S02.E04: The Principal’s Office

[DanaK]

Quote

WEDNESDAY, OCT. 12 9:00-9:31 p.m.

After Gregory sends a disruptive student to the principal's office, he's dismayed to find out the kids actually enjoy spending the supposed disciplinary time with Ava. Meanwhile, Melissa invites Janine over to her house to teach her how to cook, but Janine becomes determined to reunite Melissa with her estranged sister. 

[BAForever]

Oh Gregory.  Every elementary teacher feels your pain in this situation. Find a buddy teacher to send a child too. Principals let them play on the IPad and give them Starburst candies. 

Barbara is right. Connecting with kids is the best way to have a well-managed class. Relationships before Rigor (hate the buzz word Rigor).

Edited October 13, 2022 by BAForever

[rollacoaster]

Ahhhhhh ha haaaaa! 

Not the janitor shaming Gregory like he Cersei Lannister!

Edited October 13, 2022 by rollacoaster

[Night Cheese]

I really enjoyed Melissa and Janine's storyline. Those two are like oil and vinegar, but they have such an interesting dynamic that isn't explored very often. Melissa has her own brand of nice and she doesn't always show it, but it's great when she does. Inviting Janine into her home to personally teach her how to cook is very sweet of her. I also noticed the actress has incorporated the long "O" sound into her speech, which is one of the easiest characteristics of a Philly/southwest PA accent. I wonder if she heard the criticism that her accent was too much of a broad NY accent than Philly. Either way, I'm glad she's making the effort to make her character seem more genuine.

[Mountainair]

I have a few friends in my class that need special attention. If they have an IEP in place they are mostly treated like Micha by all staff. It can be a struggle but he had the right idea by finding a way to connect with him through Bluey. Sometimes you just have to feign interest in order to connect and that can make all the difference. We have one particular child that needs what we call an EC (exceptional teacher) on him at all times due to his ADD/ODD/Autism and violent outbursts. I have finally found a way to connect with him without his EC  present and that has been very rewarding. On the other hand, I have a child who lives in la-la land and I can’t get through to him for anything. But no IEP in place so it’s hard to get him the help he deserves. The education system is interesting.

Enjoyed the cooking scenes outside of the school but would have liked to see what they were making :)

Edited October 13, 2022 by Mountainair

[emma675]

I'm still laughing over Melissa getting sloppy drunk and reminiscing about the good times with her sister, which included a photo of her punching said sister in the face. 

I was honestly touched by the real reason for their feud. Some people can't handle a loved one getting sick and running away is how they cope. It's not noble and it makes it even harder for the ones who stick around to see that loved one through their illness. I totally understand where Melissa is coming from and her sister and her red potato gnocchi can suck it.

Oh, Janine. Once again she takes it too far but has sweet reasons for doing it. Her mother and Gregory's father are real pieces of work. It's a true testament to their characters that they've turned out to be caring, successful adults. 

[Blakeston]

I'm fine with Janine being naive and clueless, but sometimes her actions are just over-the-top. Like thinking it was in any way appropriate to try to make amends on Melissa's behalf. Come on, Janine, you're an adult.

[Annber03]

Awwwwwww, Gregory using Bluey to connect with the kid :). That was so cute. I felt for him at the end when his dad called. I also liked Barbara and Gregory bonding as they did over this whole situation. Ava being annoyed by them teaming up made it all the more entertaining :D. 

I LOVE Melissa's house. It's so her, I can totally see her having that whole look and style and decorative taste. It feels very inviting, which is interesting, given the storyline about her issues with her sister. I too like Melissa and Janine's dynamic - ironically, they seem to have kind of a sisterly vibe developing, too. And I have a sister, so I could very much relate to their thoughts and struggles with their own sisters. All those ups and downs, and yet there's still that close familial pull/bond. I agree Janine should've let Melissa and her sister sort things out themselves, but it's also so like her to want to try and help people, and I sympathized with her reasons, so...

I'd love to see Melissa and Janine team up to cook something, too. Maybe for a holiday or a staff get-together or something? 

[JeanJean]

I really liked this episode, even thought it was kind of cringey for Janine to think it was okay to do what she did.

There's something very comfy about this show, if that makes sense. Like a beloved afghan someone in your family knitted and passed along. Like some of Janine's sweaters!

And even though it was pointed out repeatedly when the show started that stylewise it borrowed from "The Office," one thing this show has that that show didn't - the characters love their jobs.

Edited October 13, 2022 by JeanJean

[possibilities]

I still really love how the kids on this show really seem like kids, not actors. 

[JeanJean]

I'm surprised we didn't see Melissa's new aide this episode.

[JakeyJokes]

8 hours ago, rollacoaster said:

Ahhhhhh ha haaaaa! 

Not the janitor shaming Gregory like he Cersei Lannister!

I fell OUT at that part. 

6 hours ago, emma675 said:

I'm still laughing over Melissa getting sloppy drunk and reminiscing about the good times with her sister, which included a photo of her punching said sister in the face. 

I was honestly touched by the real reason for their feud. Some people can't handle a loved one getting sick and running away is how they cope. It's not noble and it makes it even harder for the ones who stick around to see that loved one through their illness. I totally understand where Melissa is coming from and her sister and her red potato gnocchi can suck it.

Oh, Janine. Once again she takes it too far but has sweet reasons for doing it. Her mother and Gregory's father are real pieces of work. It's a true testament to their characters that they've turned out to be caring, successful adults. 

It’s an interesting parallel with all three of these characters and their families. Just like Melissa resented Kristin for fleeing when Nana got ill, Janine resents her sister for leaving the state and not having to deal with their toxic mother. As for Gregory, he has a decent relationship with his father on the surface but is only now understanding how much of his strict upbringing may have shaped negatively him. That this show could do all that and still have been maybe the funniest episode in its young history is amazing. 
 

I see that this show is doing with Sheryl Lee Ralph what 30 Rock did with Jane Krakowski, which is just find creative ways to show off that someone in the cast can sing. 
 

I also loved the smash cuts of Janine’s confessionals every time she was hurt about the sisters insulting her cooking.

[EtheltoTillie]

6 hours ago, JeanJean said:

I'm surprised we didn't see Melissa's new aide this episode.

This seemed like they’re showing episodes out of order. They will have to return to that I guess. 

[Empress1]

10 hours ago, Night Cheese said:

I also noticed the actress has incorporated the long "O" sound into her speech, which is one of the easiest characteristics of a Philly/southwest PA accent. I wonder if she heard the criticism that her accent was too much of a broad NY accent than Philly.

Nearly everyone who has to do a Philly accent does a NYC or generic tough-guy accent (and in fairness, it’s a hard one to do) so I was pleased to hear Lisa Ann Walter’s O’s.

8 hours ago, possibilities said:

I still really love how the kids on this show really seem like kids, not actors. 

“Now, you KNOW he don’t know.” I fell out. And Micah was cute! Disruptive, but cute.

9 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I'm fine with Janine being naive and clueless, but sometimes her actions are just over-the-top. Like thinking it was in any way appropriate to try to make amends on Melissa's behalf. Come on, Janine, you're an adult.

Totally inappropriate and out of bounds, but very Janine. She’s still on that “we’re a family!” tip, which I am on the record as disliking, and we know it’s because she doesn’t have much of a life outside of work - but she needs to build one of her own, not insert herself into her colleagues’.

10 hours ago, Mountainair said:

Enjoyed the cooking scenes outside of the school but would have liked to see what they were making :)

Looked like Melissa had pesto in the blender (which really is easy to make).

[Aileen]

10 hours ago, JeanJean said:

I'm surprised we didn't see Melissa's new aide this episode.

I assumed that this should have been the third episode to air and last week's should have been the fourth.

[Seelouis]

Was the photo of Melissa at her sisters wedding showing Melissa wearing a wedding dress?  😂

[Enigma X]

Yeah. I love this show, but Janine did grate a lot this time around. It is not so much that I would not expect this from Janine but that I feel she did not get why it was overstepping by the end of the episode and will do it again.

[Pop Tart]

What I'm really appreciating about the show is how the small moments work to fully develop the characters. Ava could just be a cartoon bad principal/manager and while it seemed at first, to Gregory and the viewers, that she was just slacking off by not disciplining the kids. It becomes clear, in her talk with Gregory, that she does know what she's doing. In sending a 7-year-old to her office, the walk there alone is going to be punishment enough if any is even needed, and that perhaps punishment isn't the way to go with a kid Micah's age. 

Quinta and her writers are doing such a good job at making these well-rounded people and not just caricatures.

[JeanJean]

42 minutes ago, Seelouis said:

Was the photo of Melissa at her sisters wedding showing Melissa wearing a wedding dress?  😂

I think so!

21 minutes ago, Pop Tart said:

What I'm really appreciating about the show is how the small moments work to fully develop the characters. Ava could just be a cartoon bad principal/manager and while it seemed at first, to Gregory and the viewers, that she was just slacking off by not disciplining the kids. It becomes clear, in her talk with Gregory, that she does know what she's doing. In sending a 7-year-old to her office, the walk there alone is going to be punishment enough if any is even needed, and that perhaps punishment isn't the way to go with a kid Micah's age. 

Quinta and her writers are doing such a good job at making these well-rounded people and not just caricatures.

I thought that with Ava, too.

[Crashcourse]

I loved the look on the little girl's face when Barbara was taking too long singing happy birthday.

Those kids aren't actors, they're just being themselves, and I love it!

[mansonlamps]

12 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I'm fine with Janine being naive and clueless, but sometimes her actions are just over-the-top. Like thinking it was in any way appropriate to try to make amends on Melissa's behalf. Come on, Janine, you're an adult.

Sadly Janine is quickly becoming my least favorite part of the show.  I hope they bring back her sweet naive personality without the constant trying to fix things.

[Crashcourse]

How old is Janine supposed to be?  She really does seem to be clueless at times.  At first I didn't mind if she and Gregory got together, but now I'm wondering if she's too naive (and nosy) to be anyone's girlfriend right now.

[Blakeston]

I thought Ava was wrong about how she handles kids coming to her office.

I understand her not feeling the need to yell at a crying, scared kid. But if she brings them back to the classroom with a toy and candy and jokes with them in front of the other students, then going to the principal's office becomes a reward, and pandemonium ensues (as we saw here).

[DearEvette]

2 hours ago, Seelouis said:

Was the photo of Melissa at her sisters wedding showing Melissa wearing a wedding dress?  😂

Yes.  The petty is large in Melissa and I am here for it!

I loved the cold open. Barbara singing like Randy Watson in Sexual Chocolate.  The kids were great they just wanted to get to chowing on cupcakes. I especially loved the birthday boy after she does the 'How old are you now' chorus saying – very annoyed – 'I'm six' as he blows out a the ginormous '6' candle.

Janine has a play cousin.  Oh that is so on brand.

Also Janine was super annoying  this episode!

I loved Melissa's sister calling Janine Bilbo Baggins

Melissa saying she would never poison anyone because if she took someone out she'd want to watch them go was my favorite line.

My second favorite line was Mr Johnson doing the Game of Thrones 'Shame, Shame Shame' on Gregory.  LOL.

Did we know Gregory's father was in the military?  I know in the threads last season I made a supposition that he was because of the way Gregory behaves, but I wasn't sure if it was canonical fact until this episode.

[jah1986]

I liked this episode as well, although Janine really was irritating me getting in Melissa's business.

One moment that made me laugh was Mr. Johnson saying "another sister". This is a man who likes to be in the know. I don't remember knowing Janine had a sister before now either, I wonder if we'll see her at any point this season.

[JeanJean]

19 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

Did we know Gregory's father was in the military?  I know in the threads last season I made a supposition that he was because of the way Gregory behaves, but I wasn't sure if it was canonical fact until this episode.

I think it came up in the first season. Maybe the episode where Gregory and Barbara plant a garden?

It would be interesting if in later seasons, we see Micah again and he's settled down. I've seen that happen with students. They change so much from year to year.

Edited October 13, 2022 by JeanJean

[tennisgurl]

The opener with Barbara getting very into the happy birthday song while the kid looks long suffering was great. Poor kid just wants his cake while Barbara wants to get her solo on. 

I really liked Janine and Melissa's story, even if Janine took it way too far trying to get the sisters to reunite. A lot of Janine's busy body tendencies seem to be based around her own issues, hopefully she can start unpacking one of these days, I think that she would ease up a lot more. 

Gregory continues to grow a lot as a teacher, its tough to know how to deal with disruptive students I can imagine, especially when they're so young. You don't want to overly discipline them to the point where they're scared of you, but you still need rules. Gregory is settling in as a teacher, but he also looked quite comfy in Ava's chair...

2 hours ago, Seelouis said:

Was the photo of Melissa at her sisters wedding showing Melissa wearing a wedding dress?  😂

And another picture was of the two of them putting her sisters cat down...the cat who's name she legally changed to Melissa for the occasion. Pettiness truly runs deep in their family and I love it.

Shame! Shaaaame!

Edited October 13, 2022 by tennisgurl

[Empress1]

1 hour ago, Crashcourse said:

How old is Janine supposed to be?  She really does seem to be clueless at times.  At first I didn't mind if she and Gregory got together, but now I'm wondering if she's too naive (and nosy) to be anyone's girlfriend right now.

I’m thinking early-mid 20s. This is her second or third year teaching.

[DearEvette]

21 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

1 hour ago, Crashcourse said:

How old is Janine supposed to be?  She really does seem to be clueless at times.  At first I didn't mind if she and Gregory got together, but now I'm wondering if she's too naive (and nosy) to be anyone's girlfriend right now.

I’m thinking early-mid 20s. This is her second or third year teaching.

That's a good question.  She does skew young, Jacob as well in some ways.  Does anyone know if you have to have a Master's degree to teach in PA?  In New York  I believe in order get permanent certification you need a Master's degree within 5 years of getting your initial (BA) certification.

[perkie1968]

16 hours ago, Mountainair said:

Enjoyed the cooking scenes outside of the school but would have liked to see what they were making :)

The first night it looked like spaghetti, which Janine brought to school the next day and made them all eat it.  The second night, with the sister there, Melissa was making meatballs.  

2 hours ago, Crashcourse said:

How old is Janine supposed to be?  She really does seem to be clueless at times

I found it hard to beleive that she didn't know how to cook because Tariq did all the cooking.  Tariq looked like he had no idea where the kitchen was, much less did all the cooking.  

[sweetandsour]

Ava relaxalotles all day, every day.

I truly believe that Jacob will look back at his career and being called Mr. C with such fondness.

I like that Gregory and Janine argue with each other, rather than Gregory treating her differently because he obviously has feelings for her.

I'm glad Gregory already scrapped his aggressively-plotted curriculum scheduling, or Micah's Bingo and Bluey obsession would have driven him to madness.

[Ms Blue Jay]

16 hours ago, emma675 said:

Oh, Janine. Once again she takes it too far but has sweet reasons for doing it. Her mother and Gregory's father are real pieces of work. It's a true testament to their characters that they've turned out to be caring, successful adults. 

I'm so glad the show 'goes there'.  It's so relatable and 90% of sitcoms won't even touch issues like this.

[Crashcourse]

1 hour ago, perkie1968 said:

I found it hard to beleive that she didn't know how to cook because Tariq did all the cooking.  Tariq looked like he had no idea where the kitchen was, much less did all the cooking.  

Tariq was portrayed as being lazy and living off Janine, but I thought it was interesting that he did all the cooking.  So he did contribute, in addition to the 20% for expenses.   I do hope we see him again and I hope he's doing well.

[kathyk24]

Janine tries to solve problems when she can so it makes sense she would try to help Melissa. I felt bad for her when she said she hadn't seen her sister. I'm waiting for her mother to show up so Barbara will tell her off.

[Snapdragon]

3 hours ago, perkie1968 said:

I found it hard to beleive that she didn't know how to cook because Tariq did all the cooking.  Tariq looked like he had no idea where the kitchen was, much less did all the cooking.  

Yeah, I found that hard to believe too.  I can't see Tariq taking the time to do the grocery shopping, much less having the patience or skill to actually cook something.  And if he did cook something, I would imagine he'd get "creative" with the recipe and it would turn out a mess.  It would have been more believable to say that Janine and Tariq just lived off of take out and tv dinners but now that Janine is trying to save money, she's having to cook instead.

[Crashcourse]

Since Tariq was such a natural with the kids, I can believe he'd be a good cook.  I could see him being a stay-at-home dad and enjoying it. 

[chitowngirl]

1 hour ago, Snapdragon said:

I can't see Tariq taking the time to do the grocery shopping, much less having the patience or skill to actually cook something.

I see Janine doing (and paying for) the grocery shopping.

[Crashcourse]

1 minute ago, chitowngirl said:

I see Janine doing (and paying for) the grocery shopping.

But Tariq would have to give her a list because she wouldn't have a clue. 🤣

[gesundheit]

20 hours ago, possibilities said:

I still really love how the kids on this show really seem like kids, not actors. 

Absolutely. I rewound the Happy Birthday scene so many times just to enjoy each "kid actor" once all the way through. They were freakin' perfect, even the one who did a faceplant in such a low-commitment real-kid way! Some children's acting coaches in Hollywood right now are really nailing it instead of churning out the old-school Child!Star! types. And the casting director here has a hell of an eye.

6 hours ago, DearEvette said:

That's a good question.  She does skew young, Jacob as well in some ways.  Does anyone know if you have to have a Master's degree to teach in PA?  In New York  I believe in order get permanent certification you need a Master's degree within 5 years of getting your initial (BA) certification.

You don't need a Master's in PA, no. 

Did Gregory get a Master's though, I assume? I don't remember a ton of details from last season but I remember he'd said that was the educational track he'd been on in school, so I was assuming Master's in Educational Leadership or something?

Edited October 14, 2022 by gesundheit

[Night Cheese]

15 minutes ago, Crashcourse said:

Since Tariq was such a natural with the kids, I can believe he'd be a good cook.  I could see him being a stay-at-home dad and enjoying it. 

That's a great point, I can see that too. I really like how they've given Tariq some nuance. When they first introduced him I thought "of courrrrrse Janine's got a deadbeat boyfriend who drives her car without paying for gas and happily eats her breakfast and wakes up at noon." But despite not being right for Janine now that they're not teenagers anymore, he's not a totally bad guy. They could have gone that route, but they didn't and that was a pleasant surprise. He's going to make a good partner to someone one day. Most likely a partner that doesn't need a 50/50 relationship, but will be happy with an 80/20, but he'll find love with someone. As will Janine.

[JakeyJokes]

I read somewhere that they use “real” kids as opposed to child actors. I’d assume they have to directly cast actors for speaking roles, but the extras are neighborhood L.A. kids and that they always shape up when Sheryl Lee Ralph walks into the room.

[gesundheit]

4 hours ago, perkie1968 said:

I found it hard to beleive that she didn't know how to cook because Tariq did all the cooking.  Tariq looked like he had no idea where the kitchen was, much less did all the cooking.  

Hit home for me, I had an ex who was a lot like Tariq (in so many ways!) who did all the cooking in a way that felt like it was to shut me up about how I was the only one even trying to pay the bills (which had not been the plan). The cooking involved googling recipes and then smoking a lot of weed and drinking a lot of whiskey while cooking -- and very by-the-book about recipes. Nobody ever believed me when I explained who did the cooking, from the outside people expected the opposite roles.

Now I make my own food but I still "can't cook." 

Which reminds me, my own teacher brain cringed when Janine said, "My mother never taught my sister and I how to cook." But it's just conversational, it's okay! She's not my student!

[Crashcourse]

1 minute ago, gesundheit said:

Which reminds me, my own teacher brain cringed when Janine said, "My mother never taught my sister and I how to cook." But it's just conversational, it's okay! She's not my student!

Yes!  I cringed when I heard that.  

[Height-Nonchalance]

Really, I don't go around correcting people's grammar, but there was a line that was so wrong.  Janine was saying her mother did or did not teach "my brother and I" something.  Alright, big deal, it should have been "my brother and me," or better, "me and my brother," and that well-educated teacher would have said it correctly.  Just amazes me that the line stayed wrong through writing, editing, reading, table read, and performance.

[gesundheit]

3 minutes ago, Height-Nonchalance said:

Really, I don't go around correcting people's grammar, but there was a line that was so wrong.  Janine was saying her mother did or did not teach "my brother and I" something.  Alright, big deal, it should have been "my brother and me," or better, "me and my brother," and that well-educated teacher would have said it correctly.  Just amazes me that the line stayed wrong through writing, editing, reading, table read, and performance.

Oh was it brother? I remembered it as sister. But yes, same idea! And normally I'll argue in favor of keeping incorrect grammar in naturalistic TV dialogue, because that's how people talk. But people who are literally teaching grammar at the level where they'd cover that on a regular basis? That seems a little less likely for sure. It would be so ingrained, I would think. 

[possibilities]

36 minutes ago, gesundheit said:

Which reminds me, my own teacher brain cringed when Janine said, "My mother never taught my sister and I how to cook." 

That drove me crazy, too. She's a teacher. Set an example, please!

[Tom1mac2]

I was a speech-language pathologist in the public schools for 19 years in the second half of my career.  I retired 4 years ago, and have done part-time online therapy since. When I watch this show, I tear up at how much I miss being with the kids in an actual school.  This show totally nails it!  The writers and the actors are outstanding!

[Ms Blue Jay]

2 hours ago, gesundheit said:

Hit home for me, I had an ex who was a lot like Tariq (in so many ways!) who did all the cooking in a way that felt like it was to shut me up about how I was the only one even trying to pay the bills (which had not been the plan). The cooking involved googling recipes and then smoking a lot of weed and drinking a lot of whiskey while cooking -- and very by-the-book about recipes. Nobody ever believed me when I explained who did the cooking, from the outside people expected the opposite roles.

Now I make my own food but I still "can't cook." 

LOL.  We dated very similar men. He was great at providing me food but a bad boyfriend.

I finally learned how to cook because of the pandemic. I'm obsessed now.

[P2C2E]

So many good parts to this episode but one of my favorites was this exchange:

Jacob: Talk to me, bro

Gregory: Try again.

Jacob: Copy that. 

I thought it was hilarious and also a nice way to show the progression of their friendship.

[kwnyc]

You let Barbara sing, children. She was in the original cast of Dreamgirls!

Also: Melissa's doormat reads "Go Away"