful that your children are sleeping, no matter what it is that helps them sleep.

[DrSparkles]

I was cracking up with the Yo Mama montage, complete with the President's SOTU burn. I was wondering where they were going with the cartoon bits since slavery was part of Dre's history lesson, but they did nicely by just putting that the producers thought best not to animate that part because it was "too much of a bummer."

The SOTU burn solidified my undying love.

Eta: i hope I don't get your thick neck...

Raven Symone with a fade!

Edited February 26, 2015 by DrSparkles

[Athena]

I really enjoyed seeing Diane act like a little kid. She is amusing but edges on being too precocious sometimes. She also gives good burns, maybe even better than her brothers and her Dad.

 

Love Bow.

[kia112]

I really enjoyed seeing Diane act like a little kid. She is amusing but edges on being too precocious sometimes. She also gives good burns, maybe even better than her brothers and her Dad.

 

But she was so scandalized when Junior said she looked like the world's youngest librarian,

[Mozelle]

I loved this episode too. That entire scene at the office when Dre and Charles went in on Josh had me dying. Diane's hand on her chest and scandalized look when Junior said that she looked like a librarian was perfect, too.

Lastly, Dre's burn about Junior looking like Raven Symone with a fade was hilarious given that she's going to guest star as Dre's sister in an upcoming episode.

Edited February 27, 2015 by Mozelle

[attica]

When my alarm went off (entirely too early) this morning, my first coherent thought was: Oh no. Photons.

[ridethemaverick]

Best. Episode. Ever!

Where I grew up we called it jonin' but regardless, this episode felt like home. Loved all of the insults and how offended Diane got when they snapped on her glasses. I actually even liked Diane this episode which never happens.

Dre and Charlie giddily going in, Josh and his dayglow tan, Zoe claiming Junior, the parted teeth, I mean everything was good. And I agree with Junior...Dre really should sit down and watch Star Wars.

This show just keeps getting better. I hate that it's on opposite Empire but thank goodness for DVRs.

I'm about to watch again.

[Watermelon]

Best. Episode. Ever!

Where I grew up we called it jonin' but regardless, this episode felt like home. Loved all of the insults and how offended Diane got when they snapped on her glasses. I actually even liked Diane this episode which never happens.

Dre and Charlie giddily going in, Josh and his dayglow tan, Zoe claiming Junior, the parted teeth, I mean everything was good. And I agree with Junior...Dre really should sit down and watch Star Wars.

This show just keeps getting better. I hate that it's on opposite Empire but thank goodness for DVRs.

I'm about to watch again.

You from DC?

[ridethemaverick]

You from DC?

Atlanta

[Jade Foxx]

 

Where I grew up we called it jonin'

 

We called it baggin' - good old LA/Inglewood, baybee!

 

This episode was perfection.

[tennisgurl]

Where did the Photons go?!?!

 

I love Bow so dang much "I am going to hang up this phone, and I want you to call 911. For me."

 

Diane was so cute in this episode! Its good to see her acting like a little kid. 

 

Dre does tend to give mixed messages in his advice. And he really does need to watch Star Wars. 

[Mozelle]

We called it baggin' - good old LA/Inglewood, baybee!

 

This episode was perfection.

 

I grew up in Inglewood, too, and was about to say the same! I caught Dre using "baggin'" as well, which was a nice touch given that he's supposed to come from Compton.

 

This episode really was perfection.

[jhlipton]

I'd heard insults called "dozens" before, but never knew where the term came form.  If Dre is right about iy's origin, the term itself is a major burn.  

Bow: The dark is the absence of photons. That's it.
Diane: Wait. So there's no photons?
Bow: Nope.
Diane: Where did the photons go? Did they go into me? Oh God. I'm full of photons!

 
So we actually got two Kubrick references -- "Oh my God, it's full of stars!" is too close not to be a call-back.
 

I really enjoyed seeing Diane act like a little kid. She is amusing but edges on being too precocious sometimes.

"I read at a 10th grade level" -- of course she does!

[peeayebee]

So we actually got two Kubrick references -- "Oh my God, it's full of stars!" is too close not to be a call-back.

What movie is that star quote from and what's the context?