S42.E03: Go for the Gusto

[Guest]

1 minute ago, eel21788 said:

Are we watching the same show? I keep hearing Jonathan's tribemates complaining about how annoying he is.

Are you thinking of Rocksroy on the blue tribe? He's the one being labeled as bossy, to the point where he was a possible boot target in the first episode. Jonathan on the orange tribe seems to be liked just fine, so far.

[eel21788]

Just now, tracyscott76 said:

Are you thinking of Rocksroy on the blue tribe? He's the one being labeled as bossy, to the point where he was a possible boot target in the first episode. Jonathan on the orange tribe seems to be liked just fine, so far.

It's possible that I am. I still can't keep track of who's who yet.

[Wandering Snark]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

Two of them are sure the hell aware of it [their lack of anonymity as a lost vote holder] now….  😆

(Added the [] for clarity...)

Yeah I loved seeing Jeff have to forego the "yes there was one less/more vote than there should be here but you saw NOTHING I TELL YOU!!!" song and dance and say 'Yeah, there's like 2 of 4 votes here and we gotta say something about it now... but still, don't mind the mohawked man behind the curtain...' instead.

Edited March 24, 2022 by Wandering Snark

[eel21788]

17 hours ago, TVFan1 said:

I feel bad for Jenny. She got screwed by having more twists in the game and players losing their vote. If it weren't for the 3 way idol rule and the prisoner's dilemma, Jenny probably would have been safe.

However, she had the same option to lose her vote or gain an extra vote at the beginning of the game. She chose the safe play which left her vulnerable tonight.

[jsm1125]

12 minutes ago, eel21788 said:

However, she had the same option to lose her vote or gain an extra vote at the beginning of the game. She chose the safe play which left her vulnerable tonight.

But choosing the risky play would have lost Jenny her vote, given that Drea and MaryAnne chose to risk their vote.

[iMonrey]

Quote

It's possible that I am. I still can't keep track of who's who yet.

I made a list this season, so I'm not having that problem.

What I did lose track of was the voting plan for last night's tribal. Hai and Lydia obviously voted Jenny; Daniel and Jenny voted Lydia. What was Chanelle trying to get Hai and Lydia (?) to do beforehand? She was trying to direct how they would split the vote or whatever and I was unable to follow her logic or her plan there.

[Wandering Snark]

49 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

What was Chanelle trying to get Hai and Lydia (?) to do beforehand? She was trying to direct how they would split the vote or whatever and I was unable to follow her logic or her plan there.

There was no logic to her plan except to cover her own butt, which she figured they would go along with due to her dazzling social game. She wanted the guys to vote for Mike and the women to vote for Lydia.

Edited March 24, 2022 by Wandering Snark

[lilabennet]

She wanted Hai to vote Mike and Lydia to vote Jenny.  That way if she lost her vote, then Lydia would have still been voted out 2-1-1.

[himela]

Eh I still don't find anyone to root for. I think the tribes of six has ruined this for me because it is pure luck which side someone finds themselves at. If there are more young or more older people, if they vibe good with one or more people, if they have something in common with other people etc. Also I have no idea who Jenny was, had they shown any information about her? At least Marya had a segment telling her story last week.

[Nashville]

2 hours ago, Wandering Snark said:

(Added the [] for clarity...)

Yeah I loved seeing Jeff have to forego the "yes there was one less/more vote than there should be here but you saw NOTHING I TELL YOU!!!" song and dance and say 'Yeah, there's like 2 of 4 votes here and we gotta say something about it now... but still, don't mind the mohawked man behind the curtain...' instead.

 

1 hour ago, lilabennet said:

[Chanelle] wanted Hai to vote Mike and Lydia to vote Jenny.  That way if she lost her vote, then Lydia would have still been voted out 2-1-1.

Yeah, but Chanelle sold the split-vote notion SO badly she pinged doubleplushard on Hai’s radar - which was a shame, strategically speaking, because that was M/J/C/D’s only shot at a clean TC coup.

[GenerationX]

"The sea was angry that day, my friends."  Finally, an Immunity Challenge with a challenging level of difficulty.

I prefer the complicated web of relationships with two large tribes rather than three small tribes.  More strategery.

The boat wheel has only two choices, but needs three.  Risk Your Vote, Protect Your Vote, and Waste Your Vote.  You choose the latter when you don't want to offend either alliance.

Edited March 25, 2022 by GenerationX

[treeofdreams]

I am experiencing the same attitude adjustment about Jonathan others are expressing.

I also wanted to say I love the relationship between Jonathan and Omar.  I noticed that after the challenge when Jeff handed Jonathan the immunity trophy Jonathan immediately turned and handed it to Omar.

[SVNBob]

On 3/23/2022 at 8:04 PM, LadyChatts said:

Those are the TC I live for.  Mike and Chanelle now have to explain why they didn't have votes (because you know Hai/Lydia are going to keep asking), and Daniel loves to run his mouth so he may volunteer the information without even being asked.  I feel bad for Jenny, but I'm kind of glad Mike's alliance lost a number.  They really played that poorly on so many levels.  They banked too much on Hai/Lydia splitting the vote between Mike/Jenny.  Hai's a lot more perceptive than they gave him credit for.  I like him.  He made the right decision by not budging.  I said it in the chat thread, but it might have been worth it to sacrifice Jenny tonight knowing Chanelle possibly didn't have a vote, and Mike doesn't have one.  Not sure how this will bode for Daniel going forward.  Throwing Chanelle under the bus was not a smart idea.  I do think he made the right decision for himself, but not sure at what cost in the long run.

 

On 3/23/2022 at 8:23 PM, LadyChatts said:

And for all the talk about how bad Daniel played this, Chanelle wasn't any better.  I don't know if it was lack of communication between her and Omar or she didn't understand what she was doing, but I don't see how she couldn't go with 'protect your vote'.  Either that or she really trusted her ability to sway Hai/Lydia to do what she wanted.  She raised red flags with Hai over her plan to split the vote, and while I don't blame her for getting defensive as Daniel was throwing her under the bus, he wasn't exactly wrong.  She was the one who said to split the vote, so I don't see how she could defend the move to Hai.  Overall just bad gameplay all around on Mike's side.  As I mentioned, sorry to Jenny, but it would have been easier for them to just ax her tonight and keep up the charade that they were all with Hai/Lydia.

 

On 3/23/2022 at 9:02 PM, Wandering Snark said:

She thought they'd just go for her crazy 'Guys vote/girls vote' split for no reason but it was the only way to save her ass. Turns out, you're not so big.

Here's the thing though.  Hai came to Chanelle with a vote-split plan first.  After Chanelle got back and told Daniel she might not have a vote, they both met up with Hai and Lydia, and Hai suggested a 3-1 vote split*, with the 1 going to Mike.  All she had to do was agree to it while making sure she and Daniel would vote on the 3 side, and things would have been much smoother.  But Hai noticed Chanelle was acting a little squirrelly, so he was already a little suspicious before TC.  Chanelle's behavior and Daniel's words at TC amplified those suspicions.  As did the unexpected number of votes.

*Yeah, that was a bad split.  It doesn't actually make sense for Plan Voodoo.  If the person they put 3 votes on plays the idol, then the person with 2 votes goes instead.  And that would have been Lydia.  Which makes this bad split even more advantageous for what Daniel and Chanelle really wanted to do.  So I don't get why they didn't go along with it.  What Chanelle proposed was a proper Plan Voodoo split.

 

12 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

Maryanne relies too much on global stops to replace consonants.

First, I think you mean glottal, but I'll assume Otto got to this post.

Second, MaryAnne is of Kenyan ancestry, and thus Swahili is most likely her first language.  (English and French being equal second, because she's a Canadian citizen.)  And doing some research, it turns out that one of the unique features of Swahili are implosive consonants, where the sound is made while inhaling instead of exhaling.  So she might be doing something similar while speaking in English, and the result sounds more like a glottal stop to someone unfamiliar with Swahili.

 

11 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

Maryanne told her bunny rabbit story pretty well. Mike, on the other hand, doesn't think he needs to say his phrase until he hears the other two. Now why didn't Daniel say anything to Mike  about saying the phrase at the next tribal council? 

Two reasons:

1. Daniel had already convinced Mike not to say his phrase until he heard both the others said.  And there was only the one phrase said at that TC; MaryAnne's.  If someone on Blue had said the other phrase, then Mike for sure would have said his and activated the idols, despite his distaste for soccer.
2. It was still in Daniel's best interests for Mike to not have an idol or a vote at the time.

 

11 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

Losing tribe is missing two votes.

Was only missing two votes.  AFAIK, you only lose your vote at the next TC you attend if everyone risks during the Dilemma.  So Chanelle should have her vote back for the next TC she attends.  Whereas Omar is still without his until after the next time he visits TC, and MaryAnne and Mike are without votes until the idols are activated or the Merge.

 

Lots of people are upset that Daniel threw Chanelle under the bus.  But he does have a valid justification that he can use with the rest of Green that might help save him.  She said there at TC, in front of all of them, that she played it safe at the Dilemma.  Then it was revealed that she did not.  So she lied to all of them.  Yes, he knew she might not have a vote, but in ass-cover mode, that part will get left out.  But even if she brings it up, he can just call that another lie, and it'll fit with the story he started building at TC during the rock talk.

[LadyChatts]

5 hours ago, treeofdreams said:

I am experiencing the same attitude adjustment about Jonathan others are expressing.

I also wanted to say I love the relationship between Jonathan and Omar.  I noticed that after the challenge when Jeff handed Jonathan the immunity trophy Jonathan immediately turned and handed it to Omar.

I noticed that, and it got me thinking back to my high school gym days and how I always seemed to get stuck in a class with all the kids who played sports.  They acted like that stupid game of floor hockey was do or die and meant something.  Me, I was just trying to survive the 40 minutes.  I needed a Jonathan in my class.  
 

Count me in as someone whose totally done a 180 on Jonathan.  

Edited March 25, 2022 by LadyChatts

[CountryGirl]

As inept as Daniel is, I can't agree that he did Chanelle dirty.

She did herself and her alliance dirty even before they went to tribal by getting greedy with wanting an extra vote. And this after saying: "I absolutely cannot lose my vote. I'm in a split tribe where one of my allies already has lost his vote. My vote is crucial to this moment." Why in the world she would risk her vote knowing her tribe was going to tribal that night? It was so foolish and equally dumb was her thinking Omar, the guy she just met from another tribe (the enemy for now) was going to play it safe? She set things in motion for what happened to happen, so I lay most of the blame on her.

She also did a horrible job selling the split vote idea and was acting sketchy and Hai, who might not have any sort of poker face but has excellent Spidey senses, knew it.

She got found out that she lied her ass off at playing it safe when it was confirmed (as Hai already suspected) that she had not, in fact, done that but risked her vote and lost it.

And the kicker?

She is whisper-shouting "Lydia!" to Daniel during tribal and Hai can see and hear all of this.

Most of the damage was already done although Daniel didn't help matters by announcing to all and sundry that he didn't want to go to rocks. I wouldn't have wanted to go to rocks either as a 25% chance is hardly insignificant.

Elsewhere, I'm still fanning myself over Jonathan and how he literally muscled his entire tribe through that challenge. Jeffy, you go ahead with your man-crush as I'm right there with you, for once. But way to put an even bigger target on his back, Jeff, by proclaiming that your most orgasmic Survivor moment since Boston Rob ran up and down all those flights of stairs. 

Maryann was surprisingly quick on her feet with the bunny story and she is just quirky enough that folks will buy it as "oh, Maryann..."

Sorry to see Jenny go as she did get screwed by her own tribe, Chanelle, especially, who could and should have kept her vote so that she, Jenny, and Daniel would have had the majority to vote Lydia out and not put Daniel in the position he was put in in the first place.

Hai's facial expressions were everything.

Even with all the twists, advantages, et al, I feel like my Survivor is back and this tribal is one I'll remember. 

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, CountryGirl said:

She is whisper-shouting "Lydia!" to Daniel during tribal and Hai can see and hear all of this.

I agree that Chanelle deserves a lot of the blame for the whole fiasco, but I suspect that this particular moment was a trick of editing and Hai's reaction was taken from another moment. They were trying to sell the whole "Daniel and Chanelle are effing up, and Hai is onto them!" bit, and I think in this case oversold it. Because if Hai had really noticed her doing that, I feel like he would have either called them out right then, or brought it up during the post-tie debate over drawing rocks, and they would have shown it.

[CountryGirl]

26 minutes ago, tracyscott76 said:

I agree that Chanelle deserves a lot of the blame for the whole fiasco, but I suspect that this particular moment was a trick of editing and Hai's reaction was taken from another moment. They were trying to sell the whole "Daniel and Chanelle are effing up, and Hai is onto them!" bit, and I think in this case oversold it. Because if Hai had really noticed her doing that, I feel like he would have either called them out right then, or brought it up during the post-tie debate over drawing rocks, and they would have shown it.

Daniel was sitting right next to Hai so if he heard Lydia (which it seems clear he did), it's not a stretch to think Hai heard it, too.

Even if he didn't see her motioning to Daniel, which, she wasn't subtle whatsoever. No one else was talking at the moment and there obviously isn't the dramatic Survivor music playing. He had no reason to call it out as Daniel and Chanelle were doing a spectacular job of blowing up their own games, knew he was willing to go to rocks, sensed the cracks in the alliance and that Daniel could be swayed to keep Lydia from Daniel's very first statement that he did not want to go to rocks.

[peachmangosteen]

I'm with you @tracyscott76, I think that was an editing trick. I doubt Hai actually knew for sure that in that moment Chanelle was telling Daniel to vote for Lydia. If he did, I imagine he would have been much less confused about everything than he appeared to be. Although, he could have been faking some of his confusion. But yea I just think that was editing and Hai did not hear Chanelle saying 'Lydia.'

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, CountryGirl said:

Daniel was sitting right next to Hai so if he heard Lydia (which it seems clear he did), it's not a stretch to think Hai heard it, too.

Even if he didn't see her motioning to Daniel, which, she wasn't subtle whatsoever. No one else was talking at the moment and there obviously isn't the dramatic Survivor music playing. He had no reason to call it out as Daniel and Chanelle were doing a spectacular job of blowing up their own games, knew he was willing to go to rocks, sensed the cracks in the alliance and that Daniel could be swayed to keep Lydia from Daniel's very first statement that he did not want to go to rocks.

It's entirely possible that Hai did notice it, but for me, the footage they showed of Hai looking puzzled right at that moment did not seem at all like the kind of reaction someone would have hearing one of his supposed allies tell another of his allies to vote for his third (and primary) ally. It was just more of the same general "wtf?" confusion Hai showed throughout TC and could have been pulled from anywhere.

But who knows? The end result was the same and it was still a fun TC. And no getting up and whispering in little mini meetings, which I know everyone here hates 😆

[CountryGirl]

I just rewatched the whole TC. That moment with the whispering took place before the first round of votes were cast and Hai's reaction, which I took as less confusion and more "crap, Daniel isn't with us at all" between Daniel saying he's calmed down by his obvious alliance members (aka not Hai or Lydia) and then Chanelle whispers "Lydia." He's still shaking his head as he goes to vote and I think he had a moment of panic where he thought "maybe I should just vote for Lydia and try to broker my way from the bottom," but then sticking to his vote for Jenny because you never know in this game.

ITA that it's the most fun TC we've seen in some time and yes, none of that infernal chit-chat. I was quite surprised there wasn't any of that although probably not much use considering two couldn't vote and it was really down to Hai and Daniel.

[blackwing]

I find Daniel incredibly annoying and neurotic.  He's also fairly useless in challenges.  He sat out last week's challenge and he sat out this week's challenge.  Is that because of his shoulder, or because he is fat and out of shape?  I thought he said his shoulder was all better after the medic popped it back in.  If his shoulder is still that bad where it hurts, then he should be medically withdrawn.

I guess the rule that "you can't sit out two challenges in a row" only applies when there is a reward challenge and an immunity challenge in the same voting cycle?  If he does make it to merge and is still using his shoulder as an excuse to sit out challenges, then he's done.

I do think Chanelle completely misplayed... if she knew her vote was important she shouldn't have risked it at all.  She and Omar had said that if there was a way to both get something, they should.  But she overplayed by telling Omar she absolutely couldn't risk her vote. From Omar's perspective, she said she absolutely couldn't risk her vote.  He reads the rules and sees that if they both risk, they both lose.  But if one protects and one risks, the one risk gets the advantage.  Since she was adamant about not losing her vote, I think he could assume she would protect.  He never said he wasn't going to risk his vote, so why would she assume that all of a sudden he would protect his vote?

Jonathan is completely carrying his team in the challenges.  Jeff really should have said "Jonathan wins immunity!" instead of his tribe name.

On 3/23/2022 at 8:41 PM, Melina22 said:

That was wonderful to watch. Has there ever been a Survivor quite like Jonathan? Insanely strong and competitive, yet well liked by his tribe and apparently fairly self-aware and humble? He's actually fun to watch, as he calmly carries a ladder and his bedraggled tribe members through giant pounding surf as it drowns the other tribes. 

He reminds me a lot of John from David vs. Goliath, the "Mayor of Slamtown" wrestler.  John allied with Dan (the internet labelled "Hot Cop") and nerdy Christian.  Christian was in heaven, like a high school nerd who was getting stuffed in lockers but then suddenly befriended by and protected by the two popular buff dudes.  Jonathan and Omar are kind of like John, Dan and Christian.

 

22 hours ago, bankerchick said:

OK, perhaps I am splitting hairs but I just rewound and this is exactly what the note says:  'At the next immunity challenge you must say a secret phrase in front of the other players.  If another player has found their idol they will reply with their secret phrase.  Once all three phrases have been said at the same immunity challenge, then all three idols have power.'

There is nothing in the note to indicate that saying the phrase is optional if you don't want to say it today, or it's ok to wait until you feel like saying it.  To me the only explanation is that Mike has said the phrase and they have edited it out (unlikely given his conversation with Daniel, but of course still possible,) they are going to penalize him at a future time, or must doesn't really mean must, in which case, why use that word?

I completely agree with this.  The note clearly says "at the next immunity challenge, you must say a secret phrase".  It doesn't say "you must say the phrase to activate the idol".  It says "you MUST say the phrase".  I doubt they would have edited out Mike saying it (because Jeffy loves to see his stupid twists playing out on TV), and Mike actually said something like "I didn't hear a second phrase so I chose not to say mine".

Xander from last season and the other players clearly interpreted that they had to keep saying the phrase.  I think it is arguable that with Mike's second immunity challenge, he had a choice not to say it.  But the instructions seem clear that he had to say it at the "next" challenge after finding it.

I think it's crap that this wasn't addressed.  I really do hope that after all three phrases are said, that he gets a note that says "you failed to follow the instructions since you did not say the phrase at the first challenge after you found the advantage".  I would think it's BS if that doesn't happen.

I continue to be shocked that self-congratulatory Jeffy has NOT said anything about "come on in [guys]".  I would have assumed that he would have gone onto this whole explanation about how self-aware he is and how he pushed for this and got the approval of the cast from 41 to do this.

 

 

[ProfCrash]

Daniel's shoulder has been useless this entire season. If you look at the immunity challenge with the round puzzle, his arm is hanging loosely at his side. it had popped out again. I am guessing it has happened more then that time. I can see why they would sit him out of challenges, his shoulder is going to come out of the socket pretty easily. 

I am hoping that he goes home soon. 

It doesn't help that Stephen Fishback (sp) said on Rob Has a Podcast that Daniel is a friend of his, so that makes me a bit more anti-Daniel. Stephen was neurotic enough and Daniel puts Stephen to shame.

[CountryGirl]

I don't think Daniel is long for the game as he is just too dang scatter-brained and not nearly as smart as he thinks he is, but my sense is Chanelle will be right behind him, which is too bad as I was really rooting for her. I still am, but I don't see either of them recovering.

[treeofdreams]

I hope the next episode gives a good deal of time at the beginning to the reactions back at camp to what happened at tribal.

Edited March 25, 2022 by treeofdreams

[fishcakes]

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

I just rewatched the whole TC. That moment with the whispering took place before the first round of votes were cast and Hai's reaction, which I took as less confusion and more "crap, Daniel isn't with us at all" between Daniel saying he's calmed down by his obvious alliance members (aka not Hai or Lydia) and then Chanelle whispers "Lydia." He's still shaking his head as he goes to vote and I think he had a moment of panic where he thought "maybe I should just vote for Lydia and try to broker my way from the bottom," but then sticking to his vote for Jenny because you never know in this game.

I don't know if the sequence was edited to make it look more dramatic, but I do agree that Hai caught the exchange between Chanelle and Daniel and realized they weren't with him and Lydia. Because the last info we got before TC was that they had agreed to split the votes -- guys on Mike, women on Jenny -- so if Hai had been following the plan he would have voted for Mike. I think once he realized that he and Lydia were on their own, he switched his vote from Mike to Jenny, knowing it might be a 4-2 result, but hoping for a 3-3. It was a Hail Mary, but the only thing he had, and as it shook out, with the two missing votes that he didn't know about before then, it worked.

Assuming the tribes don't change up anytime soon, Hai and Lydia are in a good position now and I'm guessing will scoop Mike up as a third vote to get rid of Daniel and Chanelle.

 

48 minutes ago, blackwing said:

I do think Chanelle completely misplayed... if she knew her vote was important she shouldn't have risked it at all.  She and Omar had said that if there was a way to both get something, they should.  But she overplayed by telling Omar she absolutely couldn't risk her vote. From Omar's perspective, she said she absolutely couldn't risk her vote.  He reads the rules and sees that if they both risk, they both lose.  But if one protects and one risks, the one risk gets the advantage.  Since she was adamant about not losing her vote, I think he could assume she would protect.  He never said he wasn't going to risk his vote, so why would she assume that all of a sudden he would protect his vote?

Omar did say he would protect her vote. First Chanelle said they shouldn't risk it unless both of them could get an advantage and he was nodding and saying "yes yes yes" the whole time, then right before they split up to do the wheel, he said, "if we can both get something without screwing over the other person and losing their vote, we should do it," and she agreed. Then we get THs from both of them, where they're trying to justify going back on that -- Chanelle's was that she believed Omar would protect her vote as he said he would and choose the option that would protect both of them so it was safe for her to risk hers, and Omar's was that he was certain Chanelle would protect her own vote so it was safe for him to risk his. They each thought they were outsmarting the other but ended up outsmarting themselves.

[Meowwww]

I was sure the last two tribes were drowning on that challenge.  
I can’t stand Lydia.  She sits out the challenges.  She seems like a slacker to me.  When they turned in their flint, she was giggling and laughing inappropriately.  Ugh. 

[Nashville]

4 hours ago, blackwing said:

I find Daniel incredibly annoying and neurotic.  He's also fairly useless in challenges.  He sat out last week's challenge and he sat out this week's challenge.  Is that because of his shoulder, or because he is fat and out of shape?  I thought he said his shoulder was all better after the medic popped it back in.

I suspect Daniel meant the immediate pain was relieved - but even when a shoulder dislocation is immediately reduced without complications by a trained medical professional (as Daniel’s was), it’s not going to be 100% for quite a while; muscles can be torn, ligaments and tendons overstretched, nerves bruised - all of which requires time to recover and rebuild.

Back in the real world Daniel’s arm would be in a sling for 3-4 months after such an injury - during which the shoulder would have a significant tendency to dislocate again if exerted, and the medic on the beach said as much - and after THAT he’d likely be looking at a few months of rehab PT to regain full mobility.

 

4 hours ago, blackwing said:

  If his shoulder is still that bad where it hurts, then he should be medically withdrawn.

 Daniel is probably teetering on the razor’s edge of a medevac right now, and another dislocation or associated injury would likely mean adios.

[zscore]

14 hours ago, SVNBob said:

*Yeah, that was a bad split.  It doesn't actually make sense for Plan Voodoo.  If the person they put 3 votes on plays the idol, then the person with 2 votes goes instead.  And that would have been Lydia. 

The 3-1 split is in case Jenny plays SITD and gets safety. In this case it will be a 1-1 tie and they can vote out Mike in the revote.

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, zscore said:

The 3-1 split is in case Jenny plays SITD and gets safety. In this case it will be a 1-1 tie and they can vote out Mike in the revote.

We know that’s how it would’ve panned out, but Hai and Lydia didn’t; until Peachy’s big TC reveal, they were not aware Mike didn’t have a vote. Before that H&L would’ve seen a 3-1 split as useless because their (incomplete) read on the situation indicated if Jenny did successfully play her SITD, then Mike & Jenny would’ve sent Lydia home on a 2-1 vote.

Edited March 25, 2022 by Nashville
Clarification

[zscore]

2 hours ago, Nashville said:

We know that’s how it would’ve panned out, but Hai and Lydia didn’t; until Peachy’s big TC reveal, they were not aware Mike didn’t have a vote. Before that H&L would’ve seen a 3-1 split as useless because their (incomplete) read on the situation indicated if Jenny did successfully play her SITD, then Mike & Jenny would’ve sent Lydia home on a 2-1 vote.

If you play SITD you can't vote. so it would be a 1-1 tie. 

[bankerchick]

18 hours ago, SVNBob said:

(English and French being equal second, because she's a Canadian citizen.) 

I'm not sure exactly what you're trying to say, but most Canadians are not equally fluent in both English and French.  Less than 20% of Canadians are bilingual, more in Quebec and Ottawa, where the federal government is located, less in provinces like Alberta or Saskatchewan.

9 hours ago, blackwing said:

Since she was adamant about not losing her vote, I think he could assume she would protect.  He never said he wasn't going to risk his vote, so why would she assume that all of a sudden he would protect his vote?

Agreed.  This seemed like a freebie for Omar; Chanelle was quite adamant she was going to protect her vote, so there was no reason for him not to select Risk.  He will not be happy when he finds that out and if she makes it to the merge, it probably won't go well for her.   

[North of Eden]

Okay well...three episodes in I finally have someone to hate and root against....

That little vegan creep.

Thanks to him and "I'm not changing my vote" my favorite player Jenny who I wanted to go deep into the game is gone.

If not before hand I hope he becomes the first casualty of the merge.

And to close this vote out will also be tainted by "what might have been" if they had allowed the contest to continue in the water. Maybe the other tribe would have been so spent that they blew the bag toss.

The whole episode leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

[Nashville]

3 hours ago, zscore said:

If you play SITD you can't vote. so it would be a 1-1 tie. 

Good point, and one I missed. 😄  But wasn’t the possibility of Jenny idoling out also mentioned as a concern?

[SVNBob]

40 minutes ago, Nashville said:

But wasn’t the possibility of Jenny idoling out also mentioned as a concern?

That was the only concern mentioned in the splitting votes talk.  No one brought up the SITD.  (Unless it was edited out or the audio of that happening was dumped during Hai's TH, both of which could easily have happened.)  Which is why I didn't include it in my earlier post.

Strictly going by what was presented, Hai was trying to work a badly calculated Plan Voodoo, and Chanelle talked him out of it into a proper one.

[Lantern7]

Erik weighs in on the episode's conclusion.

Once again . . . I'm not saying Daniel made the right move, but I can't really blame him for blinking.

[ratgirlagogo]

On 3/24/2022 at 12:01 PM, Birnam Wood said:

Remember when Probst retired the phrase "Come on in, guys?" even though no one cared?

Why is he still allowed to say "Let's get it on!" in that horrific way at the beginning of challenges? WHY?????

That "GIT IT ON!!!) sounds SO much like the go-phrase Captain Tenneal used on the old classic  MXC, aka Most Extreme Elimination Challenge:

and an extra, just for fun and context:

 

Edited March 26, 2022 by ratgirlagogo

[Blissfool]

I like to think that someone told Jonathan, "Your team is only as fast as it's slowest member." And Jonathan was like, "F_ that!"

Edited March 26, 2022 by Blissfool

[AntFTW]

I just rewatched this episode. Daniel gave all of the power to Hai at that TC. Once Hai said he wasn't changing his vote, the entire TC shifted to convincing Hai to possibly change his vote. Daniel was more scared of going to rocks than reclaiming the little power that he had. Call his bluff and say you're also willing to go to rocks. GIVE US A SHOW! GIVE US AN EPISODE TO REMEMBER!

[Lisamyrt]

Sorry if this has been asked already, but why did the winning tribe have to give up fruit to get the fishing gear?  The second place team got both.

 

[jsm1125]

18 hours ago, North of Eden said:

Okay well...three episodes in I finally have someone to hate and root against....

That little vegan creep.

Thanks to him and "I'm not changing my vote" my favorite player Jenny who I wanted to go deep into the game is gone.

If not before hand I hope he becomes the first casualty of the merge.

And to close this vote out will also be tainted by "what might have been" if they had allowed the contest to continue in the water. Maybe the other tribe would have been so spent that they blew the bag toss.

The whole episode leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

How is Hai a creep? 

Hai was closer to Lydia than he was to Jenny; why wouldn’t he choose to keep the former over the latter? And this is coming from someone who was super bummed to see Jenny go.

Daniel is the one who flipped on Jenny. Why not direct your wrath on him? 

[North of Eden]

4 hours ago, jsm1125 said:

How is Hai a creep? 

Hai was closer to Lydia than he was to Jenny; why wouldn’t he choose to keep the former over the latter? And this is coming from someone who was super bummed to see Jenny go.

Daniel is the one who flipped on Jenny. Why not direct your wrath on him? 

It was all in his attitude...I got this millenial entitlement vibe from him.  Things  have to be his way and he's not changing because  he's a special don't you know, the big bad high principaled vegan snowflake. My read was he was acting like it was all personal against  him. Maybe I'm wrong...but that's my take on him and it made him come off as a whiny creep.

[jsm1125]

15 hours ago, North of Eden said:

It was all in his attitude...I got this millenial entitlement vibe from him.  Things  have to be his way and he's not changing because  he's a special don't you know, the big bad high principaled vegan snowflake. My read was he was acting like it was all personal against  him. Maybe I'm wrong...but that's my take on him and it made him come off as a whiny creep.

You got all of this from Hai refusing to flip on his closest ally? What exactly is entitled about that? 

[blackwing]

15 hours ago, North of Eden said:

It was all in his attitude...I got this millenial entitlement vibe from him.  Things  have to be his way and he's not changing because  he's a special don't you know, the big bad high principaled vegan snowflake. My read was he was acting like it was all personal against  him. Maybe I'm wrong...but that's my take on him and it made him come off as a whiny creep.

I think I mostly agree.  I don’t like Hai.  I don’t know if creep is the word I would use for him, I think maybe I would use the word “twerp”.  

I haven’t liked him ever since that challenge where the three took a secret advantage.  I don’t know why he thought he had to take his shirt off, but he applied so much fake blood it was ridiculous.  And then his fake pained expression.  People saying he was bleeding and he shrugs it off.  Did no one notice that he didn’t have any scrapes that could have caused the bleeding?  Where are the scabs then in the coming days?

I have no idea why a vegan would think it is a good idea to go on Survivor and think it is feasible to stay vegan.  So much whining about not wanting to eat the crab, and then some sanctimonious blathering about how he hopes the universe forgives him.  What if he gets a reward and it includes a salad with ranch dressing?  I can just picture him being a diva and making production prepare the salad again.  I am reminded that whichever one of Nat and Kat from Amazing Race that was vegetarian ate half of a sheeps head including the eyeball in order to advance in the race.  And I don’t think she whined about it.  She didn’t like doing it but she did it to keep going and got the job done.  

I don’t fault Hai for wanting to keep his ally Lydia instead of Jenny.  I just don’t like him.

[ljenkins782]

On 3/24/2022 at 10:55 AM, SHD said:

Kudos to the editors and camera people for their work during that challenge. The use of slow motion and close-ups during their struggle was epic. And Jonathan THROWING people through the water was amazing.

There a moment where RocksRoy's head almost got wedged in the ladder, if a wave had hit at that moment, he could have been so badly injured. I'm glad they called it a day on that challenge, but I'm a little surprised that they made that choice once Jonathan beast-ed his way through to complete it. It does seem like Jonathan's tribe should have gotten some kind of perk for actually finishing the challenge as intended.

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I liked Jenny a lot because she's a puzzle queen, but she wasn't super interesting to watch so I don't think the entertainment of the show will suffer but her tribe definitely will.

Yeah, she's very smart and very rational, but also very low-key, which doesn't always make for great TV. And I prefer Hai to Mike, so I'm glad his alliance mate stayed.

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Like most (apparently), I was initially under the impression “must” meant “you have to say this at the next TC or you’re in violation of the game rules and subject to penalty/expulsion/whatever” - but now I’m wondering if it simply means “you have say this at the next TC for the idol to be activated”.  The latter is the only interpretation of which I can think which explains why Mike hasn’t suffered blowback for his lack of compliance.

So, Mike's choice has some logic behind it, but the fatal flaw is if TWO people make that same choice. If someone else wants to hide their idol holding secret and they withhold the phrase, there could be idol holders on each beach who can't activate their idols.

Actually, I'm rewatching the first 2 episodes because I had them on in the background before I knew who anyone was and the choice to not say the phrase was Daniel's. He wanted to actively prevent all of the idols until he realized that if the idol went home with Mike, there would be no more idols.

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That was wonderful to watch. Has there ever been a Survivor quite like Jonathan? Insanely strong and competitive, yet well liked by his tribe and apparently fairly self-aware and humble?

Are we watching the same show? I keep hearing Jonathan's tribemates complaining about how annoying he is.

 

I think Jonathan's halo is getting knocked off next week, but so far, he's had a golden boy edit. The editing this season has been heavy-handed, they can make a hero into a zero and vice versa in the space of a 5 minute clip. I'm finding my opinions on people changing back and forth as the show chooses to present someone as all annoying or all amazing, it's hard not to be affected. Like after this episode where Daniel was all buffoon all the time, it's funny to me to go back to episode 2 and see that he was considered the "smart one" (Watching this past episode without remembering Mike telling Daniel about the idol, I was like "how the hell did this doofus get on the inner circle of information??" )

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Loved the conversation between Hai and Lydia about how Daniel kept losing things:  his shoes, his water bottle, his arm ....

Hai started to take the lead as my favorite with his deadpan "...shoulders" response to Lydia's list of things Daniel had lost. I like those 2 together, they are funny and reactive, Hai's expressions up there in the Eliza Orlins range, but he's not annoying like Eliza, so I appreciate them more. 

And Hai came out the best in that shitshow of a TC, he sized up Daniel's position (which admittedly, Daniel had already put out there with a glowing neon sign) and chose not to budge, but he didn't muddy the waters with anything beyond "Lydia is my ally and I'm sticking with her." Compared to the way Daniel torpedoed every single relationship methodically and individually, Hai played his role understatedly. Jenny won't be on the jury and Mike is now without his number 1 AND without a vote unless the other tribe finds theirs next week, so saving Lydia was Hai's best option.

Lastly, I'm relieved to hear that Daniel is a law clerk and not a trial lawyer because his clients would be up a creek with that doofus. Honestly, I feel like he missed his calling in acting, he seems straight out of central casting to be the goofy sidekick/nerd extraordinaire. He's very animated with his bright blue eyes, he's got an odd charisma that comes across strongly on TV.

[treeofdreams]

2 hours ago, blackwing said:

I have no idea why a vegan would think it is a good idea to go on Survivor and think it is feasible to stay vegan.

Probably because in the past they have always been given rice and beans.  And then there are coconuts, and whatever fruit they could find, like bananas, mangos, etc.  Plenty to eat even if they have to work to find it.  Many times the tribes never managed to fish, and there are meat products only at rewards, but along with other foods that a vegan could eat.

[sharkerbaby]

I am really glad they stopped giving chickens to people who had little, if any, knowledge on how to properly feed, manage, or butcher them.  I raise chickens so I do not have any philosophical objections to the process only objections to fostering and enabling irresponsible and sometimes inhumane animal husbandry practices.

Edited March 27, 2022 by sharkerbaby

[North of Eden]

8 hours ago, jsm1125 said:

You got all of this from Hai refusing to flip on his closest ally? What exactly is entitled about that? 

Petulance is the reaction when ones believed entitlements are not full filled and instead of taking it like a champ like some players have even when they themselves are blindsided and voted out... this special snowflake was glaringly petulant because the universe wasn't going his way. Sorry but that's my read on the guy. Don't like him and don't want him to last now.

[goldil]

I know Jeff did a little well-deserved crushing on Jonathon, but I really don't think he's his type. Jeff likes the douche-bro frat boys.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, North of Eden said:

9 hours ago, jsm1125 said:

You got all of this from Hai refusing to flip on his closest ally? What exactly is entitled about that? 

Petulance is the reaction when ones believed entitlements are not full filled and instead of taking it like a champ like some players have even when they themselves are blindsided and voted out... this special snowflake was glaringly petulant because the universe wasn't going his way. Sorry but that's my read on the guy. Don't like him and don't want him to last now.

The outcome of who was going home was still very much up in the air, so why should Hai take being blindsided like a champ? He was fighting to make sure his ally Lydia stayed in the game. And "glaringly petulant" is in the eye of the beholder. I just saw someone standing firm to get what he wanted, which he ultimately did. Daniel was also arguing (poorly) to get what he wanted, and Chanelle got irritated and tried to defend herself when Daniel threw everything on her - are they also snowflakes? Hate on the guy all you want, but in my opinion, Hai was just doing what he had to do.

[treeofdreams]

1 hour ago, tracyscott76 said:

The outcome of who was going home was still very much up in the air, so why should Hai take being blindsided like a champ? He was fighting to make sure his ally Lydia stayed in the game. And "glaringly petulant" is in the eye of the beholder. I just saw someone standing firm to get what he wanted, which he ultimately did. Daniel was also arguing (poorly) to get what he wanted, and Chanelle got irritated and tried to defend herself when Daniel threw everything on her - are they also snowflakes? Hate on the guy all you want, but in my opinion, Hai was just doing what he had to do.

Agreed.  This is a game of strategy, and protecting your closest ally is just good strategy.  He was willing to really go out on a limb to protect Lydia, which should strengthen their alliance since she has seen how much she can trust him, and he has also demonstrated to others that he is a loyal and trustworthy ally.