S40.E10: The Full Circle

[SG429]

So very happy for the DVR. Even FF'ing through the first half looked excruciating.

Problem #1 - FamVisit has been used with a much smaller group of players, often as a recognition of achieving, what, Final 7 or 8 or 9? Probst must have felt like Oprah - "You get a family and you get a family! Everybody gets a family!"

Problem #2 - FamVisit also is  used to advance the game: the reward challenge and subsequent "pick another player(s) and loved ones to join you on the reward." This was more like Take Your Family To Work Day.

Edited April 16, 2020 by SG429
expanded thoughts on why 1/2 the episode was a waste.

[SuburbanHangSuite]

I really Cannot. Stand. Sarah.   I hope her whiny, entitled ass gets on Tony's last nerve and he abandons that stupid Cops R Us loyalty.  Jeremy was right to want to split up she and Sophie.

Jeremy's one daughter was his straight-up twin.  I'm not mad at him playing his advantage.  I really thought his whole Firefighter "You go, we go" code would kick in and he wouldn't play it but I think that whispering unnerved him---no one seemed to be checking in with him.

I still love Rob above all others but I will be rooting for Tyson to get back in again from The Edge.  He was pissed.

 

[Jextella]

Seems I'm in the minority, but I LOVE the family visits.

I especially loved this one.  Bringing in the children and the loved ones for both the players and those on EOE was wonderful - and fitting given the nature of this season.

I also REALLY like the family-friendly focus of this group.  All their relationships seem happy and healthy.  And Tony's point is well-taken.  They can bond over their love of family and now they have a 2nd family in Survivor.  

I recall an interview with Spencer.  He had a really tough upbringing and then some wierdness from his parents after he played.  He said a LOT of past players reached out to him.  He was very moved and referred to them as family. I hope he and Tony are still in touch.  I think Spencer could use him.

Anyway, I'm not super close with my family so maybe that's why I like the family visits - and why I like to see the players bond as a second tier of family.

Anyone know why Tyson's other daughter wasn't there? He has two kids, right?

 

Edited April 16, 2020 by Jextella

[TVFan1]

Yeah, the loved ones visit lasted way longer than it needed to. It basically ate up half the show. I'm all for showing the loved ones visit, but this one took up too much time.

The whispering at tribal council is really getting on my nerves. How did Denise become a target?  This tribal council left me confused as to who was the actual target, and who was safe. It would be great to know this stuff, show. I feel nervous for Kim and company now.

Edited April 16, 2020 by TVFan1

[Scatterbrained]

I’m glad everyone got to spend time with their families.  The part I fast forwarded through was the immunity challenge.  So boring.

[LadyChatts]

25 minutes ago, Jextella said:

Seems I'm in the minority, but I LOVE the family visits.

I especially loved this one.  Bringing in the children and the loved ones for both the players and those on EOE was wonderful - and fitting given the nature of this season.

I also REALLY like the family-friendly focus of this group.  All their relationships seem happy and healthy.  And Tony's point is well-taken.  They can bond over their love of family and now they have a 2nd family in Survivor.  

I recall an interview with Spencer.  He had a really tough upbringing and then some wierdness from his parents after he played.  He said a LOT of past players reached out to him.  He was clearly touched and referred to them as family. I hope he and Tony are still in touch.  I think Spencer could use him.

Anyway, I'm not super close with my family so maybe that's why I like the family visits - and why I like to see the players bond as a second tier of family.

Anyone know why Tyson's other daughter wasn't there? He has two kids, right?

 

I actually enjoyed the family visit more on EOE than I did with those in the game.  I got thinking, in the early seasons, they didn't always have family visits, or it was one loved one that the winner of the challenge would go meet somewhere.  There were a couple of times I remember them surprising the person, too (Sean with his dad in season 1, and Colby with his mom in season 2).  But it took up half of the episode, and it led to what was probably a more chaotic TC because no one knew what was going on.  We heard 4 names thrown out, and I'm still confused why Sophie over Sarah.  I can't even remember why Tony targeted Tyson.  And I'm confused about how the numbers side came out and Kim's side had no one.  They should have done a 2 hour episode, or even a 90 minute one, with this. 

I guess my problem with the family visit is when everyone gets so weepy.  They haven't been away from their loved ones that long.  Even Parvati, who has a little baby, seemed to be crying less than some of the others.  

But at least it beats last year's where the person whose name rhymed with Pan was trash talking the other contestants in front of his kid.  And I was also wondering the same thing about Tyson's other kid; I think Probst made a point of mentioning "and one of your daughters".  Maybe they couldn't get her to fly?  Was sick?

Edited April 16, 2020 by LadyChatts

[Steph Sometimes]

Half the show. The family visit was half the show. At first when they brought everyone out, I thought how upset TPTB must be about the Marianos being out. But nope, they brought out their kids. 

Maybe I'm just a little bitter because I haven't been able to see my family since quarantine started. Well, more bitter. Kids were cute though.

Ha! I had the same thought about Probst bringing out Wendell for Michele.

I'm not sure how they divided into those two (equal numbered) groups. I would've liked more time spent on that.

My mom still likes Ben. She also said something about all the advantages being pulled out at tribal which was weird. So I then described the tragic situation of one Cirie Fields.

Edited April 16, 2020 by Steph Sometimes

[30 Helens]

I think I enjoy the family visits more than most. I like seeing what the players’ significant others look like (“How did he get her?!” and so on), and I’m not immune to a bit of sentimentality. That said, HALF THE SHOW was way too long to spend on that. They should have just released the hordes of kids, done some pan shots and closeups, and called it a day. I was surprised to see Val, though. I thought she was sick? I’m glad to be (hopefully) wrong. 
 

2 hours ago, Wandering Snark said:

I don't really actually care what they are saying I just want to hear it for crissakes. We are the audience and we should know what's going on. I don't care how 'in the dark' this makes others or portions of the contestants. Let them keep the advantage of not knowing what people are saying but LET US IN. Hang a few new mic and the people at home can hear but the other contestants don't. It's that easy. Period. 

Agreed. I think it was the first EoE season where this became a thing— I remember the first batshit crazy TC where everyone jumped up and started whispering and having impromptu conferences. I loved it at the time because, unlike now, I could actually hear what was going on. And what wasn’t audible, was subtitled. Keeping it silent ruins all the fun and just makes it annoying. If they don’t want to let us in, they should just edit it out. 

2 hours ago, healthnut said:

Word is they did and it was 3-3-3 and then Tyson went home on revote but it was edited out. I believe they edited out a revote on Kellyn’s exit in GI. 

Now, see, that’s an example of something that is actually interesting, edited out so we would have more time for whispering. And endless family introductions.

Yawn. Hoping for a better episode next week.
 

[Growsonwalls]

One thing I will say about the new school Survivors is that they seem to be closer than the old school Survivors. Back in the day you had situations like Rob and Lex feuding for years and Eliza feuding with her entire cast after Vanuatu. The new school Survivors are more cordial with each other (judging from social media) despite the expected differences in politics and lifestyle. 

[30 Helens]

3 minutes ago, Steph Sometimes said:

My mom still likes Ben. 

I just had a horrible thought. I’ve been considering Ben as merely a pesky anomaly, certain to be eliminated at any moment. But what if, at the end of all this,  the player anointed as the Greatest of All Time, Winner of Winners, is... Ben. 
😱

[CraftyHazel]

34 minutes ago, Steph Sometimes said:

Half the show. The family visit was half the show. At first when they brought everyone out, I thought how upset TPTB must be about the Marianos being out. But nope, they brought out their kids. 

Maybe I'm just a little bitter because I haven't been able to see my family since quarantine started. Well, more bitter. Kids were cute though.

Ha! I had the same thought about Probst bringing out Wendell for Michele.

I'm not sure how they divided into those two (equal numbered) groups. I would've liked more time spent on that.

My mom still likes Ben. 

My best friend, I suspect, likes Ben.  I despise him.  We pointedly don’t discuss Survivor, ever, because when we used to, she never liked any of the players I did and always seemed to like the ones I couldn’t stand.  So by silent mutual agreement, we never really talk about the show.

Which is why y’all are stuck with me.

[GaT]

I can’t believe they wasted half the episode on the families, I HATE the family episode.

I give Kim credit for guts, too bad she picked the wrong person. I think Jeremy is in a world of trouble now.

[Jextella]

11 hours ago, TVFan1 said:

Yeah, the loved ones visit lasted way longer than it needed to. It basically ate up half the show. I'm all for showing the loved ones visit, but this one took up too much time.

My feeling is that one hour is not enough to do justice to the viewers.  With EOE and all the new twists and turns, we see very little strategy.  Tonight's episode was a super example.  Out of the blue, we see Nick and Michelle on differnt sides and no idea why that happened.

I think the loved one's visit is a nice break in the season.  Given the all-winners season, I can forgive the show for making it so long.

Regardless, with so many new elements (EOE, fire tokens, and crazy things like idol nullifiers that players can't strategize around), all episodes need to be 90 minutes long or they need to drop something.

At this point, I'm watching for entertainment rather than game play.  We just don't see enough of the latter to make a difference for me.  Consequently, I'm no longer super invested in who I'd like to win.

It's fun tv but not much of a game anymore.

Oh, and I also think the whispering at tribal is getting old fast.  That also speaks to how poorly the game is structured now-a-days.  If its sort of a random free-for-all right up to the end, there really isn't a ton of solid strategy to begin with.  This also makes the game less of a game.   It's just a big mess.

Edited April 16, 2020 by Jextella

[LadyChatts]

Here is the TC voting.  I know there were some comments about who voted for who, since it looked like Tyson/Michele/Kim/Denise were all voting together, yet Sophie only got 2 votes.  Michele definitely voted for Tyson, along with Sarah (one of her votes), Ben, Tony, and Nick.  Sarah used her other vote to vote for Denise, as did Sophie.  Also, Sophie looks like she's in a hostage video when holding up Denise's name.  Michele kind of threw her arms up at that vote, so I'm thinking she probably went along with voting off Tyson reluctantly.

https://youtu.be/z9ueHJQ4wr4

 

Edited April 16, 2020 by LadyChatts

[Primetimer]

Joe Reid weighs in on those 30 minutes of family visits and what they cost strategy-minded fans in his weekly wrap-up:

https://www.primetimer.com/features/survivor-goes-more-is-more-on-the-biggest-loved-ones-visit-ever

 

 

 

[grandmabegum]

6 hours ago, Vgmastr said:

Can we please be done with the whispering at Tribal?  That needs to be a new rule, it's ruining the game.  Can you imagine how fun that Tribal could have been if everyone had been forced to immediately vote after Jeremy left without being able to talk and decide on a new plan?

This! 1000x this! The whispering at tribal is annoying already, but they've let it go for so long you can't stop it now. But to have Jeremy expose his advantage and then allow them to regroup and then allow Sarah to play her advantage is bullshit. Since they didn't vote right away they were able to huddle up, be like "it's 5 votes to 4, but if Sarah plays her advantage it's 6 votes to 3 and we can split it up and someone's going home even if they do have an idol."

Sorry if this was said up thread. I watched late online on the west coast but this just got me so pissed off. I shall catch up now! Huzzah!

ETA: So I was totally right that people had already discussed. I feel like I need to have a notepad so I can read the whole thread and then comment since I'm so behind. Anyway, I am doubling down to ask a question that may have been answered - I did a keyword search and it didn't seem to pick anything up. Here goes --

Seems like there's a lot of chatter about a revote. I agree that there's a very good possibility that this would happen based on my thinking that they wanted to flush an idol out. But if they did revote, that would mean that no one played the idol the first vote. So I was just curious if there was a rule that you could play it after any vote.

Given the rules about advantages this TC were loosey goosey, but it's kind of weird that you could hold it for the first vote and use it the second. But then again it would explain why Kim was really nervous cause she must have figured people would flip, but in that case I would think she would've played it on Tyson because he's way less likeable.

Follow up ridiculous question: If it was a revote, Kim played Tyson and then it was a tie between Denise and Sophie would they revote again? Oh, the madness.

Edited April 16, 2020 by grandmabegum
Going down the revote rabbit hole

[Tdoc72]

5 hours ago, tracyscott76 said:

Nadiya's. I believe one or the other of them referred to Natalie as "Aunty" at one point.

Yes!  And how adorable was that little baby in her teeny pink life jacket?

3 hours ago, SG429 said:

So very happy for the DVR. Even FF'ing through the first half looked excruciating.

Problem #1 - FamVisit has been used with a much smaller group of players, often as a recognition of achieving, what, Final 7 or 8 or 9? Probst must have felt like Oprah - "You get a family and you get a family! Everybody gets a family!"

Problem #2 - FamVisit also is  used to advance the game: the reward challenge and subsequent "pick another player(s) and loved ones to join you on the reward." This was more like Take Your Family To Work Day.

I think it would be unfair for kids to fly that far and not get to spend time w/their parent. While adults would understand if there was a challenge or whatever, I don’t think kids (especially the under 7 crowd) would get it. This way, they saw their parents, played on the beach and had a picnic. 

3 hours ago, Jextella said:

 

Anyone know why Tyson's other daughter wasn't there? He has two kids, right?

 

I had the same question. And also who brought the Mariano children there?  They didn’t hop a plane to Fiji by themselves. 

[Nashville]

6 hours ago, Eolivet said:

Family visits with one family member = oh god, here we go again, quit yer whining, jeez, you'll see them again in a month, get control of yourself.

Family visits with family members and kids = Awww, so CUTE!!! Look at their little faces!!! Oh, they miss their mommies and daddies so much, the sweet things!! This is wonderful.

::shrugs:: I can't explain it.

 

Was it just me, or did Tony’s daughter look like she had a “scared shitless” expression permanently tattooed on her face?  Swear to god - the kid was cute, but I couldn’t look at her without seeing a giant walking ulcer.

 

5 hours ago, tracyscott76 said:

With the way Sophie and her fiance sprinted out of the challenge, I'm guessing they were hoping to beat everyone else back.

Derned if I wasn’t thinking the exact same thing at the time....

[grandmabegum]

4 hours ago, Jextella said:

Anyone know why Tyson's other daughter wasn't there? He has two kids, right?

I was also wondering this. Just speculating, since Tyson didn't seem surprised she wasn't there I wonder if it's just something as simple as she doesn't like planes or boats or something.

And I would assume the Mariano kids came with whoever's been taking care of them this whole time, but having Rob and Amber have six visitors would be over kill -- they probably stashed the guardians where the boat took off from.

Jeez some of those babies were so small. I don't have kids nor do I have a maternal instinct, but the babies that were cradled in arms I was like, "why are they not in bjorns!" I'm not holding a baby free handed on a boat. But who knows maybe there's some weird safety thing. I didn't notice if the littlest ones had vests on, I don't think the babies did though, but babies also can't walk so they sure as hell can't tread water so they go over it's sadness. Okay and on that bleak thought.

[HeShallBMySquishy]

6 hours ago, Eolivet said:

Family visits with one family member = oh god, here we go again, quit yer whining, jeez, you'll see them again in a month, get control of yourself.

Family visits with family members and kids = Awww, so CUTE!!! Look at their little faces!!! Oh, they miss their mommies and daddies so much, the sweet things!! This is wonderful.

::shrugs:: I can't explain it.

I admit, I'm of two ways regarding the family visits. If it's a contestant I like and am rooting for, often I'm all, "Awww, look at that, that is so sweet!" But if it's someone I find obnoxious: "For fuck's sake, quit your whinging and get on with it."

6 hours ago, Vgmastr said:

Can we please be done with the whispering at Tribal?  That needs to be a new rule, it's ruining the game.  Can you imagine how fun that Tribal could have been if everyone had been forced to immediately vote after Jeremy left without being able to talk and decide on a new plan?

6 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

Probst loves the whispering.  He's talked about it before.  And that's great for him, because he's actually there to probably overhear what's going on and eavesdrop and ask follow up questions.  Personally, I hate it and don't see how it makes good TV at all.

5 hours ago, Wandering Snark said:

I've harped on this one over and over since it became 'the thing' as it is now.... *sighs* But I don't really actually care what they are saying I just want to hear it for crissakes. We are the audience and we should know what's going on. I don't care how 'in the dark' this makes others or portions of the contestants. Let them keep the advantage of not knowing what people are saying but LET US IN. Hang a few new mic and the people at home can hear but the other contestants don't. It's that easy. Period. But f'n Probst loves how "his" game is 'always evolving' yadda yadda and he LOVES him a "live" tribal. But this bullshit has gone on long enough, it ruined this episode completely. Why even have them say anything Bring them in, wait for the whispers to stop and vote. Because that's what it seems like now and that is NOT a fun way to experience Survivor from home.

^^^ All of this.

"Hey, here's an idea: why don't you guys go to the backyard and play Telephone without me, and I'll stay in the kitchen and watch through the window!" said no one ever. But it seems the producers don't care about treating their audience with contempt, as evidenced  by their willingness to make all of us remain in the kitchen, watching through a window, where we can only speculate on what was or was not said.

It's a blatantly cheap trick on behalf of the producers to not clue the audience in on how and why plans and targets change. I don't know why anyone thinks it makes for riveting television to watch other people whispering and plotting and scheming, and being told much later that this is what happened and what was said, so just accept it. Screw the other contestants if they have no clue what is happening, but goddamn, at least let us in!

Damn, I wanted to smack Jeff when he gave Sarah and Jeremy not one, but two chances to play out their ridiculous "You go first, no YOU go first, no YOU go first" display. If both had something to say, give them 5 seconds to spit it out, then cut them off after 3 seconds, tell them they had their chance, too bad so sad, it is time to vote.

[grandmabegum]

The only "legitimate" (using that term very loosely) reason I can see them not recording the whispering is they'd lose the ability to keep tension for the reveal of the votes. When people are scrambling around the beach and giving talking heads they can edit any narrative they want. When they are sitting, or huddling and scrambling at tribal the conversations might tip the vote to heavily? I don't know. That's all I can think of. I really hate the whispers though. Whoever up thread said if you get up you lose your vote is a genius.

[LadyChatts]

4 hours ago, Growsonwalls said:

One thing I will say about the new school Survivors is that they seem to be closer than the old school Survivors. Back in the day you had situations like Rob and Lex feuding for years and Eliza feuding with her entire cast after Vanuatu. The new school Survivors are more cordial with each other (judging from social media) despite the expected differences in politics and lifestyle. 

I sometimes wonder if it’s the different experiences with Survivor.  The new school Survivors are what I call the SM generation of Survivor, the super fans who grew up watching the show (seriously, someone born in 2000, Survivor’s premiere season, can now play).  The old school Survivors were on when the show was watched in the millions, got coverage on TV Guide and David Letterman.  In addition, though, aside from either pursuing an acting career or going on Survivor again, most of the castaways went back to their own lives.  Returning player seasons were few and far between.  Now, there seems to be one every couple of years.  Contestants cross over onto other reality shows.  It’s like there’s more to being on Survivor than just being on TV’s #1 rated show like it use to be in the old days.  Looking back at older seasons, there is just a different vibe with contestants.  They took winning and the game more seriously than I feel contestants do now.  And in reality, alliances were usually the make or break for someone in a game.  There wasn’t an overabundance of idols and advantages.  If you got blindsided out of the game people usually took it personally. 

And while I think Lex’s feud with Rob was and is ridiculous (especially because he appears to still have a chip on his shoulder all these years later), I kind of miss the days of bitterness.

[violet and green]

I guess that episode cemented who I want to win. Only the people whose reunions with their loved ones that I wanted to watch and was moved by: Tony, Rob, Ethan.

It was instructive, but also awkward to see the way some of the littler kids responded after being left... but if we could have just had some visual highlights, minus Jeff's enthusiastic talk show host questions, and more awkwardness, I would've been fine. Just get this show on the road, man. And then having sucked up half the ep (and then Tony wins immunity, cool! I cheered), there is a few minutes left for strategizing, or what's become of it this season, and then loads of muffled whispering at tribal, on and on (you can thank the innocent cast of newbies, many of whom had never watched a season, on Australian Survivor 2016 for coming up with that, in my view, as nobody had told them you had to sit there, and now everyone does it) -- almost as long as some of those tell the folks how much you love your loved ones interviews...

I kind of passed out, and next thing I know the exilers are hugging Jeff. Weird episode. What I'd give for an old timey episode with opening theme music and captioned snatches of every player, and then a beginning, middle, editing misdirect, and satisfying/shocking vote, with the votes shown at the end.

[nlkm9]

8 hours ago, tvgoddess said:

Sarah's frog face is grating on mine.

Danielles overly filled and botoxed face is terrifying . Yikes .

[Guest]

7 hours ago, Fake Jan Brady said:

But then we would have missed out on my favorite bit of the episode: Natalie shouldering her way past a worried Rob and Ethan and seeing the "IT'S OUR FAMILIES" realization dawn on her face.

I enjoyed Amber's reaction. When she realized the families were there she got this look on her face and started running - the look was less of a smiling "oh yay my kids" and more of an intense "God help anyone who gets between me and that boat". I'm starved for Amber content, so I cling to moments like that XD

[JudyObscure]

9 hours ago, North of Eden said:

Twenty years of SURVIVOR and in my book I am declaring that to have been the worst episode ever! Not even the multiple advantage/idol plays at tribal could save it.

I'll second that vote. Those poor kids. Every last one of them looked to be in a state of shock from exhaustion, jet lag, and the frightening experience of  watching their parent have a sobbing break down right in front of them.  

 

[Haleth]

I wonder if the episode was re-edited to include more family stuff in light of the pandemic.  So many of us haven't seen loved ones in weeks but we at least get to talk, text, Zoom, whatever.  Perhaps some of us are sick or have loved ones who are sick.  Maybe we have financial worries or job insecurity.  Maybe we still can't find toilet paper.  Whatever is going on it seems the producers thought a big dose of the feels was what we need.  Yeah, I had a cathartic cry, not only when the participating players saw their kids, but the folks on EoE island did too.  That was a nice gesture.  

Poor Sandra.  Lol.

[Whimsy]

9 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Hi, Nadiya! Sorry you didn’t get enough time on camera! I still think she could swap places with twin sister Natalie, and nobody in Production would tell the difference.

Cutting the quotes down for space, since I'm responding to several here. 

There's no way, with a baby that small, that Nadiya has the abs that Natalie does.  I think that would be a dead giveaway lol. 

 

10 hours ago, North of Eden said:

The family visits are just always excrutiating but this...this waste of nearly half the episode took it to a new level. Look when at most you might only care about one or two of the ACTUAL players we are suppose to get choked up  over a invading horde of men, women and children most of whom are millionaires that were completly interchangeable and for the most part nameless after their overlong introductions? I couldn't take it after a while and pressed fast forward. And  then there was Jeff Probst pimping for an airline that's probably in the shadow of bankruptcy right about now.

Anyway I say it every year...why are they acting like the family just got liberated from Auschwitz...it's only been three weeks people?! And the irony is right about  now after being cooped up with each other for 24/7 the SURVIVORS are probably wishing they were back on the island.

 

They are not millionaires.  They all won 1,000,000.  After taxes, they won way less than that.  Even if they invested wisely, they are not multi-millionaires who can retire forever and ever.  Even if they were the uber-rich millionaires, I would still be moved by this.  I don't love the family visits.  I don't hate them like some of you, but I could take them or leave them.  This time, I loved them.  I loved seeing all the kids.

I also don't roll my eyes and get annoyed at the tears.  These people are in a pressure cooker of a situation.  I've said this in past seasons, but I give them leeway at getting emotional.  To be able to let their guards down, be themselves truly and freely in front of someone that loves them and is not trying to find any way to get you out of the game is refreshing.  I would for sure be crying if I saw my loved ones in that type of situation. 

 

4 hours ago, grandmabegum said:

Jeez some of those babies were so small. I don't have kids nor do I have a maternal instinct, but the babies that were cradled in arms I was like, "why are they not in bjorns!" I'm not holding a baby free handed on a boat. But who knows maybe there's some weird safety thing. I didn't notice if the littlest ones had vests on, I don't think the babies did though, but babies also can't walk so they sure as hell can't tread water so they go over it's sadness. Okay and on that bleak thought.

I think the baby had a lifejacket on.  Regardless, the definitely make them that small.  Also, babies are natural swimmers!  That's why they have all those baby swimming classes and they take to it like ducks to water.  

 

7 hours ago, Jextella said:

Oh, and I also think the whispering at tribal is getting old fast.  That also speaks to how poorly the game is structured now-a-days.  If its sort of a random free-for-all right up to the end, there really isn't a ton of solid strategy to begin with.  This also makes the game less of a game.   It's just a big mess.

100% agree.  It's annoying, not entertaining. 

3 hours ago, HeShallBMySquishy said:

I admit, I'm of two ways regarding the family visits. If it's a contestant I like and am rooting for, often I'm all, "Awww, look at that, that is so sweet!" But if it's someone I find obnoxious: "For fuck's sake, quit your whinging and get on with it."

^^^ All of this.

"Hey, here's an idea: why don't you guys go to the backyard and play Telephone without me, and I'll stay in the kitchen and watch through the window!" said no one ever. But it seems the producers don't care about treating their audience with contempt, as evidenced  by their willingness to make all of us remain in the kitchen, watching through a window, where we can only speculate on what was or was not said.

It's a blatantly cheap trick on behalf of the producers to not clue the audience in on how and why plans and targets change. I don't know why anyone thinks it makes for riveting television to watch other people whispering and plotting and scheming, and being told much later that this is what happened and what was said, so just accept it. Screw the other contestants if they have no clue what is happening, but goddamn, at least let us in!

Damn, I wanted to smack Jeff when he gave Sarah and Jeremy not one, but two chances to play out their ridiculous "You go first, no YOU go first, no YOU go first" display. If both had something to say, give them 5 seconds to spit it out, then cut them off after 3 seconds, tell them they had their chance, too bad so sad, it is time to vote.

I agree with your entire post.  I also think it's sweet if it's a contestant I like and roll my eyes so hard they practically pop out of my head for a contestant I don't like.  

 

But, mostly, I want to agree with what you said about all of the whispering.  I HATE, HATE, HATE it.  I know they are trying to make good television and "blindsides" have become a thing.  But, when the viewing audience are completely confused as to how this even happened, that's not good television.  We should be given at least little clues so after the vote we can say "oh, yeah!  I see it now!".  I don't care if they have let it go on for so long now.  They need to just set it as a new rule.  Whispering is done.  Come in with a plan and either stick with it or don't, but it's too late to strategize once you're at tribal. 

[skybolt]

Have Michelle and Jeremy burned all bridges with Kim and Denise, and are now the 6th and 7th wheels with the other 5? At this point I just can't see Nick, Michelle, Jeremy, Denise and Kim getting on the same page to go after the other 4. Michele acting like a potential mole has definitely limited her options with the smaller group. Also, with both Denise and Kim coming out as big threats over the last couple of episodes, I can see Jeremy working with Tony again to stay alive for another couple of votes and taking them out. He's better off doing that than trying to explain abandoning his group. They will never trust him.

I like Tyson, but at this point I'd like to see anybody else come back from EoE than him. Serious Tyson is not that fun to watch.

[violet and green]

47 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

I'll second that vote. Those poor kids. Every last one of them looked to be in a state of shock from exhaustion, jet lag, and the frightening experience of  watching their parent have a sobbing break down right in front of them.  

 

Followed up by, I kept thinking, mommy or daddy's dragon breath!

[JudyObscure]

I think Tony's little girl is probably traumatized for life.

Imagine being a child on a a 14 hour fight.  Then imagine being a grown-up, regular person on the flight that brought all those Survivor families.  The show should at least pay for their tickets.

[skybolt]

With only 9 players left I do think that they need to come out of their shell and make moves in front of the jury. You see Kim using her idol for Denise. Denise obviously using 2 idols to take out Sandra (although it was not directly in front of the jury). Sophie boldly telling her group to go to the side and make a move to give the impression that she's the ring leader. Tony is also planning a big move for the next episode. Sarah playing chicken with Jeremy. Heck, even Nick made that big speech last week about fighting to stay. If Michelle, Ben or even Jeremy think they can just stay out of the limelight and get the jury vote, that is just not happening with this group. 

I will say it was funny seeing Kim trying to read the opposing group with her idol play, with Tony looking down, Sarah closing her eyes, Sophie peeking through her fingers and Ben looking around like he has no clue what's happening. 

[CountryGirl]

Normally, I cannot roll my eyes hard enough at the loved ones visit episodes, but my Grinch's heart grew 3 sizes last night - especially with the folks on EoE. 

I loved Ethan and Rob being all concerned when they first saw the boat.

I loved all these moments, but seeing Ethan and his wife reunite, the rest of the world fading away, was beautiful to watch.

Jeremy's son, staring down Probst was amazing.

Elsewhere, I was really, really hoping that Kim would have guessed right.

Not because I love Tyson (although seeing him with his daughter brought a smile to my face) but I'm kind of over the other side, especially Sarah.

Jeremy did exactly the right thing.

And OMG ROTFLMAO at another perfect Nick out of nowhere moment:

 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, skybolt said:

I will say it was funny seeing Kim trying to read the opposing group with her idol play, with Tony looking down, Sarah closing her eyes, Sophie peeking through her fingers and Ben looking around like he has no clue what's happening.

That was awesome XD

I also enjoyed Sophie's loose hair at Tribal. After seeing it tightly wound all season, it was kind of fun to see that shock of wild hair going all over.

[LanceM]

In case anyone needs more family time, here you go.

 

https://www.cbs.com/shows/survivor/video/72E2E7AE-1892-958E-ACB1-7F11E8ACC741/survivor-winners-at-war-secret-sc-more-fun-with-loved-ones/

[skybolt]

6 minutes ago, tracyscott76 said:

That was awesome XD

I also enjoyed Sophie's loose hair at Tribal. After seeing it tightly wound all season, it was kind of fun to see that shock of wild hair going all over.

I've really enjoyed Sophie's confidence at tribal. I still like Tony and Kim, but if she does win this All Winner's season, I can totally get on board with that. Please no Michelle or Ben.

[Eolivet]

4 hours ago, HeShallBMySquishy said:

It's a blatantly cheap trick on behalf of the producers to not clue the audience in on how and why plans and targets change. I don't know why anyone thinks it makes for riveting television to watch other people whispering and plotting and scheming

Here's the thing: I don't mind the whispering if it's a truly live tribal like last night, with two distinct factions trying to guess each other's plans. And if that's the only time we saw it, I get it. But they also used it in last episode, an 8-2-1 vote. So, what were they whispering about then?

"Are you voting out Adam? Yes, I am. Are you? Okay, so we're for sure voting out Adam. Yes, but let's just whisper about it for five more minutes."

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, LanceM said:

In case anyone needs more family time, here you go.

 

https://www.cbs.com/shows/survivor/video/72E2E7AE-1892-958E-ACB1-7F11E8ACC741/survivor-winners-at-war-secret-sc-more-fun-with-loved-ones/

This almost seems like trolling XD (jk, thanks for posting it)

And yeah, not seeing any traumatizing with those kids.

Edited April 16, 2020 by tracyscott76

[blackwing]

 

6 hours ago, grandmabegum said:

This! 1000x this! The whispering at tribal is annoying already, but they've let it go for so long you can't stop it now. But to have Jeremy expose his advantage and then allow them to regroup and then allow Sarah to play her advantage is bullshit. Since they didn't vote right away they were able to huddle up, be like "it's 5 votes to 4, but if Sarah plays her advantage it's 6 votes to 3 and we can split it up and someone's going home even if they do have an idol."

I don't like the whispering, even if they actually captioned it so we could hear what was going on, because I want the players to have strategized in advance and planned for all contingencies.  Tribal council is supposed to be crazy and have unexpected things happening, and players have to adapt immediately.  I miss the days of Tony brazenly pulling out his idol and wearing it and upending the other side.  Or Keith Nale just SITTING IN HIS SEAT and cluelessly exposing his alliance by saying "stick with the plan".  I hate that they are all able to talk with each other and all decide who they want to vote for.

I would definitely institute a rule that says you are not allowed to leave your seat or whisper to the person next to you or to talk to anyone.  You can give prearranged handsignals (e.g. 1 finger for Tyson, 2 fingers for Jeremy, 3 fingers for Kim) but no talking.

10 hours ago, tvgoddess said:

Sarah's frog face is grating on mine.

 

9 hours ago, SuburbanHangSuite said:

I really Cannot. Stand. Sarah.   I hope her whiny, entitled ass gets on Tony's last nerve and he abandons that stupid Cops R Us loyalty.  Jeremy was right to want to split up she and Sophie.

There are so many players to hate this season, for me it's a tossup between Sarah and Ben for the one I hate the most.  But I think it's Sarah.  I have loathed her from her first season and pretty much despise everything about her.  Her fat puffy round face.  Her bulging, constantly startled eyes.  Her Heidi pigtails.  Above all, her whiny grating voice is like nails on a chalkboard to me.  I can't stand the way she always thinks she is in control of the game and I really wish she gets voted out ASAP.

I hope Nick and Michelle can get something going and find a way to get Sarah out of this game ASAP.

[skybolt]

It's interesting that Nick voted out his idol Tyson twice. He also voted out his crush Parvati. Maybe it's better not to be admired by Nick. 🙂

[meatball77]

I don't want secrets at tribal.  If you are changing your mind at tribal then you've lost your element of surprise and you need to discuss so everyone can hear.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, skybolt said:

It's interesting that Nick voted out his idol Tyson twice. He also voted out his crush Parvati. Maybe it's better not to be admired by Nick. 🙂

But at least he didn't VOTE OUT HIS MOM

Has anyone ever done that? I forget.

[SandyToes]

1 hour ago, Whimsy said:

I also don't roll my eyes and get annoyed at the tears.  These people are in a pressure cooker of a situation.  I've said this in past seasons, but I give them leeway at getting emotional.  To be able to let their guards down, be themselves truly and freely in front of someone that loves them and is not trying to find any way to get you out of the game is refreshing.  I would for sure be crying if I saw my loved ones in that type of situation. 

That's how I feel.  To just, for a few fleeting moments, be able to talk with and to someone that wasn't going to stab you in the back any minute.  Add in exhaustion, starvation, etc.

When Jeff mentioned the little ones digging in the sand for stuff, there were a few panicky children's faces...  The teens seemed thrilled.  The little ones not so much. I'm glad everyone got to go play and have a picnic. Even the EoEers.  It's a lot to put your life and career on hold for that length of time - as we are all seeing from the comfort of home and air conditioning.

I figured some of the babies came with nursing moms.  Harder to leave those behind.

And completely agree about the whispering.  I joined Survivor pretty late, and have gone back and watched some of the earlier versions.  Lots to love about the old game.

[dsteele]

12 hours ago, North of Eden said:

Twenty years of SURVIVOR and in my book I am declaring that to have been the worst episode ever!

You literally read my mind. Those are the exact words I used after the show ended.

[neece26]

Add me to the group that is completely over the whispering at tribal.  They have more than enough down time out there to strategize and come up with a Plan A, B and even C before they head to tribal.  The scrambling is supposed to take place before they go.  Watching them get up and run around once the tribal starts is not entertaining at all to the viewers.  

Also, way too many clever advantages (steal a vote, leave tribal with no vote) really detracts  from original game.  

 

[Guest]

I get the irritation over the family visit taking up half the show and the endless whispering, but to me, these are minor offenses compared to the Kellee/Jamal boot episode last season with all the cringy attitudes surrounding Dan's behavior, Kellee's issues with same, and Janet's attempt to do something that she thought was helpful.

Not trying to dismiss anyone's views here, just saying that to me, lousy behavior (to put it mildly) trumps all in terms of how bad an episode is. 

Edited April 16, 2020 by tracyscott76

[JudyObscure]

1 hour ago, tracyscott76 said:

And yeah, not seeing any traumatizing with those kids.

Picnics are fun for kids.   It's seeing your father or mother  on their knees, sobbing that's hard for kids to process  because "happy tears" aren't something they're very familiar with.  So they think their parents are hurt.    Look at their faces during those moments.  Of course, I know lots of adults don't really care if children go through bad experiences ..."because they're kids." 

[ProfCrash]

OK. Still bored. 

I don't begrudge the family visit. The tears and reactions don't bother me. I get it. The game is hard and seeing family/friends is a huge release and a needed temporary game break. I am fine with that. But 30 minutes? Half the freaking episode was the visit. We saw nothing that was happening at camp. We saw lots of confused kids that were massively jet lagged and needed to be earing hats to shield their eyes and protect their heads. 

I watch on the DVR. I turned it on and figured that I had missed a large part of the show somehow because it started with the reward challenge. 

The Immunity Challenge was meh. The discussions at camp were not all that enlightening. 

The only thing that came out of this was that Jeremy lost any votes he might have had with the Jury. He used his advantage to save himself but he was seen as screwing over his alliance. His decision made no real difference because Sarah used the vote steal in order to change the numbers any way.

They do need to get rid of the whispering and group meetings at tribal. Either say it so everyone can hear or keep it to yourself. 

[QTBlueMoon]

What I don't understand is how Tyson has never had a family visit before. How does a past winner NOT have a family visit? Did they not have one at all during his winning season?

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

Picnics are fun for kids.   It's seeing your father or mother  on their knees, sobbing that's hard for kids to process  because "happy tears" aren't something they're very familiar with.  So they think their parents are hurt.    Look at their faces during those moments.  Of course, I know lots of adults don't really care if children go through bad experiences ..."because they're kids." 

The statement was made that "Tony's daughter was probably traumatized for life." I'm sure it was confusing and even unsettling for the kids to see their parents crying, but I just don't agree that it did permanent damage and shouldn't have happened.

But I'm not a child psychologist, just a heartless bastard who doesn't care about children going through bad experiences.