S04.E03: Unhinged

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Awww, I loved the scenes with the siblings. I appreciate that we get to see different aspects of their relationships with each other. Sometimes you fight, sometimes you snipe at each other, sometimes you drop everything to help each other, and sometimes you admit something out of the blue like kissing a boy.

I also liked Deja going to Tess to talk about her boy drama. I'm glad that Deja now feels comfortable enough to go into her room specifically to discuss something like that. It's taken a while for her to get to that point so I like seeing their relationship evolving. Ha, STEP MOM!

Yay for Tim's return to tv! I'm glad he's doing well enough to take on a recurring role. I'm looking forward to his daily walks with Kate. I was also glad to see that he has realistic goals. It's okay not to run ten miles every morning (RANDALL). He has set small attainable goals and he's reaching them. Baby steps, man.

Edited October 9, 2019 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Blakeston]

6 hours ago, bybrandy said:

I think Randall was less shocked about the dress code violation as it being given by the young, hip black teacher who Randall thought would be his ally in the school.

I just don't buy Randall taking the risk in the first place. This is someone who clearly someone who hasn't gotten into this kind of trouble before. At a school where everyone's had to wear the exact same thing for years, he's going to parade around openly all day wearing something different, and not even be nervous?

It would have made a lot more sense if it had happened on his first day as a student, like the teacher was wondering. Or if he'd put the shoes on quickly in between classes to show them off to some friends, when he didn't think any teachers would see.

Edited October 9, 2019 by Blakeston

[peace355]

16 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

I just don't buy Randall taking the risk in the first place. This is someone who clearly someone who hasn't gotten into this kind of trouble before. At a school where everyone's had to wear the exact same thing for years, he's going to parade around openly all day wearing something different, and not even be nervous?

It would have made a lot more sense if it had happened on his first day as a student, like the teacher was wondering. Or if he'd put the shoes on quickly in between classes to show them off to some friends, when he didn't think any teachers would see.

I think it fits, particularly with last episode. It wasn't Randall going out of his way to break the rules or to be an individual, I think he did it specifically to impress the new teacher (who he had clearly researched!). He is in a very white school and I saw it as again him trying to fit in with his black identity and thought he and new teacher could bond over it.  Randall doesn't care about air jordans but he thought his teacher would (didn't he say something about the teacher supporting Basketball team)/

Edited October 9, 2019 by peace355

[Haleth]

What a lovely episode.  It was awesome to see scenes with the kids of both generations together rather than interacting with their parents.  Great to see Kevin not being an ass to Randall for once.  Loved that Deja and Tess had a sisterly bonding moment.  

Wow.  Kate's crabby neighbor.  Good reminder to not judge.  Loved that she decided to start walking with him.  His gang comment made me laugh out loud.  I hope Kate finally got around to telling Toby to not block the sidewalk.

8 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

Timothy Omundson! I am so glad to see him return and in good health!

So the actor really did have a stroke?  (I see yes, he did.)

I don't think I can love Miguel any more than I do.  It was a dumb gesture to threaten to quit, but something a true friend would do.

Kevin is wonderful with Nicky.  I'm not a huge Jennifer Morrison fan but her reactions were great, first her anger at a grown man playing with her kid, then her giggling uncontrollably at Kevin's overwrought Pearson monologue.  (It'a about time someone had that reaction!)

I'm just not interested in Randall's political storyline.  It feels like he's in a completely different show, one that I probably wouldn't watch.

[Blackie]

5 hours ago, chocolatine said:

When Kevin was going on and on about turning down movies and "jowl city", I was wondering if it's acceptable to mock someone in an AA meeting.

I was surprised they actually called it an AA meeting.  Usually in shows they only say "meeting" so I wondered if there was a reason they couldn't call them AA.  From what I know of AA (very close friend goes), meetings aren't like that. I have been to open meetings and there is a speaker that tells their story but it isn't a big sharing circle thing.  According to my friend, in closed meetings they read through the 12 steps and then focus on one of the steps but it isn't a "lets all sit down and share", there is more of a format to the meeting. I always thought that is why they never called them AA meetings on shows.

[shoovenbooty]

For me, there is still a huge disconnect between sweet, brainy Kid Randall and smug, arrogant (at least, that's how he comes off to me) Adult Randall. Kid Kate and Kid Kevin seem a lot more like their adult counterparts, but I don't consider Kid Randall, or Teen Randall, to be the same person as Adult Randall.

[ShadowFacts]

1 hour ago, peace355 said:

I think it fits, particularly with last episode. It wasn't Randall going out of his way to break the rules or to be an individual, I think he did it specifically to impress the new teacher (who he had clearly researched!). He is in a very white school and I saw it as again him trying to fit in with his black identity and thought he and new teacher could bond over it.  Randall doesn't care about air jordans but he thought his teacher would (didn't he say something about the teacher supporting Basketball team)/

Yes, I agree that's why he did it.  He knew the teacher was from Chicago and therefore thought showing him he was also a Bulls fan would be a great way to make an impression.  A little bit of magical thinking because at best it would have been a conversation starter, but he is desperate to make connections after being called an oreo. 

[Johnny Dollar]

Seeing Timothy reminded me of how much I miss Galavant. And Pushing Daisies, and Trial and Error and other shows where you just might have to think a little bit to get the joke. 

[JudyObscure]

34 minutes ago, Haleth said:

Wow.  Kate's crabby neighbor.  Good reminder to not judge.  Loved that she decided to start walking with him.  His gang comment made me laugh out loud.  I hope Kate finally got around to telling Toby to not block the sidewalk.

My big laugh moment was when he turned away from Kate and said, "This is me storming off," as he inched down the sidewalk.  I love him already and had no idea the actor had a stroke in real life.  The show gets big props for hiring him and the grown up Jack. 

I hope the AA group bursts out laughing the next time Cassidy complains about something because, unlike most American people, she and her child have completely free medical coverage and housing, plus other allowances.  Kevin's worries are as valid as anyone elses when it comes to being able to keep his job, in fact his job is far less secure and stable and I'm sure he doesn't have a pension plan like hers.

[Jillybean]

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I just don't buy Randall taking the risk in the first place. This is someone who clearly someone who hasn't gotten into this kind of trouble before. At a school where everyone's had to wear the exact same thing for years, he's going to parade around openly all day wearing something different, and not even be nervous?

It would have made a lot more sense if it had happened on his first day as a student, like the teacher was wondering. Or if he'd put the shoes on quickly in between classes to show them off to some friends, when he didn't think any teachers would see.

I agree. Kid Randall is a rule follower, and it was way out of character for him to violate dress code with his Air Jordans. 

[MissLucas]

This was a great episode. I loved every single plot line which is rare. So this was Randall's first panic attack. I wonder if the show will follow up on how they progress. Someone above mentioned that teenage Kevin ignored Randall in panic in another episode. That made me wonder if Randall kept the attacks from his parents and relied on Kevin when they got really bad. Judging from how Kevin read the signs back in season one when adult Randall freaked out I'd say that was probably the case for a while. If so, it wouldn't surprised me to see teenage Kevin one day just refusing to be the panic crutch. Still a jerk move but it can be an awful burden especially at that age. Did Randall ever get therapy for his anxiety? I can't remember.

I also think Randall violating the dress code ties in with what went down last episode at the pool. 

Crabby stroke neighbor was fantastic: 'If he does again tomorrow, I'm keying his car. This hand still works fine. This is me storming away! Don't blink, you'll miss it.'

The toughest gang in the neighborhood walk was a peak TIU moment (of the good kind):

[bettername2come]

Kid Kevin’s little “no, really, are you okay?” moment got me. That was the first time we’ve seen them act like brothers over something serious. Like, we’ve seen them play together and fight like brothers, but this is the first time he’s had his back. Kate was a nice little addition to that scene. I want to see more of the littler Big Three bonding. Sneaking out, lying to mom and dad, that kind of thing.

So happy to see Tim Omundson. I like that they got someone really recovering from a stroke, but I hope he’s doing better than was seen here in the upcoming Psych movie.

Kate’s dress at dinner was gorgeous. Toby was being a good husband. Love the little kiss he gave her after they sorted out the booth. Seriously though, he has to have gotten more buff than just losing the fat suit. I need to go watch the first ep of Stranger Things to check.

Assertive Kevin was good. I do like that the people laughing were people who’d met Kevin before. I look forward to all three of them bonding in the future. In a more appropriate way of course.

[SunnyBeBe]

Another uncharacteristic thing that they had Randall do was go along with Kevin signing the demerit slip. That must be against school policy and I bet you could get in trouble for that. Hard to believe that a stickler like Randall would have taken that kind of chance.  He might have been suspended if discovered.  And, wouldn't your parent have signed it when you took it home that night, not the same day while you're at school.  Odd.  I get their point though.

I was impressed at the way Toby made it seem that his clients were impressed with Kate and she helped him seal the deal.  Perhaps, they chatted and got to know Kate and did not focus on her obesity.  Her mood seems to have improved from past seasons. 

Randall used to be my favorite, but, I wouldn't mind if they skipped over his storyline.  He and his family aren't that interesting to me. 

[Ohiopirate02]

1 hour ago, shoovenbooty said:

For me, there is still a huge disconnect between sweet, brainy Kid Randall and smug, arrogant (at least, that's how he comes off to me) Adult Randall. Kid Kate and Kid Kevin seem a lot more like their adult counterparts, but I don't consider Kid Randall, or Teen Randall, to be the same person as Adult Randall.

I have no difficulty seeing Adult Randall in Kid Randall.  I think the writers have done a good job showing Randall's need to control everything as a child and his subtle and sometimes not so subtle manipulations of Rebecca.  I know that Randall does have real issues stemming from his adoption which are extremely valid and do need to be addressed, but I have always seen the Pearson house as being run by Randall.  Randall grew up being used to getting his way with Rebecca and that carried over into his adult life.  

[gonzosgirrl]

For me, Tim O is "Cain" (I know at least a couple people here will get that 🙂 ) and I loved him in this episode for so many reasons. "This is me, storming off" was my favourite part.

I felt so supremely bad for Kate at the restaurant. Regardless of the whys, being in a position like that is horrible. Someone upthread mentioned it being odd/wrong that she was at this business meeting, but Toby specifically said at the beginning of the episode that the clients asked to meet his wife. No idea why, considering the business matter, but it was there.

I'm glad her snit didn't last long and wasn't as completely self-centered as she often is. I hope that stays the case.

Don't care even a little bit about Randall's politics. I hope they find a way to keep me engaged in their story while living so far away from the rest of the family. I mean, it's normal for families to live in different cities and states, even countries, but it is challenging to write for, I'm sure.

[Ohiopirate02]

One thing that bothered me in this episode and last weeks as well, where are Kid Randall's glasses?  I am assuming that the events in these last two episodes happened after their cabin vacation where we know Kid Randall had them.  Why is Randall not wearing his glasses at school?  

[Lady Calypso]

6 hours ago, NUguy514 said:

Having said that, while his kvetching in his AA share was annoyingly lacking in self-awareness in that very particularly obnoxious Pearson way, it is pretty verboten to laugh at/mock, essentially, someone's share openly while that person is sharing in most 12-step meetings.  I mean, just because Kevin's problems seem privileged and specious to you, Cassidy, that doesn't mean they're not real for him and deserve your open derision.  What a dickhead.  And I don't buy that Kevin, or anyone, would find her anything other than cruel after that.  Thanks for making me hate your desired coupling right from the get-go, show.

Honestly, I was really hoping that Kevin wouldn't have laughed along with that, at least in the moment, and that it would simply only bond Cassidy and Nicky together (again, way more into the idea of those two being connected than Cassidy/Kevin).

8 hours ago, chocolatine said:

I know Kate has a lot going on, but when her neighbor first confronted her about the car on the sidewalk, he had his cane, so it wasn't hard to figure out why he was upset. To me it was another example of Kate being all about herself and her problems.

Honestly, I didn't really understand why Cranky Neighbour was so cranky in that first scene (I mean, I knew it was probably going to be stroke-related to reflect what Timothy Omundson has gone through), but even so, he needed to use his words to explain, which he didn't do initially. As we saw from Kate, she would have been entirely understanding and gotten Toby to move his car ASAP if he had been nicer about it. You don't need to be a cranky asshole and snap at your new neighbour upon your first meeting. She can't read your mind or know exactly what the issue is. She doesn't know you take walks every day and need the sidewalk to be cleared. 

Which is why I was fine with Kate's initial reaction. If I was introducing myself to my new neighbour, who I never met before, and he responded with insults and threats, I probably would react similarly. Plus, Kate's reaction was more tame than I thought. She was annoyed, but I think it helped that she had baby Jack with her so that she could play it off as something silly with him. 

[Guest]

I liked this episode; the show has gone way downhill for me fast but this week was at least entertaining.

I thought Randall was good to try to make it work with Bernice, because he's right. He does need someone with more experience. And she had some good points. But you can't be outright insubordinate to a boss like she was, so he needed to fire her.

I liked Kate's neighbor story.  

The Nicky stuff is okay, but I find I only care about the Nicky storyline as it relates to Kevin, not really to Nicky.

[ShadowFacts]

57 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

I do wonder where Randall's panic attacks are coming from.   Is it hereditary?   Is there something going on in the Pearson household?  Is it both?

If there is something going on in the Pearson household, why doesn't anxiety affect Kate and Kevin as much as it does Randall?

He's a black kid adopted into a white family.  In past seasons/episodes he has been shown to be trying all the time to fit in, excel at everything, not make mistakes.  That's a big burden for a kid, one that Kate and Kevin don't have to carry.

1 hour ago, MissLucas said:

This was a great episode. I loved every single plot line which is rare. So this was Randall's first panic attack. I wonder if the show will follow up on how they progress. Someone above mentioned that teenage Kevin ignored Randall in panic in another episode. That made me wonder if Randall kept the attacks from his parents and relied on Kevin when they got really bad. Judging from how Kevin read the signs back in season one when adult Randall freaked out I'd say that was probably the case for a while. If so, it wouldn't surprised me to see teenage Kevin one day just refusing to be the panic crutch. Still a jerk move but it can be an awful burden especially at that age. Did Randall ever get therapy for his anxiety? I can't remember.

The parents became aware of the panic situation because we saw Jack at one time take Randall's little face in his hands and try to calm him, and they both kind of dropped everything later when Randall was freaking out about something as a teen, thus enabling Kevin's teen sexcapades to kind of fade into the background.  We did see adult Randall visit a psychiatrist or other practitioner and talk about his progress after his breakdown when Kevin bailed on his play to come help him. 

[PRgal]

This episode reminded me of how 90s workout videos were so lame to me - even then.  No wonder I hated working out as a teen.  But I'm sure younger Gen Z kids think spin or barre is dumb.  

[MissLucas]

28 minutes ago, PRgal said:

This episode reminded me of how 90s workout videos were so lame to me - even then.  No wonder I hated working out as a teen.  But I'm sure younger Gen Z kids think spin or barre is dumb.  

Don't forget Zumba 😁

[Empress1]

21 minutes ago, ShadowFacts said:

He's a black kid adopted into a white family.  In past seasons/episodes he has been shown to be trying all the time to fit in, excel at everything, not make mistakes.  That's a big burden for a kid, one that Kate and Kevin don't have to carry.

He also knows that his brother resents him; we know Kevin is really mean to Randall in their teen years and Kevin straight up TOLD Randall as adults that he resented Randall's presence in the family because if Randall weren't there, Kevin would have been the star. I thought it was really poignant last episode when Randall said that Kevin had embarrassed him in front of his friends AND he'd enjoyed doing it. That's a hard thing to know about your brother.

Jae Won is a better employee than I am. I wish my boss WOULD ask me to go on what is at least an 8-mile run before work. How early does Randall get up?! And I'm into fitness! I was in the gym this morning! But 8 miles before work is a hell no from me. (I thought it was adorable that Jae Won was talking about a marriage proposal.)

I would not want my teenage daughter (and isn't Deja a young teen, like 14? She's starting high school, right?) dating a boy with a baby, especially someone like Deja who has already had to shoulder too much responsibility at too young an age, so I'm curious to see how Beth and Randall handle it if it comes to that.

I was frankly pretty horrified at the laughing in the AA meeting. Aren't those supposed to be safe spaces? Yes, Kevin has rich white guy problems, but he struggles with the same addiction the rest of them do. He's not less of an addict because he's an actor. He's as powerless over alcohol and drugs as the rest of them.

I thought it was adorable when Cassidy's son asked Kevin if he wanted to play a video game and Kevin was like "I'll crush Mario Kart, let's go!" I don't always like Kevin but I like how he is with kids. He responds to them kind of how I do - I talk to them like they're real people, which they are. Always age-appropriate but never condescending.

I think Beth's studio had "Clark" in the name, which made me wonder if it was near Clark Park in West Philly.

[ShadowFacts]

6 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

I was frankly pretty horrified at the laughing in the AA meeting. Aren't those supposed to be safe spaces? Yes, Kevin has rich white guy problems, but he struggles with the same addiction the rest of them do. He's not less of an addict because he's an actor. He's as powerless over alcohol and drugs as the rest of them.

It was inappropriate, and the leader called them out, but it kind of reminded me of a situation like that of Mary Tyler Moore at Chuckles the Clown's funeral (dating myself a lot), where you just cannot stifle the laughter.  I don't think they were demeaning everything he said, just that one thing about the AARP commercial triggered the laughs.

8 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

I think Beth's studio had "Clark" in the name, which made me wonder if it was near Clark Park in West Philly.

It might be, but I think that's her maiden name. 

[Pallas]

Not Randall's first anxiety attack. The one he had three years ago --about being too smart to fit in at school -- is what prompted Jack to calm him with his hands on either side of his face, and, work longer hours in order to pay for tuition at the private school.

It's really moving to see these same child actors continue to mature with their characters, as they portray them at different ages of their childhoods. 

[Aloeonatable]

Question: Did it seem to anyone else that Jack, forgetting to get the water line inspected before the foundation was installed, out of character? Kind of a lazy excuse for the writers to show how great the Jack/Miguel friendship is. 

[gonzosgirrl]

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

I thought it was adorable when Cassidy's son asked Kevin if he wanted to play a video game and Kevin was like "I'll crush Mario Kart, let's go!" I don't always like Kevin but I like how he is with kids. He responds to them kind of how I do - I talk to them like they're real people, which they are. Always age-appropriate but never condescending.

I thought her reaction to them playing the game together was way OTT. It's not like he was luring him away in a parking lot. They were both sitting in a waiting room together and she was treating him like a pedophile.

[ams1001]

4 hours ago, Haleth said:

Wow.  Kate's crabby neighbor.  Good reminder to not judge.  Loved that she decided to start walking with him.  His gang comment made me laugh out loud.  I hope Kate finally got around to telling Toby to not block the sidewalk.

 

I assumed the car parked on the street behind the neighbor was Toby's, so yes, apparently.

24 minutes ago, Pallas said:

Not Randall's first anxiety attack. The one he had three years ago --about being too smart to fit in at school -- is what prompted Jack to calm him with his hands on either side of his face, and, work longer hours in order to pay for tuition at the private school.

I wasn't sure...with all the time jumps I couldn't remember what age he actually was during that scene with Jack. But the way he was talking about how his heart felt sounded like that particular feeling was unfamiliar to him. (I always feel like my throat is closing up, personally. I was at least older than Randall (23) when I started having them. I think I was a little better able to intellectualize things in the moment and get a grip on it, at least once I figured out what was happening after the first few times. 20+ years later now a full-blown attack is pretty rare, because I've (mostly) figured out how to head it off when I feel it coming.)

Just now, gonzosgirrl said:

I thought her reaction to them playing the game together was way OTT. It's not like he was luring him away in a parking lot. They were both sitting in a waiting room together and she was treating him like a pedophile.

That bugged me, too. If you don't want your kid talking to strange adults, don't leave him alone in a waiting room at the VA.

[Ohiopirate02]

4 minutes ago, Aloeonatable said:

Question: Did it seem to anyone else that Jack, forgetting to get the water line inspected before the foundation was installed, out of character? Kind of a lazy excuse for the writers to show how great the Jack/Miguel friendship is. 

I actually found it to be realistic.  Again I am assuming here, but I think these events are happening in the same year as Jack completely cutting Nicky off.  I can see Jack having some difficulty being the perfect husband/father/employee all of the time while not taking a drink.  He cant't be all things to all people while he is trying to box his feelings away instead of actually dealing with them.  He didn't seem 100% that morning when he went into work, so I am not surprised that it was revealed that he made a huge mistake at work.  I think it is realistic to see Jack not be Superman every day in every area of his life.

[Cheyanne11]

6 hours ago, peace355 said:

As for Kate I thought she handled Toby's news a lot better than she would have in earlier seasons, she was just a bit thrown and had to take some time to herself, nothing wrong with that. I like the friendship she is developing with neighbour too.

Yeah, at first I was rolling my eyes at her reaction to Toby's reasoning for working out, re he had a heart attack at 38 and wanted to get healthy to be around for his kid, but she regrouped pretty quickly.

I hope we see more of the neighbor.  He seems like he'll be a good sounding board for her.

[ShadowFacts]

5 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I actually found it to be realistic.  Again I am assuming here, but I think these events are happening in the same year as Jack completely cutting Nicky off.  I can see Jack having some difficulty being the perfect husband/father/employee all of the time while not taking a drink.  He cant't be all things to all people while he is trying to box his feelings away instead of actually dealing with them.  He didn't seem 100% that morning when he went into work, so I am not surprised that it was revealed that he made a huge mistake at work.  I think it is realistic to see Jack not be Superman every day in every area of his life.

Agree, and he also could be drinking. 

[Empress1]

1 hour ago, gonzosgirrl said:

I thought her reaction to them playing the game together was way OTT. It's not like he was luring him away in a parking lot. They were both sitting in a waiting room together and she was treating him like a pedophile.

Totally agree. They were out in the open, there were other people around, and they were playing a video game. Kevin wasn't doing anything wrong.

I know we're supposed to like Cassidy (I'm sure she's going to be Kevin's new love interest; it's kind of like the Law & Order trope of "the most famous person did it") and I do feel sorry for her, but I also just don't like her.

1 hour ago, ams1001 said:

That bugged me, too. If you don't want your kid talking to strange adults, don't leave him alone in a waiting room at the VA.

This! She leaves him alone in a waiting room, she runs the risk of him talking to people - he was probably bored out of his mind.

Edited October 9, 2019 by Empress1

[Packerbrewerbadger]

Every restaurant I’ve ever been in asks up front if we want a booth or table....not so in LA?...

i think Randall’s aide has a huge crush on him and I’m guessing might make a sexual move.

[scatteroflight]

Kate makes me crazy, honestly. I hate that everyone tiptoes around her weight to their own detriment. Toby should be proud of what he's accomplished in getting healthier, especially in light of his heart attack, and Kate should be supportive of his efforts. But as usual, it's turned around to be all "oh, poor Kate, she's burdened by so much, and she has such a difficult time with her weight issues and let's not celebrate our own achievements because it might make her feel bad." I'm so glad that her new neighbour got her to pull her head out of her own butt for just a moment. Maybe one day she'll realize that other people have problems, too. 

Edited October 9, 2019 by scatteroflight

[tennisgurl]

24 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

Totally agree. They were out in the open, there were other people around, and they were playing a video game. Kevin wasn't doing anything wrong.

Yeah I found that off-putting and an overreaction as well, and considering she is clearly being set up as Kevin's new love interest, its not a great first impression for the audience. Its not like Kevin was being inappropriate or trying to lure him into a dark ally, he was just talking to the kid who was clearly bored out of his mind while his mom left him in a waiting room for his whole appointment. How dare he be nice to some kid when they're both in a waiting room, what a creep?! I like Jennifer Morrison and I think she is doing fine in the role, but I dont like Cassidy very much. I feel bad for her, but I dont really enjoy her on the show, and I dont really see her and Kevin working very well together. 

Its a bit of a pet peeve of mine, that men just cant like kids or want to be around kids because it MUST be weird or possibly pervy, and not just because some people like kids and be good with them (as Kevin is) and happen to be men. Because only women can be good with kids, thats what they do, obviously! Which...is actually kind of ironic as it sounds like that was the whole joke of The Manny, right? That Kevin was playing a male nanny who sucks at working with kids and that was the joke? Even though Kevin himself really does like kids, and is really good with them, and its not treated as weird or a joke.

[Empress1]

I forgot to say (I had it in my first post but it got eaten) that I thought Deja looked beautiful this whole episode. I love her hair that way (mine is in two flat twists right now!), she had on cute makeup, and she was smiling! I loved her laughing with Tess. "Stepmom!" "OH LORD" and they both fell out. That was lovely.

5 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

Its a bit of a pet peeve of mine, that men just cant like kids or want to be around kids because it MUST be weird or possibly pervy, and not just because some people like kids and be good with them (as Kevin is) and happen to be men

Huge pet peeve of mine too, as is the reverse - when it's portrayed that men don't actually like spending time with their kids, and that's supposed to be ... I don't know, cute? Normal?

Edited October 9, 2019 by Empress1

[Pallas]

14 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

Also, I don't think I've been attracted to Kevin more than when he demanded Nicky come with him to the meeting.

"Get UP. let's go."

More Assertive Kevin, please.

Kevin's tone with moody Nicky seemed to be, unconsciously, drawn from Jack's tone with moody young Kevin. A family-manly assertiveness which Nicky recalled, on some level, and responded to. 

[bybrandy]

13 minutes ago, scatteroflight said:

. Toby should be proud of what he's accomplished in getting healthier, especially in light of his heart attack, and Kate should be supportive of his efforts. But as usual, it's turned around to be all "oh, poor Kate,

But it was Toby's decision to tiptoe around Kate.  Kate didn't make that choice.  And when Toby finally leveled with her after she caught him lying to her she was fine with it.  Yes, she asked for an explanation with what was going on with him, he'd been lying to her.  And honestly I think it is hurtful for her struggles when he's pretending that the weight is just flying off because he's stressed when instead he's working INCREDIBLY hard to get it off.  When he finally came clean she dealt with it.  But I think it was the tiptoeing around her and lying more than the weightloss.
 

40 minutes ago, Packerbrewerbadger said:

Every restaurant I’ve ever been in asks up front if we want a booth or table....not so in LA?...

i think Randall’s aide has a huge crush on him and I’m guessing might make a sexual move.

My dad was a big guy and incredibly claustrophobic.  Whenever we we went to a restaurant he'd just flat out say the number of people in hi party and "table rather than a booth."   But I have to say I have been in plenty of restaurants where I have been seated at a booth without being asked if I had a preference.    

Which aide?   Jae-Won?  I hope not for his soon to be fiance's sake.   

19 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

Huge pet peeve of mine too, as is the reverse - when it's portrayed that men don't actually like spending time with their kids, and that's supposed to be ... I don't know, cute? Normal?

See also men who get nearly canonized for being active in their children's lives.  It is their JOB!  It isn't heroism.

[bichonblitz]

Are the "kids" supposed to be 15? The kid that plays Kevin seems younger than Randall. His voice hasn't dropped yet and he still looks younger and smaller than Randall and Kate. Unpopular opinion but I don't think it's very good casting. 

[Ohiopirate02]

1 minute ago, bichonblitz said:

Are the "kids" supposed to be 15? The kid that plays Kevin seems younger than Randall. His voice hasn't dropped yet and he still looks younger and smaller than Randall and Kate. Unpopular opinion but I don't think it's very good casting. 

The kids are supposed to be 12.  

[Lady Calypso]

6 minutes ago, bichonblitz said:

Are the "kids" supposed to be 15? The kid that plays Kevin seems younger than Randall. His voice hasn't dropped yet and he still looks younger and smaller than Randall and Kate. Unpopular opinion but I don't think it's very good casting. 

They should be about 12 (seventh grade, I think that's what Rebecca or Jack said last episode). All of them are born in 2007, so they're all roughly the same age. I think Parker (Kid Kevin) is the oldest of the three, though.

[ShadowFacts]

1 hour ago, Packerbrewerbadger said:

Every restaurant I’ve ever been in asks up front if we want a booth or table....not so in LA?...

Even if it's not the custom there, Toby should be very used to always asking for a table proactively, because Kate and not long ago, himself, can't fit in booths.  He could have prevented that embarrassment.

3 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

They should be about 12 (seventh grade, I think that's what Rebecca or Jack said last episode). All of them are born in 2007, so they're all roughly the same age. I think Parker (Kid Kevin) is the oldest of the three, though.

When they were originally cast, there was no way of knowing how fast any of them would grow.  Anyway, Kevin and Randall aren't related genetically and wouldn't be expected to grow at the same rate even if they were.  Kate is shooting up but girls often do at that age. 

[Packerbrewerbadger]

21 minutes ago, bybrandy said:

Which aide?   Jae-Won?  I hope not for his soon to be fiance's sake. 

I missed/forgot Jae-Won had a girl friend ( not a fan of Randall’s political arc) but if I were her, I wouldn’t be putting any money down on a wedding dress! He is school girl giddy around Randall. 

[qtpye]

3 hours ago, PRgal said:

This episode reminded me of how 90s workout videos were so lame to me - even then.  No wonder I hated working out as a teen.  But I'm sure younger Gen Z kids think spin or barre is dumb.  

3 hours ago, MissLucas said:

Don't forget Zumba 😁

That purple leotard looked so bad on Rebecca. I guess I'm weird because when I'm at home, I just work out in sweats.

1 hour ago, scatteroflight said:

Kate makes me crazy, honestly. I hate that everyone tiptoes around her weight to their own detriment. Toby should be proud of what he's accomplished in getting healthier, especially in light of his heart attack, and Kate should be supportive of his efforts. But as usual, it's turned around to be all "oh, poor Kate, she's burdened by so much, and she has such a difficult time with her weight issues and let's not celebrate our own achievements because it might make her feel bad." I'm so glad that her new neighbour got her to pull her head out of her own butt for just a moment. Maybe one day she'll realize that other people have problems, too. 

I began to realize how privileged both her and Rebecca are to have men that support them so they can take care of their children full time. Of course, Rebecca never wanted to be a housewife so it wasn't really easy on her but she is still lucky. Kate is very privileged because she has never really needed to worry about herself financially. Her rich brothers seemed to have her back and now she can devote a lot of time to her special needs child because her husband is a good provider.

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

I forgot to say (I had it in my first post but it got eaten) that I thought Deja looked beautiful this whole episode. I love her hair that way (mine is in two flat twists right now!), she had on cute makeup, and she was smiling! I loved her laughing with Tess. "Stepmom!" "OH LORD" and they both fell out. That was lovely.

Huge pet peeve of mine too, as is the reverse - when it's portrayed that men don't actually like spending time with their kids, and that's supposed to be ... I don't know, cute? Normal?

Love happy Deja! Her boyfriend looks like a parakeet.

Quote

He also knows that his brother resents him; we know Kevin is really mean to Randall in their teen years and Kevin straight up TOLD Randall as adults that he resented Randall's presence in the family because if Randall weren't there, Kevin would have been the star. I thought it was really poignant last episode when Randall said that Kevin had embarrassed him in front of his friends AND he'd enjoyed doing it. That's a hard thing to know about your brother.

Makes me wonder how he would have been with Kate if she did not have low self esteem. Kate is pretty and could definitely have been a star in her own right but she does seem to always take a back seat to Kevin's alpha male attitude. Randall is also an alpha male but in a totally different way.

Edited October 9, 2019 by qtpye

[ECM1231]

8 hours ago, peace355 said:

I'm glad Randall didn't fire Jae Won, I also thought it was fun that his "proposal" he wanted to talk about was a marriage one,

I missed this. When did this happen and what was it about? I remember Jae Won kept asking Randall for a minute of his time to talk about some proposal but Randall kept running out of time, because of his open door policy Mondays. 

[Brookside]

6 hours ago, Blackie said:

I was surprised they actually called it an AA meeting.  Usually in shows they only say "meeting" so I wondered if there was a reason they couldn't call them AA.  From what I know of AA (very close friend goes), meetings aren't like that. I have been to open meetings and there is a speaker that tells their story but it isn't a big sharing circle thing.  According to my friend, in closed meetings they read through the 12 steps and then focus on one of the steps but it isn't a "lets all sit down and share", there is more of a format to the meeting. I always thought that is why they never called them AA meetings on shows.

There are many types of meetings, and some groups traditionally will "share" their stories.  What is universally unacceptable is "cross talk", ie commenting directly on what someone has just said.  This is basically what Cassidy did by laughing. especially since she was so obviously derisive. 

[ams1001]

8 minutes ago, ECM1231 said:

I missed this. When did this happen and what was it about? I remember Jae Won kept asking Randall for a minute of his time to talk about some proposal but Randall kept running out of time, because of his open door policy Mondays. 

It was at the very end; they finally had a chance to sit down and Randall asked him to tell him about his proposal. He proceeded to describe how we was planning to propose to his girlfriend* (I only remember the plan involved the acoustic version of Everlong by Foo Fighters).

*do we know for sure it's a girlfriend? 

[MissLucas]

10 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

*do we know for sure it's a girlfriend? 

He mentions a name: Hannah. 

[tennisgurl]

1 hour ago, bybrandy said:

See also men who get nearly canonized for being active in their children's lives.  It is their JOB!  It isn't heroism.

Or men who call taking care of their kids when their wife is gone "babysitting". Its not babysitting when its your own damn kid!

[ECM1231]

13 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

It was at the very end; they finally had a chance to sit down and Randall asked him to tell him about his proposal. He proceeded to describe how we was planning to propose to his girlfriend* (I only remember the plan involved the acoustic version of Everlong by Foo Fighters).

*do we know for sure it's a girlfriend? 

Thank You. I have NO idea where my head was at b/c I don't remember this scene at all. 

[ams1001]

2 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

He mentions a name: Hannah. 

Ah, I missed that, thanks.