S10.E06: Baby Number Two, But Who?

[Pasha Kitty]

Anna has the Duggars by the balls.  She knows it and they know it.   

[SMama]

Then why isn’t she using that power to get the hell out with her kids? Popping a kid every two years, and ongoing embarrassment do not seem like a good place to be.

[Churchhoney]

18 minutes ago, Pasha Kitty said:

Anna has the Duggars by the balls.  She knows it and they know it.   

Kind of, I guess. To me it seems more like they have a pact of Mutually Assured Destruction, though.....

I have a hard time seeing either side being especially happy with the other or with the situation in general. Although who knows? They're all nuts, so maybe they're happy as clams. 

[bichonblitz]

18 hours ago, DangerousMinds said:

What do you find “perfect” about her makeup? It just looks pretty basic to me.

It's natural, she applies just enough but not too much  as opposed to that black eyeliner she used to wear. 

[sATL]

when they mention Anna's pregnancy -

do they said "we're expecting" , "they're expecting" - like most of the couples do on this show... OR do they say something like "Anna's expecting " - as if she is had no help in the beforehand festivities..

[Sew Sumi]

There was no formal announcement like with the other three this season. She just showed up on this episode and mentioned that she was in the early stages of pregnancy.

Edited November 21, 2019 by Sew Sumi

[sATL]

1 hour ago, SMama said:

Then why isn’t she using that power to get the hell out with her kids? Popping a kid every two years, and ongoing embarrassment do not seem like a good place to be.

the more kids she has, she becomes more an elevated mother in her circle... dutiful wife... being with and available to her husband... birthing all of the little blessings that God brings..

I wonder if they will show her birth as she is getting back more camera time.. As many as she's had, one a good sneeze or cough will push out the blessing..

[Oldernowiser]

Anyone else keep reading this episode title as, “Baby Number Two—But Why?”

[Sew Sumi]

They didn't have birth specials for either Meredith or Mason. I doubt she gets a special for this blessing, either.

[GeeGolly]

Was there some mention of a leather shop in another thread? Michelle went on and on about changing Paco's tag to a leather daisy and Anna mentioned she had on leather earrings.

Also, do the Duggars realize their Fundy MDs and Speech Pathologist friends are educated? Like, what would they do if all Fundies followed the Duggar's lead? There wouldn't be any Fundies to call upon.

[Churchhoney]

2 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Was there some mention of a leather shop in another thread? Michelle went on and on about changing Paco's tag to a leather daisy and Anna mentioned she had on leather earrings.

Also, do the Duggars realize their Fundy MDs and Speech Pathologist friends are educated? Like, what would they do if all Fundies followed the Duggar's lead? There wouldn't be any Fundies to call upon.

Stop it! Stop it! Stop applying (shudder) logic to the situation! Don't you know that's satanic! 

Edited November 21, 2019 by Churchhoney

[lookeyloo]

23 hours ago, Chicklet said:

Henry might have a delay but he reminds me of my nephew who did the same screaming instead of talking. Turns out the turnip was lazy and not delayed in any way. Taught him sign language, he spoke in complete sentences at 4 and then we wished he'd never spoken at all.

I have said before on one of these threads that my baby brother didn't make intelligible sounds until way past age 3 and went on to get a PhD.  More recently the niece didn't say anything but a funny way of saying DADA until she was three.  The pediatrician said if she doesn't start more words by age 3 we will test.  Around then she starting talking.  She is in her third year of college.  Not that Henry will have any of those opportunities.

[xwordfanatik]

Yes, do the Duggars even think about a world where everyone was as uneducated as they are?  Who would do all those mundane, heathen jobs, that they think they're too good for?

1 hour ago, Churchhoney said:

Stop it! Stop it! Stop applying (shudder) logic to the situation! Don't you know that's satanic! 

Yep.  Now I'm talking satanic shit.  Shame on me!  

[Absolom]

First Jessa said Henry only had two words, yet right before the speech therapist showed up she was listing other words he had recently started saying.  It seemed the speech therapist had a good idea of waiting a few weeks to see how he was doing.  A friend of mine had a son like that.  Two intelligible words at 2 and normal/average speech somewhere between 2 1/4 and 2 1/2 without any intervention.  

[becca3891]

13 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

Did y'all catch the bling the speech pathologist was wearing? A triple cross necklace with YOU CAN'T MISS THEM crosses with matching cross earrings of equal size? The entire ensemble was beyond gaudy.

Any doctor they see has to be a Christian, I've noticed.

[Sew Sumi]

Well, that lady made sure you knew it. It was soooo tacky.

[queenanne]

Nothing to see here

Edited November 23, 2019 by queenanne

[Twopper]

On 11/21/2019 at 6:23 PM, lookeyloo said:

I have said before on one of these threads that my baby brother didn't make intelligible sounds until way past age 3 and went on to get a PhD.  More recently the niece didn't say anything but a funny way of saying DADA until she was three.  The pediatrician said if she doesn't start more words by age 3 we will test.  Around then she starting talking.  She is in her third year of college.  Not that Henry will have any of those opportunities.

My daughter that I mentioned earlier who invented her own sign language and didn't talk until her brother made her really mad one night at dinner also went on to get a PhD.  It appalls me that none of the Duggar children have had that opportunity.  Not that I would expect them to head for the most elite schools, but, gee, they don't even get to go to junior college or a trade school.  Maybe Jill's children will get a better education, because their dad went to college/law school.  Maybe Jeremy will send Felicity to college as well.   I have friends that home school, and their children get great educations so maybe Jill and Jinger will find better home school materials than the senior Duggars had.   My SIL was home-schooled and he has a PhD from a very good university.

I am glad Jessa and Ben  had Henry checked out since they were concerned.  I hated how the senior Duggars had a chance to get on their soapbox and talk about Josie being a micro-preemie.   If they had to say something, just say "we understand that Ben and Jessa were concerned that Henry might have hearing/speech issues, and we are pleased that they took him to experts who say that so far they see no problem."  Just hush up, senior Duggars!

[Aunt Catfish]

55 minutes ago, Twopper said:

My daughter that I mentioned earlier who invented her own sign language and didn't talk until her brother made her really mad one night at dinner also went on to get a PhD.  It appalls me that none of the Duggar children have had that opportunity.  Not that I would expect them to head for the most elite schools, but, gee, they don't even get to go to junior college or a trade school.  Maybe Jill's children will get a better education, because their dad went to college/law school.  Maybe Jeremy will send Felicity to college as well.   I have friends that home school, and their children get great educations so maybe Jill and Jinger will find better home school materials than the senior Duggars had.   My SIL was home-schooled and he has a PhD from a very good university.

I am glad Jessa and Ben  had Henry checked out since they were concerned.  I hated how the senior Duggars had a chance to get on their soapbox and talk about Josie being a micro-preemie.   If they had to say something, just say "we understand that Ben and Jessa were concerned that Henry might have hearing/speech issues, and we are pleased that they took him to experts who say that so far they see no problem."  Just hush up, senior Duggars!

Ma and Pa Kettle can never pass up an opportunity to make everything about themselves, can they?

[sATL]

5 hours ago, Twopper said:

My daughter that I mentioned earlier who invented her own sign language and didn't talk until her brother made her really mad one night at dinner also went on to get a PhD.  It appalls me that none of the Duggar children have had that opportunity.  Not that I would expect them to head for the most elite schools, but, gee, they don't even get to go to junior college or a trade school.  Maybe Jill's children will get a better education, because their dad went to college/law school.  Maybe Jeremy will send Felicity to college as well.   I have friends that home school, and their children get great educations so maybe Jill and Jinger will find better home school materials than the senior Duggars had.   My SIL was home-schooled and he has a PhD from a very good university.

I am glad Jessa and Ben  had Henry checked out since they were concerned.  I hated how the senior Duggars had a chance to get on their soapbox and talk about Josie being a micro-preemie.   If they had to say something, just say "we understand that Ben and Jessa were concerned that Henry might have hearing/speech issues, and we are pleased that they took him to experts who say that so far they see no problem."  Just hush up, senior Duggars!

ITA.

As I sit here and watch college football, where in the stands/backstory there are siblings, parents and even grandparents supporting their family member getting a higher education. Not to mention all of the other students.  I guess I didn't realize until I read above - what a blessing it is for someone to been in the corner of making education happen for a person. In many cases it is team/village but if just ONE person say - yes you can go beyond grade 12 - that might be all that is needed. 

We have what a dozen Duggars over 18 (ie GED graduates), and in all of this time NONE of them feel like even a trade school is worth the time, investment and outcome ? Don't they come across higher educated people ?  I can't even say I've met a person who is selling used cars -as their 1st career choice. I do know  a person who owns a dealership , that has a small used car section. Even the grocery store bagger is probably taking classes part time, online,etc - just trying to get ahead. 

On one of the older episodes when Derrick first appeared on the scene - JB seemed to be highly impressed that Derrick graduated from undergrad debt free. I don't remember if he quizzed Jeremy on the same. I think Bin has an accredited 2 yr degree - earned while married..

Maybe someone told JB in back 1919, when he was young, that he couldn't go to college b/c there was no family money. And it must have been a shock to his system that a married person can also attend school. And in California !

 If JB's issue was affordability - then he should have been honest (ie be a man)  with his children and said that was the reason for no college - find your own way. And its no sin to have a student loan.  Just pay it off like any other bill.

Edited November 23, 2019 by sATL

[Twopper]

I was so annoyed by the senior Duggars that I forgot to add that I really wished TLC had re-edited this episode after Joy lost her baby. 

I noticed Grandma Duggar was also in this.  There was a brief shot of her at the table during the painting lesson.  

Also I think Jana said Monday night was "family night," but I thought I recalled in an earlier episode that Friday was family night.   Who knows-- I am sure it is a moveable event.  As much as I love my family,  I cannot imagine having a family night with everyone weekly.  At least Jinger is spared this "command performance."

[Sew Sumi]

They've started Monday night family fun time about a year ago. They've posted several pictures from it, especially Anna. I've seen the Caldwells there as well as the Swansons.

[Natalie68]

On 11/20/2019 at 8:54 AM, sATL said:

Jinger and Joe might be 13 months apart but they are strangers now. Jinger is more alive , has seen and experienced new things, and Joe married and had a son- without really growing.

Usually friends like that wind up getting dropped, as life goes on. Joe mentioned it took 2 years for a visit. But I think the same would have been true if they were in the same town - unless Jeremy needed a handyman.

For the record Kendra- red snapper is sold just about everywhere.

I get them not knowing frogs legs or crickets.  But red snapper?  They don't even qualify as a rube.  A rube probably knows what that is.  They are SOOOOOO sheltered I find myself still capable of shock.  

[Churchhoney]

3 hours ago, sATL said:

Maybe someone told JB in back 1919, when he was young, that he couldn't go to college b/c there was no family money. And it must have been a shock to his system that a married person can also attend school. And in California !

 If JB's issue was affordability - then he should have been honest (ie be a man)  with his children and said that was the reason for no college - find your own way. And its no sin to have a student loan.  Just pay it off like any other bill.

JB's parents sent him to private school from at least 9th grade onward (and I think it may have been 6th or 7th grade onward.) Also, his father managed a fairly thriving commercial real-estate business that he had inherited from his father and that did some fairly prominent sales in their area. 

So it seems quite unlikely that JB's problem traces back to his parents being unable or unwilling to send him to school.

It was probably either a dislike of school and learning or insecurity about whether going to a place where everybody would have some inclination toward pursuing education might expose him to too many people who could show him up -- and he didn't want anybody to show him up.......As an adult, he exhibits both those qualities, positively flying in the face of most human tradition by clearly trying to bar his own children from showing him up, for example.

He also was very hot to get married soon after high school, so that may well have played a role also. Harder to argue that your early marriage is a great idea if you're also planning to be in school for the next several years. 

It's not just student loans that JB and M supposedly oppose, however! They oppose all loans, or at least proclaim they do.

They also grilled the perspective sons-in-law about scenarios like this: "Your car has broken down. You can't get to work without the car. But you don't have the cash to pay for a repair. Do you put that repair on a credit card?????' And the  only correct answer, according to them, was "No no no! I would never use credit. Even if it meant I lost my job!" Seriously. That was their stance. 

I'm not sure trying to find logic behind JB's feelings about education or mortgages or the like will ever yield much that makes any sense!

He is, however, a stupid, arrogant, stubborn fearful-but-claims-he's-a-strong-guy jerk. And I'm pretty sure he's been one all his life......So personally, my bet is that that's the explanation for most of his ridiculous "principles" and "decisions." 

Edited November 23, 2019 by Churchhoney

[floridamom]

Didn't Michelle say once on the show that Jim Bob was dyslexic? Perhaps this is the reason he didn't continue his education? Maybe because of this, his grades also were not good and he wanted to be done with school.

[Albanyguy]

13 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

B's parents sent him to private school from at least 9th grade onward (and I think it may have been 6th or 7th grade onward.) Also, his father managed a fairly thriving commercial real-estate business that he had inherited from his father and that did some fairly prominent sales in their area.

Jim Bob seems to be very emotionally invested in a false narrative: that his father was a failure and his parents were neglectful of their duties to him.

[Churchhoney]

14 hours ago, floridamom said:

Didn't Michelle say once on the show that Jim Bob was dyslexic? Perhaps this is the reason he didn't continue his education? Maybe because of this, his grades also were not good and he wanted to be done with school.

Could be. Nothing wrong with that at all -- unless you then do everything in your power to stop all 19 of your children (20 now, with J'Tyler involved) from even imagining they might want to continue with school!

Edited November 24, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Future Cat Lady]

I think that the Duggars parents are opposed to school because they don’t want the kids exposed to other ideas. It’s a form of control. They don’t want to loose their influence over the kids. All the boys work for Daddy. Jed may run for office, but it’s all about preserving the values his parents taught him. I don’t think he has an original thought in his head.

Some of the kids may have wanted more education at one time, but they’ve been told no or brainwashed into thinking that it’s a bad idea.

[BitterApple]

17 minutes ago, Future Cat Lady said:

I think that the Duggars parents are opposed to school because they don’t want the kids exposed to other ideas. It’s a form of control. They don’t want to loose their influence over the kids. 

I don't know if you've watched the Plaths, but they're the same way. The oldest daughter was offered a full scholarship to study music, and the mother made her turn it down. Just like Bob and Michelle, they don't want their kids to succeed or have agency over their lives because it increases their chances of fleeing the cult. 

[Churchhoney]

3 hours ago, Future Cat Lady said:

I think that the Duggars parents are opposed to school because they don’t want the kids exposed to other ideas. It’s a form of control. They don’t want to loose their influence over the kids. All the boys work for Daddy. Jed may run for office, but it’s all about preserving the values his parents taught him. I don’t think he has an original thought in his head.

Some of the kids may have wanted more education at one time, but they’ve been told no or brainwashed into thinking that it’s a bad idea.

That's it, all right. Control. 

Yet we continue to see this stuff but then spout the apparently soothing fiction, "But Jim Bob loves eez kidzzzz..."

You can't simultaneously love someone and squelch their every move toward being an individual independent person. Control freaks of this kind don't love their kids. They love owning and controlling their kids.....Or, maybe more accurately, they crave owning and controlling their kids. 

I wish we'd get over the crap cultural lie that calls it "love' when parents like the Duggs and the Rodrigui et al exhibit nothing but sick control-freak behavior day in and day out and ad infinitum. 

 In fact, they're just like abusive spouses -- control is the name of their game, too. But the parents actually have an easier time since they're able to start their control at the kids' unfortunate births, making it even more powerful. 

It's dangerous bullshit to do the polite thing and keep calling that "love," as an alarming number of people want to do. But a tidal wave of sentimentality pushes this myth that parents all love their kids if they aren't observed actively physically harming them -- and often the myth carries even then. 

That sentimentality to the contrary, though, all this "sheltering" or whatever the Duggs, Rodrigui, etc, want to call it is really just the satisfaction of ownership -- once you've got somebody under control it calms your fear of losing them or whatever. And, often, added to that is the thrill of pushing others around. 

As so often, there's a commentary in one of the many Bible verses they totally ignore. The verse in the gospel of John where it says there's no fear in love and that love casts out fear. 

Edited November 24, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Twopper]

1 hour ago, Churchhoney said:

Yet we continue to see this stuff but then spout the apparently soothing fiction, "But Jim Bob loves eez kidzzzz..."

You can't simultaneously love someone and squelch their every move toward being an individual independent person. Control freaks of this kind don't love their kids. They love owning and controlling their kids.....Or, maybe more accurately, they crave owning and controlling their kids. 

I wish we'd get over the crap cultural lie that calls it "love' when parents like the Duggs and the Rodrigui et al exhibit nothing but sick control-freak behavior day in and day out and ad infinitum. 

 In fact, they're just like abusive spouses -- control is the name of their game, too. But the parents actually have an easier time since they're able to start their control at the kids' unfortunate births, making it even more powerful. 

I agree with you.   I do think, however, that JB "loves" his children in the sense that he has warm, fuzzy feelings for them--or most of them.  I am not so sure about Mrs. JB.   The Greeks had 4 words/classifications of love.  Storge is the natural affection between parents and children, which I think he has,  but love is both verb and noun in English.  A selfless love for one's children has to go beyond the warm fuzzies  to seeking the best for each individual child.  Out of any 19 children, there are going to be a range of differences, and there would likely be some who wanted some sort of further education.  The story that the Plaths had a daughter who was offered a full scholarship which they declined makes me want to cry.  Just from the commercials for the show, I already dislike the mother.   I would like to think that JB would hear the word "free" and perhaps let a daughter leave the nest to accept a full scholarship, but I doubt he would unless he could send a brother to stand guard over her.   I do hope they lessen their controls for the younger group of children which may happen anyway as the younger group spends time with their married siblings.  I am actually hopeful that Jinger/Jeremy and Jill/Derrick will be significantly better parents than the senior Duggars.

[Churchhoney]

18 minutes ago, Twopper said:

I agree with you.   I do think, however, that JB "loves" his children in the sense that he has warm, fuzzy feelings for them--or most of them.  I am not so sure about Mrs. JB.   The Greeks had 4 words/classifications of love.  Storge is the natural affection between parents and children, which I think he has,  but love is both verb and noun in English.  A selfless love for one's children has to go beyond the warm fuzzies  to seeking the best for each individual child.  Out of any 19 children, there are going to be a range of differences, and there would likely be some who wanted some sort of further education.  The story that the Plaths had a daughter who was offered a full scholarship which they declined makes me want to cry.  Just from the commercials for the show, I already dislike the mother.   I would like to think that JB would hear the word "free" and perhaps let a daughter leave the nest to accept a full scholarship, but I doubt he would unless he could send a brother to stand guard over her.   I do hope they lessen their controls for the younger group of children which may happen anyway as the younger group spends time with their married siblings.  I am actually hopeful that Jinger/Jeremy and Jill/Derrick will be significantly better parents than the senior Duggars.

Totally agree. 

My issue is with the fact that because we don't have those classifications of love, our culture persists in speaking of those warm, fuzzy, biological feelings toward JB's (and others') grownup gametes as if that's a love that matters, a love that's not just a product of our anatomy --

And because it's repeatedly spoken of in that way, it seems pretty clear to me that in the minds of many it becomes, conceptually, a love that somehow proves something positive about his attitude and behavior toward his children, as if it's essentially the same as or equivalent to a selfless or generous love.

I share your hope about Jin/Jer and Jill/Der. Coming from a somewhat different background will help. 

[mynextmistake]

On 11/24/2019 at 5:04 AM, BitterApple said:

I don't know if you've watched the Plaths, but they're the same way. The oldest daughter was offered a full scholarship to study music, and the mother made her turn it down. Just like Bob and Michelle, they don't want their kids to succeed or have agency over their lives because it increases their chances of fleeing the cult. 

Erin Bates was also reportedly offered a full scholarship to study music at one of the Tennessee state universities, and Gil told her she couldn’t go.

[becca3891]

2 hours ago, mynextmistake said:

Erin Bates was also reportedly offered a full scholarship to study music at one of the Tennessee state universities, and Gil told her she couldn’t go.

That saddens and disappoints me. People here seem inclined to view the Bateses more favorably than the Duggars, and I do like Gil and Kelly Jo more as people than Jim Bob and Michelle. But if this is true, it's a good reminder that ultimately, they're cut from the same cloth and share the same belief system. 

[lookeyloo]

23 minutes ago, becca3891 said:

That saddens and disappoints me. People here seem inclined to view the Bateses more favorably than the Duggars, and I do like Gil and Kelly Jo more as people than Jim Bob and Michelle. But if this is true, it's a good reminder that ultimately, they're cut from the same cloth and share the same belief system. 

All the Bates are is a more attractive version of the Duggars. IMHO!

[seasons]

Words can't describe how angry i am to see those two parents back on the show. Anna too. Tlc figures enough time has gone by that we will take them back in small doses. Soon josh will be back. Just wait and see.

[Fosca]

Luckily, they've come back just in time for another scandal to hit.  Hopefully whatever this is will drive them off the air once and for all.

[sATL]

1 hour ago, Fosca said:

Luckily, they've come back just in time for another scandal to hit.  Hopefully whatever this is will drive them off the air once and for all.

what scandal ?  PM me if it is a spoiler...

[Sew Sumi]

The scandal from last week about Homeland Security raiding Smuggar's car lot. 

[MsJamieDornan]

6 hours ago, seasons said:

Words can't describe how angry i am to see those two parents back on the show

Disgusting.

[sATL]

2 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

The scandal from last week about Homeland Security raiding Smuggar's car lot. 

ok thanks.. let me google.. my mind has been on the the holiday and haven't been keeping up with any news...

THE US homeland security on a sam-I-am dime a dozen used car lot in Ark? God that has to be juicy...🤣  🍿🍵

Edited November 26, 2019 by sATL

[becca3891]

15 hours ago, Fosca said:

Luckily, they've come back just in time for another scandal to hit.  Hopefully whatever this is will drive them off the air once and for all.

I doubt it. It's probably to do with taxes or land zoning, but that's not nearly as bad as sexual abuse in my opinion, which didn't stop them from continuing the show under a new name.

[MonicaM]

Ironically, something like federal tax charges might do them in just as it did Al Capone.  Obviously something like tax evasion doesn't compare to sexually abusing young children, but actual criminal charges might finally turn the tide against them.

[the-grey-lady]

Jana: Family FUN night blah blah littles painting blah blah so important to spend time together blah...

Me: Aren't you nearly thirty?

[Soaper410]

On 11/27/2019 at 12:45 PM, MonicaM said:

Ironically, something like federal tax charges might do them in just as it did Al Capone.  Obviously something like tax evasion doesn't compare to sexually abusing young children, but actual criminal charges might finally turn the tide against them.

My assumption is they all own 4-5 "businesses" which allow them to take advantage of tax loop holes and credits.  Add in a kitten caboodle of children...and you make money from taxes. 

Between their religious exemptions for claiming the house, etc.  & the businesses, they probably didn't pay in a ton to begin with.  Their vehicles could all be claimed for a business or agriculture. Then add 17-18 dependents (depending on the year) and you have got a LOT of money coming back.  

I wouldn't be surprised if they do get caught this way but with some legal creative thinking, they may need to break the law to get all their money back ++++++

10 minutes ago, Soaper410 said:

 

 

Edited January 18, 2020 by Soaper410

[awaken]

7 minutes ago, Soaper410 said:

My assumption is they all own 4-5 "businesses" which allow them to take advantage of tax loop holes and credits.  Add in a kitten caboodle of children...and you make money from taxes. 

A kitten caboodle!  😂 I’m saying that from now on!  

[Aunt Catfish]

6 hours ago, awaken said:

A kitten caboodle!  😂 I’m saying that from now on!  

The idiom actually is "kit and caboodle".  I found an excellent explanation of the saying on Grammarist.  It is an oldie but goodie!

[Jynnan tonnix]

On 1/18/2020 at 5:12 AM, Aunt Catfish said:

The idiom actually is "kit and caboodle".  I found an excellent explanation of the saying on Grammarist.  It is an oldie but goodie!

But kitten caboodle would sound exactly the same if you said it, and would make for amusing mental images with no-one being the wiser 🙂