S01.E05: Illusions

[ElectricBoogaloo]

A spouse who cheats is an asshole. A spouse who keeps cheating is a shit bag (if you're unhappy enough to keep cheating, just man up and leave your wife). A man who asks HIS CHILD to keep it a secret that he's cheating again is a FUCKING ASSHOLE. It is not your child's responsibility to keep your awful secrets from his own mother.

Although I always root for people to be able to move out of their small towns if they don't want to stay, I could not feel sorry for Brianna when she told Dylan that she can't go to college now due to what she did to Erin. This wasn't some silly prank. She deliberately catfished Erin out of spite/jealousy/pettiness, lured her out to the woods to publicly humiliate her in front of their classmates, beat the shit out of her, and then refused to admit what she had done until the police told her that the video had been posted online. What's that, Brianna? The consequences of your actions biting you in the ass? And all for a guy who doesn't even really like you.

Mare unable to stop laughing in the car after the dead woman's husband revealed to everyone at the funeral that he'd had an affair with Helen was hilarious.

If Erin's friend knew where Erin's journals were all this time, why didn't she just go get them herself before now? Why did she wait until Dylan wanted to burn them? She clearly wanted to read them all, and with Erin's dad in jail she could have gone into the house at any time and read every single page in the past few weeks.

Oh, Zabel. I'm glad that he and Mare had an honest conversation before he got shot in the head.

4 hours ago, SnazzyDaisy said:

I really wanna know what Jess took from Erin’s journal.

I only saw the general size and that the back of it was white, but I think it was a wallet sized photo.

2 hours ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

Mare’s father and her son committed suicide.

The therapist asked some stupid questions. 

Sometimes the questions that therapists ask are to get useful information, but sometimes they ask questions so that the patient has to admit these things aloud, sometimes for the first time. Sometimes just getting a patient to admit that something made them sad/angry/confused can be a breakthrough, especially if it's a patient who isn't used to verbalizing their feelings (and Mare being the kind of person who squashed her feelings about her father's death because she didn't want to burden her mother seems like the kind of person who does not talk about her feelings a lot). Even though the therapist put 2 and 2 together about Mare's family history of mental health issues, she was trying to get Mare to draw that conclusion herself and talk about it.

[Snazzy Daisy]

Allie (the sex worker) described her attacker as a bearded white man who smoked Winston cigarettes and drove a blue utility van. Maybe Mr. Pott the kidnapper has an accomplice. 

Something from previous episode that still bothers me, when the news on missing Missy Sager was aired, the way Ryan (Lori’s son) stared at the TV was very unsettling, could there be more to this? 🤨

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I was so creeped out when Katie told the new girl that Hillary disappeared after she got pregnant. I'm guessing the guy who owned the bar has a bunch of bodies buried in his yard because lord knows teenager girls aren't worth keeping captive and raping after they get knocked up. Mare said that Hillary was from New Jersey so this guy was getting girls from all over the tri state area.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Did anyone compare the sideburns of the guy who had the girls locked up in his bar with the sideburns that we saw last week? You know, just to make sure that they actually match.

[Cristofle]

Wow! RIP, Zabel. I don't know whether to give kudos to the show because I was genuinely surprised in the moment, which doesn't happen often on TV anymore, or if I'm frustrated that we lost a good character who added an important balance to the show two episodes too early in order to create that shock value (I'm less annoyed than I might be because this is such a limited series, but in general killing off important characters for shock value is not a trope I appreciate in the slightest). 

That said, I am glad the girls were found alive. This is an otherwise grim show ; at least Katie gets to go home to her mother.

I don't know why I'm more focused on John Ross than the other cousin Billy who appeared to have a legit panic attack when Erin's name was brought up (and is clearly deeply suspicious to Mare now), but I am just so disturbed by his behavior towards his son. On the surface, it SEEMS he was covering up an ongoing affair, but that is such classic grooming behavior for abuse, and his son's violent outburst hints to me it goes a lot deeper than covering up an affair. 

I did crack up at Mare's mother getting outed for having an affair at a funeral (so small-town) and Mare's response, which was a rare light spot in the episode. 

It really does make me sad that it seems no one in the world truly cared about Erin, at least not more than their own issues. Yes, the best friend seemed conflicted, but she still went along with Dylan and burned the journals. 

[ChicagoMe]

This town is one big hot mess! If this show doesn't dominate the Emmy's I'd be surprised. I don't know what the "Illusion" refers to - possibly that now they think they caught the perp. This guy could not have acted alone - I called it. I'm as depressed as all of Easttown because this series only has 2 episodes left.

[Dminches]

7 hours ago, Norma Desmond said:

Mare is such a black hole of misery and everyone around gets pulled into it. Damn.

She has lived through the suicide of her father and her son.  Most people would not be able to function after that.  Not only is she a capable cop but she has been caring for her grandson.  Frankly, people should view her as a role model for surviving tragedy and keeping moving.  I am not sure who has been pulled into her “black hole.”  Her daughter seems to be doing very well and her mom lives with her.

 

[pasdetrois]

What about the other priest?

[Snazzy Daisy]

1 hour ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Did anyone compare the sideburns of the guy who had the girls locked up in his bar with the sideburns that we saw last week? You know, just to make sure that they actually match.

The sideburns are more or less the same...

 

[paigow]

1 hour ago, ChicagoMe said:

I don't know what the "Illusion" refers to - 

• "Sherlock" Zabel is a fraud
• Dylan loves Brianna
• Husband stopped cheating

[Mrs Shibbles]

2 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Did anyone compare the sideburns of the guy who had the girls locked up in his bar with the sideburns that we saw last week? You know, just to make sure that they actually match.

I was also trying to determine  if he looked like a weasel. 

[Snazzy Daisy]

Is Colin really dead???

Just for a shock value?

[SG429]

I really hate the TV/Film trope of backup arriving only after our hero has vanquished all threats and is sitting quietly holding a smoking gun. IRL, an "officer down" call especially would get a huge, almost instantaneous, response from several surrounding departments. I don't think we even heard distant sirens until she was done.

[DoubleUTeeEff]

4 hours ago, SnazzyDaisy said:

Allie (the sex worker) described her attacker as a bearded white man who smoked Winston cigarettes and drove a blue utility van. Maybe Mr. Pott the kidnapper has an accomplice. 

I also noticed that he didn't have a beard! On the one hand, Katie kept referring to a "he" singular and not a "them" like there was only one kidnapper but on the other hand when "he" was tying up Katie, he looked like he did have a beard. Maybe the simplest explanation is that he shaved for some reason?

I think they used the same blue van at each of the houses Zabel (RIP) and Mare visited. I mean, they were all the exact same bright blue color. That just stood out to me.

I noticed Mare noticing Billy's Rolling Rock as well. It looked like he hadn't drunk any of it though like he didn't want to leave his DNA behind in a detective's house. But that could be a prop error, see blue vans.

I knew I wasn't crazy to think that Erin wasn't lying to her dad about getting the ear surgery money! I haven't watched and read 18 million murder mystery shows and novels for nothing! Here's hoping that Dylan actually DOES use the money for DJ's ear surgery. C'mon Dylan, redeem yourself!

Poor Zabel unknowingly made a deathbed confession to Mare. Falsely taking credit for cracking a case doesn't seem quite as bad as planting evidence but nevertheless, Mare and Zabel a match made in unethical police behavior. I will miss Zabel for the final two episodes.

Lori's daughter getting bullied really took me back to middle school so well done on that scene, show.

[Dminches]

40 minutes ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

I think they used the same blue van at each of the houses Zabel (RIP) and Mare visited. I mean, they were all the exact same bright blue color. That just stood out to me.

I noticed Mare noticing Billy's Rolling Rock as well. It looked like he hadn't drunk any of it though like he didn't want to leave his DNA behind in a detective's house. But that could be a prop error, see blue vans.

 

 

 

The 3 blue vans were actually very different colors in the video.

Billy had finished one of the Rolling Rocks and got up to get another.  He didn’t drink from the new one. I am sure there was more than enough DNA on the finished one which he left on the table to do some testing.

 

[jrzy]

10 hours ago, GussieK said:

On a lighter note, Mare’s hysterical laughter in the car on the way home from the funeral was a wonderful moment. 

I love those moments with Helen and Mare.

[Broderbits]

10 hours ago, SnazzyDaisy said:

I really wanna know what Jess took from Erin’s journal.

Yes! And I know she was using the flashlight feature on her phone, but maybe she took some pictures with it when Dylan had his back turned.

[blixie]

Quote

Maybe the simplest explanation is that he shaved for some reason?

Uh yeah I think so, almost certainly if he encountered a girl who "got away" he'd at least be smart enough to change the way he looked.

Joanna Robinson at Vanity Fair has made a really strong case for why the dad/killer is John Ross, the only hole I can find in this is I can't see how his son KNOWS he killed Erin, I'm sure he caught his dad coming in late after Frank had already passed out, and it makes sense the kid assumed it was cheating, and not murder durdering.

[SomeTameGazelle]

30 minutes ago, blixie said:

strong case for why the dad/killer is John Ross, the only hole I can find in this is I can't see how his son KNOWS he killed Erin, I'm sure he caught his dad coming in late after Frank had already passed out, and it makes sense the kid assumed it was cheating

It didn't seem like Ryan assumed anything he told Lori. She asked if it was the same woman and he said yes -- either he saw his dad with someone specific or his dad confirmed it in their "secret" talk.  Why would he say yes if he didn't know?

[preeya]

6 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

A spouse who cheats is an asshole. A spouse who keeps cheating is a shit bag (if you're unhappy enough to keep cheating, just man up and leave your wife). A man who asks HIS CHILD to keep it a secret that he's cheating again is a FUCKING ASSHOLE. It is not your child's responsibility to keep your awful secrets from his own mother.

How would the kid know the dad is cheating [again]? Why would the FUCKING ASSHOLE confide in his young son?  However, kudos to the son for beating the shit out of the other FUCKING ASSHOLE in the lunchroom.

Edited May 17, 2021 by preeya

[roughing it]

The resemblance between Lori and her son is uncanny.  They look like they are really mom and son.

With Helen always bringing people into their home (Brianna's mom, Siobhan's ex, Carrie) I wonder if she will offer Carrie to live with them, in order to keep Drew there.

[Cristofle]

10 minutes ago, SomeTameGazelle said:

It didn't seem like Ryan assumed anything he told Lori. She asked if it was the same woman and he said yes -- either he saw his dad with someone specific or his dad confirmed it in their "secret" talk.  Why would he say yes if he didn't know?

It's possible he's lying about it being the same woman (because this poor child obviously caught his father having an affair at some time previous, which what on earth). I think he's lying about something. Yes, having your father coax you to help cover up an affair and keep it from your mother is utterly repulsive, but that kid seems deeply traumatized and troubled. Not even just about the level of violence he showed the bullies (to be honest, I also wanted to hit that kid with a tray - middle school bullies are the actual worst) but he just comes off as so profoundly damaged and distressed. I don't know if he's lying about it being "the same woman" because it's actually Erin (or he's not lying at all and it was always Erin, which would be worse on a number of levels) or if he's hiding something else altogether, but I don't think he told his mother everything he knows or everything that's happened. 

[Pike Ludwell]

15 hours ago, aghst said:

Isn't it convenient that Mare is unarmed when they go into confronting a kidnapper and killer?  Soon as they saw the Winstons, Zabel should have drawn his gun on him.  It shouldn't have taken the girls beating on that pipe.

I've found Zabel annoyingly weak and timid all along. He bristled at toughness in questioning suspects. He questioned very weakly. At the kidnapper's house, he was the officer in charge, but he just stood there like a dope when it was clear the guy needed to be arrested immediately and forcefully. Mare had to, slightly annoyedly, it seemed to me, say to him "Zabel!" and motion with her head to get him to take action, and though he had the jump the other guy outdid him. He was just too inexperienced to have been in a sitation like that at that time.

 

Edited May 17, 2021 by Pike Ludwell

[Cristofle]

1 minute ago, Pike Ludwell said:

I know it goes against all the love people here have for Zabel, but I found him annoyingly weak and timid all along. He bristled at toughness in questioning suspects. He questioned very weakly. At the kidnapper's house, he was the officer in charge, but he just stood there like a dope when it was clear the guy needed to be arrested immediately and forcefully. Mare had to, rather annoyingly, say to him "Zabel!" and motion with her head to get him to take action, and though he had the jump the other guy outdid him. He was just too inexperienced to have been in a sitation like that at that time.

 

While I liked Zabel and will miss his energy on the show, I agree that he was WAY out of his depth in this situation and should have drawn his weapon much sooner. Mare had made it clear to him she didn't have a weapon and he needed to be more immediate and decisive with his. He did not respond appropriately to a person who was more than likely extremely dangerous. I think that's kind of the sad thing about Zabel at the end of the day; he had just acknowledged he was not as experienced as he was believed to be, and a few minutes later his lack of experience and ability to respond quickly to a highly dangerous situation led to him getting killed. 

[EtheltoTillie]

4 minutes ago, Pike Ludwell said:

I know it goes against all the love people here have for Zabel, but I found him annoyingly weak and timid all along. He bristled at toughness in questioning suspects. He questioned very weakly. At the kidnapper's house, he was the officer in charge, but he just stood there like a dope when it was clear the guy needed to be arrested immediately and forcefully. Mare had to, slightly annoyedly, it seemed to me, say to him "Zabel!" and motion with her head to get him to take action, and though he had the jump the other guy outdid him. He was just too inexperienced to have been in a sitation like that at that time.

 

I agree with this, and he had started to reveal that he was not the wonderkind after all in a previous episode.  But he did spot the Winstons.

[aghst]

5 minutes ago, Pike Ludwell said:

I know it goes against all the love people here have for Zabel, but I found him annoyingly weak and timid all along. He bristled at toughness in questioning suspects. He questioned very weakly. At the kidnapper's house, he was the officer in charge, but he just stood there like a dope when it was clear the guy needed to be arrested immediately and forcefully. Mare had to, slightly annoyedly, it seemed to me, say to him "Zabel!" and motion with her head to get him to take action, and though he had the jump the other guy outdid him. He was just too inexperienced to have been in a sitation like that at that time.

 

In real life, we see that cops will shoot first, ask questions later.  If they have the slightest sense that a suspect could be armed or harm them in other ways, they'd draw and try to get the suspect to put his hands up and if he doesn't, they shoot.

Also in real life, suspects who committed crimes will either give themselves up or kill themselves rather than try to kill cops to evade capture.

In TV shows and movies criminals are more inclined to double-down and keep killing once they're found out rather than give up, kill themselves, commit suicide by cop.

[Penman61]

2 hours ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

I think they used the same blue van at each of the houses Zabel (RIP) and Mare visited. I mean, they were all the exact same bright blue color. That just stood out to me.

I noticed Mare noticing Billy's Rolling Rock as well. It looked like he hadn't drunk any of it though like he didn't want to leave his DNA behind in a detective's house. But that could be a prop error, see blue vans.

(emphasis added)

Small in the scheme of things, but: This is a multi-million-dollar series starring an Oscar-winning actor presented by the world's most prestigious streaming service.

If they can't get this basic murder-mystery movie-making shit right, it's really annoying. "The filmmakers fucked up, lol" should not be an option when I'm trying to follow the story of solving a crime.

Edited May 17, 2021 by Penman61

[paigow]

12 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

A spouse who cheats is an asshole. A spouse who keeps cheating is a shit bag (if you're unhappy enough to keep cheating, just man up and leave your wife). A man who asks HIS CHILD to keep it a secret that he's cheating again is a FUCKING ASSHOLE. It is not your child's responsibility to keep your awful secrets from his own mother.

This adultery spectrum have has space for single people that are knowing accessories?

Edited May 17, 2021 by paigow
Grammar

[ElectricBoogaloo]

1 hour ago, SomeTameGazelle said:

It didn't seem like Ryan assumed anything he told Lori. She asked if it was the same woman and he said yes -- either he saw his dad with someone specific or his dad confirmed it in their "secret" talk.  Why would he say yes if he didn't know?

Clearly his dad did something because when he was leaving the house with a packed bag (I'm assuming Lori kicked his ass out after confronting him), he said, "Hey, Ryan. This is all my fault and I'm going to fix it. I promise. You just gotta hang in there, okay?" Maybe the show is trying to misdirect us into thinking that his dad did something when what actually happened is Ryan did something and his dad covered it up and is now letting Lori assume that he cheated on her in order to keep Ryan's secret. But the simplest explanation is that his dad cheated, Ryan saw it happen, and his dad told him to keep it a secret. It's possible that Ryan knows something else and when his mom asked, "Is your dad doing it again?" he just said yes because it was easier to nod his head silently than to tell her what was really happening.

[Kirsty]

13 hours ago, aghst said:

Isn't it convenient that Mare is unarmed when they go into confronting a kidnapper and killer?

No, Mare has been unarmed since the end of episode three when she got suspended. I'd forgotten that, so at first I wondered why she wasn't pulling her weapon in that Bennie's Tavern scene. But she had to hand over her badge and her gun to her boss two episodes ago.

It's good storytelling but I hated that kid (Ryan?) getting pressured by both his parents. His father leaning on him to stay complicit in Dad cheating on Mom. And his mother leaning on him to give up Dad's secrets to Mom, instead of reassuring the kid or talking about his feelings. Terrible stuff. Anyway, I wonder if Ryan saw his father with Erin at some point.

Good episode. Poor, dead, careful Zabel and his poor mom who knew him best in the world.😭

Dawn's daughter is a survivor. I like the way she knew what was going on in the rapist's house and she took advantage of the situation. Smart cookie.

Edited to add:

Quote

That's my point, that side plot about her trying to frame Carrie, then getting suspended. Part of that is all about setting up this armed confrontation, which isn't realistic.

Maybe, as you say, that *was* the point of her getting suspended, but I really enjoyed the armed confrontation sequence in this episode. So it worked for me. And so far, I have no complaints about the pacing of the show. I'm enjoying the journey. This show is as at least as much about life in Easttown as it is about the mystery. You could say that the mystery is just an excuse for exploring the lives of the people of Easttown.

Edited May 17, 2021 by Kirsty

[aghst]

Just now, Kirsty said:

No, Mare has been unarmed since the end of episode three when she got suspended. I'd forgotten that, so at first I wondered why she wasn't pulling her gun in that Bennie's Tavern scene. But she had to hand over her badge and her gun to her boss two episodes ago.

That's my point, that side plot about her trying to frame Carrie, then getting suspended.  Part of that is all about setting up this armed confrontation, which isn't realistic.

That and to fill up 7 episodes, they had to get Mare sidelined for a couple of episodes, so that the mystery isn't wrapped up in say 4 episodes instead of 7.

[cardigirl]

Deacon Mark said that Erin became hysterical over an inconceivable "betrayal" so I'm thinking her bff Jess may have been involved somehow. But I've been wrong about everything else so far.  What do I know. 

Still reeling over Colin Zabel's demise. 

[SG429]

Interesting that they chose to leave the real name of this Delaware County school on the wall, while adding the Easttown branding. I'm sure they've got some photoshoppy trick to change Tinicum to Easttown if they wanted.

[ShadowHunter]

I turn on the radio and Sweet Dreams is playing lol. Evan Peters ran to that song in X-Men Apocalypse lol. I'm being mocked lol. I hope he gets another HBO series down the line.

 

[thesupremediva1]

This ep was obviously the best yet - Mare and Zabel by the bridge was gold, as was the funeral and car ride home.

My only gripe is that it was terrible police work for Mare and Colin to go in there unarmed without backup and not leave immediately upon realizing what they were dealing with. Or Colin should have had his weapon drawn before the guy got back in the room. Mare and Colin both looked terrified and weak during the confrontation, which I wouldn't expect of a hardened detective like Mare. Maybe Zabel but even that is stretch.

All those issues aside, this ep was like watching "The Departed" for me. When that guy shot Colin I had the same expletive-filled, jump-out-of-my-seat reaction I had when Billy was shot. At that moment, I just wasn't expecting it. I saw a tense shoot-out and maybe an escaped perp for the next two eps. I was wrong. I will miss Zabel - he was the best thing in this show. 

It's quite possible her friend's husband was having an affair with Erin on and off and finally killed her. For some reason I believe her death is not related to the two kidnappings and the guy Mare shot. This show so far has been all about misdirection.

Cue Mare being in biiiig trouble for all of this mess, including Colin's death. Good luck proving it was all self-defense given what she's pulled in the last few eps.

Edited May 17, 2021 by thesupremediva1

[Cristofle]

1 hour ago, Kirsty said:

And his mother leaning on him to give up Dad's secrets to Mom, instead of reassuring the kid or talking about his feelings.

What trips me up with her is more that this has apparently happened before. That's what the episode is saying. Lori's husband had an affair before the show's timeline, their son found out, the husband convinced him to keep quiet, and it naturally caused the son extreme distress. She probably could have bypassed asking her son about this now and confronted her husband directly (he could have lied and probably would have, but she could have at least tried, but I also think this son keeping whatever secret he has is toxic for him, so that's a tougher call). But more to the point, why on EARTH would she take her husband back in the first place, for this to happen again??? I can see an affair not being a deal breaker, personally. Whatever it would or would not be for me, I can see why it doesn't always end a marriage. But roping their young child into the affair, trying to manipulate him into keeping secrets? I can't fathom getting past that. 

[Penman61]

12 minutes ago, thesupremediva1 said:

Cue Mare being in biiiig trouble for all of this mess, including Colin's death. Good luck proving it was all self-defense given what she's pulled in the last few eps.

Maybe. But Mare returning two kidnapped/sex-slaved girls alive to their families will mitigate that trouble, I should think.

Edited May 17, 2021 by Penman61

[SerenityNow721]

4 hours ago, blixie said:

not murder durdering

Don’t you mean durder murdering?? 😂😂😂

[BC4ME]

I really liked Colin. I especially liked how this episode he was so indecisive at his mom's house when she was telling him Mare was just using him before he left with her. Like he "knew" but he didn't want to know. It seemed like real life. I'm a pretty decisive person but I've definitely been exactly like that in certain situations. You want what you want and you don't want to listen to your head. But he definitely wasn't a real powerhouse. Very charming though. At least the person he stole credit from in his big breakout case died so there was nobody to really give the credit to so I guess he felt like it was harmless. It wasn't harmless to him. More secret demons.

Mare going in there with the kidnapper guy with no gun put them both at risk and then when she motioned for Colin to draw, she was too late. Or he wasn't fast enough. Either way, I can see how she might think she got him killed. 

I read that last scene as her breaking down over someone else (besides her son) dying because of her.  Or at least that's how she saw it. 

It seems like every character in this show is living in some kind of private hell. 

Edited May 17, 2021 by BC4ME

[FemmyV]

8 hours ago, Cristofle said:

Wow! RIP, Zabel. I don't know whether to give kudos to the show because I was genuinely surprised in the moment, which doesn't happen often on TV anymore, or if I'm frustrated that we lost a good character who added an important balance to the show two episodes too early in order to create that shock value (I'm less annoyed than I might be because this is such a limited series, but in general killing off important characters for shock value is not a trope I appreciate in the slightest).

Well, it is Mare of Easttown, not Mare & Zabel of... Fwiw.

And I'm really looking forward to the next scene with Mare and Zabel's mom, because it may give some hint as to how dysfunctional either or both women are. 

 

[Cristofle]

54 minutes ago, thesupremediva1 said:

Cue Mare being in biiiig trouble for all of this mess, including Colin's death. Good luck proving it was all self-defense given what she's pulled in the last few eps.

I could see her getting in trouble for working on the case for being suspended. Less so for Colin's death - he was the lead detective and it was his job to the appropriate back-up in that moment. However, I don't think she will be questioned at ALL for it being self defense. This man shot and killed a cop. He had two girls held hostage, and they can report they had been held hostage (in Katie's case for some time) and that they made a racket to indicate to the cops that they were in the house (therefore setting off their abductor - they can also report hearing gunshots, seeing Mare, and seeing/hearing parts of a struggle before hearing the shots that killed the man). He shot Mare herself. I'd be very surprised if anyone even suggested the shooting wasn't justified. The main reason she'd be in trouble would be working on the case and questioning a suspect while suspended. I don't think they can hold her responsible for Colin's death and I seriously, seriously doubt she'll get anything but a medal for killing this guy. 

[Snazzy Daisy]

5 hours ago, blixie said:

Joanna Robinson at Vanity Fair has made a really strong case for why the dad/killer is John Ross, the only hole I can find in this is I can't see how his son KNOWS he killed Erin, I'm sure he caught his dad coming in late after Frank had already passed out, and it makes sense the kid assumed it was cheating, and not murder durdering.

If we go along with the theory that John Ross killed Erin, what would be the best explanation for the (alleged) murder weapon to be in Billy’s possession, hidden in his toolbox? And why is he still keeping it?

 

[paigow]

If there is a wake for Zabel, will Mare jump up and say:

"Colin deserved to die because he has no quick draw ability. Furthermore, he was a fraud and I only kissed him once."

10 minutes ago, SnazzyDaisy said:

If we go along with the theory that John Ross killed Erin, what would be the best explanation for the (alleged) murder weapon to be in Billy’s possession, hidden in his toolbox? And why is he still keeping it?

 

Guns are expensive...

Edited May 17, 2021 by paigow

[Snow Fairy]

I had a feeling that Jess found someone's picture. Possibly the baby's father

[HeyThere83]

There was a brief focus on Zabel's coffee cup as he was leaving his mother's house.  I would like to know why. 

[Tippi]

This is the first show that's been must see TV for me since GOT.  I had never heard of Evan Peters before this, have not seen him in anything else.  Like many here, I screamed out NO! when he got shot.   In a show full of great performances, his was one of my favorites.  

[Cheezwiz]

After having time to think more about this and previous episodes, I'm wondering if the whole issue of the identity of Erin's baby daddy is a bit of a diversion or slight-of-hand. People have been assuming that whoever fathered the kid is likely the murderer. Just as the two missing person cases featured in the show appear to be unrelated, someone may have fathered the kid, and a completely different person could have killed her.

Could jumpy beardy cousin (who got all uncomfortable and left the pizza party abruptly) be the father, and other beardy cousin John Ross be her killer? Could the two beardies be covering for each other OR alternately keeping secrets from each other? Could Lori have snapped and killed Erin in a jealous rage? Because of their son's distress, I'm now giving both Ross's major side-eye.

I mentioned above that as of now, the cases appear to be unrelated, but perhaps that's not actually true. One of the girls who was interviewed by Mare & Zabel said her abductor had a beard. Could one of the beardies be an accomplice? Perhaps Erin figured out what he was up to, freaked out and threatened to go to the police?

I'm also still wondering about Mare's clergy cousin. He's been appearing repeatedly throughout the show, but only briefly. He seems very preoccupied with the case, and I'm not sure if it's out of concern for sketchy Deacon, or something else.

 

[raven]

1 hour ago, HeyThere83 said:

There was a brief focus on Zabel's coffee cup as he was leaving his mother's house.  I would like to know why. 

I noticed that too so went back to look.  The cup just says "Detective.  County of Delaware, Pennsylvania". 

55 minutes ago, Cheezwiz said:

One of the girls who was interviewed by Mare & Zabel said her abductor had a beard.

I think in this case it's the simplest explanation - he shaved.  The kidnapper had a lot of scruff, as if he shaves often and badly.  I think the kidnappings are solved and that Erin's murder is unconnected, except for the prostitution angle.

On re-watch, Billy definitely says that Erin stayed him "at least 3 years ago, maybe more",  Of course that doesn't mean that they couldn't have had sex after she moved out.  I hate that idea, she would have been around 15? 

I have sympathy for Jess.  I think she really was a friend to Erin.  She seems somewhat intimidated by the two guys, or Dylan at least.  She copied/photo something from the journal.  It looks to me that right now she is the only teen trying to do something for Erin.

I think I'm on the Dylan is the killer train until proven otherwise.  His occasional kindness to DJ is the red herring; the real Dylan is the one who stood coldly by while his girlfriend and other people beat up Erin.   Erin was hysterical after receiving a text - maybe Dylan threatened to expose her on SideDoor and take the baby away.  She adored that baby; threatening to take him away would def make her hysterical and insistent that she be dropped off to meet someone.

3 hours ago, Cristofle said:

I could see her getting in trouble for working on the case for being suspended.

Yes, this is the only thing I think she did wrong in the kidnapping scenario.  Colin's inexperience was not her fault - though she may not see it that way.  It all happens rather quickly - shut the music off, spot the Winstons, oh shit Mare has no gun, Colin undo your holster, the girls start banging on the pipes, kidnapper tries to blow it off, Mare spots the security cameras which increases her suspicion, banging gets louder.  Mare has to tell Colin to draw his gun.   Even after being shot and running and hiding, Mare has the presence of mind to text for help.  Killing the guy was absolutely self defense, he would have killed her otherwise.  Other than the fact that she wasn't supposed to be working, I can't fault her in the scenario at all.

Damn, I hate waiting so long for the next episode!

[Laurie4H]

19 hours ago, ZeeEnnui said:

I co-sign the poster who said that it was nice to see him not starring in a Ryan Murphy vehicle. Between this and WandaVision, it's nice to see Peters branch out and show his range. 

Yes it’s nice when actors get a chance to show their range.  Or finally get a legit acting job.  Like Stephen Dorff in True Detective.  HBO should keep up the good casting.  
This show is very well done.  

[bosawks]

I really thought Colin wasn’t going to make it through the season but I was not prepared for that.

And my prediction for Erin’s killer is whatever will devastate Mare the most…..